"Where is He?" (Rings of Power S2E6)

[00:00:07] [SPEAKER_08]: You yielded to him, I resist it.

[00:00:11] [SPEAKER_00]: For a while, it's no longer later he sees you, not just who you are, but who you wish to be.

[00:00:24] [SPEAKER_00]: His eye, bore the whole, and the rest of him slith us in.

[00:00:32] [SPEAKER_00]: For a while he even makes you believe that his power is becoming yours.

[00:00:40] [SPEAKER_00]: He's a resistable power that makes every desire fulfilment seem inevitable.

[00:00:47] [SPEAKER_00]: An ocean of colour, against which everything else feels forever thereafter.

[00:00:53] [SPEAKER_08]: A dough.

[00:00:55] Great.

[00:01:32] [SPEAKER_07]: Great angsty worms of the abyss, bat calling dwarfs, lizard-brathed stores and can knife an uttax welcome to our podcast, I'm N1.

[00:01:41] [SPEAKER_07]: And I'm Rima.

[00:01:43] [SPEAKER_07]: And this is the cast of the Rings episode 22.

[00:01:47] [SPEAKER_05]: This episode we're going to cover season 2 episode 6 of The Rings of Power.

[00:01:52] [SPEAKER_05]: Where is He?

[00:01:55] [SPEAKER_05]: It's so amazing to have you here, Rima.

[00:01:57] [SPEAKER_05]: Welcome back.

[00:01:57] [SPEAKER_05]: How are you?

[00:01:59] [SPEAKER_05]: Thank you for having me.

[00:02:00] [SPEAKER_05]: I'm doing very well.

[00:02:02] [SPEAKER_05]: I'm so excited to be here.

[00:02:03] [SPEAKER_05]: Thank you for asking me.

[00:02:06] [SPEAKER_07]: Fantastic.

[00:02:06] [SPEAKER_07]: And what do you think is so far of the season?

[00:02:10] [SPEAKER_05]: I'm really enjoying the season so far.

[00:02:13] [SPEAKER_05]: I really enjoyed season 1 and coming into season 2.

[00:02:16] [SPEAKER_05]: I didn't realize that they dropped all three episodes at once, that they were one of

[00:02:21] [SPEAKER_05]: the best shows that did that.

[00:02:22] [SPEAKER_05]: So I thought, oh wow, they're just giving us so much goodness at once.

[00:02:26] [SPEAKER_05]: So I dive right in and I've really been enjoying the ride.

[00:02:31] [SPEAKER_05]: I love this world so much.

[00:02:33] [SPEAKER_05]: I'm fresh off a rewatch of the trilogy.

[00:02:38] [SPEAKER_05]: So a decent version.

[00:02:40] [SPEAKER_05]: I was really excited.

[00:02:42] [SPEAKER_07]: And it's really cool.

[00:02:43] [SPEAKER_07]: I'm really looking forward to going back again to the trilogy after season 2 because there's

[00:02:47] [SPEAKER_07]: so many juicy little bits that this series is giving us a background for.

[00:02:52] [SPEAKER_07]: And then you see some moments in there and you're like, ah, it's so cool.

[00:02:55] [SPEAKER_07]: It's really amazing.

[00:02:56] [SPEAKER_07]: It's giving so much more depth to a lot of the character that we see maybe even just mentioned

[00:03:00] [SPEAKER_07]: or we see for a couple of seconds on screen in the trilogy.

[00:03:04] [SPEAKER_07]: It's really cool.

[00:03:05] [SPEAKER_07]: And this season 2, I think, you know, the pace is so much better.

[00:03:09] [SPEAKER_07]: They've really settled into their writing and it's overall, I think, just so much more satisfying.

[00:03:14] [SPEAKER_07]: And season 1 was so it's really great.

[00:03:17] [SPEAKER_07]: I'm glad you're enjoying it.

[00:03:19] [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I'm having a great time and I agree.

[00:03:20] [SPEAKER_05]: I think they're really getting, I feel like they're finding their way, you know, with the pacing

[00:03:25] [SPEAKER_05]: and the story, the writing.

[00:03:27] [SPEAKER_05]: So yeah, I'm definitely entertained.

[00:03:30] [SPEAKER_07]: Fantastic.

[00:03:31] [SPEAKER_07]: And I think that takes a while.

[00:03:32] [SPEAKER_07]: There's quite a few shows that do that.

[00:03:34] [SPEAKER_07]: You know, as many great shows where if you do go back to season 1 you go, oh, yeah.

[00:03:37] [SPEAKER_07]: That was still just kind of finding their footing.

[00:03:39] [SPEAKER_07]: And when you're talking about a world that is as rich and detail as this,

[00:03:43] [SPEAKER_07]: the fact that they were able to manage to get through season 1 with all of that world building

[00:03:47] [SPEAKER_07]: and set up as pretty amazing and then getting to where the real action starts in season 2.

[00:03:53] [SPEAKER_07]: So it's fantastic.

[00:03:54] [SPEAKER_07]: Mm-hmm.

[00:03:56] [SPEAKER_07]: Great.

[00:03:56] [SPEAKER_07]: So shall we get into it?

[00:03:58] [SPEAKER_07]: What did you want to start with today?

[00:04:01] [SPEAKER_07]: Since you're the guest?

[00:04:03] [SPEAKER_05]: Well, I think I'm going to start off today just talking a little bit about the Niminaur storyline.

[00:04:11] [SPEAKER_05]: I really love where they're going.

[00:04:14] [SPEAKER_05]: I've always enjoyed Niminaur.

[00:04:16] [SPEAKER_05]: I'm fascinated with this little piece of middle earth.

[00:04:21] [SPEAKER_05]: And I think that they've really done a great job with the location.

[00:04:26] [SPEAKER_05]: It's still just beautiful to look at again.

[00:04:27] [SPEAKER_05]: I think I talked a lot about it whenever I guessed it during season 1.

[00:04:33] [SPEAKER_05]: You know, just an amazing job that they've done with the locations and

[00:04:37] [SPEAKER_05]: bringing to life, you know, this world.

[00:04:41] [SPEAKER_05]: And Niminaur is certainly no exception.

[00:04:43] [SPEAKER_05]: It's just absolutely beautiful.

[00:04:44] [SPEAKER_05]: So and I think they're really doing a great job right now with the story line there

[00:04:48] [SPEAKER_05]: and what's currently happening.

[00:04:51] [SPEAKER_05]: I love what they're doing with Ellen Dill.

[00:04:54] [SPEAKER_05]: I think that right now we're seeing him, especially in this episode,

[00:05:00] [SPEAKER_05]: he is the really giving us that powerful hero that we're using in middle earth.

[00:05:05] [SPEAKER_05]: You know, I keep looking at him and seeing flashes of like Erdogan in that,

[00:05:12] [SPEAKER_05]: you know, that honor and his refusal to back down knowing that he's going to be executed

[00:05:19] [SPEAKER_05]: because they're like, you know, this is your choice.

[00:05:24] [SPEAKER_05]: And he just says no and he holds true to what he believes and feels like that that's

[00:05:31] [SPEAKER_05]: you know, and his heart what he needs to do.

[00:05:33] [SPEAKER_05]: And for his queen.

[00:05:36] [SPEAKER_05]: So I love what they're doing with him.

[00:05:38] [SPEAKER_05]: I think his Lloyd Owens performance is so interesting to watch.

[00:05:43] [SPEAKER_05]: And I really think that he's giving that performance that makes it so easy for fans

[00:05:48] [SPEAKER_05]: to get behind him and want to follow him.

[00:05:53] [SPEAKER_05]: And then along with Ellen Dill, you know, we have Mirriol.

[00:05:56] [SPEAKER_05]: And I've loved seeing her evolution where we saw her in season one.

[00:06:02] [SPEAKER_05]: She was kind of this warrior queen which was so great.

[00:06:07] [SPEAKER_05]: And now she's kind of become this like spiritual leader, political rival.

[00:06:14] [SPEAKER_05]: She's I feel a lot more interesting in season two so far.

[00:06:19] [SPEAKER_05]: And in this episode especially, she's just so remarkable.

[00:06:23] [SPEAKER_05]: And I love that how much she has risen to become this rival against Ferris on all that dude.

[00:06:30] [SPEAKER_05]: He's just rotten.

[00:06:31] [SPEAKER_05]: Just rotten.

[00:06:32] [SPEAKER_05]: I just don't like him at all.

[00:06:36] [SPEAKER_05]: But, you know, with is how awful is what he is.

[00:06:39] [SPEAKER_05]: He has this greed and ambition.

[00:06:43] [SPEAKER_05]: She perfectly counteracts that with that serenity that she has.

[00:06:48] [SPEAKER_05]: Like I've just I've loved seeing her evolve.

[00:06:51] [SPEAKER_05]: And I think between Ellen Dill and his character and how people will easily be able to get behind him.

[00:07:00] [SPEAKER_05]: I think she's making it really easy for people to get behind her.

[00:07:04] [SPEAKER_05]: So I feel like between them to I can't wait to see what happens next.

[00:07:10] [SPEAKER_05]: And also I just I'm totally hoping like there's something between them too.

[00:07:14] [SPEAKER_05]: I'm totally shipping them.

[00:07:15] [SPEAKER_05]: I don't like shipping characters but I'm behind that.

[00:07:19] [SPEAKER_07]: They are amazing together.

[00:07:21] [SPEAKER_07]: I don't like their chemistry is just incredible from the beginning of love to any scene with the two of them.

[00:07:26] [SPEAKER_07]: And I love how they started out, you know, we actually see them kind of meet really for the first time.

[00:07:31] [SPEAKER_07]: I think she'd maybe sort of been aware of him or her to them but really early on in season one they kind of meet.

[00:07:36] [SPEAKER_07]: And it's really incredible to see how that has grown over the two seasons.

[00:07:42] [SPEAKER_07]: To where you see them come together to sort of trust each other and to really know that they're on the same side and they can lean on each other.

[00:07:51] [SPEAKER_07]: Right throughout to now we are I think they've crossed that line over into, you know, there's that one line that she said what about my heart.

[00:07:59] [SPEAKER_07]: And that's kind of where it crossed over I think from that kind of.

[00:08:02] [SPEAKER_07]: And I think that's a very good one.

[00:08:03] [SPEAKER_07]: But, I really love to the kind of maybe a bit more in antic love but I loved absolutely loved.

[00:08:09] [SPEAKER_07]: That they didn't kiss and I was sitting there going kiss kiss kiss kiss.

[00:08:13] [SPEAKER_07]: So I was waiting to take it out.

[00:08:15] [SPEAKER_07]: But I also loved that they didn't and that four-head tattooing was just so much more intimate I felt than if they had kissed and I just thought it was beautiful, this so incredible.

[00:08:24] [SPEAKER_07]: And I agree with what you say about in Linde or he's just the performance is incredible.

[00:08:29] [SPEAKER_07]: First of all, the castem because I think they found someone who has not just a similar kind

[00:08:34] [SPEAKER_07]: of look but also just that same gravitas that we go brought to our recording. That Lloyd

[00:08:41] [SPEAKER_07]: Arwen is now bringing to this character that we can really believe that his arrogance and sister.

[00:08:46] [SPEAKER_07]: So you've got this kind of the acting, the physicality but then also just these actions that

[00:08:50] [SPEAKER_07]: he's doing that is setting us up to believe that one day he is going to become the hiking of

[00:08:55] [SPEAKER_07]: Gondor and Arnor. You know, you can just see it in him. He's so noble and absolutely loved that

[00:09:01] [SPEAKER_07]: sequence in the course when he's standing there and it first says that he renounces his crimes

[00:09:06] [SPEAKER_07]: and you can see that kind of look of relief on the audience face but then when they ask him to swear

[00:09:13] [SPEAKER_07]: to, far as on, he just says I do not and then when he stood up and then he just walked towards

[00:09:19] [SPEAKER_07]: and pointed to bars on. Oh, that was so amazing. Absolutely. So powerful. Yes. 100% agree with everything

[00:09:28] [SPEAKER_07]: you just said. Yeah and then they have to have this trial by a person that whole scene in the

[00:09:33] [SPEAKER_07]: jail where a Yardian comes to him and it was quite a touching scene between the two of them

[00:09:37] [SPEAKER_07]: because they've been estranged for this time and she wants him to swear for the authority and

[00:09:42] [SPEAKER_07]: then that moment where she says put away a pride and he just looks at her and says if you think

[00:09:47] [SPEAKER_07]: that pride as all it is then we've got nothing more to say to each other and I was like oh no

[00:09:52] [SPEAKER_07]: they're truly lost to each other. It was so sad. Yeah and she still seemed to want to, I know

[00:09:58] [SPEAKER_07]: she, I'm not sure where she's going you know. I do feel like she's potentially still redeemable

[00:10:04] [SPEAKER_07]: because she did go and get Marielle but again I don't think she got Marielle for her father. I think

[00:10:09] [SPEAKER_07]: she got Marielle just so that he would listen and bow to pharaohs on and then she would not

[00:10:15] [SPEAKER_07]: have to see him die. That was I do think it was still a little bit selfish from her parts not really

[00:10:19] [SPEAKER_07]: about the cause or about him. Both just so beautifully actors really loved it and then Marielle

[00:10:28] [SPEAKER_07]: takes a lendial's place you know in the trial and that that sequence with the C-wim that was so

[00:10:35] [SPEAKER_05]: beautiful underwater wasn't it? It was very beautiful, so powerful, very powerful moment

[00:10:42] [SPEAKER_07]: and I just love how whatever she is on screen whatever she is doing she is a regal. She is just

[00:10:50] [SPEAKER_07]: so noble and regal and poised and she can be you know in the fires of Mount Doom losing her

[00:10:56] [SPEAKER_07]: sight, you know trying to help other people or she can be an energial cell or she can be there

[00:11:03] [SPEAKER_07]: really to sacrifice her life for the cause and for a lendial to save him and she's just standing

[00:11:09] [SPEAKER_07]: the absolute stradest you could ever stand and just her posture and her demeanor everything is just

[00:11:14] [SPEAKER_07]: so incredible. We've got a bit more about that in news because I really wanted to explore and to

[00:11:19] [SPEAKER_07]: how they how they filmed that scene and what it meant to the actors so we'll talk a bit more about

[00:11:23] [SPEAKER_07]: that later but I just love that and the chief of lives and I was kind of like hang on wait

[00:11:29] [SPEAKER_07]: as she queen again now because everyone was going queen of the sea queen Maria and I don't know

[00:11:39] [SPEAKER_07]: her is on and these things people have to die in the sea can that. Yeah I was confused too I'm like wait

[00:11:46] [SPEAKER_05]: you just you just this eagle came down and everyone's like look they've chosen fair zone

[00:11:54] [SPEAKER_05]: and so they start chaining his name and I'm like okay so now he's ruling they can just do that

[00:11:59] [SPEAKER_05]: and now yeah now the same back to to Mariel and I'm like wow you you all kind of change your mind

[00:12:08] [SPEAKER_07]: and that's what I'm doing and but the other thing is to that kind of shows to me that

[00:12:14] [SPEAKER_07]: first of all they're probably quite you know persuadable but also that potentially the old

[00:12:20] [SPEAKER_07]: faith is stronger amongst the majority of people in pharaohs on beliefs because this was as whole

[00:12:25] [SPEAKER_07]: thing was let's just test out what that they basically went okay well let's

[00:12:31] [SPEAKER_07]: discredit the faithful by sending Maria or Elendelle to their death and it would just show

[00:12:36] [SPEAKER_07]: that the Vala don't care about them and that was basically going to be his way of saying

[00:12:41] [SPEAKER_07]: the Vala aren't here we don't need to worship anymore that's all good but it back

[00:12:45] [SPEAKER_07]: fires because first of all both Elendelle and Maria will not know all that they're ready to die for

[00:12:50] [SPEAKER_07]: their cause and then you know the the seaworms spat her out so it's basically showing everyone

[00:12:56] [SPEAKER_07]: that the Vala are around and are there to protect them and do think they're worthy and so

[00:13:00] [SPEAKER_07]: for the crowd to suddenly just go yeah yeah it sort of makes me think well maybe they are

[00:13:05] [SPEAKER_07]: paying more attention to what the Vala are wanting then pharaohs aren't actually thanks

[00:13:10] [SPEAKER_07]: so yeah definitely backflied I don't know whether yeah we have to wait till next week but

[00:13:15] [SPEAKER_07]: yeah I don't know whether that means that he's now becoming or she's not and I've got a bit to

[00:13:18] [SPEAKER_07]: say about that in the spill of section as well but overall I'm excited yeah to hear her myself

[00:13:24] [SPEAKER_05]: yeah that's a really good point I'm glad that you brought that up because then maybe it does show

[00:13:29] [SPEAKER_05]: that you know because a lot a lot of the faithful feel like they're still kind of in secret a little

[00:13:35] [SPEAKER_05]: right like maybe not everyone is proclaiming to be you know faithful and this is going to

[00:13:43] [SPEAKER_07]: hopefully make a turn yeah exactly but yeah having rid the books it's not going to go well

[00:13:51] [SPEAKER_07]: it's not just suddenly one or the other it's like you can actually see the unrest and I

[00:13:56] [SPEAKER_07]: think this is what happens in real life you know it's not just one thing happens and then everyone

[00:14:00] [SPEAKER_07]: turns it's always going to be different factions and different royalties that are being tested all

[00:14:04] [SPEAKER_07]: away through so yeah it'll be great to see what they do with that and then at the end of that

[00:14:10] [SPEAKER_07]: sequence we get a shot of pharaohs on looking into the pallin tier which I thought was really cool

[00:14:15] [SPEAKER_07]: because I thought you know he's talking all along and front of people about how this is just

[00:14:22] [SPEAKER_07]: alph metric and no one wants this set in magical seeing stones kind of thing and then I was like

[00:14:27] [SPEAKER_07]: well just wait he's going to look in there they can't help himself and then I love that visual

[00:14:33] [SPEAKER_07]: that they use where they put their hand on it and then you don't just get that crackling effect

[00:14:37] [SPEAKER_07]: within the stone but it kind of crackles reality like it kind of spreads out which I think is really cool

[00:14:42] [SPEAKER_07]: and then he sees how brand and we wondered last week you know what is he going to actually see in

[00:14:48] [SPEAKER_07]: the pallin tier and again I think that opinion I spoke about this a little bit where I think at this

[00:14:55] [SPEAKER_07]: stage what people are seeing in the pallin tier is their own future so we had Maria Alcine,

[00:15:00] [SPEAKER_07]: the wave we had Elendiel seeing himself right away from the city and we've got pharaohs on

[00:15:06] [SPEAKER_07]: now seeing how brand so I think he's realizing that how brand is going to be part of his future

[00:15:11] [SPEAKER_07]: and it's going to turn dark a game so I thought that was really really cool. Yeah that a very

[00:15:17] [SPEAKER_05]: interesting scene I can't wait to see how it plays out. Yeah it's awesome all right anything else on

[00:15:27] [SPEAKER_07]: on nubin or for you? Nope not at the moment. Awesome we might pop back there a little bit in

[00:15:34] [SPEAKER_07]: glad you're smart. I've quite keen to just pop on over to Roon and have a chat about what's happening

[00:15:40] [SPEAKER_07]: there we didn't get a huge amount in terms of screen time over there with Tom Bobbadell,

[00:15:46] [SPEAKER_07]: the stranger and Norian Poppy but we did get a little bit and it was probably significant so

[00:15:50] [SPEAKER_07]: we have worked chat about that. First of all Tom Bobbadell, the stranger quite a short scene with

[00:15:56] [SPEAKER_07]: the two of them but quite important I think and I am fully now confirmed in my suspicion from

[00:16:02] [SPEAKER_05]: last week that Gandalf's getting that hat. Yes I've wondered if that was where y'all were kind of

[00:16:11] [SPEAKER_05]: leaning is the stranger Gandalf because if there were any doubts before I feel like this

[00:16:19] [SPEAKER_05]: episode all bit affirmed it for me anyway I wasn't sure it's like I don't know there's so many

[00:16:24] [SPEAKER_05]: characters and I guess you could be like it could be this it could be that but I mean it feels like

[00:16:28] [SPEAKER_05]: that's where they're going but this episode I think affirmed it for me for sure. Yeah I've seen so much

[00:16:34] [SPEAKER_07]: talk out there in the internet and there's still a lot of people who are delighted and don't

[00:16:37] [SPEAKER_07]: think it is and a lot of people who don't want it to be because they're so hung up on the timelines

[00:16:42] [SPEAKER_07]: and that Gandalf isn't supposed to arrive yet and all that sort of stuff we've talked about

[00:16:46] [SPEAKER_07]: there in a lot of work that's not gonna matter they're crunching the timeline that's all good

[00:16:50] [SPEAKER_07]: but I think that a lot of people are still trying to deny that it's hermen. I see a lot of

[00:16:58] [SPEAKER_07]: it's hermen then they're gonna say it's not and I'm like there has been like 14 episodes so far

[00:17:04] [SPEAKER_07]: where they have dangled this and there's not just this week there has been clues every single

[00:17:09] [SPEAKER_07]: week in the dialogue and the way he's speaking everything that points towards it being Gandalf

[00:17:15] [SPEAKER_07]: and I honestly just think it would be so mean if it wasn't at this point it's just not gonna happen

[00:17:19] [SPEAKER_07]: and the hat I was like last week I was like a bonvadouz got a wizardy type hat we haven't seen it yet

[00:17:25] [SPEAKER_07]: I'm pretty sure Gandalf's gonna get it and then as soon as we saw the silhouette of the hat

[00:17:29] [SPEAKER_07]: against the sky with that really distinctive little curve at the end of it I thought that's it

[00:17:36] [SPEAKER_07]: and he takes some strange artyops still calling him the stranger to work confirmed but he takes

[00:17:41] [SPEAKER_07]: the stranger out to the wilds and he says to him you'll find your true staff only when the vision

[00:17:47] [SPEAKER_07]: of your heart is single to the service of the secret fire and and then he comes out with the

[00:17:54] [SPEAKER_07]: absolute Gandalf like line to the strangers this is coming from Tom Bonvadouz and he says many

[00:17:59] [SPEAKER_07]: that die deserved life some that lived deserved death who are you to give it to them and that

[00:18:05] [SPEAKER_07]: is a direct quote from Gandalf saying to Frodo when Frodo says he wish to kill God when he had

[00:18:10] [SPEAKER_07]: the chance it's flipped around because the wording is slightly different Gandalf says to Frodo

[00:18:15] [SPEAKER_07]: many that lived deserved death and some that died deserved life can you give it to them

[00:18:19] [SPEAKER_07]: do not be too eager to deal that death in judgment but even the very wise cannot see all ends

[00:18:25] [SPEAKER_07]: so I love that they've done that all the way through they've given him lines that end up either

[00:18:29] [SPEAKER_07]: being something that Gandalf says or something that is really true to the character so

[00:18:34] [SPEAKER_07]: that was really cool and then they see this this whole big kind of valley or canyon filled with these

[00:18:40] [SPEAKER_07]: twisty-nald sticks and they are looking like yeah really exactly like the Nald kind of staff that Gandalf

[00:18:49] [SPEAKER_07]: that we see visually and you know the Lord of the Rings movies so I guess the question is

[00:18:55] [SPEAKER_07]: is he going to be going down there to to get the staff or is he going to go back to Norie because

[00:19:01] [SPEAKER_07]: that's the choice that he's been given isn't it by Tom Bonvadouz you have to choose your destiny

[00:19:05] [SPEAKER_05]: all your friend. I think he's going to go try and save Norie and he's going to get his staff

[00:19:15] [SPEAKER_05]: from that tree where his teeth live. Yeah I think this is a Tolkien story that you don't

[00:19:27] [SPEAKER_05]: abandon your friends and I just don't see the stranger abandoning Norie I think it's going to be one

[00:19:33] [SPEAKER_07]: in the same. Yeah I agree I think that's the taste yeah it's the taste and you know there's

[00:19:41] [SPEAKER_07]: a theme throughout Tolkien is as yes you can have these grand notions about saving the world

[00:19:48] [SPEAKER_07]: but at the begins at home you have to look after your people first and I think that's what's

[00:19:52] [SPEAKER_07]: going to happen as well. We've just seen that tree mentioned and looked at a few too many times

[00:19:57] [SPEAKER_07]: with the kind of year of I think you're right I think it's what we're going to go with and just from

[00:20:03] [SPEAKER_07]: what we know already just of the stranger but even more so if we do believe that his Gandalf

[00:20:08] [SPEAKER_07]: that's what that's what he would choose so I think that's what we're going to see as well.

[00:20:14] [SPEAKER_07]: I liked the mention of the secret fires but we've heard that a few times before and the

[00:20:19] [SPEAKER_07]: lot of the rings so I've got a bit of background to that. The secret fires also known as the

[00:20:24] [SPEAKER_07]: flame imperishable or the imperishable flame and it was thus that gave Erie the creator god

[00:20:30] [SPEAKER_07]: has mysterious power of creation so you can only make something of substance and life from nothing

[00:20:37] [SPEAKER_07]: using the secret fire you can't just make up anything at any time and only Erie could command

[00:20:43] [SPEAKER_07]: the secret fire neither being could could claim it and that's why we in more god-themed evil things

[00:20:49] [SPEAKER_07]: he had to twist and distort good things that already exist in so for example that the

[00:20:54] [SPEAKER_07]: elves into orcs and so on and symbolically I guess the secret fire is an alternative name for the

[00:21:06] [SPEAKER_07]: Carol of God and there was this discussion that Tolkien has with Clyde Kilbe who and Clyde

[00:21:14] [SPEAKER_07]: basically quoted this and said, Professor Tolkien talks to me at some length about the use of

[00:21:19] [SPEAKER_07]: the word holy in the summer early and very specifically you told me that the secret fire

[00:21:23] [SPEAKER_07]: sent to burn at the harsh of the world in the beginning was the Holy Spirit so that's quite cool

[00:21:29] [SPEAKER_07]: it's because Tolkien actually often did not want to make this allegorical and did not want to

[00:21:36] [SPEAKER_07]: I guess acknowledge their very obvious echoes between religion and between his story but this is a

[00:21:44] [SPEAKER_07]: specific time where he said yet pretty much that's what it is. And we've heard it before in

[00:21:49] [SPEAKER_07]: Lord of the Rings too so when Gandalf is on the bridge there and he's about to take down the bell

[00:21:53] [SPEAKER_07]: he says I'm a secret I'm a servant of the secret fire, we're all of the flame of anor so anor is

[00:21:59] [SPEAKER_07]: the word for some but yeah it's quite cool to see that he code again here we're on the doers

[00:22:04] [SPEAKER_07]: basically saying this is what it is you need to be able to be in service of the secret fire and again

[00:22:10] [SPEAKER_07]: that's another deep lore clue that's Gandalf literally later he says I'm the servant of the secret fire

[00:22:17] [SPEAKER_07]: and right here Thomas saying you need to be single to the service of the secret fire.

[00:22:21] [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah all fingers point there but I am curious why I mean if that's where they're going with this

[00:22:31] [SPEAKER_05]: you know the stranger is Gandalf why why did they like drag it out for so long I guess because

[00:22:38] [SPEAKER_05]: I feel like they have been trying to drop those clues so I'm not sure why they wanted to

[00:22:45] [SPEAKER_05]: make us wait so long and we still haven't officially gotten that reveal or anything but

[00:22:50] [SPEAKER_05]: you know it's like my make us wait just I know yeah I know because for me personally I

[00:22:56] [SPEAKER_07]: felt like a hell brain took a long time because I clocked hell brain from I've been so too pretty

[00:23:01] [SPEAKER_07]: much when he arrived and he's on there so good like he's got a man and so for me we're doing another

[00:23:09] [SPEAKER_07]: six episodes was quite long for that especially with the fear the clues that came along but

[00:23:13] [SPEAKER_07]: this is just in your face it's so obvious and I don't know I always I always wonder did they do

[00:23:20] [SPEAKER_07]: research before making the show in terms of what people's knowledge base would be out of all

[00:23:27] [SPEAKER_07]: of their viewers or have they done that now so they go okay we've got 40 million viewers we

[00:23:32] [SPEAKER_07]: know from from research or anecdotal evidence or whatever that this number of percentage of them

[00:23:38] [SPEAKER_07]: have not seen anything this is completely coming in fresh just viewing this show then there's

[00:23:44] [SPEAKER_07]: the stage of people who are yep probably seen the movies but haven't read anything and then you've

[00:23:49] [SPEAKER_07]: got the next lot of people who've seen the movies probably read Lord of the Rings in the Hobbit

[00:23:55] [SPEAKER_07]: that nothing more and then you've got the people who are the Philon Tolkien nerds have read

[00:23:59] [SPEAKER_07]: the simulion and know all the background stuff and I honestly think that there's a huge number

[00:24:03] [SPEAKER_07]: of people just in those first two categories either never having seen anything or just having

[00:24:08] [SPEAKER_07]: seen the movies and I think that they have to cater to the huge fans by dropping in all these

[00:24:14] [SPEAKER_07]: little cool nuggets but I think that also we are that they have to make it accessible for people

[00:24:18] [SPEAKER_07]: who really only know well this is thank all the Lord of the Rings and it's got a wizard in

[00:24:22] [SPEAKER_07]: it cool game out like most people know that. Right so good point yeah I just think they're right

[00:24:28] [SPEAKER_07]: that's why they're doing it but even for those people this is still a long time yes it's

[00:24:35] [SPEAKER_07]: still taking a little bit farther that's cool and yeah it's interesting because I have heard

[00:24:43] [SPEAKER_07]: you know people who get the episodes ahead of time and journalists who've seen the whole season

[00:24:51] [SPEAKER_07]: have said oh yeah it does get revealed by the end of this and it's I've heard people say it's

[00:24:55] [SPEAKER_07]: kind of a cheesy way in which they they reveal it but I actually don't know if it's still going

[00:25:01] [SPEAKER_07]: happen this season and I wonder whether the thing that they were meaning that was cheesy was back

[00:25:06] [SPEAKER_07]: when the leader of the stores said oh he's just a great big grand elf and I wonder whether

[00:25:12] [SPEAKER_07]: that's what they meant but it wasn't actually a true reveal I don't know but they can't they can't

[00:25:17] [SPEAKER_05]: drag it up for no reason yeah I hope if that's where they're going then hopefully by the last

[00:25:24] [SPEAKER_07]: episode of the season I hope we get that yeah yeah for sure yeah and then we move over to

[00:25:32] [SPEAKER_07]: to the other part of room and we're in the stores village and we've got a couple of scenes there

[00:25:38] [SPEAKER_07]: so we have Nory talking to Gunn the Gunn and there was a little bit of new information there for

[00:25:45] [SPEAKER_07]: me because I was under the impression that the half-foot's moved seasonally so they were here

[00:25:50] [SPEAKER_07]: for summer then they moved here for winter type thing but she sees they moved every month so I thought

[00:25:56] [SPEAKER_05]: it was kind of clarifying things a little bit yeah I don't recall hearing that or that being

[00:26:04] [SPEAKER_05]: reference in season one and if it was I missed it which is possible but I thought wow that's

[00:26:11] [SPEAKER_05]: that's a lot of moving they're really good at that they've really got there like I've got a pattern

[00:26:16] [SPEAKER_05]: down yeah they know exactly what they're doing and when but that's a lot and it's and I was like

[00:26:22] [SPEAKER_07]: I felt like the migration that we saw was potentially the biggest season or one so they

[00:26:27] [SPEAKER_07]: go from this area right all the way to the grove surely that I moved that far in a month because

[00:26:32] [SPEAKER_07]: it seemed like it was many days of traveling to get there but the whole point of her talking

[00:26:37] [SPEAKER_07]: about this with with the Gunn was to actually talk about how they move on and they don't

[00:26:43] [SPEAKER_07]: settle and that gave Gunn the opportunity to describe what it's like to live in a settle place

[00:26:48] [SPEAKER_07]: and been linked to somewhere with your own history and I absolutely loved that and the the

[00:26:55] [SPEAKER_07]: kind of method that she used or the tool that she used to describe that was the tree and we

[00:27:00] [SPEAKER_07]: talked about that tree potentially being important but the way that she said that she tended

[00:27:06] [SPEAKER_07]: it since she was a small child and then she married her sweetheart under the tree and then when

[00:27:11] [SPEAKER_07]: he passed she buried him under the tree so it's linking this really really important sense of place

[00:27:18] [SPEAKER_07]: with your family and with your life and I loved how Nori was kind of intrigued by that she hadn't

[00:27:25] [SPEAKER_07]: thought about that there could be benefits to that because she only knows her own way of life

[00:27:31] [SPEAKER_07]: and I loved that and I loved that this description that Gunn was saying is very like the

[00:27:35] [SPEAKER_07]: settle nature of the Shire that we see later and we know that eventually all these Hobbits are

[00:27:39] [SPEAKER_07]: across the mountains and they're going to hear on over in you know settle the Shire we might

[00:27:44] [SPEAKER_07]: get to see that in this series I hope so I think that would be a really cool way to say that

[00:27:49] [SPEAKER_07]: you just am first and the best of both worlds because you got settled but you've also got the

[00:27:55] [SPEAKER_07]: grain fields and the streams and everything so that the two things that both of these

[00:27:59] [SPEAKER_07]: cultures want will be in one place which is really cool and what I loved was the music

[00:28:06] [SPEAKER_07]: and the background has such echoes of the Shire and music in it without being exact same notes they

[00:28:12] [SPEAKER_07]: had sort of three or four similar notes and sequence that sounded really really like the Shire

[00:28:18] [SPEAKER_07]: music from the trilogy I thought that was amazingly well done by B. M. Crary that he brought

[00:28:25] [SPEAKER_07]: and little echoes that people familiar with the music were known it's real heartstring music

[00:28:30] [SPEAKER_07]: you know because that's the music that they played the end when everyone kind of you know

[00:28:34] [SPEAKER_07]: has their resolution at the end of the trilogy and whenever Frodo and Sam are talking about the

[00:28:39] [SPEAKER_07]: Shire they bring that theme back and as well I thought it was beautifully done. It was it was I

[00:28:45] [SPEAKER_05]: remember watching and I'm like I think I know that music I think I know where where that's from

[00:28:52] [SPEAKER_05]: and it was I think a lovely little Easter egg and a little callback. Yeah and then the good talks

[00:29:00] [SPEAKER_07]: are not just a story about these houses that they live in and they're called Smales so it's

[00:29:06] [SPEAKER_07]: is M. I. A. L. Some people pronounce it smile but the correct pronunciation I believe is Smale

[00:29:12] [SPEAKER_07]: and that's the word for their little little hobbit holes and the word is an adventure of

[00:29:17] [SPEAKER_07]: Tolkien is based on the English old English word, Smile or Smiggle is in Y G E L's, Smiggle

[00:29:25] [SPEAKER_07]: and Smiel is a translation of the Hobbitish word for Burrow and Tolkien explained that

[00:29:32] [SPEAKER_07]: and has guide to the names of all of the rings and it's actually the origin of the name Smiggle,

[00:29:37] [SPEAKER_07]: the character that we know of Gollum as well which is kind of a cool callback. It is.

[00:29:43] [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah so the Smiel is a word particular to Hobbits meaning Burrow or leave unchanged. It's a form

[00:29:49] [SPEAKER_07]: of the old English word, Smiggle Burrow might have had if it had survived. The same element

[00:29:55] [SPEAKER_07]: appears in Gollum's real name, Smiggle. Smales were the Hobbit holes tunneled into Earth

[00:30:00] [SPEAKER_07]: Mounds and Hales for generations the Hobbits dug into the Earth to live by the later third age

[00:30:05] [SPEAKER_07]: the poorest Hobbits still went living in Burrows with the most primitive kind but for the most

[00:30:09] [SPEAKER_07]: well to do Hobbits, Smales were luxury versions of these primitive diggings their tunnels had

[00:30:14] [SPEAKER_07]: rounded walls and branched off to other rooms and these included the most famous one that we know

[00:30:19] [SPEAKER_07]: though those house spagging and then the Smales along the backshot row of Hobbit and the great

[00:30:25] [SPEAKER_07]: Smales of Takabura and Brandy Hall. So they end up being this really elaborate cozy, beautiful

[00:30:31] [SPEAKER_07]: and wonderfully decorated places but they started out as these kind of holes in the ground you know

[00:30:37] [SPEAKER_07]: so I thought that was really cool and nice cool back. Oh I really hope we get to see that sometime

[00:30:43] [SPEAKER_05]: during this series that would be just amazing seeing all of the divisions. I know there isn't

[00:30:49] [SPEAKER_05]: there are third division as well of Hobbit that we haven't yet seen and maybe we're at there

[00:30:55] [SPEAKER_07]: there are. Yeah they might come, they might come into it too. I do believe that we'll see

[00:31:00] [SPEAKER_07]: that happening this settling of the Shire I think that they're telegraphing that really early on.

[00:31:04] [SPEAKER_07]: Again it's not exactly the same as the timeline in the book but who cares we just want to see

[00:31:09] [SPEAKER_05]: all of them. You know what? I look I just I'm happy to just be here and be entertained so

[00:31:15] [SPEAKER_05]: I'm okay with that not that my opinion has you know any say at all but I think that would be

[00:31:21] [SPEAKER_05]: just so cool to get all of them together and then start seeing the seeds of the Shire.

[00:31:28] [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah and it goes back to that thought that you know the vast majority of people here don't

[00:31:34] [SPEAKER_07]: know exactly which year in the third age, Gandalf's supposed to arrive they don't know exactly

[00:31:37] [SPEAKER_07]: which year the Hobbit's cross the best few mountains and winter and settled it's just way

[00:31:42] [SPEAKER_07]: now what they look like and we want to see it. And then we have that seed with Poppy and nobody,

[00:31:50] [SPEAKER_05]: what did you think about that? I thought it was so darn cute but first I first I was kind of

[00:31:55] [SPEAKER_05]: taking out a little bit because I'm like is she holding a snake like that? I had to kind of rewind

[00:32:06] [SPEAKER_05]: it for a bit because I like it. It goes like what is she what is she holding what are they doing?

[00:32:12] [SPEAKER_05]: So that and I was like okay okay now go back and let's appreciate this moment but I thought

[00:32:17] [SPEAKER_05]: it was adorable. I I had a feeling there were some feelings between those two. There were some

[00:32:25] [SPEAKER_05]: you know looks in previous episodes and I thought hmm someone's catching feelings and it's adorable

[00:32:32] [SPEAKER_05]: so I thought it was really sweet but I you know I wonder I wonder if maybe Poppy will stay

[00:32:39] [SPEAKER_07]: you know there. Yeah it seems like they're really made a connection and

[00:32:46] [SPEAKER_07]: potentially that could be something where the two of them Poppy and Nori get separated or something

[00:32:51] [SPEAKER_07]: that happens I don't know. Yeah I thought it was really cute as well and you know often on TV shows

[00:32:58] [SPEAKER_07]: there are few very few scenes apart from really intense ones where people are literally just

[00:33:03] [SPEAKER_07]: sitting talking to each other like we did we did get that with with Nori and Grund but the

[00:33:09] [SPEAKER_07]: content of what they were saying was really important so they're not doing anything else physically

[00:33:13] [SPEAKER_07]: but often in TV shows we do see people are undertaking a task or doing something

[00:33:19] [SPEAKER_07]: physical even if it's just walking around while they're talking but the two of them they're decided

[00:33:25] [SPEAKER_07]: to milk the venom of the snake super casual not even talking about it or looking like it was

[00:33:31] [SPEAKER_05]: dangerous in any way. Yeah yeah I was like you're you're way too kind of with that Poppy. I

[00:33:38] [SPEAKER_05]: you know you're stronger than I am but it looked like they were uh I don't know if

[00:33:45] [SPEAKER_05]: using the venom or something for was it for Woppins maybe yeah look like yeah maybe Dars or

[00:33:52] [SPEAKER_05]: something I can quite tell what he was using and then popping that in that little bit there but

[00:33:57] [SPEAKER_05]: I was like okay so it looks like maybe they're going to use them maybe for defense

[00:34:01] [SPEAKER_05]: in some way but I'm like just having this nice pleasant little moment while she's just

[00:34:08] [SPEAKER_07]: snake I just had to get her a little bit. Yeah and then I love I love when the shows don't

[00:34:15] [SPEAKER_07]: miss around you know like so they basically saw each other they had a bit of a thing when they first

[00:34:20] [SPEAKER_07]: or each other and then they said in their chadage and he goes to ask her out and she's like

[00:34:24] [SPEAKER_07]: W Street bed grabs his hand and then they kiss like it's just really cool where they get to the

[00:34:28] [SPEAKER_07]: point and they've made this connection it so it was super cute I really loved it and then of course

[00:34:33] [SPEAKER_07]: the absolute hilarious moment where she's like did you have pleasant fit to that. It's got pleasant

[00:34:39] [SPEAKER_07]: breath. So cute. It was really cute. Yeah I'm here for it all just yeah.

[00:34:50] [SPEAKER_07]: But yeah I think they're going I think that looks like sort of quills or something like quills or

[00:34:56] [SPEAKER_07]: barbs that they were putting this venom on and then they're storing them and I'm guessing maybe

[00:35:01] [SPEAKER_07]: blowdarts later on they're going to be in a battle of some kind and that's going to come into play

[00:35:06] [SPEAKER_07]: because yeah you don't just throw in a random snake venom scene without a pay off. Yeah absolutely

[00:35:12] [SPEAKER_07]: I'm going to see I want to see that in action. Yeah. All right. Okay co so what

[00:35:20] [SPEAKER_07]: where did you want to go to next? Couple more, a couple more locations I think and my left at this point.

[00:35:27] [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah we're getting to all of them this episode they didn't really leave anything out even if it

[00:35:32] [SPEAKER_05]: was just small pieces or it got some you know long scenes in dialogue they they'd really touched on

[00:35:38] [SPEAKER_05]: everything this episode but you know speaking of you know good dialogue that you were just you know talking

[00:35:45] [SPEAKER_05]: about I would love to kind of go to the scene of Gallauderial and Adar.

[00:35:54] [SPEAKER_05]: I love seeing these two together I think it's very interesting these two enemies

[00:36:03] [SPEAKER_05]: foes but also share a common enemy you know the enemy of my enemy is my friend is what

[00:36:10] [SPEAKER_05]: it it's kind of feeling like here between the two of them I love the setting you know as Adar

[00:36:17] [SPEAKER_05]: he's got this you know hold dinner prepared you know with Gallauderial you know in the seat

[00:36:25] [SPEAKER_05]: knowing she's prisoner he doesn't have a chain at the moment but you know she can't really go anywhere

[00:36:32] [SPEAKER_05]: I love how Adar it's interesting because I'm like am I supposed am I am I sympathizing for

[00:36:41] [SPEAKER_05]: orcs you know it's it's such a weird feeling you know he hates soar on so much and I believe

[00:36:51] [SPEAKER_05]: good reason I've not I know some of the history I've read tried to read up on a little bit of

[00:37:01] [SPEAKER_05]: more than that he has this love for the orcs his children and I think that that gives us

[00:37:09] [SPEAKER_05]: the ability to sympathize and see his side of things really easy and then with Gallauderial

[00:37:24] [SPEAKER_05]: herkroath from season one to this season I think has been really fantastic because I think that

[00:37:34] [SPEAKER_05]: you know she she has evolved I feel she used to be very headstrong she was kind of brash in season one

[00:37:45] [SPEAKER_05]: and she's she has flaws which I love you know she's not you know she's not perfect she does have

[00:37:51] [SPEAKER_05]: flaws she's I you know think still a young elf but I think that she has gotten to a point now

[00:37:57] [SPEAKER_05]: where she's learned from her mistakes with sour on when it ended in season one and she's gotten a lot

[00:38:04] [SPEAKER_05]: more self-aware that she she's now able to kind of have this sympathy with Adar that

[00:38:13] [SPEAKER_05]: she wouldn't have had before maybe in season one and I love seeing that that they are kind

[00:38:21] [SPEAKER_05]: seeing this benefit that they can have with each other and or you know if they help each other

[00:38:27] [SPEAKER_05]: but it was so hard to then see like she she knows like what sour on is trying to do

[00:38:35] [SPEAKER_05]: but in trying to tell Adar that and then he continues on with his plan to go to you know

[00:38:43] [SPEAKER_05]: erygion and and march on um that was I was like oh no please listen to her she knows you know

[00:38:52] [SPEAKER_05]: I feel like she and I because they still feel like maybe sour on is still clouding Adar a little like

[00:38:58] [SPEAKER_05]: even though he's I think got a longer history with him that he's still not clear or maybe he

[00:39:04] [SPEAKER_05]: doesn't want to maybe he's you know so stuck on his mission and this payback I'm not not clear

[00:39:14] [SPEAKER_05]: but you know I loved the scenes between them I thought they were really beautiful I thought

[00:39:19] [SPEAKER_07]: the dialogue was great yeah it's beautiful isn't it and I'm interestingly odd and I

[00:39:25] [SPEAKER_07]: the end today is a weird place but I've seen a lot of people shipping the tour of the image well

[00:39:30] [SPEAKER_07]: oh no that's it but I loved out was that typical kind of feast with your captive scene

[00:39:39] [SPEAKER_07]: which there's a bit of a trope that we see and a lot of movies and TV shows as well where the

[00:39:43] [SPEAKER_07]: the captive is sitting there and the one that this actually reminded me of was a few echoes actually

[00:39:48] [SPEAKER_07]: parts of the Caribbean the scene where um where the captive obosa is sitting there and he's having dinner

[00:39:55] [SPEAKER_07]: with Elizabeth on his ship and that always have this that incredibly elaborate feast set out

[00:40:01] [SPEAKER_07]: front of them and they don't really eat it they just talk business but it was a really quite cool

[00:40:05] [SPEAKER_07]: that we're seeing this and obviously of course at Arcaneite unlike Bobo so at least he's there

[00:40:13] [SPEAKER_07]: enjoying the feast which is cool but yeah I think I think you're right and I think that

[00:40:18] [SPEAKER_07]: he's got two goals really two very strong goals so the one goal is revenge upon Sarah and he

[00:40:24] [SPEAKER_07]: destroyed and the second goal is getting his walks their home so he wants his hereduct to

[00:40:31] [SPEAKER_07]: have more joy to be lived in to not be attacked or abused by anybody else like that was the

[00:40:37] [SPEAKER_07]: question that he asked God I did I was as God God I was going to let us have our home and she could

[00:40:43] [SPEAKER_07]: not advance you almost didn't even pay attention to it kind of like hang on this isn't even what

[00:40:48] [SPEAKER_07]: we're talking about we're talking about destroying Sarah but she really didn't listen to his

[00:40:52] [SPEAKER_07]: goals so she was proposing this idea that the two of them unite to defeat Sarah on

[00:40:59] [SPEAKER_07]: without thinking about what might happen later for his people and that was the tipping point I

[00:41:04] [SPEAKER_07]: feel like for him because it really was this test he he really manipulated her he found out

[00:41:10] [SPEAKER_07]: what they were doing with army was he found out that she didn't have her ring she confirmed for

[00:41:16] [SPEAKER_07]: him that how brand was Sarah which I think he's a sped dead but needed the confirmation for sure

[00:41:21] [SPEAKER_07]: so how got a lot out of that conversation and and left her with nothing nothing but the realization

[00:41:28] [SPEAKER_07]: that really it's all we're going to go sideways now for her and for the Alps because you've

[00:41:33] [SPEAKER_07]: got this massive walk army coming to attack the city that's got very little defence to it

[00:41:40] [SPEAKER_07]: and then realizing that it was Sarah's plan along he doesn't have an army so he needs these

[00:41:47] [SPEAKER_07]: has got Sarah's goal is to destroy a region to destroy the power structure that the the Alps have

[00:41:54] [SPEAKER_07]: got I mean he's cutting it fine with um that with caliber boards don't try to make the

[00:41:59] [SPEAKER_07]: ranks it's like you'd be at a height none of those little five bombs actually had the forge before

[00:42:03] [SPEAKER_05]: his rings get made no kidding no kidding might want to put a pause on that for a little bit

[00:42:09] [SPEAKER_05]: no you're right you're right um it feels like both of them are kind of being a little short

[00:42:14] [SPEAKER_05]: side it in their own way you know gallidrial with you know not being able to answer that question

[00:42:19] [SPEAKER_05]: of will what happens to us if we defeat soar on or we are we going to be left in peace or we're

[00:42:25] [SPEAKER_05]: going to be able to be just be left alone and then he also can't see ahead and ahead enough to

[00:42:32] [SPEAKER_05]: know that this is you know that he's just basically doing exactly what soar on once him to do so they're

[00:42:37] [SPEAKER_05]: both you know still still not able to see the the bigger pictures and you know what what the outcome

[00:42:44] [SPEAKER_05]: could potentially be if they move forward with that let's true and the dialogue was incredible

[00:42:51] [SPEAKER_07]: I love how she still calls him or like she has all the way through and he keeps saying

[00:42:57] [SPEAKER_07]: eric and then by the end she did call him eric so she was kind of compensating to that a little

[00:43:03] [SPEAKER_07]: bit like yo k-core on when you're sorry I can see your value and all that kind of stuff but

[00:43:08] [SPEAKER_07]: that moment where they really understood each other and they understood saron's grip on the

[00:43:14] [SPEAKER_07]: both of them was a credible where he's talking about about what that means to be influenced by

[00:43:21] [SPEAKER_07]: saron and I love I love his mind he says she sees you yielded I resisted him and then

[00:43:33] [SPEAKER_07]: just who you are but who you wish to be his eye was a hole and the rest of him slivers in

[00:43:38] [SPEAKER_07]: everything else feels for a while he even makes you believe that his power has become yours

[00:43:43] [SPEAKER_07]: it was a stable power that makes every desire for full-ancing and inevitable

[00:43:47] [SPEAKER_07]: ocean of color against which everything else feels ever thereafter and then she completes the sentence

[00:43:54] [SPEAKER_07]: a dull grey so they completely understand each other and what that means I thought that was

[00:43:58] [SPEAKER_07]: incredibly well written and shows you that they both are really in tune with what happens when

[00:44:03] [SPEAKER_07]: saron has this hold over you so I loved that kind of meeting of minds there but then it just

[00:44:08] [SPEAKER_07]: splinted right off into both wanting really different things I thought it was powerfully done

[00:44:12] [SPEAKER_07]: it was really beautiful yeah very good done and then he brings out a more goth scram saron scram

[00:44:23] [SPEAKER_05]: just like you're just like in just pissing on the table like no big deal

[00:44:29] [SPEAKER_07]: incredible and did you notice that Galadriel couldn't even look at it she was sort of

[00:44:36] [SPEAKER_07]: shit like showing away almost like she couldn't even clap eyes on it because it was so

[00:44:40] [SPEAKER_07]: powerful to her and so terrifying to her and you know the idea that she would have seen this on

[00:44:47] [SPEAKER_07]: goths head and it's been changed slightly but I like the way that they said that it had

[00:44:53] [SPEAKER_07]: been changed because there's no evidence in the book that more goths scram went to saron but I

[00:44:59] [SPEAKER_07]: liked that they've taken the idea that it was sort of melted down and he reforged it for

[00:45:04] [SPEAKER_07]: himself into his own crown it obviously looks enough like more goth that that Galadriel

[00:45:10] [SPEAKER_07]: was triggered by it but the crown itself because you know more goth started out as melcore so

[00:45:16] [SPEAKER_07]: he was one of the vela and he was there from the beginning who's the most powerful vela when

[00:45:21] [SPEAKER_07]: Etero first made the music of the creation but um how he started was he disrupted the music

[00:45:26] [SPEAKER_07]: of creation by weaving his own kind of chaotic discord into it and he kind of became the

[00:45:32] [SPEAKER_07]: big bad guy you know from the beginning of all these stories we've talked about it before

[00:45:36] [SPEAKER_07]: he ended up destroying the two lamps that lit the world and then he destroyed the two trees that

[00:45:41] [SPEAKER_07]: led them and the quote from the Silmarillion goes he forged for himself a great crown of iron

[00:45:47] [SPEAKER_07]: and called himself King of the world you see the Silmarils in his crown his hands were burned

[00:45:52] [SPEAKER_07]: black by the touch of those hellowed hellowed jewels and black they remained ever after nor was he

[00:45:58] [SPEAKER_07]: ever free from the pain of the burning in the anger of the pain that crown he never took from his head

[00:46:03] [SPEAKER_07]: though its weight became a deadly weariness and I just love that description that it was um

[00:46:09] [SPEAKER_07]: the kind of weight of his evil that sat on him and and affected him forever and that someone

[00:46:16] [SPEAKER_07]: that evil could not touch the Silmarils they're symbols of light without being burned and

[00:46:22] [SPEAKER_07]: yeah last week I talked about how beer and a luthion got one of the Silmarils back from the crown

[00:46:27] [SPEAKER_07]: and all that stuff um but yeah nothing in the writings about sour and reforging it but I do think

[00:46:32] [SPEAKER_07]: it fits the story really nicely because you took over as a sort of successor of more golf

[00:46:36] [SPEAKER_07]: he was his lieutenant and the idea that he literally then took the crown from him in terms of being

[00:46:42] [SPEAKER_07]: the big bad I thought was actually really cool and Galegra's reaction to it was quite amazing

[00:46:46] [SPEAKER_07]: I really thought yeah I agree very powerful yeah this awesome um and then she yeah he

[00:46:56] [SPEAKER_07]: basically she says you can't take you can't take a regular one with just one Legion and he kind

[00:47:00] [SPEAKER_07]: goes well I don't just have one Legion she can out and it reminded me a lot of the scene where

[00:47:11] [SPEAKER_07]: Sirenman and Wermtanger at the top of the tower and Wermtanger is really aware of the kind

[00:47:16] [SPEAKER_07]: of might I guess of Sirenman's army yet and then look out and they see that massive

[00:47:21] [SPEAKER_07]: plane just completely covered with these big legions of auks and he's there's that tear that

[00:47:27] [SPEAKER_07]: down his face because he's just struck by the power of the numbers there and it kind of

[00:47:32] [SPEAKER_07]: reminded me of that the Galegra was seeing au no we are really in trouble now and she's understanding

[00:47:38] [SPEAKER_07]: what that impact is going to have on a riggy on I thought it was really powerful yeah agree at a

[00:47:43] [SPEAKER_05]: very good callback to that scene in the trilogy love that it's really cool how you've just so recently

[00:47:51] [SPEAKER_05]: because you got a appreciative one oh I do and then I don't you know it's like because then I

[00:47:57] [SPEAKER_05]: started on the hobbit too um try because I'd never seen that before so I'm starting that journey as

[00:48:03] [SPEAKER_05]: well but then jumping into rings of power you know trying to be up to date on that but uh there's

[00:48:08] [SPEAKER_05]: so much to remember and there's a lot yeah so much to remember but you know just amazing yeah

[00:48:15] [SPEAKER_05]: so cool yeah I need to watch it again after all this is a group yeah definitely for sure yep

[00:48:24] [SPEAKER_07]: alright so I guess I guess we've got to talk about the main action what's happening what's

[00:48:29] [SPEAKER_07]: happening with the rags and what's happening in the forge yes let's do it oh my goodness

[00:48:35] [SPEAKER_07]: I just absolutely love the ongoing manipulation that Anata is doing here with with all of them

[00:48:42] [SPEAKER_07]: not just Calibre Mwia and his poor old mid-day near into it now as well and um I love how

[00:48:50] [SPEAKER_07]: he says Anata is his term Adania pray that he finishes this work before it finishes him and she

[00:48:57] [SPEAKER_07]: sort of trusts him to keep others away so again that classic narcissistic behavior that we've

[00:49:02] [SPEAKER_07]: talked about before where you first of all isolate your victim but then you also pull another

[00:49:08] [SPEAKER_07]: people to be your kind of um minions like yes and you're kind of the allies against your

[00:49:15] [SPEAKER_07]: victim so he's kind of poisoned her mind to think that Calibre Mwia is the one that's dark

[00:49:21] [SPEAKER_07]: and there's happened all these issues and even asks her to basically keep all of the

[00:49:26] [SPEAKER_07]: other smiths away from Calibre Mwia and and she falls for it and then you get that message so

[00:49:33] [SPEAKER_07]: they notice that the uh that nobody had been coming in and out of the city and so they sent

[00:49:38] [SPEAKER_07]: some people to go and see what was happening only one of them came back with this message cut into

[00:49:41] [SPEAKER_07]: his chest and at first I thought, why kind of smith read rooms it seems a bit weird that she would

[00:49:47] [SPEAKER_07]: not be able to read the message but I guess that it was in the black speech so um that's it but

[00:49:52] [SPEAKER_07]: I wanted to yeah yeah so that's probably why she she wouldn't know but you know again he's um

[00:50:00] [SPEAKER_07]: as Anata saron doesn't lie and it was the same with Calibre Mwia everything he says is actually

[00:50:05] [SPEAKER_07]: truth or the or a version of the truth and so he doesn't bother trying to make up something

[00:50:09] [SPEAKER_07]: that it says different he says the carving says where is he? um and the go Steve might drop

[00:50:15] [SPEAKER_07]: name at the episode and um yeah it's it's it's I'll say you know they take their take this body

[00:50:25] [SPEAKER_07]: away and then he basically says don't tell anybody about this but he's kept that seed in her mind

[00:50:30] [SPEAKER_07]: that where is he um she of course she doesn't know it means saron and she probably thinks

[00:50:36] [SPEAKER_07]: now that they're talking about somebody wanting Calibre Mwia I don't know what was going through

[00:50:39] [SPEAKER_05]: her mind at that point. I don't know either but I just I feel like Anataar saron however

[00:50:49] [SPEAKER_05]: we want her further him but in this right now he's Anataar it's like he doesn't even have to

[00:50:56] [SPEAKER_05]: hide really who he is anymore you know he when he first uh you know introduced himself as

[00:51:04] [SPEAKER_05]: Anataar is this Lord of Gifts he was in this all white and he was he just seemed very ethereal

[00:51:10] [SPEAKER_05]: and all knowing and wise and good right according you know from their perspective but now he's in

[00:51:18] [SPEAKER_05]: all this black and it's like he's not even really hiding who he is I feel like he is just so

[00:51:25] [SPEAKER_05]: under control that that and we see that so clear in this episode that he's so under control that

[00:51:32] [SPEAKER_05]: he's not worried because I was like why why wouldn't you guess that when it or why wouldn't you

[00:51:37] [SPEAKER_05]: think that if if this message it says where you know where is he well he's the newcomer to

[00:51:47] [SPEAKER_05]: Arigian you know why wouldn't you think but it's like he's not worried about that at all because

[00:51:51] [SPEAKER_05]: he has everyone so much under his control and manipulation that he's okay to translate that message

[00:51:59] [SPEAKER_05]: without being worried that someone might think it's him. Exactly. Again the classic narcissistic

[00:52:05] [SPEAKER_07]: behaviour is it's just not even worrying or caring what people think because you know that you're

[00:52:10] [SPEAKER_07]: the boss with your own charge and I feel like over the last several episodes we've seen

[00:52:15] [SPEAKER_07]: you know like you say he started out humble and even with his clothing he's sort of quite Jesus

[00:52:19] [SPEAKER_07]: like with those kind of robes and then he's slowly starting to sort of not weird power but

[00:52:27] [SPEAKER_07]: just sort of meant it when everyone to wear rather than caliber and bore being the boss and

[00:52:32] [SPEAKER_07]: him helping him he's over the last couple of episodes just started to take that power so for

[00:52:38] [SPEAKER_07]: example we saw that good cop bad cop. Last episode where he was sort of saying I don't

[00:52:43] [SPEAKER_07]: worry about caliber and bore you know he's under a lot of pressure and it's okay we're going

[00:52:47] [SPEAKER_07]: to be the team and we're going to all beat all of this kind of stuff so he started to take

[00:52:50] [SPEAKER_07]: over but really I did feel like this was the episode where he takes full power and you know visually

[00:52:57] [SPEAKER_07]: really evident in that costume change so he's not wearing his his pilgrimey type robes any more

[00:53:04] [SPEAKER_07]: he's got what looks like kind of battle arm or a kingly kind of arm he's got that the gold kind of

[00:53:08] [SPEAKER_07]: waste band and the black kind of feathered mantle that kind of goes over his shoulder was incredible

[00:53:14] [SPEAKER_07]: I thought that was really really cool beautiful and he's realizing that that a region is under

[00:53:23] [SPEAKER_07]: attacks and he sort of sees what's happening with the walks gathering and you see him up on

[00:53:29] [SPEAKER_07]: the top of that tower and he cuts his hand and I thought to myself what what is he doing oh

[00:53:34] [SPEAKER_07]: I wasn't sure at the time and then there's something that happens later that I think I realized

[00:53:37] [SPEAKER_07]: why he did it but at the time I was like what's he doing and again that trope of people

[00:53:42] [SPEAKER_07]: cutting their hand right across the palm where it's really uncomfortable that's gonna hell well

[00:53:47] [SPEAKER_07]: anyway he's a mine so I think he'll be good but yeah I think he'll be okay but I never understood

[00:53:52] [SPEAKER_07]: them like that's the worst place I think yeah that's not good and then caliberable here's the

[00:53:58] [SPEAKER_07]: siege alarm and he goes to go out and see what's happening and Anata tries to make him stay and they have

[00:54:03] [SPEAKER_07]: that altercation and caliber boy actually shops him and he says unhand me friend which was really cool

[00:54:11] [SPEAKER_07]: and then you see Anata go all quiet and kind of do a little bit of spooky woo woo breathing

[00:54:18] [SPEAKER_07]: and obviously he's casting the spell to make caliber and boy see you know this beautiful

[00:54:24] [SPEAKER_07]: sunny courtyard with happy smiling albs and birds chirping and everything's all okay

[00:54:29] [SPEAKER_07]: I thought that was amazing it was really really cool and then he basically convinces

[00:54:36] [SPEAKER_07]: once again we're in this we have to do it you've got to you've got to finish this job and he

[00:54:42] [SPEAKER_07]: gives him phay and was hammer and remember we saw phay and was hammer and the probably the very first

[00:54:49] [SPEAKER_07]: scene that we saw caliber and boy they can season one where he and Alron are talking kind of

[00:54:54] [SPEAKER_07]: than caliber and was office and you see it's there just under display on a stand and he's any

[00:55:06] [SPEAKER_07]: smile of of Mithril and I wonder hang on did he steal the Mithril because he went to

[00:55:14] [SPEAKER_07]: to cause a doom and they they wouldn't give it to him and part of me wonder whether he stole it

[00:55:20] [SPEAKER_07]: but then I thought actually is that vial actually has blood from when he cut his hand

[00:55:28] [SPEAKER_07]: and yes even just as blood in his mind it looked like Mithril or maybe he got a little bit of

[00:55:32] [SPEAKER_07]: enthused he's pretty clever he could have just snuck out and grabbed what he wanted from

[00:55:38] [SPEAKER_07]: from cousin doing when we're after that z-no I wouldn't think that would be challenging at all for him

[00:55:43] [SPEAKER_07]: so maybe he went and grabbed some Mithril powder that up and put a few drops of his blood into it

[00:55:51] [SPEAKER_07]: and infused it with his with his evil and then basically kind of let's part of his illusion

[00:55:57] [SPEAKER_07]: to caliber and more here he is just a Smithrel divided into nine parts equally and there go

[00:56:02] [SPEAKER_07]: your nine rings and for me that would really explain the power he has later over the kings of

[00:56:09] [SPEAKER_07]: men when he gives them these nine rings that's literally got his evil blood in it with the

[00:56:13] [SPEAKER_07]: dwarven rings he held the Mithril when he kind of put his power into it before he put it into the

[00:56:17] [SPEAKER_07]: forge but with this one I actually really do think it's his blood in there. I agree it's the only thing

[00:56:25] [SPEAKER_05]: that made sense for me when we see him cut his hand but we don't see anything after that and then

[00:56:31] [SPEAKER_05]: we see him hand the Mithril to kill a brim for I was like hmm dude where did you get that?

[00:56:39] [SPEAKER_05]: I was like you know maybe you could have stolen it but and maybe he did and like he said in

[00:56:43] [SPEAKER_05]: Fizzot or it's just he's seeing he's making kill a brim for C what he wants to see you know just

[00:56:49] [SPEAKER_05]: with the rest of the vision that everything is just fine you know in er and errogone so I do think

[00:56:59] [SPEAKER_05]: that there that it was not Mithril or if there was then there he hasn't fused it with his blood

[00:57:05] [SPEAKER_05]: because I was thinking the same thing that it would make perfect sense that why those nine rings for

[00:57:12] [SPEAKER_05]: men why he had that control over them why he was able to manipulate them to his will and why

[00:57:18] [SPEAKER_05]: he had such a strong hold on them so I hope that's where they're going with it.

[00:57:24] [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah I think so and I think also in this version of the story that we're seeing you know Anata had

[00:57:29] [SPEAKER_07]: quite a lot to do with the forging of the seventy he was literally there and he was holding

[00:57:33] [SPEAKER_07]: the Mithril and passing it in but I think he's he's gonna be a bit busy first of all continuing

[00:57:38] [SPEAKER_07]: that's vial over Calibre and Borsity he doesn't notice that there's a war going on around him

[00:57:42] [SPEAKER_07]: while he finishes the ring so I don't think he's gonna be his hands on literally his hands on

[00:57:46] [SPEAKER_07]: the nine as he was with the seventy so I think that he has to put something into it for then

[00:57:53] [SPEAKER_07]: Calibre water make them so that they still had the same level of power for him and I like that

[00:57:59] [SPEAKER_07]: though I have in this conversation standing right under the statue of Faye Norse you've got

[00:58:03] [SPEAKER_07]: Faye Norse standing there in the middle of the courtyard with the with the semeral

[00:58:08] [SPEAKER_07]: and he says to I just love this he says to Calibre and Borsity where the history of this age is

[00:58:14] [SPEAKER_07]: the semerals will mirror a little more than a whisper but your rings the rings of power they

[00:58:19] [SPEAKER_07]: will be deemed the most precious creations in all middle of the earth do not turn back now the very

[00:58:24] [SPEAKER_07]: moment your boots are kissing the threshold use it my friends best Faye Norse best to yourself

[00:58:31] [SPEAKER_07]: one last time and it was so much in there because first of all I think it's the first time that

[00:58:38] [SPEAKER_07]: we've seen him say precious and he's talking about the rings which was so for Colina was he paused

[00:58:43] [SPEAKER_05]: for the fans almost wanted to work to the camera did you did just the just the inflection I was like

[00:58:49] [SPEAKER_07]: dude you know just what you're doing yeah so great yeah they are the most precious creations

[00:58:56] [SPEAKER_07]: oh it was great it was so good it was really cool and then I also thought what he was saying about

[00:59:02] [SPEAKER_07]: the semerals was almost a little bit meta it was kind of like everybody knows one of the rings

[00:59:08] [SPEAKER_07]: but only those who know the deep law really understand the semerals of what they're about and I

[00:59:12] [SPEAKER_07]: thought that was actually true of our general knowledge you know everybody knows the Lord of the Rings

[00:59:16] [SPEAKER_07]: everybody knows the rings of power and he's really appealing to Calibre and Bors prize and vanity

[00:59:24] [SPEAKER_07]: to make these rings again he brings up Faye Norse you know Calibre and Bors always wanted to

[00:59:30] [SPEAKER_07]: make something that was singular and exceptional and to be just as grandest myth as Faye Norse so

[00:59:36] [SPEAKER_07]: again he's bringing that in and he's appealing to that vanity and he's sucking him in

[00:59:41] [SPEAKER_07]: as he says one last time and sorry Ruby but it is gonna be the last time

[00:59:50] [SPEAKER_07]: yes no spoilers on that anymore again so

[00:59:55] [SPEAKER_07]: but yeah so we have talked about Faye Norse a little bit before but I'll go into it again

[01:00:01] [SPEAKER_07]: now there's a little bit of more here for the background a friend who's not familiar with it

[01:00:08] [SPEAKER_07]: so he was the greatest of the Noldaw elves he had this great skill of word and hand

[01:00:13] [SPEAKER_07]: he was a craftsman a warrior he was a really a really incredible Smith and as we know his most

[01:00:20] [SPEAKER_07]: famous deed was the creation of the semerals and he took the light of the two trees he created

[01:00:25] [SPEAKER_07]: this incredible jewels that sort of diamond like jewels and they were crafted of this crystalline substance

[01:00:32] [SPEAKER_07]: which Faye Norse had devised you made it himself and they were named after it was with

[01:00:37] [SPEAKER_07]: so that's why they called the semerals and after he had made them he became really

[01:00:42] [SPEAKER_07]: really busy silver for them and a really greedy of them he didn't want anybody asked to have them

[01:00:46] [SPEAKER_07]: and when the trees were destroyed the bell I actually asked for the semerals back because

[01:00:51] [SPEAKER_07]: they were needed to restore the light the only way to restore the light of the trees was to take

[01:00:55] [SPEAKER_07]: what they had been kind of forged into the semerals but he refused to give them back

[01:01:01] [SPEAKER_07]: and then at that point Melcore stole them and that's when Faye Norse gave Melcore

[01:01:06] [SPEAKER_07]: the his new name Morgoth and then he made this terrible oath so it's the oath of Faye Norse

[01:01:13] [SPEAKER_07]: and the oath was that anyone who stood in his way from any race or for any reason

[01:01:18] [SPEAKER_07]: he would show no mercy to anybody that got on the way of him in the semerals or tried to take

[01:01:23] [SPEAKER_07]: the semerals or even touch the semerals that he wasn't happy with that he was going to kill

[01:01:29] [SPEAKER_07]: and he actually did several rounds of kin slaying so other elves opposed him

[01:01:33] [SPEAKER_07]: he went to get the bell out wishes and he followed Morgoth to mid-learth

[01:01:37] [SPEAKER_07]: and then because of this terrible oath that had taken

[01:01:41] [SPEAKER_07]: and the killing of his own people the bell out placed upon his line the the doom of

[01:01:47] [SPEAKER_07]: mandoss so it was basically a curse so cursed him and has descendants for even more

[01:01:52] [SPEAKER_07]: and I'm going to read this directly out of the semeralian because it is really really cool language

[01:01:58] [SPEAKER_07]: the bell asked you to him tears unnumbered you shall shed and the bell I will fence

[01:02:03] [SPEAKER_07]: Valle Norse against you and shut you out so that not even the echo of your lamentation shall

[01:02:08] [SPEAKER_07]: pass over the mountains on the house of Faye Norse the wrath of the bell I admire from the

[01:02:14] [SPEAKER_07]: West until the ashramosed east and upon all the will follow then it shall be laid also

[01:02:20] [SPEAKER_07]: their oath shall drive them and yet betray them and ever snatch away the very treasures

[01:02:24] [SPEAKER_07]: that they have sworn to pursue to evil end shall all things turn that they begin well and by

[01:02:30] [SPEAKER_07]: treason of kin unto kin in the fair of treason shall this come to pass the dispossessed shall

[01:02:35] [SPEAKER_07]: they be forever you have spelled the blood of your country unrightlessly and have stained the

[01:02:41] [SPEAKER_07]: land of aman for blood you shall render blood and beyond aman you shall dwell in death shadow

[01:02:47] [SPEAKER_07]: for though you're appointed to you not to die and no sickness may assail you yet slaying you may

[01:02:52] [SPEAKER_07]: and slaying you shall be by weapon and by torment and my grief your houseless spirits shall

[01:02:58] [SPEAKER_07]: then come to mandos their long shung ear by and yearn for your bodies and find little pity that

[01:03:04] [SPEAKER_07]: all whom you have slange it and treat for you and those that endure in mid-earth and come not to

[01:03:10] [SPEAKER_07]: mandos shall grow weary of the world as with a great burden and shall wane and to become it as

[01:03:15] [SPEAKER_07]: shadows of regret before the younger race that come after the bell I have spoken.

[01:03:23] [SPEAKER_07]: Cool and so powerful and this idea that they die but then they get re incarnated pretty much so

[01:03:29] [SPEAKER_07]: they go to the halls of mandos they get judged and then pretty much most of them get re incarnated

[01:03:34] [SPEAKER_07]: in a new body sometimes looks like they're old ones sometimes it's kind of new but they're

[01:03:39] [SPEAKER_07]: pretty much you know just keep getting re incarnated and so there's no such thing as true death

[01:03:44] [SPEAKER_07]: but the idea that for him and for his his kin because of all these awful deeds that they did

[01:03:50] [SPEAKER_07]: that they're going to be stuck in this purgatory yearning to be reincarnated yearning for their

[01:03:56] [SPEAKER_07]: bodies and even since the people that they've killed will say that's like hey let's give

[01:04:03] [SPEAKER_07]: them their bodies back we don't mind like that actually in treatment but it's still not going

[01:04:07] [SPEAKER_07]: to happen they're basically not going to get any pity and I just thought there was really really cool

[01:04:12] [SPEAKER_07]: and it's really cool and really says that calibre bore is the last of Faye Norse line so

[01:04:19] [SPEAKER_07]: it happened you know over these thousands of years since this curse all of them have come to

[01:04:26] [SPEAKER_07]: and not happy end and then you get calibre bore who's the last of the line trying to maintain or

[01:04:32] [SPEAKER_07]: recreate the glory of Faye Norse you know the good things that he did do and created the

[01:04:37] [SPEAKER_07]: stone rails before he kind of went off the rails and yet you know he's still going to fail

[01:04:45] [SPEAKER_07]: which is really sad it's moving that that performance from Charles Edwin it's just really

[01:04:50] [SPEAKER_07]: incredible to see him sliding into that descent of kind of just being taken over and being so

[01:04:57] [SPEAKER_07]: desperate and I think it's going to get even more in the next episode or two so sad yeah it is sad

[01:05:04] [SPEAKER_05]: it's been he's been doing so great in his performance and his how he has you can just see

[01:05:12] [SPEAKER_05]: that collapse of his mind as he just gets manipulated more and more and more by Annatar and

[01:05:22] [SPEAKER_05]: such a huge deal you know this scene where he forgets Rodania's name because you know just

[01:05:31] [SPEAKER_05]: I cannot remember the exact episode but you know air and deer earlier in the season said

[01:05:37] [SPEAKER_05]: elves memories never dim so it's like a really big deal like when she when her reaction she's like

[01:05:43] [SPEAKER_05]: you don't remember my name you don't know like acting like he didn't know who she was

[01:05:49] [SPEAKER_05]: it's such a huge deal because it's it's it was said earlier it's been I think mentioned multiple times

[01:05:55] [SPEAKER_05]: throughout lord of the rings that you know elves memory it's like flawless so while it might be

[01:06:03] [SPEAKER_05]: a little more for a human to forget you know when they're under stress or once you get older it's not

[01:06:09] [SPEAKER_05]: it's pretty much unheard of right in like elves like a killer grandpa so to you know to see that

[01:06:17] [SPEAKER_05]: was just like oh it just you know it's another gut punch you know it was a carnival wasn't

[01:06:23] [SPEAKER_07]: it and the the acting there from the actress who plays Medanian was amazing because she does not

[01:06:29] [SPEAKER_07]: horrify not just like slightly offended like you might have someone you know forgot your

[01:06:35] [SPEAKER_07]: name and a meeting was something like that it was just right not believe it and yeah I love that

[01:06:39] [SPEAKER_07]: they planted that seed earlier on with Adon de Asayna that the the memory of elves does not dim

[01:06:44] [SPEAKER_07]: and you know he's potentially worked with her and it looks like a small group you know this

[01:06:49] [SPEAKER_07]: sort of baby ten maybe maximum ten of them of these these really elite kind of Smiths

[01:06:53] [SPEAKER_07]: yeah he's potentially worked with them for hundreds if not maybe a thousand years and and he's

[01:06:59] [SPEAKER_07]: forgetting a name like it so it was really impactful and and then again annotars kind of twisting that

[01:07:07] [SPEAKER_07]: back to being you know look how much stress is under and we have to isolate him and he really has

[01:07:10] [SPEAKER_07]: to focus now on all of his stuff and again making it sound like it was his idea basically you know

[01:07:17] [SPEAKER_07]: he's asked that we that we keep it the body away and oh he was really heartbreaking yeah he's doing

[01:07:23] [SPEAKER_05]: such a good job in in sliding back and forth between like I'm your friend and you know all

[01:07:31] [SPEAKER_05]: of like making it like this is all their idea and not his manipulation and he just he's he's doing a

[01:07:38] [SPEAKER_07]: great job at the masterful wizard and yeah I actually love it I've seen a few interviews and you say

[01:07:44] [SPEAKER_07]: Charlie that can's being interviewed because he's just this like cheerful happy Aussie bloke

[01:07:50] [SPEAKER_07]: really like and he's and he's quite kind of like excited about it all the eager and like this

[01:07:56] [SPEAKER_07]: is really cool everything and then you see him you know these two really different portrayals

[01:08:00] [SPEAKER_07]: as a hellbrand and an attire where I do believe that he's being these planes such a different character

[01:08:08] [SPEAKER_07]: it's really incredible so I'm looking forward to seeing what other iterations we get of

[01:08:14] [SPEAKER_07]: Charlie as Salron because I think he's just got so much depth to him and yeah it's absolutely

[01:08:21] [SPEAKER_07]: stunning and I see lots of fun praise online for the Charlie's they call them so Charlie

[01:08:26] [SPEAKER_07]: for kids and the Charlie's so nice to get there a lot which is really cool and they play off

[01:08:32] [SPEAKER_07]: each other nicely and interviews too which is really cool I think they must have had a great time

[01:08:36] [SPEAKER_07]: shooting this together but yeah absolutely amazing and then you know he's busy telling

[01:08:44] [SPEAKER_07]: him that he has to do this thing one last time and then he sends calibre and ball back into the

[01:08:49] [SPEAKER_07]: forge the doors closed and then the day turns back into night and that scene was incredible

[01:08:58] [SPEAKER_07]: and we'd seen in the train of a four unitar walking through this kind of chaotic dark

[01:09:03] [SPEAKER_07]: courtyard all of these people running around but to see it transition from one to the other was

[01:09:09] [SPEAKER_07]: amazing and they actually showed some of that in the behind the episode and I was super impressed

[01:09:16] [SPEAKER_07]: it they actually filmed that in camera with lighting I thought it was digital but when you go

[01:09:20] [SPEAKER_07]: back and see it they actually have one camera and they had the lighting and daylighting and then

[01:09:25] [SPEAKER_07]: the camera just kind of paned around and followed him and then you can see the lights come down

[01:09:30] [SPEAKER_07]: and then the you know elf the panicking elf extras running past I was all done in one shot it was

[01:09:36] [SPEAKER_05]: incredible it was incredibly shot I thought it was just beautifully done like I said they're doing

[01:09:43] [SPEAKER_05]: such an amazing job with the camera works cinematography really bringing to life this world and

[01:09:51] [SPEAKER_07]: I thought that was beautifully done yeah it was just gorgeous and and then he goes to the top of

[01:09:58] [SPEAKER_07]: tower again and he sees the you know the chaos it's about to ensue and he just slowly raises his arms

[01:10:07] [SPEAKER_07]: I thought that was really powerful and then again in the behind the episode B.M.A.C.R.E the composer

[01:10:15] [SPEAKER_07]: had this really cool description of that you see it's basically like he's conducting an orchestra

[01:10:20] [SPEAKER_07]: and this was an idea from one of the showrunners was what if he lived his arms and he's actually

[01:10:26] [SPEAKER_07]: literally conducting a orchestra because he's he's made everything happen that's happening right now

[01:10:31] [SPEAKER_07]: he's moved all the pieces around he he's basically running the show so what they did is they

[01:10:37] [SPEAKER_07]: for the soundtrack for that part they actually played over the the weeks of recording they recorded

[01:10:45] [SPEAKER_07]: every time the orchestra tuned up and so this is what you hear when he's starting to raise his arms

[01:10:51] [SPEAKER_07]: using this hearing is really discordant music of all these different instruments playing different

[01:10:56] [SPEAKER_07]: times and different out of key and different and it builds up and builds up until it comes into harmony

[01:11:01] [SPEAKER_07]: when his arms finally reached the top I thought that was so beautifully done it's so bold yeah it's just

[01:11:07] [SPEAKER_07]: like the sound of it and I read back and listen to it a couple of times after I had heard that into

[01:11:12] [SPEAKER_07]: you and it's really symbolic of him planning everything bringing all the players together

[01:11:19] [SPEAKER_07]: and I also love the deeper symbolism there that Salron's whole mission is to bring order out of chaos

[01:11:27] [SPEAKER_07]: so more go through the whole thing was chaos he just wanted to break the world

[01:11:32] [SPEAKER_07]: whereas Salron wants order he thinks he's doing the right thing he thinks he's the good guy

[01:11:37] [SPEAKER_07]: and he wants to bring order out of chaos and the idea that he's orchestrating all of these people

[01:11:42] [SPEAKER_07]: and all these events bringing it into harmony and standing there sort of full of power of the

[01:11:48] [SPEAKER_07]: fact that he's doing that thought was so incredible loved it that's brilliant honestly and

[01:11:56] [SPEAKER_05]: makes so much sense and Kudos to bear McCurray I mean we've you know I know he's been a part of

[01:12:02] [SPEAKER_05]: so many projects but I think we know him really well just from the walking dead and the amazing

[01:12:08] [SPEAKER_05]: things that he did there and it's just I love seeing that he's a part of the show because he's just

[01:12:13] [SPEAKER_05]: really brilliant now I need to go back and rewatch that and just really listen yeah it's really

[01:12:20] [SPEAKER_07]: beautifully done and then after after I saw that interview I also downloaded the soundtrack from

[01:12:27] [SPEAKER_07]: season 2 as well so you can get all of the score and it's amazing there's a song that we're going

[01:12:34] [SPEAKER_07]: to hear I think at the end of the next episode that's on that soundtrack and it's some it's

[01:12:43] [SPEAKER_07]: like it's like a death-emotional song it's really great not what you'd expect you know to

[01:12:50] [SPEAKER_07]: think about it's really cool and then there's also heaps of other stuff almost like a bit

[01:12:57] [SPEAKER_07]: sporinary in terms of the title tracks of the of the of the songs or of the tracks as we get

[01:13:02] [SPEAKER_07]: towards the end of the season and the episodes that we haven't seen yet there's some titles of

[01:13:06] [SPEAKER_07]: the tracks there that you're like oh okay that's gonna happen all that's gonna happen so

[01:13:10] [SPEAKER_07]: you want to be completely unsquiled it maybe don't but yeah I don't think it gives too much

[01:13:14] [SPEAKER_07]: away if you know a little bit about the story or what we're expecting as well so yeah that was

[01:13:20] [SPEAKER_07]: that was super cool and and then the the other part I guess of that is that we haven't

[01:13:27] [SPEAKER_07]: touched on is what happens and and because I do which again there's so much else happening

[01:13:34] [SPEAKER_07]: that I had to remind myself yes still stuff is going on there yeah what did you what did

[01:13:39] [SPEAKER_07]: you think of that whole sequence because it's a couple of times I know the

[01:13:42] [SPEAKER_07]: seep is so did jump around quite a little bit you know you're going for one to the other but

[01:13:46] [SPEAKER_07]: we did visit and cousin do you know a couple of times what do you think of everything that's

[01:13:49] [SPEAKER_05]: going on there I love the story line with the dwarves and cousin doom I think it's been a really

[01:13:56] [SPEAKER_05]: strong storyline throughout season two so I love anytime we get to visit what's going on there

[01:14:03] [SPEAKER_05]: although I mean it's it's heartbreaking though to see King D'Ren really succumb to the ring

[01:14:10] [SPEAKER_05]: and even more so in this episode where you just really like they're just dumping these piles of

[01:14:16] [SPEAKER_05]: like gold because they're just he's got this ring now and it's it's a super secret finder for all

[01:14:23] [SPEAKER_05]: the all the things that they need and you know so he's like dig here dig here dig here we're going

[01:14:28] [SPEAKER_05]: to keep going further and further than what we've ever ever been to get to all these riches

[01:14:35] [SPEAKER_05]: and you just see all this gold just surrounding like his throne room and when when oh so hard

[01:14:44] [SPEAKER_05]: because you know during his son is like really excited to see him turn so on down and at our

[01:14:51] [SPEAKER_05]: down like you know no no me thrill for you and he's like well thank goodness I really thought

[01:14:58] [SPEAKER_05]: you know that ring was really manipulating you and it was for the bad and he's like you know

[01:15:04] [SPEAKER_05]: well they're going to come crawling back they're going to need it and then we can ask in any

[01:15:09] [SPEAKER_05]: price we want and it was like no it was just so heartbreaking and to see I felt like the dwarves

[01:15:16] [SPEAKER_05]: Lans had so much heart I really really love Prince Doran and you see that in this episode how

[01:15:23] [SPEAKER_05]: torn he is the love for his father but yet you know like when he's talking with Disa

[01:15:32] [SPEAKER_05]: that something has to be done like it's it's getting ready to get really really bad for

[01:15:39] [SPEAKER_05]: the dwarves that live there so I I love Disa I think she is amazing such a strong beautiful

[01:15:45] [SPEAKER_05]: character the baths took me out just a little bit but I'm like you know I can it doesn't

[01:15:54] [SPEAKER_05]: doesn't like you know ruin anything form get up just kind of like okay but otherwise I thought

[01:16:01] [SPEAKER_05]: a really strong you know some scenes that we got there from Cousin Doom yeah it was really well

[01:16:10] [SPEAKER_07]: and the acting is just incredible you know all of them but I particularly loved a Wayne Arthur

[01:16:15] [SPEAKER_07]: playing young Prince Doran in this in these few scenes because just to look on his face that

[01:16:21] [SPEAKER_07]: pure relief when he felt okay it's great you're not going to give him the me through and then

[01:16:26] [SPEAKER_07]: there the realization dawning on his face that that his father is you know fully under the spell

[01:16:33] [SPEAKER_07]: he's still going to expand his dig he's still going to you know exact any price that he wants

[01:16:39] [SPEAKER_07]: from Anata in the Alves for getting the me through and you know Pini's talked about this one

[01:16:45] [SPEAKER_07]: lot before in the podcast that seeing his father like this is sort of like seeing a parent

[01:16:51] [SPEAKER_07]: losing their cognition you know whether it's to to disease or to old age or you know kind of

[01:16:56] [SPEAKER_07]: degenerative kind of you know issue it's like an endurance here the last episode I you know I can still see

[01:17:05] [SPEAKER_07]: part of him and it's it's really heartbreaking and I also think it's a really good kind

[01:17:11] [SPEAKER_07]: of mirror of having someone that you love in addiction because he's completely bound to this he can't

[01:17:17] [SPEAKER_07]: see anything that's wrong and he's fine with it all and even to the point of durin trying to

[01:17:22] [SPEAKER_07]: literally take the the ring off his hand you know that's really common in people who have dealt

[01:17:28] [SPEAKER_07]: with that with someone that their love is is trying to remove the cause kind of thing which

[01:17:32] [SPEAKER_07]: is not always the best option in the moment but you can definitely say why he did that and

[01:17:38] [SPEAKER_07]: then he just gets thrown across the road which is just horrible so hard to watch it just heartbreaking

[01:17:44] [SPEAKER_05]: for for durin to yeah like I said there's you can see the deterioration and he I think he

[01:17:52] [SPEAKER_05]: feels so powerless and I can't imagine what that was what that was like for him in that moment

[01:17:58] [SPEAKER_07]: yeah and the and there's a moment where King Durin says I will not give it to you it's mine

[01:18:05] [SPEAKER_07]: it belongs to me and the way you see it so like no go it was literally the same words I thought

[01:18:11] [SPEAKER_07]: that was so clever and so well done even his facial expressions looked a little bit above

[01:18:17] [SPEAKER_07]: in that moment when he said yeah just follow focus just like looking at it no it's mine it's my

[01:18:27] [SPEAKER_07]: belong to it oh it was and the music in behind that was incredible too um it's sort of this

[01:18:36] [SPEAKER_07]: slowly building strings and these really high there's really kind of high pitched horns I think

[01:18:40] [SPEAKER_07]: they use and it's basically the ring music so whenever you see and the Lord of the Rings trilogy

[01:18:47] [SPEAKER_07]: when you see the one ring or you see someone talking about the one ring there's this really high

[01:18:52] [SPEAKER_07]: pitched kind of extended notes um that we associate now with kind of the ring music and they

[01:18:58] [SPEAKER_07]: play that so I know it's a dwarven ring and not the one ring that they had that same kind of emotional

[01:19:03] [SPEAKER_07]: tether that you have when you're thinking about the ring which was beautifully done again

[01:19:07] [SPEAKER_07]: that was incredible and you've got D-Sert and Durin's you know staying true to each other they're

[01:19:13] [SPEAKER_07]: just such this great team and they call off the call off of the bats yeah I was a little taken

[01:19:19] [SPEAKER_07]: as well as kind of like wait what bats why bats and did we know that she had the bat power

[01:19:25] [SPEAKER_07]: and how many bats has she got in stock for one of the different doors that are going to join

[01:19:30] [SPEAKER_05]: mine in each different area yeah again it seemed a little odd that I mean they live in a mountain

[01:19:39] [SPEAKER_05]: and in these caves they're probably encounter bats quite often when they're doing their digs or

[01:19:45] [SPEAKER_05]: they really be scared of the bat so I don't know it's whatever it's fine it was cool to see D-Sert

[01:19:51] [SPEAKER_05]: um like exercise her power I think yeah it's always a really cool thing yeah so I'm like oh

[01:19:56] [SPEAKER_07]: absolutely yeah oh sorry you're definitely done absolutely love it and then there's that moment

[01:20:04] [SPEAKER_07]: as well we're um he just looks over at her and says I love you and she says love me later

[01:20:10] [SPEAKER_05]: that's like that is so great I love them so much I think they're just absolutely adorable

[01:20:18] [SPEAKER_07]: and sweet loving couple for sure so great together loved it um yeah and then the only other bit

[01:20:26] [SPEAKER_07]: that I thought was quite sort of stuck out to me there was when um durin's is no to amateur

[01:20:37] [SPEAKER_07]: and then unattain looks over at the firebraze you and then the bell rock pops out rock

[01:20:43] [SPEAKER_07]: I wasn't sure like I was I could have taken that two ways one could be that he got a flash of

[01:20:51] [SPEAKER_07]: the fact that there's a bell rock there and it was just kind of foreshadowing and like oh well you

[01:20:55] [SPEAKER_07]: got that stuff coming to you or was it kind of like a threat like okay well that's fine if you want

[01:21:01] [SPEAKER_07]: to do this I can control everything that's dark around here and I can bring this on you because

[01:21:05] [SPEAKER_07]: I didn't I didn't seem that the durin's noticed it at all it was really just unattain looking

[01:21:11] [SPEAKER_07]: over and seeing it what what did you think of the bell rock in the flame there well first I was just

[01:21:15] [SPEAKER_05]: like oh my gosh um you know kind of a fan moment and then once I come down I wasn't sure

[01:21:24] [SPEAKER_05]: either was it for shadowing that he got the glimpse that it's there because I think he he knew

[01:21:31] [SPEAKER_05]: like they're just they're just digging and digging and digging and eventually they're going to get

[01:21:37] [SPEAKER_05]: to a place that they've never been before and they're gonna get so deep that it's the the bell

[01:21:43] [SPEAKER_05]: rock's going to to come out or if he's kind of wishing it upon them like okay you don't want

[01:21:51] [SPEAKER_05]: to work with me well here you go I'm going to write you know reach out to this this creature to

[01:21:59] [SPEAKER_05]: you know come out so is he instigating it or is he just going to leave them to their

[01:22:06] [SPEAKER_05]: doomed knowing that it's coming I wasn't sure either I wasn't sure how to take it but

[01:22:12] [SPEAKER_05]: either way just very threatening and very sad knowing that yeah what's to come and again you you will get

[01:22:19] [SPEAKER_07]: those um those um absolutely kind of law stickless who are gonna say it's true really that's not

[01:22:25] [SPEAKER_07]: to happen yet until later but I mean I think it's gonna work with the they are of the story that

[01:22:30] [SPEAKER_07]: we are definitely going to see some bowel robaction and that's that's where they're going to go with

[01:22:34] [SPEAKER_07]: it and I'm fine because I'm I'm not too bothered by timelines when you get to see a bowel rock

[01:22:39] [SPEAKER_05]: on screen you absolutely and you know I I am definitely not an expert in the lore or anything else

[01:22:46] [SPEAKER_05]: you know I'm not read um uh the books or any of the source material but I've tried to do a little bit of

[01:22:54] [SPEAKER_05]: because I am fascinated by this world and the characters and I want to learn the history of

[01:23:00] [SPEAKER_05]: the people and the locations and everyone that has an impact or a part in the story and you know

[01:23:06] [SPEAKER_05]: hearing um you know some folks say that um I guess in the books the the siege of a rigion is like

[01:23:14] [SPEAKER_05]: decades and decades well we we can't watch decades and decades of a siege on a TV show you know

[01:23:23] [SPEAKER_05]: it it makes sense that some things you have to kind of push forward and condense the story lines again

[01:23:31] [SPEAKER_05]: so I you know and of course I've come from this point of view from like house of the dragon

[01:23:38] [SPEAKER_05]: and having read the books and you know I have my gripes about things and I that's why I'm like

[01:23:43] [SPEAKER_05]: I'm really glad I maybe don't have that knowledge that I can't pick apart any of this and I'm

[01:23:48] [SPEAKER_05]: free to just enjoy the show without having that knowledge sometimes there's a a little bit of freedom

[01:23:56] [SPEAKER_05]: that comes with that so I totally get ways to and I think we our roles are reversed because

[01:24:01] [SPEAKER_07]: I've really enjoyed the coverage of half of the dragon and I haven't read any of the books and um

[01:24:07] [SPEAKER_07]: I always listen to the spoiler section which talks about how similar they are to the books but I

[01:24:12] [SPEAKER_07]: never listen to the what might happen next section because I do what I remember and I know

[01:24:18] [SPEAKER_07]: that feeling I've just been able to let the show watch over you and really enjoy it for what it is and

[01:24:23] [SPEAKER_07]: I think you're talking about some of the things with George R.R. Martin books where

[01:24:27] [SPEAKER_07]: the timelines are going to be really different as well obviously not quite as confused as we're

[01:24:31] [SPEAKER_07]: seeing here but you know and this show when you've got some of these through lines with

[01:24:36] [SPEAKER_07]: mortal characters I know the nomenorians and the dwarves live for a couple hundred years so it took

[01:24:41] [SPEAKER_07]: a bit more extended than we used to but we are not going to have that luxury of seeing for example

[01:24:46] [SPEAKER_07]: the you know anatau was in a riggy on for 500 years making the ring so I'm just trying to

[01:24:52] [SPEAKER_05]: remember yeah we're not going to have a however many season show and be able to put that in there

[01:24:58] [SPEAKER_05]: so you have to accelerate some things so I get it I understand feelings about things like that but

[01:25:06] [SPEAKER_05]: you know for for these purposes it makes sense yeah so the only one real question that I have

[01:25:17] [SPEAKER_07]: sort of plot wise was to galatry of noise that souran is an riggy on because at our told him so basically

[01:25:24] [SPEAKER_07]: Halburn goes you know he handed himself an early in the in the season told a dad that there's this

[01:25:30] [SPEAKER_07]: sorcerer there and then a riggy on making you know helping the elves do all this stuff but

[01:25:39] [SPEAKER_07]: and then he obviously tells galatry but then does he say about the other rings I couldn't

[01:25:47] [SPEAKER_07]: remember whether like how does galatry will know about the the rings for dwarves and the rings

[01:25:53] [SPEAKER_07]: from then or does he just know that he's there making mischief and doing more stuff you know because

[01:25:57] [SPEAKER_07]: I never really talked about further rings when they're making the three with Halburn so I wasn't

[01:26:04] [SPEAKER_07]: quite clear that I might have to go back and do a rewatch if anyone else picked that up yeah please

[01:26:09] [SPEAKER_07]: just write it in an asno but I wasn't clear that she knew for sure that there were more

[01:26:14] [SPEAKER_07]: rings being made or whether it was just that she knew he was there um creating mischief and

[01:26:19] [SPEAKER_07]: and messing with caliber and war um did you pick up on anything like that? No I and it's it's weird

[01:26:26] [SPEAKER_05]: because we've got the audience perspective right like we know what's going on but we forget like oh well

[01:26:32] [SPEAKER_05]: that character doesn't know how would they know um I don't think that they know anything about

[01:26:37] [SPEAKER_05]: what's going on because soren kept taking out all the messengers between you know lindor or

[01:26:45] [SPEAKER_05]: yeah you know erry gion so they they don't know anything that's going on there I mean I think she

[01:26:52] [SPEAKER_05]: obviously knows that if he's there then it means bad but I don't think she has any knowledge

[01:26:57] [SPEAKER_05]: I don't recall anyway um of her having any knowledge of any other rings outside of the three

[01:27:03] [SPEAKER_07]: that were made and caliber and more had even seen because his messages were getting through

[01:27:08] [SPEAKER_07]: that was one way messages were allowed um his messages were getting through to say they had shut down

[01:27:12] [SPEAKER_07]: the forge and they had stopped everything right so yeah um I'm not sure if that's an

[01:27:22] [SPEAKER_07]: accepting that we know about it and so therefore you know you've got to have the next actions

[01:27:26] [SPEAKER_07]: stepping up um yeah it's just a good excuse to have to watch the whole thing again absolutely

[01:27:34] [SPEAKER_07]: awesome well that's on my main point so have you got anything else or any notes?

[01:27:40] [SPEAKER_05]: Just a couple of callouts not really notes but just um I think interesting things that I saw

[01:27:45] [SPEAKER_05]: we talked about the ballerog and then the word precious being thrown around a couple of times

[01:27:52] [SPEAKER_05]: you mentioned earlier when killing brim bores and told Anatar unhand me friend I thought that was

[01:27:59] [SPEAKER_05]: a nice little turn of words when you think of um I don't know I don't want to say for sure in

[01:28:05] [SPEAKER_05]: case it's spoilery but like and something that happens to soar on later um during the trilogy I was like

[01:28:13] [SPEAKER_05]: hmm that's interesting um turn of turn of words there turn of phrase and that he says to him

[01:28:20] [SPEAKER_05]: and then again I'm learning I'm learning and I'm new to so much in this world

[01:28:26] [SPEAKER_05]: so this might be something that um for everyone with the knowledge is like yeah that a duh of course

[01:28:33] [SPEAKER_05]: but something I just noticed from it was either this episode or last episode was

[01:28:41] [SPEAKER_05]: in Numanore like where the throne room area is and they have that area I guess where the eagle

[01:28:48] [SPEAKER_05]: had come in there is a very large white tree that this whole architecture and that tree is

[01:28:57] [SPEAKER_05]: very reminiscent of Gondor which it took me a hot minute to put two and two together like I said

[01:29:02] [SPEAKER_05]: still there ain't so much about all the connections and such but I just I found that really

[01:29:10] [SPEAKER_05]: really cool so I'm guessing that they have found a way to take seedlings or something from Numanore

[01:29:16] [SPEAKER_05]: it got to Gondor maybe that's spoilery but I just I couldn't help but like it I don't know

[01:29:21] [SPEAKER_05]: just clicked with me um sometimes I'm so into the weeds of things it takes me a minute for things to

[01:29:27] [SPEAKER_05]: click but I just thought that was really cool for me yeah it's beautiful and it's voice

[01:29:33] [SPEAKER_07]: it's always about the trees you know these trees are really symbolic and um and we do see them

[01:29:38] [SPEAKER_07]: in the through kind of story um and we mentioned last week about the the island you know see

[01:29:44] [SPEAKER_07]: which is where this beautiful white tree first um was grown and a seedling from that tree

[01:29:50] [SPEAKER_07]: was then brought to Numanore and created this tree there that we see and then yes a seedling from

[01:29:55] [SPEAKER_07]: that tree does end up getting saved and taken to Middle-Earth and the white tree of Gondor

[01:30:02] [SPEAKER_07]: is a direct descendant from that I won't go into who does it because it's a bit swernery but yeah

[01:30:06] [SPEAKER_07]: that's going to happen and I hope that we do get to see that happen too because it's really cool

[01:30:10] [SPEAKER_05]: I love that okay yeah it took me a minute to like connect the dots I think I think the rewatch

[01:30:17] [SPEAKER_05]: helped me a lot like okay okay it was bringing all those those things kind of back so I've kind

[01:30:23] [SPEAKER_05]: of had that in my you know imagery in my head and then seeing Numanore and I'm like wow look at how

[01:30:29] [SPEAKER_05]: much is so like similar between the two and then the tree just really kind of brought it

[01:30:35] [SPEAKER_07]: yeah more me so beautiful yeah so we're just cool the only other note that I had was of course

[01:30:44] [SPEAKER_07]: our beautiful art on deer at the very start of the episode yes I think it was really cool because

[01:30:51] [SPEAKER_07]: we get to see him obviously he's going to be ending up at a regular and be part of the fighting

[01:30:57] [SPEAKER_07]: so we kind of have to see how he got how he got there and this was just a nice little way of doing

[01:31:01] [SPEAKER_07]: fighting these walks killing them fighting in there and going okay cool Elizabethja of Marigion let's

[01:31:06] [SPEAKER_07]: head down there and I also kind of thought they they're pretty sure that we're gonna riot if

[01:31:13] [SPEAKER_07]: we don't get Eastmar Cruz Cordovant to episodes in a row so we have a love at Arondia has to be on

[01:31:20] [SPEAKER_07]: screen at least once in this two episodes and that's beautiful people are a little earth I'm telling

[01:31:28] [SPEAKER_07]: you so gorgeous and the way he takes out those walks his fighting style is so beautiful I love how

[01:31:34] [SPEAKER_07]: he always does the little turns and spins and then he kind of kills that one without even looking

[01:31:39] [SPEAKER_07]: behind him and then the sword goes straight back into the scaven and oh just beautiful I mean it

[01:31:45] [SPEAKER_07]: wasn't very long but you know you do have to go back and watch a few times just to make sure he

[01:31:49] [SPEAKER_05]: didn't miss any detail for sure on that yeah it didn't it didn't bother me to go to watch

[01:31:53] [SPEAKER_07]: a couple of times at all so well done beautiful love love love love it brilliant okay great well

[01:32:02] [SPEAKER_07]: I think what we do is we'll take a quick break and we're gonna come back for some news and some

[01:32:06] [SPEAKER_07]: feedback so stay with us and we're back and we've just got one news article this week but

[01:32:38] [SPEAKER_07]: it's a fairly long one I really wanted to literally dive into the scene with Mediels C trial

[01:32:45] [SPEAKER_07]: so we have an article here from emission.com sent the adio Robinson breaks down Mediels C trial

[01:32:53] [SPEAKER_07]: and the Lord of the Rings the Rings of power on the island of Nomenal season two of the Lord of

[01:32:58] [SPEAKER_07]: the Rings the Rings of power has been one long test of the inhabitants faith in the elves

[01:33:02] [SPEAKER_07]: in the divine vala some like you can ask out as on Tristan Gravel and his slimy son Kevin Leon

[01:33:09] [SPEAKER_07]: bottom a failing spectacularly even going so far to disagree the oldest vala shrine in Nomenal

[01:33:14] [SPEAKER_07]: a small few like former queen Tom Adiel sent the adio Robinson and former C guard captain

[01:33:21] [SPEAKER_07]: Elendale Lloyd Owen helped strong to their beliefs that steadfastness has landed them in hot water

[01:33:27] [SPEAKER_07]: with Elendale and prison and poised to be executed however an episode six

[01:33:32] [SPEAKER_07]: thought as on and has crony lord Belzaga to side that Elendale can undergo trial by a best

[01:33:37] [SPEAKER_07]: as a customary for the ways of the vala the C trial is still as good as a death sentence

[01:33:42] [SPEAKER_07]: there's likely no coming back from it and Elendale knows it if he dies far as on wreaks not only

[01:33:48] [SPEAKER_07]: the reward of wiping one of his detractors off the board but also gets to further discredit the

[01:33:52] [SPEAKER_07]: vala by saying that they're vanned at their followers in time of need.

[01:33:56] [SPEAKER_07]: Bloodfatters on couldn't predict was Emediall would volunteer herself in Elendale's place

[01:34:01] [SPEAKER_07]: it's a massive moment for Emediall and a team to take back some control after being at her lowest

[01:34:05] [SPEAKER_07]: point all season long. There was definitely an excitement of getting to put her in a position where

[01:34:11] [SPEAKER_07]: it was going to be that show of strength at Irohenson told Mashable for Medial there's also another

[01:34:16] [SPEAKER_07]: layer to a choice that of sacrificing herself for Elendale the decision marks a new turning point in

[01:34:21] [SPEAKER_07]: their relationship which initially started as a perfunctory leader and subject dynamic before

[01:34:26] [SPEAKER_07]: evolving into something greater the two are bound by their shared faith in love with a new manor now

[01:34:31] [SPEAKER_07]: the two are each others greatest allies. It's obviously a deep love there at Irohenson said

[01:34:36] [SPEAKER_07]: there's a lovely moment during a conversation after the debacle of the coronation in the

[01:34:40] [SPEAKER_07]: episode three where she puts her hand on Elendale's chest it shifts the dynamic because that's

[01:34:45] [SPEAKER_07]: not a leader subject just a train sends the romantic it's really more about respect and admiration

[01:34:50] [SPEAKER_07]: and care and love between them that doesn't necessarily lend itself to a label and Irohenson added

[01:34:56] [SPEAKER_07]: I love that there is room for interpretation for the audience if this should think we're all about it

[01:35:02] [SPEAKER_07]: that deep connection to Elendale is what pushes Medial to take on the trial of the

[01:35:06] [SPEAKER_07]: abyss of course is some doubt in her mind as she enters the water but at Irohenson believes

[01:35:11] [SPEAKER_07]: the serenity of Medial's decision at ways the very human look out of doubt if it is a

[01:35:16] [SPEAKER_07]: sacrifice for the greater good it's a sacrifice for her people if it is a sacrifice for Elendale

[01:35:21] [SPEAKER_07]: then it is a sacrifice worth making at Irohenson said the article goes on the rings of power

[01:35:30] [SPEAKER_05]: shot the lead up to Maryow's trial on location in 10 or if 10 or if I'm pronouncing that correctly

[01:35:38] [SPEAKER_05]: months before at Irohenson filmed the underwater portion of the scene in a tank at Pinewood Studios

[01:35:45] [SPEAKER_05]: under careful supervision from a dedicated water safety team this tank work held some fascinating

[01:35:51] [SPEAKER_05]: parallels to Maryow's predicament just like a nervous Maryow had to believe that the Volar would

[01:35:57] [SPEAKER_05]: see her through that Irohenson tempered her own worries about the scene with her faith in the people

[01:36:02] [SPEAKER_05]: overseeing her I was absolutely terrified to be underwater it's not my comfort zone at Irohenson

[01:36:08] [SPEAKER_05]: explained you spend a long day in the water and it's draining psychologically as is the case

[01:36:13] [SPEAKER_05]: with things that we have deep fear around and a lot of ways you're facing your own mortality

[01:36:18] [SPEAKER_05]: every minute I was down there I had the panic response of I'm going to drown I need to come up

[01:36:24] [SPEAKER_05]: so settling my mind and trusting people was to me the real exercise in the end both at Irohenson

[01:36:30] [SPEAKER_05]: and Maryow made it through the trial by a bus the resulting scene is one of the rings of powers

[01:36:36] [SPEAKER_05]: most gripping as Maryow faces down a massive sea monster that would leave any hero

[01:36:41] [SPEAKER_07]: quaking in their boots that's fantastic isn't it and I love like what you were saying before

[01:36:49] [SPEAKER_07]: no one is looking so awesome on screen and I think there are times where obviously was

[01:36:57] [SPEAKER_07]: upset that the rings of power move from New Zealand to the UK but I can also understand

[01:37:02] [SPEAKER_07]: the reasoning behind a lot of it particularly when you're looking at a cast who is going to

[01:37:06] [SPEAKER_07]: have to be involved with this show for eight years or ten years you know eight months at a time

[01:37:10] [SPEAKER_07]: you've recovered a year's quite a lot to be you know that far away

[01:37:16] [SPEAKER_07]: there's times where I thought that it's just not going to look the same and you really need

[01:37:19] [SPEAKER_07]: New Zealand with New Minor it's all on set anyway and so the actual city itself is not going

[01:37:26] [SPEAKER_07]: to be any different and I thought this was a place where they were at head access to this kind of

[01:37:31] [SPEAKER_07]: incredible you know cliff edge in this beautiful kind of cove that they had there that just

[01:37:37] [SPEAKER_07]: looked amazing and it fits really well with this story and I thought it was just beautifully

[01:37:42] [SPEAKER_07]: done and the way that they blended that with the work that they did in the tank was incredible

[01:37:47] [SPEAKER_07]: it was one of those scenes where I wish I hadn't seen the trailer like penny and I

[01:37:52] [SPEAKER_07]: saw a trailer breakdown you know before the season starts and so we kind of get excited and all this

[01:37:57] [SPEAKER_07]: stuff but there's been a few moments throughout where I kind of got a wish I hadn't seen that because

[01:38:01] [SPEAKER_07]: it was so beautiful but that figure of Medial and the water with the sea when coming up to her

[01:38:08] [SPEAKER_07]: was just gorgeous and yeah it was it was it was worth the wait I knew that it was coming but

[01:38:15] [SPEAKER_05]: yeah it was so beautiful to see really loved it yeah and you certainly couldn't tell that she was

[01:38:20] [SPEAKER_05]: actually like nervous to do that you know she was talking about being out of her cumbersome

[01:38:25] [SPEAKER_05]: and being worried about like I'm going to drown I need to get back up I can only imagine I'm not

[01:38:31] [SPEAKER_05]: I don't love water you know and I can you know have have that fear as well so I totally

[01:38:36] [SPEAKER_05]: understand where she's coming from so you that that really shows that she was able to get to a place

[01:38:43] [SPEAKER_05]: you know because you can't read that on her face it all she looks so peaceful and serene despite

[01:38:48] [SPEAKER_05]: this giant worm see worm being in front of her. It was incredible so it was you know I love

[01:38:54] [SPEAKER_07]: that the actress uses the same word that you did this serenity and I think that's obviously

[01:38:58] [SPEAKER_07]: what's driving her kind of performance it's really maintaining that serenity throughout and I

[01:39:03] [SPEAKER_07]: want else is happening and yeah absolutely beautiful that was great all right so we got

[01:39:11] [SPEAKER_07]: some list of feedback this week would you like to start us off fairama with a comment from Greg

[01:39:16] [SPEAKER_05]: from Facebook I would love to so Greg says I have to admit while I really enjoyed this episode

[01:39:24] [SPEAKER_05]: and where it ended up I felt a little bit of the game of thrones syndrome between the stranger

[01:39:30] [SPEAKER_05]: bombadill the stores the durians a darry galledriel saw her own caliber and bore a new manure

[01:39:37] [SPEAKER_05]: it was too much they should feel free to exclude a storyline that isn't fleshed out this episode

[01:39:42] [SPEAKER_05]: I really wish that I could have gotten a little more of the stranger and bombadill effectively

[01:39:47] [SPEAKER_05]: one scene of inner turmoil wasn't enough for me loved the durian father sent face off and

[01:39:55] [SPEAKER_05]: during the is it during the fourth crisis of conscious regarding attempting to overthrow his father

[01:40:00] [SPEAKER_05]: or really take any action against him whatsoever and Disa continues to show that she is a BAMF

[01:40:08] [SPEAKER_05]: in turn the fourth I love you was poignant and hysterical when Soron was visiting Kazadoo and got turned

[01:40:16] [SPEAKER_05]: down by King Durin did he see the ballrog in the flames is that why he was basically like as you wish

[01:40:24] [SPEAKER_05]: peace

[01:40:26] [SPEAKER_05]: new manure was really cool but unfortunately it feels like stuff we've seen before and I'm a little bored with

[01:40:32] [SPEAKER_05]: it it's visually stunning but the bad guys are really bad the good guys are really good and pitiful

[01:40:37] [SPEAKER_05]: and it just seems like old hat at this point I'm waiting for the twist I liked the poppy in

[01:40:44] [SPEAKER_05]: nobody scene but the revelation that the harfots or hoppets that just haven't settled may be significant

[01:40:49] [SPEAKER_05]: to nori but may okay fine whatever Brutia Dar and Brutie Gallagherial sure okay we need to see the

[01:40:58] [SPEAKER_05]: recognition that Soron has orchestrated this the bear McCree tid bit about the music was Soron on

[01:41:04] [SPEAKER_05]: the parapet was awesome but it felt a little filerie I really love the Soron Kailabrimbore

[01:41:10] [SPEAKER_05]: signs especially the last one even though Prissie Soron irritates me I get a pretty big nerd

[01:41:16] [SPEAKER_05]: as them with the transition visuals and then they end on the landing of the fiery whatever in

[01:41:23] [SPEAKER_05]: arrogant can't wait to see what happens next

[01:41:28] [SPEAKER_07]: there's brilliant thanks so much Greg I love it I definitely agree with the jumping around

[01:41:33] [SPEAKER_07]: I was happy to see all of the different scenes and the different things that were happening

[01:41:38] [SPEAKER_07]: with everybody but I did feel like it jumped to and throw a little bit too much so there was a

[01:41:47] [SPEAKER_07]: I kind of thought you could have just had all of that once and then all of the other one at once

[01:41:51] [SPEAKER_07]: and I don't think it would have been too jarring but I did find this switch from one to the other

[01:41:55] [SPEAKER_07]: because so much is happening now that you feel taken out of the story when you lose one plotline

[01:42:02] [SPEAKER_07]: but definitely and I'm sorry you don't get the same buzz from Numanor as we do but

[01:42:08] [SPEAKER_07]: I'm just guessing maybe you're not quite as enamored with a lendial as some of us are

[01:42:14] [SPEAKER_07]: into just a little bit I don't know and I don't know I don't know when other show

[01:42:19] [SPEAKER_07]: writers listen to us while whether they listen to I'm pretty much everybody out there

[01:42:24] [SPEAKER_07]: when we've all been talking about how much hotter Vgo is when his duty compared to when

[01:42:29] [SPEAKER_07]: his claim because that shirt elendial that was their filthiest piece of costume I have ever

[01:42:36] [SPEAKER_07]: sent on screen honestly looked like he had wanted for a year without taking it off it was

[01:42:42] [SPEAKER_07]: and I thought he looked fans has to kill our two amazing like in real life you wouldn't want

[01:42:47] [SPEAKER_07]: to be anywhere within about four meters of that you know with your nose because it grows but

[01:42:55] [SPEAKER_07]: oh my god he looked amazing absolutely amazing no little heroic you know and I just I just think

[01:43:01] [SPEAKER_07]: it's really cool you know knowing the contrast we're going to see him go from that to hiking

[01:43:05] [SPEAKER_07]: and I love it yes I hope we get to see that one day yeah this really awesome thanks so much

[01:43:12] [SPEAKER_07]: great really appreciate it we got some voice files as well and we've got one here from Sam

[01:43:18] [SPEAKER_04]: I'd sound another great episode just more the sower on manipulations as ennitar

[01:43:27] [SPEAKER_04]: that scene where he was manipulating Krabrimboer and showing him sunny bright happy people in

[01:43:35] [SPEAKER_04]: city and the director just pans around and you just see the accuracy of the horror that is happening

[01:43:42] [SPEAKER_04]: there was masterful that was just I I grew out and watched it a couple of times because

[01:43:49] [SPEAKER_04]: you're just lulled into this full sense of peace that I mean as viewers I don't know I kind of thought

[01:43:54] [SPEAKER_04]: that might hmm I don't think they're this happy because no thing I mean wants this happy

[01:44:01] [SPEAKER_04]: and then I was like okay and then just that pan around to that complete chaos just like a

[01:44:08] [SPEAKER_04]: 180 and I think this is the first time I've ever been thoroughly creeped out by sower on sphowers

[01:44:16] [SPEAKER_04]: and he's powerful I get it I liked him being able to look into the fire and since the evil

[01:44:21] [SPEAKER_04]: that is in cusodum but seeing this sort of manipulation of reality having it be so far from the truth

[01:44:30] [SPEAKER_04]: that's like right in front of you I don't know it was just like gaslighting to the extreme

[01:44:38] [SPEAKER_04]: like I don't know it was just really haunting it still kind of gives me chills thinking about it

[01:44:43] [SPEAKER_04]: like you came and trust your own eyes around sower on and I know they talked about this but

[01:44:47] [SPEAKER_04]: it was just really beautiful and wonderful and effective to see it and a little poor caliber

[01:44:55] [SPEAKER_04]: I get to feel like this is gonna end well like I don't I don't know the seams pretty

[01:45:01] [SPEAKER_04]: terrible and a region like those those things coming in from the sky like oh this seems rough

[01:45:08] [SPEAKER_04]: a little question I had as I do like so many questions why is sower on so insistent

[01:45:16] [SPEAKER_04]: making the nine rings for man he already has the elf rings he already has a door for the

[01:45:23] [SPEAKER_04]: rings and I know what he's telling everyone else so he wants to do is it is it just because

[01:45:29] [SPEAKER_04]: he wants to have more evil minions or something I'm he was just very very insisted even in the

[01:45:36] [SPEAKER_04]: light of at our being outside the a region like he's like cool that guy who killed me is still there

[01:45:45] [SPEAKER_04]: and I'm just gonna let it go I'm just I'm confused on his his complete obsession with making these

[01:45:51] [SPEAKER_04]: rings and like what what is happening and also so at our new that hell brand was so long

[01:45:59] [SPEAKER_04]: why why did he let him go do you let him go because he's like I know I can't defeat sower on

[01:46:05] [SPEAKER_04]: on my own again I don't know the element of surprise so I'm gonna let hell brand run off to a region

[01:46:13] [SPEAKER_04]: like did addar just want to take a ready on because he wants to have more of the else I don't know

[01:46:18] [SPEAKER_04]: I was just very confused I'm like wait a minute you knew you knew it was your friend of me sower on

[01:46:25] [SPEAKER_04]: so I was sort of fascinated by that maybe guys have more insight into that the kiss with the

[01:46:31] [SPEAKER_04]: harfots was kind of cute I was really stressing out that one of them was gonna get bit by that snake

[01:46:36] [SPEAKER_04]: they were milking no this is gonna be terrible I assume you all have anti-bent on a bigger

[01:46:42] [SPEAKER_04]: like actively milking that snake for the poison I think it was snake but yeah I mean everything else

[01:46:49] [SPEAKER_04]: was so beautiful and I mean the harfots are they're sweet characters I just have no interest in seeing

[01:46:57] [SPEAKER_04]: them make this up they feel like they're in a different TV show so yeah I'm kind of with with you

[01:47:03] [SPEAKER_04]: guys I hope they get tied into the larger storyline because it seems like with Gandalf I know

[01:47:08] [SPEAKER_04]: this is stranger but come on it's Gandalf this is my opinion of it's reminded me a little too much

[01:47:15] [SPEAKER_04]: of Damon and Haran Hall from House of the Dragon like we're spending way too much like legit

[01:47:21] [SPEAKER_04]: very entire experience in the show the stranger in this episode was he had a flash and the future

[01:47:27] [SPEAKER_04]: the past something like that and then all of them could have never fails to be delightful

[01:47:32] [SPEAKER_04]: says find your stick or your screwed forever and that was it I'm like what is happening like

[01:47:38] [SPEAKER_04]: we're giving my piece meal the storyline and it's starting to make me not care about so it's just

[01:47:44] [SPEAKER_04]: like overall amazing I can't wait to get back to our idea on I'm so excited to see where this goes

[01:47:49] [SPEAKER_04]: and just cause I do man it continues to be awful and brutal and I love D-Sat that little sweep of

[01:47:57] [SPEAKER_04]: her cloak I was like you do that it's it's like from Shogun I love it so I can't wait to hear what you

[01:48:05] [SPEAKER_07]: guys have to say thanks Sam that was brilliant so good yeah I think with the um

[01:48:18] [SPEAKER_07]: almost even more important so the three he doesn't really have any power over um once he makes

[01:48:24] [SPEAKER_07]: the one ring he can see the hours when they're wearing their rings but he doesn't it doesn't

[01:48:29] [SPEAKER_07]: make him the head power over them with this even you know it increases the the dwarves greed which

[01:48:36] [SPEAKER_07]: can potentially help him later but he again doesn't really have power but the real power actually

[01:48:43] [SPEAKER_07]: comes with the nine so once he's got these nine powerful kings of men that he can control

[01:48:49] [SPEAKER_07]: that really does help with bringing further darkness to mid-learth so in some ways I think it's

[01:48:54] [SPEAKER_07]: almost more important that he's got those and then with a dire um yeah interesting question why

[01:49:04] [SPEAKER_07]: didn't he just take help around out if you and I kind of wondered that as well and I think maybe

[01:49:12] [SPEAKER_07]: that he um he knows that the Hellbrand is in this physical or seren as in this physical form

[01:49:19] [SPEAKER_07]: and he knows that he's taken him out before in that way and maybe he's wanting to try something

[01:49:25] [SPEAKER_07]: different I'm not sure though because it's kind of like well he had a right in his grasp but later on

[01:49:31] [SPEAKER_07]: he's just going to attack with a much bigger weapon of all of these thousands of walks what

[01:49:35] [SPEAKER_05]: do you think about that well but did a darno for sure that that was soar on I thought and maybe

[01:49:43] [SPEAKER_05]: maybe I misunderstood the conversation between him and gallidrial I thought he wasn't sure that

[01:49:53] [SPEAKER_05]: Hellbrand was soar on he was maybe suspicious but wasn't sure so he let him go to try to

[01:50:00] [SPEAKER_05]: kind of as a test like yeah I agree that's how he took it and then hey him asking gallidrial

[01:50:09] [SPEAKER_07]: really confirmed it for him so he was kind of sure yeah I think that's what it was what do you think

[01:50:14] [SPEAKER_07]: of the the diamond hair and whole comparison big guy with Rod's expert yeah a well whole goodness

[01:50:25] [SPEAKER_05]: I don't know about expert yeah I can definitely see some parallels there for sure but I think that

[01:50:35] [SPEAKER_05]: and for my opinion it's handled better here and rings a power then maybe what house of the dragon

[01:50:43] [SPEAKER_07]: did in season two I think it also depends on the size of a payoff right like I think I

[01:50:51] [SPEAKER_07]: can't say just like it was episode after episode I was like how much spooky we were stuff can we have

[01:50:57] [SPEAKER_07]: from from you know but yeah I think having that number of episodes to really see the effect

[01:51:03] [SPEAKER_07]: that it had on it and then the payoff of her actually coming around to the way that he did

[01:51:09] [SPEAKER_07]: was super satisfying so yes but we're still talking only maybe seven or six episodes whereas

[01:51:15] [SPEAKER_07]: stranger with head for four to eight so it's not there yet so I get you say I'm entirely

[01:51:20] [SPEAKER_07]: gay yeah yeah for sure that's awesome all right we also got a message from Denise

[01:51:32] [SPEAKER_01]: hey ladies this is Denise offering some thoughts on episode six of rings of power

[01:51:38] [SPEAKER_01]: I was thoroughly impressed at how saran could create basically a holiday image in

[01:51:45] [SPEAKER_01]: Kalebrembor is mined a sure him that oregano was fine and I could go back to making the nine rings

[01:51:52] [SPEAKER_01]: when in reality everybody was running and screaming for their lives you can tell Kalebrembor

[01:51:59] [SPEAKER_01]: is struggling with anatar trying to you know reassert some sort of equality and power there

[01:52:08] [SPEAKER_01]: well at the same time anatar just keeps you know pegging at his pride to get him to focus on

[01:52:15] [SPEAKER_01]: the nine rings and don't worry about anything else so to point that Kalebrembor you know gives up

[01:52:21] [SPEAKER_01]: administrative power to saran which I thought was nuts and and so you can go back to make the nine

[01:52:27] [SPEAKER_01]: rings so when we go ahead and move over to the eight our gladiaries story our gladiaries you know

[01:52:37] [SPEAKER_01]: warns eight are you're walking into a trap basically bringing saran in or army that he did not have

[01:52:45] [SPEAKER_01]: previously so yes you're laying siege to oregano but you're doing it at the manipulation of saran not because of

[01:52:54] [SPEAKER_01]: your own intent to find saran and thus destroy him so I think that is also a masterful play

[01:53:01] [SPEAKER_01]: but saran is trying to get Kalebrembor to force the rings fast enough so you can get those nine rings

[01:53:07] [SPEAKER_01]: all fast you know before the siege concludes and then you can go on to form the the one ring

[01:53:16] [SPEAKER_01]: we move over to numinar I am not a fan of the actor who's playing phares on phares on is a very

[01:53:23] [SPEAKER_01]: substantial character in the books and I wish this actor was more elevated to where he could

[01:53:33] [SPEAKER_01]: elevate the role I should say there's I don't think there's any other way to say that and I think he's just a week

[01:53:39] [SPEAKER_01]: week a key portrays phares on is very petty very low rate low rank and whereas in the book phares on

[01:53:49] [SPEAKER_01]: this quite substantial so I'm having a hard time with that and I'm having a hard time with the

[01:53:54] [SPEAKER_01]: pregnant pauses long looks between Ellen deal and myriel can we in that now we know they like each other

[01:54:01] [SPEAKER_01]: can we in that now can we move on otherwise I thought it was a great episode I thoroughly enjoyed it

[01:54:07] [SPEAKER_07]: and I look forward to hearing your bit of thoughts every day brilliant thanks so much to nice another

[01:54:14] [SPEAKER_07]: person not a fan of the lead deal and video oh well that's okay there's something for everyone

[01:54:22] [SPEAKER_05]: there is we all don't have to love the same things thanks for and yeah um what you're

[01:54:30] [SPEAKER_07]: going to that um Tristan Gravel who plays phares on um I see what you mean but my take on it is that he's

[01:54:39] [SPEAKER_07]: playing this very cautiously now we've talked about it at the beginning where you can't have too much

[01:54:45] [SPEAKER_07]: moustache twirling from the beginning those of us who know him and no one has arches going to be

[01:54:51] [SPEAKER_07]: are expecting greater things from him but I think that for the casual viewer who doesn't know the story

[01:54:57] [SPEAKER_07]: you can't know from those first few episodes that he's going to be super villainous because

[01:55:02] [SPEAKER_07]: you need to see him play it politically I think and I think that's what the actor is as portraying

[01:55:08] [SPEAKER_07]: to my mind anyway um and that sort of demonstrated in a lot of the scenes that he's done where

[01:55:14] [SPEAKER_07]: he just sits and watches so if you remember that scene in the pub where Kevin and Valindia were

[01:55:20] [SPEAKER_07]: getting into that argument he didn't intervene at all he just sat and watched and listened

[01:55:24] [SPEAKER_07]: and several of the other scenes he's done the same as well so I think he's playing it quite

[01:55:28] [SPEAKER_07]: now and we're going to see a lot more um grandeur and darkness from him later as we move through

[01:55:35] [SPEAKER_07]: so that's going to be really interesting to see um as awesome or right thank you so much for

[01:55:42] [SPEAKER_07]: that Denise and we also have a voicemail from Penny yeah with us this week so I'm really glad

[01:55:49] [SPEAKER_02]: you've seen us you thoughts thank you so much here we go hey Annwin and Rima and a big thank you

[01:55:57] [SPEAKER_03]: to Rima for filling in for me since I'm not there this week I loved episode six what an action

[01:56:05] [SPEAKER_03]: packed adventure it was I can't wait to hear what you guys have to say about it I just wanted to put

[01:56:12] [SPEAKER_03]: in my two cents about King Durin and how I think his storyline is a real commentary on the military

[01:56:21] [SPEAKER_03]: industrial complex and the way that war profiteering can destroy your humanity and requires people

[01:56:34] [SPEAKER_03]: because of greed to root for war to break out it's incredibly upsetting I also just want to

[01:56:44] [SPEAKER_03]: mention that I continue to absolutely adore Durin and Denise's relationship and after she

[01:56:50] [SPEAKER_03]: sang those bats out and he turned and he was like I love you and she said love me later I lost my

[01:56:58] [SPEAKER_03]: hope that was so funny and adorable have a good week you guys love you bye thanks Penny love you too

[01:57:06] [SPEAKER_07]: that is awesome is really cool I'm a little bit invious of Penny I have to admit because

[01:57:13] [SPEAKER_07]: because she wasn't recording for this show as soon as she'd seen episodes six she went ahead

[01:57:18] [SPEAKER_07]: and was able to watch episodes seven on our screeners but I kept myself pure so that I could

[01:57:24] [SPEAKER_07]: call today without knowing what happens in the next episode and the sad tragedy is that the screen

[01:57:29] [SPEAKER_07]: is only last for a couple of weeks so they've actually expired so I can't see it so even now even though

[01:57:35] [SPEAKER_07]: it's not even though I'm not recording next week it's either it's going to be Penny and some guests

[01:57:40] [SPEAKER_07]: but unfortunately I'm going to have to wait I'm like everybody else I'm telling me it's just like

[01:57:46] [SPEAKER_07]: the rest of us so funny but yeah it's funny because you know you've been to die at the top that

[01:57:54] [SPEAKER_07]: the three episodes released it all together at the beginning and that was a mission Penny and I

[01:58:00] [SPEAKER_07]: to record we didn't do it all in one weekend but we did do it across two weekends including our

[01:58:06] [SPEAKER_07]: our prep episode so we did four episodes in a couple of weeks and it was um oh no how you pretty

[01:58:12] [SPEAKER_07]: intense so yeah but the good thing about it was that you know I kind of knew what was coming up so

[01:58:18] [SPEAKER_07]: I was able to do quite a bit of research ahead of time before even seeing each episode so

[01:58:23] [SPEAKER_07]: it took a little bit of the time out of it but yeah it's worth the work because it's just so

[01:58:28] [SPEAKER_07]: much fun to talk about and so to watch all of this cool stuff you know how to hold the brown eyes

[01:58:33] [SPEAKER_05]: both of you are so brilliant at covering this show so it's it's much appreciated all the work

[01:58:38] [SPEAKER_05]: that you both put into it thank you so much that's awesome and thanks everybody for

[01:58:44] [SPEAKER_07]: the messages we really appreciate them if you would like to write an all-earned me so it's

[01:58:49] [SPEAKER_07]: all that contact information at podcastgur.com you can also send a voice mail and all the ways

[01:58:56] [SPEAKER_07]: to contact us are right there so go on a long and have a little look there yeah and while you're there

[01:59:03] [SPEAKER_05]: make sure to check out all of our other podcasts something there for everyone and something new

[01:59:10] [SPEAKER_05]: coming out very soon will be Agatha all along yeah I'm so excited about that we actually

[01:59:18] [SPEAKER_07]: watched the first episode last night and so yeah it's it's really cool yeah quite a lot darker

[01:59:25] [SPEAKER_07]: then some of the other shows that we've seen from Marvel you know it's obviously an off-shoot

[01:59:30] [SPEAKER_07]: from Wonder Vision which did get dark at times but I think this is going to take a different

[01:59:34] [SPEAKER_07]: track and just interest every moment of Catherine Harlan screen is just incredible because she's

[01:59:39] [SPEAKER_05]: amazing she is absolutely amazing and I love her I mean one division was just I thought such a

[01:59:48] [SPEAKER_05]: fantastic show I mean the emotions I felt just wow you know watching that show just the places

[01:59:56] [SPEAKER_05]: it took me was incredible and Catherine Hawn and her character Agatha I thought I was just I mean

[02:00:02] [SPEAKER_05]: I love her and everything I've seen her in so I haven't got a chance to watch it yet but I can't

[02:00:06] [SPEAKER_05]: wait I've been waiting for this one I think she's just brilliant I can't wait to see the show

[02:00:11] [SPEAKER_07]: and I'll still listen to the coverage yes I've impressed so far I think it's going to be great

[02:00:17] [SPEAKER_07]: and you know it's been a while since we saw the lead up but I managed to find on YouTube

[02:00:23] [SPEAKER_07]: a really cool there's super out there but I did find a really cool kind of Agatha homework type

[02:00:29] [SPEAKER_07]: video which takes you with that. 16 minutes long and it takes you through all of the background

[02:00:35] [SPEAKER_07]: that you need to know from all of the Marvel films and from all of the shows that lead to the story

[02:00:41] [SPEAKER_07]: and the background which is really cool because it's actually so much and a lot of the previous

[02:00:46] [SPEAKER_07]: Marvel movies that touch on it as well so hi there we can end that if you're going to go into

[02:00:51] [SPEAKER_07]: Agatha all along and you're not so you know familiar with comics or anything go and have a little

[02:00:56] [SPEAKER_07]: look at that and it'll just remind you of all the little main touch points that you kind of need

[02:01:00] [SPEAKER_07]: to know before you get into it so yeah I can't wait to hear a penny and everyone talk all about that

[02:01:06] [SPEAKER_07]: excited yeah it's going to be great and what have you got coming up on strange indeed

[02:01:13] [SPEAKER_05]: well super excited for what we have coming up next we've been on a little bit of a pause since we

[02:01:18] [SPEAKER_05]: wrapped up sweet tooth back in was it June feels like forever ago but we'll be back

[02:01:26] [SPEAKER_05]: next week if if if you haven't seen in the news this come out great British bake-off

[02:01:34] [SPEAKER_05]: returns next week and you know it's just become this weird little tradition that we started

[02:01:40] [SPEAKER_05]: covering it just as like kind of like why not we we love talking about it you know and like

[02:01:48] [SPEAKER_05]: offline in our group we you know we would always kind of talk about it's like why don't we just

[02:01:52] [SPEAKER_05]: put a little you know put it at the end of one of our episodes and then it became its own episode

[02:01:57] [SPEAKER_05]: and we're just continuing on that tradition so the newest season hits Netflix on Fridays so

[02:02:05] [SPEAKER_05]: September 27th it'll hit the the U.S. on Netflix on the 27th I think it premieres in the UK

[02:02:11] [SPEAKER_05]: I think the 24th September 24th so we'll we'll be picking up our coverage of that because you know

[02:02:18] [SPEAKER_05]: it's if we could use a comfort watch during any time it's definitely right now so at the time

[02:02:25] [SPEAKER_07]: I just love that you guys cover that we we have gotten to the habit of watching that together as

[02:02:30] [SPEAKER_07]: a family and we really enjoy it we get it on free to air TV here at New Zealand and it's usually

[02:02:36] [SPEAKER_07]: up to date so I'm looking forward to just checking out when we can watch that and I just love how you know

[02:02:41] [SPEAKER_07]: we watch all these dark shows and then we need a show to watch as a public lenser

[02:02:46] [SPEAKER_07]: and then the fact that you're covering it as well means we've got all this dark podcast coverage and

[02:02:50] [SPEAKER_07]: we've got this beautiful light and delicious podcast that we can listen to to cover that

[02:02:56] [SPEAKER_05]: which is great I'm so glad you're covering it again yeah it's I can't wait Wendy and Greg will be

[02:03:01] [SPEAKER_05]: joining and you know I'm trying to get pink as well to join us if if schedule's allow and of course

[02:03:08] [SPEAKER_05]: you know who knows you never know who's gonna turn up during during one of the episodes so

[02:03:13] [SPEAKER_05]: thank you for for listening I you know I thought is anyone even gonna care this is not what we

[02:03:18] [SPEAKER_05]: normally cover but we've had really good response and you know we did think that because I'll

[02:03:25] [SPEAKER_05]: definitely see them some big back if we get feedback then I will absolutely include it we

[02:03:33] [SPEAKER_05]: we don't often we did not get a lot last year for the last season but if if we get anything then

[02:03:39] [SPEAKER_07]: it's definitely included yeah fantastic I also love going to there we've started and trying to

[02:03:48] [SPEAKER_07]: what sake that they made with it was proves lemon lemons our tray bake cake oh my god it's

[02:03:55] [SPEAKER_07]: so I've got I've taken it to various occasions and everyone loves it so yeah that's wonderful

[02:04:00] [SPEAKER_07]: I love hearing stories like that it's so beautiful fantastic oh that's great

[02:04:07] [SPEAKER_07]: so now it is going to be time to have a little look into the ledgerals mirror so if you are happy

[02:04:13] [SPEAKER_07]: to hear possible spoilers for future episodes and future seasons of the show we're going

[02:04:19] [SPEAKER_07]: to discuss how the show compares with the book and some of the things that we think might have

[02:04:24] [SPEAKER_07]: been next so if you don't want to be spoiled we'll see you next time if you do please join us now

[02:04:30] [SPEAKER_07]: for Galadriel's mirror will you look into the minute what will I see things that were

[02:04:39] [SPEAKER_08]: things that are and some things that have not yet come to pass all right so

[02:04:49] [SPEAKER_07]: couple of things that I wanted to talk about here um obviously we're building up to this

[02:04:54] [SPEAKER_07]: massive battle the siege of Eriegion and this is a pretty important plot points it is a little bit

[02:05:01] [SPEAKER_07]: of order um can we can paired with the book so other books um saron makes the seven in the

[02:05:08] [SPEAKER_07]: nine first and then he makes the three and then he goes away and makes the one and in the books

[02:05:14] [SPEAKER_07]: at this stage when we have this battle sounds actually already left Eriegion his return to

[02:05:19] [SPEAKER_07]: moredoer made the one ring and then when he he puts on the one ring he knows then that the elves

[02:05:27] [SPEAKER_07]: have got the three because he actually isn't aware of the three at all they've been made in secret

[02:05:31] [SPEAKER_07]: without him knowing and so he he's only aware of them it doesn't have power over them but

[02:05:37] [SPEAKER_07]: he's still connected to them so he puts the one ring on he can sense the other three and at

[02:05:43] [SPEAKER_07]: that point um Galadriel and Kurdon and Gugal had to take their rings off so oh so he can see us

[02:05:49] [SPEAKER_07]: let's quickly take them off and hide them so they hit them at that point um and once he knew

[02:05:54] [SPEAKER_07]: that they had these rings he wanted those he wanted all of the rings back from himself

[02:06:01] [SPEAKER_07]: and it was in response to finding that information out that he led a huge army out of

[02:06:05] [SPEAKER_07]: moredoer to attack the city so in the book it's saron's army that's taking not at ar as a show

[02:06:12] [SPEAKER_07]: creation um okay yes so it's a little bit different different twist to it and I think it is

[02:06:17] [SPEAKER_07]: quite clever how they've done it the effect is going to be the same you're going to have the

[02:06:21] [SPEAKER_07]: heck of a rig on and in the book El Rondon Gugalos we're sent to help defend a rig on

[02:06:29] [SPEAKER_07]: and then you've got this massive clash between the two armies which we are definitely

[02:06:33] [SPEAKER_07]: going to see based on what we've seen already in the trailer so that's going to have one for sure

[02:06:37] [SPEAKER_07]: and it's just about how much they show where they kind of end that I guess we've got two more

[02:06:42] [SPEAKER_07]: episodes to go um you do have to end a season with some kind of resolution even though obviously

[02:06:48] [SPEAKER_07]: it's still going to be fairly cliffhangery in terms of the fate of the people's and what happens next

[02:06:54] [SPEAKER_07]: but we're definitely going to set it out sharp and a big battle and I don't know whether or

[02:06:59] [SPEAKER_07]: not they're going to have the door strap so in the book the doors also come to help too

[02:07:04] [SPEAKER_07]: none of it really helps in the city is pretty much destroyed and then everybody runs off and does

[02:07:08] [SPEAKER_07]: their own things so Galadrill escapes and goes off and starts the founding of Mothorian

[02:07:15] [SPEAKER_07]: and you've got El Rondon running off to Establish Rivendell and then Gugalod runs off back to

[02:07:22] [SPEAKER_07]: London as well which is never really attached so you're going to have all these pieces at the end

[02:07:27] [SPEAKER_07]: of this special with whatever is going to happen next and then of course we're also going to have

[02:07:34] [SPEAKER_07]: the death of Calibran Boa so um it's interesting like I said before listening to the soundtrack

[02:07:42] [SPEAKER_07]: there's a one very long sort of about 11 minute piece of music that is covering the siege

[02:07:48] [SPEAKER_07]: and there's a section about halfway through that where I listened and I was like oh I think

[02:07:55] [SPEAKER_07]: that's Calibran Boa going out because it was the kind of what we now recognise as the

[02:08:01] [SPEAKER_07]: Alphdeth music so if you remember you're just fresh off the rewatch of the trilogy but remember

[02:08:07] [SPEAKER_07]: it's a great time to see if you're at home's deep when Halder and a beautiful Kiwi actor Craig Parker

[02:08:12] [SPEAKER_07]: who plays the Alphdeth healthier. Hey is killed and it is probably I think maybe the first time

[02:08:17] [SPEAKER_07]: that we see an Alphdeth killed on screen in the trilogy or one of the first times and you get this

[02:08:23] [SPEAKER_07]: high kind of you know, Alphdeth music and in this special of a regeon piece there is a moment

[02:08:32] [SPEAKER_07]: of that and I thought oh something's going down so yeah my question as always and we've talked

[02:08:39] [SPEAKER_07]: about this before is how far are they going to show it what are they going to show because

[02:08:44] [SPEAKER_07]: Calibran Boa is tortured by Sarah on to try and find the we are out where the rest of the rings are

[02:08:50] [SPEAKER_07]: he tells him the location of the the seven and the nine but he never gives away the three

[02:08:55] [SPEAKER_07]: he keeps that a secret and his tortured to his death. He then gets basically stuck on a pipe

[02:09:02] [SPEAKER_07]: shot through with arrows and then his body is paraded as a banner at the head of the army so

[02:09:08] [SPEAKER_07]: depending on how far they go with the gruesomeness of that it is going to be really interesting to see

[02:09:13] [SPEAKER_07]: and by the way whether they just imply that whether they do shot fully it's going to be heartbreaking

[02:09:17] [SPEAKER_07]: and I think there's going to be that moment where either Galadriel or Alrundal both see this

[02:09:23] [SPEAKER_07]: happening to their to their old friend so it's going to be absolutely heartbreaking. It's yeah.

[02:09:29] [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah especially with his matches what we've gotten to know in Calibran Boa throughout the show.

[02:09:34] [SPEAKER_07]: Exactly yeah yeah and then the other main thing that I really wanted to talk about was just

[02:09:41] [SPEAKER_07]: what's happening in Nermon O'OS so you know we've got the the faithful and we've seen this

[02:09:47] [SPEAKER_07]: towing and frooring between sort of who's in charge or who the crowd is following in terms of

[02:09:57] [SPEAKER_07]: having to try and crush the old faith. And last week when they closed the shrine and you had

[02:10:03] [SPEAKER_07]: the killing of Fallen Diel actually forgot to mention that who the the idol of the Valar,

[02:10:10] [SPEAKER_07]: the little statue that they smashed was I was all taken up with them with being heartbroken

[02:10:14] [SPEAKER_07]: over Valen Diel but quite a good emblem I think that's the the idol of Nena which is the who

[02:10:20] [SPEAKER_07]: was the Valar of Morning and so the fact that they're kind of worshiping her and they're dealing

[02:10:24] [SPEAKER_07]: with their grief through the worship of this Valar of Morning I thought was really beautiful

[02:10:32] [SPEAKER_07]: and more and more I thought about it was really the contrast between Elendio and Earian where she's

[02:10:38] [SPEAKER_07]: not working through her grief she's turning it into anger and kind of vengeance she's not

[02:10:43] [SPEAKER_07]: grieving with her father for a seal door who they believe is dead or she would have been there

[02:10:48] [SPEAKER_07]: with them. So the smashing of the the grief statue basically was was really poignant and

[02:10:58] [SPEAKER_07]: again a symbol of them trying to get rid of this faith for the Valar that the faithful have got

[02:11:03] [SPEAKER_07]: and that's just going to continue on and on as well because I think you know we're going to see

[02:11:09] [SPEAKER_07]: a lot more of what happens there with the persecution of the faithful that's just going to

[02:11:14] [SPEAKER_07]: you want until we get to a much much darker place with pharaohs on the end and I really like to

[02:11:22] [SPEAKER_07]: gain the portrayal of this this idol of Nena and bring it back to the lore again and when they'll

[02:11:30] [SPEAKER_07]: win and gore into the big giant spider and more goth destroyed the trees when they tried to get

[02:11:35] [SPEAKER_07]: the trees to come back to life. Nena was the one that wept and her tears went onto the trees and

[02:11:42] [SPEAKER_07]: caused just one last silver flower and one last golden fruit to grow on them before the trees died

[02:11:48] [SPEAKER_07]: and then she and Yavana who's the Valar and charge of all the growing things made those that

[02:11:54] [SPEAKER_07]: flower and that fruit into the sun in the moon which I think is really cool so it's a really

[02:11:59] [SPEAKER_07]: nice part of the story and some ways I kind of liked that they didn't name that it was Nena but

[02:12:05] [SPEAKER_07]: those of us who are fully with the lore will kind of know there and it was just a really beautiful

[02:12:10] [SPEAKER_07]: trailer thought so that's another example of all these old traditions that they have so the faithful

[02:12:16] [SPEAKER_07]: will be aware of all of those things that happened in the legends with the creation of the sun in

[02:12:22] [SPEAKER_07]: the moon and all of that kind of stuff and I quite like that one of the sort of symbols of

[02:12:26] [SPEAKER_07]: Nuna or as a sun like you see it in a lot of their um heraldry and things like that in the

[02:12:31] [SPEAKER_07]: the top of the sepda that pharaohs on now has is as a sun as well and so these these old traditions

[02:12:37] [SPEAKER_07]: are being um basically forbidden and they're going to start rounding them up and it's going to

[02:12:43] [SPEAKER_07]: become forbidden completely to worship the Valar so that's going to be interesting to see what

[02:12:47] [SPEAKER_07]: happens with that as well um yeah and then with pharaohs on so like I see it up you know

[02:12:54] [SPEAKER_07]: I was like hey I'm awake let's she now the queen again because pharaohs on is you know they're

[02:12:58] [SPEAKER_07]: saying queen Maria and pharaohs on just only looking all grumpy with her with a checkpoint I browse

[02:13:04] [SPEAKER_07]: and I'm so I kind of was like I really just have to see what's going to happen I guess in the next

[02:13:12] [SPEAKER_07]: couple episodes with that because um in this story um they he actually marries Mariael by force

[02:13:20] [SPEAKER_07]: so that's how he gets power is that he marries and his first cousin and so the the book basically says

[02:13:27] [SPEAKER_07]: that he does he does this evil thing by taking her for marriage by force but the second evil is

[02:13:32] [SPEAKER_07]: that that's actually forbidden in their cultures so you can marry a second cousin but you know

[02:13:38] [SPEAKER_07]: out of marry your first cousin and so he sort of done this double evil and taking her as a

[02:13:42] [SPEAKER_07]: wife and that's how he got his power I don't know if they're going to go there I thought that

[02:13:48] [SPEAKER_07]: they weren't because of this whole he's just happened to take advantage of the evil coming and

[02:13:52] [SPEAKER_07]: that's how he got his power but now that I see what's happening with her regaining some of her

[02:13:58] [SPEAKER_07]: respect from the people with passing the sea trial I think he might still use that as a backup

[02:14:03] [SPEAKER_07]: plan and I kind of think they are going to go there um it'll be really interesting to see whether

[02:14:09] [SPEAKER_07]: they actually will or not and I have to go back and defend their pin disease to see how much is

[02:14:15] [SPEAKER_07]: on there in terms of um because a lot of it's explained in the downfall of minimal which is a um a chapter

[02:14:22] [SPEAKER_07]: as a book and itself and it's also a chapter of the summary and but to see how much they actually

[02:14:26] [SPEAKER_07]: go there with that and then what that means to this kind of um show created uh relationship between

[02:14:33] [SPEAKER_07]: a lendial and medial and what what that's going to mean for the two of them but

[02:14:37] [SPEAKER_07]: either way it's going to be tragic so yeah yes it's going to be great yeah

[02:14:43] [SPEAKER_07]: was there anything else that you had in terms of spoilers any um questions or thoughts on anything

[02:14:48] [SPEAKER_05]: that might come up based on what we've seen no I mean I think we've we've we've covered most of it

[02:14:56] [SPEAKER_05]: but it's like I don't I don't know what I don't know I kind of stumbled upon things in like

[02:15:03] [SPEAKER_05]: as I think we were talking I might have been before we started recording that you know because I

[02:15:08] [SPEAKER_05]: am so interested in the in the lore and I haven't read the source material that I'm like I want

[02:15:14] [SPEAKER_05]: to know more about this character so of course doing that I get exposed to things which

[02:15:18] [SPEAKER_05]: are I'm okay with sometimes I don't like spoilers but you know I don't go look for them so if

[02:15:23] [SPEAKER_05]: I do learn a little bit of something that I don't get to torn up about it because I'm like well

[02:15:27] [SPEAKER_05]: I don't know if that'll play out the same in the show you know you don't know exactly where

[02:15:32] [SPEAKER_05]: it will go um and how it will look so um so honestly there's just a lot I don't know um so I don't

[02:15:39] [SPEAKER_05]: even really have any other questions but I'm really interested to see how they choose to play it out

[02:15:47] [SPEAKER_05]: just seeing what they've done so far I think I think they'll do a good job whatever they decide to do

[02:15:52] [SPEAKER_07]: yeah I think it's great I've got full trust in them now and you know the the showrunners

[02:15:57] [SPEAKER_07]: have got access to the Lord of the Rings the Hobbit and the Appendices of Lord the Rings

[02:16:03] [SPEAKER_07]: and then anything that's not in there they have to go case by case to the Tolkien estate to ask

[02:16:07] [SPEAKER_07]: permission to use and on my feelings is that they're probably going to get more and more as they go

[02:16:11] [SPEAKER_07]: on I think that the Tolkien estate is probably gonna trust them more with what they're telling

[02:16:17] [SPEAKER_07]: so let's see where that goes I'm not I'm not 100% sure but I don't like that.

[02:16:22] [SPEAKER_07]: Interesting I don't know there yeah so that the name Anata is not does not appear in the Lord of

[02:16:28] [SPEAKER_07]: the Rings so they talk about the Lord of Gifts and about him going and you know making the

[02:16:33] [SPEAKER_07]: rings and so on but their actual name doesn't appear so they had to go specifically to Tolkien estate

[02:16:37] [SPEAKER_07]: to ask the permission to use the name so there's little pieces like that it's all very

[02:16:43] [SPEAKER_07]: legal requirements but yeah I think I'm hoping that they're happy with what's happening and

[02:16:50] [SPEAKER_07]: it's a right issue but yeah I think they're doing really well what they can with the information

[02:16:55] [SPEAKER_07]: that they've got so that's really really cool and yeah I think that's actually just about it

[02:17:03] [SPEAKER_07]: it's been a wonderful chat and I don't think there's ever going to be a chance for us to get

[02:17:08] [SPEAKER_07]: easy besides I'm to too ask is just so much to talk about so thanks everybody if you still listen

[02:17:15] [SPEAKER_05]: another it's it's always worth it you know on the listener and it just flies by

[02:17:21] [SPEAKER_05]: you know you're just so into it like in I can I can attest as a listener and also podcasting

[02:17:26] [SPEAKER_05]: it doesn't feel like we're sitting here for this long doing it totally worth it.

[02:17:31] [SPEAKER_07]: So fun isn't it it's great and thank you so much for coming on this week when Pini couldn't be

[02:17:36] [SPEAKER_07]: really appreciated and loves talking to you about a lot of the rags that's fantastic.

[02:17:40] [SPEAKER_05]: Of course I mean huge shoes to fill in Pini's absence but I'm happy that I was available

[02:17:47] [SPEAKER_05]: you know I don't have anyone to talk to this about this show. So this was definitely a great

[02:17:53] [SPEAKER_07]: outlet for me in gear for having me so well cooked so we're going to flip things around

[02:17:59] [SPEAKER_07]: a little next week um I'm not going to be around because I'm going to be and wellington the true

[02:18:05] [SPEAKER_07]: spiritual home of Middle Earth and Pini is going to be covering episodes seven the

[02:18:11] [SPEAKER_07]: penultimate episode with Renee and Jason so I'm really looking forward to hearing what they have

[02:18:16] [SPEAKER_07]: to say about this next massive battle episode so that's going to be really really cool.

[02:18:21] [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah good times fantastic well thanks everybody that is our show.

[02:18:28] [SPEAKER_07]: Thanks for listening everyone it's going to be so hard wedding for next week's episode

[02:18:33] [SPEAKER_07]: but if it is the will of the valour that we have the patience then it will be.

[02:18:38] [SPEAKER_07]: What if it isn't? The sea is always right. The sea is always right.