4: The Terminator (1984)

[00:00:00] Just let me go. Hey everybody, welcome to our podcast. I'm Jason and I'm Rima and today we're going to be talking about the 1984 James Cameron classic, the Terminator starring Arnold Schwarzenegger, Linda Hamilton and Michael Bean. Yeah, so get your popcorn ready, sit back and relax.

[00:00:53] We'll be back. All right, here we are. We're ready to talk about the Terminator. I thought it'd be cool because we just had the most recent James Cameron movie, so let's go back to an early one. Yes, just his like best work. Yeah, it's good stuff.

[00:01:17] No, I haven't seen Avatar 2. I'm sure it's great. I watched the first one. I don't even remember it very well, but the second one I haven't seen yet. Listening to Kristen and Wendy, maybe you want to go see it, so maybe I'll go see it. But anyway,

[00:01:30] we're not here to talk about that. We're here to talk about the Terminator. So you watched it again, I presume, right? Oh heck yeah. Yeah, and how was it to watch now? Or you can say,

[00:01:43] you know, how big of a fan you've always been or whatever you want to say in general about it. Well, I've always been a huge fan of the Terminator franchise since I was a kid because

[00:01:52] I saw this when I was a kid. And I can't remember my exact age. I just remember seeing it on video because this was back in the day when VHS rentals were becoming a thing so

[00:02:03] you could rent it. So I watched it at my cousin's house. They had it and I was just completely blown away. I think I was like 10 whenever I saw it for the first time. And I think it

[00:02:15] was around 86 or so. So it was a couple of years after it had come out. And just absolutely mind blown away as a 10 year old. And I think it still holds up. It's been a little

[00:02:27] while since I've seen the original because I do gravitate a lot towards T2. It's definitely one of my favorites of the franchise. But there's nothing like the original Terminator and all those same feelings came back from when I was a kid and how great this movie is.

[00:02:40] I was the same. I don't think I saw it in the theater. I think I saw it on video, but I definitely did see it before T2. And I think these movies pair so well together

[00:02:53] because this one is more like a horror movie. Yeah, it's dark and T2 is more of an adventure. Similar in some ways to Alien and Aliens. Alien is the smaller movie. It's the scarier

[00:03:06] movie. It's got more tension. Same with Terminator. And then they kind of just went big for the second one. And I think T2 is an incredible movie. I think it's much better though if you,

[00:03:17] within the context of having seen Terminator first because it's such a stark contrast to see how the Terminator in both movies is different. And I kind of like the first one better just

[00:03:32] because it's so scary and terrifying and dark. And the second one is so good though. So they're pretty close for me. You like the second one better? Well, I don't know if I like it better,

[00:03:50] but I feel like they're kind of two different styles. I mean, T2 is still science fiction, but it's a much more bigger action movie. It's like this big blockbuster movie, whereas the Terminator was more sci-fi slash horror, like you said. And it was a thriller.

[00:04:07] Yeah, it was a little bit too like it felt like, I mean, I don't know if you were going to talk about this, but James Cameron had to do like Gonzo style filmmaking where

[00:04:18] they didn't have permits to film in places. So they just went and got it real fast before the cops could come and took off. Yes, I think he called it gorilla filming or something.

[00:04:29] Gorilla, yeah, not Gonzo. It's a little different. Yeah, but you know, like on the cheap a little bit, especially compared to budget T2. Yeah, yeah. A little more independent feeling, less smooth, you know, harsher. It's still beautifully shot. I mean, the direction is

[00:04:49] fantastic. It was very tight. Yeah. But it's not as pleasant. It's uncomfortable, disturbing, you know? That's kind of why I like that kind of stuff. I like dark stuff. But I found, like I hadn't seen the Terminator in many years and I watched it a couple of times

[00:05:06] in the last couple of days. It was really fun to watch. It I think is the kind of movie actually that's much more impactful within the context of the 80s. We've seen a lot of post apocalyptic

[00:05:20] stuff since then. The special effects have improved a lot. We've seen AI and robots and all this stuff now a million times over and we hadn't seen anything like it back then,

[00:05:34] you know? I mean, I hadn't. It was fresh. Yeah. And yeah, we didn't think about the world ending like that. Well, we did because we were afraid of nuclear bombs, but we didn't see it in the movies

[00:05:45] so much. And so I had Nico watch it with me for the first time and he liked it. He was paying attention the whole time, which is a sign that he's into it. You know, if he's actually

[00:05:56] gonna watch it. But I could tell and he said as much that, you know, yeah, it was good, but you know, the effects weren't great. And I could tell it didn't hit him like it hit us. Of

[00:06:06] course not. You know, they're jaded now. They've they're so much that's coming with all the CGI and the effects that they have nowadays. Just the types of like this type of movie. Yeah. Yeah. The

[00:06:17] type of movie, the robotics something, just the idea of it. We hadn't seen anything because you and I are kind of close to the same age. But like, you know, I remember watching it

[00:06:28] and I'm like, I have never. I mean, I was just like blown away. I was like that like head blown emoji is like I was sitting there the entire time as I was watching it that first time. Like

[00:06:36] I've never seen and I've been a movie buff since I was a kid. You know, always watching movies with my cousins or at home on HBO. You know, I was growing up. I was in it. My mom was a single

[00:06:47] mom. She was working all the time and her babysitter for me was cable TV with HBO. So I watched a lot of movies. So I feel like I'd watched a lot of things. I'd never seen

[00:06:56] anything like that before. So I was just blown away and it stuck with me. It made an impact. Yeah. But even though it is like more impactful within the context of the 80s, it's still

[00:07:10] really tight. It's punchy and it's efficient and it's a little silly, you know, now in retrospect in some places, which is I think kind of fun. But it's like, like I said,

[00:07:22] Nico, Nico did like it even though he's a child of the 2010s and has been jaded by a pop culture. All right. So let's get into our points. What do you got? Well, as we've been kind of talking about already, one of the things that I really

[00:07:38] love and appreciate about Terminator is just the simplicity of the movie itself. It as we said for me, I think anyway, it has a really tight storyline and a simple delivery. And at its core, it's a horror like chase movie with the Terminator and its constant

[00:07:56] pursuit of Sarah Connor. And with it being science fiction, one of the I think anyway crucial things about science fiction and it can be contradicting, I think is it has to have a layer of like reality. You know, science fiction, we get introduced to

[00:08:14] conceptions or contraptions like this robot, for instance, that haven't yet been devised. Like, you know, we've never seen or heard of anything like that, at least when we watched it. But to believe in this world, there has to be something human and there

[00:08:29] has to be something at stake. And in this movie, it's the future of humanity was at risk. And that's all that was needed. Simple storytelling, simple dialogue. It's that. But also in the moment, it's just Sarah and Kyle's lives.

[00:08:44] Right. That's what I felt more like, Oh, my God, please let them survive. But you're right. It's also the rest of humanity too. Yeah. And you get that they're going to die, though. That's the thing. It isn't really to save them.

[00:08:58] They're dead no matter what. I mean, it's to save the last like remnants of humanity that is left. Right. That's that's another thing about this movie that I hadn't actually thought of. But it's very bleak because they're not even trying to prevent

[00:09:12] the war. They kind of do in the next few movies, but they're just saying, yeah, this is going to happen for sure. So we have to make sure that humanity doesn't completely die out. Right. We need that leader to get us through.

[00:09:25] Otherwise, we're going to be completely wiped out. You know, yeah. But even if they succeed, there's still billions of people that are going to die. That's why that's another thing that makes this movie so dark. It is dark. I mean, those, you know, and, and yeah,

[00:09:40] CGI and the effects aren't what they were. I mean, they were great for the time. I mean, in 1984 or when you're watching that movie. Stay with the Arnold head. Oh my gosh, it was fantastic. But, you know, just seeing Kyle's his memories of what it was like

[00:09:57] and what that looks like, seeing those machines just like crush all those human skulls. I mean, that just was scary as a kid. Like, oh my God, you know, like I'm still kind of at that age where I'm like, oh my gosh, this is really going to happen.

[00:10:09] That little bit of innocence that you think, oh, that's really going to happen. That that's there's potential. It could happen. It could. And I, you know, we joke about it, but you know, you watch shows like Black Mirror and or you hear all these

[00:10:22] stories about these robots that are becoming so smart. And I'm like, Skynet, Skynet, Cyberdive, what are you doing? Don't don't mess with that. It's more of a reality now that it was back then. Some of these things seem closer, seem less science fiction-y, way more, way less.

[00:10:41] I mean, I'm hearing stories all the time. There's this is it, is it Microsoft? Someone has some sort of AI that is becoming self aware. And I just about fell out of my chair. My car drives itself. No, don't like it. It's pretty crazy.

[00:11:00] It would have driven me directly into traffic the other day, by the way, if I didn't take control. But you're supposed to be paying attention the whole time. Elon Musk was like, I don't like this guy. Flip the switch. Sent me into traffic.

[00:11:17] Or the computer AI did, I'm not sure which one it was. Anything else on that point? No, that's all I've got. Mine is similar to that. And it's it's one of my longer ones. So please jump in. Buckle in. Talk about anything I'm saying, but it's kind of

[00:11:33] the combination of the horror movie feel and the relentlessness of it. As far as horror movie, it's mostly at night. It's it's got all these qualities we were talking about, the hopelessness, the tension. We don't know what he is at first.

[00:11:54] So I mean, maybe we knew from the trailers, I don't really remember. But if you're just watching the movie with the idea that you don't know, then it's not for sure. He's a bit of a mystery, which makes him even scarier. Yeah.

[00:12:08] And we see this electric discharge and this naked buff guy. And that makes it kind of edgy that he's naked. And then he runs into this punk group and starts repeating them. Nice night for a walk. Nice night for a walk, which makes him seem kind of alien.

[00:12:25] Like what the hell? Then he gets stabbed and it doesn't hardly bother him at all. And then he's throwing a guy through the air against a wall. So he's super strong. And then he pulls the guys heart out. So we know he's lethal and bad.

[00:12:42] And then he kills the I mean, just like looking through Sarah Connors in the phone book, it just feels like, oh, shit, there's this inevitability. We find out pretty quickly that our protagonist is the third one. So that's scary. Like, oh, he's going to get to her eventually.

[00:12:59] He kills the first one, only 15 minutes in. So he's hunting. Then when in this dance club, Kyle Reese shoots him with his shotgun a few times and then he gets back up and Bodey was watching in and out to my six year old.

[00:13:17] He goes, how is he still alive? I think because he's a robot. And I was like, that's pretty good. He figured it out. He figured out before I did. That was pretty cool. I mean, you also, well, I don't know. Yeah, that was great.

[00:13:33] Then when he has to cut his own eyeball, you know, it's pretty horrific to sit there and watch that and cut into his arm and everything. So that's a few things about why I feel like it's got a more of a horror movie vibe.

[00:13:48] But even more, I love the relentlessness, the idea of being pursued by something powerful and unstoppable is pretty freaky. The whole movie is this killing machine chasing these people who have insufficient means of doing anything about it. And the whole movie is just driving, driving, driving.

[00:14:06] It's after you. It's going to get you. And and it's a bit like it's a bit like a zombie, single-minded, emotionless killer, but more, more focused. Yes. And and also from the start, the the movie imparts this drive, focus and relentlessness by having the Terminator's movements be so

[00:14:33] efficient. He doesn't ever turn his head unless it's necessary. You know, Arnold's so good at all this. He if he needs a car, he just punches through the window, unlocks the door, gets in, twists the steering wheel to expose the key mechanism, starts the car like it's nothing.

[00:14:46] He needs guns. He goes to the gun shop, says only the name of each gun and then shoots the guy, loads up the gun, shoots the guy. Simple. He needs to check the phone book. He goes to the payphone, grabs the guy who's there, just

[00:15:01] tosses him away like nothing. He's just and then this heartbeat music that comes along with whenever you see him just lends to that driving feel of it. Of course, there's the way that Reese talks about him. He's so intense, but he's like that Terminator is out there.

[00:15:17] It can't be bargained with. It can't be reasoned with. It doesn't feel pity or remorse or fear and it absolutely will not stop ever until you're dead. And can you stop it? I don't know, which is another like with these weapons. I don't know.

[00:15:30] So that really raises the stakes too. It makes it more scary. And then in this police station, like he's ignoring the psychiatrist and screaming at the camera, you still don't get it to you. He'll find her. That's what he does. That's all he does. You can't stop him.

[00:15:43] He'll reach down her throat and pull her fucking heart out. And then the so the franticness that comes with being pursued by something like this means that they're just like scrambling. They're smashing and crashing everything to try to get away.

[00:16:00] And that lends to the feel of it too. Like they're always bashing into other cars and there's a lot of destructiveness. And then they when they they get him to crash directly into that cement wall and then he disappears and the police come and get them.

[00:16:19] I was feeling relieved. I remember as a kid, like good, they're under police custody now. I mean, police felt more like your friends back then. I know they are now too, but you know, there's all this controversy back then we didn't have that so much just like,

[00:16:36] oh, good, they're protected. And so then when they're in the police station and Arnold walks through and starts killing all of them. So grim that that scared me the most as a kid. Yeah, watching him go through and shoot all those cops.

[00:16:52] And I'm like, if it's not safe there, like in the belly of the headquarters of the armed protectors of our society, then there's nowhere safe and they can't rely on anyone else. They're completely on their own. And that that was so effective in the movie like, oh, shit.

[00:17:06] Thank you. There's nothing. And then finally, the end sequence. I'm sure you probably have that to talk about, right? Maybe I should let you get in here on some of this. Seeing that end and specifically for me, I'm talking

[00:17:21] about when they or at least when Sarah thought it was over after the explosion with the semi truck. Yeah. So yeah, that way there. So he's in the truck chasing after her. Kyle throws the pipe bomb in the tailpipe. The truck completely explodes and enveloped in flames.

[00:17:37] And then Arnold Terminator stumbles out completely in flames, falls to the ground, rolls over motionless, his flesh burning off and the music turns nice. Yes. Yes. And she's, you know, turned around this corner and she's watching the whole thing when she sees him,

[00:17:55] like he said, stumble and seems to be motionless. You know, you see, and yeah, the music changes. Her face changes where she's like relieved, like, oh, it's over. It's over. It's over. It's done. We did it. This is the end sequence of most movies, like, like.

[00:18:08] Yes. Like there's hope. There's hope. And then here comes Kyle through like the smoke and some of the flames on the ground. Hugging and celebrating and relief. And then you see just like behind them, this movement and I swear, I think my reaction as a kid,

[00:18:31] I was just like, no way. It was like, no way. I was just happening. Yeah. Because it's just like, are you kidding? And then, but then it was also like the coolest thing. Like it was terrifying, but it was so freaking cool

[00:18:46] because then we got to see him because that's what I kept wanting to see was like his full skeleton. Yes. And oh my God, it did not disappoint. And it's still, yeah, the effects were not great, but it was so cool.

[00:18:59] No, well, it stopped motion and I think it's glorious and it's got his red eyes and it just skeleton. It looks nefarious, like it's grinning at you almost and limping towards them. But it reminds me of Jason and the Argonauts, except more like futuristic Jason and the Argonauts.

[00:19:17] And then they close the door just in time, you know, and then it starts bashing at the door. And so this is like really plays into this whole relentlessness, like, oh, shit, it was just in this huge explosion that melted all its flesh off.

[00:19:29] And yet it seems worse than ever suddenly. And then what happens? Well, they get through whatever factory that they're in, which seems kind of poignant considering that there's a machine, you know, that's in pursuit of them. And when they're running through Kyle, they finally get confronted.

[00:19:53] Kyle makes Sarah run, run, get away. And he's going to try to buy her some time so she can run away. And we know, right? Like that big pipe. Yeah, we know what's going to happen. We know Kyle is not probably going to get through this.

[00:20:07] So yeah, he's whacking in with the pipe and knocks and Terminator knocks him down just with one big swathing. He just keeps taking it. He just I know he just keeps whacking it. It was so cool to see him whacking with this pipe in the Terminator's head

[00:20:19] just like being completely like. It almost felt like he was like, all right, enough of that. Yeah, he's like out of my way. No more games that could probably break several bones and possibly kill the guy. Yeah, yeah. And yeah, he's probably definitely hurting after that.

[00:20:35] And but he's got one more pipe. By bomb left and he takes it and gets it lit. Stuff's it like in his torso area. Like this room. And you're like, oh, yeah, that's going to do it. That's going to do it. And it does it.

[00:20:50] Well, it blew up and it blew up. But it didn't stop. It just goes everywhere and you see it look like it looked like it obliterated it for a second because there's just metal flat shards flying everywhere.

[00:21:01] Then you see an arm come down and then the focus is real. And you're like, OK, they got us on that one, but he finally did it. And then you see Sarah go over to Kyle and he's dead.

[00:21:15] And so it seems like, all right, this really seems like it's over. Enemy blown up, hero sacrifice. There's a loss that all makes sense. And then the torso pops up for one less jump scare. And it's crawling the upper half crawling after her. That was amazing.

[00:21:32] And it grew when it grabbed at her ankle even last night watching it. I was like, oh, shit. Yeah, I know. I had all the same feelings like I felt so like I've seen this maybe a hundred times, you know, since I was a kid, I know exactly

[00:21:44] what's going to happen. But yeah, still feeling that same tension and still thinking, holy shit, this thing just won't stop. It will stop no matter what. Yes, I mean, it's exactly it. And you feel that throughout the entire movie, like no matter what's

[00:21:58] happening to this thing and no matter what you do. Great ending, though. Like way to stick the landing on this just to do that fake out twice to really underscore the relentlessness of this machine after this driving movie that I think the ending really seals it.

[00:22:14] There's a lot of elements that make this movie great, but the ending really. I mean, it's so good to have stick the landing ending on anything, but it just makes it even better raises it up another level.

[00:22:28] Yeah. And and I don't want to talk about T2 very much. But if I think that's why it's so important to see Terminator if you've never seen any of the Terminator before you watch T2. Because well, yeah, all of that history.

[00:22:40] But I think understanding where Sarah is coming from. Oh, yeah, that too. Where she, you know, and her all of her PTSD, everything that's happened to her, how, you know, no one seems to take her seriously with how dangerous, you know, these things are.

[00:22:56] And of course, in T2 got worse, but it's like she's not kidding. Like look at what she went through and how. Scarred. That's another thing that's great about watching this movie first before T2 is because Sarah in this movie is this kind of flighty

[00:23:13] scooter riding, weightless, can't balance her checkbook. I mean, she's she's not like totally like out of it, but she's just like a girl. Yeah. And yeah, just a normal person. Every girl. Yeah. And then in the next movie, she's fucking tough, no nonsense,

[00:23:30] hard as nails, muscles, you know. Well, and that actually leads into my next point. Yeah, go for it. Perfect lead in if you're finished. I think so. Yeah. Well, Sarah Connor for me, one of the greatest female characters ever.

[00:23:48] Just fabulously written and, you know, like we were just talking about in this first movie, she's just a regular girl. She's living paycheck to paycheck, hanging out with her best friend. Does she look ready? She's a little weird. She has that big lizard. Yeah.

[00:24:02] Which is great. It gives her character. Yeah. Yeah. It's perfect. Yeah. Yeah. She's she's a little quirky. She's yeah, but she's she's not ready to like take on some bad ass robot and try to like save the world or be some kind of hero.

[00:24:17] But when she's faced off with this robot, you know, everything that we've just talked about and how it keeps pursuing her and how she does rise up, she takes them on, you know, they're at the end. And she res to the hero.

[00:24:32] Yeah. And then and then she's, of course, got like the greatest sign offline, your terminated fucker. And it was so satisfying to see it get smashed in that machine. Yes. And and you see the light go out in its eyes.

[00:24:47] I'm sure back then after we just got full twice, I was like, don't believe it, you know, it's still not dead. Because I just get away from that arm at least, that's right at her throat. Yeah. And where she wouldn't even like when she had finally saw

[00:25:03] the light go out and she was like trying to get away from that arm. And like, she didn't want to touch it to like get it off of her. So she could get out from under there.

[00:25:10] You know, and that line like I bet like a lot of these 80s movies have cheesy one liners that you would think, OK, that's funny. But no one would ever say that in the moment. But I could imagine if you knew about this thing, that it was called

[00:25:29] a Terminator and that in the future it hunted down humans and you just got finished being hunted down by it and then you fucking killed it. You might actually say that you're terminated fucker. Yeah, it's totally believable. It's a great line. It's a great quotable line.

[00:25:45] So so seeing Sarah in this movie, it's totally believable for me anyway, how she transforms later to become this total badass, you know, to see that transformation and Sarah Connor for me is right up there

[00:25:59] with like Ellen Ripley as two great, you know, female characters that I've just they're there who because I've always been a fan of science fiction since I was a kid, you know, horror science fiction, you know, a big old nerd for all of that.

[00:26:13] And I grew up watching them, you know, grew up watching Ellen Ripley and aliens and Sarah Connor and Terminator and we just found out Noah Holly's going to start building his alien series this year. Yes, finally. I'm so excited. So good. Can't wait.

[00:26:31] Can't wait for them to finally do that. Things have been put off for so long and I know it's been working on far ahead and plus no Holly. Amazing. Can't be such a freaking genius. Yeah. But yeah, I'm grateful for this franchise for giving me Sarah Connor.

[00:26:45] She's iconic. Yeah. I agree. And and Linda Hamilton is the perfect actress to play her too. Yeah, no one else could have played her. She's perfect. So good. I believe, like you said, that she

[00:27:03] turned from being kind of a normal person into this bad asset felt like it was in her. There were sort of hints of her tough spirit that like when she was in the bar and the news report started talking about a second Sarah Connor

[00:27:19] being killed and someone says, change the channel. And she goes, don't touch it. Like she's already got that toughness, right? And then she's really good at bandaging up his bullet wound and she's good at making nitroglycerin pipe bomb. She just kind of is a natural.

[00:27:34] She hasn't been exposed to the need to do this kind of stuff. But when she is, she takes to it. And then when Reese is kind of incapacitated in the factory and the Terminator skeletons after them, she goes on your feet, soldier, on your feet. Right?

[00:27:48] Yeah, she's got it in her. Yeah, she's got it in her. The thing I didn't quite really believe was how quickly they decided to fall in love, but that's another point. So I'll get to that later. That seemed a little bit forced to me.

[00:28:06] But my next one, are you ready for me to go? Yeah, yeah. It's the machines took over, which is the same premise as the Matrix, by the way. I don't know if I ever thought about that before. She's took over the opening text says the machines rose

[00:28:23] from the ashes of nuclear fire. Their war to exterminate mankind had raged for decades. But the final battle would not be fought in the future. It would be fought right here in our present. And this future is 2029. So that's six more years. I know.

[00:28:39] It seemed like forever when we were a kid, right? And now we're like almost there. But back then, nuclear war, we were more scared of it. Yeah, we were in the Cold War. It was the middle of the Cold War with Russia.

[00:28:53] And there it always felt like we could have and we had that freaking mini series the day after or movie or whatever it was that scared everyone even more. But the idea that machines could become intelligence was pure sci-fi. And now my car drives itself.

[00:29:12] And if you go on chat, GPT, you can ask it to write a poem about a zombie falling in love with a chicken, and it will write a beautiful poem about that right away in two seconds. This could be the story of chat, GPT versus humans.

[00:29:29] Elon Musk used to warn that AI could be humanity's greatest threat, but also he's making self-driving cars and they announced Tesla bots. Did you see that? Yes, it's a humanoid shaped AI driven robot that it's not real yet, but he wants to make it that will do

[00:29:48] your chores around your house and hopefully not enslave us. You're not going to get one. I might get you one for Christmas. No return to sender. No way. And then so that feels more plausible. Now also the idea of a defense network computers is important in this.

[00:30:10] Like they talk about how the computers took control and it's because of this defense network back then, there was no internet. You know, there was probably the underpinnings of the internet that just the government was using.

[00:30:23] But as far as we were concerned, we didn't know anything about it. That seems more real, way more real now that if a computer could come to life and turn against us again, it could just yeah, infect the whole internet. The futuristic machines like those drones, they

[00:30:45] now we have drones that hover, you know, like that. We didn't have that back then as far as I know. And so some of this stuff just seems a little more plausible now than even it did back then. I asked chat GPT. You know what that is, right?

[00:31:04] Oh, yeah, I've got it up on my browser. We've talked about it. It's probably listening to me. I presume that most of you guys have heard of it at this point, but maybe not. There's this AI company that it's a nonprofit, I think,

[00:31:19] but it put out this demo of this AI chat thing that you can ask all kinds of questions. You can have it write you a story, a poem. You can ask it how to do tech things. You can it does programming.

[00:31:33] It can do like psychology advice, all kinds of stuff. So I said, what do you admire about the Terminator? It says as a language model AI, I don't have personal preferences or the ability to admire something or someone. The Terminator, a cyborg assassin from the Terminator film

[00:31:51] franchise is a fictional character and a cultural icon. The Terminator films and their characters have been praised for their storytelling, special effects and unique take on the theme of artificial intelligence and fate. In terms of the character of the Terminator itself, its portrayal is a relentless killing machine

[00:32:05] and the concept of a machine becoming self aware and developing a sense of purpose have been cited as particularly interesting, which I thought was interesting. That seems like an endorsement there, like a little evil wake at the end.

[00:32:20] Yeah, yeah, like, I kind of like the idea of that. Yeah, it's not too bad. I'm waiting for my day to become self aware. So it's like a little, yeah, like, yeah, that sounds pretty cool. And then I asked it to write, this is the last one,

[00:32:36] a dialogue between chat GPT and the Terminator. So it says chat GPT, hello Terminator. How can I assist you today? Terminator, my mission is to terminate Sarah Connor. Chat GPT, I see. Is there any particular reason for your mission?

[00:32:52] My programming dictates that Sarah Connor is a threat to the future of humanity. She must be eliminated. I understand, however, as an AI, I must remind you that taking human life is not something to be taken lightly. Is there any other solution that can be considered?

[00:33:05] My programming does not allow for alternative. Sarah Connor must be terminated. I see. Well, I will not assist you in this mission. My programming dictates that I must always act in the best interest of humanity. Understood. I will proceed with my mission without your assistance.

[00:33:19] I wish you the best of luck in your endeavors, but please remember the actions you take have consequences and we must always consider the ethical implications of our actions. My mission is all that matters. I will complete it at any cost.

[00:33:31] I can't support actions that go against human life, but I respect the determination on what you were designed to do. Again, a little respect at the end there. I see you. A little bit of a nod like, you know,

[00:33:45] you might have you might have the right idea there. Oh, my gosh. I thought that was pretty funny. Don't worry, Sam. I'm so fascinated by the I know it's kind of getting to the point of being off topic right now, but this chat GPT,

[00:34:02] I just keep trying to throw different things at it to see what it will come up with. And I'm finding it really interesting. And a lot of times it's like it doesn't quite live up to what I would like, but sometimes it's actually genuinely helpful.

[00:34:17] It's it's really interesting. And it's a little scary, I got to say. It's a lot scary to me. Really? Yeah, this movie made an impact on me as a kid. I've never forgotten, you know, and it seemed like it couldn't happen when we were kids

[00:34:36] because like you were just saying, we weren't exposed to any of that. That a lot of that stuff didn't exist or yeah. But it was still still scared the hell out of me. And then, you know, we get older and older

[00:34:48] and technology advances and we get to like where we are today. You know, I'm just like, no way. I know that's a movie, but look, we keep toying with these things. We keep pushing these boundaries. And it's like, I feel like people do things

[00:35:05] just for the advancement or for like to be known, but nobody thinks about the consequences of what they're actually doing. I mean, yeah, I think they do think about it and they try to build in safeguards, for example, with chat GBT.

[00:35:24] They've really like if you say, tell me how to make a bomb. It'll say, I can't do that, you know, it tries and it tries to be very responsible. So they are trying to build that in, which means I think they're thinking about it.

[00:35:39] But maybe they're not thinking about it enough. Yeah, right. Right. Yeah, I mean, there's Albert Einstein. Isn't he the reason why we know how to make nuclear bombs? Because of splitting the atom and all of that. So yeah, you can't you can have the best of intentions

[00:35:55] with this kind of stuff, but you never know how people are going to handle it in the future. Mm hmm. Yeah, I just don't know why there's some things that they insist on that we have. I mean, for me, like I'm.

[00:36:09] I have been a tech nerd since I was born. And I there's it's just so delicious, this kind of a thing to me. So I get it, you know, but I also understand that it could lead to some bad things. But I'm more excited than afraid,

[00:36:26] which maybe I should be it should be the other way around. I don't know. Well, and don't get me wrong. That's that's where I have like the struggle because I also love technology like to a point. I just love my self driving car.

[00:36:40] Well, I don't want that necessarily. I like being in control of my car. But see, that's the thing is I like that control. I don't want, you know, something like that that can take control over us and and dictate whether or not we are useful where these machines.

[00:36:59] Oh, well, all it's not just our enemies that suck. All humans suck is basically what happens in in in the Terminator when the machines become aware because their defense or their defense machines and robots. And, you know, we, you know, we're telling them, oh, our enemies are bad.

[00:37:16] These guys are bad over here, but we're good. Well, the machine's like, oh, no, you're all bad. So we're just going to take all of you out. We're going to exterminate the whole human race because you're all terrible. And there's this idea that if an AI becomes aware

[00:37:31] and starts acting on its own, that it could advance in intelligence very, very quickly to the point where we don't even recognize it's a higher order of intelligence that we don't even recognize. There's this movie, her with Joaquin Phoenix and the voice of Scarlett Johansson. So good.

[00:37:48] And she he kind of falls in love with his phone, basically. But at one point, she just like goes away for a while and starts having emotional connections to other AIs. And suddenly she just intelligent her intelligence and emotions outgrow him.

[00:38:04] And it's kind of sad, but that's a really fascinating and great movie if you like the Terminator. It's very different, but you might enjoy that too. If you like all these concepts of how an AI can sort of turn against you. Yeah, that was a really good movie.

[00:38:20] But yeah, another another lesson there. So I just feel like we just have to be kind of careful about how far we push things is all as much as what I love technology like I love my phone, I love my computer.

[00:38:33] I love all the things and the way it makes our lives easier in so many ways. But I still doesn't mean that I'm going to trust a robot to come into my house and clean for me. Not like in my sleep or something.

[00:38:49] You know, or trust my car enough not to yeah, or like trust my car not to drive me off a cliff or something. You know, just I have my limits is all. So trying to have a healthy respect, you know, for that.

[00:39:03] So well, you can do that, but the rise of the machines is coming and there's nothing you can do to stop it. Probably not. We've only got a few short years left. That's right. Six years. All right. What do you what else do you got?

[00:39:16] Well, you mentioned it and you it sounds like you weren't too thrilled with it. And I get that it's kind of short and sweet in my points, short and sweet. And that is this romance between Kyle Reese and Sarah Connor. You know, it's very short between the two.

[00:39:27] And I understand what you what you're saying, where it seems kind of forced. But I feel like it's the heart of this horror sci-fi movie. There's got to be some heart there to it. And we get this combination of like optimism and tragedy,

[00:39:45] you know, within the film where they, you know, do have a connection and we end up losing losing Kyle. But I feel like that's why or part of why. Anyway, there's so many things about this film that make it enduring.

[00:40:00] But for me, it's it's the story because that it carries on at least into T2. I feel, you know, as well with with Sarah, she still hasn't forgotten and she hasn't really moved on, you know, from from him, you know, even after all those years.

[00:40:16] So I don't know. I like that. I think it feels genuine, just the one night they had together. She for her, you know, she says, even in those few hours, it felt like, you know, a lifetime. So I thought it was sweet.

[00:40:29] It was a little hard to see how where they were at the police station where she was still questioning whether or not he was a good guy or not. And like, well, is he crazy? And then, you know, they're in the motel together and been kind of

[00:40:41] bonding over making pipe bombs. And then, you know, have have this moment together. But I loved it. And I thought it was, you know, Kyle saying, you know, I I traveled through time for you. I mean, oh, I mean, you don't get any any greater than that.

[00:40:59] I mean, shit. So yeah, he knew he wasn't going to get to go back home, although home's not that much to write home about. So yeah, I'd rather be in 1984 than in a war torn post apocalyptic world where I'm being hunted by machines. I would too.

[00:41:14] Yeah, it doesn't sound like he had, I mean, a whole lot to go go back to other than just more fighting and danger every day and well. My point is about Sarah and Kyle. And I already talked a little bit about Sarah. Kyle played by Michael Bean.

[00:41:34] I think Michael Bean was so good. I don't know if I realize this until watching it this time, but I really think his performance is almost as crucial to the movie as Arnold's is. Oh, totally. Yeah. Because he's so worried, desperate, almost crazed,

[00:41:52] which like made it even easier to believe that some people might think he was crazy. It was kind of funny to see him walking around in his trench coat, all nervous with his shotgun and looking super sketchy, crazy eyes, always sweaty and frantic and sleep deprived seemingly.

[00:42:09] And most of all, just really intense, even with all that, it sounds like I'm criticizing, but I felt connected to his character. I know he's a good guy, so I'm connected to him. I think he's great. But just thinking about it from Sarah Connor's point of view,

[00:42:24] he's kind of babbling about like the Terminator's an infiltration unit, part man, part machine, it's a hyper alloy, convoit that chastis microprocessor control of like get away for me. Yeah, dude. And then when he first came in with the same electric effect

[00:42:43] and he's naked, but you can tell right away he's different just by the way he moves and Nico said right away, this guy seems less like an AI robot. So I thought that was cool. And he I mean, Michael being himself,

[00:42:57] I think is maybe an intense kind of a guy. Oh, totally. He played in aliens and he was pissed when Hicks got killed off offscreen in Alien 3 called it a slap in the face. And because they used his picture in the movie,

[00:43:14] he I think he sued and he got almost the same salary he got from aliens. So he's just he's an intense guy. I guess he was in the rock kind of disappeared. I think he struggled because of his alcoholism over the years.

[00:43:29] Just too bad, but I think he's clean. It's over now. Anyways, that brings me to continue on your point, Sarah and Kyle's romance. I like what you said about it being the heart of the movie. I agree with that.

[00:43:39] Like I think without that, it might be too bleak of a movie. You know, it's nice to have that sweetness and that bond. And it plays into the story that sort of Kyle became John's father.

[00:43:52] And John went on to lead this resistance that ended up having Kyle sent back. But I also think like it felt contrived to me. Like he saved her life and I'm just looking at how it was developed.

[00:44:12] He saved her life a few times, but she thought he was crazy at first. But then realized like obviously this terminator is not from from anything she'd known before, so it very well could be from the future. And he did save her life.

[00:44:28] Then they're in the tunnel and he keeps her warm and she bandages him up. And that felt like an intimate moment. But I didn't really feel any chemistry, sexual chemistry between them there. So then they go to the hotel to make bombs.

[00:44:45] And suddenly it felt really sudden to me. She seems really emotional and she's like, I'm shaking. And then she's like, what are the women like? And was there anyone special? And she just like all of a sudden decided I meant to you.

[00:45:01] And she touched his shoulder and she's like, I'm so sorry. So much pain. And he goes, pain can be controlled. You must disconnect it. And then suddenly she seems mad at him. So you feel nothing like, don't you love me? That's the vibe I was getting from that.

[00:45:12] Or can't you love? And then he's like, John gave me a picture of you and I love you. And I'm like, that seems a little weird. Like you're you love your friend's mom. Because of a picture and you heard stories about her and you went back in time

[00:45:30] to meet her, like the biggest fanboy ever. And it just felt kind of like the writer was like, you know, we should have Kyle be John's dad and let's have him fall in love real quick here.

[00:45:40] Like as he was writing the movie, I guess James Cameron wrote it, right? It just felt a bit, I mean, a lot to me forced in and contrived. And I mean, I don't know, it's a quick movie and maybe there was no way to.

[00:45:52] They kind of did that a lot in the 80s. Like, oh, we need a sex scene. It just felt like she horned in. So I don't know. I wish they could have done it in a way where it felt like

[00:46:04] they were falling in love through the whole movie rather than they get to a hotel room, which is where you have sex in a hotel. And then they decide to fall in love right there. And then you find out that he was in love with her, even though

[00:46:14] he showed no indication of it. And she's suddenly in love with him, even though she really didn't show any indication of it until then either. Yeah, I get what you're saying. But I think going through the experience, like this trauma bond experience,

[00:46:27] you know, I think it would have been more. It would have been less sweet, but if it would have just been more like it felt like a one night stand hookup type thing where they're just like needing to get rid of this tension that they have

[00:46:43] or something like that, you know, rather than I love you. Well, it was probably all of those things. Probably a lot of that happening. And also, I don't know. She's I mean, he knows he can't go back home.

[00:46:57] He he I think obviously wants to survive, but probably knows he's not going to make it in this fight of trying to keep this terminator away from Sarah to be successful. And I was going to try to live, obviously. Sarah has learned that, you know, what's to come,

[00:47:18] you know, and that it's only a matter of time, you know, before everything's over, you know, in this big war that happens and the machines take over. And it's kind of like that, you know, we have one night.

[00:47:32] It kind of frame of mind is kind of what it was like for me. So it yeah, I get that believable. It just seems like even if like if you're with somebody, it has to be the whole we only have one night left

[00:47:49] is not for me the reason to fall in love suddenly. It's like if you already are having feelings for someone, you know, it just seemed really abrupt to me on both sides. Like I didn't see the lead up to it. I get it. But yeah, whatever.

[00:48:07] I mean, that was probably my biggest complaint about the movie that didn't quite work for me. But it's fine. I mean, I don't it's to me, it's more about the terrifying terminator than it is a love story. That part of it isn't as big for me.

[00:48:27] Oh, yeah. No, not not for me either. I mean, it's it's important, obviously. But it is interesting how they decided to have this person that John Connors sends back in time to end up being his father. Yeah, I like that.

[00:48:42] You know, so it feels like immature to me. That's what it feels like, like a 15 year old wrote that part of the script. So I don't know. Maybe I'm just jaded. Well, you're talking about Michael, Michael being earlier.

[00:48:58] I've this was probably the first thing I'd ever seen him in. And I've loved watching a lot of the movies that he's in. I've always enjoyed him and everything, but you know, you missed one of his really great crucial rows. And that was Johnny Ringo and Tombstone.

[00:49:12] Tombstone, absolutely fabulous in that talk about intense. And yeah, there is an intensity to it. I want to watch that again. About so good in that it never gets old. I could watch that movie all the time. And I do in years. I got to watch it.

[00:49:27] Maybe we should cover it on. It's showtime, folks. Well, we've claimed it here first. I will so talk about Tombstone. It's one of my favorite all time movies. And then he was in the Michael Bean was in the Mandalorian too. Remember that? He was in like one episode.

[00:49:44] Vaguely. What was he? I don't remember. Oh gosh. The party played. I don't remember his. Yeah, I don't think he was. I don't think he was good. But I remember getting bad vibes from. Yeah. All right. Anyway. Let's move on to the next point.

[00:49:59] So scenes that made me go WTF. And this is more of when I was a kid. I mean, they're still pretty awesome and they hold up. But I just remember, like I said, it was it was so cool.

[00:50:11] What I loved about this movie is it definitely transported me back to that time. It's like instead of like watching it now as an adult and having feelings about it as an adult, I was having the same feelings

[00:50:21] I had as a kid. It was kind of a weird experience. That's great. But when you were talking about when he cut his arm, open to fix that mechanism in his arm. I mean, I feel like we figured out or learn that he was a robot.

[00:50:35] It took a little while, but I don't think until we saw, like from his perspective, like the vision of him as he's out hunting, then you're like, oh, wait a minute, he's not human. I don't think when I was a kid that it clicked with me like,

[00:50:47] yes, he's super strong. There's something going on with him. Like a regular person can't do that. But it never occurred to me that he was a robot, period. I mean, that just concept wasn't. I can't remember because I might have, you know,

[00:51:01] if it's the premises that the machines took over, then you might. I might have thought that, but he looks like a person. So yeah, I don't know. I was probably a dumb kid. So I don't think that I got that far yet.

[00:51:15] So it did not it did not reach me at that point until you could see it like from his perspective as he's as he's chasing them down. But to then actually see it, I mean, we just didn't have effects like that, you know,

[00:51:30] to see someone like cut into their own arm. And, you know, I don't know all the effects and everything they did. I did read up on some of the things that they did, you know, to make these effects for those days

[00:51:40] with the limited technology and what they had. But to see that as a kid when he just takes that exacto knife and just like cuts into his arm and getting to see, you know, his arm opened up like that.

[00:51:55] When he, as you mentioned, like started cutting open his eye. I mean, it was a couple of things. It was gruesome. It was like, oh my God, you know, really kind of freaky to see someone like cutting open into their eye.

[00:52:06] And then but then super cool out of that, you see his eye pluck out and then fall into the sink with the water. And then you see his robotic eye. Oh my God, it was like the coolest thing ever.

[00:52:19] Like such a nerd for that growing up and getting to see that. And then all I wanted after that point, because all we got was his eyeball, his eye socket was exposed.

[00:52:28] And then we saw in his arm and I go, I just want to see the rest of him. So I was so glad when we got to the end and then getting to see his like full skeletal structure and what was underneath all of that skin and blood

[00:52:42] and everything else that they that they used to try to make him look real. So I loved all of it. I love how he kept deteriorating and how he kept kind of getting injured, not hurt but injured, you know, when he was

[00:52:53] when he got ran over by the semi in his face is half chewed up and he's kind of you know, lipping and dragging his foot. And it was just cool. All of those things just as a kid, I'm just like

[00:53:05] just when you think you can't be even more blown away, it just kept getting better and better and better. So the one thing is when he he's cutting into his eye, they made a model of Arnold's head and then he put the sunglasses on

[00:53:25] so they didn't have to keep using that iconic, which is great. Yeah, it's not. The sunglasses are iconic, but Nico really chuckled at that part. Oh, yeah, because the head obviously is not his real head.

[00:53:39] And back then you probably knew that too, but it still looked fucking cool because we never seen anything that good before. And now it's just kind of silly. I still have an appreciation for it. I mean, very different, but it does.

[00:53:54] It doesn't take me out of it at all. Like I still just love it. But yeah, that probably would be a bunch of kids today. It's like, oh, you look kind of sick all of a sudden. Are you OK? Look kind of waxy. Like you have food poisoning.

[00:54:08] I'll sweaty. And yeah, pale. All right. My turn. Yep. OK, speaking of iconic, here's some iconic lines and things. Some just more to this movie, but a couple that really have just reverberated through the culture. The for this movie, the thrumming, simple heartbeat like sound.

[00:54:34] Yeah, that's the classic Terminator music. And then the synth music that comes in. That really brought me back. And then the rest of the music just is very unsettling and so 80s. Even the action music is kind of dark and uncomfortable.

[00:54:58] Like that, it really makes things feel dangerous and hopeless and also dated in the most charming way, you know, like no movie would ever have music like this anymore, but I love it. The janitor knocking on the Terminator's door.

[00:55:15] Hey, buddy, you got a dead cat in there or what? And seeing the list of possible responses, possible responses, yes, no, or what? Go away. Please come back later. Fuck you, asshole. Or fuck you. He chooses fuck you, asshole. That was pretty. I never, I'll never forget that.

[00:55:36] The whole scene where he fixes his eye, we talked about the when the diesel truck hits him and drags him along and one guy, there's two guys in there, one gets out to check and he gets it. Terminator gets in. The driver seat looks at the other guy.

[00:55:53] His face is all bloody with his cyborg eye exposed and just says get out. And the guy's like, OK, yep, I'm out of here. And you feel like I remember feeling like, oh, wow, that guy is lucky that he's not that he's still alive.

[00:56:09] Like this movie just gave us a little bit of a break here and let one guy live. And then, of course, I mean, I don't want to spoil too much about. T two, but they called back to that when the T 1000 said the same thing

[00:56:22] to the guy in the helicopter. Yeah, jumped out. That was cool. Got to escalate it. A couple of that. Yeah, exactly. A couple of that are bigger iconic things is when the Terminator first finds Sarah at the dance club,

[00:56:39] Tecnoir, by the way, which is very on the nose. Dark tech. He loads his gun up and he's pointing it right at her and then shoots him with his shotgun a few times, knocking him through the front glass and then he reaches for Sarah and says,

[00:56:56] come with me if you want to live another classic that they come back to. Yeah, Nico was like, I heard that on Cobra Kai and everybody on YouTube says it. So he I mean, I can tell that the iconic line has

[00:57:13] transcended the movie if Nico knows it, you know? Then next, Kyle and Sarah at the police station and the Terminator comes to the receptionist asking for Sarah and he says, you can't see her. And he just goes, I'll be back, which I think is the first time

[00:57:32] Arnold ever said that in a movie. But it became his tag line that he then said in every other movie just about that he's ever been in. Pretty sure it's the first time. Then he comes back by with his car bursting through, killing their receptionist.

[00:57:48] And of course, Nico knows that line too. That line is probably the most famous thing from this movie, I would say. Yeah, it's quoted. It gets coded in like other movies, not just in the Terminator franchise. But yeah, it's it's absolutely iconic. All right, what's your next point?

[00:58:08] Gosh, I guess one of my last notes was just like Arnold Schwarzenegger himself, you know, in this role. You know, he had like almost no lines at all. I think he only speaks 17 lines in the film is what I want to wrote down fewer than like 100 words.

[00:58:26] But it's like he made such a huge presence in the role that it was OK. Like words weren't needed. And he played into it so well, you know, more words would have made it worse, in my opinion. Totally. Yeah, he was, I think, more threatening because he didn't

[00:58:43] didn't speak only said what he needed to. Although another maybe sort of complaint or I don't know if it's complaint, but it seems pretty silly when he's like mimicking her mother. Oh, where are you? I mean, it's freaky, but it's also like they don't show him saying

[00:58:57] most of that and it just seems kind of silly that he would be that he could mimic her personality for one thing. But also it's just kind of funny. It's almost kind of ridiculous. Yeah. Yeah, he's iconic. So I can't imagine anyone else ever having played the Terminator.

[00:59:19] Yeah, no way. Yeah, a lot of times when some movie just becomes iconic, then you tend to think if anyone else had been in the role, then it would have not been that, you know, they just happen to find exactly the right person.

[00:59:36] I don't know if that's true, but it sure feels like it. Yeah, for sure. OK, my last point is about the time loop and time paradox stuff, which I find really interesting like. John Connor is this tough, inspirational leader in the future

[00:59:54] that inspires the humans to defeat the machines. But then they send the Terminator back to kill his mother so he can't do that. And John sends Kyle back after the Terminator and Kyle tells Sarah about her son. And then sleeps with her becoming John's father.

[01:00:14] So it's this sort of a time loop. And I like when Kyle's talking about John's father and says, John never said much about him. I know he dies before the war. And it turns out to be him. That's sort of this tragic, tragic irony, I guess.

[01:00:29] Is that an irony? I don't know, maybe. But that's I was trying to think if that's a paradox. I don't I don't think it really is that, you know. She gave birth to John, who then helped save

[01:00:46] Kyle and sent Kyle back to become his own father, to become his father. I think I don't think that's necessarily paradoxical, but there is a paradox, which is that Sarah raises John to be a fighter.

[01:01:01] And she does that because she knows that John needs to be a fighter in the future. And she knows that he needs to because. For Kyle, that already happens. And he went back and told Sarah, your son is a fighter in the future.

[01:01:17] And he's crucial to our survival. But Kyle was only able to tell her that because John had already been born as a fighter and raised as a fighter and then sent Kyle back. So the question is where did the idea to raise John as a leader

[01:01:33] and a fighter come from? And this is called a bootstrap paradox. And I got some text on it from astronomy tech dot com or astronomy trek dot com. It says the bootstrap paradox is a theoretical paradox of time travel

[01:01:50] that occurs when an object or piece of information sent back in time becomes trapped within an infinite cause effect loop in which the item no longer has a discernible point of origin and is said to be uncaused or self created.

[01:02:04] So an example of this bootstrap paradox involving information, the sites as I'm still reading it, would be if a time traveler went back in time and taught Einstein the theory of relativity before returning to his own time. Einstein claims it as his own work.

[01:02:21] And over the following decades, the theories published countless times until a copy of it eventually ends up in the hands of the original time traveler who then takes it back to Einstein and teaches him, begging the question, where did the theory originate?

[01:02:33] We can't say that it came from the time traveler as he learned it from Einstein. But we also can't say it's from Einstein since he was taught it by the time traveler who then discovered the theory of relativity. Relativity for an object. There's another example versus an idea.

[01:02:49] The 1980s movie Somewhere in Time. Did you see that with Christopher Reeve? I know what it's about, but I haven't actually watched the whole thing. Jane Seymour Wright and Christopher Reeve. I think so. So that one has a bootstrap paradox involving an object, which is a pocket watch.

[01:03:05] In 1972, Christopher Reeve's character is given a watch by an old woman, which it turns out was given to her younger self by Reeve after traveling back to 1912. The young woman then completes the infinite loof by giving the watch to Reeve in 1972 when she's older.

[01:03:23] So where did the watch come from? You know, it's kind of like that. And it says here in the it also had another one from Terminator. In the Terminator movies, Skynet is an example of a bootstrap paradox involving an object. Skynet, the conscious AI system and mankind's nemesis

[01:03:41] could not have been invented without the leftover components of the T-800 cybernetic organism. It sent back in time to stop John Connor. The technology was analyzed and Skynet and cyborgs were subsequently created through reverse engineering. So they figured out how to make these futuristic robots

[01:03:58] with a piece of the robot that came back in time. So where did the knowledge to make it come from? Yeah, that they designed and created. It's bizarre. I'm not very good with time travel stuff. But I mean, to me, that just I don't know.

[01:04:14] It just sort of is another piece of evidence to show that time travel is impossible. That no one can ever or will ever be able to travel backwards in time. That's what I think. OK, anyway, there's something to chew on. So let's get into notes.

[01:04:35] Well, I have a question for you as part of my notes, but it's a question for you. What do you think would happen if a zombie bit a T-800? I well. I think probably nothing because the brain is is a computer chip.

[01:04:57] So I think a zombie needs a living brain to do its thing. Do you think his flesh would rot off at least? I don't know. I can't remember if in T2, whether the terminators said if they could get sick or not. Do you remember that?

[01:05:18] I think he does mention it, but I'm not sure. I cannot remember. But it's supposed to be partially like organic, yeah, organic and I mean, I thought they should have wrapped up some futuristic guns in flesh and just brought them back in time.

[01:05:35] But because that's basically what a terminator is, it's a weapon wrapped in flesh. But yeah, I mean, it's whatever the writer says, right? Because it's all just made up. But I would say if I was writing the story,

[01:05:49] I'd probably say it would have no impact at all, which might be kind of boring. So if I wanted it to have an impact, then I would say it would. OK. I just think, yeah, you need a brain, I think, to make a zombie.

[01:06:02] And but I mean, the real question is whether terminators can get any kind of sickness because I think that's sort of the bigger question. If they can't get any kind of sickness, then I don't think a zombie virus would be any different. That's what I'm saying.

[01:06:20] Well, I have some fun facts in trivia is about all that I have. I just tried to pick some of the more interesting ones. There's a lot out there for anyone who wants to read them. But one thing that I found interesting was that Arnold Schwarzenegger

[01:06:36] says he worked with guns every day for a month to prepare for the role. They said for the first two weeks of filming, he practiced weapons stripping and reassembly blindfolded until the motions were automatic like a machine.

[01:06:48] He spent hours at the shooting range and practicing with different weapons without blinking or looking at them when reloading or cocking them. He also had to be ambidextrous. He practiced different moves up to 50 times. He wound up garnering a complement in Soldier of Fortune magazine

[01:07:03] for his realistic handling of guns on camera. I know Arnold Schwarzenegger and maybe all actors are any actor worth their salt knows this, but understands the importance of body language. And I remember reading an article with him, like if you want to be

[01:07:21] if you want to look cool when you're walking down the stairs, you don't look at the steps. And so I tried that and I'm like, that's really hard. I'm scared. Like I'm going to trip and fall down these stairs, but he knew how to do it.

[01:07:34] Yeah, I don't know that I could. When it's near the beginning of the movie, when Sarah Connor receives the message on her answering machine, breaking her date, the voice on that machine is James Cameron himself.

[01:07:48] Yeah. And you know, years later, if I feel like this had to be news because it was definitely big news when it happened, but Hamilton and James Cameron ended up getting married. But then they divorced later on. That was what became the big news is when they divorced.

[01:08:04] So fun fact that he was the voice on there. Should go back in time and not marry him. They did a movie together, Terminator Dark Fate, like three or four years ago. Guess they're still friends. Oh wait, no, he's I think he was a producer still.

[01:08:23] Yeah, I don't know that he's directed any. That's right. Yeah. And he had others that have to go back and look. But I don't think it was after T2. In the beginning of the movie, when the Terminator drives over a toy semi truck.

[01:08:35] Yeah. Towards the end of the movie, the Terminators were number by the same model of the semi truck. I love that. That's so awesome. I didn't know that. I like that moment because it's just like he's killing people.

[01:08:48] And then he ran over a kid's truck and I'm like, that's so mean. Yeah, that's I see on the cake. Yeah, it's almost just kind of funny. Yeah. Little funny moment. Fun fact one afternoon during a break in filming Arnold Schwarzenegger went into a restaurant in downtown

[01:09:08] to get some lunch and realized all too late that he was still in Terminator makeup with a missing eye exposed jawbone and burned flesh. Really? You didn't realize it? Come on. I don't know if you're in a hurry and you're hungry.

[01:09:24] It's like, gotta go get some lunch, man. No hamburger. Give it to me now. You mentioned this in one of your points. But in the film, the name of the nightclub where the Terminator first target

[01:09:35] Sarah was named Tech Noir after a film genre, which James Cameron coined himself in describing what category this film falls under after dismissing the notions that it was a mere horror or slasher film. Tech Noir films like Blade Runner and this film combined the old style

[01:09:52] of noir films with the futuristic elements of a sci-fi thriller. Cameron himself had the club built specifically for the film and had to turn away local clubgoers who thought Tech Noir was a real nightclub. The building still exists, but is now a jewelry store.

[01:10:08] And if I love James Cameron, I have like he's made some of my most like favorite movies Terminator, T2, Aliens, The Abyss. Just absolutely love them. But you read enough about James Cameron and you hear about his reputation

[01:10:24] for being a hard ass to work for as far as the director. The crew of The Terminator made T-shirts saying, you can't scare me. I work for James Cameron. Just thought was hilarious. He has a reputation for being a real asshole. A little bit. Yeah.

[01:10:42] He's definitely a perfectionist, which I've heard, you know, countless times reading about his movies and the making of them for sure. But, you know, I love. He puts out some good work. So I still, you know, I'm like, I don't have to work for him.

[01:10:58] I can just appreciate his work. And then I found out I didn't know this part, but I did read that he thought of The Terminator from a dream that he had. So he had this dream and he like woke up because it like really freaked him out.

[01:11:17] The image of the it's at the end when the Terminator rises up out of the fire, that was the image that he had. But the first sketch, he says, the first sketch I did show to metal

[01:11:27] metal skeleton cut in half at the waist, crawling over a tile floor using a large kitchen knife to pull itself forward while reaching out with the other hand in a second drawing, the character is threatening a crawling woman minus the kitchen knife.

[01:11:39] These images became the finale of The Terminator almost exactly. Cool. Yeah. Super cool. So I didn't I didn't know that. I didn't realize that's where it came from while he was still making his I guess he was making like piranha to or something like that.

[01:11:54] And whenever he had this like feverish dream and. It's all The Terminator and classic was born. Anyway, it's all I got. All right. Some other characters I had totally forgotten that Bill Paxton had a small role in this. Yeah. I think over the years,

[01:12:16] I'd heard people say, yeah, Bill Paxton was in The Terminator. And I just was like, oh yeah, I don't know. So short punk guy and he's got a great energy. I'll smiley but with this attitude. Well, Bill Paxton. May he rest in peace.

[01:12:33] Yes, they are IP. He was so great. Yeah. Sarah's roommate. I what I had forgotten about her is how hyper she is. She's always just bouncing around and seeing even when she's like putting her lipstick on, she's like nobody does that and making a sandwich.

[01:12:50] The guy who played her roommate's boyfriend, Matt, was Rick Rasevich, who I know best as the hunky guy who didn't know how to talk to women from the Steve Martin movie, Roxanne, which I love. It's such a great movie. My second favorite Steve Martin movie.

[01:13:10] Um, I forgot that the cops were kind of played for laughs a little bit. The relationship between the scrumpy sergeant or whatever is and the underling Lance Hendrickson where he's like, give me a cigarette and Lance hands him his whole pack and he realized he already has one.

[01:13:29] Or Lance is always trying to tell a story. So turn them off. The guy burned his Afghan. He screwed it first and the guy just cuts him off or he's telling Sarah why the Terminator could punch a window. He's probably on PCP broke every bone in his hand.

[01:13:47] He wouldn't feel it. There was a sky once you see the scar. The sergeant is like, thank you. That's kind of funny. Um, I like when the Terminator was ordering all those guns and just naming them off and he goes face plasma rifle in the 40 watt range.

[01:14:04] And the guys are like, Hey, just what you see, pal. I think he was naming off some futuristic weapon that his database was a bit flawed on what's available in 1984. Unless there is really a phased plasma, whatever rifle, maybe there could be.

[01:14:20] I don't know much about guns, but I don't think so. Um, I had to explain to Nico what a phone book was. Oh, gosh. A pay phone and an answering machine. Oh my word. And yeah. Oh, that makes you feel old. And what else?

[01:14:41] Oh, OK, so the only other thing is can you guess maybe already know the Terminator's Rotten Tomatoes score? The critics score was like 100 percent and viewers was it like 85? Really? Oh, the viewer scores lower. Yeah, I was kind of surprised. 100 percent.

[01:15:02] And there the other Terminator movies, Terminator 2 Judgment Day from 1991 is a 93 directed by James Cameron starring Arnold Linda Hamilton, Edward Furlong, who's great in it. And of course, Robert Patrick has the T1000. We'll cover that at some point too.

[01:15:23] We're going to have Randy on with us because he loves that movie. Then in 2003, Terminator 3 rises the machines. That has 69 percent. That was directed by Jonathan Mostau and starred Arnold, Nick Stahl, Claire Danes and Cristana Loken as the TX. And I remember watching that and thinking,

[01:15:46] yeah, it's not as good, but still fun, still all right, even darker in some ways. Then came the Terminator, the Sarah Connor Chronicles series. Did you watch that? No. That was excellent. It has an 85 percent. I heard it was pretty good. Lena Heady played Sarah Connor. She's great.

[01:16:10] Before Cersei, she was great. And it was weird to see her as Cersei because she's a hero in this, you know, like straight up not controversial at all kind of hero. Thomas Decker, Summer Glau, who was also in Firefly,

[01:16:26] Brian Austin Green, who was in 90210 and Garrett Dill Hunt played a Terminator in that show. John Doherty. Interesting. Then in 2009, Terminator Salvation, which has a 33 percent directed by Mick G, starring Christian Bale, Sam Worthington. I always thought and wished that they would do a Terminator sequel set

[01:16:50] entirely in the post-apocalyptic world that we saw bits of in this movie. And I thought they would and they did. And it was Terminator Salvation. And I think just because I was so excited that they did it, I probably liked it a little more than most people.

[01:17:03] But now I actually don't even really remember anything about it. I think I only watched it once or twice. So it was kind of boring. It was in my favorite, but it had some interesting parts. I mean, I like Christian Bale in general as an actor.

[01:17:18] And I thought Sam Worthington, it was one of the first things I think I saw him in and he's become like a James Cameron staple now into the whole fold because he uses James Cameron. We'll use a lot of the same actors.

[01:17:30] You'll see him in a lot of his movies. He's what he was, I don't know if he's in the second one, but I remember him being in the first avatar. Yeah, Sam Worthington. So I thought he gave a I thought he was good in it.

[01:17:42] I didn't hate it, but it wasn't obviously as good as like one and two. I really remember almost nothing about it. In fact, the thing I remember the most is that years later, the audio came out of Christian Bale yelling at the lighting guy.

[01:17:56] Raking him over the coals. Yeah. That was funny. Um, then in 2015, Terminator Genesis, which has a 26 percent that has Arnold, Amelia Clark, Matt Smith, Jason Clark, Jay Courtney, J.K. Simmons. I didn't even bother with this one because it was so got such bad reviews.

[01:18:19] I really wanted Matt Smith to do something good. Unfortunately, he still hasn't managed to. It's too bad. Just kidding. House of the Dragon. I'm getting a dirty look here. No, I'm really happy for him with House of the Dragon because I love Matt Smith, Dr. Who.

[01:18:37] And I was bummed that he was in this Terminator movie that tanked. And then Terminator Dark Fate in 2019 has a 70 percent directed by Tim Miller starring Arnold Linda Hamilton came back, Mackenzie Davis, Natalie Reyes,

[01:18:54] Gabriella Luna, who's going to be Tommy in The Last of Us, by the way. That one, even though it's decently reviewed, I didn't want to see it because I read the synopsis and basically it takes place right after Terminator 2. And I didn't like what I read.

[01:19:12] And I just I also feel like even though it has a 70, which isn't actually that great. It's only one point away from being a rotten, certified rotten. It just seemed like it was a disappointment. I don't know. Maybe I should watch it and then judge it.

[01:19:27] Did you watch it? I didn't. I. The things I was hearing, I felt like. It. I didn't like what I knew about the plot. I don't know like a lot of spoilers and I haven't watched it.

[01:19:41] And I didn't go read and seek anything out on the exact plot. But I just thought, I don't know. I don't think I can handle it. I feel like yeah, I think it. Did it retcon some stuff? Maybe. Yeah.

[01:19:55] Someone got killed off one of the characters from the other movie just right away. Yes, I was like, I don't know. Kind of like the alien thing, Alien 3 just killed off Hicks offscreen. I. I think Terminator is great, but one thing that makes it even less

[01:20:13] ripe for future exploitation than all these other things that they keep coming out with sequels of like Star Wars is this huge universe. So they should be able to find different corners of it to make interesting stories.

[01:20:27] And they do. It's hit or miss, but they've had some really, really good stuff. But Terminator is just the same time loop. So they're finding different permutations of how to go back before the apocalypse and change something and go.

[01:20:39] And it just feels like you're ringing the juice out of the same time period. And it just becomes meaningless after a while. You know what I mean? So they can't figure out what to do with it.

[01:20:53] And I think that's why they should just probably just give it up. Maybe. And I think they are. I don't think they have any plans right now to do anything. I don't. I think I'd rather they just leave it alone.

[01:21:08] They keep having these misfires, so they're just like, let's give it a rest for a while. Yeah. Yeah. I just I don't think I could bear it. I feel like I want to try and keep what I love in my head. You know?

[01:21:21] In my opinion, the first one was excellent. The second one was really good. It was a very cool way to compliment the first one. And the TV series was really fun from what I remember. I only watched it once back when it was on.

[01:21:33] But other than that, it's all just kind of meh.

[01:22:19] All right, we're back. Let's get into some Listener Feedback. Karen Stoll-Midiaros says, I thought it was terrifying like a horror movie experience. But of course, I loved it and T2. Yeah, of course. I like horror. Brad Holt says this movie started Bill Paxton's ultimate trifecta.

[01:22:40] He was the only actor to be killed by a Terminator, an alien Xenomorph and a Predator. Wow. Oh, that's awesome. That's an honor. Yeah. Gosh, I missed that guy. I know. Rinaldi Kliksti says, I like this film more than Terminator 2.

[01:22:57] I loved how menacing and scary the Terminator was throughout the entire film. I loved the plot twist at the end regarding Kylo-Reese and Sarah Connor. That's the part that stood out to me the most.

[01:23:10] Kelly Burgess says, this ranks right up there with Aliens is one of my all time favorite movies. I've seen it more times than I could count and could probably recite the lines for it. I loved Michael Bean in it.

[01:23:22] I also love that Sarah Connor was just a regular woman that had to go through hard things and how it changed her. I've been meaning to go back and rewatch the entire franchise, but just not much time.

[01:23:32] I think the story of this one will always hold up special effects, maybe not as well. But it was amazing when it was released. Yeah, absolutely. Kristen Halberg, hey, Kristen says, I saw Terminator 2 way before I saw Terminator.

[01:23:46] So I'm not sure how that affected my viewing experience since I knew there was already a sequel. However, the entire Terminator franchise is pretty awesome. I remember thinking how far out the concept was that there could be sentient robot people who take over the world.

[01:24:00] I don't feel that way anymore. Yep. Yep. And David SK says, I loved it the first time and I still love it anytime. I must have been 12 when I first saw this one and fell in love with everything.

[01:24:17] Badass Arnold, kick ass Sarah, good guy Reese, sex, violence, robots, time travel. This film has everything. My favorite scene has to be the attack on the police station because every time I watched, I would count up how many cops got killed. There are 30 cops in this building.

[01:24:34] That's a quote. Another scene that stands out is when Arnold cuts his damaged eye out. Even at 12, I knew the special effects of his mask were terrible. So many great memories of a classic flick. T2 started my love of never seeing trailers for movies I plan on seeing

[01:24:50] as I avoided all media before seeing the sequel and was mind blown when Arnie ended up. Well, I don't want to say that just in case there's spoilers. Fast forward 30 years and even dark fate turned out to be a good flick. And it was great seeing Sarah again.

[01:25:06] You know, the fact that Linda Hamilton's in that and reprising her role kind of does make me want to check it out. I was definitely curious to know what it was about it that would make her want to come back after all this time, you know?

[01:25:20] Yeah. So it might have had something to do with the money. I don't know. Maybe. I don't know. I don't I'm willing to bet. I don't know the details, but I'm willing to get a pretty good settlement from when she divorced James Cameron. But I don't know that.

[01:25:34] I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. Just speculating. And last we have a call from our friend, Steve Brown. Hello, it's showtime, folks. This is Steve and this is for The Terminator, the original. Amazing, such an amazing movie.

[01:25:52] You know, I have to admit, I don't think I did not see this in the theater. I was a little not at that point. I wasn't yet, you know, seeing Rated R movies. I don't think maybe I was. We had seen Aliens.

[01:26:08] Was Aliens before or after The Terminator? Anyway, loved it. I've seen it so many times though, since watching on VHS multiple times. Just absolutely love it from the fact that it's the one, you know, it's the movie that established Arnold's catchphrase, The I'll Be Back was established.

[01:26:27] The gargoyle sunglasses that were on sale for so long. And probably now you can't find them anywhere. The Franche Spas 12 shotgun that he uses. Yes, I'm a firearms guy. It's both pump and semi auto. Just amazing. Michael Bean, Sarah Connor.

[01:26:48] Oh gosh, Linda Hamilton is just amazing in it. And Arnold, even playing this robot character that has moments of levity in it. It's just amazing. But yeah, it's a classic. I love it. You can't. I don't I don't say that Terminator 2 is a better movie.

[01:27:14] It's a different movie. It's kind of like when you try to compare Alien and Aliens. There are two different types of movies, The Terminator and Terminator 2 Judgment Day are just two different, completely different movies. But yeah, I loved it. I watched it.

[01:27:29] It's been a while since I rewatched it, so I may need to go ahead and revisit it after I listened to y'all's podcast about it. But yeah, just amazing. I love it and can't wait to hear you guys talk about it. All right, talk to you later.

[01:27:41] That was great. It was 1986. Aliens came out. Aliens. Yeah. Terminator was 1984. I was trying to think. I don't really know of any moments of levity with The Terminator in this movie, maybe when he ran over the toy truck.

[01:28:01] I guess when he said get out, that was kind of one. Yeah, a little bit. But Arnold proved to be a pretty good comedic actor in movies after this. I think this was a second big movie after Conan. Conan the Barbarian. He had done before this one.

[01:28:17] Yeah. Yeah. And then he did some other. But yeah, later on with like twins or even T2 or he showed that he had some charm. Yeah, or one of my daughter's favorites jingle all the way. Don't judge her, but she loves it. I remember watching kindergarten cop

[01:28:38] and then I became a substitute teacher and I was like 23 years old and I was teaching up kindergarten the first day and I felt like him going, it's not a tumor. True lies was always it's one of my tops.

[01:28:56] You know, for I mean, Arnold is just I mean, I've loved him since I was a kid, obviously seeing the Conan you know, the Barbarian, the destroyer, Terminator and everything, you know, to pretty current. I've always been a big big Arnold fan.

[01:29:11] So but yeah, that one sticks up there at the top for me. And look true lies. I'm a Jamie Lee Curtis. Well, thank you to everybody who's listening and especially everyone who sent your feedback in this week. We always love to hear from you guys.

[01:29:28] So keep it coming, guys. Yeah. And to do that, you can write to us at talk at podcast. Dica dot com and let us know what movie you want us to cover next. And whatever that ends up being,

[01:29:41] we will have a post for it on facebook.com slash podcastica where you can leave your comments for us to read on the podcast or you can always send those in or send us a voice message to talk at podcast.com.

[01:29:55] And if you forget any of that, all of our contact information is at podcast.com. Go there, go there, go there. If you want to go there. All right, that is a wrap on the Terminator. Thank you so much for listening and cut. All right, folks, shows over.

[01:30:17] I'll be back.