“Familiar By Thy Side” (Agatha All Along S1E6)

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[00:01:17] [SPEAKER_12]: Keep telling yourself that.

[00:01:22] [SPEAKER_04]: When did you figure it out?

[00:01:24] [SPEAKER_12]: I had a feeling when we first met. Even with the sigil in the way, you and your mother have the same tell.

[00:01:35] [SPEAKER_11]: Which is?

[00:01:36] [SPEAKER_11]: Very inconvenient for you. I wasn't sure-sure until... you.

[00:01:59] [SPEAKER_12]: It's nice to see you again, Billy.

[00:02:03] [SPEAKER_07]: Hey everybody, welcome to Marvel TV cast from Podcastica. I'm Penny.

[00:02:36] [SPEAKER_03]: And I am Jim. And today we'll be talking about Agatha All Along, Season 1, Episode 6, Familiar By Thy Side.

[00:02:46] [SPEAKER_03]: And what a tasty episode this was.

[00:02:50] [SPEAKER_07]: I mean, we got so many answers to questions, but it just opened up all these new questions for me.

[00:02:58] [SPEAKER_03]: You know what I will say about the show, just in awe that I have about us doing this podcast, is that as we've talked out several things, a lot of these things that we're starting to see, we have certainly touched upon.

[00:03:16] [SPEAKER_03]: And I, we both were talking about either in the last episode or the episodes before about we have to have that teen episode where it goes back in time and kind of fills in the holes.

[00:03:27] [SPEAKER_03]: And I didn't think it was going to go quite back this far and just fill in all of the holes, which I thought was tremendous.

[00:03:32] [SPEAKER_03]: So I will commend both of us because I think we're, we're starting to hit a stride with this where we're starting, we're starting to get the rhythm of the show.

[00:03:40] [SPEAKER_03]: And with three episodes left, I starting to feel like I know where we're heading.

[00:03:43] [SPEAKER_07]: I feel like there's another big twist coming because in, in WandaVision, the Agatha twist happened in episode seven where Agnes was revealed as Agatha.

[00:03:59] [SPEAKER_03]: Yes.

[00:03:59] [SPEAKER_07]: So I'm guessing that there's a big twist, another big twist coming in episode eight of this nine part series.

[00:04:08] [SPEAKER_03]: Yes.

[00:04:09] [SPEAKER_03]: Well, there's so.

[00:04:10] [SPEAKER_07]: Like a bigger surprise.

[00:04:11] [SPEAKER_03]: I, again, I have a feeling we're going to be making some guesses as to certain things, but there's some big things that we still don't really know who's sort of controlling all of this.

[00:04:24] [SPEAKER_03]: And I think as I watched this episode, a couple of semi-important questions popped into my head that maybe didn't seem as important before that we'll kind of get into.

[00:04:34] [SPEAKER_03]: Not to mention the fact that as of, as we currently stand, we have two witches left.

[00:04:42] [SPEAKER_03]: I don't, I don't believe that to be, I don't believe that to be true.

[00:04:46] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[00:04:46] [SPEAKER_03]: But, you know, as they were walking down the road, we, we really had an episode that was sort of focused strictly on a teen who I guess we can now call William or Billy.

[00:04:57] [SPEAKER_03]: Billy, of course, he's kind of both.

[00:05:00] [SPEAKER_03]: And so right now we're, as we, as we end the episode, we, we really only saw it in current time to two of our witches.

[00:05:08] [SPEAKER_03]: So it'll be fun locating the rest as we head into the last three episodes, which makes me so sad.

[00:05:16] [SPEAKER_07]: I know only three episodes left.

[00:05:18] [SPEAKER_07]: That's crazy.

[00:05:18] [SPEAKER_07]: It's crazy.

[00:05:20] [SPEAKER_07]: Cause it's been such a fun ride.

[00:05:22] [SPEAKER_03]: Yes.

[00:05:22] [SPEAKER_07]: And it seems like it went by so fast.

[00:05:24] [SPEAKER_03]: Yes.

[00:05:25] [SPEAKER_07]: Um, so where should we start digging in?

[00:05:29] [SPEAKER_07]: Do you want to start, do you want to go kind of chronological?

[00:05:33] [SPEAKER_03]: Well, yes.

[00:05:34] [SPEAKER_07]: Start with the bar mitzvah.

[00:05:35] [SPEAKER_03]: Because I think that short period of time that Jack Schaefer introduced us to William was very impactful in making us feel attached to a character that we really have not known and only knew for about five minutes of the episode.

[00:06:00] [SPEAKER_03]: But I, um, of course the episode starts with William, who at the moment, that moment we don't know is a different character from the one that we're dealing with.

[00:06:11] [SPEAKER_03]: And well, I mean, maybe isn't in some ways, but.

[00:06:15] [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[00:06:15] [SPEAKER_07]: It's very unclear.

[00:06:16] [SPEAKER_03]: I, I immediately was, I mean, just on a, on a, in a visceral sense, I was, I love it when shows just in the normal storytelling mode introduces, you know, to the viewers, to things that I think it's important that we see.

[00:06:38] [SPEAKER_03]: And I love that, uh, in a, in a series that has delved into LGBTQ plus in a series that has, um, handled these really finicky situations, um, with, with.

[00:06:55] [SPEAKER_03]: Just the, the, the.

[00:06:59] [SPEAKER_03]: Fantastic hands of, of care.

[00:07:01] [SPEAKER_03]: Um, we, we get to meet William who is going through his bar mitzvah, which is important in that, um, it gives us kind of a cultural reference point.

[00:07:09] [SPEAKER_03]: And it also, um, gives us an age because of course you go through your bar mitzvah, your bar mitzvah at the age of 13.

[00:07:16] [SPEAKER_03]: And of course we know, um, that something happened to him at the age of 13.

[00:07:20] [SPEAKER_03]: So, um, I'm going to pass the torch onto you with this, but I, I, I loved, I loved the, the scenes of the bar mitzvah.

[00:07:29] [SPEAKER_03]: I love that the, uh, the background of William was quickly, um, kind of informed upon us as, you know, he's kind of interested in, in magic.

[00:07:40] [SPEAKER_03]: Because if you looked on the, uh, um, his invitations that you could kind of see on the side, it said it was a magic mitzvah.

[00:07:48] [SPEAKER_03]: Uh, and then of course the theme at the, at the, at the bar mitzvah was, was of course magic as we got introduced to some very familiar faces.

[00:07:55] [SPEAKER_03]: But I, I'm going to stop there.

[00:07:57] [SPEAKER_03]: I just loved the intro.

[00:07:58] [SPEAKER_03]: I loved getting to know William, uh, of course, before I guess the first surprise happened, um, at the tail end of the bar mitzvah.

[00:08:06] [SPEAKER_03]: But I'm going to, I'm going to pause there because I'm going to let you kind of dive into it.

[00:08:09] [SPEAKER_03]: What did you think of the intro?

[00:08:11] [SPEAKER_03]: Because I was not expecting it at all.

[00:08:15] [SPEAKER_07]: I wasn't either.

[00:08:16] [SPEAKER_07]: And I'm so glad that they did because there are other shows where there's a huge cliffhanger or revelation at the last minute of one episode.

[00:08:24] [SPEAKER_07]: And then the next episode starts in a completely different place.

[00:08:27] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[00:08:27] [SPEAKER_07]: And so you're like, no, we want to know.

[00:08:30] [SPEAKER_07]: In this one, it was like, oh, you want to know who he was?

[00:08:32] [SPEAKER_07]: Like who he is?

[00:08:33] [SPEAKER_07]: Let's just, we'll go right there.

[00:08:35] [SPEAKER_07]: Here is who we're going to answer some questions.

[00:08:37] [SPEAKER_03]: Here is not only who he is, but here's who he was.

[00:08:40] [SPEAKER_03]: Here's who he became.

[00:08:42] [SPEAKER_07]: Here's everything we need to know.

[00:08:44] [SPEAKER_03]: Fantastic.

[00:08:44] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[00:08:46] [SPEAKER_07]: And having it, you know, it be the day of his bar mitzvah, we get to see his proud, happy parents.

[00:08:53] [SPEAKER_07]: They look like, like the most like wholesome, normal little Jewish family in the whole world.

[00:09:00] [SPEAKER_07]: Right.

[00:09:00] [SPEAKER_07]: He's like the, the quintessential nice Jewish boy.

[00:09:03] [SPEAKER_07]: And he's got this like, you know, slightly ritzy, but not super over the top ritzy bar mitzvah going on.

[00:09:11] [SPEAKER_07]: It's very relatable.

[00:09:11] [SPEAKER_07]: It looked like a bar mitzvah that I've been to before.

[00:09:15] [SPEAKER_07]: You know, he seems really happy.

[00:09:17] [SPEAKER_07]: Like there's the, they do the chair dance and he's got this like, I'm the center of attention.

[00:09:21] [SPEAKER_07]: Do I like it?

[00:09:23] [SPEAKER_07]: I don't know.

[00:09:23] [SPEAKER_07]: Kind of quality about him.

[00:09:25] [SPEAKER_07]: That's very like 13 year old.

[00:09:27] [SPEAKER_07]: And then, you know, he goes in to the fortune teller tent and it's Lilia, which I was like, oh, so he's met Lilia before.

[00:09:37] [SPEAKER_07]: Like, why didn't she recognize him?

[00:09:39] [SPEAKER_07]: And then of course it's because she's the one that puts the sigil on him.

[00:09:43] [SPEAKER_07]: It's like all this time I thought it was, he did it to himself or something.

[00:09:48] [SPEAKER_03]: Well, I, I mean, I, I think that the three that have been, you know, we've talked about, you know, Agatha himself or pot.

[00:09:56] [SPEAKER_03]: Well, I guess four, because I think there was a small part of me that thought Rio, Rio might've been involved or Wanda.

[00:10:01] [SPEAKER_03]: And it turns out to be Lilia, which is as to me, adds another question onto the pile of questions that we have.

[00:10:09] [SPEAKER_07]: Right.

[00:10:09] [SPEAKER_07]: I don't completely understand why she did that.

[00:10:12] [SPEAKER_07]: She knew from looking at his palm that, that his lifeline was broken into.

[00:10:18] [SPEAKER_07]: Yes.

[00:10:18] [SPEAKER_07]: And then she's like, that could mean a lot of things.

[00:10:20] [SPEAKER_07]: It could just mean change or transformation.

[00:10:23] [SPEAKER_07]: And he's like, okay.

[00:10:25] [SPEAKER_07]: And she says, she says the tower.

[00:10:28] [SPEAKER_07]: And then he's like, what?

[00:10:29] [SPEAKER_07]: And she's like, oh, I just remembered something.

[00:10:32] [SPEAKER_07]: Which is interesting.

[00:10:35] [SPEAKER_07]: And I'll come back to that about remembering.

[00:10:36] [SPEAKER_07]: Um, the tower is a tarot card that like, she keeps yelling out these tarot cards and the tower is, it means, um, when it's upright, it means catastrophic change.

[00:10:50] [SPEAKER_07]: It, it's used to relate calamities like, uh, you know, a volcano erupting, an earthquake or personal calamities like, you know, a death in the family or going bankrupt or, you know, horrible.

[00:11:05] [SPEAKER_07]: It's not a good card.

[00:11:07] [SPEAKER_07]: You don't want to get it.

[00:11:08] [SPEAKER_07]: And then I found a few different meanings for what it means when it's reversed because she specifically said the tower reversed.

[00:11:14] [SPEAKER_07]: Yes.

[00:11:14] [SPEAKER_07]: And that means that it's, it's upside down.

[00:11:16] [SPEAKER_07]: Um, and one of the meanings I heard was that it means negligence, absence, distribution.

[00:11:22] [SPEAKER_07]: I don't even know what that means.

[00:11:23] [SPEAKER_07]: Carelessness.

[00:11:24] [SPEAKER_07]: I don't think that's what it is.

[00:11:25] [SPEAKER_07]: The other place I found a meaning, it says resisting change, averting disaster, avoiding tragedy, delaying the inevitable, inevitable and avoiding loss.

[00:11:36] [SPEAKER_07]: And it doesn't seem like that's quite right either because he did have catastrophic change in his life.

[00:11:43] [SPEAKER_07]: Right.

[00:11:44] [SPEAKER_07]: He, he died.

[00:11:45] [SPEAKER_07]: Yes.

[00:11:45] [SPEAKER_07]: Or something.

[00:11:47] [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[00:11:47] [SPEAKER_07]: And then he is now host to, or has been replaced by Billy Maximoff in his body.

[00:11:55] [SPEAKER_07]: And I, uh, I, I'm still trying to figure out why she said the tower reversed unless when she says these, these tarot card, when she yells out these tarot cards, I don't know if it's related to the person in front of her or if she's, you know, quote unquote, remembering.

[00:12:16] [SPEAKER_07]: And then she says, she's remembering a future event where she's doing a tarot reading.

[00:12:20] [SPEAKER_07]: Yes.

[00:12:20] [SPEAKER_07]: And these are the cards that she's reading.

[00:12:22] [SPEAKER_03]: Well, well, so.

[00:12:23] [SPEAKER_03]: If that's true.

[00:12:25] [SPEAKER_03]: It could mean anything, right?

[00:12:27] [SPEAKER_07]: It could mean a lot of different things because we don't know if the order that she said the cards corresponds to the order of a tarot reading.

[00:12:37] [SPEAKER_07]: And if it does, then is it chronological by when we saw it in the show?

[00:12:43] [SPEAKER_07]: I don't think so.

[00:12:44] [SPEAKER_07]: I think it would be chronological as to when she said it within the world of the show.

[00:12:48] [SPEAKER_07]: So the tarot would be the first card.

[00:12:50] [SPEAKER_02]: First swat card.

[00:12:51] [SPEAKER_07]: And if it's the first card, it represents the general situation.

[00:12:54] [SPEAKER_07]: The second thing she says is high priestess.

[00:12:57] [SPEAKER_07]: This is another aspect of the general situation.

[00:13:00] [SPEAKER_07]: I thought originally that meant she was calling Jen high priestess.

[00:13:03] [SPEAKER_07]: But I think, I think that Agatha is the high priestess.

[00:13:07] [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[00:13:07] [SPEAKER_07]: It's like big catastrophe change related to Agatha.

[00:13:12] [SPEAKER_07]: And then the third card she said was, I've got this written down just to get to the right part of my notes.

[00:13:19] [SPEAKER_07]: Three of pentacles.

[00:13:20] [SPEAKER_07]: Yes.

[00:13:21] [SPEAKER_07]: And the third card is what's on your mind?

[00:13:25] [SPEAKER_07]: I don't know if that's right.

[00:13:27] [SPEAKER_07]: That's just one way to read the cards.

[00:13:29] [SPEAKER_07]: But that would be three of pentacles, which is, you know, this teamwork concept.

[00:13:34] [SPEAKER_02]: Right.

[00:13:34] [SPEAKER_07]: Although she said three of pentacles before she said high priestess.

[00:13:38] [SPEAKER_07]: So now that I think about it, that would mean three of pentacles is part of the general situation.

[00:13:43] [SPEAKER_07]: So it's a catastrophic event about a team.

[00:13:46] [SPEAKER_07]: And then high priestess would be what's on your mind.

[00:13:49] [SPEAKER_04]: Okay.

[00:13:49] [SPEAKER_07]: Maybe.

[00:13:50] [SPEAKER_07]: And then the next card she said was three of swords.

[00:13:55] [SPEAKER_03]: Three of swords.

[00:13:56] [SPEAKER_03]: She said that written down.

[00:13:57] [SPEAKER_03]: Yep.

[00:13:58] [SPEAKER_07]: Yep.

[00:13:58] [SPEAKER_07]: The three of swords, that's in the fourth position.

[00:14:01] [SPEAKER_07]: And that means it's an influence over the last several years.

[00:14:07] [SPEAKER_07]: Okay.

[00:14:07] [SPEAKER_07]: Like a recent influence.

[00:14:09] [SPEAKER_07]: And three of swords was about a breakup.

[00:14:12] [SPEAKER_07]: So I don't know where I'm going with this.

[00:14:15] [SPEAKER_07]: Because after that, it kind of falls apart.

[00:14:18] [SPEAKER_07]: But I'm going to keep track of the tarot cards and I'm going to keep trying to figure it out.

[00:14:22] [SPEAKER_03]: Well, I think, I think too.

[00:14:25] [SPEAKER_07]: It's definitely a narrative device.

[00:14:26] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[00:14:26] [SPEAKER_03]: Well, yes.

[00:14:27] [SPEAKER_03]: And I think Patti LuPone's character obviously is the central force of all of this.

[00:14:35] [SPEAKER_03]: And obviously her story, I'm really intrigued with what they do with her story simply because I don't think they like to use the same storytelling device, which means I don't think we're going to get a story with her where we go back in time and kind of have all of these pieces fit together that way.

[00:14:55] [SPEAKER_03]: I think they'll tell her story differently.

[00:15:25] [SPEAKER_03]: It's hard to tell.

[00:15:25] [SPEAKER_03]: But that's what I love about.

[00:15:26] [SPEAKER_03]: That's what I love about this.

[00:15:27] [SPEAKER_03]: We know that they're putting a puzzle together.

[00:15:29] [SPEAKER_03]: We just don't know how it's all going to fit.

[00:15:31] [SPEAKER_03]: But if they put it together as well as they did this episode, I think we're in good hands those last three episodes.

[00:15:36] [SPEAKER_03]: I do think we have to get Lily's episode next.

[00:15:40] [SPEAKER_03]: And I don't want to jump ahead.

[00:15:41] [SPEAKER_03]: But obviously we're running out of trials.

[00:15:46] [SPEAKER_03]: And I do believe that her trial is next.

[00:15:49] [SPEAKER_03]: So I think we're going to get those answers, which should leave us perched right at the end of the road.

[00:15:57] [SPEAKER_03]: No pun intended.

[00:15:58] [SPEAKER_03]: And I guess this is where you call in the boys to men to start singing the end of the road, I guess.

[00:16:02] [SPEAKER_03]: But, you know, as we still have a little bit more path and how that path gets filled in and how we get all these cards fit together.

[00:16:10] [SPEAKER_03]: I'm just thankful that you're here to at least make sense of some of these cards because I'm trying.

[00:16:16] [SPEAKER_03]: Well, it's interesting because when it when it said tower reversed, there was and I did not think about I wrote it down, but I didn't really think it connected there.

[00:16:27] [SPEAKER_03]: If you remember, we got a there was that that shot of Billy.

[00:16:31] [SPEAKER_03]: Well, William at the time in the in her her ball, her.

[00:16:39] [SPEAKER_03]: Fortune ball, what are they called?

[00:16:42] [SPEAKER_03]: The cheese crystal ball, crystal ball.

[00:16:44] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, she had a crystal ball sitting there in the middle.

[00:16:47] [SPEAKER_03]: And there was a scene there where he was literally upside down in that crystal ball.

[00:16:53] [SPEAKER_03]: So when you if the tower means it's flipped upside down, I would think that there may be shot that shot to let us know that they were talking about him specifically.

[00:17:00] [SPEAKER_03]: But how that pertains to to that information is hard, hard to say, although I would think it might have been somewhat foreshadowing what was to come within the next few minutes because his life.

[00:17:13] [SPEAKER_03]: Well, his life ends in the next few minutes.

[00:17:16] [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah. And then but kind of goes on, like depending on I mean, it was a big question that they talked about at the end of WandaVision between the two visions.

[00:17:25] [SPEAKER_07]: Right. Like, sure.

[00:17:27] [SPEAKER_07]: It is if you don't have the memories, but you do have the body.

[00:17:30] [SPEAKER_07]: But if you don't have the body, but you do have like who's the real William Kaplan?

[00:17:34] [SPEAKER_07]: Is he is Billy completely replaced William Kaplan?

[00:17:38] [SPEAKER_07]: Because he doesn't seem to remember his life as Billy any more than he remembers the first 13 years of William's life.

[00:17:45] [SPEAKER_07]: So.

[00:17:46] [SPEAKER_07]: Is it like the two are merged and they're a completely new being like it's it's not really settled?

[00:17:53] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I I kind of thought it was I was hard for me to piece that together because I.

[00:18:00] [SPEAKER_03]: I, you know, I was hoping there'd be kind of shadows.

[00:18:04] [SPEAKER_03]: I did not want William to be gone.

[00:18:06] [SPEAKER_03]: That was such a sad story to tell because.

[00:18:09] [SPEAKER_07]: Because he's such a sweetie pie.

[00:18:11] [SPEAKER_07]: And then his parents are so relatable.

[00:18:14] [SPEAKER_07]: Right.

[00:18:14] [SPEAKER_07]: They're like, we just want him to be OK.

[00:18:16] [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[00:18:17] [SPEAKER_07]: This is so hard.

[00:18:18] [SPEAKER_07]: And he's like, stop, stop worrying.

[00:18:19] [SPEAKER_07]: And who was it?

[00:18:23] [SPEAKER_07]: It was Sam.

[00:18:23] [SPEAKER_07]: Our friend Sam texted like, I still don't want telepathy ever.

[00:18:27] [SPEAKER_07]: I never, ever want telepathy.

[00:18:29] [SPEAKER_07]: This does not make it look good.

[00:18:31] [SPEAKER_07]: Like I there's a Buffy episode where she gets the ability to hear people's thoughts.

[00:18:35] [SPEAKER_07]: And that episode makes it very clear that it's not a gift.

[00:18:39] [SPEAKER_07]: Right.

[00:18:40] [SPEAKER_07]: It's horrible.

[00:18:40] [SPEAKER_07]: And in this case where he can't control it again, it's it's horrible.

[00:18:45] [SPEAKER_07]: Before he leaves the the fortune teller tent, he does drop a line.

[00:18:51] [SPEAKER_07]: I love the vibe in here.

[00:18:52] [SPEAKER_07]: It's very early Argento.

[00:18:54] [SPEAKER_07]: Yes.

[00:18:55] [SPEAKER_07]: This is such a deep cut.

[00:18:57] [SPEAKER_07]: Yes.

[00:18:57] [SPEAKER_07]: Argento is an Italian film director known for his work in horror.

[00:19:02] [SPEAKER_07]: And this is 70s, 80s horror movies, which last week's episode pulled from.

[00:19:09] [SPEAKER_07]: But not these.

[00:19:11] [SPEAKER_07]: His Argento's movies are.

[00:19:14] [SPEAKER_07]: Um.

[00:19:15] [SPEAKER_07]: Uh.

[00:19:18] [SPEAKER_07]: Suspiria is probably the best known one.

[00:19:21] [SPEAKER_07]: Mother of tears, deep red, tenebrae, phenomena, opera, four flies on the gray velvet, three mothers.

[00:19:29] [SPEAKER_07]: Oh, that's the name of Suspiria Inferno and the mother of tears.

[00:19:33] [SPEAKER_07]: Um.

[00:19:34] [SPEAKER_07]: And then he also worked on Dawn of the Dead.

[00:19:37] [SPEAKER_07]: Yes.

[00:19:39] [SPEAKER_07]: Um.

[00:19:40] [SPEAKER_07]: And once upon a time in the West, which is hilarious.

[00:19:42] [SPEAKER_07]: That's like so out there.

[00:19:44] [SPEAKER_07]: Well, when I when I heard that was such a specific pull.

[00:19:47] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[00:19:48] [SPEAKER_03]: Well, I.

[00:19:48] [SPEAKER_03]: So my background and my history when when that was said, I immediately thought of the Western.

[00:19:56] [SPEAKER_03]: I didn't think of all of the horror movies that he had done, which is so when I did my research and found out that he had done a trilogy about three witches called the three mothers.

[00:20:06] [SPEAKER_03]: I was like, oh, OK.

[00:20:08] [SPEAKER_03]: Then then when I realized I've watched two of them and didn't know that they were his movies.

[00:20:12] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, I again, the the the deep cuts that they put in in these shows are fantastic.

[00:20:20] [SPEAKER_03]: Now, I don't know much about those movies.

[00:20:21] [SPEAKER_03]: Those movies didn't didn't impact me the way they may may have other people.

[00:20:26] [SPEAKER_03]: So I don't know how if there was any if the deep cut was maybe an homage just to those movies or if there was more to it.

[00:20:33] [SPEAKER_03]: But I love that.

[00:20:35] [SPEAKER_07]: So, yeah, I.

[00:20:36] [SPEAKER_07]: I haven't seen most of these movies and the ones I've seen, I barely remember.

[00:20:40] [SPEAKER_07]: So I'm going to have to maybe dig into that a little bit more.

[00:20:44] [SPEAKER_07]: I loved the contrast of how.

[00:20:48] [SPEAKER_07]: Like deeply normal and not very interesting, the Kaplan parents are like there's hardly any decor in their house.

[00:20:54] [SPEAKER_07]: Everything is really muted and and they're just like they're they're just pleasant, nice people.

[00:21:01] [SPEAKER_07]: There's nothing really remarkable about them other than dad's cooking.

[00:21:07] [SPEAKER_03]: Dad's cooking, which if you remember, like you mentioned this.

[00:21:11] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[00:21:12] [SPEAKER_03]: In episode.

[00:21:14] [SPEAKER_03]: Three, when Jen was was doing her potions.

[00:21:22] [SPEAKER_03]: The teen goes and grabs the.

[00:21:26] [SPEAKER_07]: Oh, the sous vide sous vide.

[00:21:27] [SPEAKER_03]: And he mentioned that his dad had taught him what that was for.

[00:21:31] [SPEAKER_03]: And you had mentioned in the podcast that I'll bet his dad is a cook or something like that.

[00:21:36] [SPEAKER_03]: And sure enough, they tie again.

[00:21:38] [SPEAKER_07]: And a gadget guy.

[00:21:39] [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[00:21:39] [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[00:21:40] [SPEAKER_03]: Just a very small.

[00:21:41] [SPEAKER_03]: But you're I and I love.

[00:21:43] [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[00:21:44] [SPEAKER_03]: I know him.

[00:21:45] [SPEAKER_03]: The man that Paul Adelstein, like he's been in a lot of like TV shows over the years.

[00:21:50] [SPEAKER_03]: And they portrayed that simpleness very well.

[00:21:55] [SPEAKER_03]: I thought there they portrayed the pain of.

[00:22:00] [SPEAKER_03]: Having partially been responsible for the car accident, even though they weren't.

[00:22:05] [SPEAKER_03]: But, you know, any good any good parent who's driving a car will will probably blame themselves for that accident.

[00:22:11] [SPEAKER_03]: Trying to figure out why their son is is gone.

[00:22:14] [SPEAKER_03]: And I found myself as the show proceeded trying to figure out if they were living in an area of.

[00:22:23] [SPEAKER_03]: OK, the parents are they think that their son is is is back to normal and everything's good.

[00:22:28] [SPEAKER_03]: And I found myself wondering if if that was the way it was or if they were all kind of living on on those tiptoes that you might have.

[00:22:37] [SPEAKER_03]: If you know your son isn't quite who you think who you think he was.

[00:22:41] [SPEAKER_03]: And obviously he was pretending to be to be William.

[00:22:44] [SPEAKER_03]: I just found that fascinating kind of as a kind of the backstory of that episode is, you know, three years later, he's just pretending to be William.

[00:22:54] [SPEAKER_03]: With this insane room, which we'll get to in a few minutes.

[00:22:57] [SPEAKER_07]: But oh, my God, his room.

[00:23:00] [SPEAKER_07]: The room is so great.

[00:23:02] [SPEAKER_07]: All right.

[00:23:03] [SPEAKER_07]: Let's just go there because we've talked about the parents.

[00:23:05] [SPEAKER_07]: So we see his room when as William Kaplan's room and then we see it three years later as Billy's room.

[00:23:13] [SPEAKER_07]: Yes.

[00:23:13] [SPEAKER_07]: So when we first see it as William's room, first of all, it is so blue.

[00:23:18] [SPEAKER_07]: It could not be more blue.

[00:23:19] [SPEAKER_07]: There's so much blue in that room.

[00:23:20] [SPEAKER_07]: It's like blue on top of blue on top of blue.

[00:23:23] [SPEAKER_07]: All right.

[00:23:23] [SPEAKER_07]: We get it.

[00:23:24] [SPEAKER_07]: His color is blue.

[00:23:25] [SPEAKER_07]: He's into magic and Houdini.

[00:23:27] [SPEAKER_07]: He's got a couple of different Houdini posters.

[00:23:29] [SPEAKER_07]: What I could clock.

[00:23:30] [SPEAKER_07]: There was a lot of stuff that was soft focus.

[00:23:32] [SPEAKER_07]: So I just I could not tell what it was.

[00:23:34] [SPEAKER_07]: But the ones I could read.

[00:23:35] [SPEAKER_07]: There's a poster for Assateague Island, which is a place I have always wanted to go my whole life.

[00:23:40] [SPEAKER_07]: I don't know what that has to do with witchcraft, but I'm like Assateague Island.

[00:23:44] [SPEAKER_07]: So cool.

[00:23:46] [SPEAKER_07]: The Alice in Wonderland Disney movie.

[00:23:49] [SPEAKER_07]: Yes.

[00:23:50] [SPEAKER_07]: The Wonderful Wizard of Oz looked very much like the books.

[00:23:53] [SPEAKER_07]: I don't think that poster had anything to do with the movies.

[00:23:56] [SPEAKER_03]: It definitely was the I think the original book cover.

[00:23:59] [SPEAKER_03]: I used to have the original, not the original, obviously not a first edition or anything like that.

[00:24:05] [SPEAKER_03]: But my first Wizard of Oz book had that cover, that same cover on it.

[00:24:10] [SPEAKER_03]: So either it was that original cover or whatever version cover that I had when I was a kid.

[00:24:16] [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, there was a poster for the Disney movie, The Black Cauldron, a pennant about Eastview, a bunch of pictures of his family.

[00:24:26] [SPEAKER_07]: There's like a framed image of an old man surrounded by books and globes.

[00:24:31] [SPEAKER_07]: I couldn't tell if that man was meant to be a wizard or like someone famous that I just didn't recognize.

[00:24:36] [SPEAKER_03]: That's I feel like it's one of those paintings that I've seen.

[00:24:42] [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[00:24:43] [SPEAKER_03]: You know, kind of flipping through maybe maybe paintings that are in like the Louvre or something.

[00:24:47] [SPEAKER_03]: I think it's a famous painting, but I don't know much about it.

[00:24:51] [SPEAKER_03]: And I tried to find it, but I just couldn't.

[00:24:53] [SPEAKER_03]: And I kind of stayed away from, you know, I didn't want to connect it to the show in any way because I didn't want any spoilers.

[00:25:00] [SPEAKER_03]: So I but I that looked familiar to me.

[00:25:03] [SPEAKER_03]: And I I don't know if they were just trying to get us in the theme of wizardry, but that's what it that's what it put in my head.

[00:25:09] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, this this seemed to be a kid who, you know, I'm surprised there wasn't like Lord of the Rings stuff sitting there.

[00:25:16] [SPEAKER_03]: So, well, they probably couldn't get the rights.

[00:25:19] [SPEAKER_03]: Yes.

[00:25:19] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[00:25:19] [SPEAKER_03]: Well, most there was a lot of a lot of Disney connections.

[00:25:23] [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[00:25:24] [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[00:25:24] [SPEAKER_07]: And also there were a couple of things that I was like, oh, they're just doing like there was a poster for a movie called Goofballs.

[00:25:31] [SPEAKER_07]: And I was like, is that Goonies?

[00:25:33] [SPEAKER_07]: Is that Goonies?

[00:25:35] [SPEAKER_07]: Well, there was a poster for something like Mystic Rock.

[00:25:38] [SPEAKER_07]: It said it's every Friday.

[00:25:39] [SPEAKER_07]: So that seems like a radio show or something.

[00:25:43] [SPEAKER_07]: Harry Houdini, King of Cards.

[00:25:45] [SPEAKER_07]: I didn't see that.

[00:25:46] [SPEAKER_07]: Another Harry Houdini poster that said Master Mystifier.

[00:25:50] [SPEAKER_07]: A whole mess of board games.

[00:25:52] [SPEAKER_07]: The ones I could read were Stay Alive, Operation, Carcassonne, Hang on Harvey.

[00:25:58] [SPEAKER_07]: There was this like medieval-ish looking illustrated map.

[00:26:02] [SPEAKER_07]: A movie poster for Goofballs.

[00:26:04] [SPEAKER_07]: Wizard of Oz figurines.

[00:26:06] [SPEAKER_07]: Yes.

[00:26:07] [SPEAKER_07]: I saw the witch, Dorothy, the Scarecrow and the Lion.

[00:26:10] [SPEAKER_07]: A box set of all of the Wizard of Oz books.

[00:26:13] [SPEAKER_07]: They were centered on his dresser, like place of honor.

[00:26:17] [SPEAKER_07]: And there was a moon like globe light, like pendant lamp that I was like, oh, I want that.

[00:26:23] [SPEAKER_07]: That's cool.

[00:26:25] [SPEAKER_07]: They did a really cool mirror shot where he's like looking in the floor length mirror at himself.

[00:26:31] [SPEAKER_07]: And he says, William Kaplan.

[00:26:32] [SPEAKER_07]: I'm William Kaplan.

[00:26:34] [SPEAKER_07]: And there's a small mirror on the dresser.

[00:26:35] [SPEAKER_07]: So you get two shots of him, of his face, of him looking at himself.

[00:26:41] [SPEAKER_07]: And he looks from one mirror to the other.

[00:26:43] [SPEAKER_07]: And I watched it several times.

[00:26:45] [SPEAKER_07]: I don't think either of those reflections does something weird.

[00:26:48] [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[00:26:48] [SPEAKER_07]: But it did sort of suggest visually that there's like a split personality situation going on there.

[00:26:57] [SPEAKER_07]: It was just beautiful photography.

[00:26:59] [SPEAKER_07]: And I was thinking about how mirrors were used in Doctor Strange Multiverse of Madness.

[00:27:06] [SPEAKER_07]: And how like Scarlet Witch moved through mirrors and stuff.

[00:27:09] [SPEAKER_07]: And so I was like, maybe that's just a little homage.

[00:27:12] [SPEAKER_03]: Well, and I connected those two shots too to that initial shot where he was flipped upside down.

[00:27:20] [SPEAKER_03]: Like they definitely were doing some things with mirrors and reflections and windows.

[00:27:25] [SPEAKER_03]: And we get to see him through some windows.

[00:27:29] [SPEAKER_03]: And going back to the initial like five minutes when he was in the hospital after he became Billy,

[00:27:39] [SPEAKER_03]: we see him through initially we see him through the windows of the hospital room.

[00:27:47] [SPEAKER_03]: And then as he comes home, that really kind of creepy scene where he walks up to the door and we see those balloons kind of creep up to the window.

[00:27:56] [SPEAKER_07]: And we see him through that little window.

[00:27:58] [SPEAKER_03]: So there was a lot of that window and reflection things.

[00:28:02] [SPEAKER_03]: And there was somebody, you know, Ben and Kristen did a Lost rewatch.

[00:28:10] [SPEAKER_03]: And there was someone who was calling in and Lost depended a lot on.

[00:28:14] [SPEAKER_03]: And I got to find out who that was because he did these like really in-depth like sort of watch alongs with these mirror reflections and Lost.

[00:28:23] [SPEAKER_03]: And I kind of want to get him to watch that up this episode to see what he thinks.

[00:28:26] [SPEAKER_03]: Because it seemed like this dealt a lot with screens and windows and mirrors.

[00:28:35] [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, there was definitely something going on with reflections.

[00:28:39] [SPEAKER_07]: And I'm therefore, I love mirror shots.

[00:28:42] [SPEAKER_07]: I'm sort of known for taking mirror selfies with convex mirrors.

[00:28:51] [SPEAKER_07]: Because I think they're fun.

[00:28:53] [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[00:29:20] [SPEAKER_05]: Thank you.

[00:29:49] [SPEAKER_03]: There were two things that struck me about...

[00:29:56] [SPEAKER_03]: You mentioned the Black Cauldron.

[00:29:58] [SPEAKER_03]: And I...

[00:29:59] [SPEAKER_03]: The minute I saw that poster, that movie jumped out to me.

[00:30:03] [SPEAKER_03]: Because that movie in the lore of Disney is a kind of...

[00:30:09] [SPEAKER_03]: It carries a lot of weight.

[00:30:10] [SPEAKER_03]: Because there's a lot of firsts.

[00:30:12] [SPEAKER_03]: That came out in 1985.

[00:30:13] [SPEAKER_03]: You know, when I was still...

[00:30:15] [SPEAKER_03]: Actually, I think I was 14 when that movie came out.

[00:30:19] [SPEAKER_03]: And I remember seeing it and being mortified by the movie.

[00:30:22] [SPEAKER_03]: But the movie has a ton of history.

[00:30:24] [SPEAKER_03]: Just some fun little facts.

[00:30:26] [SPEAKER_03]: That was a movie that Tim Burton was working on.

[00:30:29] [SPEAKER_03]: Not as a director.

[00:30:30] [SPEAKER_03]: But he was part of, I think, just...

[00:30:34] [SPEAKER_03]: I can't remember what his role...

[00:30:35] [SPEAKER_03]: Because he was an artist or conceptual artist in that film.

[00:30:38] [SPEAKER_03]: But that movie was initially...

[00:30:40] [SPEAKER_03]: So PG-13 came out in July of 84.

[00:30:45] [SPEAKER_03]: And Disney had never done a movie that wasn't a musical.

[00:30:49] [SPEAKER_03]: And had never done a movie that wasn't rated G.

[00:30:52] [SPEAKER_03]: This movie, when it first got screened, was going to get screened as a rated R movie.

[00:30:57] [SPEAKER_03]: And Disney didn't want to have anything...

[00:30:59] [SPEAKER_03]: Really?

[00:30:59] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[00:31:00] [SPEAKER_03]: Didn't want to have anything to do with that.

[00:31:02] [SPEAKER_03]: The second two times it got screened, they were going to PG-13 it.

[00:31:06] [SPEAKER_03]: So they had to edit it down.

[00:31:07] [SPEAKER_03]: And they took out a lot of hidden footage.

[00:31:11] [SPEAKER_03]: They took out a lot of footage, which has become like hidden footage that everybody will kind of want ads added to the movie.

[00:31:17] [SPEAKER_03]: But the movie itself came out.

[00:31:20] [SPEAKER_03]: So fought the PG-13.

[00:31:22] [SPEAKER_03]: It became the first PG movie that Disney put out.

[00:31:27] [SPEAKER_03]: And if you ever watch it, it is one of the creepiest animated movies that they've ever put out at its current state.

[00:31:36] [SPEAKER_03]: Let alone some of the snippets that have come out over time.

[00:31:39] [SPEAKER_03]: There's lots of death in it that could have been in it that got taken out.

[00:31:43] [SPEAKER_03]: But the movie is about three witches.

[00:31:45] [SPEAKER_03]: Which, again, kind of connects to us.

[00:31:48] [SPEAKER_03]: And again, if you haven't seen Black Cauldron, it didn't do very well at the box office back in the day.

[00:31:54] [SPEAKER_03]: Because it just definitely wasn't.

[00:31:56] [SPEAKER_03]: It didn't fit into the confines of a Disney movie.

[00:32:00] [SPEAKER_03]: And it's just super creepy.

[00:32:03] [SPEAKER_03]: I haven't seen it in a book.

[00:32:04] [SPEAKER_07]: It's one of my favorite books.

[00:32:07] [SPEAKER_07]: Oh, yes.

[00:32:09] [SPEAKER_07]: I read those books.

[00:32:12] [SPEAKER_07]: Lloyd Alexander.

[00:32:13] [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, it's Lloyd Alexander.

[00:32:14] [SPEAKER_07]: That's right.

[00:32:14] [SPEAKER_07]: It's the first book of the series called The Chronicles of Prydain.

[00:32:19] [SPEAKER_07]: And it's an adventure story, you know, coming of age, sort of magical fantasy story based on Welsh folklore.

[00:32:31] [SPEAKER_07]: And I remember, I haven't seen the movie in a really long time.

[00:32:34] [SPEAKER_07]: Because I remember seeing it and being like, they missed the point of the book.

[00:32:38] [SPEAKER_07]: This isn't even close to the book.

[00:32:40] [SPEAKER_07]: I love the book.

[00:32:42] [SPEAKER_07]: This is, I don't want to watch this.

[00:32:44] [SPEAKER_07]: But now I'm curious.

[00:32:45] [SPEAKER_07]: Because I'm like, first of all, I love the art of adaptation.

[00:32:50] [SPEAKER_07]: And seeing how things go from book to screen is really interesting to me.

[00:32:54] [SPEAKER_07]: And when they screw up, it's almost more edifying.

[00:32:58] [SPEAKER_07]: Because you can see all the edges in the decisions.

[00:33:01] [SPEAKER_07]: You can really see them.

[00:33:02] [SPEAKER_07]: When a movie is seamless and, you know, like, translates to screen from a book really well,

[00:33:08] [SPEAKER_07]: you don't see as many of the edges, right?

[00:33:12] [SPEAKER_07]: Because you get swept up in the thing.

[00:33:13] [SPEAKER_07]: That's how it's supposed to work.

[00:33:14] [SPEAKER_07]: So when they're bad, I almost like bad movies in a different way for a specific reason.

[00:33:19] [SPEAKER_07]: That I'm like, oh, I can see exactly what decisions they made along the way.

[00:33:24] [SPEAKER_07]: Wherever the movie is, like, a little, like, clumsy or creepy when it shouldn't be.

[00:33:30] [SPEAKER_07]: Like, that gives you insight into what was going on behind the scenes.

[00:33:33] [SPEAKER_03]: Oh, well, and this was one of those very typical Disney.

[00:33:38] [SPEAKER_03]: There was a switch in power at the time.

[00:33:41] [SPEAKER_03]: And I know that Katzenberg was involved in it.

[00:33:43] [SPEAKER_03]: But I can't remember if he was there and then someone else took over.

[00:33:46] [SPEAKER_03]: If he's the one that took over, saw the movie and didn't like it.

[00:33:49] [SPEAKER_03]: But this is one of those where not only did they take scenes out, but they also re-edited a lot of it.

[00:33:54] [SPEAKER_03]: They tried to put some of their old, like, they clipped in some shots from some of their other movies

[00:34:03] [SPEAKER_03]: just to kind of give it that old flair and that old flavor.

[00:34:05] [SPEAKER_03]: But I am now curious to see if the initial movie might be more to your taste.

[00:34:10] [SPEAKER_03]: But it's never been out.

[00:34:12] [SPEAKER_03]: This is another one of those movies that once it was out of the movies,

[00:34:14] [SPEAKER_03]: it bombed so badly that Disney had nothing to do with it for well over a decade before they put it out again.

[00:34:20] [SPEAKER_03]: And I remember when it came out, it was like right around the, during Y2K, somewhere around there it came out.

[00:34:27] [SPEAKER_03]: And I remember it was such a big deal because everybody thought it would be a director's cut version

[00:34:30] [SPEAKER_03]: where they would just put out the original, which they didn't do.

[00:34:34] [SPEAKER_03]: And I don't.

[00:34:34] [SPEAKER_07]: The R-rated version.

[00:34:35] [SPEAKER_03]: Yes.

[00:34:36] [SPEAKER_03]: Which is insane to me.

[00:34:37] [SPEAKER_03]: Like, I would have seen that.

[00:34:38] [SPEAKER_03]: Oh, come on.

[00:34:44] [SPEAKER_03]: The other thing I wanted to mention was that Goofballs poster.

[00:34:48] [SPEAKER_03]: Because.

[00:34:49] [SPEAKER_07]: Oh, yeah.

[00:34:49] [SPEAKER_07]: Is that a real movie?

[00:34:50] [SPEAKER_07]: Or is that Goonies?

[00:34:51] [SPEAKER_03]: No, no, no, no.

[00:34:52] [SPEAKER_03]: That is definitely Goonies.

[00:34:53] [SPEAKER_03]: And I don't know why they did.

[00:34:54] [SPEAKER_03]: I don't know if they.

[00:34:55] [SPEAKER_03]: Okay.

[00:34:55] [SPEAKER_03]: I don't.

[00:34:56] [SPEAKER_03]: Was Goonies a Disney movie?

[00:34:59] [SPEAKER_07]: I don't know.

[00:35:00] [SPEAKER_03]: So I'm surprised they didn't.

[00:35:01] [SPEAKER_07]: I assume it's a rights issue.

[00:35:03] [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[00:35:04] [SPEAKER_07]: If they didn't go with the real thing.

[00:35:06] [SPEAKER_07]: Because they did the real thing on other stuff.

[00:35:08] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[00:35:08] [SPEAKER_03]: Well, so in this one, I think may have just been an homage to like Matt Shackman.

[00:35:14] [SPEAKER_03]: I saw an interview that he had done.

[00:35:16] [SPEAKER_03]: I believe it was with Kevin Smith.

[00:35:19] [SPEAKER_03]: But I can't remember now if it was on Kevin Smith's Fat Man on Batman podcast.

[00:35:25] [SPEAKER_03]: Or just Kevin Smith talking to him at a con.

[00:35:27] [SPEAKER_03]: But Shackman's intention with the last episode of.

[00:35:31] [SPEAKER_03]: The last two episodes of WandaVision was to.

[00:35:35] [SPEAKER_03]: Sort of create an homage to Goonies using the two boys.

[00:35:40] [SPEAKER_03]: And our wonderful Ralph Boner.

[00:35:43] [SPEAKER_03]: Or going down into the basement.

[00:35:46] [SPEAKER_03]: Looking to try to steal the book.

[00:35:48] [SPEAKER_03]: Like the whole thing was going to be a journey.

[00:35:50] [SPEAKER_03]: And I don't know why they changed that.

[00:35:53] [SPEAKER_03]: Maybe it just didn't fit the tone.

[00:35:55] [SPEAKER_03]: But I think that that might have been put in there.

[00:35:57] [SPEAKER_03]: As kind of an homage to that.

[00:35:59] [SPEAKER_03]: But that's just a guess.

[00:36:00] [SPEAKER_03]: On my part.

[00:36:01] [SPEAKER_03]: I just remembered.

[00:36:02] [SPEAKER_03]: I just remembered seeing that podcast.

[00:36:04] [SPEAKER_03]: And I.

[00:36:07] [SPEAKER_03]: In Ralph.

[00:36:08] [SPEAKER_03]: Since Ralph Boner was used in this.

[00:36:09] [SPEAKER_03]: It just.

[00:36:10] [SPEAKER_03]: It got me thinking that I might have been the connection.

[00:36:12] [SPEAKER_03]: But if you look at the poster that's on the wall.

[00:36:15] [SPEAKER_03]: And you look at the Goonies poster.

[00:36:17] [SPEAKER_03]: They're nearly identical.

[00:36:19] [SPEAKER_03]: I can't quite make out the characters though.

[00:36:22] [SPEAKER_03]: I wonder if the characters that are on that goofballs poster.

[00:36:25] [SPEAKER_03]: Aren't something familiar to us.

[00:36:27] [SPEAKER_03]: But I couldn't.

[00:36:28] [SPEAKER_03]: I couldn't get it zoomed in enough to see.

[00:36:31] [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[00:36:31] [SPEAKER_07]: And a lot of it was in a soft focus.

[00:36:34] [SPEAKER_07]: While he's walking around the room.

[00:36:36] [SPEAKER_07]: The vibe was very much.

[00:36:38] [SPEAKER_07]: Like this is a blur to him.

[00:36:40] [SPEAKER_02]: Yes.

[00:36:41] [SPEAKER_07]: Right.

[00:36:41] [SPEAKER_07]: So we just.

[00:36:42] [SPEAKER_07]: We just didn't get a lot of.

[00:36:44] [SPEAKER_07]: Of close-ups.

[00:36:45] [SPEAKER_07]: Or.

[00:36:46] [SPEAKER_07]: Or clarity.

[00:36:47] [SPEAKER_07]: The room was also always kind of dark.

[00:36:49] [SPEAKER_07]: Yes.

[00:36:50] [SPEAKER_07]: You know.

[00:36:50] [SPEAKER_07]: It was like.

[00:36:51] [SPEAKER_07]: Like there were times.

[00:36:52] [SPEAKER_07]: There were stuff.

[00:36:52] [SPEAKER_07]: I paused and I walked right up.

[00:36:54] [SPEAKER_07]: Put my face right up against my giant TV.

[00:36:56] [SPEAKER_07]: And I was like.

[00:36:57] [SPEAKER_07]: I still can't tell what that is.

[00:36:58] [SPEAKER_07]: Like it's so dark.

[00:36:59] [SPEAKER_07]: And blurry.

[00:37:00] [SPEAKER_07]: I have no idea what that is.

[00:37:03] [SPEAKER_07]: It was.

[00:37:04] [SPEAKER_07]: It was such a.

[00:37:08] [SPEAKER_07]: I don't know.

[00:37:08] [SPEAKER_07]: It was such a tempting thing too.

[00:37:10] [SPEAKER_07]: Because every inch of space in that room was covered.

[00:37:12] [SPEAKER_07]: And I was like.

[00:37:12] [SPEAKER_07]: Ah.

[00:37:13] [SPEAKER_07]: There's so much detail here.

[00:37:14] [SPEAKER_07]: And I'm sure.

[00:37:15] [SPEAKER_07]: Some of it is going to matter.

[00:37:17] [SPEAKER_07]: And I.

[00:37:17] [SPEAKER_07]: I want to see it.

[00:37:18] [SPEAKER_03]: Well.

[00:37:19] [SPEAKER_03]: We'll probably get to see more of it.

[00:37:21] [SPEAKER_03]: When the series is over.

[00:37:23] [SPEAKER_03]: And they put out some materials.

[00:37:24] [SPEAKER_03]: That go along with it.

[00:37:25] [SPEAKER_03]: Because I can't imagine.

[00:37:28] [SPEAKER_03]: That we saw even a quarter of the detail.

[00:37:30] [SPEAKER_03]: I.

[00:37:31] [SPEAKER_03]: The way that this show is put together.

[00:37:33] [SPEAKER_03]: I have a feeling.

[00:37:33] [SPEAKER_03]: There's so many things that we've missed.

[00:37:35] [SPEAKER_03]: That are going to.

[00:37:36] [SPEAKER_03]: When we see them in whatever form we see them in.

[00:37:38] [SPEAKER_03]: It's going to be so frustrating.

[00:37:41] [SPEAKER_07]: Oh my God.

[00:37:42] [SPEAKER_07]: We didn't even know that was there.

[00:37:44] [SPEAKER_07]: All right.

[00:37:45] [SPEAKER_07]: Future room.

[00:37:46] [SPEAKER_07]: You want to go ahead to the three years later?

[00:37:47] [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[00:37:48] [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[00:37:48] [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[00:37:49] [SPEAKER_07]: So Billy's room.

[00:37:50] [SPEAKER_07]: 16 year old William's room.

[00:37:52] [SPEAKER_07]: Has a lot of the same stuff up.

[00:37:54] [SPEAKER_07]: But there are new things.

[00:37:57] [SPEAKER_07]: Uh.

[00:37:58] [SPEAKER_07]: Before we get there though.

[00:37:59] [SPEAKER_07]: There's a scene.

[00:38:00] [SPEAKER_07]: A really really cute scene.

[00:38:02] [SPEAKER_07]: With Billy and.

[00:38:03] [SPEAKER_07]: Or William.

[00:38:04] [SPEAKER_07]: And his.

[00:38:05] [SPEAKER_07]: His boy.

[00:38:06] [SPEAKER_07]: Uh.

[00:38:06] [SPEAKER_07]: Eddie.

[00:38:07] [SPEAKER_07]: In the car.

[00:38:09] [SPEAKER_07]: And um.

[00:38:10] [SPEAKER_07]: You know.

[00:38:11] [SPEAKER_07]: They're.

[00:38:11] [SPEAKER_07]: I like you.

[00:38:12] [SPEAKER_07]: I really like you.

[00:38:13] [SPEAKER_07]: Like it's really.

[00:38:13] [SPEAKER_07]: It's adorable teenage romance stuff.

[00:38:16] [SPEAKER_07]: And um.

[00:38:18] [SPEAKER_07]: I.

[00:38:19] [SPEAKER_07]: Uh.

[00:38:19] [SPEAKER_07]: I clipped a little bit of it.

[00:38:21] [SPEAKER_04]: The car accident.

[00:38:22] [SPEAKER_04]: I.

[00:38:24] [SPEAKER_04]: I never told you about it.

[00:38:25] [SPEAKER_04]: But uh.

[00:38:28] [SPEAKER_04]: Eddie.

[00:38:29] [SPEAKER_04]: I.

[00:38:30] [SPEAKER_04]: I died that night.

[00:38:34] [SPEAKER_04]: And when I came back.

[00:38:35] [SPEAKER_04]: I was different.

[00:38:37] [SPEAKER_04]: Something else.

[00:38:39] [SPEAKER_04]: Something more.

[00:38:42] [SPEAKER_04]: I'm not William Kaplan.

[00:38:43] [SPEAKER_04]: At least.

[00:38:44] [SPEAKER_04]: Not entirely.

[00:38:46] [SPEAKER_04]: If you're not.

[00:38:47] [SPEAKER_04]: William Kaplan.

[00:38:51] [SPEAKER_04]: Who are you?

[00:38:55] [SPEAKER_07]: And the boyfriend.

[00:38:56] [SPEAKER_07]: Handles it.

[00:38:57] [SPEAKER_07]: So well.

[00:38:58] [SPEAKER_07]: And it's hard for me to tell.

[00:39:00] [SPEAKER_07]: If.

[00:39:00] [SPEAKER_07]: Eddie.

[00:39:01] [SPEAKER_07]: Is like.

[00:39:02] [SPEAKER_07]: All right.

[00:39:03] [SPEAKER_07]: Well I met you two years ago.

[00:39:04] [SPEAKER_07]: So whoever you are now.

[00:39:05] [SPEAKER_07]: Is who I know.

[00:39:06] [SPEAKER_07]: So fine.

[00:39:07] [SPEAKER_07]: Or if he's like.

[00:39:09] [SPEAKER_07]: Well.

[00:39:10] [SPEAKER_07]: My boyfriend.

[00:39:11] [SPEAKER_07]: Is all into this.

[00:39:11] [SPEAKER_07]: Spooky magic stuff.

[00:39:12] [SPEAKER_07]: And now he's convinced himself.

[00:39:14] [SPEAKER_07]: That he's like.

[00:39:15] [SPEAKER_07]: Some other person.

[00:39:16] [SPEAKER_07]: Whatever.

[00:39:16] [SPEAKER_07]: Whatever.

[00:39:17] [SPEAKER_03]: Either way.

[00:39:18] [SPEAKER_07]: That.

[00:39:19] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[00:39:20] [SPEAKER_03]: He handled it well.

[00:39:21] [SPEAKER_03]: It was.

[00:39:22] [SPEAKER_03]: I loved it because.

[00:39:25] [SPEAKER_03]: It's a tricky situation to handle.

[00:39:27] [SPEAKER_03]: On any TV show.

[00:39:28] [SPEAKER_03]: Because you could go a bunch of different ways with it.

[00:39:30] [SPEAKER_03]: But what it gave us.

[00:39:33] [SPEAKER_03]: Is.

[00:39:33] [SPEAKER_03]: I love you for who you are.

[00:39:36] [SPEAKER_03]: Whatever you're going through.

[00:39:37] [SPEAKER_03]: Why ever you said that.

[00:39:39] [SPEAKER_03]: Whatever is actually true.

[00:39:40] [SPEAKER_03]: It doesn't really matter.

[00:39:41] [SPEAKER_03]: I love you.

[00:39:42] [SPEAKER_03]: And I loved that.

[00:39:44] [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[00:39:45] [SPEAKER_03]: I love that little dance that we got.

[00:39:47] [SPEAKER_03]: Throughout that segment.

[00:39:49] [SPEAKER_03]: Because again.

[00:39:50] [SPEAKER_03]: This is wonderful.

[00:39:53] [SPEAKER_03]: Storytelling.

[00:39:54] [SPEAKER_03]: Because what it's giving us.

[00:39:56] [SPEAKER_03]: Is in the 48.

[00:39:57] [SPEAKER_03]: Or however many actual minutes.

[00:40:00] [SPEAKER_03]: This episode was.

[00:40:00] [SPEAKER_03]: In the 40 minutes of this episode.

[00:40:02] [SPEAKER_03]: We got the depth of.

[00:40:04] [SPEAKER_03]: Of all of his relationships.

[00:40:05] [SPEAKER_03]: Prior to present.

[00:40:07] [SPEAKER_03]: Which I think plays such an important.

[00:40:09] [SPEAKER_03]: Part in what we end up getting to.

[00:40:11] [SPEAKER_03]: So yeah.

[00:40:12] [SPEAKER_03]: That was a beautiful.

[00:40:13] [SPEAKER_03]: They cast it so well.

[00:40:15] [SPEAKER_03]: He did such a nice job.

[00:40:17] [SPEAKER_03]: Being.

[00:40:19] [SPEAKER_03]: A very important part.

[00:40:21] [SPEAKER_03]: Of Billy's life.

[00:40:23] [SPEAKER_03]: And becoming a very important character.

[00:40:24] [SPEAKER_03]: In this show.

[00:40:25] [SPEAKER_03]: Which is hard to do.

[00:40:26] [SPEAKER_03]: In such a short amount of time.

[00:40:29] [SPEAKER_07]: He was extremely charming.

[00:40:31] [SPEAKER_07]: I thought.

[00:40:32] [SPEAKER_07]: And I just love seeing.

[00:40:34] [SPEAKER_07]: Gay character.

[00:40:35] [SPEAKER_07]: Whose stories are not about being gay.

[00:40:38] [SPEAKER_02]: No.

[00:40:39] [SPEAKER_07]: Right.

[00:40:39] [SPEAKER_07]: They just are gay.

[00:40:40] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[00:40:41] [SPEAKER_07]: There's no coming out.

[00:40:42] [SPEAKER_07]: There's no drama.

[00:40:43] [SPEAKER_07]: With their parents.

[00:40:44] [SPEAKER_07]: About them being gay.

[00:40:45] [SPEAKER_07]: They just are.

[00:40:46] [SPEAKER_07]: And it's.

[00:40:47] [SPEAKER_07]: It doesn't.

[00:40:48] [SPEAKER_07]: It's not narratively important.

[00:40:50] [SPEAKER_07]: That he has a boyfriend.

[00:40:51] [SPEAKER_07]: As opposed to a girlfriend.

[00:40:52] [SPEAKER_07]: And.

[00:40:53] [SPEAKER_07]: I know maybe.

[00:40:54] [SPEAKER_07]: I'm being annoying.

[00:40:55] [SPEAKER_07]: By calling it out.

[00:40:56] [SPEAKER_07]: But I feel like.

[00:40:57] [SPEAKER_07]: We've come a long way.

[00:40:58] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[00:40:59] [SPEAKER_07]: Because there was a time.

[00:41:00] [SPEAKER_07]: When if there was a gay character.

[00:41:01] [SPEAKER_07]: A.

[00:41:02] [SPEAKER_07]: He was miserable.

[00:41:03] [SPEAKER_07]: B.

[00:41:03] [SPEAKER_07]: His entire story.

[00:41:04] [SPEAKER_07]: Was about him being gay.

[00:41:05] [SPEAKER_07]: And in this case.

[00:41:06] [SPEAKER_07]: It's just not.

[00:41:07] [SPEAKER_07]: I thought it was really interesting.

[00:41:09] [SPEAKER_07]: That when he's trying to explain.

[00:41:10] [SPEAKER_07]: His telepathy.

[00:41:11] [SPEAKER_07]: Which he never quite does.

[00:41:12] [SPEAKER_07]: To Eddie.

[00:41:13] [SPEAKER_07]: He says.

[00:41:14] [SPEAKER_07]: It's a thing that happens to him.

[00:41:16] [SPEAKER_07]: When he's.

[00:41:16] [SPEAKER_07]: When he's around people.

[00:41:18] [SPEAKER_07]: He cares about a lot.

[00:41:20] [SPEAKER_07]: And they're feeling strong feelings.

[00:41:23] [SPEAKER_07]: But.

[00:41:24] [SPEAKER_07]: When they went to meet with.

[00:41:25] [SPEAKER_07]: Ralph Boner.

[00:41:26] [SPEAKER_07]: Or.

[00:41:27] [SPEAKER_07]: Boner Matic.

[00:41:29] [SPEAKER_07]: Or whatever the guy called himself.

[00:41:30] [SPEAKER_03]: I'm pretty sure it was.

[00:41:32] [SPEAKER_03]: It was.

[00:41:33] [SPEAKER_03]: It was.

[00:41:35] [SPEAKER_03]: Was it Boner Matic.

[00:41:36] [SPEAKER_03]: 69.

[00:41:37] [SPEAKER_03]: I believe it was.

[00:41:38] [SPEAKER_07]: Or Boner Rific.

[00:41:39] [SPEAKER_07]: It might have been Boner Rific.

[00:41:42] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[00:41:43] [SPEAKER_03]: I didn't.

[00:41:43] [SPEAKER_03]: I.

[00:41:43] [SPEAKER_03]: By the way.

[00:41:44] [SPEAKER_03]: I.

[00:41:44] [SPEAKER_03]: I didn't write that down on purpose.

[00:41:47] [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[00:41:47] [SPEAKER_07]: You were like.

[00:41:48] [SPEAKER_07]: All right.

[00:41:48] [SPEAKER_07]: I get it.

[00:41:49] [SPEAKER_07]: Like he's a child.

[00:41:50] [SPEAKER_07]: All right.

[00:41:50] [SPEAKER_07]: He heard Boner thinking.

[00:41:53] [SPEAKER_07]: Please don't ask about Agatha Harkness.

[00:41:54] [SPEAKER_07]: Please don't think about Agatha Harkness.

[00:41:56] [SPEAKER_07]: And I'm like.

[00:41:57] [SPEAKER_07]: He doesn't care about this guy.

[00:41:59] [SPEAKER_07]: So.

[00:41:59] [SPEAKER_07]: The telepathy is more about strong emotions.

[00:42:02] [SPEAKER_07]: I think.

[00:42:02] [SPEAKER_07]: But he doesn't know yet.

[00:42:04] [SPEAKER_07]: Right.

[00:42:04] [SPEAKER_07]: He's still.

[00:42:04] [SPEAKER_07]: I think the important thing we learned from this scene.

[00:42:08] [SPEAKER_07]: All these scenes.

[00:42:09] [SPEAKER_07]: Is that he is not a.

[00:42:10] [SPEAKER_07]: Like.

[00:42:11] [SPEAKER_07]: A mature.

[00:42:12] [SPEAKER_07]: Magic user.

[00:42:13] [SPEAKER_07]: Who's in control of his powers.

[00:42:15] [SPEAKER_07]: He is just.

[00:42:16] [SPEAKER_07]: Starting his journey.

[00:42:18] [SPEAKER_07]: As a magic user.

[00:42:19] [SPEAKER_03]: Well.

[00:42:20] [SPEAKER_03]: And.

[00:42:20] [SPEAKER_03]: And.

[00:42:20] [SPEAKER_03]: And.

[00:42:21] [SPEAKER_03]: You know.

[00:42:21] [SPEAKER_03]: Wanda is somebody who.

[00:42:23] [SPEAKER_03]: Accesses her power through emotion.

[00:42:24] [SPEAKER_03]: A lot of the time.

[00:42:25] [SPEAKER_03]: Is he that way.

[00:42:27] [SPEAKER_03]: Or isn't he.

[00:42:27] [SPEAKER_03]: And they've done a nice job.

[00:42:28] [SPEAKER_03]: Sort of betraying him last week.

[00:42:31] [SPEAKER_03]: As that.

[00:42:32] [SPEAKER_03]: As.

[00:42:32] [SPEAKER_03]: As a character who.

[00:42:33] [SPEAKER_03]: Or maybe two weeks ago.

[00:42:34] [SPEAKER_03]: As a character who.

[00:42:36] [SPEAKER_03]: When he gets.

[00:42:37] [SPEAKER_03]: Angry.

[00:42:37] [SPEAKER_03]: We see the power.

[00:42:38] [SPEAKER_03]: At least that's what we think.

[00:42:39] [SPEAKER_03]: But.

[00:42:40] [SPEAKER_03]: I think it's probably.

[00:42:41] [SPEAKER_03]: Going to turn out to be a lot more complex than that.

[00:42:44] [SPEAKER_03]: He definitely seems.

[00:42:45] [SPEAKER_03]: And I'm not yet by the way.

[00:42:47] [SPEAKER_03]: Convinced.

[00:42:48] [SPEAKER_03]: That.

[00:42:49] [SPEAKER_03]: The first time he uses his.

[00:42:51] [SPEAKER_03]: His power.

[00:42:53] [SPEAKER_03]: Is the first time he's ever used his power.

[00:42:55] [SPEAKER_03]: But we can get into that later.

[00:42:56] [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[00:42:57] [SPEAKER_07]: I.

[00:42:58] [SPEAKER_07]: But it's clear to me that he's not in control of it.

[00:43:00] [SPEAKER_07]: Yes.

[00:43:01] [SPEAKER_07]: And he doesn't completely understand it.

[00:43:03] [SPEAKER_07]: And I think that his.

[00:43:04] [SPEAKER_07]: His use of it is.

[00:43:07] [SPEAKER_07]: Instinctive.

[00:43:08] [SPEAKER_07]: At first.

[00:43:09] [SPEAKER_07]: Right.

[00:43:09] [SPEAKER_07]: It's just like.

[00:43:10] [SPEAKER_07]: It's more blunt.

[00:43:11] [SPEAKER_07]: It's the same thing Wanda went through.

[00:43:13] [SPEAKER_07]: Where at first it was about.

[00:43:15] [SPEAKER_07]: You know.

[00:43:15] [SPEAKER_07]: Being able to move objects.

[00:43:17] [SPEAKER_07]: With her mind.

[00:43:18] [SPEAKER_07]: In a very broad way.

[00:43:19] [SPEAKER_07]: Right.

[00:43:19] [SPEAKER_07]: Like throwing.

[00:43:20] [SPEAKER_07]: But like.

[00:43:21] [SPEAKER_07]: As she got more practiced.

[00:43:23] [SPEAKER_07]: She became more fine-tuned.

[00:43:25] [SPEAKER_07]: And once she got the dark home.

[00:43:26] [SPEAKER_07]: She was able to like.

[00:43:28] [SPEAKER_07]: Really hone her magic.

[00:43:30] [SPEAKER_07]: And her skills.

[00:43:31] [SPEAKER_07]: And this raw power.

[00:43:32] [SPEAKER_07]: That she was sitting on.

[00:43:33] [SPEAKER_07]: All along.

[00:43:34] [SPEAKER_07]: Right.

[00:43:34] [SPEAKER_07]: She had raw power.

[00:43:35] [SPEAKER_07]: She had to learn skills.

[00:43:36] [SPEAKER_07]: To access it safely.

[00:43:38] [SPEAKER_07]: Or whatever.

[00:43:39] [SPEAKER_07]: So we get to see.

[00:43:41] [SPEAKER_07]: Billy takes.

[00:43:42] [SPEAKER_07]: Or William.

[00:43:43] [SPEAKER_07]: I still don't really know what to call him.

[00:43:45] [SPEAKER_07]: Takes Eddie up to his room.

[00:43:46] [SPEAKER_07]: And shows him.

[00:43:47] [SPEAKER_07]: His like.

[00:43:49] [SPEAKER_07]: His like dossier.

[00:43:50] [SPEAKER_07]: He calls it.

[00:43:50] [SPEAKER_07]: Of all this information.

[00:43:51] [SPEAKER_07]: He's gathered.

[00:43:52] [SPEAKER_07]: And it's.

[00:43:53] [SPEAKER_07]: You know.

[00:43:53] [SPEAKER_07]: It's a lot of like.

[00:43:54] [SPEAKER_07]: Newspaper clippings.

[00:43:55] [SPEAKER_07]: And things about.

[00:43:56] [SPEAKER_07]: Westview.

[00:43:57] [SPEAKER_07]: And the magic that happened in Westview.

[00:43:59] [SPEAKER_07]: I mean.

[00:43:59] [SPEAKER_07]: It's way too big of a coincidence.

[00:44:01] [SPEAKER_07]: Even if you haven't seen.

[00:44:03] [SPEAKER_07]: WandaVision.

[00:44:04] [SPEAKER_07]: But there was this big event.

[00:44:05] [SPEAKER_07]: That happened on the same day.

[00:44:07] [SPEAKER_07]: That he hit his head.

[00:44:08] [SPEAKER_07]: And was in a car accident.

[00:44:09] [SPEAKER_07]: And woke up with amnesia.

[00:44:11] [SPEAKER_07]: Like.

[00:44:11] [SPEAKER_07]: Obviously those things are related.

[00:44:12] [SPEAKER_07]: The fact that his parents.

[00:44:13] [SPEAKER_07]: Aren't doing the same research.

[00:44:15] [SPEAKER_07]: As far as we know.

[00:44:16] [SPEAKER_07]: Is wild.

[00:44:17] [SPEAKER_07]: Because I would be like.

[00:44:18] [SPEAKER_07]: Well.

[00:44:18] [SPEAKER_07]: Those things are probably related.

[00:44:20] [SPEAKER_03]: The thing about that too though.

[00:44:22] [SPEAKER_03]: Is.

[00:44:22] [SPEAKER_03]: Is.

[00:44:25] [SPEAKER_03]: I have this thing.

[00:44:26] [SPEAKER_03]: That I.

[00:44:27] [SPEAKER_03]: You know.

[00:44:27] [SPEAKER_03]: When I talk about people.

[00:44:28] [SPEAKER_03]: Who.

[00:44:29] [SPEAKER_03]: Especially as a teacher.

[00:44:30] [SPEAKER_03]: In my classroom.

[00:44:31] [SPEAKER_03]: Whether it be parents.

[00:44:32] [SPEAKER_03]: Or students.

[00:44:33] [SPEAKER_03]: Who try to.

[00:44:34] [SPEAKER_03]: Who know that there's something going on.

[00:44:36] [SPEAKER_03]: But try to not.

[00:44:37] [SPEAKER_03]: See it.

[00:44:38] [SPEAKER_03]: I call it the build collector mentality.

[00:44:40] [SPEAKER_03]: And I think.

[00:44:41] [SPEAKER_03]: I think.

[00:44:42] [SPEAKER_03]: What I was trying to get at.

[00:44:43] [SPEAKER_03]: With the parents.

[00:44:44] [SPEAKER_03]: Is that.

[00:44:45] [SPEAKER_03]: That I think they know.

[00:44:47] [SPEAKER_03]: That their son.

[00:44:48] [SPEAKER_03]: Isn't their son.

[00:44:51] [SPEAKER_03]: But I think.

[00:44:52] [SPEAKER_03]: They don't want to know.

[00:44:53] [SPEAKER_03]: That their son.

[00:44:54] [SPEAKER_03]: Isn't their son.

[00:44:55] [SPEAKER_03]: So I really believe.

[00:44:57] [SPEAKER_03]: That they live in this world.

[00:44:58] [SPEAKER_03]: That.

[00:45:01] [SPEAKER_03]: The.

[00:45:02] [SPEAKER_03]: To be honest with you.

[00:45:02] [SPEAKER_03]: That.

[00:45:03] [SPEAKER_03]: That sword.

[00:45:04] [SPEAKER_03]: To pull in the MCU.

[00:45:05] [SPEAKER_03]: And I apologize.

[00:45:06] [SPEAKER_03]: For those that don't want that to happen.

[00:45:08] [SPEAKER_03]: I think sword.

[00:45:09] [SPEAKER_03]: Very much wants.

[00:45:10] [SPEAKER_03]: That Westview situation.

[00:45:11] [SPEAKER_03]: To go away.

[00:45:13] [SPEAKER_03]: And I think.

[00:45:14] [SPEAKER_03]: That the parents are fine.

[00:45:15] [SPEAKER_03]: With that.

[00:45:16] [SPEAKER_03]: That this may not be our son.

[00:45:17] [SPEAKER_03]: But.

[00:45:18] [SPEAKER_03]: He loves.

[00:45:18] [SPEAKER_03]: He seems to love us.

[00:45:20] [SPEAKER_03]: We don't quite get it.

[00:45:21] [SPEAKER_03]: We're going to keep being his parents.

[00:45:24] [SPEAKER_03]: And I.

[00:45:24] [SPEAKER_03]: I do think that that's important.

[00:45:26] [SPEAKER_03]: Because here we've got.

[00:45:27] [SPEAKER_03]: And I'm sorry.

[00:45:27] [SPEAKER_03]: Like I immediately.

[00:45:28] [SPEAKER_03]: Flip into Buffy mode.

[00:45:30] [SPEAKER_03]: And we've got like.

[00:45:31] [SPEAKER_03]: Billy portraying all three of the trio.

[00:45:33] [SPEAKER_03]: And their conspiracies.

[00:45:35] [SPEAKER_03]: Like.

[00:45:35] [SPEAKER_03]: I just.

[00:45:36] [SPEAKER_03]: He pulls out.

[00:45:37] [SPEAKER_03]: You know.

[00:45:38] [SPEAKER_03]: He walks into this room.

[00:45:39] [SPEAKER_03]: And I'm thinking.

[00:45:39] [SPEAKER_03]: How in land's hell.

[00:45:41] [SPEAKER_03]: Did.

[00:45:42] [SPEAKER_03]: His parents not know about this.

[00:45:43] [SPEAKER_03]: And of course.

[00:45:44] [SPEAKER_03]: They probably do.

[00:45:45] [SPEAKER_03]: And just don't care.

[00:45:46] [SPEAKER_03]: They just don't care.

[00:45:47] [SPEAKER_03]: They have their son.

[00:45:48] [SPEAKER_03]: That's all they care about.

[00:45:49] [SPEAKER_07]: They don't want to know.

[00:45:50] [SPEAKER_03]: By the way too.

[00:45:51] [SPEAKER_03]: When.

[00:45:51] [SPEAKER_03]: The minute we saw that floor.

[00:45:52] [SPEAKER_03]: I immediately.

[00:45:53] [SPEAKER_03]: You know.

[00:45:53] [SPEAKER_03]: As we talk about the end credit scenes.

[00:45:57] [SPEAKER_03]: That we don't quite understand.

[00:45:58] [SPEAKER_03]: Well.

[00:45:59] [SPEAKER_03]: One whole segment of that.

[00:46:00] [SPEAKER_03]: Now becomes perfectly clear.

[00:46:02] [SPEAKER_03]: Because of course.

[00:46:03] [SPEAKER_03]: We have that one.

[00:46:04] [SPEAKER_03]: Post credit scene.

[00:46:06] [SPEAKER_03]: Where we have.

[00:46:07] [SPEAKER_03]: Not.

[00:46:08] [SPEAKER_03]: The end credit scene.

[00:46:09] [SPEAKER_03]: Where we have all those clippings.

[00:46:10] [SPEAKER_03]: Clippings.

[00:46:11] [SPEAKER_03]: One of which it says.

[00:46:12] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[00:46:12] [SPEAKER_03]: Near death.

[00:46:13] [SPEAKER_03]: Which obviously was talking about Billy.

[00:46:14] [SPEAKER_03]: So.

[00:46:15] [SPEAKER_03]: We.

[00:46:15] [SPEAKER_03]: We've seen some of these clippings already.

[00:46:17] [SPEAKER_03]: But yeah.

[00:46:18] [SPEAKER_03]: I just.

[00:46:19] [SPEAKER_03]: I thought.

[00:46:19] [SPEAKER_03]: Here they are.

[00:46:20] [SPEAKER_03]: Just laying all over his floor.

[00:46:22] [SPEAKER_03]: Like they've been there for years.

[00:46:24] [SPEAKER_03]: And.

[00:46:25] [SPEAKER_03]: Apparently nobody.

[00:46:26] [SPEAKER_03]: Nobody's been paying attention to him.

[00:46:29] [SPEAKER_07]: I don't know if I thought they'd been in that spot for years.

[00:46:32] [SPEAKER_07]: Because.

[00:46:32] [SPEAKER_07]: Laying out papers on the floor like that.

[00:46:34] [SPEAKER_07]: Is not a good way to keep things organized for very long.

[00:46:37] [SPEAKER_07]: Right.

[00:46:37] [SPEAKER_07]: You just walk around the room and things are going to move.

[00:46:39] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[00:46:39] [SPEAKER_07]: But I could believe that he.

[00:46:41] [SPEAKER_07]: You know.

[00:46:41] [SPEAKER_07]: Takes them out from his folder and lays them out when he wants to think about them.

[00:46:45] [SPEAKER_07]: I noticed in his room that he had like garlands made out of triangles.

[00:46:51] [SPEAKER_07]: Yes.

[00:46:51] [SPEAKER_07]: There were little tiny triangles that were either lights or they were reflective.

[00:46:56] [SPEAKER_07]: Because they were catching the light.

[00:46:58] [SPEAKER_07]: And they look so much like the lights in the cabin last week.

[00:47:02] [SPEAKER_03]: Oh.

[00:47:02] [SPEAKER_07]: They were also like little.

[00:47:03] [SPEAKER_07]: They were little pyramid shapes.

[00:47:04] [SPEAKER_03]: I have a point.

[00:47:05] [SPEAKER_03]: I have a point for that.

[00:47:07] [SPEAKER_03]: But keep going.

[00:47:08] [SPEAKER_03]: Keep going.

[00:47:08] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[00:47:08] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[00:47:09] [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[00:47:09] [SPEAKER_03]: You've actually mentioned a couple of them.

[00:47:11] [SPEAKER_03]: And I don't think you realized it yet.

[00:47:13] [SPEAKER_03]: But we'll get there.

[00:47:13] [SPEAKER_07]: He also had a bunch of like.

[00:47:15] [SPEAKER_07]: They look like sort of paper.

[00:47:18] [SPEAKER_07]: Leaf garlands that look like fall leaves.

[00:47:20] [SPEAKER_07]: They very much resembled the leaves that are on the road.

[00:47:23] [SPEAKER_07]: The ones that were red.

[00:47:24] [SPEAKER_07]: And the ones that were blue.

[00:47:26] [SPEAKER_07]: He also has like a poster of Lorna Wu.

[00:47:30] [SPEAKER_07]: Oh.

[00:47:30] [SPEAKER_03]: And we got to hear that.

[00:47:31] [SPEAKER_03]: We got to hear that version.

[00:47:33] [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[00:47:33] [SPEAKER_03]: The actual version.

[00:47:34] [SPEAKER_03]: Right.

[00:47:34] [SPEAKER_07]: He has her record playing.

[00:47:36] [SPEAKER_07]: He has another.

[00:47:38] [SPEAKER_07]: By the way.

[00:47:39] [SPEAKER_07]: Smaller Wizard of Oz poster.

[00:47:40] [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[00:47:40] [SPEAKER_03]: Couldn't that record have been.

[00:47:43] [SPEAKER_03]: The record.

[00:47:45] [SPEAKER_03]: In Alice's.

[00:47:47] [SPEAKER_07]: In episode four.

[00:47:48] [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[00:47:48] [SPEAKER_03]: I've just thrown it out there.

[00:47:49] [SPEAKER_07]: I mean it was the exact same record.

[00:47:51] [SPEAKER_07]: Whether or not it was like the same record or not.

[00:47:54] [SPEAKER_07]: I don't know.

[00:47:55] [SPEAKER_03]: Okay.

[00:47:55] [SPEAKER_03]: Don't worry.

[00:47:55] [SPEAKER_03]: We're heading.

[00:47:56] [SPEAKER_03]: We're heading down the road to my point.

[00:47:58] [SPEAKER_03]: So you keep on going.

[00:47:59] [SPEAKER_03]: We're almost there.

[00:48:00] [SPEAKER_07]: So he had lots of.

[00:48:03] [SPEAKER_07]: There was.

[00:48:03] [SPEAKER_07]: First of all.

[00:48:03] [SPEAKER_07]: There was lots of stuff on the walls.

[00:48:05] [SPEAKER_07]: Lots of little pictures.

[00:48:07] [SPEAKER_07]: Big pictures everywhere.

[00:48:08] [SPEAKER_07]: Tons of it.

[00:48:08] [SPEAKER_07]: There were a lot of things that were like sort of celestial.

[00:48:12] [SPEAKER_07]: There's like a few different cases of like the phases of the moon.

[00:48:15] [SPEAKER_07]: That has been coming up a ton.

[00:48:17] [SPEAKER_07]: There was a deck of tarot cards.

[00:48:20] [SPEAKER_07]: There were a book about tarot cards.

[00:48:21] [SPEAKER_07]: There were a bunch of books about witchcraft.

[00:48:23] [SPEAKER_07]: Tons of candles.

[00:48:25] [SPEAKER_07]: A version of Monopoly that's for the night sky.

[00:48:29] [SPEAKER_07]: I've never heard of night sky Monopoly but fine.

[00:48:31] [SPEAKER_07]: A game called Outburst.

[00:48:33] [SPEAKER_07]: A game called Lotto.

[00:48:34] [SPEAKER_07]: A game called Space Spinners.

[00:48:36] [SPEAKER_07]: A version of Cranium.

[00:48:37] [SPEAKER_07]: An old version of Trivial Pursuit.

[00:48:40] [SPEAKER_07]: A band poster for a band called Brutalitat.

[00:48:42] [SPEAKER_07]: Which appears to be a real German band.

[00:48:45] [SPEAKER_07]: That does sort of like angry German kind of metal music.

[00:48:51] [SPEAKER_07]: Let's see.

[00:48:52] [SPEAKER_07]: Candles I said.

[00:48:54] [SPEAKER_07]: A bunch of witchy looking symbols.

[00:48:56] [SPEAKER_07]: A drawing of a cicada.

[00:48:58] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[00:48:58] [SPEAKER_07]: Some pictures that look like very old like tin types or something of some old women.

[00:49:04] [SPEAKER_07]: A Fleetwood Mac poster.

[00:49:07] [SPEAKER_07]: Like pentacles.

[00:49:08] [SPEAKER_07]: Books on like astrology or astronomy.

[00:49:10] [SPEAKER_07]: It was hard to tell.

[00:49:12] [SPEAKER_07]: Hourglasses.

[00:49:13] [SPEAKER_07]: A bunch of rocks and crystals.

[00:49:15] [SPEAKER_07]: Some small animal skulls.

[00:49:17] [SPEAKER_07]: And a poster for the craft.

[00:49:20] [SPEAKER_07]: Saw and Carrie.

[00:49:22] [SPEAKER_03]: And there was Jennifer's body as well.

[00:49:24] [SPEAKER_03]: Which I thought.

[00:49:25] [SPEAKER_03]: Oh I didn't see that one.

[00:49:27] [SPEAKER_03]: That's the one that caught me the most.

[00:49:28] [SPEAKER_03]: Just because.

[00:49:30] [SPEAKER_03]: That's.

[00:49:30] [SPEAKER_03]: There's a couple of scenes in there again.

[00:49:32] [SPEAKER_03]: That addresses like the LGBTQ plus community.

[00:49:35] [SPEAKER_03]: In a way similar to this movie.

[00:49:37] [SPEAKER_03]: So that's the one that I noticed initially.

[00:49:39] [SPEAKER_03]: Which I thought was actually.

[00:49:41] [SPEAKER_03]: Awesome homage.

[00:49:42] [SPEAKER_03]: And then of course the craft.

[00:49:44] [SPEAKER_03]: Which again.

[00:49:45] [SPEAKER_03]: Talking about the end credits scene.

[00:49:47] [SPEAKER_03]: The end credits.

[00:49:48] [SPEAKER_03]: Again.

[00:49:49] [SPEAKER_03]: There's that scene from the craft in there.

[00:49:51] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[00:49:51] [SPEAKER_03]: So we kind of get to see that connection as well.

[00:49:53] [SPEAKER_03]: So.

[00:49:54] [SPEAKER_07]: And the craft is all about a coven.

[00:49:57] [SPEAKER_07]: And forming a coven.

[00:49:58] [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[00:49:58] [SPEAKER_07]: And what are the rules of a coven.

[00:50:01] [SPEAKER_07]: And that has been so critical for this whole show.

[00:50:05] [SPEAKER_07]: Yes.

[00:50:06] [SPEAKER_03]: So let me.

[00:50:07] [SPEAKER_03]: Let me just.

[00:50:08] [SPEAKER_03]: Let's.

[00:50:08] [SPEAKER_03]: We'll come back to this.

[00:50:10] [SPEAKER_03]: But I want to talk about several things that you have mentioned.

[00:50:13] [SPEAKER_03]: And I'm going to put them all together and see what you think.

[00:50:15] [SPEAKER_03]: You mentioned the globe.

[00:50:18] [SPEAKER_03]: In his room prior.

[00:50:20] [SPEAKER_03]: You mentioned the triangular orange lights.

[00:50:25] [SPEAKER_03]: That are either similar or the same as the ones we saw.

[00:50:29] [SPEAKER_03]: So the globe.

[00:50:30] [SPEAKER_03]: I'll get to that one in a second.

[00:50:31] [SPEAKER_03]: You mentioned the angular like orange lights.

[00:50:34] [SPEAKER_03]: That we saw for sure in Agatha's cabin.

[00:50:38] [SPEAKER_03]: You mentioned the Fleetwood Mac poster.

[00:50:41] [SPEAKER_03]: Which if you remember is the exact same poster we see.

[00:50:44] [SPEAKER_03]: In Alice's.

[00:50:47] [SPEAKER_03]: Room when.

[00:50:49] [SPEAKER_03]: When.

[00:50:50] [SPEAKER_03]: When Alice is looking at all the posters.

[00:50:53] [SPEAKER_03]: That fleet.

[00:50:54] [SPEAKER_03]: That same Fleetwood Mac poster is on the wall there next to her mom's.

[00:50:58] [SPEAKER_03]: Let's see.

[00:50:59] [SPEAKER_03]: What else?

[00:51:00] [SPEAKER_03]: What else?

[00:51:01] [SPEAKER_03]: What else?

[00:51:01] [SPEAKER_03]: The globe.

[00:51:03] [SPEAKER_03]: Now this one might just mean me pulling something out of my butt.

[00:51:06] [SPEAKER_03]: I believe that globe is.

[00:51:09] [SPEAKER_03]: Are the same globes that are lighting up that house.

[00:51:11] [SPEAKER_03]: In Jen's house.

[00:51:14] [SPEAKER_03]: So now you have to go.

[00:51:15] [SPEAKER_07]: Oh because there were globe lights.

[00:51:17] [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[00:51:18] [SPEAKER_07]: So.

[00:51:18] [SPEAKER_07]: I got to go back and look at that.

[00:51:19] [SPEAKER_03]: And then of course you mentioned.

[00:51:22] [SPEAKER_03]: What was the other thing for Alice?

[00:51:25] [SPEAKER_03]: Oh.

[00:51:25] [SPEAKER_03]: The record.

[00:51:27] [SPEAKER_03]: That.

[00:51:27] [SPEAKER_03]: That.

[00:51:28] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[00:51:28] [SPEAKER_03]: The teen.

[00:51:28] [SPEAKER_03]: And the poster of her mother.

[00:51:30] [SPEAKER_03]: And the poster of her mother.

[00:51:30] [SPEAKER_03]: So.

[00:51:32] [SPEAKER_03]: Last week.

[00:51:32] [SPEAKER_03]: And the reason why I'm bringing this up now.

[00:51:34] [SPEAKER_03]: Is because.

[00:51:35] [SPEAKER_03]: I do believe.

[00:51:38] [SPEAKER_03]: That the teen is.

[00:51:40] [SPEAKER_03]: Okay.

[00:51:41] [SPEAKER_03]: I do believe that Billy.

[00:51:42] [SPEAKER_03]: It.

[00:51:42] [SPEAKER_03]: Knows more than he's letting on.

[00:51:45] [SPEAKER_03]: I don't think that all of these things are randomly.

[00:51:48] [SPEAKER_03]: Just in his room.

[00:51:49] [SPEAKER_03]: And also in all of these other rooms.

[00:51:51] [SPEAKER_03]: So.

[00:51:52] [SPEAKER_03]: I really.

[00:51:53] [SPEAKER_07]: It's.

[00:51:53] [SPEAKER_03]: I really.

[00:51:54] [SPEAKER_07]: I think he's influencing the road.

[00:51:57] [SPEAKER_03]: Yes.

[00:51:57] [SPEAKER_03]: And I can't tell.

[00:52:01] [SPEAKER_03]: I can't tell if it's on purpose.

[00:52:03] [SPEAKER_03]: Or if it's by accident.

[00:52:04] [SPEAKER_07]: I don't.

[00:52:05] [SPEAKER_03]: But either way.

[00:52:06] [SPEAKER_07]: I don't think it is on purpose.

[00:52:08] [SPEAKER_03]: Well.

[00:52:08] [SPEAKER_03]: Don't you think that we're heading to a place.

[00:52:10] [SPEAKER_03]: And you may know more about backstory than I do.

[00:52:13] [SPEAKER_03]: Because I just.

[00:52:14] [SPEAKER_03]: Really today.

[00:52:15] [SPEAKER_03]: Have sort of to dive into the comic book side of Billy.

[00:52:18] [SPEAKER_03]: But I'm starting to.

[00:52:21] [SPEAKER_03]: Really get the impression.

[00:52:23] [SPEAKER_03]: And agree with you.

[00:52:24] [SPEAKER_03]: That.

[00:52:24] [SPEAKER_03]: That perhaps.

[00:52:25] [SPEAKER_03]: The strength of Billy.

[00:52:28] [SPEAKER_03]: Might.

[00:52:29] [SPEAKER_03]: At least be on the same playing field as.

[00:52:33] [SPEAKER_03]: Some of our other witches.

[00:52:34] [SPEAKER_03]: Perhaps mom.

[00:52:36] [SPEAKER_03]: Of course.

[00:52:36] [SPEAKER_03]: And maybe Dr. Strange as well.

[00:52:38] [SPEAKER_03]: But I do start.

[00:52:39] [SPEAKER_03]: I'm starting to get the impression.

[00:52:41] [SPEAKER_03]: That there's a lot more to Billy.

[00:52:43] [SPEAKER_03]: That that meets the eye.

[00:52:44] [SPEAKER_03]: And that this is a character that.

[00:52:46] [SPEAKER_03]: That really could carry a lot of weight.

[00:52:48] [SPEAKER_03]: In this universe that they're building forward.

[00:52:50] [SPEAKER_03]: Anyways.

[00:52:51] [SPEAKER_03]: I just wanted to throw that out there.

[00:52:52] [SPEAKER_03]: Because there's lots of little connections.

[00:52:53] [SPEAKER_03]: To that room.

[00:52:54] [SPEAKER_03]: And that's why.

[00:52:55] [SPEAKER_03]: I'm pre-show.

[00:52:56] [SPEAKER_03]: When we were talking about.

[00:52:56] [SPEAKER_03]: I'm so glad that you don't.

[00:52:58] [SPEAKER_03]: Because I just noticed a few of these things.

[00:53:00] [SPEAKER_03]: And the more you keep talking about this room.

[00:53:01] [SPEAKER_03]: The more I start thinking.

[00:53:03] [SPEAKER_03]: Oh boy.

[00:53:04] [SPEAKER_03]: Especially when you started naming all those Wizard of Oz things.

[00:53:07] [SPEAKER_03]: I'm really starting to think.

[00:53:08] [SPEAKER_03]: That there's.

[00:53:09] [SPEAKER_03]: There's more at play here.

[00:53:10] [SPEAKER_03]: And I'm really intrigued with.

[00:53:12] [SPEAKER_03]: Billy slash William.

[00:53:13] [SPEAKER_03]: And how much of William is actually.

[00:53:14] [SPEAKER_03]: Billy still left.

[00:53:16] [SPEAKER_03]: Because I do feel like.

[00:53:18] [SPEAKER_03]: Billy isn't.

[00:53:19] [SPEAKER_03]: Full on Billy.

[00:53:21] [SPEAKER_03]: That we still have a little bit of William in there.

[00:53:22] [SPEAKER_03]: I'm sorry.

[00:53:23] [SPEAKER_03]: Go back to the room too.

[00:53:23] [SPEAKER_03]: I don't want to.

[00:53:24] [SPEAKER_03]: I just.

[00:53:24] [SPEAKER_03]: You had named all the little points.

[00:53:26] [SPEAKER_03]: That I had seen.

[00:53:27] [SPEAKER_03]: And I just thought.

[00:53:28] [SPEAKER_03]: Oh my gosh.

[00:53:29] [SPEAKER_03]: That he definitely has.

[00:53:32] [SPEAKER_03]: Something to this.

[00:53:33] [SPEAKER_07]: I feel like there's.

[00:53:34] [SPEAKER_07]: There's a lot of overlap.

[00:53:36] [SPEAKER_07]: Or similarities.

[00:53:37] [SPEAKER_07]: Or thematic.

[00:53:38] [SPEAKER_07]: Relations.

[00:53:39] [SPEAKER_07]: Between what we've seen on the road so far.

[00:53:41] [SPEAKER_07]: And all these things that are in Billy's road.

[00:53:43] [SPEAKER_07]: Billy's room.

[00:53:44] [SPEAKER_07]: But I don't think it's intentional.

[00:53:49] [SPEAKER_07]: So I actually had a little bit of time this week.

[00:53:52] [SPEAKER_07]: To waste.

[00:53:53] [SPEAKER_07]: Or spend wisely.

[00:53:55] [SPEAKER_07]: Depending on how you look at it.

[00:53:56] [SPEAKER_07]: And I went back and.

[00:53:57] [SPEAKER_07]: And re-watched.

[00:53:58] [SPEAKER_07]: Episodes two.

[00:53:59] [SPEAKER_07]: Three.

[00:53:59] [SPEAKER_07]: Four.

[00:54:00] [SPEAKER_07]: And five.

[00:54:01] [SPEAKER_07]: And then.

[00:54:02] [SPEAKER_07]: Again.

[00:54:02] [SPEAKER_07]: Went back and watched a bunch of episode one.

[00:54:05] [SPEAKER_07]: And.

[00:54:06] [SPEAKER_07]: I noticed a few things.

[00:54:08] [SPEAKER_03]: Can I ask you a quick question?

[00:54:09] [SPEAKER_07]: Yep.

[00:54:10] [SPEAKER_03]: When you re-watched.

[00:54:12] [SPEAKER_03]: Did you.

[00:54:13] [SPEAKER_03]: Like those episodes better.

[00:54:15] [SPEAKER_03]: Than the first time you watched them?

[00:54:19] [SPEAKER_07]: Hmm.

[00:54:20] [SPEAKER_07]: I don't know how to rank that.

[00:54:22] [SPEAKER_07]: I enjoyed them.

[00:54:24] [SPEAKER_07]: In a different way.

[00:54:25] [SPEAKER_07]: Because.

[00:54:26] [SPEAKER_07]: Now I know more about the characters.

[00:54:29] [SPEAKER_07]: But I didn't enjoy them the same way.

[00:54:31] [SPEAKER_07]: Because before it was all like.

[00:54:32] [SPEAKER_07]: Oh my god.

[00:54:33] [SPEAKER_07]: I didn't see this coming.

[00:54:34] [SPEAKER_07]: And now it's like.

[00:54:35] [SPEAKER_07]: Well I know what happens.

[00:54:36] [SPEAKER_07]: It's just hard to compare.

[00:54:37] [SPEAKER_03]: Okay.

[00:54:38] [SPEAKER_07]: That's a good.

[00:54:39] [SPEAKER_07]: No.

[00:54:39] [SPEAKER_03]: That's a good answer.

[00:54:40] [SPEAKER_03]: Because I think.

[00:54:42] [SPEAKER_03]: Probably what you're trying to say.

[00:54:43] [SPEAKER_03]: Is they carry.

[00:54:44] [SPEAKER_03]: Like probably on.

[00:54:45] [SPEAKER_03]: In the land of like.

[00:54:46] [SPEAKER_03]: Weighing.

[00:54:47] [SPEAKER_03]: The first time you've watched it.

[00:54:48] [SPEAKER_03]: Versus the second or the third time.

[00:54:49] [SPEAKER_03]: They carry the same weight.

[00:54:51] [SPEAKER_03]: Just for different reasons.

[00:54:52] [SPEAKER_03]: Which is what makes this show so special to me.

[00:54:55] [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[00:54:55] [SPEAKER_07]: It is very re-watchable.

[00:54:57] [SPEAKER_07]: So.

[00:54:57] [SPEAKER_07]: At the very beginning of episode three.

[00:54:59] [SPEAKER_07]: When they're first starting out on the road.

[00:55:01] [SPEAKER_07]: He says.

[00:55:02] [SPEAKER_07]: It's exactly how I pictured it.

[00:55:04] [SPEAKER_07]: And Agatha says to him.

[00:55:07] [SPEAKER_07]: Yes.

[00:55:07] [SPEAKER_07]: It suits you.

[00:55:10] [SPEAKER_07]: And she sort of gives him a knowing look.

[00:55:12] [SPEAKER_07]: And he's not looking back at her when she does it.

[00:55:14] [SPEAKER_07]: He's.

[00:55:15] [SPEAKER_07]: She's like.

[00:55:15] [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[00:55:16] [SPEAKER_07]: It suits you.

[00:55:17] [SPEAKER_07]: Like.

[00:55:17] [SPEAKER_07]: No duh.

[00:55:18] [SPEAKER_07]: Because.

[00:55:19] [SPEAKER_07]: You know.

[00:55:20] [SPEAKER_07]: This is the road you've chosen.

[00:55:21] [SPEAKER_07]: Or something.

[00:55:22] [SPEAKER_07]: I don't know.

[00:55:23] [SPEAKER_07]: And then.

[00:55:24] [SPEAKER_07]: You know.

[00:55:24] [SPEAKER_07]: He finds the invitation.

[00:55:26] [SPEAKER_07]: Jen reads the invitation.

[00:55:27] [SPEAKER_07]: Then.

[00:55:28] [SPEAKER_07]: When they go to.

[00:55:29] [SPEAKER_07]: The beginning of episode four.

[00:55:31] [SPEAKER_07]: And Sharon has died.

[00:55:33] [SPEAKER_07]: And after they've buried her.

[00:55:34] [SPEAKER_07]: They're talking.

[00:55:35] [SPEAKER_07]: And Teen says.

[00:55:36] [SPEAKER_07]: I wish we could go home.

[00:55:38] [SPEAKER_07]: And Agatha looks at him.

[00:55:40] [SPEAKER_07]: And narrows her eyes at him.

[00:55:42] [SPEAKER_07]: Like.

[00:55:42] [SPEAKER_07]: Do you now?

[00:55:43] [SPEAKER_07]: Interesting.

[00:55:44] [SPEAKER_07]: And then.

[00:55:45] [SPEAKER_07]: And then.

[00:55:46] [SPEAKER_07]: Um.

[00:55:46] [SPEAKER_07]: And then they go.

[00:55:48] [SPEAKER_07]: And they have Alice's.

[00:55:49] [SPEAKER_07]: Uh.

[00:55:50] [SPEAKER_07]: Whole adventure.

[00:55:51] [SPEAKER_07]: And then.

[00:55:52] [SPEAKER_07]: Um.

[00:55:53] [SPEAKER_07]: In episode.

[00:55:55] [SPEAKER_07]: Five.

[00:55:56] [SPEAKER_07]: Billy's outfit.

[00:55:59] [SPEAKER_07]: Looks like.

[00:56:00] [SPEAKER_07]: His little kid Halloween costume.

[00:56:03] [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[00:56:03] [SPEAKER_07]: From WandaVision.

[00:56:03] [SPEAKER_07]: Most identical.

[00:56:04] [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[00:56:04] [SPEAKER_07]: So much.

[00:56:06] [SPEAKER_07]: And.

[00:56:07] [SPEAKER_07]: And.

[00:56:07] [SPEAKER_07]: There were things in that cabin.

[00:56:09] [SPEAKER_07]: That looked a lot like things in his room.

[00:56:11] [SPEAKER_07]: And you had said.

[00:56:13] [SPEAKER_07]: Why is this Agatha's trial?

[00:56:14] [SPEAKER_07]: Like.

[00:56:15] [SPEAKER_07]: Why is Agatha's trial taking place in an 80s horror movie?

[00:56:17] [SPEAKER_07]: Like.

[00:56:18] [SPEAKER_07]: That didn't make any sense.

[00:56:19] [SPEAKER_07]: But.

[00:56:20] [SPEAKER_07]: If it was some kind of.

[00:56:21] [SPEAKER_07]: If it's Billy.

[00:56:22] [SPEAKER_07]: Just like.

[00:56:23] [SPEAKER_07]: Influencing the road.

[00:56:24] [SPEAKER_07]: With his reality.

[00:56:26] [SPEAKER_07]: Affecting powers.

[00:56:27] [SPEAKER_07]: Right.

[00:56:27] [SPEAKER_07]: Like.

[00:56:28] [SPEAKER_07]: Similar to Scarlet Witch.

[00:56:29] [SPEAKER_07]: When she did things.

[00:56:30] [SPEAKER_07]: She didn't even realize she was doing.

[00:56:32] [SPEAKER_07]: It.

[00:56:32] [SPEAKER_07]: It.

[00:56:33] Um.

[00:56:35] [SPEAKER_07]: It would make sense that.

[00:56:36] [SPEAKER_07]: All of the.

[00:56:37] [SPEAKER_07]: Trials.

[00:56:39] [SPEAKER_07]: Either they're not happening at all.

[00:56:40] [SPEAKER_07]: And it's all in his head.

[00:56:41] [SPEAKER_07]: Or they are happening.

[00:56:43] [SPEAKER_07]: But he's making parts of them happen.

[00:56:45] [SPEAKER_07]: But it's imperfect.

[00:56:45] [SPEAKER_07]: Because he doesn't have complete control over his powers.

[00:56:48] [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.

[00:56:49] [SPEAKER_07]: Um.

[00:56:49] [SPEAKER_07]: When they leave.

[00:56:51] [SPEAKER_07]: The.

[00:56:52] [SPEAKER_07]: Horror cabin.

[00:56:52] [SPEAKER_07]: At the end of episode five.

[00:56:54] [SPEAKER_07]: And he has that.

[00:56:55] [SPEAKER_07]: You know.

[00:56:55] [SPEAKER_07]: Showdown with.

[00:56:56] [SPEAKER_07]: With Agatha.

[00:56:57] [SPEAKER_07]: And everything.

[00:56:58] [SPEAKER_07]: The road is no longer blue or red.

[00:57:00] [SPEAKER_07]: It's like.

[00:57:01] [SPEAKER_07]: Gray.

[00:57:02] [SPEAKER_07]: Khaki.

[00:57:02] [SPEAKER_07]: Tan.

[00:57:03] [SPEAKER_07]: Like.

[00:57:03] [SPEAKER_07]: Neutral.

[00:57:04] [SPEAKER_07]: Colors.

[00:57:05] [SPEAKER_07]: And again.

[00:57:05] [SPEAKER_07]: In episode six.

[00:57:06] [SPEAKER_07]: The road doesn't have any color.

[00:57:08] [SPEAKER_07]: So.

[00:57:10] [SPEAKER_07]: Because he's like.

[00:57:11] [SPEAKER_07]: Claimed his power or something.

[00:57:13] [SPEAKER_07]: Maybe he's no longer.

[00:57:15] [SPEAKER_07]: Unintentionally.

[00:57:15] [SPEAKER_07]: Influencing the road.

[00:57:16] [SPEAKER_07]: With all his.

[00:57:17] [SPEAKER_07]: Like.

[00:57:17] [SPEAKER_07]: Blue magic.

[00:57:18] [SPEAKER_07]: Or something.

[00:57:19] [SPEAKER_07]: But there's definitely a significance.

[00:57:21] [SPEAKER_07]: To the fact that all the colors.

[00:57:22] [SPEAKER_07]: Drained out.

[00:57:23] [SPEAKER_03]: Yes.

[00:57:23] [SPEAKER_03]: Well.

[00:57:24] [SPEAKER_03]: And.

[00:57:24] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean.

[00:57:24] [SPEAKER_03]: At the end of.

[00:57:26] [SPEAKER_03]: The end of episode six.

[00:57:28] [SPEAKER_03]: Um.

[00:57:30] [SPEAKER_03]: The.

[00:57:32] [SPEAKER_03]: Color.

[00:57:33] [SPEAKER_03]: Do you remember what color it was?

[00:57:36] [SPEAKER_03]: As they walk.

[00:57:37] [SPEAKER_07]: It was color at the end of episode six?

[00:57:39] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[00:57:40] [SPEAKER_07]: How did I miss that?

[00:57:41] [SPEAKER_03]: It was yellow.

[00:57:42] [SPEAKER_07]: It was yellow.

[00:57:45] [SPEAKER_07]: Maybe Lilia.

[00:57:46] [SPEAKER_03]: Or.

[00:57:47] [SPEAKER_07]: Her color is yellow.

[00:57:48] [SPEAKER_03]: Or maybe it's just the yellow brick road.

[00:57:49] [SPEAKER_03]: Because.

[00:57:52] [SPEAKER_03]: So many homages to.

[00:57:54] [SPEAKER_03]: To.

[00:57:56] [SPEAKER_03]: Wizard of Oz.

[00:57:57] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[00:57:58] [SPEAKER_03]: The Williams side of it especially.

[00:57:59] [SPEAKER_03]: But yeah.

[00:57:59] [SPEAKER_03]: But I would agree with you.

[00:58:01] [SPEAKER_03]: I think.

[00:58:01] [SPEAKER_03]: We're heading down the road to Lilia.

[00:58:03] [SPEAKER_03]: Even though Lilia has.

[00:58:05] [SPEAKER_03]: Not quite.

[00:58:06] [SPEAKER_03]: Been.

[00:58:08] [SPEAKER_03]: Um.

[00:58:09] [SPEAKER_03]: Brought back from whatever happened to her.

[00:58:11] [SPEAKER_03]: Um.

[00:58:12] [SPEAKER_03]: I.

[00:58:12] [SPEAKER_07]: I.

[00:58:13] [SPEAKER_07]: I have trouble believing that Jen and Lilia are gone.

[00:58:16] [SPEAKER_07]: Gone.

[00:58:16] [SPEAKER_07]: I just.

[00:58:17] [SPEAKER_07]: It.

[00:58:17] [SPEAKER_07]: It's.

[00:58:17] [SPEAKER_07]: They wouldn't.

[00:58:19] [SPEAKER_07]: Narratively.

[00:58:20] [SPEAKER_07]: Like just.

[00:58:21] [SPEAKER_07]: Write them out like that.

[00:58:22] [SPEAKER_07]: So they're coming back.

[00:58:23] [SPEAKER_03]: I think they're all.

[00:58:24] [SPEAKER_03]: I.

[00:58:25] [SPEAKER_03]: So.

[00:58:25] [SPEAKER_03]: I.

[00:58:27] [SPEAKER_03]: I can't.

[00:58:29] [SPEAKER_03]: I think it was episode three.

[00:58:31] [SPEAKER_03]: Maybe it was episode four.

[00:58:33] [SPEAKER_03]: Where.

[00:58:34] [SPEAKER_03]: I think it was episode two.

[00:58:35] [SPEAKER_03]: I don't know.

[00:58:36] [SPEAKER_03]: It was the episode where.

[00:58:38] [SPEAKER_03]: Um.

[00:58:38] [SPEAKER_03]: I think it was episode two.

[00:58:40] [SPEAKER_03]: When Rio was trying to kill.

[00:58:44] [SPEAKER_03]: Well.

[00:58:44] [SPEAKER_03]: They were.

[00:58:45] [SPEAKER_03]: They were fighting.

[00:58:46] [SPEAKER_03]: In.

[00:58:47] [SPEAKER_03]: Agatha's house.

[00:58:49] [SPEAKER_03]: Oh.

[00:58:49] [SPEAKER_07]: Episode one.

[00:58:49] [SPEAKER_03]: Episode one.

[00:58:50] [SPEAKER_03]: So.

[00:58:51] [SPEAKER_03]: Uh.

[00:58:54] [SPEAKER_03]: Rio is.

[00:58:55] [SPEAKER_03]: Supposedly trying to kill her.

[00:58:56] [SPEAKER_03]: And Agatha says.

[00:58:58] [SPEAKER_03]: You can't kill me.

[00:58:59] [SPEAKER_03]: Or something like that.

[00:59:00] [SPEAKER_03]: I can't remember exactly what she said.

[00:59:02] [SPEAKER_03]: Maybe you saw it in one of your rewatches and remember.

[00:59:04] [SPEAKER_03]: But.

[00:59:05] [SPEAKER_03]: Um.

[00:59:05] [SPEAKER_03]: I just remember thinking.

[00:59:07] [SPEAKER_03]: Oh.

[00:59:07] [SPEAKER_03]: Is Agatha.

[00:59:09] [SPEAKER_03]: Unkillable.

[00:59:11] [SPEAKER_03]: And.

[00:59:12] [SPEAKER_03]: And that.

[00:59:12] [SPEAKER_03]: This is long before I thought Rio was.

[00:59:14] [SPEAKER_03]: Was death.

[00:59:15] [SPEAKER_03]: But.

[00:59:16] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[00:59:17] [SPEAKER_03]: I'm.

[00:59:17] [SPEAKER_07]: She says.

[00:59:18] [SPEAKER_07]: You can't kill me.

[00:59:19] [SPEAKER_07]: It's against the rules.

[00:59:20] [SPEAKER_03]: Yes.

[00:59:21] [SPEAKER_03]: Yes.

[00:59:22] [SPEAKER_03]: And that was the weird thing about it.

[00:59:24] [SPEAKER_03]: So.

[00:59:24] [SPEAKER_03]: I.

[00:59:24] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean.

[00:59:25] [SPEAKER_03]: I.

[00:59:25] [SPEAKER_07]: And also.

[00:59:26] [SPEAKER_07]: Then Rio says.

[00:59:28] [SPEAKER_07]: I'm not the only one who wants to.

[00:59:31] [SPEAKER_07]: See you dead.

[00:59:33] [SPEAKER_07]: Not.

[00:59:33] [SPEAKER_07]: Kill you.

[00:59:34] [SPEAKER_07]: See you dead.

[00:59:35] [SPEAKER_07]: Yes.

[00:59:36] [SPEAKER_03]: So.

[00:59:37] [SPEAKER_03]: That could mean anyone really.

[00:59:40] [SPEAKER_03]: It could mean.

[00:59:41] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[00:59:41] [SPEAKER_03]: But.

[00:59:41] [SPEAKER_03]: It could mean.

[00:59:41] [SPEAKER_03]: But Rio.

[00:59:44] [SPEAKER_07]: Rio wants Agatha to be dead for her own reasons.

[00:59:47] [SPEAKER_07]: And if she is death.

[00:59:49] [SPEAKER_07]: I think it's so that Agatha will be with her.

[00:59:52] [SPEAKER_07]: Yes.

[00:59:53] [SPEAKER_03]: Well.

[00:59:54] [SPEAKER_07]: I mean.

[00:59:54] [SPEAKER_07]: I think that's also why Rio hates ghosts.

[00:59:57] [SPEAKER_07]: Because ghosts are dead people that have resisted her power.

[00:59:59] [SPEAKER_03]: Yes.

[01:00:01] [SPEAKER_03]: Well.

[01:00:02] [SPEAKER_03]: Why don't we.

[01:00:03] [SPEAKER_03]: Why don't we.

[01:00:04] [SPEAKER_03]: Why don't we talk about.

[01:00:05] [SPEAKER_03]: Let's talk about Agatha a bit.

[01:00:06] [SPEAKER_03]: Because.

[01:00:07] [SPEAKER_03]: We find out.

[01:00:08] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[01:00:09] [SPEAKER_03]: Some funny things.

[01:00:10] [SPEAKER_03]: And we find out some super important things.

[01:00:12] [SPEAKER_03]: And then.

[01:00:12] [SPEAKER_03]: We can blend them together here at the end.

[01:00:14] [SPEAKER_03]: But.

[01:00:14] [SPEAKER_03]: We do get.

[01:00:15] [SPEAKER_03]: As Billy is doing.

[01:00:18] [SPEAKER_03]: His research.

[01:00:20] [SPEAKER_03]: He.

[01:00:21] [SPEAKER_03]: Of course.

[01:00:22] [SPEAKER_03]: Types.

[01:00:23] [SPEAKER_03]: Agatha's name.

[01:00:24] [SPEAKER_03]: Into.

[01:00:25] [SPEAKER_03]: Google.

[01:00:28] [SPEAKER_03]: Which.

[01:00:29] [SPEAKER_03]: Which.

[01:00:29] [SPEAKER_03]: Which is probably what everybody else has been doing.

[01:00:32] [SPEAKER_03]: Which I have had to fight against.

[01:00:33] [SPEAKER_03]: Over the past few weeks.

[01:00:35] [SPEAKER_03]: But.

[01:00:35] [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.

[01:00:35] [SPEAKER_03]: And we find.

[01:00:38] [SPEAKER_03]: Several.

[01:00:38] [SPEAKER_03]: Interesting pieces of information.

[01:00:40] [SPEAKER_03]: I'm going to mention the information.

[01:00:41] [SPEAKER_03]: I have some thoughts on it.

[01:00:42] [SPEAKER_03]: But.

[01:00:43] [SPEAKER_03]: Maybe we'll do this as.

[01:00:44] [SPEAKER_03]: As kind of a.

[01:00:45] [SPEAKER_03]: I'm kind of curious at what you thought.

[01:00:47] [SPEAKER_03]: Because.

[01:00:47] [SPEAKER_03]: One of the first things we see.

[01:00:48] [SPEAKER_03]: Aside from her pictures.

[01:00:49] [SPEAKER_03]: We get to see this.

[01:00:51] [SPEAKER_03]: Singular picture of her.

[01:00:52] [SPEAKER_03]: From a long time ago.

[01:00:55] [SPEAKER_03]: Like.

[01:00:56] [SPEAKER_03]: Either.

[01:00:56] [SPEAKER_03]: Like mid-18.

[01:00:57] [SPEAKER_03]: Late 1800s.

[01:00:58] [SPEAKER_03]: But then we see these headlines.

[01:01:00] [SPEAKER_03]: That note.

[01:01:01] [SPEAKER_03]: That she was.

[01:01:02] [SPEAKER_03]: Part of a couple of disasters.

[01:01:04] [SPEAKER_03]: One being.

[01:01:05] [SPEAKER_03]: The Titanic.

[01:01:06] [SPEAKER_03]: And one being.

[01:01:07] [SPEAKER_03]: The.

[01:01:08] [SPEAKER_03]: Hindenburg.

[01:01:09] [SPEAKER_03]: And I immediately had some thoughts.

[01:01:12] [SPEAKER_03]: About why.

[01:01:13] [SPEAKER_03]: Because I don't.

[01:01:15] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean.

[01:01:16] [SPEAKER_03]: I.

[01:01:16] [SPEAKER_03]: I don't think that those articles were trying.

[01:01:18] [SPEAKER_03]: Or maybe they were.

[01:01:19] [SPEAKER_03]: Trying to.

[01:01:20] [SPEAKER_03]: Lead us to believe that she had a hand in that.

[01:01:22] [SPEAKER_03]: But I actually.

[01:01:23] [SPEAKER_03]: I actually don't think that's true.

[01:01:25] [SPEAKER_03]: Did you have any thoughts about that?

[01:01:26] [SPEAKER_07]: I mean.

[01:01:28] [SPEAKER_07]: It could have been during the period of her life.

[01:01:31] [SPEAKER_07]: When she and Rio.

[01:01:32] [SPEAKER_07]: Yes.

[01:01:32] [SPEAKER_07]: Were going around.

[01:01:33] [SPEAKER_07]: Having adventures.

[01:01:34] [SPEAKER_03]: Yes.

[01:01:35] [SPEAKER_07]: And.

[01:01:35] [SPEAKER_07]: If you're having adventures with a witch.

[01:01:37] [SPEAKER_07]: And death.

[01:01:39] [SPEAKER_07]: Probably bad stuff happens.

[01:01:41] [SPEAKER_03]: Yes.

[01:01:42] [SPEAKER_07]: Like.

[01:01:42] [SPEAKER_03]: See that's what.

[01:01:43] [SPEAKER_03]: So we're taking the same thoughts.

[01:01:44] [SPEAKER_03]: Because that's.

[01:01:45] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[01:01:46] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[01:01:46] [SPEAKER_03]: Like.

[01:01:47] [SPEAKER_03]: Maybe.

[01:01:49] [SPEAKER_03]: Agatha is a vehicle for Rio.

[01:01:52] [SPEAKER_03]: Or maybe.

[01:01:55] [SPEAKER_03]: Agatha just happens to be tagging along.

[01:01:57] [SPEAKER_03]: And having fun along the way.

[01:01:58] [SPEAKER_03]: But I definitely think that.

[01:02:00] [SPEAKER_03]: These.

[01:02:00] [SPEAKER_03]: These periods are.

[01:02:01] [SPEAKER_03]: Are definitely periods that she was with Rio.

[01:02:04] [SPEAKER_03]: That's what.

[01:02:05] [SPEAKER_03]: That's what I.

[01:02:05] [SPEAKER_07]: That's what I would guess.

[01:02:07] [SPEAKER_07]: And I did.

[01:02:08] [SPEAKER_07]: I did.

[01:02:08] [SPEAKER_07]: There's that funny one.

[01:02:09] [SPEAKER_07]: Where she's Jolene.

[01:02:10] [SPEAKER_07]: From the Dolly Parton song.

[01:02:12] [SPEAKER_07]: It was like.

[01:02:13] [SPEAKER_07]: Of course Agatha is Jolene.

[01:02:15] [SPEAKER_07]: And people were like.

[01:02:16] [SPEAKER_07]: You know.

[01:02:17] [SPEAKER_07]: Piling on there.

[01:02:18] [SPEAKER_07]: And I was like.

[01:02:18] [SPEAKER_07]: I don't know.

[01:02:19] [SPEAKER_07]: That doesn't seem like Agatha.

[01:02:22] [SPEAKER_07]: I mean.

[01:02:23] [SPEAKER_07]: One thing about the song Jolene.

[01:02:25] [SPEAKER_07]: Is that.

[01:02:25] [SPEAKER_07]: The Jolene character is passive.

[01:02:28] [SPEAKER_07]: Yes.

[01:02:28] [SPEAKER_07]: Right.

[01:02:29] [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[01:02:29] [SPEAKER_07]: It's like.

[01:02:30] [SPEAKER_07]: She's so beautiful.

[01:02:31] [SPEAKER_07]: My husband or boyfriend.

[01:02:33] [SPEAKER_07]: Wants her.

[01:02:33] [SPEAKER_07]: And talks about her in his sleep.

[01:02:35] [SPEAKER_07]: But.

[01:02:35] [SPEAKER_07]: There's no indication in the song.

[01:02:37] [SPEAKER_07]: That Jolene is.

[01:02:39] [SPEAKER_07]: Reciprocating in any way.

[01:02:41] [SPEAKER_03]: But.

[01:02:41] [SPEAKER_03]: Oh.

[01:02:41] [SPEAKER_07]: I don't know.

[01:02:41] [SPEAKER_07]: There's a movie.

[01:02:42] [SPEAKER_07]: I haven't seen it.

[01:02:43] [SPEAKER_03]: I.

[01:02:43] [SPEAKER_03]: I.

[01:02:44] [SPEAKER_03]: I love it so much.

[01:02:45] [SPEAKER_03]: And now.

[01:02:46] [SPEAKER_03]: I definitely want to see an episode.

[01:02:47] [SPEAKER_03]: Where we get to see just the touch of that.

[01:02:50] Yeah.

[01:02:52] [SPEAKER_07]: I mean.

[01:02:52] [SPEAKER_07]: If they can get the actual Dolly Parton to guess.

[01:02:55] [SPEAKER_07]: Let's go.

[01:02:56] [SPEAKER_07]: That would be amazing.

[01:02:56] [SPEAKER_03]: Let's go.

[01:02:57] [SPEAKER_03]: Oh my God.

[01:02:57] [SPEAKER_03]: I would lose my mind.

[01:02:59] [SPEAKER_03]: We find out.

[01:03:00] [SPEAKER_03]: Maybe she's the one at the.

[01:03:01] [SPEAKER_03]: At the pure center of all this.

[01:03:03] [SPEAKER_03]: I don't know.

[01:03:04] [SPEAKER_07]: She's Mephisto.

[01:03:05] [SPEAKER_07]: No.

[01:03:05] [SPEAKER_03]: Oh my God.

[01:03:09] [SPEAKER_03]: Well that's going to leave.

[01:03:10] [SPEAKER_03]: That's going to live rent free.

[01:03:12] [SPEAKER_03]: Every time someone mentions Mephisto now.

[01:03:13] [SPEAKER_03]: I'm going to think Dolly Parton.

[01:03:14] [SPEAKER_03]: So that's a good thing.

[01:03:17] [SPEAKER_03]: All right.

[01:03:18] [SPEAKER_07]: I love that he Googled her and actually found stuff that was like.

[01:03:24] [SPEAKER_07]: Like useful and relevant.

[01:03:26] [SPEAKER_07]: And it didn't take all that long.

[01:03:28] [SPEAKER_07]: Like he was like.

[01:03:29] [SPEAKER_07]: I'll go in this website.

[01:03:30] [SPEAKER_07]: Yes.

[01:03:30] [SPEAKER_07]: This has something in it that I want.

[01:03:32] [SPEAKER_07]: Like.

[01:03:33] [SPEAKER_07]: I don't know.

[01:03:33] [SPEAKER_07]: Whenever that happens on a movie or a TV show.

[01:03:36] [SPEAKER_07]: I'm always like.

[01:03:37] [SPEAKER_07]: Come on.

[01:03:38] [SPEAKER_07]: Well he goes.

[01:03:38] [SPEAKER_07]: He didn't like accidentally click into porn.

[01:03:42] [SPEAKER_07]: Like.

[01:03:42] [SPEAKER_07]: He didn't get like a bunch of pop-ups.

[01:03:44] [SPEAKER_07]: Someone trying to sell him some stupid finance scam.

[01:03:47] [SPEAKER_07]: Like.

[01:03:48] [SPEAKER_07]: All the stuff that happens when I'm trying to do research online.

[01:03:51] [SPEAKER_07]: Like he didn't get any of that.

[01:03:52] [SPEAKER_03]: No.

[01:03:52] [SPEAKER_03]: He just.

[01:03:53] [SPEAKER_03]: He just went right into catfish mode.

[01:03:55] [SPEAKER_03]: Penny.

[01:03:55] [SPEAKER_03]: He just.

[01:03:55] [SPEAKER_03]: He found that picture.

[01:03:57] [SPEAKER_03]: Dragged that picture right into the Google search.

[01:04:00] [SPEAKER_03]: And all those other pictures came up.

[01:04:01] [SPEAKER_03]: And I was like.

[01:04:02] [SPEAKER_03]: Okay.

[01:04:03] [SPEAKER_03]: Okay.

[01:04:04] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[01:04:04] [SPEAKER_03]: We could have saved ourselves a lot of episodes.

[01:04:08] [SPEAKER_07]: On.

[01:04:08] [SPEAKER_07]: On Earth.

[01:04:09] [SPEAKER_07]: Okay.

[01:04:10] [SPEAKER_07]: The Earth that most of the MCU takes place on is Earth 616.

[01:04:14] [SPEAKER_07]: Right?

[01:04:15] [SPEAKER_03]: Yep.

[01:04:15] [SPEAKER_07]: So.

[01:04:16] [SPEAKER_07]: I think the Google on Earth 616 is better than Google in our Earth.

[01:04:21] [SPEAKER_03]: Yes.

[01:04:22] [SPEAKER_07]: Better Google.

[01:04:24] [SPEAKER_03]: Well.

[01:04:25] [SPEAKER_03]: And maybe he was using a little witchcraft and we.

[01:04:27] [SPEAKER_03]: He didn't know it.

[01:04:29] [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[01:04:30] [SPEAKER_07]: And he.

[01:04:31] [SPEAKER_07]: And he's like.

[01:04:33] [SPEAKER_07]: So when we first met him.

[01:04:34] [SPEAKER_07]: And he was.

[01:04:35] [SPEAKER_07]: Says to Agatha things like.

[01:04:36] [SPEAKER_07]: I know a lot about you.

[01:04:38] [SPEAKER_07]: And.

[01:04:38] [SPEAKER_07]: He says to Jen.

[01:04:39] [SPEAKER_07]: Like.

[01:04:39] [SPEAKER_07]: I know how people feel about Agatha.

[01:04:41] [SPEAKER_07]: I got the sense that he had been.

[01:04:43] [SPEAKER_07]: Like.

[01:04:44] [SPEAKER_07]: Researching her for a kind of a long time.

[01:04:46] [SPEAKER_07]: Not.

[01:04:46] [SPEAKER_07]: One night.

[01:04:53] [SPEAKER_07]: I was like.

[01:04:53] [SPEAKER_07]: Wait.

[01:04:54] [SPEAKER_07]: Is it the same night?

[01:04:55] [SPEAKER_07]: He's going to break into her house the same night?

[01:04:58] [SPEAKER_07]: Nope.

[01:04:59] [SPEAKER_07]: Okay.

[01:05:00] [SPEAKER_07]: The.

[01:05:00] [SPEAKER_03]: The complete.

[01:05:02] [SPEAKER_03]: And utter like.

[01:05:04] [SPEAKER_03]: Tact.

[01:05:05] [SPEAKER_03]: And whole mood of the show.

[01:05:07] [SPEAKER_03]: When we get that scene.

[01:05:09] [SPEAKER_03]: The scenes we've been hoping we would get.

[01:05:10] [SPEAKER_03]: Of.

[01:05:11] [SPEAKER_03]: Of the teen.

[01:05:13] [SPEAKER_03]: Breaking into her house.

[01:05:15] [SPEAKER_03]: And then.

[01:05:16] [SPEAKER_03]: Penny.

[01:05:17] [SPEAKER_03]: This is not hyperbole when I tell you.

[01:05:19] [SPEAKER_03]: perhaps some of the funniest television i have ever seen is agatha dressed in the um the boner

[01:05:31] [SPEAKER_03]: family reunion pitching a tent shirt with a yeah with a hose nozzle for her gun and she was fingering

[01:05:40] [SPEAKER_03]: that gun and i'm just thinking and we look at the teen in that moment and the teen is like

[01:05:47] [SPEAKER_03]: what in god's name is happening right here but what i also love is did you go back and watch those

[01:05:56] [SPEAKER_03]: initial scenes back in episode one yeah i did it's funny because we correct me if we get to see the

[01:06:01] [SPEAKER_03]: perspectives right because he was he was kind of an ass in episode one in this episode he was the

[01:06:09] [SPEAKER_07]: teen that we know he's polite yeah yeah so he's like i see you've cast me as the mouthy teen who's

[01:06:15] [SPEAKER_07]: guilty of some b plot crime and i'm like oh my god i love this kid i love him and in the first

[01:06:22] [SPEAKER_07]: episode i just was like yeah he's some kid yeah but this kid is hilarious and precocious oh my favorite

[01:06:28] [SPEAKER_03]: my favorite quote of the entire and this says a lot because there are so many good ones

[01:06:33] [SPEAKER_03]: is she's throwing him back in the closet and he goes please don't put me i don't want to go back

[01:06:39] [SPEAKER_03]: in the closet and again it's so brilliant because we laugh at it with all the measured levels and

[01:06:48] [SPEAKER_03]: people probably just laugh at it because oh that's funny but that's what i'm talking about with this show

[01:06:52] [SPEAKER_03]: and in a show that's so funny so weighted in the death of a character and the creation of another

[01:06:59] [SPEAKER_03]: and the discovery of so much we have that segment that we've been waiting for where we get to see

[01:07:06] [SPEAKER_03]: katherine han uh play this comedic character and we get to see the teen sort of playing the straight

[01:07:13] [SPEAKER_03]: man opposite of of her uh and then oh my god and then which leads us to to the end where again

[01:07:22] [SPEAKER_03]: katherine han in these small parts i gotta tell you if she doesn't win an emmy for this

[01:07:29] [SPEAKER_03]: because it's an mcu television show it is a travesty because she again flips that switch

[01:07:36] [SPEAKER_03]: and it occurred to me before this but maybe especially because of this episode

[01:07:43] [SPEAKER_03]: this evil that she shows you had mentioned it being a habit um that she is is created over the years and

[01:07:50] [SPEAKER_03]: and i think that i do believe that the evil that we see i'm not saying that she's i mean i do think

[01:07:56] [SPEAKER_03]: in my i do think she's the big bad although that big twist is still out there in the wind

[01:08:02] [SPEAKER_03]: in this show it does seem like billy is

[01:08:07] [SPEAKER_03]: maybe the main character at this point but but i'll let you throw out what you think i just

[01:08:11] [SPEAKER_03]: her being evil at the tail end of this and i do wonder like it i feel like she's created kind of this

[01:08:19] [SPEAKER_03]: this evil side of her to to mask like how she feels because she's she's been yeah it's it's a trauma

[01:08:26] [SPEAKER_07]: response yes yeah she's she's put up a facade of being i don't care about other people i'm tough

[01:08:35] [SPEAKER_07]: i've killed people and doesn't even bother me ha ha ha ha ha like that is a performance

[01:08:41] [SPEAKER_07]: and every now and then we see agatha behind the performance and she's scared and hurting like when

[01:08:50] [SPEAKER_07]: her mother was going to keep her in that cabin that i think that was that was like her quote

[01:08:55] [SPEAKER_07]: unquote inner child that was the agatha that was tormented by her very mean mother and

[01:09:03] [SPEAKER_07]: like as powerful as she is as many centuries as she's lived her mother is still the thing that

[01:09:09] [SPEAKER_07]: scares her more than anything else because her mother is the person who hurt her before she had

[01:09:14] [SPEAKER_07]: the defenses to stop that from happening to her again yes so i think that i've always thought that

[01:09:20] [SPEAKER_07]: agatha isn't evil in the like muah ha ha i want to run the world or i want to destroy the world kind

[01:09:27] [SPEAKER_07]: of way i think she is i want as much power as possible so no one can touch me well and that in

[01:09:34] [SPEAKER_07]: pursuit of that power she has done some really hideous evil things yeah and and i mean we see it

[01:09:41] [SPEAKER_03]: when she's sitting in front of that um that bassinet when when where her son her her son was when he was

[01:09:51] [SPEAKER_03]: little and we see that look on her face of of a mother losing her son when she hears his voice again

[01:09:56] [SPEAKER_03]: we get to see it honestly when we see her when she sees billy for the first time in this episode

[01:10:05] [SPEAKER_03]: um she has kind of an authentic uh sort of like i missed you from the wandavision series yeah there

[01:10:15] [SPEAKER_07]: was that kind of he she's yeah she's not mad at him at all yeah about throwing her in the muck yeah

[01:10:21] [SPEAKER_07]: she's just like well there you go yeah i knew there was something in there she's she's like impressed

[01:10:26] [SPEAKER_07]: she's curious she's super curious about him the same way she was with wanda when she trapped wanda

[01:10:32] [SPEAKER_07]: and wanda vision it was all like i want to know everything about how you came to be in this place

[01:10:38] [SPEAKER_07]: i want to understand your power so with billy it's the same thing she's like you're a powerful being

[01:10:43] [SPEAKER_07]: and i am so into it like she's so there for it and he's like i don't trust you and she's

[01:10:50] [SPEAKER_07]: she almost i wanted her to be like nobody does yeah like that's my thing um so big surprise oh you

[01:10:58] [SPEAKER_07]: don't trust me like but she's like got it and then like i love when she's like last one there

[01:11:03] [SPEAKER_07]: is a nice person it's like it's like the meanest thing she could think of to call someone well i

[01:11:09] [SPEAKER_03]: she she she feels like she can mentor him too which is kind of interesting i i love when she walked up

[01:11:16] [SPEAKER_03]: to him and said don't you dare feel guilty about your talent oh your talent yeah i clipped it you want

[01:11:24] [SPEAKER_12]: to hear it yes lillian jen yeah well what you did was

[01:11:34] [SPEAKER_08]: but life goes on yours anyway i mean i've killed

[01:11:49] [SPEAKER_10]: my share but you don't see it holding me back i'm not like you where have i heard that before

[01:11:56] [SPEAKER_06]: where did you come by this fresh body don't you dare feel guilty about your talent

[01:12:17] [SPEAKER_10]: you survived like witches have been doing for centuries you saw an opportunity an empty vessel

[01:12:26] [SPEAKER_10]: and you moved in so you broke the rules big deal that's what kept you alive

[01:12:35] [SPEAKER_09]: that's what makes you special it's what makes you a witch i'm not like you yeah where have i heard

[01:12:48] [SPEAKER_03]: that before i that's one of my favorite agatha quotes um in the enigma of agatha of her playing a

[01:13:02] [SPEAKER_03]: villain of her playing a mother of her playing a friend and her playing a mentor i thoroughly love

[01:13:11] [SPEAKER_03]: watching her as we sort of head towards her crescendo because of all the questions that we have left

[01:13:18] [SPEAKER_03]: the biggest questions i think remain with her what happened to her son what's what happened to her that

[01:13:25] [SPEAKER_03]: first time down the road and what is she really trying to get is she trying to get power because she

[01:13:31] [SPEAKER_03]: wants more power is she trying to save her son or is she trying wouldn't it be something if she was

[01:13:38] [SPEAKER_03]: trying to if she was trying if perhaps this road was more salvation connected to wandavision than we

[01:13:49] [SPEAKER_07]: know especially now i don't know all's i can tell redemption i also was wondering so when when we saw

[01:13:57] [SPEAKER_07]: billy's like research about the road it said the road will provide or will give you what's missing

[01:14:04] [SPEAKER_07]: and they talk a lot about what each of them wants from the road but i don't know for sure that the

[01:14:10] [SPEAKER_07]: road gives you what you want but rather what the road thinks you are missing right like who decides what

[01:14:17] [SPEAKER_07]: that thing is does it have to do with the person's intentions like or is the road gonna give

[01:14:23] [SPEAKER_07]: and is there a trick to it like a monkey's paw trick where you get what you wanted but it had

[01:14:28] [SPEAKER_07]: a horrible cost like wanda losing her son was that what she got from the road last time or is there

[01:14:34] [SPEAKER_07]: you know just the road say like oh you're not missing you know x you're missing y like this is

[01:14:41] [SPEAKER_07]: other thing that you need like billy wants to find his brother but is that what the road is going to give

[01:14:46] [SPEAKER_03]: him if he gets to the end there's no guarantee oh boy you've cracked open something that people have

[01:14:53] [SPEAKER_03]: been talking about this whole series yeah because maybe also i've been thinking a lot about about

[01:14:59] [SPEAKER_07]: the wizard of oz and and i've been thinking about this a lot lately in general there's the whole part

[01:15:04] [SPEAKER_07]: of the wizard of oz where you know the scarecrow wants a brain and the tin man wants a heart and

[01:15:11] [SPEAKER_07]: um the lion wants courage and instead of giving them those things the wizard gives them he gives

[01:15:18] [SPEAKER_07]: the scarecrow a diploma right it's like this is how you know you're smart because you have a diploma

[01:15:23] [SPEAKER_07]: that shows it and i think there are people who really do believe there's no difference between

[01:15:29] [SPEAKER_07]: intelligence and a certification of it of it you know like so they're willing to like

[01:15:36] [SPEAKER_07]: get a facsimile of the thing they want and that they don't really understand there's

[01:15:40] [SPEAKER_07]: a difference between those two things so is the road going to really give them what they're looking

[01:15:47] [SPEAKER_07]: for or is it going to give them some kind of superficial like you know a medal that says

[01:15:53] [SPEAKER_07]: you're courageous instead of feeling courageous i mean the point in the movie at least version of

[01:15:59] [SPEAKER_07]: wizard of oz is that those people that the tin man the scarecrow the lion had those things all along

[01:16:04] [SPEAKER_07]: they just didn't they didn't believe in themselves until they went through this adventure right so like

[01:16:08] [SPEAKER_07]: the scarecrow's not stupid he just thinks he is and so the diploma is to make him feel confident but

[01:16:15] [SPEAKER_07]: i think there are a lot of people who really do believe like if you get the diploma you don't need

[01:16:19] [SPEAKER_07]: the intelligence and if you get the medal you don't need to have been brave because you have a medal and

[01:16:25] [SPEAKER_07]: that's the thing you wanted that's the result so i don't know what the road there's so many

[01:16:29] [SPEAKER_07]: wizard of oz references like is the road going to give them what they want or is it going to give them

[01:16:37] [SPEAKER_07]: what it thinks they need or is it going to give them some shallow facsimile of what they think

[01:16:43] [SPEAKER_03]: they want oh boy now you've bent my mind you've hurt my mind yeah i messed with your head yeah i i

[01:16:52] [SPEAKER_03]: was so zeroed in on just the simple the simpleness of him looking for his brother

[01:16:58] [SPEAKER_03]: but this is such a complex story of all these characters looking for something and what are

[01:17:03] [SPEAKER_03]: they going to get at the end of it and is it going to be satisfying to them or unsatisfying to them

[01:17:13] [SPEAKER_03]: um and how is that going to portray itself and who is the wizard in this case

[01:17:22] [SPEAKER_03]: um which i i don't really have good answers to other than the obvious but

[01:17:29] [SPEAKER_03]: i boy i don't i i think that this show has done a really nice job of satisfying us

[01:17:39] [SPEAKER_03]: as viewers which leads me to believe that the end will be satisfying but that doesn't help me answer

[01:17:48] [SPEAKER_03]: your question of which one of those that we're going to get because i don't really know what i want this

[01:17:55] [SPEAKER_03]: end to be i i just want these i want these i want these characters to make it because i don't want

[01:18:03] [SPEAKER_03]: that part to end so maybe that will be the unsatisfying part but i do feel like some of these

[01:18:09] [SPEAKER_03]: characters can finish their time in the mcu and still be satisfying and maybe get what they want but

[01:18:18] [SPEAKER_03]: it's not what they expect because if wanda thinks she wants power but ends up being united with her son

[01:18:28] [SPEAKER_03]: and if that means you mean agatha agatha yes yes yes if agatha um wants power but ultimately is reunited

[01:18:37] [SPEAKER_03]: with her son and the only way that she can reunite with her son perhaps is death i don't know i mean

[01:18:44] [SPEAKER_03]: yeah i don't know there's i think that there's lots of ways to to to to do all of the things that

[01:18:50] [SPEAKER_03]: you said because all of these characters have so many so many unanswered questions we don't really know

[01:18:58] [SPEAKER_03]: why many of them are walking down this path still um and it seems like some have maybe like it's i really

[01:19:05] [SPEAKER_03]: was feeling like jen and alice had found what they needed and maybe that's why alice died maybe that's

[01:19:13] [SPEAKER_03]: potentially why jen died i don't know there's i don't know like now my head is spinning penny thanks

[01:19:20] [SPEAKER_07]: i don't think that lilia and jen are dead and also remember rio is not dead yes so we don't know

[01:19:27] [SPEAKER_07]: what rio is up to right now we haven't seen her this you know since last week since alice in the cabin

[01:19:32] [SPEAKER_07]: still yeah um i i if if agatha pulled herself out of the muck jen and lilia probably can pull themselves

[01:19:41] [SPEAKER_07]: out of the muck i i i don't think that that was a death sentence um but he thinks he killed them yeah

[01:19:50] [SPEAKER_07]: and agatha was teasing him about it yes i don't know if she necessarily thinks they're dead either

[01:19:56] [SPEAKER_07]: right she's just messing with him because that's what she does she messes with people she pokes at

[01:20:02] [SPEAKER_07]: them she makes them angry so they blast her with their magic and then she can steal it it that's her mo

[01:20:08] [SPEAKER_07]: right and she makes people uncomfortable she performs as this like who they expect to see

[01:20:14] [SPEAKER_07]: this like mean cackling agatha witch but i don't know how much of that is real how much of that is

[01:20:21] [SPEAKER_07]: is a conscience conscious performance or how much of it is habit that she's been doing this for years

[01:20:29] [SPEAKER_07]: and it's a mask she doesn't know how to take off there's a lot of complexity to who she is

[01:20:36] [SPEAKER_07]: and who she is with different people and who she is with teen right now is a little like snarky

[01:20:42] [SPEAKER_07]: right yeah like oh you think you don't need me anymore you need to throw a temper tantrum to use

[01:20:48] [SPEAKER_07]: your power like whatever and then she just saunters off down the road ahead of him like

[01:20:53] [SPEAKER_07]: she doesn't have a care in the world i mean she's the only person i've ever seen who can look

[01:20:59] [SPEAKER_07]: that like carefree covered in mud yes like she just is like this is who i am i'm in mud it's fine

[01:21:10] [SPEAKER_03]: she is portraying a lot too like she definitely has anger for billy that probably stems back to wanda

[01:21:21] [SPEAKER_03]: she has a mentory feel towards him because obviously when she was when they were in westview

[01:21:29] [SPEAKER_03]: she did get to spend you know some babysitting time with them that we have already talked about had value

[01:21:36] [SPEAKER_07]: uh she yeah so she she's portraying that also i think that the history of witchcraft is one of

[01:21:45] [SPEAKER_07]: masters and apprentices yes so it's just a natural role for her to see herself in like this is a new

[01:21:51] [SPEAKER_07]: magic user i could teach him slash control him yeah and his power could become my power like that's

[01:21:58] [SPEAKER_07]: that's a you know story as old as time sure well and i guess maybe her way around

[01:22:06] [SPEAKER_03]: um wanda not getting wanda's power i mean maybe this is her workaround for it now she can mentor

[01:22:12] [SPEAKER_03]: him until she can figure it figure it out i love her inquisitiveness um she is one of the most curious

[01:22:19] [SPEAKER_03]: people that the mcu has ever had we got to see that in wandavision where she literally could have

[01:22:24] [SPEAKER_03]: just taken wanda's power and instead we get a whole entire episode of her trying to find out

[01:22:31] [SPEAKER_03]: out of true curiosity where she got that power from and now she has her her son who is now just

[01:22:40] [SPEAKER_03]: discovering the power so now she can walk no pun intended she can kind of walk that road with him

[01:22:45] [SPEAKER_03]: and then take it which is kind of all of that you know all balled up in one and what's funny about

[01:22:53] [SPEAKER_03]: this too is there is um a quality to the taking of that power that isn't evil and and again we talked

[01:23:03] [SPEAKER_03]: about this before like she does see it as this is what needs to happen because he can't control it

[01:23:10] [SPEAKER_03]: all's i need to do is learn how he got it so then i can have it and make sure it doesn't happen again

[01:23:15] [SPEAKER_03]: like there's a true earnestness to that which is weird and i can't believe that i'm agreeing with it

[01:23:20] [SPEAKER_03]: but um she's if she is the big bad and i i do think she is in a lot of ways but again we have a twist

[01:23:27] [SPEAKER_03]: coming i'm sure but um she's portraying it in a really neat way and i love it so much and i i again

[01:23:35] [SPEAKER_03]: when i say the big bad i'm i i think this show is too complicated to have one hero and and one

[01:23:42] [SPEAKER_03]: protagonist and one antagonist i think you know we've been talking about this all along that this

[01:23:47] [SPEAKER_03]: is more complex than that so different episodes have different stories to tell with different

[01:23:53] [SPEAKER_03]: protagonists and antagonists and we're finding out a lot of that is internal much like the wizard of oz

[01:23:59] [SPEAKER_03]: as you mentioned so um but yeah her her brief role in this was so fantastic i have a couple of things

[01:24:07] [SPEAKER_07]: we haven't talked about yet i just want to throw out there uh first of all everything that happened

[01:24:12] [SPEAKER_07]: with ralph boner in that parking garage was hilarious i love it i love that people on the

[01:24:19] [SPEAKER_07]: internet have been like whatever happened to ralph and we got the answer so yes his best line was

[01:24:25] [SPEAKER_07]: you seriously do not know what kind of crazy that lady eats for breakfast and i was like i'm gonna

[01:24:32] [SPEAKER_07]: put that on a t-shirt that is hilarious i thought that was so great i loved his witch repellent spray

[01:24:38] [SPEAKER_07]: i loved his like little bone cross sewn into his hat and the like whatever that rattly dead animal

[01:24:44] [SPEAKER_07]: thing all of that was so funny he was so terrified but then he's also like you gotta come to my show

[01:24:50] [SPEAKER_07]: like oh my god he's still acting hey so there's that yeah there's that the boyfriend texts uh billy

[01:25:01] [SPEAKER_07]: you're my heart and he uses a black heart emoji so this is the third reference to a black heart we've

[01:25:08] [SPEAKER_07]: had on the show right first there was when rio said i have a heart it's black and it beats for you

[01:25:13] [SPEAKER_07]: the other one was when um lilia drew a little black heart instead of using rio's name on her list

[01:25:19] [SPEAKER_07]: and then now a black heart there is a marvel character named black heart and it is related

[01:25:25] [SPEAKER_07]: to mephisto it's mephisto's son so i i don't know where they're going because it's been like is it rio

[01:25:32] [SPEAKER_07]: is it billy like who is the black heart but black heart is out there um just it's it's just a

[01:25:42] [SPEAKER_07]: it's they keep bringing it up it means something um i love that agatha said that he has the same tell

[01:25:50] [SPEAKER_07]: as his mother and he goes which is and she says very inconvenient for you um just great dialogue

[01:25:59] [SPEAKER_07]: really funny and also i don't know what the tell is and i'm gonna have to go back and watch wandavision

[01:26:04] [SPEAKER_07]: now and try to figure out what the tell is um because i'm sure that there is something that he did

[01:26:10] [SPEAKER_07]: that is specific that we could um we could you know relate he definitely moves her line he definitely

[01:26:17] [SPEAKER_03]: moves his magic the way that wanda does and now we have a new story about that yeah well knowing this

[01:26:27] [SPEAKER_03]: well i haven't read that yet but knowing the story that we do um it does sort of feel like um

[01:26:37] [SPEAKER_03]: it does sort of feel like that that's a natural occurrence i mean obviously he never this version

[01:26:43] [SPEAKER_03]: of billy has never met his mother um or maybe vaguely remembers her but um so i i i am intrigued

[01:26:52] [SPEAKER_03]: by that so the tell has to be kind of interwrapped into that somehow i guess yeah and i loved her line

[01:26:59] [SPEAKER_07]: gosh you really are a maximoff otherwise none of this would be nearly as dramatic it's just like

[01:27:05] [SPEAKER_07]: it's i don't know how do you come back to that that's like such a a line that kills any kind of

[01:27:11] [SPEAKER_03]: rebuttal you'd be like but uh yeah well but we're we're left we're we're left here thinking though

[01:27:19] [SPEAKER_03]: boy you want to talk about again no pun intended the pot calling the kettle black like you want to talk

[01:27:25] [SPEAKER_03]: about someone who we this is a woman who created her own theme song in the yeah so she's she's just

[01:27:35] [SPEAKER_03]: as dramatic as the maximoffs but i guess it takes one to know one yeah exactly and also she likes to

[01:27:41] [SPEAKER_07]: be the center right for sure like for sure it's the agatha show it's not the wiccan show um there so

[01:27:50] [SPEAKER_07]: there's probably a part of her that's like stop stealing my thunder kid you know uh i have a whole

[01:27:57] [SPEAKER_07]: bunch of other observations from my rewatch but i think uh i think i'll bring those to next time

[01:28:04] [SPEAKER_03]: yeah well listen my two points were and this is where you know you we this is our i don't know

[01:28:11] [SPEAKER_03]: probably our 10th total podcast together my two points were i loved ralph boner making a

[01:28:16] [SPEAKER_03]: reintroduction it did occur to me yeah that maybe she can hear or maybe he can hear him

[01:28:23] [SPEAKER_03]: because in another universe they're related i thought they were at least yeah yeah i mean they did bond

[01:28:31] [SPEAKER_03]: during that time well i mean i'm thinking like you know he was you know in in another universe he was

[01:28:40] [SPEAKER_03]: wanda's brother so maybe maybe they're just kind of playing off of that a little bit um but i i just

[01:28:50] [SPEAKER_03]: loved ralph's ralph's characters for all the reasons you mentioned and then my other note was the black

[01:28:54] [SPEAKER_03]: heart and and i actually was gonna i tied it to something a little different though i i um since

[01:29:00] [SPEAKER_03]: lilia was the first person that we see and she's the one who puts um the spell on him early on uh

[01:29:09] [SPEAKER_03]: i connected it right to that the she had written down several names um in the second episode and

[01:29:16] [SPEAKER_03]: the last one was black heart and here i think we were assuming that through this whole time that it

[01:29:21] [SPEAKER_03]: was rio it turns out it might not have been rio at all it might have made it might have been him so

[01:29:26] [SPEAKER_03]: the fun play with that is that would make rio the person who's not supposed to be there

[01:29:34] [SPEAKER_03]: as opposed to the teen which i think either one it's kind of a fun little teeter-totter to think

[01:29:41] [SPEAKER_03]: about if it's rio who's not supposed to be there that brings its own little bags with it

[01:29:46] [SPEAKER_03]: if it's the teen who's not supposed to be there that brings some other stuff along with it uh and

[01:29:52] [SPEAKER_03]: of course it might not be either one uh but uh i do like the interplay with that again just good

[01:29:57] [SPEAKER_03]: writing where um you can have all of these open questions and um it really tells an amazing story so

[01:30:04] [SPEAKER_03]: so those are my two points and and again uh as as i keep saying from episode to episode this was

[01:30:10] [SPEAKER_03]: my favorite episode so far and i don't know if it was because it was better or because

[01:30:18] [SPEAKER_03]: in really neat ways each episode leads into another and this one again brilliantly done

[01:30:24] [SPEAKER_03]: uh and i have no iota of a clue where we're going next other than down a yellow leaf road in this case

[01:30:31] [SPEAKER_03]: um which hopefully brings back some of our other characters so yeah i i uh uh again just another

[01:30:38] [SPEAKER_03]: beautifully told story and and i don't know what kind of reviews or ratings that this show is getting

[01:30:45] [SPEAKER_03]: but my goodness is the storytelling amazing and with three episodes left with lots of answers

[01:30:51] [SPEAKER_03]: with lots of questions still out there so much fun to be had in the next three episodes and i'm so happy

[01:30:56] [SPEAKER_03]: that it wasn't just 30 minutes i was so scared um everybody in our crew had finished it so fast i was

[01:31:03] [SPEAKER_03]: like oh no it's 30 minutes again but you guys just watched it quickly yeah we just we just got got down

[01:31:09] [SPEAKER_07]: to business right away all right we're gonna take a little break and we'll be back with some

[01:31:18] [SPEAKER_07]: news and listener feedback and we're back and it's time for just a little bit of news jim

[01:31:29] [SPEAKER_03]: all right so the first bit of news that we have is really interconnected with what we were just talking

[01:31:34] [SPEAKER_03]: about um joe lock who portrays wiccan billy william teen goodness gracious uh he uh the article is from

[01:31:45] [SPEAKER_03]: variety and the title of the article is lockby became wiccan and agatha all along by using elizabeth

[01:31:51] [SPEAKER_03]: olsen's scarlet witch movement coach the way they use their magic is similar and you know if you were

[01:31:58] [SPEAKER_03]: watching you can see a lot of wanda in the way that billy moves before he uses power and the article

[01:32:06] [SPEAKER_03]: goes on to say given that billy is wanda's son and they share similar superpowers it was important

[01:32:11] [SPEAKER_03]: for lock to study olsen's movements as the scarlet witch the key to achieving that goal was working

[01:32:16] [SPEAKER_03]: with jennifer white olsen's movement coach who helped develop the hand gestures for scarlet

[01:32:21] [SPEAKER_03]: which is abilities uh quote we worked to find similarities in both billy and wanda the way

[01:32:27] [SPEAKER_03]: they use their magic unquote loke told entertainment weekly um fans of the comic corner know that billy's

[01:32:32] [SPEAKER_03]: powers are pretty much the same as wanda's with a few differences so we wanted to find similarities

[01:32:37] [SPEAKER_03]: with that but also his own finesse and they're they're very similar um they do have some slight

[01:32:45] [SPEAKER_03]: differences between the two but i a love the fact that they're movement coaches for this again it's

[01:32:51] [SPEAKER_03]: something i think you overlook you know it's obvious like if you're gonna lightsaber duel you

[01:32:55] [SPEAKER_03]: have to learn how to do it but the subtle movements of of using these powers the fact that they they have

[01:33:02] [SPEAKER_03]: a movement coach and use the same one is again paying a really great attention to the detail and

[01:33:08] [SPEAKER_03]: of course jack schaefer probably had a lot of insight into that being that she was

[01:33:11] [SPEAKER_03]: so integral to both shows so yeah i i if you go back and watch wanda vision to anybody who's

[01:33:16] [SPEAKER_03]: listening and i highly recommend it especially those last few episodes um watching wanda using

[01:33:23] [SPEAKER_03]: her power and then cutting to episode five where billy first uses his power it's it's really kind of

[01:33:30] [SPEAKER_03]: amazing how similar they are with a little bit of difference but um i i love it when they tie it

[01:33:36] [SPEAKER_03]: together and they're paying attention to that kind of detail me too our second article comes from out

[01:33:43] [SPEAKER_07]: magazine and it says uh it's titled smile twos miles gutierrez riley talks playing joe locks agatha

[01:33:50] [SPEAKER_07]: all along love interest and queering the mcu and uh you know excerpts as usual alts raffi ermac got

[01:33:59] [SPEAKER_07]: to chat with smile two star miles gutierrez riley about playing joe locks love interest in disney pluses

[01:34:05] [SPEAKER_07]: agatha all along and bringing more queer representation to the mcu with the debut of

[01:34:11] [SPEAKER_07]: agatha all along the marvel world is gayer than ever before and gutierrez riley is contributing to

[01:34:17] [SPEAKER_07]: the new era in marvel alongside lock miles gutierrez riley had nothing but praise for lock calling him

[01:34:23] [SPEAKER_07]: the industry's new it boy adding people love heart stopper it was amazing to work alongside him he's so

[01:34:30] [SPEAKER_07]: young and so wise he really has a great head on his shoulders i learned so much working with him

[01:34:35] [SPEAKER_07]: he made me laugh all the time on being part of the new era in marvel gutierrez riley said it means the

[01:34:42] [SPEAKER_07]: world the mcu is massive and it touches so many people because it's personal and the fact that

[01:34:47] [SPEAKER_07]: representation is authentic and coming from creators that actually care about the stories they're telling

[01:34:52] [SPEAKER_07]: and can relate to them it means the world and i haven't taken it for granted from the second i got

[01:34:57] [SPEAKER_07]: the call i'm really honored to be a part of it in this way with both gutierrez riley and lock leading

[01:35:05] [SPEAKER_07]: the way it's clear the mcu is headed for a very gay future and all we can say is it's about damn time

[01:35:14] [SPEAKER_07]: i really enjoyed that article i just thought it was so cute um that they're an adorable couple and

[01:35:22] [SPEAKER_07]: and um i just i don't know i'm really enjoying just out representation and not just having to wait for

[01:35:31] [SPEAKER_07]: something to be queer coded or to read gayness into a relationship that doesn't have it there or

[01:35:37] [SPEAKER_03]: whatever it's just it's really refreshing yes and and just doing it doing it in a way that

[01:35:50] [SPEAKER_03]: the story that they're telling um it's a story about you know loving each other between these two

[01:35:57] [SPEAKER_03]: it's not a story about anything more than that uh you go back to the parents i love that the parents

[01:36:02] [SPEAKER_03]: there was that wasn't that wasn't even the story was you know where's that you know it wasn't yeah

[01:36:11] [SPEAKER_03]: why isn't eddie yeah yeah it just there wasn't anything more to it than that and i just love

[01:36:16] [SPEAKER_03]: and that's really how the show has handled all of the relationships and um how everybody thinks

[01:36:22] [SPEAKER_03]: everybody else is attractive and it's just kind of part of the intermix of the show just the way

[01:36:27] [SPEAKER_03]: it's a part of life i also um i can't fathom that these characters are going anywhere and again i'm

[01:36:35] [SPEAKER_03]: not going to spoil anything for anybody because i don't know what the future holds for

[01:36:38] [SPEAKER_03]: for eddie let alone for um billy but you know if if you even dip your nose into the comic book lore

[01:36:48] [SPEAKER_03]: of billy uh and you find out um his anything about his relationships there obviously is

[01:36:55] [SPEAKER_03]: um some interconnectivity with with some characters that could be a part of the mcu in the future so

[01:37:03] [SPEAKER_03]: um if you're so interested you know take it take a deep look into that and i do think um his his his

[01:37:10] [SPEAKER_03]: acting in this episode and i don't know i don't know miles gutierrez riley at all from from any other

[01:37:19] [SPEAKER_03]: shows um although now i'll have to watch smile too although that will scare me and i don't want to

[01:37:24] [SPEAKER_03]: be scared but um i i uh um i was very impressed with i think it's hard it's hard to do what he did in

[01:37:34] [SPEAKER_03]: this episode act like you've been together for a while um show like growing love i think that's

[01:37:41] [SPEAKER_03]: hard for any actor to do and uh both joe lock and and gutierrez riley did such an amazing job of of of

[01:37:50] [SPEAKER_03]: um giving weight to to that early teenage romance that that made it feel real in such a short amount

[01:37:57] [SPEAKER_03]: of time so so i hope that he's an actor that we get to see again yeah i think he's he's been great um

[01:38:06] [SPEAKER_07]: i saw one article that was about some of the sort of homophobic stuff that happened when joe lock was

[01:38:13] [SPEAKER_07]: first announced and at the beginning of the series and there were there were people you know there always

[01:38:20] [SPEAKER_07]: are some people who are like why do they have to make the character gay it's like clearly you didn't read the comic books

[01:38:26] [SPEAKER_07]: he's very much a gay character in the comics there's no question about it and there are there are just

[01:38:34] [SPEAKER_07]: some people who want to be upset about representation and they they don't care that they're not making a

[01:38:41] [SPEAKER_07]: logical argument like they're just mad about it and i like to think that those people are diminishing

[01:38:52] [SPEAKER_07]: and there's fewer and fewer of them all the time and that the ones that are left are just really loud

[01:38:57] [SPEAKER_07]: and that's why it seems like it hasn't changed because obviously i'm pro representation yeah that's

[01:39:07] [SPEAKER_03]: enough to say about that well i do i let me just yeah i before we move on i just want to say and i don't

[01:39:12] [SPEAKER_03]: know i don't think just you know anybody who you know just looks out the window or through a tv set you

[01:39:22] [SPEAKER_03]: know i think that thinking that the landscape for lgbtq plus is is getting better i think there's part of

[01:39:34] [SPEAKER_03]: me that thinks that there is definitely movements that are growing to just make life acceptable but i

[01:39:42] [SPEAKER_03]: also feel like the opposing force to that is also growing and i don't know whether it's just noise

[01:39:49] [SPEAKER_03]: level or people level but i will say the one thing that i cannot quite comprehend about the show is how

[01:39:58] [SPEAKER_03]: for the most part up to this point with as many viewers as it's been getting how it has avoided

[01:40:05] [SPEAKER_03]: kind of a continuation of that initial volley after lock was cast because there just isn't a whole lot

[01:40:12] [SPEAKER_03]: of it and whatever the reason is i'm for it let's keep that ball rolling and um hopefully as we head

[01:40:20] [SPEAKER_03]: down this new version of the mcu hopefully that that noise will start to diminish more and more

[01:40:28] [SPEAKER_03]: now let's get away from it as far as as far as possible but i just it's it's so good to see a show

[01:40:33] [SPEAKER_03]: that can address it and it's good to see that the public is accepting it and maybe we just got rid of

[01:40:38] [SPEAKER_07]: all the people that like to whine and moan yeah go whine and moan to yourself we don't want to hear

[01:40:46] [SPEAKER_07]: all right let's talk witchy question of the week uh we got one response from a listener

[01:40:54] [SPEAKER_07]: slash guest host kara who says i still have to get my thoughts together for official feedback

[01:41:00] [SPEAKER_07]: which she did not send in but here is my dream coven one and i knew this was going to be on her list

[01:41:08] [SPEAKER_07]: taylor swift she put taylor swift in divination and said that woman is also the queen of manifestation

[01:41:14] [SPEAKER_07]: and i cannot argue with that hermione granger potions i love that she's mixing real people

[01:41:21] [SPEAKER_07]: with fictional people three buffy summers protection i mean it's buffy snoop dog in the green witch

[01:41:29] [SPEAKER_07]: category alternate martha stewart and stevie nix as the spirit witch i love that it's a great it's a

[01:41:41] [SPEAKER_07]: great lineup kara you left yourself out of the lineup though so oh what kind of witch are you

[01:41:46] [SPEAKER_03]: oh dear okay yeah um do you have yours jim i do but now i have to figure out where i'm going to

[01:41:54] [SPEAKER_03]: supplant somebody so all right let me go through it okay all right so i'm going to give you what i

[01:42:00] [SPEAKER_03]: have right now and i'm going to try to figure out which one of these people i'm going to kick out of

[01:42:05] [SPEAKER_03]: this group which is going to be very difficult so i decided to i was very much moved by atlas's

[01:42:12] [SPEAKER_03]: episode and i love the idea of the band concept so i went all musical on this one so here we go

[01:42:19] [SPEAKER_03]: my divination um which was robert plant um i have always thought that robert plant was a witch

[01:42:29] [SPEAKER_03]: if you ever pay attention to led zeppelin and the runes and the um the mystical side of their band

[01:42:35] [SPEAKER_03]: and i think robert plant was at the center of that uh my potions um this this this man has made me feel

[01:42:43] [SPEAKER_03]: better since i was a youngster with his guitar playing and that's edward van halen

[01:42:48] [SPEAKER_03]: um i found his music when i was uh less than 10 and if i told you how many times his guitar playing

[01:42:54] [SPEAKER_03]: has made me feel better um that's certainly i couldn't count that in hundreds or maybe even

[01:43:00] [SPEAKER_03]: thousands my protection witch um would be freddie mercury uh freddie mercury has

[01:43:06] [SPEAKER_03]: um a voice that could stop a stampede it's so beautiful um he would without a doubt be the

[01:43:13] [SPEAKER_03]: protection witch my green witch this would be the one that i would take the place of

[01:43:18] [SPEAKER_03]: um would be michael stipe uh lead singer of rem back in the day and he was one of the first people

[01:43:25] [SPEAKER_03]: um to and this was gosh maybe 30 years ago and he was talking about his house in georgia about how

[01:43:32] [SPEAKER_03]: green his house was and how earthly that he wanted it to be um to the point where he

[01:43:38] [SPEAKER_03]: um doesn't have paper in his entire house like everything in his house is something that he can reuse

[01:43:45] [SPEAKER_03]: um and and i just i remember being struck by someone with that much money um doing things the

[01:43:53] [SPEAKER_03]: right way um that's the person that i would take the place of because i would aspire to do that

[01:43:57] [SPEAKER_03]: and then my spirit witch um this is somebody who passed away within the past five years

[01:44:03] [SPEAKER_03]: um who uh i think probably with all of his talent and abilities could conjure plus his favorite color

[01:44:10] [SPEAKER_03]: was purple and that's where i started with this uh and and my spirit which would be prince

[01:44:15] [SPEAKER_03]: um i mean come on purple rain i mean come on i mean agatha let's go yeah so that would be mine

[01:44:20] [SPEAKER_03]: my musical version of this and uh i have a feeling that i'm going to come up with several versions of

[01:44:26] [SPEAKER_03]: this because that was a lot of fun all right penny but now it's your turn it's a fun question

[01:44:30] [SPEAKER_07]: yeah for sure all right so thinking i was so clever and original in the potions which position

[01:44:37] [SPEAKER_07]: i put martha stewart and then when i saw kara's comments i was like oh man i mean come on penny

[01:44:44] [SPEAKER_07]: like i guess i was gonna say like come on um and i specifically said martha stewart with snoop

[01:44:51] [SPEAKER_07]: dog as her familiar are you kidding right because those two come together yes they do come together

[01:44:56] [SPEAKER_07]: quite well that's awesome yeah um my green witch greta tunberg oh yeah the climate activist

[01:45:04] [SPEAKER_07]: i i think that girl has magical powers yes i believe in her uh protection witch alexandria

[01:45:11] [SPEAKER_03]: ocasia cortez because she's fierce for sure she is fierce and extremely smart she knows how to play

[01:45:20] [SPEAKER_07]: the game i like it yeah i love her uh spirit which that's where i put myself i think i'm a pretty

[01:45:28] [SPEAKER_07]: communicator and uh people in the past have thought i was psychic so i'll take it and for divination i

[01:45:36] [SPEAKER_07]: really struggled with this one and i eventually decided on maya angelou because while she may not

[01:45:43] [SPEAKER_07]: have visions she's definitely a visionary yes yes but i had also in the running

[01:45:54] [SPEAKER_07]: vanita gupta who is um a civil rights attorney who i admire katherine hahn aubrey plaza meryl streep

[01:46:02] [SPEAKER_07]: uh maya angelou okay wanda sykes megan rapino you know the soccer player yes uh jane fonda

[01:46:10] [SPEAKER_07]: frida Kahlo and michelle obama mostly because i just want to be friends with michelle obama oh man

[01:46:19] [SPEAKER_03]: i just want to hang out here's what we need to do we need to we need to figure out a way to go and

[01:46:23] [SPEAKER_03]: have drinks with michelle and barack obama that would be i would be so satisfied with my year at

[01:46:30] [SPEAKER_07]: that point like that would be i would be satisfied with like the decade yes i would be so excited

[01:46:35] [SPEAKER_03]: it'd probably be yeah you could probably convince me that my life would be not i mean i'd still have

[01:46:39] [SPEAKER_07]: plenty to live for but i'd be okay with that yeah that i mean that's like the bucket list uh

[01:46:46] [SPEAKER_07]: celebrities to meet i would love to meet them um i also suspect that once there's no cameras on them

[01:46:53] [SPEAKER_07]: they're hilarious because they're pretty funny when they're being politic and diplomatic

[01:46:57] [SPEAKER_07]: with cameras off i think they must be some of the funniest people on earth

[01:47:03] [SPEAKER_03]: i uh just watching them interact with each other um just in those brief moments of how they honor each

[01:47:13] [SPEAKER_03]: other the way that i think any good any good friends would honor each other whether the cameras are on

[01:47:21] [SPEAKER_03]: them or off of them i i have laughed so much at that power that they have it's funny when you talk about

[01:47:30] [SPEAKER_03]: couples and you talk about politicians specifically in their marriages and morality and

[01:47:36] [SPEAKER_03]: those two i don't know that i've ever seen two closer people in my life that not only

[01:47:42] [SPEAKER_03]: love each other but also honor each other's strength and power and like each other too

[01:47:48] [SPEAKER_03]: independent yeah well and and they don't see the other one just as part of a couple they see that

[01:47:56] [SPEAKER_03]: of course they see them as a family unit but they also understand their singular power as well and

[01:48:02] [SPEAKER_03]: i think that's rare um in any relationship so admirable yes yeah so our next witchy question of the week

[01:48:13] [SPEAKER_07]: is what is missing for you or from your life that you hope you would find if you made it to the end of

[01:48:20] [SPEAKER_07]: the road oh boy now i have a feeling it's going to sponsor some deep thoughts and if you don't want to

[01:48:33] [SPEAKER_07]: share the real answer with us feel free to send in a joke answer but i do challenge people to think about

[01:48:39] [SPEAKER_07]: what they actually would try to find it on the road because i think it's an interesting question for yourself

[01:48:46] [SPEAKER_03]: i don't know about you but immediately

[01:48:50] [SPEAKER_03]: people pop into my head and once i go through those names then all of a sudden the other things start

[01:48:58] [SPEAKER_03]: growing into my head this could be an interesting conversation i think i'm going to come up with a

[01:49:03] [SPEAKER_03]: funny one too just for the heck of it because who knows where this conversation is going to go next

[01:49:08] [SPEAKER_07]: week yeah could get it could get pretty heavy yeah with that said let's move on to listener feedback

[01:49:15] [SPEAKER_07]: and um jim why don't you read that first one from all right the first one comes from

[01:49:21] [SPEAKER_03]: pake pake allen who by the way has a fantastic podcast but we can get to that later uh pake allen

[01:49:27] [SPEAKER_03]: said uh that episode was incredible i was already super attached to the character of billy with a

[01:49:32] [SPEAKER_03]: personal connection to the young actor who played him before but joe lock has blown me away with his

[01:49:37] [SPEAKER_03]: portrayal of the character now what a backstory episode full of reveals billy lives all right

[01:49:44] [SPEAKER_03]: p william caplan we literally hardly knew ye and the whole ordeal ended up being a journey to find

[01:49:50] [SPEAKER_03]: his brother i legitimately teared up and i need that reunion also billy and his boy were ridiculously

[01:49:57] [SPEAKER_03]: adorable together and the actual banter and dialogue during the interrogation seems

[01:50:02] [SPEAKER_03]: comedy gold boy do i agree with that pig the episode has fully solidified this show is one of

[01:50:08] [SPEAKER_03]: if not my favorite of the year bravo oh pay high praise how i yeah i mean i definitely agree with

[01:50:18] [SPEAKER_07]: you though i mean i'm loving it so much but it might as well have been written like let's write a show that

[01:50:24] [SPEAKER_07]: penny will like you know what i mean like i the fact that other people are liking it as much as i do is

[01:50:30] [SPEAKER_03]: is like this pleasant surprise i'm like really it's so it's funny because getting to know you

[01:50:37] [SPEAKER_03]: just guesting on buffy this literally could be a show like if if all of the guest hosts got together

[01:50:46] [SPEAKER_03]: and wanted to surprise you with a show i'm pretty sure this would be the show

[01:50:51] [SPEAKER_07]: it really is it's like relevant to like all my interests i i love it on so many levels

[01:50:57] [SPEAKER_07]: uh we also heard from danielle and she said first i had to share this screenshot of my facebook feed lol

[01:51:04] [SPEAKER_07]: and the top half of the screenshot is a picture of billy from like the shoulders up and the bottom

[01:51:11] [SPEAKER_07]: half is a petco ad about somebody scooping kitty litter that's like hands and waist and then like

[01:51:18] [SPEAKER_07]: and so it looks like it's all billy so billy is like selling kitty litter it's uh it's a very silly

[01:51:26] [SPEAKER_07]: picture um it looks so much like it goes on to say oh my gosh it really merges like seamlessly into

[01:51:34] [SPEAKER_07]: one image it's really funny oh she says i see the world through the eyes of a mother among other

[01:51:40] [SPEAKER_07]: things and feel so bad for william's parents even now i imagine they are searching for their missing

[01:51:46] [SPEAKER_07]: son i see the world through the eye oh wait i apparently i copied that twice

[01:51:54] [SPEAKER_07]: um thank you danielle that is excellent feedback and um the picture is obviously hilarious and it's

[01:52:01] [SPEAKER_07]: on facebook if you guys want to see it you could go see she posted it on the facebook feed

[01:52:06] [SPEAKER_03]: jim you want to read this email from amelia amelia hi penny and jim i listened to the podcast each

[01:52:12] [SPEAKER_03]: week and thought i'd have a go at sending in some feedback keep it coming thank you so much

[01:52:17] [SPEAKER_03]: uh really enjoyed the longer episode yeah yes yes please maybe tell a friend

[01:52:24] [SPEAKER_03]: maybe tell a friend and you know just like um just like you know how you're supposed to get someone

[01:52:29] [SPEAKER_03]: else to vote get someone else to give some feedback all right i'm sorry uh really enjoyed

[01:52:33] [SPEAKER_03]: the longer episode this week it was great to delve into the teen's past and watch from his perspective

[01:52:37] [SPEAKER_03]: when he first met agatha i really hope jen and lilia aren't dead they both deserve a better send

[01:52:43] [SPEAKER_03]: off i was really looking forward to lilia's trial and learning more about her backstory i'm hoping ria

[01:52:48] [SPEAKER_03]: did a bit of life-saving off camera whilst agatha and teen billy slash william talk things out

[01:52:54] [SPEAKER_03]: thanks for doing this podcast you both do a great job amelia oh thank you so much we love doing it

[01:53:01] [SPEAKER_07]: thank you amelia yay and like i said we love when we hear from people we haven't heard from before

[01:53:06] [SPEAKER_07]: it's just i don't know it's so exciting to know that we're reaching new voices and we're not just

[01:53:11] [SPEAKER_07]: talking to each other yeah although we like doing that too and we got one voicemail from friend of the

[01:53:18] [SPEAKER_00]: podcast greg here we go hey jim hey penny this is greg uh this is gonna be a quick little note for

[01:53:25] [SPEAKER_00]: uh agatha episode six um i really loved this backstory um like and then as you go if you went as you go

[01:53:35] [SPEAKER_00]: back and watch it again um and you know oh your lifeline's broken in two and you're like oh that's

[01:53:40] [SPEAKER_00]: unfortunate and then i don't know why lilia put the sigil on him maybe to like i mean i don't know was

[01:53:47] [SPEAKER_00]: it maybe in order like it's kind of i have no idea it's i really want to know but she's not gonna be able

[01:53:53] [SPEAKER_00]: to tell us i don't think or whatever but anyway um the the fact that uh tommy's consciousness just

[01:54:02] [SPEAKER_00]: like took over this body that they found like like agatha said like that's what makes her a witch

[01:54:08] [SPEAKER_00]: uh or makes him a witch i thought it was awesome um uh one other aspect to this is that agatha was so

[01:54:17] [SPEAKER_00]: dark at the end of this like dark dark like like wandavision dark not funny dark but katherine hahn

[01:54:25] [SPEAKER_00]: played it so straight i was amazed and like she was just flat out like this is what i am let's go take

[01:54:34] [SPEAKER_00]: care of this business right now oh man anyway i thought it was great uh talk to you guys later bye

[01:54:40] [SPEAKER_07]: awesome thanks greg you know i don't know why lilia put the sigil on him there was part of it that

[01:54:47] [SPEAKER_07]: looked like it wasn't even something she was consciously doing it seemed like she might have been

[01:54:52] [SPEAKER_07]: channeling again because she did it so fast like she was like she picked up the pen did the sigil

[01:54:59] [SPEAKER_07]: dropped it in his pocket and then immediately was like whose code is this and immediately didn't

[01:55:03] [SPEAKER_03]: know a thing about it um and i i've thought about this a lot and it could just be as simple as the

[01:55:10] [SPEAKER_03]: fact that she you know she can obviously get a sense for these things but it certainly seemed

[01:55:19] [SPEAKER_03]: almost like someone was kind of leading her through it um so so i think there's there's more at play here

[01:55:27] [SPEAKER_03]: i think how he handled the sigil throughout the episode was kind of interesting as well because

[01:55:32] [SPEAKER_03]: he didn't break the bond of the sigil until the very almost the very end of the episode we see him

[01:55:40] [SPEAKER_03]: break it in his hand um which i thought was interesting as well and and um i need to know

[01:55:48] [SPEAKER_03]: that symbol more like is that a lilia symbol are we going to get to see that symbol again when

[01:55:55] [SPEAKER_03]: we get her episode if we get an episode by her then um are we going to get to learn more about that

[01:56:01] [SPEAKER_03]: and are we going to find out that she was interconnected to all of these characters in a

[01:56:08] [SPEAKER_03]: similar fashion as teen who we find out in some serious and not so serious ways that he was interconnected

[01:56:13] [SPEAKER_03]: with all of our witches as well so i don't know i we didn't really talk a lot about the sigil but i

[01:56:19] [SPEAKER_03]: think it's just based simply on the fact that much like you greg we didn't i don't i don't know yet

[01:56:27] [SPEAKER_07]: yeah i don't have a good theory for why she did it so i think that there's more information to come

[01:56:33] [SPEAKER_07]: at least i hope there is i assume there is well that that is our show next time will be episode seven

[01:56:43] [SPEAKER_07]: we still don't know what the title will be of that episode so and i checked it's still not there yet

[01:56:50] [SPEAKER_03]: episode seven if you want to join the conversation you can email or send a voice memo to agatha

[01:56:56] [SPEAKER_03]: podcastica.com and we'll put feedback posts up on the podcast podcast feedback feedback page or you

[01:57:02] [SPEAKER_03]: can find us at podcastica.com and thanks for all the feedback this week that was awesome

[01:57:07] [SPEAKER_07]: it's so good uh while you're out there look around and check out the other podcastica shows

[01:57:13] [SPEAKER_07]: so peck who wrote in this week he has a couple of podcasts uh one is called run for your lives where

[01:57:20] [SPEAKER_07]: he and daphne talk about movies where you have to run for your life so it's disaster movies it's horror

[01:57:29] [SPEAKER_07]: movies um they cover serious silly all kinds of stuff on there uh he also does a podcast with

[01:57:37] [SPEAKER_07]: rima called strange indeed that started as a stranger things podcast but now they cover

[01:57:42] [SPEAKER_07]: all kinds of other shows that are on netflix including every mike flanagan show so if you are

[01:57:48] [SPEAKER_07]: a fan of spooky stuff and you aren't watching mike flanagan shows yet you you should start because

[01:57:54] [SPEAKER_07]: they are so good they're so good and they're also midnight mass yes haunting of hill house haunting

[01:58:01] [SPEAKER_07]: of bly manor um the fall of the house of usher and i'm forgetting one midnight club midnight club

[01:58:07] [SPEAKER_03]: yeah um and they're also again to really tie it all together with the bow they're also doing

[01:58:14] [SPEAKER_03]: the great british bake-off which they're currently doing right now so maybe they're trying to tell us

[01:58:19] [SPEAKER_03]: that there's some witchcraft in there but uh they do a great uh and that's not pake but it is greg

[01:58:23] [SPEAKER_07]: yes who you just heard so yes um yeah that's great british bake-off yeah and there's so many

[01:58:30] [SPEAKER_07]: other podcasts going on right now there's the there's the daryl dixon show and we just finished

[01:58:36] [SPEAKER_07]: rings of power and there's just a lot going on at podcastica and there's new stuff coming up soon so

[01:58:43] [SPEAKER_03]: um it's worth a visit to that website yeah check it out at podcastica.com there's so much including

[01:58:49] [SPEAKER_07]: sports podcasts but yeah i digress oh yeah i haven't started listening to that yet thanks for

[01:58:54] [SPEAKER_07]: listening and until next time i'm jim and i'm penny get with you with it wünschst du dir jemanden der

[02:00:07] [SPEAKER_05]: dich versteht wie kein anderer jemand der deine wünsche wahr werden lässt und mit dir das schönste

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