"Day One" (The Last of Us S2E4)

[00:00:00] Hmm? Ah! Oh. She watches over me, she fills my soul, she watches over me. She fills my soul, she watches over me. She fills your soul. You put an arrow in a little boy's head, is she filling your soul then? She tell you to kill children? You kill our children? Never by choice. You train them to shoot at us.

[00:00:30] Because your wolves killed her? Because you trained them to shoot at us. Because you broke the truth. Because you broke the truth. Because you broke it because we broke it. I'm not playing your little chicken and egg games today, Scar. Where is the next attack?

[00:01:15] Hey Zedheads, welcome to the podcast. I'm Jason. And I'm Eric. And I'm Ben. This is The Cast of Us, Episode 640. And in this episode, we're covering The Last of Us, Season 2, Episode 4, Day 1. Day 1, Episode 4, Day 1. Uh, Lucy was supposed to be on, but we, but she and Eric are actually the same person and we just didn't want to tell you. I've been Mrs. Doubtfire the whole time!

[00:01:45] No, her, I hope she's okay with me saying this, but her cat, she came home and her cat was like tangled up in the, in the cord and she like pulled a muscle or something. They had to take the poor cat to the vet. I think she's going to be okay, but it was a last minute emergency thing. So she'll be on the feedback episode, I think this week, if you want to hear more about her. But, uh, now you got us and it's The Last of Us, Season 2, Episode 4, Day 1. Ben, would you like to read the plot summary? Sure.

[00:02:15] Uh, so, in 2018, Isaac Dixon turns on his FEDRA squad, killing them and defecting to the Washington Liberation Front. Eleven years later, as WLF leader, he executes a captured Seraphite who refuses to reveal his group's location. Meanwhile, Ellie and Dina begin their search in Seattle, navigating a city scarred by years of war. They take shelter in a music store where Ellie plays a song for Dina, briefly softening the tension between them.

[00:02:42] That night, they discover a group of WLF soldiers gruesomely killed by Seraphites and narrowingly escaping patrol and horde of infected in the subway. During the chaos, Ellie is bitten, saving Dina. They retreat to an abandoned theater where Dina, terrified, nearly kills Ellie, until Ellie reveals her immunity. In the aftermath, Dina reveals she's pregnant. Despite everything, they grow closer.

[00:03:06] The next morning, they overhear WLF chatter about Nora at the Lake Hill Hospital and Dina insists on continuing with Ellie. I'm sorry, but despite everything, they grow closer. That's one way to put that. That was, yep. They got very close. So, what'd you think, Eric? I enjoyed it.

[00:03:29] I mean, there are some bits, I think more than others that I enjoy, but overall, I thought it was a fantastic episode. I really got a kick out of the cold open with Jeffrey Isaac, or excuse me, Jeffrey Wright. Jeffrey Wright. I thought that was fantastic.

[00:03:49] And seeing Isaac's, a little bit of his backstory, I think was a really welcome diversion from, you know, kind of where we've been and just kind of, it's like, okay, there's some other players in motion here. So, who's this guy? You know, and I thought it was done really well. I agree. Yeah. Yeah. There were some parts I, I'm not sure about that I want to talk with you guys. Yeah.

[00:04:17] Cause I'm like, I don't know if I liked the way they did that, but man, the stuff they did well, which was most of it, in my opinion, was incredible. It was such a great, thrilling episode with some really good, hard hitting emotional parts and fun and funny at points. So overall, I thought it was fantastic, but there were one or two really standout moments that I was like, I don't know about this. Yeah. Yeah. Same here.

[00:04:42] However, the, some of the key set pieces, I would say that were like ripped right out of the game. Yes. It was just like pure gristle for us. Right. It's so good. Thank you. Master, give me more. Nom, nom, nom, you know, and they don't even need necessarily to create these sets that look. Well, I'm sure if you put them side by side, you'd see it wasn't exact, but just from memory, it seems like they just ripped it right out of the game. They don't need to spend the time and money and attention to detail to get it like that.

[00:05:12] They could just have it be something kind of like that and totally capture the spirit of the game. But no, they really put the time and attention, money and detail into it to, I assume, to satisfy us gamers and to thrill us gamers. And also just to get it exactly right. So they know they, they, they hit it. There's gotta be a satisfaction to that. Right. And I think that, and I think that's just it. I think like Craig Mason even said that like, it's, it's a love letter to the people who are fans and love playing the games. And you're right.

[00:05:42] It's as somebody who is literally in the middle of my replay right now, it's, and I, I made a lot of progress of my replay too. I'm like, I'm well ahead of where the story is in the show, but it's seeing it. Like it's so fresh in my mind right now because I just recently replayed all of that, that kind of seeing it was just, it is, it's just that it's a love letter to the gamers.

[00:06:03] But at the same time is so well done that even if you've never played the game, you can really, really get a love for these set pieces at the same time. Yeah. I mean, it's a testament to how cinematic this game is that you can pull so much right out of the game and just recreate it on the screen and it works. You know, as the moment I saw the first flare being thrown and all of a sudden everything was red in the subway there. Right. I'm like, Oh, there it is. Yeah.

[00:06:32] And then all of a sudden they do this thing with it where the flare activates the mycelium. I was like, Oh, well that's, that's nice. That's cool. That's new. And that's a not spoiling anything by saying that, you know, even when, um, like Ellie and Dina are having to hide at the TV station because the wolves bust in.

[00:06:53] And they're searching around for, uh, Sarah fights, the way they shine their lights, the way they move their, their body language, the way they check a segment and say clear. It's all just right out of the game. But if you're not a gamer and I feel like, yeah, this isn't really spoiler because it's not talking about the plot or anything, but if you're not a gamer, you wouldn't even know that. I don't think, but it works on the screen in and of itself. And this is why I'm so sad. Lucy isn't here right now. I know. I don't know. Does that stick out?

[00:07:23] Does that look like a game to you? I'll ask her about it on the feedback. There are a couple of little moments like that, right? Just, I really wanted to know because Maggie and I, my daughter, you know, we're both like just deep in it. Um, I, I have to say, uh, my wife, not as into this right now without Joel. Oh, I did say, yeah, it's not as much fun without Joel anymore. So I can, yeah, I can see that point of view from a number of different people, you know, where it's coming from.

[00:07:50] But this is kind of going back to what I said when we talked about after episode two, when we had Joel's death is like for the people that were, you know, hesitant to continue with the show because of that. Yeah. To stick with it because the story still stays just as engaging and still stays just as good. And I think this episode was a prime example of that because this episode had so many terrifying moments. Yes. That even as a gamer or non gamer, it's just as terrifying to watch it. Right.

[00:08:19] And, but at the same time, also those emotional notes that I'm sure we're going to get into as we, as we discuss it a little further. But I know there's going to be some people like Julie, your wife that just are like, I like Pedro Pascal. I like Joel. It's not as good without him. And I totally get that. If that's how you feel, I'm not going to argue with it, you know, not too much anyway. Well, Ben, what about you? What do you think of it? Well, I mean, I kind of just touched on it a little bit that the episode was absolutely terrifying in so many different moments.

[00:08:49] I think it was a little bit of a little bit of a sense throughout the episode, but we got those, those really nice emotional touches at the same time that I can't wait to talk about. Cause there's some of my favorite moments from the game as well. But even without the game connection, they were still just as good. And, you know, these introductions to these new characters that we've only just kind of gotten glimpse of in like the Seraphites and the WLF.

[00:09:16] There's just the fact that we're only on episode four and we're now, we're really starting to dive into the development of what this story is going to be. They're moving along. For this season. Yeah. Yeah. This might, this might be one of my, it might be, I mean, I don't want to say episode two is my favorite episode of the season because of how it ends, but this, this one might be my favorite episode so far. Yeah. It's up there for me too. It is. So, uh, let me start.

[00:09:45] I want to start with the what's up with the wolves and the Seraphites. And, uh, I, I'm not sure how much of the details of this, that non game players are catching. Uh, I, I don't know. It would have been a great to have Lucy on to ask that, but I, I, I think you can glean a lot from what we're seeing. So I'm just going to go over some of the details. And, uh, if you're listening to this and you're not a game player and you didn't know or quite get anything that I'm saying, write in and let us know.

[00:10:13] We're curious, but I'm just going to unpack the very first scene. So it's 2018 Seattle quarantine zone. So that's 15 years after the outbreak, which started in 2003. We see 15 years later, Fedra still in charge. It's a police state, at least here in Washington and these officers in this truck are just really callous about it.

[00:10:37] I mean, we've already seen them kind of, um, in the Boston quarantine zone, pushing people around and stuff here. These guys are talking mockingly of the general populace, the civilians calling them voters, which mocks them for their lack of freedom. Uh, what the guy talking says I'm easy on them. And the other guy says that ain't what they say. And then they're laughing about this guy Greenberg who slammed one of them against the wall and knock some of his teeth out, which reminds me of like American history X, you know?

[00:11:06] Oh God, don't know that scene is so bad, right? It's not something that you just laugh about. It's fucked up. And, um, so the story that he told, we can learn a few things from it. He had three of these people against the wall, caught them giving out pamphlets. He thought it was for the WLF, but it turns out it was for quote, some religious crap. So we already know that the WLF is Abby's group and they're called the Washington Liberation Front and that it's run by a guy called Isaac.

[00:11:36] Like this was in just briefly in conversation in the last couple of episodes, you may have missed it, but we met Isaac this episode. So we know that he, unless there's two Isaacs that he eventually runs the thing. Um, Dina said that Eugene had told her the WLF was one of several anti-federal groups out in the West. So maybe back in 2018, the WLF was just getting started. People were passing out pamphlets, trying to get it going. Fed was cracking down on anyone trying to recruit for them.

[00:12:04] Um, the pamphlet turned out to be for some religious thing. So that's probably this other group, the Seraphites people we've seen with the scars on their cheeks. And then 11 years later, you have Isaac torturing a Seraphite for information about when and where they'll attack next. They're both accusing each other of having broken a truce for peace.

[00:12:25] And then 11 years later, you know, the Seraphites, the WLF, the WLF, and then later Ellie and Dina found them dead. So we can probably presume that the wolves killed them. Right? May I interject something?

[00:12:49] I just kind of came to this realization as you were talking about this, is that with that father and daughter, they talk about the prophet and how she's been dead for 10 years now. So she's been dead for 10 years. We go back to 11 years with, with Isaac. So my guess is the prophet is still alive at the time Isaac turns to becoming a wolf. I'm wondering whether we're going to get to meet her. Yeah.

[00:13:11] So I'd forgotten because even when in this episode and I will go into this scene in more detail, but when, uh, Isaac is interrogating this Seraphite and they mentioned the prophet, it doesn't explicitly say that she's dead, but now because of what you just said, we know she is. But then it also kind of brings up a point that there seems to be even a schism within the Seraphites, right? Because, uh, we got this guy who's much more of a zealot and the father who was saying, look, she's not magic. Yes. Yeah.

[00:13:41] She's not magic. Heretic. She's just a woman with some good words, you know? I'm almost, I'm almost wondering if we're going to see something a little bit down the line where Isaac is the one who killed the prophet. Well, I'm assuming that might be the case, but. And in that case basically made her a martyr. Could be. And created. We don't know that by the way, in case anyone thinks we're spoiling something. No. That's a speculation. Yeah. We don't know. That's not. Yeah. That's.

[00:14:17] Yeah. That's not a worse scene in case people missed kind of the situation that's happening here. Well, I, like I said, I didn't, I missed the time difference and the time thing until you were just talking about it. Cool. Cool. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That wasn't anything I picked up as I was watching the episode. And I didn't remember them saying that she died 10 years ago. So it's all coming together. It's all coming together. Yeah. All right, Ben, what do you got?

[00:14:41] So just kind of touching a little bit back on what we said and then kind of like covering our own asses, how we said, like, that's not a spoiler because we don't, we don't know. We're making that prediction about how maybe Isaac killed the prophet of the Seraphites and in a sense kind of exacerbated. Created the Seraphites. Yeah. Exacerbated is a better word for it because they did already exist.

[00:15:03] And Jeffrey Wright is like, he is such an amazing actor that anything he pops up in, I'm instantly a fan of. And I know, Eric, you and I were talking about this with Rima last week, talking about American fiction. Oh, God, what a great movie. Yeah. And how great that movie is, like just a good idea. But he is so, I don't want to kind of, this was touched on the making of afterwards. I kind of don't want to shy away from the actor that played the Seraphite.

[00:15:33] He was good. Because that actor portrayed that tortured person, like the two of them playing off of each other. Jeffrey Wright actually praised that actor in the making of. He was good. And he's absolutely right. Like you, it takes a lot to play a tortured soul like that. Yeah. And that was the two of them playing off of each other made Isaac new to him or not. He is already just in what we know a terrifying person. Yeah.

[00:16:00] Like just when they're in the truck and the guys are goofing around telling this story and we don't know that Isaac is there. Jeffrey Wright is there. I mean, we haven't even met him yet, but still. And then as soon as they say, oh, we don't know why they call these guys voters. And you hear his voice come in, which I probably Eric could do better than me. But, uh, and then all of a sudden, all of a sudden, yeah, the tone changes. Cause it's like, oh, this guy has a darkness to him and an imposing. He's got a presence.

[00:16:30] He has a presence. Intimidating presence. Yeah. And what I love about that is, uh, Jeffrey Wright. I've seen him in Westworld where he played Bernard and, um, the watcher, you know, on what if, and it's not like either one of those two characters. I mean, he always has that deep voice of course, cause it's him, but this was a whole different thing and he did it so well. Oh, and he's, he's by, he's one of my favorite Felix Leiters out of all the Felix Leiters in the James Bond universe.

[00:16:57] He has one of the greatest lines at Casino Royale, brother from Langley. Love it. Love that dude. I forgot he was in the, I forgot he was in the, yeah, he's CIA Felix Leiter. Love him. Yeah. I forgot. And the, the, um, the certified guy, what, what most impressed me about him was just portraying that state of certainty that comes with joining a religious group or a cult sometimes, you know, where people just need.

[00:17:26] The more the world becomes uncertain, the more people look for answers and certainty. And when they find it in a way that's so satisfying like that, where like he says, you know, people are joining our group every day and none of them are leaving our group to join you guys. That was such a good line. And it really fit with his vibe where he's just like, I can sit here and you can chop up my entire body. And I know that I'm the righteous one and you're the bad guy. So fuck you. You know?

[00:17:54] And I kind of like, and I like that Isaac, um, he knows he doesn't, he's like, okay, this is done. He knows he's not going to break. He's not going to break him. What's the point? Just get this over with. He could feel it. A certain, uh, economy to that. You know, I was going to go back to when, uh, that conversation with, as I mentioned earlier, Josh Peck in the truck and he's talking about what's the guy's name. He's talking about green black Greenberg. What's his name? Greenberg was the bad guy. Yeah. The bad guy Greenberg. And as Jeffrey Wright is walking out of the truck, he says, you're all Greenbergs.

[00:18:25] He basically calls them out. And then he, then it gets, gets the one kid come on out here and you'll teach something. Right. Yeah. Uh, choose now. And that, that guy's of course the same one that we see right after that incident outside the door. 11 years later. Yeah. Cause 11 years later. And that's the interesting thing is the time jump has changed. Yeah. Maybe both of them. We don't know Isaac very well yet, but probably look like the same kid. Definitely. And yeah, he looks like the wide eyed, like, I don't really know what's happening here.

[00:18:53] And then, and, um, Oh my God, I better go with this guy or else I'm going to die right now. And then 11 years later, he's like, fuck those scars. They're fucking animals. He, Isaac did the right thing. And so to me, that says a lot of shit happened in those intervening years. And it's all about the cycle of violence with this, right? It's like, I I'm pretty sure.

[00:19:14] I don't think I've ever actually read this, but I would be shocked if the writers didn't pull from the middle Eastern conflict specifically for this story where both sides feel like they've been wronged and they're right. They both have, and they're both, uh, just rooted in that sense of you fucked me over. So I hate you and I want to kill you. You know, I, I know that's oversimplifying it, but that's kind of the way it feels with these guys too.

[00:19:43] You're just closed down around that. Everyone on the other side is they're not human to me anymore. Well, it's, it's an interesting dichotomy too, in comparison, when you, when you talk about that guy that, you know, he pulled out of the truck. First off that moment where he just turns and just casually tosses grenades in and closes the door. You're like, yeah. Oh shit.

[00:20:02] Like that was, but you know, when you fast forward to the time, you know, when you do the time jump into the future and you see that guy outside of the door, you had just seen a scene where this Seraphite is being tortured. And no matter what Isaac did to him, his opinion never changed. He was like, I'm standing by who I am. And then it, you know, if you know, you go to that next scene where he's outside the door and he's like, Seraphite got what he deserved.

[00:20:28] And you could tell he's like this cold, no feeling person now because of Isaac. But in the same moment, you kind of realize like Isaac and the part, the prophet that he was mentioning, they're basically the same. Cause this guy is to Isaac, what that Seraphite was to the prophet in his views. Isaac is right. Seraphites are bad. Just like the Seraphites are profit is good. Is good. Wolves are bad.

[00:20:53] There is a strong comparison because of that moment that you could make comparisons to Isaac and the prophet that they are the same, same attitudes in how they behave. I mean, rather. Um, maybe, I'm not sure if we know that quite yet. I mean, yeah, I could see where you're, I can see where you're coming from. What I took from, from seeing that guy again was a juxtaposition from what the Seraphite was saying and how every day you guys are leaving.

[00:21:22] One of you is leaving and none of us ever goes to you guys. And he's probably right. I'm guessing, you know, uh, however you can also see, well, this one dude who started with Isaac at the very beginning is still with him and still just as determined. Yeah. That's a good way to look at it too. I didn't think. So that's just another way to look at it. So, you know, I think just coming right after that, um, kind of, that's what I took from. What kills me about it is they're going back and forth about, you know, you, you shot arrows into one of our children.

[00:21:52] Yeah. And he's like, well, you killed our, you kill our children. Well, not by choice. And it's like, they're just going back and forth all this tit for tat. You broke the truce. Well, that was because you broke the truce. And, uh, it just. Reminds me. I always think about like the whole time we were watching the walking dead and. People would cheer for anyone who just wanted to kill right away.

[00:22:17] And I was like, can we try some other avenues first before we go straight to the violence? And I think that's what this show is about, which is one reason why I love it so much because it's about what happens when people let their hearts just harden around being a victim, which they are a victim, but let it harden and decide to respond with violence. And that's why it gets me when I'm going to bring up two things.

[00:22:41] So hopefully I won't offend too many people, but when the MAGA attacked the Capitol, MAGA attacked the Capitol and also the, I'll probably offend everyone by saying this, but then the summer before that, you know, the George Floyd protests, all the fires and breaking into, um, uh, businesses and things like that. Those are the two things that the two sides point to a lot. Like, Oh yeah, well you guys did this. Well, you guys did this. It sounds just like the Sarah fight and this wolf to me.

[00:23:09] And, and it just makes me feel like if we keep saying that, ah, you did this. So I'm justified in burning a Tesla factory or whatever. Oh yeah. Well then I'm just going to carry guns around and do this and that. It's just going to be the same fucking thing. We're just going to get worse and worse. I got to go back. Sorry. I'm laughing about this also. Cause you said what we need to do is we need to stop and talk and stop this circle of violence, which is exactly what you're led to believe Isaac is doing at the very beginning. Yeah.

[00:23:35] And it turns out, no, he's turning coat and he's throwing grenades and he's, he's, he's, he's turning. So it was almost like. But you see what I mean? Like, I don't know, maybe there is no solution, but I am one who's like, I wish, I hope we can find it. Cause if not, I don't want it. I don't want, do you guys watch civil war? I don't want that. You know what I mean? I mean, it's, it's, I mean, you make a good point that it's the whole, what about ism that we suffer from today is still going to exist after the apocalypse. Yeah. But what about, no kidding. They're continuing with it.

[00:24:05] It's human nature. It really is. I mean, because it's all about tribalism too. You, you find your people and you feel like connected to them. And then it's easy to let yourself feel like the people outside your group are, and who cares about them? And that is just the beginning of what can lead to war. Mm-hmm. I just hope if there is a civil war, I hope the soundtrack is as kick ass as the civil war movie soundtrack. At least that would be a silver lining. It's an amazing soundtrack. Oh God. I still haven't seen it yet.

[00:24:34] I need, I feel like I have to add it to my list just because of these comparisons. Yeah. And the soundtrack. What's his name? Alex Garland. De La Soul. Alex Garland. Yeah. All right. Well, did you have anything else you want to say about that, Ben? Uh, no, I feel like I made a lot of the points that I needed to make about Isaac. And just, and again, I'll watch anything that Jeffrey Wright does. Yeah. I don't care. Watching that making of thing at the end. And if you guys don't stick around and watch that, I recommend it. It's always good.

[00:25:04] And they had little tidbits with Jeffrey Wright. And I don't even remember what I said, but what he said, I mean, but what I do remember is he felt like Isaac. And I wonder if he's kind of method or at least, you know, when he's in the middle of filming something, the vibe sticks with them, even when he's off camera, because he seemed a little bit like this kind of like stick it to you as he was saying what he was saying. You know? Yeah. So I like that.

[00:25:33] But also, uh, when this whole torture scene is happening and Isaac calls the guys people scars and the guy corrects him, Sarah fights. That's another, it's just like how we come up with these dehumanizing names for groups of people that we don't like, you know, it's ugly. It's really ugly. It's really ugly. But I feel, even though it's a fictitious thing, I feel like I can't, I can only refer to them as scars when I'm quoting somebody else.

[00:26:01] Otherwise I need to say Sarah fights just to be politically correct about it. You know? Oh no, absolutely. Yeah. It feels wrong calling them. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Well, that's yeah. Uh, then this actually leads to my point, um, was, um, it kind of summed up in something that Dina says, which, you know, in the, in the studio, in the TV studio, when she says, what the fuck is wrong with Seattle? Right.

[00:26:25] Um, up until this point, we've been seeing the Sarah fights as the oppressed, right? That the wolf, uh, come down on them and they're the good guys. And we are sympathizing with the Sarah fights at this point. At this moment we see, oh my God, the Sarah fights are fucking animals. Yeah.

[00:26:45] Uh, hanging up these people, disemboweling them, having their guts hanging out the studio lights, like, uh, pointed up in such a way to make it a bigger spectacle than it even could be. I mean, uh, and, and seeing some writing in blood, feel her love. Something about seeing those words, feel her love and all of that blood was extremely disconcerting.

[00:27:11] So, um, you know, it's this great sort of situation where what we've gone to at the very beginning of this entire season that we've kept talking about is perspective. And all of a sudden we get our perspective kind of tweaked on us again. It's like, oh shit, they're not the good guys either. So, um, yeah, they, they did such a job in, in setting up an expectation as to who these people might be in the last episode, you know, having them walk with a child and talking about, you know, wanting to escape from war.

[00:27:39] And they want us to feel like Abby's people are bad right now, which they are in some ways, maybe always, who knows? But anyway, that's really the picture they're painting right now. Yeah. And, and Ellie says it at one point when they find the tank and they're going through, it's like, oh, it's just, if they look like Fedra against Fedra, like they turned on each other, just asshole killing another asshole.

[00:28:28] Yeah. And then, and then even if you go back to that scene with Isaac talking to the Seraphite about how we're going to win, we have automatic weapons, we have hospitals. What do you have? Bows and arrows and bolt actions. Well, a lot of good, those automatic weapons and everything did against the Seraphites in that moment. Yeah. Oh, and we got to see Ellie. Because they killed, they slaughtered you and hung you up. We got to see Ellie do some of her jujitsu on a, on an actual person instead of a clicker this time too. And, uh, dig her little knife into the dude's neck. Yep.

[00:29:00] As well. So, uh, I, I thought that's, I just thought it was really great that we do get to finally see the multiple side, you know, they're, they are, the show's doing a good job of. I'm not gonna, I'm not gonna say stringing us along plain and not that, but, uh, giving us these different perspectives. Yeah. Uh, in a way that's making it, I think pretty damn effective. Yeah. I mean, it's what it's doing is it's leading us down a perspective and then switching to another one.

[00:29:30] So you have to see things like you, you can understand. Okay. Yep. I know who the good guys are and the bad guys. I hate the bad guys. And there's like, oh, wait a minute. Perspective shift. What? Yeah. It's also interesting to note too, that, you know, one of the things I enjoy about, you know, bringing the WLF and the Sarah fights is the fact, and this is just Seattle. We don't even know what's happening in the rest of the country because we've seen stuff that happened in, in Boston and other places.

[00:29:58] But, you know, a lot of times when you get to shows like this, you get the franchises like this, it's usually the world against the hero. But in this case, that's not it at all. It's the world against the world. Ellie's just happening to get into the middle of it because, because her, her objective has to take her through it. But I mean, we'll see as we go along. And I think we already have seen that it's all the same themes.

[00:30:24] It's about just like Abby felt righteous in killing Joel because of what Joel did. And now Ellie feels righteous in going after Abby because of what she did. And so it's tit for tat victimhood, vengeance cycle of violence, you know, on a small scale and on a big scale. So my turn. Yep. So Ellie and Dina enter and explore Seattle.

[00:30:54] They, I like that they were searching the pharmacy for supplies and Dina finds something. And this episode did that a few times where you're not exactly sure what's happening, but it seems momentous. And she sees something, but we don't see it. And she goes, I got to pee. And you think that's just her stalling, but it turns out she did pee. I just love that. Yeah. Yeah. She did happen to be on a four sticks. Yeah. Yeah. Uh, then they see the rainbow flags and rainbow pride and stuff. And what's up with the rainbows? I don't know.

[00:31:23] Maybe they were all optimists, but, uh, the wiki says that this district that they're in, the Capitol Hill district of Seattle is widely known as Seattle's quote Gaber hood, which is a home to concentrated LGBTQ plus community. So I thought that was the perfect place for Dina to come out later. And also just kind of a funny thing that they don't even think I've ever heard Gaber hood. Sorry. That's funny.

[00:31:51] Well, Capitol Hill was in the news a couple of years ago because of all of the, uh, the protests and stuff like that, that were happening in there because it is heavily, you know, LGBTQ. So I kind of, I liked the fact that, uh, they threw that, they threw that element of Capitol Hill into, into this. And there was just something really interesting about these two. One of whom is just discovering her bisexuality riding together on a horse through this neighborhood

[00:32:19] and not knowing the history of the rainbow. You know, it's, I don't know why I find that interesting, but. Doesn't Ellie say something like, oh, so much for pride rainbow people or something like that. When they turn the corner and see everything's all that with the, the scene right before the tank, it kind of, that made me chuckle. Yeah, absolutely. And the tank, speaking of the tank. So she opens it hoping to find ammo and then accidentally slams the door down and they're freaked that the noise might draw someone's attention.

[00:32:45] And I think the point of that was so that it wouldn't seem stupid for her to play guitar later because they already had made that noise and knew that no one was around, you know? You're right. Cause I was, I was a little annoyed when Dina started playing drums for a moment. Me too. Pretty quietly though. But you're right. But yeah, I think that's why. Yeah. So then they go to the music store. I just loved how much time they put and, and of Ellie looking through all the records with this sense of wonder and reverence and Dina fiddling with the drum set.

[00:33:15] And they really took a beat for it. And it just makes me think it's gotta be strange to grow up in a world where that's basically like one big lost civilization everywhere around you is ruins of this lost civilization. And we know Ellie's into all the culture of the before time. She loves comic books and games and grunge music. And now we know she loves astronauts. And, um, so I just, it seems like they don't do that a whole lot on the walking dead.

[00:33:44] Maybe they do more than I'm remembering, but Ellie, it's a real part of her character that she's just a culture geek for a culture that's gone, you know? So, yeah. Oh, those, those moldy and rotted, uh, mildewed guitars made me so sad. I was just like, oh, and I loved, you know, the fact that she, she appreciated and, and loved the significance of the silica gel packets, uh, made me really happy. I was like, right on. She knows, she knows what's up with silica gel.

[00:34:12] What was so funny about that too, is like, I get annoyed anytime I open anything that has them in it. Yeah. Cause I question like, what is the, what is the, why do they put these in there? Now we know. Now we know. Well, so before, before I get into that, I just want to say, uh, as far as appreciating the culture of a world that's dead and gone, I was thinking like, we can sort of do that. And we do, if we like classical music, Greek poetry, you know, um, Jenny goes to silent film festivals.

[00:34:42] It's, it's, it's sort of, it's not exactly the same because civilization is still here, but it is similar to that, you know? So, but, um, yeah, so she sees all the guitars and the silica gel. Uh, I didn't know the significance of that. She kisses one, but yeah, it collects humidity and otherwise would the wood and the metal would be damaged inside there. So they were just trying to put a little bit of realism because the other guitars that she saw were kind of rotted out and stuff.

[00:35:10] So I thought that was a nice little addition. I'm going to start saving all the silica gel packets that I find and stuff and just throw them around my apartment just in case. I actually, I, where I work, there's sometimes, uh, some instruments show up with these huge silica gel packets that go into instruments for trap, for transport. And, uh, I've saved those and I have a leak in my car and my trunk every so often and I'll throw about five of them in there. Problem gone. Absolutely.

[00:35:36] I was a little sad that she didn't put the guitar back in the case with the silica gel packets at the end though, you know, just put it back for someone else to find. That's true. That's true. So, but they wanted to frame that nice shot at the end with the guitar sitting there. But, uh, so I guess I get to talk about this scene. Do it. I mean, we can all talk about it, but it was so, I like she, I I'm glad she tuned the guitar because it would absolutely need it.

[00:36:06] And then she goes into the song, um, aha's take on me. And she adjusted the melody to fit the range of her voice, just as Ellie did in the game. And it was just so beautiful. And Bella was actually playing the guitar and, um, singing. And this is one of my favorite 80 songs. And I remember when I heard it in the game, it really touched me and, and the way they did

[00:36:34] it in the show, they just completely nailed the feel that you got in the game. And they even took it to another level. I think it showed like, this is the first time that we've seen Ellie play guitar in the show. So it showed us like, we just learned, oh, it seemed like she didn't want to have anything to do with the guitar. She just had it. Cause Joel was kind of forcing it on her. Now we know, no, she did like the guitar and they did.

[00:37:04] She did learn from Joel and take lessons and took this from him. And now she has this beautiful, wonderful skill to remember him by. And then to take that and have Dina sitting there with that open look on her face and loving and tears coming to her eyes. And just, I think that's probably the moment that Dina actually realized, okay, I'm, I'm bisexual and I love this person, you know? And it was just so beautiful. It was amazing.

[00:37:33] I got watching it. I straight up got chicken skin, every single hair on my body. It was just standing on and it was beautiful. It was really well done. I got choked up. I'm not going to lie. Like I legitimately got choked up at this scene for multiple reasons, but just for how just beautifully shot this scene is, how beautifully well it is put together. I want to real quick though, I want to go back to how you, you said a number of times about Dina discovering, this is the moment she discovered that she was bisexual.

[00:38:02] There is a conversation she does have with Ellie about when she was younger, liking boys and girls. So I think she's always kind of known that she was bisexual. In that very conversation, she said, yeah, that her mom told her, no, you just like boys. And then she felt stuck and tried to basically live up to that. And so what I'm trying to say, if I'm not saying it well, is this is the moment where she's like, no, I'm going to ignore any voice that's, that's told me that I'm not this and just be,

[00:38:31] as she says later. Right. So she's accepting it. Yeah. Maybe that's what I should have said. There's a great line in the song. And when Ellie sings it, you get a sense of when she says better to be safe than sorry. And I, and I feel like Ellie was giving Dina a look there. Like, is it, is it really better to be safe than sorry? I don't think she, we know she's a liar. I don't think she necessarily buys that. And I thought that was a really wonderful little brief moment there in a fantastic scene.

[00:38:59] Also, I think that's where her accent slightly slips out when she's singing. Yeah. She's English. Yeah. English accent. I also loved that it was so moving and meaningful and the vibe between them was just so wonderful. And they didn't talk about it. You see tears in Dina's eyes and then she's just like, oh, you've gotten really good at that. All right, let's go.

[00:39:25] And it's just like enough to just let it be between them and not have to really verbalize it, at least not at this moment. You know, I just thought that was a really good choice. Yeah. Yeah. I've been, I've said it a number of times, not necessarily on a podcast, but to people that I love the song Take On Me by AHA. Again, it's like, just like you said, it's one of my favorite 80s songs too. But I feel like it has been covered so much by so many different people.

[00:39:51] That said, this is one of my favorite covers of that song ever. Nice. And it's not even a full cover. It's just that. And it really did sound a lot like the game where instead of going, like, trying to get so high, they kind of pitched that part down a little bit. And there's a little bit of a phrasing that's different than the main song because we've all heard it so many times. What was it? It's better to be safe than sorry. I forget.

[00:40:19] But anyway, when you hear it, it really stands out. Take On Me. They don't say, take on me, take. There's no re... It's just a... Yeah. I think I might know what you're talking about, but I'm not going to sit here and try to sing it. One thing I really did also like, just briefly going back to when she was going through the records and she pulls out a Tears for Fears album. That album's title is The Hurting. Yeah. Which I think is very appropriate for what Kelly's going through.

[00:40:49] So I'm glad... So there's that, but going back to the Take On Me song real quick, I'm curious of your opinion on something from both of you. So we... I kind of think at the same time, while that song is a song from the game, it's the same song she played in the game, it kind of is a little bit of foreshadowing for this episode too. Because if you remember going back to season one, the Bill and Frank episode, we realized what the codes were depending on the generation. 80s means danger. 80s means trouble.

[00:41:20] Yeah. And she's sitting there playing an 80s song that is beautiful, but it's nothing but trouble for the rest of that episode. Yeah. Like it is a precursor to what's going to be coming for the rest of that episode. I'll be gone in a day or two. Oh. Yeah. Or three. Yeah. I think... And also in season one, correct me if I'm wrong, but I do believe they play Take On Me

[00:41:47] at some point, like in an instrumental version at some point in the first season. I don't quite recall. Or maybe it was just the trailer. Yeah. But they definitely were teasing Take On Me since season one. And well, now everybody knows why. Yeah. If anybody was wondering. This is why. I'll talk a little bit more about this in the game talk section too.

[00:42:14] And just, I might as well say it right now since I'm talking about the game talk section. And the way I'd like to structure it today is I think there's a lot of people who love to hear the differences between the game and the show without any future spoilers. Yeah. And so we'll start off with that kind of stuff and then we'll let you know, okay, now we're going to talk about some stuff that might spoil future things. That's fair. Sound good? Okay. Yeah. All right. Who's next? I forget. Eric?

[00:42:44] Yeah, sure. So I guess now we're going to have to talk about Dina and Ellie arriving to Seattle. And we've already been touching on that, of course, at the music store, eventually leading to the movie theater where all this stuff is revealed. All right. So here's maybe some of my little nitpicky bits that I have to get to. Yeah. Some of the dialogue felt a little bit extra exposition-y, giving us a little more

[00:43:12] tell instead of show. But an even minor, even smaller nit to pick, Dina's wearing a lot of makeup and her hair looks fantastic for somebody that's gone from Jackson to Washington in the middle of an apocalypse. I know that's a stupid thing to complain about, but for some reason, she looked so glamorous. That may just be the way she is, but I've seen alien Romulus. She can unglam herself.

[00:43:43] So something about that and with that is they feel like they're on a fun adventure right now. And I feel like they've almost lost the point of why they're there. You know, and, and even when they did say, well, if we see any wolves, you know, they just stare at one another and like a head nod. It's like, well, okay. That doesn't feel quite the, the revenge soaked mission.

[00:44:11] I felt that we might be on right now. Um, that, so that's not detracting from anything, but boy, they just seem awfully chipper and happy for, for kind of what's going down. And I am, I am, I feel confident that that's going to change and I'm sure they just didn't want everything to be a bummer fest. Yeah. But I feel that's kind of the point is that it is supposed to be a bummer fest and, um,

[00:44:38] you might've overcorrected there may have overcorrected a little bit. Thank you. And, and, and I'm, and it's funny cause I am of two minds is like, yes, I very much enjoyed it. I thought it was good. I think I'm okay with, uh, this or that, but then, wow, they're just awfully happy. I just, and again, this is where I want a non game players perspective so badly. Well, I, I, I feel like we kind of came out of that by the end of the episode anyway,

[00:45:07] because we, we do see them kind of after that moment where they get closer, uh, as it's so deemed in the description, we, you know, we hear like the rumbles of the blast that are happening to hear the chatter on the radio and then they're up on the roof where they realize, oh yeah, we have a mission to do while we're here and we're going to do it together. But like, that's kind of where it kind of clicks that like, oh yeah, we're here for a reason. And now they know what the next step of that reason is.

[00:45:34] So I feel like I, I, I agree with your nitpicks about how it's, it's kind of like a, a happy adventure, even though Ellie gets bit, they get through the subway and everything. Not exactly happy, but. I mean, it wasn't like, oh, look at that. Pointy was, was her map and I'm like, shit, where's boots? Come on. I mean, one thing to think about and it's a little weird because they're on a revenge mission, but they're also falling in love. And I think this is like the episode where they really fell in love.

[00:46:04] So that's all happening. And so it's. Yeah. You know, when you're falling in love, you're happy. No, I know. I know. So, and here's something, here's something I also have to say, and I think this is for, for better or for worse. I actually, I do think this is for better and it's something to keep in mind. You know, episode one, we talked, we kind of talked about the fact, yeah, she's 19. You know, she's acting like a 19 year old. Honestly, I think they're kind of acting like 19 year olds in the show.

[00:46:33] That might be more realistic than what we may be even used to. Right. Maybe. Yeah. Um, and so maybe in keeping in line with 19 year olds, maybe this is how they should be acting, you know, losing the point if, if, you know, as to what they're doing. Yeah. And I'm afraid for them. I'm afraid for, we know what they're walking into. It's terrifying. These two young girls. And we already saw they dealt with it fairly well, but not that great.

[00:47:00] You know, I, but by the end of this episode too, I'm actually really glad. Cause we do get that. You know, when we get that moment where Dina says like, no, we're doing this together. Uh, that actually made me very happy because I feel like we've gotten instances throughout this, like with the, with the lid, with Ellie wanting to run right to the TV station when she sees WLF. Dina is a compass for Ellie. Yeah. Ellie, this whole journey would be so much different if Ellie was on her own.

[00:47:29] She'd be running headlong, headfirst into everything. She may be dead at this point. Yeah. So Dina saying like, no, no, like even though she revealed that she's pregnant and Ellie wants her to stay behind, I get that's Ellie being really even more overprotective of Dina now because she's with child. But the fact that Dina stood up and said, no, we're doing this together. I was like, good, because you need each other going forward. Ellie can't do this alone. I mean, Ellie should be dead. Ellie needs to be that compass.

[00:47:58] Ellie should be dead so many different times over considering how many times she's been bit. If she did not have immunity, she would have been so dead. So many times. Oh yeah. And I mean, of course, is this, this is a chicken and an egg situation, which came first, you know, Ellie being reckless or being reckless because she's immune. I think we can say reckless because we knew she was reckless even before we knew she was immune. So there we go. Yeah. She's the egg. Oh yeah. She's the egg. The shopping, the being reckless was the reason she got bit and found out she was immune in the first place. Yeah. That's what I did. Yeah.

[00:48:28] And it makes sense. You know, most people are dead. So it's not like, I mean, to have a young girl die in this world is pretty normal, you know? So she's lucky to be immune and be alive. That sounds callous, but I'm just trying to frame it in a larger perspective. But, uh, and then when she used the jujitsu on the guy and then knifed him, um, she killed him, right?

[00:48:56] That's, I think the only the third person we know she's killed Riley, then that David guy, cannibal guy, and this guy. And I was kind of surprised they didn't really dwell on that at all. Even later, you know, I don't think. Is that really the only people she's killed? I feel like she's killed other people. You may be right. You know what? She may have. You're right. Oh God. She killed a Troy Baker. Uh. She did. With the, the Cleaver in the first season. Don't kill Troy Baker.

[00:49:26] Getting away from David. Okay. Oh, not Troy Baker, but whoever he was. No, I know what you mean. Yeah. Uh, okay. But still, you know, you just killed the guy. Well, I mean, and not to mention there was a whole five year time gap too. We don't know what happened in between that with on missions with Joel and, and such. So is your argument. She's probably killed a lot of people, so she shouldn't care anymore. My argument or Eric's argument? I don't know.

[00:49:51] I, I, I don't, I don't, uh, maybe, maybe that is a good argument. Yeah. Do I think Ellie cares about killing people? Well, I don't, I don't think she cares about killing people, especially wolves. I mean, I think, uh, I think she is an extremely callous person in this world. I think a lot of people are. I mean, we saw what Joel went through. Right. Um. I just didn't know if she was at that point yet, but maybe she is. Uh, you know, I, I don't think she's going out of her way to kill anybody right now. No, I'm not saying that. I mean, other than traveling to a couple of states away, but you know, to, to kill some

[00:50:21] people. I'm just like, if someone broke in here and I had to knife him in the throat, I might take a beat and go, oh my gosh, I just killed a guy. Oh, well, it's a breakfast. We don't live in an apocalypse. I know. I know. I know. Yeah. I don't think we should. No, I'm not advocating for people going and jujitsuing somebody who's knifing them in the neck. Don't get me wrong, folks. I mean, don't go into your local gym and try this. You're going to have some problems. It's just, you know, on this show, they can choose to show a reaction or not.

[00:50:50] And I wondered if that was deliberate to show, or I'm wondering now if that was deliberate that they didn't, because they are saying that she's at a point where she can kill people and it doesn't really affect her that much, or they just didn't have time to show it. Cause there was so much going on in this episode, you know? It didn't seem to bother Dina either. Dina killed somebody like shot the dude right in the head or at least from behind, you know, shot somebody from behind. There we go. And they had already agreed that's what they were going to do if they had to. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

[00:51:17] So I just think these are, you know, unpleasant people in general. I mean, seriously. I will say too, going to the whole element of Ellie getting bit in front of Dina and Dina witnessing it, and then Dina having that paranoia that she's going to turn, I feel like Take On Me saved Ellie's life in that moment. Cause had she not played that song and had Dina fall in love with her in that very moment, Dina would have pulled that trigger so much faster. She wouldn't have hesitated.

[00:51:47] Well, here's the thing. Well, actually, let me, can I go through the whole subway thing? Yeah. Yeah. And then we'll get to that. So they retreat into the subway from the TV station and the WLF is on their trail and those flares coming down. And you see one flare disturbed a strand of mycelium, which we know called all the infected in. So I love that, that element of it. And man, you see that whole horde charge in. It looks so cool.

[00:52:17] It was thrilling. Like, I think a lot of shows attempt to be this thrilling and don't meet the mark the way this episode did. I, I, even though like, even when, um, they got down into the subway car and were coming through this really enclosed space and they had to close the door on one clicker right behind them. And then some were coming through the glass and everything. Yeah. I'm like, I know Ellie and Dina survived this and yet I'm afraid for them. Yeah. That's always like a good feeling.

[00:52:46] Bella had a look of terror at one point on their face. Uh, that I was just, it was one of those moments where I'm like, God, they're good at what they're doing. You know, just a real moment. Well, um, it was so good. Well, even for people like who aren't gamers, like people who were surprised that they killed off Joel in the second episode, it's like, well, they killed off Joel. They could very easily kill off any other character in this show. It just becomes the Dina show at this point. Cause Ellie just died. Yeah. Right. You never know. That's true. Yeah.

[00:53:13] And by the way, every time any one of us says they killed off Joel, there's a part of me that's like, Oh, don't say that. Oh wait, you can talk about it. We're allowed to say it now. We're allowed to say it. Yeah. Uh, so, so then. Um, you know, they get out of there, they go up the, they get stuck in the fucking revolving door. And then, uh, Ellie puts her arm in front to save Dina. And you can tell Dina's like watching her get bitten, but they don't have, she doesn't have any time to do anything. Then they get to the theater.

[00:53:39] And I love that Dina pulled her gun on her, even though she's falling for her because you, you gotta be real. Like, you know, she's going to turn into a monster. My one nitpick is in season one, episode one, we saw a Fedra sign saying how long to full infection, depending on where you're bitten neck, face and head five to 15 minutes, torso, arm, shoulder hand, two to eight hours. You'd presume that Dina would know that and might be like, okay, let's sit down and say our goodbyes.

[00:54:08] Not, I'm going to shoot you right now because in two to eight hours, you're going to turn into a monster. But that's a, that's a nitpick. I mean, they took the time to put it on a sign. So there's, there's 19. I, I do want to praise. There's a lot. I mean, we've already said how great of an actress she is too, but there's a lot of great acting that comes out of Isabella from this, this whole sequence of things from hesitantly standing outside of the theater and watching Ellie go in, but even going all the way back

[00:54:37] to that moment when they first entered the subway and she does the counting when she's counting, when she's like listening and she does the counting as the higher the numbers go up. Yeah. You can see the terror in her, like you could see terror in her face without saying a word and like, cause she knows I have to go to a second hand at this point. Well above it. Yeah. It's like not, there's a bunch like after five, it's like, there's just a bunch. Yeah. Yeah, exactly.

[00:55:07] We're into several. Yeah. So can I borrow your hands Ellie? Cause I'm going to. Kind of need a bigger hand. And then, you know, the, my big nitpick is when they go into the theater and Ellie show, Ellie convinces Dina that she's immune. You know, I mean, she shows her the bite the next morning and Dina's walking towards her

[00:55:33] and then she dropped or she says I'm pregnant. And, um, I think the idea was she just learned a big secret about Ellie. So decided to tell a big secret about herself, but it felt abrupt and weird. Like I felt like Dina needed a little more time to just like, at least say, okay, oh wow. You're immune. How, how did that happen or whatever?

[00:56:00] And then when, um, they just all of a sudden started kissing and groping each other, like I'm, I'm okay with the sex scene, but it felt really abrupt. And, you know, in my experience, when you're in like fight or flight mode, you don't just suddenly shift to let's get it on mode. I mean, it didn't, maybe some people do that all the time. I don't know, but, uh, it just didn't feel like that was the next thing to happen. It felt off to me.

[00:56:30] The only way it didn't feel off to me was the explanation later, which again, if you need an explanation later to make it not feel off for you, maybe there's a problem. But where she said, I was afraid that I had lost you. So maybe just with the realization that she is going to live, I'm not going to lose her. Um, I can be open with this person and, uh, you're overwhelmed with passion and, and being 19 hormones. Yeah.

[00:56:59] That's all I could think of, but it's, but cause seriously, I did find myself going like, huh? Well, interesting choice. Yeah. It didn't feel abrupt. Yeah. It didn't. It felt like, I wish they would have done a couple more takes and found, found the scene better. That's all. And, and then in the next scene, the next morning, suddenly, you know, Ellie's like, I'm going to be a dad. It's like, dude, you guys just hooked up. Yeah. She just realized, she just is accepted that she's bisexual. And now you're just like, okay, that's it. We're together forever again.

[00:57:29] They're 19. So maybe. There was an abruptness to it there. There are, you know, I was joking with Maggie. I'm like, oh, so I guess they're going to be moving in together now. They've had one date. I mean, that's kind of the, the classic joke, right? It's so the stereotype, it was, um, it did, it did feel a little abrupt, but you have to remember too, that there, there aren't a lot of options and for them and the, and Ellie at least has already been thinking about this for a while, but you know, I'm trying to rationalize

[00:57:59] something that just didn't, that whole sequence didn't quite jibe for me. And look, and to be fair, like when we've all been that age, we all have that feeling like, oh, this is the one. Of course. It's why I, it's why I keep saying it. They're 19. Yeah. I know. That's true. You know. I remember feeling at that about my high school girlfriend, my first one. She now has eight kids and she's like hardcore. Wow. You were busy, dude. No, it's not mine. It's not me.

[00:58:30] But I did like, I mean, I hope, I don't know. I remember when I was critical about, um, the kissing scene with Michonne and Rick, a lot of people didn't like it. And now I feel like this is a, maybe a similar thing. I don't know. There are definitely love, you know, sex scenes and love making scenes that work really well when there's good chemistry and it just feels right. And this felt a little weird.

[00:58:57] Now, all that said, when they were just laying there and you had kind of like a top down view and Dina put her head on Ellie's shoulder, I thought that was super sweet. You know, it was really nice. It was. And I do think it was really sweet and it was really nice. And I hate that I'm sitting here kind of shitting on a very sweet moment. Yeah. But it just, like I said, it just feels a little bit out of place.

[00:59:21] And for what they're there to do, it just, you know, I just have this feeling that this was the, this was the, the writers and the producers saying like, we better give them their moment now because there's probably not going to be another opportunity for this. Yeah. Absolutely. No, no. Yeah. And it's, it's yeah, it is what it is. It's fine. It's not terrible. I don't have, I'm not, I'm by no means saying I hate it and it takes me out or anything like that.

[00:59:50] It just, like Jason would say, it just felt rushed and just sort of, well, here we are. A little odd. Okay. I just had a couple of notes, funny things. Ellie's saying maybe the rainbows are there because the people are really optimistic. I loved just, yeah. Seeing them all strung up and, and Ellie said that group we saw in the woods, they did this and Dina said, what the fuck is wrong with Seattle? I just love that delivery. That's a great line. Really is a great line.

[01:00:18] And then when, at the theater, when Dina said, I found a pregnancy test at the pharmacy and I peed on it. You peed on it? That's how it works. I don't just randomly pee on stuff. Okay. That was good. A couple more notes. I didn't know until now that three astronauts originally slated to go to the moon, never made it off their launch pad and burned up in their capsule. Really? Really? The Apollo one. I never knew that. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, dude.

[01:00:47] I will highly recommend Tom Hanks and HBO did a series called From Earth to the Moon. Oh, From Earth to the Moon is fantastic. That goes all the way through the space program from Kennedy's, you know, saying we're going to do this to the Mercury and then the Apollo missions. And it's a phenomenal series. And the episode on Apollo one is horrible, but great. That's cool. Really good. Because I always, you know, I was in high school when the Challenger blew up the space shuttle and I just thought, oh, that was the first disaster. But Apollo one was the first one. Yeah. Mm-hmm.

[01:01:16] Never made it off the launch pad. Last. So we had Isaac giving his spiel about these like designer French pans, you know, pots and pans. Copper pans. Yeah. And I looked up this Movial copper pan with a steel handle. Guess how much it costs? About $1,200, I think. No, no. Oh, if you get the whole set, it's like $1,700.

[01:01:43] If you just get this one pan, it's $340, but it's on sale right now for $255 if anybody wants to get it. Although it is sold out, so you can't get it. I'm actually really glad you brought that up because I meant to make a note of that myself and I didn't do it because that whole conversation, I'm listening to it and I'm like, I feel this so much because ever since I heard about Gordon Ramsay's hex clad line, I'm like, that's what I want. And I'm like. No, you don't.

[01:02:11] You do not want hex clads. Stay away from it. We'll talk about that later. Cast iron or stainless steel, but no. I heard this when he was talking and all I could think is you should be using cast iron because that will retain heat. Yeah. I have. I own cast iron. Well, this is the opposite. It is the opposite. I mean, it heats up faster though. And from what I read on the website, you shouldn't set your oven to high because it'll ruin it. You can just do a lower heat. But then he said you have to polish it a lot and I'm like, eh, I don't need that.

[01:02:41] Oh, no. They're a pain. Actually, I'm not a fan of copper. I do prefer stainless steel. Whatever. You're right. This is so funny. However, all I could think about after he did the dude's hand was how bad that must smell right then. And then when he puts the pan back onto the burner, I'm like, oh, God, the smell must be terrible. Or maybe it smells really good. I don't know. Oh, like yellow jackets, right? They kind of. All I know is just hearing this whole conversation about pans. I'm like, oh, no. I relate to Isaac.

[01:03:11] Oh, when it comes to cookware. Absolutely. I'm like, I've spent much time in Williams-Sonoma. I'm all about my enameled cast iron as well. Oh, yeah. It's a thing.

[01:03:22] All right.

[01:04:04] We're back. It's time for some game talk. As I said, we're going to start just with some differences between the show and the game. We will try our best not to spoil anything. I mean, I think often if you're clever enough, you could probably glean some things from what we say. So if you don't even want that kind of a spoiler, then you should probably just stop listening. But if you're the type who enjoys hearing what was similar or different from the game, then I think you're safe listening to this first part.

[01:04:30] And then we'll move into maybe a couple little bit more spoilery things about the future of the story. So just the title day one really got me when they finally, because they don't reveal these titles until the episode comes out. And I was like, oh, my God, that's right out of the game. So next episode will be day two. I don't know. Even the font that they use on screen, it's the same font from the game. I also thought it was funny.

[01:04:58] This is something I could have brought up before, but I don't know. Whatever. What happened? They start the show saying that it was 2011 or 2018, right? They say that. And then it says 11 years later. They kind of change the format of that, right? Normally, they would have said maybe 11 years ago. Oh, yeah. Or they would say 2018 and then 2029. But for some reason, the way that they kind of mixed it up, I thought that was kind of funny. I was just like, oh, that's... It had me doing math in my head, yeah. It did have me doing a little math too.

[01:05:28] And I'm like, oh, why did they do that? You kind of mentioned, I know, that seeing how Isaac joined up with the WLF was cool. And, you know, I wasn't sure, like, is he already like a mole, like a spy? Or is he actually on the up and up right now, but he's thinking about joining? Like when he asked the young guy to come out, I was like, eh, it seems like those other guys are probably going to be fucked right now.

[01:05:57] But I wasn't sure, you know? Like, they had me guessing that whole time. I had no idea what was necessarily going to happen. And I like that. I like that a lot. I just wasn't sure. So... Well, we should have hit this point a little bit harder in the main part, but it was so cool when he just casually tossed those grenades in and closed the door and barred it up. You said it, but... Oh, it was fun. Yeah. No, it was amazing. So great. It was about as cold as you can be.

[01:06:23] Well, and just the fact that he did that, the fact that he invited that guy out and he just casually tossed those grenades in, that to me feels like that was always part of the plan. Like this move was arranged. Yeah. I mean, what I got out of it was that he'd been talking with them and this was to show that, to prove to them that he was really on their side and not just some plan to get it. Clearly he's become disillusioned with the way that they're behaving and, you know, all

[01:06:51] you seen that with the whole Greenberg thing. Yeah. I thought that was a phenomenal scene. I thought it was so well done. And I am extremely curious as to who the woman is that he's talking to. In the game, you learn a lot about the founders of the WLF who are known as the Pattersons. So I know there's a question about whether or not she is one of the Pattersons. Okay. I don't know. Yeah. Well, I think we're going to learn some things that we never learned about in the game now.

[01:07:20] And I'm excited about that. I really, yeah. I thought that was cool. And the fact that this was not in the game at all. Yay. Yeah. That was great. That's what I said. Like the fact that this is a new element of Isaac that we had never, we never got in the game. This is new to us even as gamers as well. Yeah. And I, I mean, I kind of just said that, but I, I do think we'll get more WLF stuff that we never got in the game and more Seraphite stuff. And that's going to be really cool. Yeah.

[01:07:45] So D the Dina and Ellie part opens with them at the pharmacy, searching through rooms, opening drawer after drawer. And I'm like, you spend so much time opening drawers in this game. Like, yeah, that's like, I would say 80%. No, I'm just kidding. But it's like maybe 30%. It's, it's a good portion. Here's half of a scissor. It's, it's a good portion of it. Cause even though I'm like, I'm playing through it now and I'm still, I still find myself just because it's the completionist in me.

[01:08:14] And because I know how badly you need that stuff to progress in the game. Like how many, how many times you're going to have to make med kits and all of that stuff. So yeah, I'm, I still find myself searching every nook and cranny of every room. And I'm sitting there playing and every once in a while, Jenny will come down and watch and I feel bad. I'm like, I know it's like me looking through drawers, but I have to, I mean, you really

[01:08:40] need all the supplies you can get because you're making weapons with most of the stuff and weapons are scarce. I mean, ammo and stuff. Yeah. Well, it's, it took me until this replay too, to realize more. I don't think I realized it as much the first time, but this time I'm realizing you can find food in vending machines. Yeah. If you smash the vending machines, there's like bars and chips and stuff in there. Cokes and stuff. Yeah. The visuals, like the Seattle building, the overgrowth, even some of the camera shots with

[01:09:07] the horse, the music store, the TV station, the subway, the theater. I mean, all these things are so great. No, it was bang on and that was incredible. And it, yeah, visually it, it, it was stupendous for sure. That's, that's one. And, and, but going back to what my, my little nitpicky bits, you know, with, with the pacing and that kind of thing or the dialogue, unfortunately I think this is where, you know, we weren't

[01:09:35] sure how the changes were going to impact it. And I feel like this is kind of where we sort of hit the point where it's like, Ooh, I think the change has impacted a little bit. What do you mean? In a negative way. Um, not having their relationship kind of starting a little bit earlier that it now, by this point, this did feel rushed. Oh, I see. To be such a, you know what I mean? Cause they're, they wanted to have, I think they wanted to have some story to tell during this part other than they're killing a lot of people that they come across.

[01:10:04] But that means that a romance is happening when they should be sort of in focus mode. And, and so, and, and because, so again, this gets into the differences between the two in the, in the game. Ellie is really, really pissed off at Dina for being pregnant. She's not all loving. Oh yeah. Hey, I'm going to be a dad. Right. She's livid. Cause you've now endangered the mission. Yeah. Because she knew when she started. Right. Didn't she? Or did she not? I forget.

[01:10:33] No, I don't think she did know when she started. I think, you know, cause again, it would take a while to go from Idaho or Wyoming to, to Washington. Well, even, even in the game, cause it is fresh in my head. I don't even think Dina is at the time she admitted to Ellie, it is in the theater. Like it is in the game. It's in the theater. Yeah. Yeah. But I think, but she says, I think I'm pregnant. Oh, she didn't have a pregnancy test. Yeah. Yeah. It wasn't quite like this.

[01:11:01] I just kind of, but Ellie was the realization. Yeah. Yeah. So Ellie is more pissy in the game, in the game. And Ellie is more pissy in the game. And I think Ellie is more directed, more bitter, more angry, all these kinds of things. It's not, Dina's not the one like making sure that Ellie has her shit together. Exactly. So Ellie's already got it together. And this is a problem for me now. I'm looking at this like, ah, shit, this is a me problem now because this is a, I'm just

[01:11:30] used to the game version. And maybe I'm finding the TV show version a little off-putting and then I'm reminded, oh wait, she is 19. Maybe she really is acting more like an 18 year old than game version is. Hormones going crazy. You know, I get it. I was 19. Also, I mean, even in season one, I remember, and now two in season two, sometimes as I'm watching and I'm starting to feel like, oh, this isn't like the game and I'm starting to not like that. I have to go, wait, this is different.

[01:12:00] Remember The Walking Dead? You love the comic. Yeah. You love the show. But I came to think of them as two almost completely different things. And I want to try to do that. Even it's hard with this show because that was a comic in the show. It's a lot closer. It's a lot closer. But I want to try to appreciate these actors, portrayals of the characters that are different in some ways and just think of them as different, you know, and see if I can appreciate it in and of itself too.

[01:12:26] And I think that helps sometimes when I'm not feeling like it's quite like the game. Oh, and I'm, and I'm please listener, anybody listening to me say this, it's on me. I mean, this is like I said, this is a me problem. I don't think it's a show problem except for maybe the makeup and the hair. Sometimes, yeah. It's hard to suss out. And the cleanliness of the clothes. There are legitimate critiques, you know, I think. Well, it's funny because I was going to say earlier, one of my biggest nitpicks is the fact that you have so many nitpicks. That's not true. But it's not true at all. It's not true at all.

[01:12:56] By the way, I just want to mention Kate Heron was the director. She's a big fan of the games and asked to be involved with this show and got to be the director. And, and, you know, so that's one reason why everything looks so great. She directed the first season of Loki. That's like her biggest thing before this, I think. So the, the, the take on me, the aha scene, I'm, I'm really glad they included it. It's a scene in the game. That's a fan favorite and is emotional, just like in the show.

[01:13:25] And it's a scene that you don't even need to do and you may miss it. I missed it the first playthrough. It's extra, it's an extra scene. It doesn't, it's not essential to the game. Which is interesting. But I'm, I'm, I, when I replayed that scene a couple, like a couple of days ago, I was sitting there watching this cut scene and I'm like, man, I hope they include this in the show. And then when we, when we got it this week, I was like, okay, like I'm, I'm really happy. I, I, yeah.

[01:13:52] I mean, I saw a promotional shot of Ellie with her guitar, with all that greenery around her and the light coming in. I'm like, that's the aha scene. I hope, I just hope that they use the right song and they did. Yeah. Oh, that would have been hilarious if they switched the song. Yeah. We built this city on rock and roll. Oh, my heart would have sank. I think I would have had to quit, quit the podcast. Depeche mode. I just can't get enough.

[01:14:19] Like, I just, just can't get enough. So here's one, one very happy change they've made, uh, from the game to the show. Shimmer lives. Yay. Where is Shimmer? Oh, I was just going to. Shimmer should be dead by now. Where is Shimmer? Oh, she's in. Oh. Yeah. Oh, cause they left her in the, uh, in the music store. They went through the subway and everything. They went by foot to the theater. Yeah. Shimmer's dead. No. I don't know. I don't know.

[01:14:50] Hopefully Shimmer's just chilling at the, at the music store still. I think Shimmer belongs to a wolf now. Maybe. Oh. Well, okay. Then let me rephrase that. Shimmer didn't blow up. That's good. Yay. That's a better way to do it. As far as we know. As far as we know. When Isaac's torturing this, uh, Seraphite, we saw him torturing a Seraphite, but not in the same context.

[01:15:13] And even, uh, independently of that, I just thought it felt more up close and personal seeing it on screen in a TV show like this than in the game. I don't know why, but it felt more dramatic and like we're really getting a closer look at these two characters. I mean, seriously, seeing the feel her love written like that in blood. Yeah. Kind of, it, it made me sort of like, oh, it, it, it chilled me a bit and you know,

[01:15:43] you see it all over in the game, but it seems like it's painted. Yeah. For some reason, painting it in blood is just like. It's worse. Yeah. It is worse. I don't know. Weird. I don't know. Yeah. Well, I mean, and this isn't looking future either too, but talking about Isaac again real quick in the game, we don't meet Isaac for a while at this point. Oh, he's like a mythical feature for most, uh, a mythical person for most of the game. We, we, it's a, it's not for a good portion of the game until you meet Isaac. Yeah.

[01:16:12] Then you meet Isaac and you're like Jeffrey Wright. Yeah, exactly. I bet you one reason why they put him in earlier is because Jeffrey Wright, they just like, Hey, we have this guy. He's great. Let's use him. Fair enough. Yeah. Uh, the hanging wolves with entrails. I mean, sorry. Yeah, no hanging wolves with entrails hanging out is just like the game, but it seems even grosser to me seeing it in a show than in a game. I was kind of happy.

[01:16:39] They kept their distance and we didn't have to get all close up and show all David Krodenberg. Cause I'm like, nah, I can live without that. I love, I love the fact that it was actual people and not like mannequins or like, or like artificial, like people, like they showed in the making. Oh my God. You mean they disemboweled? No, that you know. Why did you like that, Ben? That's, that's messed up, man. No, I meant like it was actual. Talk about a commitment to reality. Wow.

[01:17:03] Well, I mean, I am the one that did say you need to kill everybody and, you know, close off loose ends. That's true. No, like the fact that in the making of the behind the scenes, it's actually stuntman up there. Not just, not just, uh, like mannequins or anything. Yes. And then when the wolves bust in and, uh, Ellie and Dina hide, I, like I said before, it felt right out of the game, even the way they're like pointing their flashlights and then they kind of turn a little bit and you hear clear over here, clear.

[01:17:31] And it's, I felt like I was right in the game and it just, I wish Lucy was here so we could ask, but to me, I thought it worked really well for a show. I don't think people were like, oh, suddenly I'm in Pac-Man or something. Yeah. I like that they kept it dark. They didn't turn on all the, turn on the flood. You know? Um, uh, it felt, it, it, it felt, uh, the tension in that scene, uh, everything beginning in the, uh, with that subway and all. Yeah.

[01:17:58] And the subway was more cramped inside the subway cars than the game, which made it even scarier. I thought. Oh, and a total game mechanic to go, look, we can squeeze, squeeze through this hole. They can't, you know, that was a total game thing too. It's like, you know, small, small hole under the rubble where you crawl in and get in there inside the train. That was, yeah, that was phenomenal. Well, and even Eric, going back to something that you said earlier too, with the red flares, like the moment they tossed the red flares and the whole environment goes red, like, you

[01:18:28] know exactly where you are in the game at this point. You're like, oh no, like I remember this. And one difference, and it's something about season two that's been different than season one, way more infected in this scene than we're in the game. Yes. Oh yeah. We were, we were so worried. Oh, well, they have more infected this time. Yeah. Yeah. No, no question. Now that was, they're doing such a killer job. Oh yeah. Yes. And we've seen so many clickers.

[01:18:55] Those fast ones are just, it's just so like anxiety producing. Well, that, that scene in the game. Yeah. You're, you're basically trying to avoid like what I think like five or six clickers and that's about it. It's not an entire horde that they had to, they had to do in the show. I think I have managed to get through there killing every clicker and person at some point, but I'm not, I'm not positive. The fun part about that scene is like throwing a glass bottle to get the clickers to attack them. Yes. Yes. Because they're in there. That's all I do. That's how I did it.

[01:19:25] All I do. Yeah. I forgot. I do that. Then you get all the clickers to attack all the dudes. And then once they're all in one big thing, you throw a couple of Molotovs and you're good to get. It's just really satisfying. And then when, so somehow they're running away and you probably heard us talk about this before. Maybe you don't remember, but there's no mycelium network in the show.

[01:19:53] It's, I mean, in the game, it's spores that come out and every time you see spores, you have to put on a gas mask because if you breathe in spores, that's another way to get infected. And so in the game, they get into a situation where they put their gas masks on. And Dina doesn't know Ellie's immune. So she puts hers on and then it breaks and Ellie, I mean, Dina sees that and thinks that Ellie's a goner. She didn't get bitten at this point in the game. She breathed in spores.

[01:20:22] And, and again, definitely a big change in that. And that's the way that Ellie is able to prove to Dina that she's immune by taking, you know, taking the mask off and Dina tries to give her her mask. Right. That's right. She's like, no, no, no, don't. Right. At that point it's like, yes, because they are at that point already a couple and they have been a couple for a while now. Yeah. That kind of makes sense that she might do that for Ellie. Sacrifice herself. Yeah.

[01:20:48] Well, cause the, this, the getting close scene, um, happens before they even leave Jackson in the game. Exactly. Yeah. That's in the weed room. Yeah. It's in Eugene 7-Eleven. It was a great, except it wasn't a 7-Eleven, but yeah. No, it wasn't. Uh, and then the theater, I was just stoked to see that. Me too. It looked so good and, uh, just felt like home. I just love, and even how the way she barred the door the same way by just sticking a chair in there. Yeah.

[01:21:17] You know, I remember seeing that in the video game and just thinking, oh, that's a really good idea. I need to remember that. I know. Me too. Yeah. Some future apocalypse. Yeah. Or just for the bathroom or something. I don't know. Um, so before we move on to talking about things a little bit more spoiler, is there anything else you can think of that I didn't mention? I'm sure there's a lot, but those are what stuck out to me. Yeah. I mean, I like learning, uh, at least in this world that, or in the show that Isaac was Fedra.

[01:21:46] I think that's kind of a cool, uh, nice little tweak to the whole thing to Isaac's mythology about who he was. He may have been in the game. I, I don't remember that for sure, but I don't, uh, it's not, my understanding is that you don't really know because all you ever see of him early on is a Fedra poster, a wanted poster. Okay. Uh, for him. So, I mean, he could have been, who knows, but he was definitely military. I know that's established in the game. Um, I, I did love that we got the backstory.

[01:22:16] I love that we did get more Seraphites. I really do love that they kind of tweaked with our, uh, subverted our expectations about the Seraphites being good. Now they get to see that they're just as fucked up as the wolves and, and everybody else. Um, yeah. And it really makes you appreciate Jackson that much more. Right. Yes. The worst thing in Jackson is, uh, Seth and maybe he's not even all that bad. Yeah. No, not compared to these two parties. Right. Okay.

[01:22:46] So now, um, there's just a couple things that I wanted to talk about that are maybe a little bit more spoilery for future things. So if you don't want to hear that, then you should stop listening and thanks for listening. Thanks everyone. So one thing that's in the game, but not in the show is that they show this really great scene where Joel is teaching. There's playing a song for Ellie and they connect.

[01:23:13] It's that Pearl Jam future days song. Yeah. And then that's where he says, I'm going to teach you to play guitar. And she says, okay. So then you get the idea from the game that they're going to be, uh, playing guitar. And, um, and in the show, they took that out. And I think it was so that when you got this scene, it would take on a little extra meaning. You'd be like, oh, they did, they did learn guitar together. He did teach her.

[01:23:40] And so the reason why I kept that in the spoilery section is just because I think it means that we will get that scene as a flashback at some point. Yeah. Episode six with the museum probably. That would be great. It's going to be. So actually what I thought you were going to mention, and this was something I wanted to wait for this is Tommy and the lack of Tommy, I think does make a bigger difference right now. Um, cause in the game, Tommy goes off Tom.

[01:24:09] I'll just say, so Ellie comes over and says, uh, I want to go get, I want to go get Abby. And Tommy's like, let me go ask Maria just like he did in the show. Only then he just goes off by himself. He just goes. Yeah. Um, so maybe Tommy will be with Jesse when Jesse shows up. I hope so. Maybe, maybe they're going to be like, you know, Maria is going to be like, okay, you can go, but there's no way in hell you're going alone. Take Jesse with you. We'll see. And I actually thought, look at those arms. Look at Jesse's arms.

[01:24:39] He has to go with you. I thought about that too. Cause when you mentioned shimmer, I thought actually leaving shimmer behind is going to be a lead that Tommy and Jesse are going to find. Okay. Yeah. It's going to be like, where are they girl? Yeah. Oh, down in the subway. Stamping, stamping his hook. I didn't mean it. The shimmer is going to lead them to, to Ellie. Ellie's in a well, but it's, it's going to be in an indication that Tommy and Jesse are on the right track to finding. Yeah. Yeah.

[01:25:09] Well, and in the show or excuse me, in the game, we have a number of points where they find Tommy's horse, uh, dead with a saddlebag. So it's, you know, Tommy's leaving his clues and they're following along on Tommy. So yeah, maybe they're going to reverse it. I think that it's kind of a switch. They're going to find their clues. I hope they don't just leave Tommy out. That would be a shame. Or, well, or Jesse. It would be. Yeah. There's a certain moment with Jesse that's pretty like keen to the story. Oh no, Jesse, Jesse has to be there.

[01:25:38] I think he'll, he'll be there for a while. Then he's going to find out that he's going to be dad number two and that'll be really depressing and sad. Uh, when, so I didn't, it didn't really occur to me during the game, but for some reason when I heard Ellie sing, I'll be gone in a day or two, I'm like, you sort of will mentally. I wonder if that was on purpose, you know?

[01:26:03] Like, cause, cause I think one reason why they're spending a lot of time with Ellie and Dina being so simpatico right now, getting together, being on the same page, being so loyal and devoted to each other and choosing to go on, even though Dina's pregnant, she's like, no, we'll be together is because at some point Dina won't be with Ellie anymore. Ellie will go too far and that'll be a contrast to what we're seeing right now. You know, I kind of worked that way in the game too, but yeah. And, and, you know, my, my impatience may be due to the fact that, you know, I think

[01:26:33] in the game, Ellie is at a higher level of that, you know, anger and hate and vengeful sort of thing right now. Um, that that's just throwing me off seeing her so light and bubbly still now waiting for next episode where we're going to get Nora. Hmm. Okay. That should be for all intents and purposes, the turning point, right? Um, if after that she's still playing cutesy and then I'll have a problem, I guess. But, um,

[01:27:03] You don't think they're going to like switch over to Abby and give us an Abby episode or something? Not anymore. Because I don't think so. You think they're going to wait until next season to give us the Abby stuff? I don't think so because they brought Caitlin Deaver in and I just, I find it hard to believe that she's barely in this season. And Jeffrey Wright. We've only got three more episodes. I bet you they'll do an Abby episode, but you might be right. We'll see. Maybe. I don't know. I mean, I just, I mean, truer words cannot be said.

[01:27:32] I don't know. Yeah. Um, and it's fun not to know. I really don't. Yeah. I think it is. So, so you guys have played the, through the game multiple times and I'm on my, my first actual second playthrough, uh, or first play first second playthrough for first playthrough of, yeah. First second playthrough of the game. Um, do we ever get more? So at the point in the game where I'm playing through now, I'm in the Abby storyline and I got to say too, in the, in the replay of it, like I always knew you get more sympathetic

[01:28:01] for Abby, but now that I'm replaying it, I'm remembering exactly why you become more sympathetic for Abby. Um, like I'm past the Owens on the run apostate. Like I'm through all of that, the sky. It's funny. Cause I'm looking in the background and I'm looking for high buildings and I'm like, are there any tall enough buildings that we can do the bridges later? Cause that would be a lot of fun. Oh yeah. You gotta have that. I hope they do that. Oh God. They will. They will. Terrified me.

[01:28:29] But like, do we ever get more Isaac than just that particular scene before Abby goes to find Owen? Well, there's his death scene. Oh, that's right. I mean, we do. And there's another scene in between that as well. There is another scene that we get. Now I'm wondering whether or not this kid that's with Isaac is the one that Owen goes out with. The. Now remember. So the thing is, is Owen goes out with somebody and he kills or he shoots and eventually

[01:28:58] kills another wolf and he's trying to protect a scar. That's why Owen's on the run and Isaac's out. Oh, maybe they're going to make this kid. Burton. That guy. Oh, the one that was in the truck with Isaac. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Well, that could be an interesting introduction to that character. Yeah. I mean, it's just a, just a thought, you know, and that would, that would extra tell you why Isaac would be that much more pissed that, um, Owen would turn. Yeah. Yeah.

[01:29:28] I realize I still have a lot to go in the game. Yeah. Yes, you do. Yeah. Even though I've been playing Abby for a while. The only other just little thing is we're getting all these little things from the game and like searching through drawers and throwing the bottle and stuff. And I think one thing we haven't gotten yet are, are two things, smoke bombs and trap bombs. And I bet you that that seems like something WLF would have.

[01:29:56] So I bet you when we spend more time with them, maybe we'll get those, you know, still waiting for the bricks. Damn it. Yeah. We need a brick to trip wires. I'm still waiting to, I'm still waiting to pick up the rope and toss it over something so that you can climb it. All the different times you do that in the game. Oh, or what? An extension cord that you have to toss over two different fences to get to a generator. Or the fire hose that you have to like toss down to climb. Yeah. I can truly live without pretty much all of those things.

[01:30:34] All right. That is our show. Episode 640. Thanks so much for listening, everybody. Next up will be The Walking Dead. Yes, I said it. The Walking Dead. Dead City. Season two. Episode one. Power equals power. Which Ben will be podcasting about tonight. What is Dead City? This is the, which one's Dead City? Negan and Maggie. Okay. Thank you. In New York. Yeah. As a matter of fact, I'm going to be recording that shortly after we're done recording this. This is the big wedding episode, right?

[01:31:04] Yeah. Yeah. Well, we found out that the wedding happened in between season one and two. Oh, okay. This is the honeymoon in Niagara. Oh, that's nice. Honeymoon in Vegas. Yeah. Well, I said Niagara because it's not far from New York. No. That was more believable. Yeah. If you guys didn't get a chance to listen to Ben and Alex on the, they did a recap of season one and I think they were great. And you guys are going to be great hosts together.

[01:31:32] It's going to be the two of you and then bringing in some other people to join you guys. Yeah. That's going to be fun. And yeah, you sent in an email addressing your opinion on Negan and where he stands in the universe. And I'm looking forward to reading that. We're going to read that on the, before we even start discussing episode one, we're going to talk about that. Oh my gosh. Yep. We're kicking off the episode with that email. Oh boy. Oh, you have a doozy of an email. I take it, huh? This is my thoughts.

[01:32:01] It's, I'm not going to say, regardless, it's, it's a, it's an interesting read. That's all I'll say. And I'm not saying that's good or bad. It's, you know, if you want to know, you got to listen. Oh, I think what this will, what this will accomplish, because I didn't know you were going to read it first, is it will make everyone happy that I'm not hosting this. Podcast. For that show. I would still like to have you on though. They'll appreciate you more. But that requires you actually watching the series. I will.

[01:32:31] Yeah. Maybe I'll come on for one. That'd be fun. There you go. If you want to write in or leave us a voice message about that or any, or the cast of us or the last of us, you can find all of our contact information at podcastica.com. And while you're there, please check out our other podcasts. Yes. I would recommend the walking dead, dead city with Ben, where he's going to read Jason's thoughts. First thing. This is the first I'm hearing of this. Also, Rima and Paik are back with strange indeed.

[01:33:00] They've been on a break for a while, but they're back talking about the final season of you on Netflix right now. Yeah. And I also would like to say this episode's made possible by Patreon supporters like Fiona Neal, who've pledged their support at patreon.com slash Jason Cabassi. So thank you to Fiona. She gets ad free episodes. I'm thinking about restructuring the prices on Patreon soon. So there might be a limited time to get in at the current pledge amounts if you guys

[01:33:29] want to do that. And again, I really do appreciate it. If it wasn't for you guys, I wouldn't be able to keep doing all this. So thank you so much. All right. That is our show. Thanks for listening. Don't get bit, Brandi Carrington.