5: Everything Everywhere All at Once (2022)

[00:00:00] I know you're all fighting because you're scared and confused.

[00:00:15] I'm confused too.

[00:00:21] All day.

[00:00:22] I don't know what the heck is going on.

[00:00:28] But somehow, it feels like it's all my fault.

[00:00:33] Hey hey everybody!

[00:00:38] Welcome to the Podcast.

[00:00:39] I'm Kristen.

[00:00:41] And I'm Ben.

[00:00:42] And today we are talking about the 11-time Oscar-nominated movie, Everything Everywhere All At Once.

[00:00:49] So get your popcorn ready, sit back and relax because...

[00:00:54] It's Showtime, Folks!

[00:00:56] Yeah, so I've been wanting to podcast on this movie since the first time I saw it.

[00:01:11] I've been, to be honest with you, I never thought about podcasting on it until you

[00:01:15] brought it up.

[00:01:16] Oh really?

[00:01:17] And I don't know why I didn't think about podcasting on it because this movie is...

[00:01:23] I mean if you've listened to the Wilhelm podcast episode that you, me and Jason did

[00:01:29] where we talked about our top five favorite movies of 2022, this was my number one.

[00:01:34] Spoiler.

[00:01:35] And yeah, it was my number two and I think it was Jason's number one or two.

[00:01:39] We just, all three of us enjoyed it.

[00:01:42] And really everybody that I've spoken to, especially in our age group has really, really,

[00:01:49] really loved it.

[00:01:51] I spoke with my baby boomer aunt the other day and she said that she couldn't get past

[00:01:57] the first like couple of minutes.

[00:01:59] It just didn't grab her.

[00:02:02] And I think that that's really interesting because it presents as such a simple movie,

[00:02:08] it's such a complex journey to get to this very simple message.

[00:02:13] And that's something that I really loved about the movie overall.

[00:02:17] Yeah, I mean I agree with you completely is that it is, it's a very complicated...

[00:02:22] That's the weird thing like it's usually like the simple journey to get to like a complicated

[00:02:25] ending for some movies.

[00:02:27] But this is a very complicated journey to get to an ending that's incredibly simple.

[00:02:34] And that's not, I don't mean that in a negative way.

[00:02:37] Not at all.

[00:02:38] It's a beautifully, it's a beautiful way to tell a story.

[00:02:43] Mm-hmm.

[00:02:44] I mean and not only that but I mean you're taking a movie that has elements from every

[00:02:51] freaking genre of movie in this.

[00:02:54] It takes, I mean this movie literally is everything everywhere all at once.

[00:02:59] It's every, it takes elements from every kind of genre, every...

[00:03:04] Mm-hmm.

[00:03:05] Like that's God.

[00:03:06] It's a perfect movie about family and the choices we make in life.

[00:03:12] As well as how the world would be better off without the IRS.

[00:03:19] So...

[00:03:20] And their buttplug trophies.

[00:03:22] Oh my God, seriously.

[00:03:24] And the scene that comes up later with those trophies is just it's so good.

[00:03:31] I mean I rewatched this movie.

[00:03:35] It's a movie that the first time I watched it I knew.

[00:03:38] I was like, this is my favorite movie of the year.

[00:03:40] Like there's no question about it.

[00:03:42] It's my favorite movie of the year.

[00:03:44] And as badly as I wanted to rewatch it I was like, no, like I need to preserve

[00:03:51] how great this movie is.

[00:03:52] Like I can't watch this movie over and over and over again.

[00:03:55] You don't want to watch it to death.

[00:03:56] It loses its luster when you do that.

[00:04:01] I can see what you're saying there but I think that this movie,

[00:04:05] especially coming off of my second watch just right before we started

[00:04:08] recording this, is how much more I found in my second watch.

[00:04:12] And I'm sure if I were to watch it three, four or five more times

[00:04:15] that I would notice even more just because there's so many little details

[00:04:20] that are put into the movie throughout the entire film

[00:04:24] that you really only catch once you kind of relax into the story.

[00:04:29] Because the first time you watch it you're like, what the hell is going on?

[00:04:32] Yeah, you're kind of an overload of information.

[00:04:37] Especially for somebody that can't really handle a multiversal,

[00:04:41] multiversal, multiverse kind of movie who doesn't think in the abstract,

[00:04:47] who doesn't think outside the box as far as what their movie experience is.

[00:04:52] You may turn it off at hotdog fingers.

[00:04:56] Oh my God.

[00:04:57] You know what I mean?

[00:04:58] You may just be like, no, this movie is definitely not for me.

[00:05:02] I'm not going to.

[00:05:03] There's squirting ketchup and mustard into each other's faces.

[00:05:06] I don't get it. You know?

[00:05:08] Yeah. Yeah.

[00:05:12] I mean, and I get like.

[00:05:14] It's kind of almost hypocritical for me to say to that I don't want to watch it

[00:05:18] too many times because it loses.

[00:05:20] Luster, especially a movie this complicated.

[00:05:23] I actually, you know what?

[00:05:24] I don't even want to say complicated because it's really not.

[00:05:28] It's just a lot of information.

[00:05:31] You know, it's a lot of it.

[00:05:33] I don't mean actually it's not even information.

[00:05:34] It's stimulation to be completely honest.

[00:05:37] And it's.

[00:05:40] You know, to say that I don't want to watch it too many times

[00:05:42] because it loses its luster, but yet another movie on my top five list

[00:05:45] was Spirited, which I watched like 10 fucking times.

[00:05:48] Right. You know, so it kind of a hypocritical thought to say that.

[00:05:53] Well, it's interesting that you say that, though, just because

[00:05:57] I think that this movie first, first of all,

[00:06:00] anybody who's listening to this, I really hope got much more.

[00:06:06] Than a multiverse movie.

[00:06:09] I hope that when you watch this movie that you didn't just get

[00:06:14] this weird multiverse movie of this, you know, family

[00:06:19] and this woman that needs to save the universe because it's not what

[00:06:23] this is not what that movie is about.

[00:06:25] Right. To me, the movie is kind of in its simplicity

[00:06:30] with the complex journey of getting there.

[00:06:33] It's such a perfect metaphor of what our lives as individuals are.

[00:06:38] You know, we have this very simple existence.

[00:06:41] Really, we do, you know, we live, we're born, we live, we die.

[00:06:46] We make connections along the way.

[00:06:48] And it's our decisions that make our life complicated.

[00:06:52] It's us as individuals that make our life complicated.

[00:06:55] And really, when you bear it all down at the very end,

[00:06:58] it's really about who you love, who loved you and how you nurtured

[00:07:04] those around you.

[00:07:05] And this story to me is.

[00:07:09] This woman where in the part one, everything part

[00:07:13] life is crumbling around her.

[00:07:16] Everything is she's losing everything.

[00:07:19] Her marriage, her daughter, her her her laundromat.

[00:07:23] She's being audited by the by the IRS.

[00:07:25] It's just this.

[00:07:28] Crumbling of someone's life that they've struggled so hard to get.

[00:07:33] And then you get to the everywhere and you see that she's finally

[00:07:38] accepting all of it and she's taking it all in.

[00:07:40] But as she's taking it all in, she's realizing that there's only one thing

[00:07:44] that matters and she realizes it all at once.

[00:07:48] Right. In part three, that all that matters is her daughter, her husband,

[00:07:53] her happiness, her joy, her kindness.

[00:07:56] You know, and she sees that everybody has their own individual

[00:08:04] stripes and struggles and and issues from the guy with the raccoon friend

[00:08:09] to, you know, Deidre, the IRS woman who, you know, she's very unhappy

[00:08:15] in her own life and she projects that out in her job.

[00:08:19] You know, and then she sees her husband who is just this light in her life

[00:08:24] that she never fully appreciated till towards the end of the movie.

[00:08:27] And it's when that all comes into place for her that she's able to really

[00:08:31] love her life and appreciate where she is and and

[00:08:38] and kind of go from there, you know, at the end of the movie

[00:08:41] in that final scene, she's just staring at Weyman with this love

[00:08:47] of this glow of love over her face.

[00:08:49] And she's not even paying attention to whatever is happening in the audit

[00:08:52] because she has her husband and she has her daughter who's right there with her

[00:08:56] and she has her father who she just stood up to for the very first time in her life.

[00:09:02] Everything has fallen into place all at once for her.

[00:09:06] And I think that is the beauty of this story.

[00:09:10] Well, you even kind of hit the nail on the head, too,

[00:09:12] for anybody who thinks it's a multiversal

[00:09:15] and you were right to use that word the first time.

[00:09:17] Is that a word?

[00:09:18] It is now, OK, you know.

[00:09:21] But yeah, I mean, for anybody who thinks this is like a multiversal

[00:09:23] saving the universe kind of thing, it really isn't because when you watch

[00:09:27] this movie, especially upon the second viewing, which as much as I love

[00:09:32] this movie, the viewing I watched last night really was only my second

[00:09:35] viewing of this movie.

[00:09:36] And, you know, you start to realize that like, yes,

[00:09:41] there's there's all this multiverse travel and such within it.

[00:09:46] But it really has nothing to do with anybody outside of her.

[00:09:51] It's just her, it's her family and the characters that she interacts with

[00:09:55] in her own life.

[00:09:57] There's no saving the universe.

[00:09:59] It's saving her own world.

[00:10:01] Her universe, her universe.

[00:10:03] Exactly. Right. Like it has nothing to do

[00:10:05] with anybody else in the world around her except for her.

[00:10:09] And it's so easy to lose that in the story, to lose that thread.

[00:10:14] And I think that that's what we are supposed to understand is that

[00:10:18] it's so easy to lose ourselves in our lives

[00:10:22] that we forget what is actually important in our lives, you know,

[00:10:27] because we're every single, you know, as Wayman says in the

[00:10:31] beginning of the movie, like in the during the first like fight

[00:10:35] scene in the IRS building is that he's like every single one of your

[00:10:39] decisions or your failures. Hang on, I wrote it down.

[00:10:45] Well, blah, blah, blah, blah.

[00:10:46] I have a lot of notes, so just.

[00:10:50] Bear with us for a second.

[00:10:53] You need an index.

[00:10:55] I do need an index for this one.

[00:10:57] I absolutely need an index.

[00:11:00] So everything that she everything that she has, every single failure.

[00:11:09] I didn't write it down by a word of something else.

[00:11:11] Every single failure or every project that she hasn't finished

[00:11:15] or every small decision that she has made that has fractured off

[00:11:20] into a what could have been universe for her.

[00:11:23] And I think that we as people, we can get bogged down in

[00:11:27] what could have been in our lifetime if I hadn't gotten married,

[00:11:30] if I hadn't had a child, if I hadn't moved to America,

[00:11:33] if I hadn't ran off with this boy when my father told me not to.

[00:11:39] What would have happened in my life?

[00:11:40] And all of a sudden these branches of regret are now plagued in your life

[00:11:46] in your life, right?

[00:11:47] And so Wayman says as the fight is about to start,

[00:11:51] the first big fight is about to start is you either you have to make

[00:11:55] a choice to either live up to your ultimate potential or lie here

[00:11:59] in your own consequences.

[00:12:00] And in the beginning of the movie, she chooses to lie down.

[00:12:03] She says, I'm lying down.

[00:12:05] I'm choosing to lie down.

[00:12:05] I don't want to do this.

[00:12:07] But then you see her make those small decisions

[00:12:10] throughout the movie to eventually want to live up to her own potential

[00:12:15] and fight her battles and fight for her family.

[00:12:18] And she makes those decisions.

[00:12:19] And it's like she completely obliterates the alternate universes

[00:12:25] on the little phone pad.

[00:12:26] You know, it just all goes red because now she's made her life her life.

[00:12:32] And I just I love that so much.

[00:12:34] And I think it was done in such an out of the box creative way.

[00:12:38] I cried today.

[00:12:40] I cried the first time I saw the movie.

[00:12:43] The movie is just such an emotional roller coaster for me as a wife,

[00:12:46] as a mother, as a daughter.

[00:12:49] I had so many feelings throughout this movie on how it reflected on me as a

[00:12:54] as an individual.

[00:12:56] And then I just it makes me wonder who else had these huge emotional

[00:13:02] reactions to this movie?

[00:13:04] I know I absolutely cried the.

[00:13:08] I think the first time I watched it.

[00:13:13] I definitely I cried towards the end of the movie with her and Joy.

[00:13:18] I mean, that was that was a kind of the part where when I was watching it,

[00:13:22] was like why?

[00:13:23] Like, I didn't realize this movie was legitimately just about a woman's

[00:13:27] relationship with her daughter.

[00:13:28] Like that is the biggest connection in this movie.

[00:13:31] Like there's yes, there's a connection to her husband.

[00:13:33] There's a connection to her father.

[00:13:34] But it's mainly the biggest connection that she is kind of trying

[00:13:39] to save is the one between her and her daughter.

[00:13:41] It's the reason why her daughter is the villain of the movie

[00:13:46] or a multiverse version of her daughter is the villain of the movie.

[00:13:52] But the second time around when I watched it last night, like I started to cry

[00:13:56] more during even before that, I started getting choked up.

[00:14:02] And it was more towards the

[00:14:07] the parts with Wayman trying to

[00:14:11] like convince her that like she didn't need to be violent, that kindness was a weapon.

[00:14:16] And that was what he was trying to convince her to do.

[00:14:19] And it was the reconnecting with her husband that I started getting choked up.

[00:14:23] And then I kept I just kept crying until the end with everything with joy,

[00:14:27] because that's still that still gets me to.

[00:14:29] But I want to go back to something that you mentioned earlier,

[00:14:31] because this is something that I had in my head too, in that you mentioned regret.

[00:14:35] You know, you mention all these branches of them that are created in them

[00:14:39] in this in her multiverse because of decisions that she didn't make

[00:14:43] or decisions that she wanted to make and chose to go a different direction.

[00:14:47] And you know, regret is a big part of that.

[00:14:50] It's you regret the things that you didn't that you didn't do.

[00:14:53] She gets a vision of her life where if she didn't leave with Wayman and she stayed at home.

[00:14:58] Or I actually forget.

[00:15:01] Gong Gong.

[00:15:02] Well, well, Gong Gong, yeah, her father is the one that convinces her to

[00:15:05] stay and not leave with him.

[00:15:06] Is that the one where she becomes she basically becomes Michelle Yo.

[00:15:11] Yeah, she she becomes a famous martial arts actress.

[00:15:17] Yes. Again, she basically there's two of them.

[00:15:21] She basically becomes Michelle Yo.

[00:15:22] So there's two of them.

[00:15:23] There's the one where she becomes the martial arts actress.

[00:15:26] And then there's the one where she becomes the famous singer

[00:15:30] where her dad is waiting in the wings while she's singing the whole time.

[00:15:33] So there's there's two alternate universes with her and her father.

[00:15:38] Well, but I'm more thinking about the martial arts one.

[00:15:42] OK. And you're right.

[00:15:45] And they're both from, you know, she's this world where.

[00:15:50] She could have become this huge actress,

[00:15:53] you know, famous around the world and she has the regret.

[00:15:58] Because she even says that to Wayman, like, I saw what my life was like

[00:16:01] without you and it was beautiful.

[00:16:03] That's like that's hard.

[00:16:06] Correct. That's hard.

[00:16:07] That's heartbreaking to hear those are words that you say in a marriage

[00:16:11] that you can't take back. Yes, ever, ever.

[00:16:14] Yeah, exactly.

[00:16:18] And you shouldn't ever be able to take those words back.

[00:16:22] No, right.

[00:16:22] Except what you're fundamentally changing your marriage in that moment, I think,

[00:16:27] even even when when and if you get over that, there's still that conversation.

[00:16:32] There's still that those words that came out of your mouth.

[00:16:36] And you can't grab them and shove them back down your throat.

[00:16:40] Exactly. But, you know, that's her seeing that life that she could have had

[00:16:48] without him and seeing how beautiful it was, at least to her at the time,

[00:16:53] because she does continue on that timeline and she sees it later on

[00:16:57] that she does eventually get want to be with him again

[00:17:00] when she reconnects with him later on in that life.

[00:17:03] I found it very interesting that in a sense, in a very metaphorical sense

[00:17:08] is that when she taps into that life to use the martial arts to fight,

[00:17:14] it's using your regret as a weapon.

[00:17:18] Because that's basically that's basically what it is.

[00:17:21] She's tapping into a life that she regrets not having,

[00:17:25] at least in that moment in time.

[00:17:27] And she's using that regret, the martial arts that she takes from that as a weapon.

[00:17:34] Which by the end, when she realizes the life that she wants,

[00:17:37] is the life she had all along.

[00:17:39] That's what she was fighting for this entire time.

[00:17:41] She's basically using her regrets as a weapon to get what she wants.

[00:17:45] Well, to get that, I don't want to say it that way,

[00:17:49] because that kind of sounds off, but it's more she's using her regret

[00:17:53] as a weapon to find her own happiness, to get her happiness.

[00:17:58] Well, and I think that the way that she fights, too,

[00:18:00] is really interesting throughout the movie because she does use

[00:18:04] her regret to fight her battles in the beginning because she's so angry

[00:18:09] and she's so depressed.

[00:18:11] And so she's fighting.

[00:18:15] She's using her regrets to fight

[00:18:19] in the wrong way, right?

[00:18:21] The more that she fights using those regrets,

[00:18:24] kind of the more she's losing the battle, you know?

[00:18:28] And you can see when her life starts to fracture

[00:18:31] in like the conversation that she's having with Waymond in the.

[00:18:37] In the van, right, about about getting a divorce and

[00:18:42] and then the fight that she's having in the IRS

[00:18:47] office with with Deidre, with I think it's Alpha Deidre.

[00:18:54] The circle on the circle on the forehead is the alpha.

[00:18:58] OK, it's Alpha Deidre.

[00:18:59] Well, Deidre takes on many forms, too,

[00:19:01] because she's also the pro wrestling Deidre.

[00:19:04] She's hot dog fingers, Deidre.

[00:19:07] She's Alpha Deidre.

[00:19:08] She's bagel follower, Deidre.

[00:19:11] But yeah, I mean, and that's like the beautiful thing about this

[00:19:14] not to go off on another tangent.

[00:19:16] I'll just say it real quickly is that, yeah, these characters,

[00:19:20] every one of these actors, actors and actresses from Michelle

[00:19:23] Yo, Stephanie Sue, Jamie Lee Curtis, Keehu Kwan,

[00:19:27] James Hong, who is a freaking legend in the industry, legend.

[00:19:32] Legend actually doesn't even explain it like he is.

[00:19:37] He's been around a long time and he's done a ton.

[00:19:41] But they all deserve these nominations that they're getting

[00:19:45] and accolades that they're getting because they're not just playing one

[00:19:48] character in this movie.

[00:19:50] They have all taken on multiple.

[00:19:53] I don't think there's one actor in this movie who doesn't take on multiple roles.

[00:19:58] Well, even Jenny Slate plays different roles.

[00:20:01] And she's a small part of this movie, but we're getting

[00:20:05] getting ahead of ourselves because I do want to take it back to this fighting thing.

[00:20:09] Yeah, yeah, yeah. Sorry.

[00:20:09] And then no, that's OK.

[00:20:11] So she's taking her regrets and she's using them as her defense mechanism

[00:20:16] to fight back in a kind of a dirty way, a petty way.

[00:20:20] Right. But then you see her fighting technique as she channels more

[00:20:25] more of her branches of, you know, her alternate universes.

[00:20:30] It slowly morphs into alternate universes of ways that she

[00:20:36] could love somebody or, you know, forgive somebody or

[00:20:42] or have grace with somebody until finally at the end she's fighting

[00:20:46] and she's fighting up those steps, which I think is just such a pivotal part of this movie.

[00:20:52] And she's

[00:20:53] she's she's healing people, you know, the man whose neck that she, you know,

[00:21:02] I don't know, fixes, you know, with her karate chop moves.

[00:21:05] And he says, thank you at the end.

[00:21:07] Right. He's fighting his own personal battle.

[00:21:10] Right. And he's fighting against that personal battle because he's in pain

[00:21:14] and it makes him a different person.

[00:21:17] And then she just responds in kindness.

[00:21:19] She responds in love.

[00:21:21] She responds the way that Waymond has been trying to tell her the whole time

[00:21:25] to respond until she gets to the top of that stairs.

[00:21:29] And she just wants she just wants her daughter to feel all the love

[00:21:34] and all the acceptance that she feels in that moment, especially for her daughter.

[00:21:39] And her daughter is still resisting it.

[00:21:41] And her daughter is still wanting to go into that void,

[00:21:44] into that darkness of the bagel that she's created.

[00:21:48] And, you know, it's such a silly term to say that there's this bagel.

[00:21:52] But, you know, when you're watching these

[00:21:54] these people being sucked into this bagel and you're

[00:21:57] it's in that moment that you realize this is the void of depression.

[00:22:02] This is the void of unhappiness.

[00:22:04] This is where people go to the darkness and maybe they don't come out of it,

[00:22:10] you know, and her support system is trying to pull her out of it,

[00:22:14] pull her out of it until they have to let go and let her go.

[00:22:18] And then in that moment, we see the rock go off the cliff.

[00:22:20] We see her going to the void.

[00:22:22] We see we see the fall, basically of of joy, fall of joy,

[00:22:29] which again is another metaphor in her name.

[00:22:33] But then what happens after that is that Evelyn falls, goes off the cliff with her

[00:22:39] and she's prepared to risk everything to save her daughter.

[00:22:43] And she follows her off that cliff.

[00:22:45] She follows her into the void and they come out of it, you know?

[00:22:49] And she does this as a selfless act.

[00:22:51] She starts off as a very selfish, self-absorbed mother and she comes out of it

[00:22:56] as this selfless healer of a woman who only wants one thing and that is to save her daughter.

[00:23:03] And I just think that that may be the most beautiful thing I have ever seen in a movie ever.

[00:23:11] Well, that whole scene of finding up the steps is just phenomenal because,

[00:23:14] I mean, as you mentioned, it's, you know, this entire movie,

[00:23:18] we see her tapping into these other verses of herself to find strengths

[00:23:22] that other people have to use for herself.

[00:23:24] So she's not even using her own strength.

[00:23:27] She's using the strength of others.

[00:23:28] I mean, it's basically her, but it's other versions of her.

[00:23:31] So it's not really herself.

[00:23:33] And then we get to finding herself again.

[00:23:36] Yes.

[00:23:36] But then when we get to that scene, she's not tapping into herself.

[00:23:40] She's tapping into everybody else.

[00:23:41] As you mentioned, she's finding out what is the key, what has them in pain.

[00:23:47] And then that's what she's healing is rather than tapping into these skills

[00:23:51] that these other versions of herself have to defeat them.

[00:23:54] She's tapping into them and using their pain to heal them,

[00:24:00] which is which is such a great thing.

[00:24:02] And if you ever look at the behind the scenes of that or even some deleted scenes,

[00:24:07] there's one or two other ones that they actually ended up cutting out of that movie.

[00:24:11] They cut 45 minutes out of the movie.

[00:24:14] Well, one of the ones that they cut out of that scene was Jenny Slate.

[00:24:18] There's actually a version of that with Jenny Slate's character

[00:24:20] where she shows her on her phone.

[00:24:23] You find out that Jenny Slate is a divorced mom

[00:24:26] who does not have custody of her son.

[00:24:29] And she sends her like a video on her phone of her son asking her

[00:24:34] if she's coming to if she's coming to his birthday party.

[00:24:36] Yeah. And that's what heals her.

[00:24:38] And she's like, yes.

[00:24:39] And then she asks her how's your dog?

[00:24:42] And that kind of like.

[00:24:46] But what I kind of want to go into the thing that you mentioned

[00:24:49] with the bagel and everything, what I love about the metaphor of the bagel

[00:24:53] is they could have simply used a hole.

[00:24:56] Because I mean, you know, a hole is the center of a circle.

[00:25:01] And the circle represents at least to me watching that is just being stuck

[00:25:05] in a rut, like you were just going through the motions.

[00:25:07] It's the same things over and over again.

[00:25:10] It's just life constantly repeating itself over and over again.

[00:25:14] It's what creates that circle.

[00:25:15] It's what creates that void.

[00:25:17] But the use of a bagel rather than just creating a black hole or a void,

[00:25:23] I thought was great because it's an everything bagel.

[00:25:26] Yeah. And it's just it's everything in your life is what is

[00:25:31] repeating and it's what's creating this void.

[00:25:34] So to use a hole would have been fine, but to use an everything bagel

[00:25:38] was just a great metaphor to me.

[00:25:41] Yeah, so I don't know in what culture it is, but in and it's one of it is

[00:25:46] I believe it's an Asian culture.

[00:25:51] But if somebody wants to tell me what it is later, I don't know.

[00:25:54] But it a bagel is actually a slang term for zero or nothing.

[00:26:00] So to me.

[00:26:02] There is so.

[00:26:04] So.

[00:26:05] When you read interviews by the creators, Daniels, the two Daniels

[00:26:10] that created and wrote this movie,

[00:26:15] they wanted a major theme of of Roy's character

[00:26:19] to kind of represent nihilism.

[00:26:21] Nothing matters.

[00:26:23] Nothing is nothing.

[00:26:24] Everything, you know, everything is everything.

[00:26:26] And so when they were creating this void, they did talk about the circle,

[00:26:32] you know, and they said it was a joke that was a bagel.

[00:26:35] But the bagel just all of a sudden just took on this whole new meaning

[00:26:38] in this whole new character.

[00:26:40] And and so they left it in.

[00:26:42] So it was supposed to be kind of a joke, like a gag thing.

[00:26:45] But it ended up it ended up working really well for, you know,

[00:26:50] a whole theme of nihilism, especially when it comes to joy and.

[00:26:56] Right.

[00:26:57] What?

[00:26:57] Jobu Tupaki, Jobu Tupaki, who was the villain of the story,

[00:27:03] who had, you know, entered joy, joy is persona or joy is character.

[00:27:11] But what was interesting to me was that staying with Jobu Tupaki

[00:27:16] and the bagel and whatnot, Evelyn, her main goal was if I can become

[00:27:21] like her, maybe I'll be strong enough to save my joy.

[00:27:25] And so she knew that she had to go deep into the bagel, deep into the darkness.

[00:27:33] In order to save her joy or her daughter, but also her own joy.

[00:27:39] And I just thought that, you know, pushing through the darkness

[00:27:43] instead of running away from the darkness.

[00:27:48] Is also really an interesting

[00:27:51] path to take only because a lot of us think that

[00:27:56] not not us, but a lot of people who don't really believe that depression

[00:28:00] is a medical condition.

[00:28:05] Would think just choose not to be depressed.

[00:28:07] Just choose to be fine, you know, just, you know, look at the darkness

[00:28:11] and just say, no, I'm not going to do that today.

[00:28:13] Sometimes you need to go through the darkness to come out of the darkness

[00:28:16] and realize that you're able to get out.

[00:28:18] Sometimes there's something that you need to experience in that darkness

[00:28:21] in order for you to grow or evolve as a person.

[00:28:25] And, you know, whether or not that was intentional on the from the writer's standpoint,

[00:28:30] I definitely took away an element of that after watching the movie.

[00:28:36] How about you?

[00:28:37] No, I definitely mean you kind of hit the nail on the head

[00:28:40] with people saying that like depression, like just choose not to be depressed.

[00:28:44] That's it's not that easy.

[00:28:45] I've been there.

[00:28:47] I know a lot of people who have been there.

[00:28:51] So like I kind of I see exactly where you're coming from.

[00:28:55] And I think that's one of the reasons why the end of this movie hits

[00:28:58] as hard as it does.

[00:29:00] And it makes people as emotional as it is because there are a lot of people

[00:29:03] who kind of find relation in everything that these people

[00:29:09] are going through, whether it be, you know, conflicts or fractures

[00:29:14] in their own family, their own family existence or dealing with depression

[00:29:20] or dealing with overbearing parents or just.

[00:29:24] It's it's amazing how this one family has so many things that happen to them

[00:29:28] that different people can find relatable.

[00:29:35] But I do I do want to kind of say one thing

[00:29:39] that if if I remember correctly,

[00:29:42] when it comes to joy going into the void,

[00:29:46] like falling backwards into the bagel at the end.

[00:29:51] I don't think Michelle Yo's character actually goes into the void to get her.

[00:29:56] She doesn't follow her into the void.

[00:29:57] She lets her go.

[00:30:00] And it's not. But she does as the rock.

[00:30:03] She falls off the cliff behind her.

[00:30:06] She falls off the cliff as if she's willing to

[00:30:08] to to to find to let or to be with Joy to go that route with her.

[00:30:16] But when it comes to the scene in the void, it's actually joy that reaches out.

[00:30:22] Michelle Yo never goes into the right joy reaches out for her.

[00:30:26] And it happens after and it happens after the rock goes over.

[00:30:31] Yes, the side after the Evelyn rock goes over the side to go after her.

[00:30:36] Is when Joy.

[00:30:39] In the in, I guess the Alphaverse finally reaches out of the darkness to grab on to.

[00:30:46] Evelyn, because it's because she's seeing all these different versions

[00:30:49] of Evelyn willing to make that journey with her, right?

[00:30:53] That she realizes I need to be with my mother and then

[00:30:58] she reaches out for Evelyn and Evelyn pulls her out of the void.

[00:31:02] She was willing to let her go.

[00:31:05] Yeah. And you know what?

[00:31:06] I think that that's really that's an important distinction to make.

[00:31:09] So I'm glad that that you corrected me on that because ultimately

[00:31:14] we have to pull ourselves out of our own darkness.

[00:31:18] Yeah, because we don't we can't always.

[00:31:21] I mean, it's great to have help,

[00:31:24] but we have to help only works better if we ask for it

[00:31:30] rather than be forced to take it because we have to be willing

[00:31:35] to do it. Right? You can resent forced help.

[00:31:37] If somebody forces their help upon you, you can resent that and it even makes

[00:31:41] you push it away even harder sometimes.

[00:31:43] But when you realize that you can accept the help to make yourself a better person,

[00:31:51] that's what helped genuinely actually helps because that means

[00:31:54] you're willing to make the journey.

[00:31:56] Right. Like we can't do anything alone.

[00:31:59] Nothing is ever accomplished alone, but we have to be willing

[00:32:03] to put in the work as well ourselves.

[00:32:07] You know, it's no it's no secret.

[00:32:09] Anybody that has listened to me on any number of podcasts

[00:32:12] that I've been in the past is that, you know, I have a sister who passed away.

[00:32:17] She had a deep addiction problem.

[00:32:21] That's not why she passed away, but she did have a deep addiction problem

[00:32:24] that complicated her life pretty much.

[00:32:28] And letting go of her and letting her find her way to reach out finally for help.

[00:32:39] That's an extraordinarily difficult thing to do.

[00:32:41] Yeah. To let go, especially of somebody that you love so much.

[00:32:46] It's it's and for a parent to do that, to let go and and let

[00:32:51] and be willing to watch their child fall

[00:32:54] and still be there for them when they're when they're ready to pick themselves back up.

[00:32:59] That's borderline impossible.

[00:33:02] You know, and so I I love that these that these directors, the Daniels

[00:33:10] that they didn't really shy away from that theme.

[00:33:13] They didn't you know if it was there if you wanted to see it.

[00:33:16] It was there if you could relate to it.

[00:33:18] And I hope that there's a lot of people, a lot of people who saw this movie

[00:33:25] that did take that away because I think with the mental health crisis

[00:33:29] that we're having right now, like in our country.

[00:33:34] That this movie is such a beautiful reminder that there is light in the darkness.

[00:33:38] There is help if you need it.

[00:33:41] And it's a complicated, messy journey there.

[00:33:47] But it's there.

[00:33:48] Yeah, you know, and it's there for a reason.

[00:33:51] And it can be silly.

[00:33:52] It can make zero sense at all.

[00:33:54] It can be filled with, you know, build those, I guess,

[00:33:58] and hot dog finger hands and but plugs and but plugs.

[00:34:03] But, you know, if you come out of it,

[00:34:06] you can have a really beautiful life, you know, and life is beautiful

[00:34:10] and it's messy, man.

[00:34:12] Oh my gosh, life is so messy.

[00:34:13] But, you know, I think from the end and the movie really, really shows it.

[00:34:20] Man, life is so awesome and it's beautiful and it's gorgeous and it's simple.

[00:34:25] It's just love others and be kind to yourself.

[00:34:29] Well, and I think some of the other cool elements of I mean,

[00:34:33] and this could absolutely be reading too far into things

[00:34:36] because we got nos as podcasters, we tend to overanalyze stuff

[00:34:41] to the degree.

[00:34:42] I understand that.

[00:34:43] But this movie, this movie, I believe is OK to take this

[00:34:47] deep of an existential dive on.

[00:34:49] Yes, but I like how like the two elements with the bagel

[00:34:54] are the first time you see the bagel and it's a small.

[00:34:58] It's literally just a bagel, like there's no void in between.

[00:35:01] It's literally just life kind of repeating itself.

[00:35:04] But it's in this brilliant white room

[00:35:08] like the extreme contrast of light to dark with this black

[00:35:13] everything bagel in this brilliantly lit white room.

[00:35:17] I loved that contrast, but then I loved how later

[00:35:21] you know, and everything is kind of calm, like, you know,

[00:35:25] it's there, but you're not too worried about it.

[00:35:28] And then later when we see the bagel and become the actual void,

[00:35:33] it's not in this room anymore.

[00:35:35] Now it's in this office building with all these other people.

[00:35:38] And I think that alone is a great metaphor for how if you let

[00:35:42] things spiral that far out of control, sometimes in your own life,

[00:35:46] it will affect all the other people around you.

[00:35:50] It doesn't just affect your family any longer.

[00:35:53] It's going to affect other people that you're connected to.

[00:35:57] And so moving the bagel from because that battle could have

[00:36:00] taken place in that white room and it would have been just as stupendous.

[00:36:04] But to move it into the actual world with all these other characters now,

[00:36:09] like I said, it's just a great metaphor for how when things get that bad,

[00:36:14] it's going to affect other people.

[00:36:16] It bleeds out into every facet of your life.

[00:36:19] Absolutely. 100 percent.

[00:36:22] Yeah. So.

[00:36:26] I really like the way this movie is set up with the three parts.

[00:36:31] We have part one with everything.

[00:36:34] We have part two with everywhere.

[00:36:35] And then we really have just it's almost like like a coda, right?

[00:36:40] Parts three. It's a prologue.

[00:36:42] All at once. No, part three all at once.

[00:36:44] It's the end. Yes. Right.

[00:36:46] It's it's the end of the movie.

[00:36:48] It's very short, but it wraps up

[00:36:51] what the previous two parts had been trying to do.

[00:36:57] Maybe what do you think?

[00:36:59] I like the way that the movie set up in.

[00:37:01] No, I agree with you.

[00:37:02] The parts I agree with you.

[00:37:03] I think it's three acts.

[00:37:04] I think it's great in three acts and.

[00:37:09] You know, the everything part of it,

[00:37:11] the first chapter of it is literally everything that's happening in her life.

[00:37:14] It's a great introduction to that.

[00:37:15] And we're seeing what it does to her.

[00:37:18] The everywhere is literally the splintering of her of herself

[00:37:22] and going in all these different directions, which not just in the

[00:37:26] multiverse, but in her own life, like she's trying to be in pooled

[00:37:30] in all these different directions.

[00:37:32] That's the everywhere part.

[00:37:33] And then the all at once is kind of the harmony of everything.

[00:37:37] It's the balance.

[00:37:39] It's it's being able to take everything that's happening

[00:37:42] everywhere it's happening and just be in the moment,

[00:37:45] which is the all at once.

[00:37:47] And it's it's a great Coda like you meant like using that word Coda.

[00:37:51] It's it's a great finish.

[00:37:53] It's finally her balancing out her life.

[00:37:57] And then when we get that final moment where she's kind of hearing

[00:38:00] everything that's happening, but Deidre pulls her back out of it.

[00:38:04] And she's living up to the promise that she made to Joy, that she will be there.

[00:38:09] She doesn't need to be everywhere else.

[00:38:11] Right. Right. Absolutely.

[00:38:13] But I also like to.

[00:38:16] If you think about it, the conversation that Deidre is happening

[00:38:21] is having with them like you've made improvements.

[00:38:25] Everything's better.

[00:38:26] But it's not there yet.

[00:38:28] It's like, OK, she's even telling you there's room to grow.

[00:38:33] She says, well, she says, you listen to me, but you really did.

[00:38:37] But you also didn't listen to me.

[00:38:38] Yeah. So like she and herself is almost like a narrator of their story

[00:38:44] in that moment because she's saying like you did good.

[00:38:47] There's still more to go.

[00:38:49] This is you're not there yet.

[00:38:52] Like it's not perfect.

[00:38:54] But you can still keep going.

[00:38:57] Yeah, absolutely.

[00:38:58] And I love that.

[00:38:59] And isn't that the truth?

[00:39:00] Right. You don't come out of it like all better, you know, when you dust off

[00:39:04] your pants and you keep going, you're just like, OK, like now I'm going to work

[00:39:08] and I'm going to do the work and it's going to get a little easier every day.

[00:39:11] And I'm going to have good days.

[00:39:12] I'm going to have bad days.

[00:39:13] But I'm going to be here for my family.

[00:39:16] I'm going to honor what I've made of my life.

[00:39:20] I'm going to appreciate it.

[00:39:22] Well, I mean, as weird as this may seem, and I'm literally just thinking about this now.

[00:39:28] Deidre auditing that family and them risking losing their laundromat

[00:39:34] because of everything, the mistakes that they've made.

[00:39:37] This movie, in a sense, is the audit of their life.

[00:39:42] And you're absolutely correct

[00:39:45] because they are looking at everything.

[00:39:48] They are in risk of losing their family because of mistakes that have been made

[00:39:53] and they need to correct those mistakes so that they don't.

[00:39:55] Similar to how they have to.

[00:39:59] Change things, they have to prove different things with their receipts

[00:40:02] so that they don't lose the laundromat.

[00:40:04] This movie, everything that happens is the audit of their life.

[00:40:09] Of Evelyn's life of Evelyn's life.

[00:40:11] Well, yeah, of of the Wanks of the Wang family.

[00:40:16] Yeah, because because by the end,

[00:40:19] it does improve the relationship with her joy.

[00:40:22] It improves the relationship with her and Gong.

[00:40:24] It I mean, it is mainly OK.

[00:40:25] So you're right, it is her life, but it affects the rest of her family.

[00:40:31] Well, yeah, I mean, as a mom, the mom rules the house.

[00:40:34] Sorry, guys. You know.

[00:40:37] What mom says goes so not just a mom's not right.

[00:40:41] Oh, if mom's not right, the house isn't right.

[00:40:43] And that's I mean, I've experienced that firsthand as a daughter and as a mother.

[00:40:47] You know, disagreeing with you.

[00:40:48] What? No, you shouldn't know.

[00:40:51] Well, in the very beginning when this movie was first

[00:40:56] being made, the Daniels tried to keep the plot under wraps by saying

[00:41:01] that the movie was about a woman who tries to do her taxes.

[00:41:04] And that was it.

[00:41:08] It's it's not a lie.

[00:41:11] It's not a lie. No, it's not.

[00:41:13] It's really not a lie.

[00:41:16] One bit.

[00:41:19] It's kind of brilliant.

[00:41:20] It's too bad it didn't stick, but, you know, it would have been awesome

[00:41:23] if that's just all it ever said, you know, if that's all the summary

[00:41:29] or the plot was right.

[00:41:34] So that would have been great.

[00:41:36] So I love.

[00:41:37] Do you have do you have a point that you want to take on?

[00:41:40] I have all these points that I feel like I'm guiding the entire.

[00:41:44] I'm totally fine with you guiding the conversation, because as you and I talked

[00:41:48] about before we started recording, I just did.

[00:41:51] I did not take any notes because even upon my second viewing,

[00:41:55] I just got so drawn back into just watching.

[00:42:00] And there's so much that happens in the movie that I felt like if I look

[00:42:04] down for any point to take notes, I was going to miss something.

[00:42:09] I have a lot of writing that I did as I was watching, but I did pause a lot.

[00:42:14] So it's not in the lines.

[00:42:16] Right. It's all over the page.

[00:42:18] It's all over the page. It's everywhere.

[00:42:20] I'm fine just kind of going along with like just talking about any points

[00:42:24] that you make. Awesome.

[00:42:25] I'm sure I have stuff to say about all the points that you're making.

[00:42:29] Awesome. That that makes me feel very excited because now I get to just go for it.

[00:42:33] Take the lead.

[00:42:36] So in the everywhere.

[00:42:39] So I don't want to go to everywhere just yet.

[00:42:41] Well, I'm kind of bouncing all over the place, but I noticed from the very beginning,

[00:42:45] the opening shot of the movie is of a mirror.

[00:42:48] Right. Yes.

[00:42:48] And we see kind of what's happening with the family through the mirror.

[00:42:53] Right. And then as we go to

[00:42:58] when we go to the laundromat,

[00:43:01] we see a shot of the movie through one of those like mirrors that you can see

[00:43:05] around the other side or something like that.

[00:43:08] And then as there was a conversation between Evelyn and Joy about the party

[00:43:15] or no, about how Joy wants to introduce Becky to Gonggong as her girlfriend.

[00:43:24] You see in the background all of the cameras

[00:43:27] and you see Waymond is becoming Alpha Waymond

[00:43:30] and he's sliding all over the place in the cameras and stuff like that.

[00:43:33] And then he goes back.

[00:43:34] So there's a lot of reflection that's happening in the first

[00:43:39] in the first 20 minutes, 30 minutes of the movie.

[00:43:42] And then it's not until we get to the the IRS office that the mirror

[00:43:47] or, you know, the fourth wall, the screen begins to crack, cracks into two.

[00:43:52] Right. And so that mirror begins to crack.

[00:43:55] The subtitles crack and you can see subtitles in both sides

[00:43:59] in a broken sense in the movie.

[00:44:02] And then as we move to everywhere,

[00:44:05] as all of her universes kind of start to crack open

[00:44:09] and right before she vomits everywhere, that crack turns into about

[00:44:14] turns into almost a shatter on the screen.

[00:44:16] And you just see that

[00:44:19] she is overwhelmed with

[00:44:23] with all of her shoddakutta wood is and trying to fix her family, that she just

[00:44:28] you know, we talked about it in our other podcast.

[00:44:31] She just kind of mentally, verbally

[00:44:33] vomits literally all over the carpet.

[00:44:36] Right. And it's almost like she needed to just

[00:44:40] urge it all out in order for her to make any sense.

[00:44:43] Because after that happens, you know, you see that

[00:44:48] she's.

[00:44:50] Finally, strong enough to

[00:44:54] stand up to Gong Gong.

[00:44:56] And so she actually stands up to Gong Gong.

[00:45:03] Right after that in the office scene, like they go from

[00:45:06] the IRS and then they go into that office

[00:45:09] and it's right before they go into the.

[00:45:15] Whatever you call it.

[00:45:17] What do you call it when people have submissives and and.

[00:45:22] Oh, the.

[00:45:24] The.

[00:45:26] It's basically a sex dungeon.

[00:45:28] Yes, a sex dungeon, but it's a it's

[00:45:31] Bido or Bado or, you know what?

[00:45:34] Whatever, I don't know because I.

[00:45:37] I'm stupid, but Evelyn finally protects joy from Gong Gong.

[00:45:42] Alpha Evelyn has realized that she has pushed alpha joy so hard

[00:45:46] that she broke alpha joy.

[00:45:49] And that's why alpha joy is the way that she is.

[00:45:51] So now her father is telling her or alpha Gong is telling

[00:45:56] her in this office, you need to kill this joy right now.

[00:45:59] If we're going to save the universe, like let's just get it over with.

[00:46:03] She's all tied up in the chair, like do it now.

[00:46:05] And she has she has the box cutter in her hand.

[00:46:09] And she's going towards and she frees her instead.

[00:46:11] And she turns around and she confronts her father for the first time.

[00:46:15] And she says, I'm not going to do this.

[00:46:18] I can become like her.

[00:46:19] Maybe I'll be strong enough to save my joy.

[00:46:22] So I'm not going to do it your way.

[00:46:23] I'm not going to do it the way that you told me to do it.

[00:46:25] I'm going to do it my way.

[00:46:26] And I'm going to try and save my daughter by not killing her any more

[00:46:30] than I already have.

[00:46:32] Well, it's interesting.

[00:46:33] And good.

[00:46:34] Go ahead.

[00:46:35] I was just going to say it's in the.

[00:46:37] Go ahead.

[00:46:38] I was just going to say it's interesting, too, when she makes that

[00:46:40] choice right then and there, too, if I can kind of be like her or, you know,

[00:46:47] kind of become do the same things that she does and be everywhere

[00:46:51] this way that she is, then maybe I can save her rather than defeat her.

[00:46:55] And then when you watch that, especially when we go into the

[00:46:58] everywhere part of it, you realize that almost breaks her, too.

[00:47:02] Like she almost becomes another alpha joy.

[00:47:07] Or.

[00:47:09] What's the the?

[00:47:12] What's her name?

[00:47:14] I haven't written down to Paki.

[00:47:16] Jobu, that's yeah.

[00:47:18] It's just so fun to say.

[00:47:20] Well, I hear Jobu and I think majorly, but OK.

[00:47:25] But yeah, like she almost becomes that version of herself

[00:47:29] the same way that joy has become that version of herself.

[00:47:33] But it's it's it's wayman that kind of brings her out of that

[00:47:39] and saves her from that, which lets her then save joy.

[00:47:44] At the same time.

[00:47:46] Yeah. Well, I think that during.

[00:47:49] I think that during her journey to become like joy, she realizes

[00:47:55] that Evelyn and Joy or the viewer watches Evelyn realize

[00:48:02] that she has the same struggles as her daughter.

[00:48:06] Her daughter only wants her mother's approval, right?

[00:48:10] And it's just she's she's destroying everything around her

[00:48:13] to get her mother's attention so that she can get her mother's love and approval.

[00:48:18] And Evelyn is starting to realize that her whole life has been doing the same.

[00:48:25] Her father has never approved of her, has never been proud of her.

[00:48:29] And she's done everything to try.

[00:48:32] She's almost killed her life trying to make that a reality.

[00:48:38] You know, she's.

[00:48:40] She's so focused on this laundromat being successful

[00:48:43] that she's neglected her marriage and now that's crumbling

[00:48:46] and she's about to have a divorce.

[00:48:47] Her daughter is literally pulling away from her

[00:48:51] and wants nothing to do with her because all Evelyn can think about

[00:48:55] is how can I get my father to love me the way that I want him to love me?

[00:48:59] And then in that realization, that joy is doing the exact same thing.

[00:49:05] To her, I think that that's where the fight in Evelyn starts to unravel

[00:49:11] where she where she actually unclenches her fists.

[00:49:15] And there's a scene where it shows her unclenching her fists and she is done fighting.

[00:49:22] She's done fighting her father and she's ready to just start accepting.

[00:49:28] She's going into this acceptance phase where she she's accepting her husband.

[00:49:32] She's accepting her life.

[00:49:33] She's accepting her daughter and she's realizing how much she loves them.

[00:49:37] Well, that's what that whole unclenching her fists to is right after

[00:49:41] Wayman gives that whole speech about being able to use kindness as a weapon.

[00:49:45] Right. And then she kind of reflects upon her own life

[00:49:47] and she sees that from different from different perspectives of her life

[00:49:51] and realizes that's true.

[00:49:53] And this is a wayman who she literally just stabbed to like he

[00:49:58] like she tried to kill him and he's still giving her this speech

[00:50:03] about how kindness can be a weapon instead of violence.

[00:50:06] And that's when she unclenches her fist and everything changes for Evelyn.

[00:50:10] Right. Well, and it's interesting because a lot of us when we.

[00:50:16] When someone and I'll speak to this personally.

[00:50:21] When you go to a dark spot, when you go into what kind of a

[00:50:26] just a depression state,

[00:50:30] you want to destroy everything good in your life because you're at this mental

[00:50:34] point where you don't think you deserve anything good.

[00:50:37] And so right.

[00:50:39] And so her stabbing her kind husband, her destroying her daughter,

[00:50:44] who she's named Joy, right?

[00:50:46] So she's literally destroying joy.

[00:50:49] She's destroying kindness.

[00:50:50] She's destroying the good parts of her life.

[00:50:53] It's remarkable to watch in in the beautiful way that these directors have done.

[00:51:02] Her it is beautiful to watch her realize that she doesn't have to destroy

[00:51:07] everything good in her life, that once she welcomes and accepts

[00:51:11] everything good in her life, she can defeat her demons

[00:51:15] and she can help her daughter defeat her demons.

[00:51:19] You know, the googly eyes as silly as they are,

[00:51:24] they have such a wonderful, albeit silly, but a wonderful

[00:51:31] representation of in this movie where there is a yin and a yang

[00:51:37] in this in this movie.

[00:51:38] And the yin is the and I don't know which is which.

[00:51:41] I know that one is one is light, one is dark, right?

[00:51:44] But one is the bagel.

[00:51:47] And the exact inverse of that bagel is a googly eye, right?

[00:51:52] Instead of having a white center and a black circle, we have a black center

[00:51:57] and a white circle, right?

[00:51:59] So the the googly eye, which represents the silliness, the kindness,

[00:52:03] the love that is being replaced or that is being balanced by the bagel,

[00:52:08] which is now representing, you know, the darkness and loneliness, despair and anger.

[00:52:14] So when Evelyn puts that googly eye on her forehead,

[00:52:18] she is literally going against the exact opposite of that

[00:52:24] with everybody that has the bagel drawn on their forehead,

[00:52:28] which is the exact opposite, which I think is really, that's really great.

[00:52:32] So when, you know, so wayman, who is seen as weak,

[00:52:36] but he chooses kindness over fighting, he wants others to stop fighting

[00:52:39] due to fear and confusion and choose kindness.

[00:52:42] He wants his wife to stop fighting the wrong way and fight for joy,

[00:52:46] fight for love, for connection, for family.

[00:52:49] He wants her to fight for him and for their marriage.

[00:52:51] And I think that when she unclenches her fists

[00:52:55] and she puts that googly eye on her forehead,

[00:52:57] she is ready to do exactly what her husband has been screaming

[00:53:02] for her to do the whole time.

[00:53:05] Well, I love to that.

[00:53:06] I really loved the whole the googly eye on the forehead part

[00:53:10] of the film as well, because if you're not familiar with the third eye,

[00:53:14] the third eye is kind of like it's always been thought of as a mystical

[00:53:17] and visible eye that lets you see things that you don't usually see

[00:53:21] with your ordinary eye.

[00:53:22] And that kind of is a huge metaphor in that moment as well,

[00:53:25] because her putting the googly eye in addition to what you said

[00:53:29] about what the eyes represent, it also becomes the ability.

[00:53:32] It also kind of gives her the ability to see

[00:53:35] everything she was never able to see before in her life,

[00:53:38] like the good things that were always there that she always neglected.

[00:53:41] She's able to see with this third eye

[00:53:45] all these things that were kind of invisible to her,

[00:53:49] but now are in plain view and it makes her appreciate everything that she has.

[00:53:54] And then in that same moment when she turns all the bullets into googly

[00:53:58] eyes and just kind of tosses them back and they get stuck to everybody else.

[00:54:03] That, in a sense, too, is her helping everybody else see,

[00:54:07] even though they might not be a third mystical eye on the forehead,

[00:54:09] they're still attached to them because every person that she fights,

[00:54:12] the googly eyes are on them. Right.

[00:54:15] If you look close enough,

[00:54:16] you can see the googly eyes are stuck to them somewhere.

[00:54:19] Right. And it's kind of now like she's using

[00:54:22] she's using it to help others see

[00:54:25] that there's good in their own lives, too,

[00:54:27] which then she goes through helping all of them.

[00:54:31] Right. And it's it's it's the spreading kindness, spreading joy, spreading love.

[00:54:36] And that's the best weapon that you can ever have for to combat fear

[00:54:42] and confusion and chaos.

[00:54:45] And I and I love how in the all at one section of the movie,

[00:54:48] in the ending of the movie, when we see Evelyn sitting at the table again,

[00:54:52] doing the receipts and joy is there.

[00:54:54] And and they're all there getting ready to go to see Dijer at the IRS.

[00:54:58] If you look up at the laundry bags on top,

[00:55:02] where they were in earlier in the movie, where she was ripping all the googly eyes off,

[00:55:06] they're back on those bags. Yeah.

[00:55:09] Yeah, she's she's accepting it.

[00:55:11] She's accepting it now. And I love that.

[00:55:16] I do too.

[00:55:17] So.

[00:55:19] You talking about the third eye at the very end of the movie,

[00:55:22] it says everything everywhere, all at once.

[00:55:24] And then it's stretch the the.

[00:55:27] Title stretches out to fill up the screen almost like a barcode.

[00:55:30] And then there's Chinese characters that come through.

[00:55:33] So those Chinese characters read a heavenly steed

[00:55:37] staring across soaring across the sky, which is symbolic of an uncommon,

[00:55:42] limitless imagination not bound by natural laws.

[00:55:46] See that I didn't look into.

[00:55:48] So I'm glad you kind of brought that up because I think that I wondered

[00:55:51] what those characters meant.

[00:55:53] Yeah. And I think that that goes directly into your your your comment

[00:55:57] about, you know, the third eye and then the yin and the yang

[00:56:00] and the googly eye versus the bagel.

[00:56:02] I mean, this is such a weird conversation that we're having.

[00:56:06] Well, when you said like the googly eyes are very silly,

[00:56:09] I was almost thinking, I'm like, we were just talking about a bagel

[00:56:12] that sucks everything in.

[00:56:13] Like there's a lot of silliness in the movie makes no sense.

[00:56:17] It's great. But it's beautiful.

[00:56:19] It's right fighting with dildos.

[00:56:21] Like it's there's so like making a cop's head pop into confetti.

[00:56:26] Like there is so much silliness in this movie.

[00:56:30] Right. But I I just I love it so much.

[00:56:36] Did you get did you get the the hitchhiker's guide to the galaxy nods

[00:56:41] in the movie? No.

[00:56:43] So there's two.

[00:56:45] One of them is

[00:56:48] Jenny Slate's character comes in and her ticket number is 42.

[00:56:52] Well, it's zero for two.

[00:56:54] So I didn't think anything of that.

[00:56:56] Forty two is for anybody that

[00:56:58] meaning has seen or read hitchhikers.

[00:57:01] Forty two is the meaning of life.

[00:57:04] OK, which that's how old I am.

[00:57:06] That I'm a year older.

[00:57:08] But OK, I'm having my well, I'm having my my hitchhiker's birthday

[00:57:12] year, which is nice.

[00:57:14] And then there's also the aspect of verse jumping.

[00:57:18] And the verse jumping is very similar to hitting the button for the infinite

[00:57:23] probability drive. Yeah, OK. Right.

[00:57:27] So, you know, I when we're talking about different genres and different elements

[00:57:31] so that, you know, you can you can find matrix, you can find

[00:57:37] the hitchhiker's guide of the galaxy.

[00:57:38] I mean, you could find I'm sure horror references and.

[00:57:43] Horn with the dildos and the butt plugs.

[00:57:46] Can't forget the butt plugs.

[00:57:48] No, you can't. They're they're awards.

[00:57:50] They're IRS awards.

[00:57:51] I still remember the first time I watched this movie when Deidre is showing off

[00:57:55] her award saying like, you don't earn these awards for just being anybody.

[00:57:58] I'm like, they're butt plugs.

[00:58:00] I said that I said, is that a butt plug?

[00:58:02] And Tim goes, it sure are.

[00:58:05] And then they come into play later.

[00:58:07] And like the scene where I'm sure we'll dive into some of our favorite scenes

[00:58:11] do, but the scene where like she's trying to prevent the one guy because

[00:58:15] in order to pull from all these different universes, you have to do

[00:58:18] something completely improbable, whether it be chew on chapstick or at one point

[00:58:24] if she wipes like she wipes snot from gongong and like tastes it.

[00:58:29] It shoves it in his mouth.

[00:58:30] Shubs it in his mouth and like, but at one point,

[00:58:32] like in order for one of the guys she's fighting to pull,

[00:58:36] he has to insert one of the butt plugs into his own ass.

[00:58:39] And she's preventing him from doing it.

[00:58:41] And then all of a sudden the security guard in slow motion just comes flying in

[00:58:47] pantsless, holding his legs out.

[00:58:50] It's blurred out.

[00:58:52] It's great. Holding his legs out, just coming into deep dive bomb on top of it.

[00:58:58] But like.

[00:59:01] And then later on, the guy that she was fighting comes back into the scene

[00:59:05] and he's got like a trophy or something stuck.

[00:59:10] And it's weird.

[00:59:12] Well, and then you have you have

[00:59:15] Waymond, who is giving himself paper cuts between his fingers.

[00:59:19] And I'm just on the couch going, I can't handle this.

[00:59:22] I can handle all the butt plugs in the world.

[00:59:24] I cannot handle paper cuts.

[00:59:26] It's so funny because like I like I'm a big fan of the Jackass movies.

[00:59:31] And those things don't get me.

[00:59:33] But there's one stunt where like they just give Steve

[00:59:36] Oh, paper cuts that I have to fast forward through.

[00:59:39] Oh, gosh, I can't handle that.

[00:59:41] So when he's sitting there trying to give himself paper cuts, I'm like,

[00:59:44] oh, God, stop it.

[00:59:45] I can't do it.

[00:59:48] But it's your balls here at the inside of your thigh.

[00:59:51] That's fine.

[00:59:51] I cannot handle.

[00:59:53] And it's in between his fingers.

[00:59:56] But you know, I just oh, oh, my gosh.

[00:59:59] Yeah, the paper cut cuts were the worst one for me.

[01:00:01] But I did like it where, you know, she's realizing that she has

[01:00:05] to do something improbable or ridiculous in order to reverse jump.

[01:00:08] And she's like, I love you.

[01:00:10] And she puts the cross with her fingers in front of her.

[01:00:13] She's like, I love you.

[01:00:14] I love you.

[01:00:17] There's so many weird things that like these people do

[01:00:20] in order to do their verse jumping.

[01:00:22] And it's like, like, I love like I forget exactly what it is.

[01:00:25] But at one point, like Wayman's like, do jumping jacks.

[01:00:28] And Joyce like, that's not weird.

[01:00:31] Yeah.

[01:00:32] Wayman's like, I think she's about to do something weird again.

[01:00:37] But it like it kind of it kind of throws you to because the first time

[01:00:41] you see it happened is the the Fanny Pac scene, which is an amazing scene,

[01:00:47] by the way, amazing scene.

[01:00:49] And like the first thing the first weird thing you see anybody do

[01:00:54] is Wayman when he takes out chapstick out of the Fanny Pac.

[01:00:58] Rolls it up so that it's high bites it and just choose it.

[01:01:02] And you're like, what?

[01:01:04] What is happening at this point?

[01:01:07] And that's that's tame.

[01:01:10] Right. And so and we are the security guards.

[01:01:12] We are the security guards in that in that instance.

[01:01:15] We're like, I don't think you want to do that.

[01:01:19] Yeah. He goes, dude, whatever you think you're going to do,

[01:01:22] don't do it.

[01:01:24] But that that whole scene with the Fanny Pac is just.

[01:01:30] So I don't know if you I don't know if you you picked up on this or not.

[01:01:33] But do you know who two of the producers are on the movie?

[01:01:36] In addition to the Daniels.

[01:01:39] Is one of them Jackie Chan?

[01:01:40] No, it's the Russos.

[01:01:42] Oh, it is. You're right.

[01:01:44] It's the reason it's the Russos brothers who did obviously Avengers

[01:01:47] and Endgame, which is in itself very multiversal.

[01:01:52] Yeah. What was he versatile?

[01:01:54] Is that where they can?

[01:01:55] No, actually, the Russos brothers movie Marvel movies didn't deal with the multiverse.

[01:02:00] Yes, they did want them. They want them verse.

[01:02:04] I'm sorry, they do do multiversal stuff in in Endgame.

[01:02:08] So I take that back.

[01:02:11] But like that the fight scene, like the moment I saw

[01:02:15] the Russos brothers were producers, I was like, OK, well, that makes a lot of sense.

[01:02:19] Do you know?

[01:02:20] Did you know who was supposed to be the lead role for in the Michelle Yo spot?

[01:02:26] No, Jackie Chan.

[01:02:29] Really?

[01:02:30] They chose to have it be a woman instead to make it kind of a more grounded

[01:02:37] and centered story about a woman who's trying to get her life back

[01:02:41] instead of a man who's trying to get his life back.

[01:02:44] That was a conscious decision that they made.

[01:02:46] And I like it works better.

[01:02:47] Imagine it another way.

[01:02:49] Yeah, it works better with Michelle Yo.

[01:02:51] And Aquafina was originally supposed to be Joy. Joy.

[01:02:55] And I don't think she would have done it.

[01:02:58] I love Aquafina, but Stephanie Sue.

[01:03:02] Amazing in this.

[01:03:04] I like Aquafina too.

[01:03:05] And surprisingly, because I didn't think I would, because there are certain

[01:03:09] actresses that are kind of like similar to her that I could only take

[01:03:13] in very small doses.

[01:03:14] She's great in Shang-Chi.

[01:03:15] Like, oh, she's great in Shang-Chi.

[01:03:17] She's great in crazy rich Asians.

[01:03:18] Like, she's phenomenal.

[01:03:21] But another movie that Michelle Yo was in actually was crazy rich Asians,

[01:03:25] which is great.

[01:03:27] But like Rebel Wilson, I can only take in small doses.

[01:03:30] I can't take very large amounts for Aquafina.

[01:03:32] I actually really enjoy.

[01:03:35] You're right.

[01:03:36] I don't think it would have worked the same way if she played that role

[01:03:39] because it would have been played completely different.

[01:03:41] Right.

[01:03:42] It wouldn't have been played as serious, I don't think.

[01:03:45] Well, and just imagine if we had gotten Jackie Chan as as the lead,

[01:03:50] we wouldn't have gotten short round for Waymond.

[01:03:55] And I think Waymond makes this movie.

[01:03:58] He who?

[01:03:59] Kwan.

[01:04:00] I can't.

[01:04:01] I didn't want to butcher his name, which is why I called him short round.

[01:04:05] Yeah, just want everybody to know that.

[01:04:07] Key hoy. It's key.

[01:04:08] Hoi Kwan.

[01:04:09] He Hoi Kwan.

[01:04:11] Yes. Thank you.

[01:04:13] He has been having such a renaissance

[01:04:17] and resurgence because of this movie.

[01:04:19] Yeah, when he.

[01:04:23] Won the Golden Globe.

[01:04:26] I audibly cheered and started getting

[01:04:30] teared up and and teared up at his speech.

[01:04:33] It's very deserved.

[01:04:34] He plays like I think I saw in the trivia for this movie that he plays

[01:04:39] like 60 different characters.

[01:04:41] One surprised me.

[01:04:42] Right. One bit.

[01:04:44] He is phenomenal in this movie.

[01:04:49] I really, really, really hope he wins the Oscar.

[01:04:53] Do you know why he hasn't acted in 20 years?

[01:04:57] I do not.

[01:04:58] He wouldn't take any roles that weren't.

[01:05:05] He didn't like the Asian stereotype

[01:05:08] that was being offered to him, and he wasn't getting the roles

[01:05:12] that he wanted to really do.

[01:05:15] So he just didn't do them.

[01:05:17] And more power to him for that.

[01:05:19] Right. Because it led to what he's what's been happening now.

[01:05:23] He's and he's really knocked it out of the park.

[01:05:25] The best thing I think about.

[01:05:28] You know what? Go ahead, because I wanted to touch on something.

[01:05:31] It'll take a while.

[01:05:32] But no, the only other thing I was going to make mention of that too.

[01:05:35] I mean, I don't want to skirt around the performances of anybody else

[01:05:38] in this movie because Michelle Yeo is absolutely amazing.

[01:05:41] Pop notch.

[01:05:43] Jamie Lee Curtis is phenomenal, phenomenal in this movie.

[01:05:49] She's so good.

[01:05:50] And I love the fact that she like she says like,

[01:05:53] I didn't have to get shaped for this movie.

[01:05:56] Like I just played myself in this movie.

[01:05:58] Like they asked her if she gained weight for the movie.

[01:06:00] And she said, no, I just stopped sucking in.

[01:06:03] Well, I do think Deidre is a little bit of a fat suit.

[01:06:07] But in the fight scene, like when she goes to Alpha Deidre, it kind of sucks in.

[01:06:12] I think she just sucks in.

[01:06:14] Oh, really?

[01:06:15] I don't think Jamie is that heavy.

[01:06:18] She said she said that she just didn't have to suck in.

[01:06:21] She said, I just, you know, let it all hang out.

[01:06:24] Yeah, but I don't know because there's a huge difference

[01:06:27] between Jamie and this and Jamie and Halloween,

[01:06:30] and they were not that far off from each other.

[01:06:33] I think they film this movie.

[01:06:34] They filmed this movie in 38 days in January of 2020.

[01:06:41] I don't I still think there's a little bit of prosthetic there.

[01:06:45] I could be wrong.

[01:06:46] I think I still think there's a little bit.

[01:06:49] But again, Jamie Lee Curtis is is phenomenal in this movie.

[01:06:56] Like we mentioned Ki Hikwan.

[01:06:58] Stephanie Sue is fantastic.

[01:07:00] James Hong is amazing in this movie.

[01:07:03] He and he plays James Hong like that's this is the same kind of role

[01:07:07] he plays in everything, but he plays that kind of role so often

[01:07:10] because he's so good at these kind of roles like the old curmudgeonly

[01:07:17] Korean dad, like that's the right perfect role for him now.

[01:07:20] Like he's been in Big Bang Theory as the owner of the of the Chinese

[01:07:24] suit restaurant where Sheldon wants him to show is there is

[01:07:29] their orange peels because right he wants orange chicken,

[01:07:33] but he thinks it's tangerines like tangerine chicken.

[01:07:35] Yeah, but maybe going all the way back to Big Trouble in Little China.

[01:07:39] You know, it's just he's a phenomenal legendary actor.

[01:07:43] But one of my favorite things about.

[01:07:46] What's happening now in the world with award season

[01:07:49] with the Golden Globes and the Oscars and everything is I love

[01:07:53] this big reconnection between Kihoo Kwan and Spielberg.

[01:07:57] That's been happening because Spielberg gave him his start.

[01:08:01] Oh, and now they're both up for Oscars together this year,

[01:08:04] not in the same category, but Spielberg for best directing

[01:08:08] for the Fableman's than Kihoo Kwan obviously for supporting actor

[01:08:10] for everything everywhere all at once for fableman's.

[01:08:14] Well, I said I'm just kidding.

[01:08:16] No, yeah, not for which I still need to watch that movie.

[01:08:20] Actually, he's in tar, everybody.

[01:08:23] Who's Spielberg?

[01:08:25] All of them.

[01:08:26] He plays the whale and the whale.

[01:08:28] No, but like I also love the reconnection of him

[01:08:32] and Brendan Fraser, that's been happening right now,

[01:08:35] because they're both two actors who kind of disappeared from Hollywood

[01:08:39] for a while for a while until this year

[01:08:43] and are now in their first movies back

[01:08:46] or getting huge accolades for their performances.

[01:08:50] Yeah. Like Brendan Fraser is nominated

[01:08:52] for best actor for the whale, Kihoo Kwan obviously for supporting actor

[01:08:55] for everything everywhere all at once.

[01:08:57] I want them both to win and I haven't seen the whale yet.

[01:09:02] I just I just want to feel good story really.

[01:09:05] I do. I want like when

[01:09:09] when Kihoo Kwan gave a speech at the Golden Globes, it got me choked up.

[01:09:12] Brendan Fraser speech at the Spirit Awards

[01:09:16] was incredibly emotional, even though it was under a minute.

[01:09:19] Like you can just feel the pure joy that is coming from these people.

[01:09:25] Like these aren't two guys that are regularly nominated and up for awards

[01:09:29] and are at the awards ceremonies every year.

[01:09:31] This is the first time they've been doing this for a year

[01:09:34] and it's a completely new element to them.

[01:09:37] So you can feel the genuine emotion coming from them.

[01:09:41] And I want like I just love sharing in that and witnessing that.

[01:09:45] So that's why I'm not saying there aren't other great nominees this year.

[01:09:51] I don't care about them because I want to feel the joy that these guys feel when they win.

[01:09:56] Yeah, I see what you're saying.

[01:10:00] So I have just a few extra things.

[01:10:01] I have two more little points that I just wanted to make.

[01:10:05] One of them is I mentioned a few a few minutes ago

[01:10:09] that this movie was filmed in January of 2020.

[01:10:13] This was before the pandemic.

[01:10:15] This was before the election.

[01:10:17] This was before all the chaos and turmoil and fear injected kind of society

[01:10:25] that we've been living in for the past three years now.

[01:10:30] And this movie comes out in the beginning of 2022.

[01:10:34] And it's and it's telling us to fight fear and chaos with kindness and love

[01:10:40] and to not get off track of what really matters, which is who we are

[01:10:45] and who we love and who is around us.

[01:10:48] And for this to be filmed and thought of and written before all of this happened

[01:10:55] of this kind of post apocalyptic chaos we've been living in for the past three years.

[01:11:01] I think it's just it's the movie that we really needed.

[01:11:05] You know, it's that injection of hope,

[01:11:08] that injection of we can be better and we can get out of this.

[01:11:12] And we all we need is is our own compass.

[01:11:15] There's that compass again, our own compass and our own people.

[01:11:20] And we'll be just fine if we just make life simple again.

[01:11:24] Right. And it's just become too complicated.

[01:11:27] So I did want to touch on that for just a moment because the movie was very

[01:11:32] ahead of what was to come when it was being made.

[01:11:36] And I'd love to know if

[01:11:42] if the directors or the writers really have any thoughts as

[01:11:48] to what kind of happened to our society and our world

[01:11:52] after they finished filming this movie.

[01:11:55] And let's ask them, please welcome to know.

[01:11:57] Sorry. Oh my gosh, wouldn't that be amazing?

[01:12:00] And then the second thing I wanted to kind of touch on was their intention

[01:12:04] of really handling intergenerational trauma, which, you know, I look, I'm not

[01:12:10] I'm not of Asian descent.

[01:12:12] I don't know a lot about Chinese culture.

[01:12:15] I know what I've studied.

[01:12:17] I know what I've read.

[01:12:18] But again, I don't know from personal experience.

[01:12:21] So if I'm wrong, I apologize in advance.

[01:12:25] But from what I from what I have gathered,

[01:12:29] you know, Chinese culture is very, very, very dependent on

[01:12:36] treating their ancestors and their elders with respect.

[01:12:40] And I did I lived with the Chinese family when I was lived in San Francisco for a year.

[01:12:46] And, you know, it's that sandwich generation living where,

[01:12:52] you know, you have the mom and the dad and they have a child,

[01:12:55] but they also take care of their parents.

[01:12:58] And they all live in the same house together.

[01:13:00] And it's it's the idea that we take care of the younger,

[01:13:04] the future and we take care of the past.

[01:13:07] And, you know, at this age, the age that I'm in where I do have,

[01:13:11] I have my parents and I do have my children.

[01:13:13] And so I would, you know,

[01:13:18] if we had a parent that needed to be taken care of,

[01:13:22] it would be our responsibility and our privilege to to care for our parents.

[01:13:28] As they're older and we and that is kind of how it goes.

[01:13:33] So.

[01:13:36] What I what I'm interested in is, is the the theme of intergenerational

[01:13:40] trauma because of.

[01:13:43] Whether it's a Chinese thing or American thing,

[01:13:48] African American thing, I think it's just a human thing, right?

[01:13:52] That we seem to take on.

[01:13:55] The trauma of our elders, the trauma of our ancestors and, you know, what.

[01:14:02] What my like what my how my mother was raised directly affected

[01:14:07] how she raised me, which directly affected how I raised my children,

[01:14:12] which will directly reflect how my children raised my grandchildren.

[01:14:18] If I get to have them.

[01:14:21] And I think that we take the negative with us,

[01:14:25] the emotional baggage with us along the way.

[01:14:28] And you can see how that's written out in the story.

[01:14:32] So I did find, I did find a quote.

[01:14:36] So it says, I'm just going to read this, but it says,

[01:14:39] during his May 2022 interview with Dan Kwan and Daniel China.

[01:14:45] I'm sorry if I said that wrong.

[01:14:46] An empire magazine.

[01:14:48] Journalist John Nugent writes that the idea of a parent not understanding

[01:14:53] their kid bled into what eventually became everything everywhere all at once.

[01:14:57] The intergenerational divide turned multiversal metaphor.

[01:15:01] OK, good. That's what I told you as a real word.

[01:15:05] Kwan explains, quote, our parents are constantly having to deal

[01:15:08] with the fact that we are their kids like I am the parent of the guy

[01:15:12] who made the farting corpse movie.

[01:15:14] This movie in some weird way is a reflection of that,

[01:15:18] that daughter is this strange creature and the mother has to go on the journey

[01:15:24] to basically become a monster herself in order to connect with her.

[01:15:28] Hopefully it's a very gracious portrayal of our relationship with our parents.

[01:15:33] So I saved that in my phone because I wanted to make sure to read that

[01:15:37] because I definitely got that out of the movie.

[01:15:42] How did you feel about that?

[01:15:43] No, I agree with you.

[01:15:45] I'm kind of stuck on the whole and I didn't realize it until now

[01:15:48] that the Daniels were also the ones that directed Swiss Army Man

[01:15:52] and the farting corpse movie.

[01:15:54] That is the farting corpse movie.

[01:15:55] OK, there you go.

[01:15:57] What's our name? No. Yeah, it's.

[01:16:00] It's I don't know if you've ever if you've ever seen it.

[01:16:04] It's no actually it's.

[01:16:07] I don't.

[01:16:08] It's kind of similar to everything everywhere all at once is that when

[01:16:11] you read when you watch the trailer and you what listen to the premise,

[01:16:15] it it sounds completely and utterly ridiculous.

[01:16:18] But when you watch it, there are so many elements that make

[01:16:22] total sense to the story that they're trying to tell.

[01:16:25] So like I'm starting to realize a pattern now in the way

[01:16:29] that the Daniels kind of portray the stories that they that they tell.

[01:16:34] And I'm actually I'm really it's kind of it's kind of similar

[01:16:38] to like I will watch almost anything a 24 puts out.

[01:16:43] And this is one of them.

[01:16:44] This is one of them. Yeah.

[01:16:46] And like now I'm to the point where I feel like if I if the Daniels do movies,

[01:16:53] I feel like I need to watch them.

[01:16:55] But there's only been two that they've directed.

[01:16:57] It's been everything everywhere all at once and Swiss Army Man.

[01:17:01] So well, maybe they'll do more after this.

[01:17:04] This probably will open up a lot of doors for them.

[01:17:06] I hope so.

[01:17:08] So but I kind of got away from your question.

[01:17:09] What was your question again?

[01:17:10] How I feel about the the just the idea of the intergenerational trauma

[01:17:16] aspect of what I was talking about before and then the the portrayal of,

[01:17:20] you know, how parents see their kids as these weird creatures

[01:17:24] that they have to try to identify with if they're going out of a relationship with them.

[01:17:28] Yeah, I know I agree with you completely on the inner and the intergenerational

[01:17:33] trauma, carrying the baggage of what you

[01:17:37] of what your parents kind of went through as well.

[01:17:39] I kind of.

[01:17:41] I see that a little bit of myself with my mother because like I see a lot

[01:17:46] of the things that my mother went through in her life and I've kind of gone

[01:17:48] through a lot of similar things, both emotionally and physically.

[01:17:53] My father not so much only because I've

[01:17:56] I've I kind of got away from the negative negativity of that family life.

[01:18:01] I don't speak to my father.

[01:18:03] If anybody knows me, I'm a strange from my father and that side of the family.

[01:18:06] I don't speak to them.

[01:18:07] And that was almost kind of my escape from repeating.

[01:18:12] You know, I saw what my the way my father treated his marriage.

[01:18:17] I saw the way my father treated his kids.

[01:18:19] And I didn't want to be that kind of a parent when I grew up.

[01:18:22] So that was one of the reasons kind of why I escaped from it.

[01:18:26] I learned unlike some other like unfortunately for some people,

[01:18:30] I learned the kind of parent I want to be by emulating by

[01:18:36] seeing how my father did it and not doing those things.

[01:18:41] You know, multiple marriages, affairs, things like that.

[01:18:44] And I learned I kind of escaped from it.

[01:18:47] But I do see that reflected in my mother and it's not

[01:18:51] in the in the intergenerational baggage, but it's not anything

[01:18:56] that's too hard to handle, at least at this point.

[01:19:01] So but I do see it.

[01:19:05] As far as the.

[01:19:08] What was the second part?

[01:19:10] Sorry. No, that's OK.

[01:19:12] Just the idea of, you know, relating with

[01:19:18] in this respect, your children is like these weird creatures.

[01:19:22] Right. Or I mean, since you don't have children,

[01:19:24] you could be like, you know, your your mom probably saw you as a weird creature.

[01:19:28] Still think but she also now she watches movies with you and she'll sit down

[01:19:33] and, you know, she'll talk to you about the kind of stuff that you do.

[01:19:36] And I don't know, maybe that's been an evolution for you with your mom over the years.

[01:19:40] Yeah, I mean, it's.

[01:19:42] I don't think it was too heavy of an evolution because my mom's always

[01:19:45] been a very open minded person about a lot of different things.

[01:19:48] And she's like, yeah, you're right.

[01:19:50] I don't have children of my own.

[01:19:52] So I get to watch it kind of reflect in.

[01:19:58] In other friends of mine that have children,

[01:20:01] you know, with you and your kids, I get along and your kids are absolutely weird creatures.

[01:20:06] Thank you.

[01:20:08] I see it, you know, in my friend, one of my best friends, Rob and his wife,

[01:20:12] you know, and their two year old daughter, who is absolutely adorable,

[01:20:15] but she is a weird child like, yeah, I see these things.

[01:20:18] And you kind of realize like, well, we were like that when we were younger, too.

[01:20:22] We were absolutely these these younger kids.

[01:20:25] But as time changes, it kind of changes and becomes more acceptable.

[01:20:30] Like the things that I'm doing now at my age at 43 years old, my mother was not doing

[01:20:36] like she was not good.

[01:20:37] Like she was at 43.

[01:20:41] She was a parent.

[01:20:42] She was a mom like I'm and I have friends who are my age who have kids,

[01:20:46] but they're still doing like they're going to movies with their kids.

[01:20:50] They're going to events with their kids.

[01:20:52] My mom, you didn't do that back then.

[01:20:54] No, you didn't do that back then.

[01:20:55] No, there was a separation.

[01:20:57] It kind of changes.

[01:20:58] But you're right.

[01:20:59] Like I love the fact that I get to watch things.

[01:21:02] I get to share in experiences with my mom.

[01:21:04] Like I take I get to go to screenings,

[01:21:07] event screenings of all the Marvel movies.

[01:21:09] And I usually take my mom with me because she's like we're going

[01:21:13] to a advanced screening of Ant-Man and the Wasquantum Mania in a couple of weeks.

[01:21:18] That's awesome.

[01:21:19] I took my mom to a screening of Bad Santa, not bad Santa, a violent night.

[01:21:24] And we absolutely loved it.

[01:21:26] That's even better.

[01:21:27] Right. Like, you know, we and then there are certain shows

[01:21:31] that we only watch together when because my mother still comes to visit

[01:21:34] one night a week and we always have dinner and then we have lunch the next day

[01:21:38] and because she'll spend the night.

[01:21:41] And there are certain shows that we watch together because their experiences from us,

[01:21:45] like New Amsterdam, we watched every week.

[01:21:47] We watched the Masked Singer because it's fucking ridiculous,

[01:21:50] but we love it for that reason.

[01:21:52] Like America's Got Talent, like we just share in these experiences.

[01:21:55] So junk food television.

[01:21:57] Yeah, pretty much even like we're watching The Last of Us together right now.

[01:22:01] That's not junk food.

[01:22:02] That is not junk.

[01:22:03] Some of it some of it is junk food.

[01:22:05] But I mean, I guess my point is, is that, you know, we.

[01:22:09] Is that we are always trying to make the connections that we can, right?

[01:22:16] And I think starting at our family and starting at the people

[01:22:20] that either made us or that we made, right, is a really good place to start.

[01:22:25] Yes. You know, in this movie, it just opens up so many

[01:22:29] memories and emotions and feelings.

[01:22:32] And, you know, I can't wait to watch it again.

[01:22:37] I felt the same way.

[01:22:38] Like after I finished watching it last night, I was like,

[01:22:41] I really want to watch this again.

[01:22:42] I put off watching it for like a couple of weeks, too.

[01:22:45] You too. Like, again, this last was my first.

[01:22:48] My second watch was last night.

[01:22:50] And it was better than the first time.

[01:22:52] And my first watch was when it first came out.

[01:22:55] So I've been sitting on it for a couple of months, actually.

[01:22:58] Yeah, before we were watching it now that I've rewatched it

[01:23:01] and we've talked about it and we've kind of taken a deeper look at it.

[01:23:04] And I'm like, yeah, I kind of want to watch it again now.

[01:23:08] Yeah, because I want to see like you mentioned,

[01:23:10] I want to see if there's anything I'm going to pick up on

[01:23:13] the second time or the third time around.

[01:23:16] And like getting to the point of like how people can relate to this movie

[01:23:21] and the family dynamic and everything that's happening with this.

[01:23:24] First off, I want to say to anybody who might be listening

[01:23:27] just because you're a fan of the podcast, even if you haven't seen the movie.

[01:23:31] If you tried the movie and it wasn't for you,

[01:23:34] like you couldn't get into it, I urge you just try it again.

[01:23:37] Try it again. Just just try it one more time.

[01:23:39] And especially if you're still listening at this point,

[01:23:41] I think we've been talking for a while.

[01:23:44] Yeah, you know, try it again.

[01:23:46] If you don't like it, like that's fine.

[01:23:49] It is what it is.

[01:23:50] But I urge you just kind of try it again.

[01:23:54] With this in mind, with everything that we've talked about in mind.

[01:23:57] Yes. If you've already seen the movie, watch it again,

[01:24:01] because that's what we're going to do.

[01:24:03] You know, in terms of that relation, I think that's one of the reasons why

[01:24:07] like I kind of got choked up the second time around earlier on with

[01:24:13] with Evelyn and her husband is because like the first time around

[01:24:18] I connected to well, I didn't connect to it,

[01:24:21] but I saw the mother-daughter relationship that was that was being fixed.

[01:24:25] And it's just an emotional story.

[01:24:27] So I got connected to it.

[01:24:28] But then, you know, I see Wayman and Evelyn's relationship.

[01:24:34] And I kind of reflect in that a little bit like, well, I'm not a husband,

[01:24:37] but that would be the husband I would want to be.

[01:24:40] Like the one that's constantly supportive of not only my wife, but my child.

[01:24:46] And even if I feel like my wife is now granted,

[01:24:50] he did have divorce papers drawn up and it was out of complete desperation

[01:24:54] because you can only try so many times before it's constantly

[01:24:57] two steps forward, one step back.

[01:24:59] It's one of the reasons why I'm estranged from my father,

[01:25:01] because you can only try so many times before nothing takes effect.

[01:25:06] There's really two steps forward, three steps back.

[01:25:09] Yeah, yeah, that's true, too.

[01:25:13] So I kind of understand his desperation in drawing up the papers.

[01:25:19] But still, like even with everything when she

[01:25:23] smashes the window to the laundromat when she,

[01:25:26] you know, goes off on this this thing at the end,

[01:25:29] like he's even with divorce papers drawn up.

[01:25:32] He still loves and supports his wife.

[01:25:36] Well, she signs the papers and she's in the she's in the nihilism part,

[01:25:40] you know, of her journey.

[01:25:41] She's like, nothing matters.

[01:25:43] I want to break this glass.

[01:25:44] Doesn't matter. I'm going to get a rest.

[01:25:46] Rested doesn't matter. I'm going to sign these papers.

[01:25:50] See, yeah, doesn't matter.

[01:25:52] But I love the fact that what saves

[01:25:57] gives them a temporary stay of execution on the losing the laundromat

[01:26:01] is the fact that it's Wayman that tells Deidre

[01:26:05] where I just presented her divorce papers.

[01:26:08] This is why she feels this way.

[01:26:11] And the fact that Deidre completely understands that

[01:26:15] and says, like, let her go, like take the handcuffs off her.

[01:26:18] It's fine. Like we'll give you, you know, we'll give you some.

[01:26:20] We're going to go get high outside on the bench.

[01:26:22] We're going to go smoke a vape on the bench outside.

[01:26:25] But it's because she relates to it.

[01:26:28] And then in that moment, like when Evelyn says, like, no,

[01:26:31] you're not a horrible person like the like that whoever that person made you feel.

[01:26:37] It's another reflection of how Evelyn was just got done healing all these people

[01:26:41] in this battle to save joy.

[01:26:43] She's continuing on with this.

[01:26:45] This is a woman.

[01:26:46] This is a woman who she's had nothing but issues with

[01:26:49] because she feels there is a threat because she's trying to take her laundromat

[01:26:53] from her, but now she's sitting on a bench next to her consoling her

[01:26:57] and making her feel like she's not a horrible person.

[01:27:00] And that she's not alone.

[01:27:01] And that she's not alone.

[01:27:02] And then they smoke a vape together.

[01:27:04] And it's it's it's fantastic.

[01:27:07] Yeah, I agree.

[01:27:08] So yeah, what a good movie.

[01:27:10] There's a lot of things people can find in this movie.

[01:27:14] And I think that's one of the reasons why I love it so much

[01:27:17] is that different people can take away different things from watching this movie.

[01:27:22] And it's just it's fantastic.

[01:27:27] Oh, boy.

[01:27:29] Yeah.

[01:27:30] All right. Well, with that, I don't know if you have it pulled up,

[01:27:34] but do you want to go over what everything that the movie has been

[01:27:38] nominated for before we go into listener feedback?

[01:27:40] I'm actually looking that up as we speak

[01:27:45] because it has been nominated for, as you mentioned, 11.

[01:27:49] 11 11 Academy Awards.

[01:27:52] It is the most nominated film this year.

[01:27:55] In all honesty, it should have been 12

[01:27:57] because it was not nominated for visual effects.

[01:28:00] And I was just going to say that.

[01:28:01] I can't even believe it.

[01:28:02] It is a travesty that it was not nominated for.

[01:28:07] Like, I know that it's, you know, it's, you know,

[01:28:09] it's already nominated for 11.

[01:28:10] Why not 12? But come on, come on.

[01:28:14] Well, I mean, when you watch the movie.

[01:28:20] It's visually stunning.

[01:28:21] It's visually fantastic.

[01:28:23] But the.

[01:28:25] So I have it's nominated for 11 awards, two of them in the same category.

[01:28:30] So it's technically 10 different awards, but it has 11 nominations.

[01:28:34] Best picture, best actress and Michelle Yo,

[01:28:38] best supporting actress for

[01:28:41] Jamie Lee Curtis and Stephanie Stephanie Sue, Stephanie Sue,

[01:28:46] best supporting actor for Ki Huu Kwan, best original score,

[01:28:50] best director for the Daniels, best original screenplay,

[01:28:53] best costume design and best film editing.

[01:28:55] Now I could see the film editing in lieu of the visual effects,

[01:29:00] but the visual effects are just as good.

[01:29:02] They're phenomenal.

[01:29:03] I mean, come on, like.

[01:29:05] And the costumes are really great too.

[01:29:06] Like when you think about

[01:29:08] Joby, Joby's job, a ray of costumes was pretty great.

[01:29:15] She is.

[01:29:17] God, she is just as amazing as everybody else in this movie.

[01:29:21] Like everybody had to have been an exhausting 38 days for her.

[01:29:26] Right. For all of them.

[01:29:27] 38 days for all of them.

[01:29:30] When you see all the different environments and all the different scenes,

[01:29:33] like you think about the fact that there are so many different

[01:29:36] universes that they visit, even if just for a short period of time.

[01:29:41] There's a ton of setup.

[01:29:42] There's a ton of scripted like scripts that go into it.

[01:29:45] Like it's just, yeah, I can't.

[01:29:49] I can't imagine so good.

[01:29:51] But think about now.

[01:29:54] What it's what it's done for them.

[01:29:57] Like all these awards that it's up for, like it's it was worth the grueling.

[01:30:02] Absolutely.

[01:30:03] And Jamie Lee Curtis said that she had no idea what she was filming.

[01:30:08] She just kind of did what she was told through the whole movie.

[01:30:11] And it wasn't until she because she never saw the finished product until

[01:30:16] the premiere and she came up to one of the Daniels at the end and she was sobbing.

[01:30:20] And she said, I understand it now.

[01:30:22] I get it.

[01:30:23] I understand what this whole thing is supposed to be.

[01:30:27] And one of the Daniels said that that was just the highest

[01:30:30] compliment that he could have ever received from somebody.

[01:30:33] It just is legendary and iconic as Jamie Lee Curtis.

[01:30:35] So, yeah, it was really great.

[01:30:38] I mean, I mean, Jamie Lee. Oh my God, like not even just you're right.

[01:30:43] She is. I mean, you look at the caliber of people in this movie.

[01:30:47] I mean, obviously, Kihu Qua is who's got a nice resurgence, hasn't done

[01:30:50] anything for a while.

[01:30:52] But Michelle Yeo is fantastic.

[01:30:54] Like she's been in a ton of stuff.

[01:30:56] We mentioned James Hong already and the legend that he is.

[01:30:59] But Jamie Lee Curtis is for someone like her of her caliber to take on

[01:31:04] a supporting role like this and not a lead speaks volumes one of her as a person.

[01:31:12] Because she'll take a role not for the fame, but for the story.

[01:31:17] Even though she didn't know what the story story was when she was filming it.

[01:31:21] It's like a Marvel movie.

[01:31:22] But you look at like all of the stuff that she's done from Halloween

[01:31:25] to, you know, trading places and true lies, fish called Wanda.

[01:31:28] Like she has done a ton of stellar work and this just is just yet another.

[01:31:36] Thing on her resume that just makes another feather in her cap, right?

[01:31:40] Mm hmm. It's just, man.

[01:31:43] Cast is phenomenal stories, phenomenal, the visual effects are phenomenal.

[01:31:47] This movie is just I hope it sweeps.

[01:31:50] I really do. I hope it sweeps.

[01:31:54] I don't know if it will sweep.

[01:31:58] I'm just saying I hope it sweeps.

[01:32:00] I think I still need to watch everything else.

[01:32:07] I still hope it sweeps. No, I'm with you.

[01:32:10] I hope it wins everything it's nominated for.

[01:32:13] But there is some there is some heavy competition.

[01:32:17] Yeah, yeah, yeah, I hope it sweeps. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[01:32:19] They're going to win. La la la la la la.

[01:32:22] I was getting a listener feedback.

[01:32:24] Yes, because we do have a couple of things. Yes.

[01:32:28] We have a little bit we did only give.

[01:32:30] We gave very short notice on listener feedback.

[01:32:33] So thank you to those who gave us a little comment about the movie.

[01:32:38] We really appreciate it.

[01:32:41] How about if you start us off? OK, first piece of feedback we have

[01:32:45] comes from Barry Evits.

[01:32:47] He says I watched this twice and could probably watch 100 more times

[01:32:51] and still find new things to enjoy about this movie.

[01:32:54] Us too. I love the message of this film

[01:32:57] to appreciate the life that you have and not the one that you could have had

[01:33:00] or dream having amazing performances from the entire cast, fantastic action sequences

[01:33:04] as well as stunning dramatic scenes.

[01:33:06] This movie really creates a world that you enjoy seeing slowly unravel ten out of ten.

[01:33:13] I agree with all your words.

[01:33:16] Every every single word in that I completely agree.

[01:33:19] You used very good words.

[01:33:21] Our next piece of feedback is from Steve Brown.

[01:33:26] No live steving when we didn't give enough time.

[01:33:30] But he Steve says saw this in the theater and was blown away.

[01:33:35] Incredible cast and acting.

[01:33:37] I should have watched it again.

[01:33:39] Well, fix that, Steve, and watch it again.

[01:33:41] Fix it.

[01:33:44] And the last piece we have comes from good old Jason Kabbasi.

[01:33:49] The the the pod father as he is.

[01:33:53] And he says, love this movie so crazy and imaginative.

[01:33:57] And I especially like the unlikely protagonist at the center of it.

[01:34:01] A middle aged Chinese mother worried about the path she's taken in life.

[01:34:05] I thought it was an exciting, funny, visually stunning, multiversal.

[01:34:08] There's that word again.

[01:34:10] Metaphor of untapped potential and ultimately the appreciation of one's life.

[01:34:15] Very bold move to put out a movie like this that, in my opinion,

[01:34:18] is so unlike anything we've seen.

[01:34:20] Awesome. I like all those words, too.

[01:34:24] You know, completely agree with all of them.

[01:34:27] But yeah, thank you for the feedback, guys.

[01:34:30] Definitely. Thank you.

[01:34:31] And thank you to all of our listeners and especially to everybody

[01:34:34] who sent in their feedback.

[01:34:36] We love to hear from you.

[01:34:37] Any podcast on the podcast to connect work, we love to hear from the listeners.

[01:34:42] It's honestly, it's my favorite part of the podcast.

[01:34:46] I love the engagement.

[01:34:47] I love seeing what everybody thinks.

[01:34:49] I love feeling like we're actually talking to somebody.

[01:34:52] So that's really fun.

[01:34:53] So definitely keep it coming.

[01:34:55] If you're listening to the podcast, just drop a line on anybody's podcast.

[01:35:00] You know, drop a quick line. I love you. I hate you.

[01:35:03] I have a good recipe for non-dairy paleo cheesecake.

[01:35:06] Oh, that again.

[01:35:08] Still looking for.

[01:35:13] I told you, I'll have someone send it to me and then I'll send it to you

[01:35:16] because it's garbage in my house.

[01:35:19] No, no paleo or no gluten free cheesecake will enter this apartment.

[01:35:24] But if you do have an idea for what you would like covered next on the podcast,

[01:35:28] let us know by writing to us at talk at podcastica.com.

[01:35:34] Yeah. And maybe we can keep going with some Oscar nominees, which is always fun.

[01:35:38] Yeah. I mean, there's 10.

[01:35:39] There's 10 best picture nominations right now

[01:35:42] to 10 episodes.

[01:35:43] And two of them have already been covered now with you covering

[01:35:46] a avatar of the way of water with Wendy and now us covering

[01:35:50] everything, everywhere all at once.

[01:35:51] So I seem to be monopolizing this.

[01:35:53] So I would if it's not there was no way in how I was going to join you on the avatar one.

[01:35:58] So OK, Wendy and I had a good time.

[01:36:01] I'm sure you did.

[01:36:02] And I do kind of have to see it now because it's been nominated.

[01:36:05] So I'm being I'm forced into watching it this year, even though I don't want to.

[01:36:12] I'll see it in the theaters.

[01:36:13] But I do play I do play fair when I watch all the Oscar movies.

[01:36:17] I watch them all.

[01:36:17] I don't exclude any of them just because.

[01:36:23] And if when we do have our next episode scheduled,

[01:36:26] we will have a post for that on facebook.com forward slash podcastica,

[01:36:31] where you can leave a comment for us to read on the podcast.

[01:36:34] Or you can write in or send us a voice message to talk at podcastica.com.

[01:36:39] And if you forget any of that that we've mentioned so far,

[01:36:43] all of the contact information can be found at podcastica.com.

[01:36:48] And that is a wrap on everything, everywhere, all at once.

[01:36:52] Thank you so much to everybody for listening.

[01:36:56] And cut.

[01:36:58] All right, folks, shows over.