84: “Familiar By Thy Side” (Agatha All Along S1E6)

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[00:01:24] I had a feeling when we first met. Even with the sigil in the way, you and your mother have the same tell.

[00:01:35] Which is?

[00:01:36] Very inconvenient for you. I wasn't sure sure until... you.

[00:01:59] It's nice to see you again, Billy.

[00:02:03] Hey everybody, welcome to Marvel TV Cast from Podcastica. I'm Penny.

[00:02:36] And I am Jim and today we'll be talking about Agatha All Along Season 1 Episode 6.

[00:02:44] Familiar by Thy Side. And what a tasty episode this was.

[00:02:50] I mean, we got so many answers to questions, but it just opened up all these new questions for me.

[00:02:58] You know what I will say about the show, just in awe that I have about us doing this podcast, is that as we've talked out several things, a lot of these things that we're starting to see, we have certainly touched upon.

[00:03:16] We both were talking about, either in the last episode or the episodes before, about we have to have that teen episode where it goes back in time and kind of fills in the holes.

[00:03:27] And I didn't think it was going to go quite back this far and just fill in all of the holes, which I thought was tremendous.

[00:03:32] So I will commend both of us because I think we're starting to hit a stride with this, where we're starting to get the rhythm of the show.

[00:03:40] And with three episodes left, I'm starting to feel like I know where we're heading.

[00:03:43] I feel like there's another big twist coming because in WandaVision, the Agatha twist happened in episode 7, where Agnes was revealed as Agatha.

[00:03:59] Yes.

[00:03:59] So I'm guessing that there's a big twist, another big twist coming in episode 8 of this nine-part series.

[00:04:08] Yes. Well, there's so...

[00:04:10] Like a bigger surprise.

[00:04:11] I, again, I have a feeling we're going to be making some guesses as to certain things, but there's some big things that we still don't really know who's sort of controlling all of this.

[00:04:24] And I think as I watched this episode, a couple of semi-important questions popped into my head that maybe didn't seem as important before that we'll kind of get into.

[00:04:35] Not to mention the fact that as we currently stand, we have two witches left.

[00:04:42] I don't believe that to be true.

[00:04:46] Yeah.

[00:04:46] But, you know, as they were walking down the road, we really had an episode that was sort of focused strictly on Teen, who I guess we can now call William or Billy.

[00:04:57] Billy, of course, he's kind of both.

[00:05:00] And so right now, as we end the episode, we really only saw in current time two of our witches.

[00:05:08] So it'll be fun locating the rest as we head into the last three episodes, which makes me so sad.

[00:05:16] I know. Only three episodes left. That's crazy. It's crazy.

[00:05:20] Because it's been such a fun ride.

[00:05:22] Yes.

[00:05:22] And it seems like it went by so fast.

[00:05:24] Yes.

[00:05:25] So where should we start digging in?

[00:05:29] Do you want to start? Do you want to go kind of chronological?

[00:05:33] Well, yes.

[00:05:34] Start with the bar mitzvah?

[00:05:35] Because I think that short period of time that Jack Schaefer introduced us to William was very impactful in making us feel attached to a character that we really have not known and only knew for about five minutes of the episode.

[00:06:00] But I, of course, the episode starts with William, who at that moment we don't know is a different character from the one that we're dealing with.

[00:06:11] And well, it maybe isn't in some ways, but.

[00:06:15] Yeah, it's very unclear.

[00:06:16] I immediately was.

[00:06:20] I mean, just in a visceral sense, I love it when shows just in the normal storytelling mode introduces to the viewers to things that I think is important that we see.

[00:06:38] And I love that in a series that has delved into LGBTQ plus in a series that has handled these really finicky situations with with.

[00:06:55] Just the the.

[00:06:58] Fantastic hands of of care.

[00:07:01] We get to meet William, who is going through his bar mitzvah, which is important in that it gives us kind of a conversation.

[00:07:08] Cultural reference point.

[00:07:09] And it also gives us an age because, of course, you go through your bar mitzvah at the age of 13.

[00:07:16] And of course, we know that something happened to him at the age of 13.

[00:07:20] So I'm going to pass the torch on to you with this.

[00:07:23] But I I loved I loved the the scenes of the bar mitzvah.

[00:07:29] I love that the the background of William was quickly kind of informed upon us as you know, he's kind of interested in and magic, because if you looked on the.

[00:07:44] His invitations that you could kind of see on the side, it said it was a magic mitzvah.

[00:07:49] And then, of course, the theme at the at the at the bar mitzvah was was, of course, magic as we got introduced to some very familiar faces.

[00:07:55] But I'm going to stop there.

[00:07:57] I just loved the intro.

[00:07:58] I loved getting to know William, of course, before I guess the first surprise happened at the tail end of the bar mitzvah.

[00:08:05] But I'm going to I'm going to pause there because I'm going to let you kind of dive into it.

[00:08:09] What did you think of the intro?

[00:08:11] Because I was not expecting it at all.

[00:08:15] I wasn't either.

[00:08:16] And I'm so glad that they did, because there are other shows where there's a huge cliffhanger or revelation at the last minute of one episode.

[00:08:24] And then the next episode starts in a completely different place.

[00:08:27] Yeah.

[00:08:27] And so you're like, no, we want to know.

[00:08:30] In this one, it was like, oh, you want to know who he was like who he is?

[00:08:33] Let's just we'll go right there.

[00:08:35] Here is who we're going to answer some questions.

[00:08:37] Here is not only who he is, but here's who he was.

[00:08:40] Here's who he became.

[00:08:42] Here's everything you need to know.

[00:08:44] Fantastic.

[00:08:44] Yeah.

[00:08:46] And having it, you know, it be the day of his bar mitzvah.

[00:08:50] We get to see his proud, happy parents.

[00:08:53] They look like like the most like wholesome, normal little Jewish family in the whole world.

[00:09:00] Right.

[00:09:00] He's like the the quintessential nice Jewish boy.

[00:09:03] And he's got this like, you know, slightly ritzy, but not super over the top ritzy bar mitzvah going on.

[00:09:11] It's very relatable.

[00:09:12] It looked like a bar mitzvah that I've been to before.

[00:09:15] You know, he seems really happy.

[00:09:17] Like there's the they do the chair dance and he's got this like I'm the center of attention.

[00:09:21] Do I like it?

[00:09:23] I don't know.

[00:09:23] Kind of quality about him.

[00:09:25] That's very like 13 year old.

[00:09:26] And then, you know, he goes in to the fortune teller tent and it's Lilia, which I was like, oh, so he's met Lilia before.

[00:09:37] Like, why didn't she recognize him?

[00:09:39] And then, of course, it's because she's the one that puts the sigil on him.

[00:09:43] It's like all this time I thought it was he did it to himself or something.

[00:09:48] Well, I mean, I think that the three that have been, you know, we've talked about, you know, Agatha himself or pot.

[00:09:56] Well, I guess four, because I think there was a small part of me that thought Rio might have been involved or Wanda.

[00:10:01] And it turns out to be Lilia, which is as to me, adds another question onto the pile of questions that we have.

[00:10:09] Right.

[00:10:09] I don't completely understand why she did that.

[00:10:12] She knew from looking at his palm that that his lifeline was broken into.

[00:10:18] And then she's like, that could mean a lot of things.

[00:10:20] It could just mean change or transformation.

[00:10:23] And he's like, OK.

[00:10:25] And she says she says the tower.

[00:10:28] And then he's like, what?

[00:10:29] And she's like, oh, I just remembered something, which is interesting.

[00:10:34] And I'll come back to that about remembering.

[00:10:37] The tower is a tarot card that like she keeps yelling out these tarot cards.

[00:10:42] And the tower is it means when it's upright, it means catastrophic change.

[00:10:50] It it's used to relate calamities like, you know, a volcano erupting, an earthquake or personal calamities like, you know, a death in the family or going bankrupt or, you know, it's not a good card.

[00:11:07] You don't want to get it.

[00:11:07] And then I found a few different meanings for what it means when it's reversed because she specifically said the tower reversed.

[00:11:14] Yes.

[00:11:14] And that means that it's upside down.

[00:11:16] And one of the meanings I heard was that it means negligence, absence, distribution.

[00:11:22] I don't even know what that means.

[00:11:23] Carelessness.

[00:11:24] I don't think that's what it is.

[00:11:25] The other place I found a meaning, it says resisting change, averting disaster, avoiding tragedy, delaying the inevitable and avoiding loss.

[00:11:36] And it doesn't seem like that's quite right either because he did have catastrophic change in his life.

[00:11:43] Right.

[00:11:44] He died.

[00:11:45] Yes.

[00:11:46] Or something.

[00:11:47] Yeah.

[00:11:47] And then he is now host to or has been replaced by Billy Maximoff in his body.

[00:11:55] And I, I, I'm still trying to figure out why she said the tower reversed unless when she says these, these tarot card, when she yells out these tarot cards.

[00:12:10] I don't know if it's related to the person in front of her or if she's, you know, quote unquote, remembering a future event where she's doing a tarot reading.

[00:12:20] Yes.

[00:12:20] And these are the cards that she's reading.

[00:12:22] Well, well, so if that's true.

[00:12:25] It could mean anything, right?

[00:12:27] You know, it could mean a lot of different things because we don't know if the order that she said the cards corresponds to the order of a tarot reading.

[00:12:37] And if it does, then is it chronological by when we saw it in the show?

[00:12:43] I don't think so.

[00:12:44] I think it would be chronological as to when she said it within the world of the show.

[00:12:48] So the tarot would be the first card.

[00:12:50] First slot card.

[00:12:50] And if it's the first card, it represents the general situation.

[00:12:54] The second thing she says is high priestess.

[00:12:57] This is another aspect of the general situation.

[00:13:00] I thought originally that meant she was calling Jen high priestess.

[00:13:03] But I think, I think that Agatha is the high priestess.

[00:13:07] Yeah.

[00:13:07] It's like big catastrophe change related to Agatha.

[00:13:12] And then the third card she said was, I've got this written down, just to get to the right part of my notes.

[00:13:19] Three of pentacles.

[00:13:20] Yes.

[00:13:21] And the third card is what's on your mind?

[00:13:25] I don't know if that's right.

[00:13:27] That's just one way to read the cards.

[00:13:29] But that would be three of pentacles, which is, you know, this teamwork concept.

[00:13:34] Right.

[00:13:35] Although she said three of pentacles before she said high priestess.

[00:13:38] So now that I think about it, that would mean three of pentacles is part of the general situation.

[00:13:43] So it's a catastrophic event about a team.

[00:13:46] And then high priestess would be what's on your mind.

[00:13:49] Okay.

[00:13:49] Maybe.

[00:13:50] And then the next card she said was three of swords.

[00:13:55] Three of swords.

[00:13:56] She said that written down.

[00:13:57] Yep.

[00:13:58] Yep.

[00:13:58] The three of swords.

[00:13:59] That's in the fourth position.

[00:14:01] And that means it's an influence over the last several years.

[00:14:07] Okay.

[00:14:07] Like a recent influence.

[00:14:09] And three of swords was about a breakup.

[00:14:12] So I don't know where I'm going with this.

[00:14:15] Because after that, it kind of falls apart.

[00:14:18] But I'm going to keep track of the tarot cards and I'm going to keep trying to figure it out.

[00:14:22] Well, I think, too.

[00:14:25] It's definitely a narrative device.

[00:14:26] Yeah.

[00:14:26] Well, yes.

[00:14:27] And I think Patti LuPone's character obviously is the central force of all of this.

[00:14:35] And obviously her story, I'm really intrigued with what they do with her story simply because I don't think they like to use the same storytelling device, which means I don't think we're going to get a story with her where we go back in time and kind of have all of these pieces fit together that way.

[00:14:55] I think they'll tell her story differently.

[00:14:57] I can't wait to see what that is.

[00:14:59] But it may be disjointed on purpose.

[00:15:02] And I think a lot of the things that she says outside of just the tarot cards are very disjointed, as we talked about with Kara last week.

[00:15:10] I think that this is very much like a puzzle that's getting pieced together in a very nonlinear sort of way.

[00:15:18] So how we see them and how they were said and how they've come up and who they're about, it's really hard to tell.

[00:15:25] But that's what I love about that's what I love about this.

[00:15:27] We know that they're putting a puzzle together.

[00:15:29] We just don't know how it's all going to fit.

[00:15:31] But if they put it together as well as they did this episode, I think we're in good hands those last three episodes.

[00:15:36] I do think we have to get Lillia's episode next.

[00:15:40] And I don't want to jump ahead.

[00:15:42] But obviously, we're running out of trials.

[00:15:46] And I do believe that her trial is next.

[00:15:49] So I think we're going to get those answers, which should leave us perched right at the end of the road.

[00:15:57] No pun intended.

[00:15:58] And I guess this is where you call in the boys to men to start singing the end of the road, I guess.

[00:16:02] But, you know, as we still have a little bit more path and how that path gets filled in and how we get all these cards to fit together.

[00:16:10] I'm just thankful that you're here to at least make sense of some of these cards because.

[00:16:15] I'm trying.

[00:16:16] Well, it's interesting because when it said tower reversed, there was, and I did not think about, I wrote it down, but I didn't really think it connected.

[00:16:27] If you remember, we got a, there was that shot of Billy, well, William at the time, in her ball, her fortune ball.

[00:16:40] What are they called?

[00:16:42] The cheese.

[00:16:43] Crystal ball?

[00:16:43] Crystal ball.

[00:16:44] Yeah.

[00:16:44] She had a crystal ball sitting there in the middle.

[00:16:47] And there was a scene there where he was literally upside down in that crystal ball.

[00:16:52] So when you, if the tower means it's flipped upside down, I would think that they maybe shot that shot to let us know that they were talking about him specifically.

[00:17:00] But how that pertains to, to that information is, is hard, hard to say.

[00:17:06] Although I would think it might've been somewhat foreshadowing what was to come within the next few minutes because his life, well, his life ends in the next few minutes.

[00:17:16] Yeah.

[00:17:16] And then, but kind of goes on, like depending on, I mean, it was a big question that they talked about at the end.

[00:17:22] Of, um, WandaVision between the two visions, right?

[00:17:26] Like.

[00:17:26] Sure.

[00:17:27] It is.

[00:17:28] If you don't have the memories, but you do have the body, but if you don't have the body, but you do have like, who's the real William Kaplan?

[00:17:34] Is he, is Billy completely replaced William Kaplan?

[00:17:38] Because he doesn't seem to remember his life as Billy any more than he remembers the first 13 years of William's life.

[00:17:45] Correct.

[00:17:46] So is it like the two are merged and they're a completely new being?

[00:17:51] Like it's, it's not really settled.

[00:17:53] Yeah.

[00:17:54] I, I kind of thought I, it was, I was hard for me to piece that together because I, I, you know, I was hoping there'd be kind of shadows.

[00:18:04] I did not want William to be gone.

[00:18:06] Oh, that was such a sad story to tell because.

[00:18:09] Because he's such a sweetie pie.

[00:18:11] And then his parents are so relatable, right?

[00:18:14] They're like, we just want him to be okay.

[00:18:16] Yeah.

[00:18:17] This is so hard.

[00:18:18] And he's like, stop, stop worrying.

[00:18:20] And, um, who was it?

[00:18:23] It was Sam.

[00:18:23] Our friend Sam texted.

[00:18:25] Like, I still don't want telepathy ever.

[00:18:27] I never, ever want telepathy.

[00:18:29] This does not make it look good.

[00:18:31] Like I, um, there's a Buffy episode where she gets the ability to hear people's thoughts.

[00:18:35] And that episode makes it very clear that it's not a gift, right?

[00:18:40] It's horrible.

[00:18:40] And in this case where he can't control it again, it's, it's horrible.

[00:18:45] Before he leaves the, uh, the fortune teller tent, he does drop a line.

[00:18:51] I love the vibe in here.

[00:18:52] It's very early Argento.

[00:18:54] Yes.

[00:18:55] This is such a deep cut.

[00:18:57] Yes.

[00:18:57] Argento is an Italian film director known for his work in horror.

[00:19:02] And, um, this was seventies, eighties horror movies, which last week's episode pulled from,

[00:19:09] but not these.

[00:19:11] His, um, Argento's movies are, um, uh, Suspiria is probably the best known one.

[00:19:20] Uh, Mother of Tears, Deep Red, Tenebre, Phenomena, Opera, Four Flies on the Graveyard,

[00:19:27] Velvet, Three Mothers.

[00:19:29] Um, oh, that's the name of Suspiria Inferno and the Mother of Tears.

[00:19:33] Um, and then he also worked on Dawn of the Dead.

[00:19:37] Yes.

[00:19:39] Um, and once upon a time in the West, which is hilarious.

[00:19:42] That's like, so out there.

[00:19:44] Well, when I, when I heard that was such a specific pull.

[00:19:47] Yeah.

[00:19:48] Well, I, so my background and my history, when, when that was said, I immediately thought

[00:19:55] of the Western, I didn't think of all of the horror movies that he had done, which is,

[00:20:01] so when I did my research and found out that he had done a trilogy about three witches called

[00:20:05] the three mothers, I was like, oh, okay.

[00:20:08] Then, then when I realized I've watched two of them and didn't know that they were his movies.

[00:20:12] I mean, I, again, the, the, the deep cuts that they put in, in these shows are fantastic.

[00:20:20] Now, I don't know much about those movies.

[00:20:21] Those movies didn't, didn't impact me the way they may, may have other people.

[00:20:26] So I don't know how, if there was any, if the deep cut was maybe an homage just to those

[00:20:32] movies or if there was more to it, but I love that.

[00:20:35] So yeah, I, I haven't seen most of these movies and the ones I've seen, I barely remember.

[00:20:40] So I'm going to have to maybe dig into that a little bit more.

[00:20:44] I loved the contrast of how like deeply normal and not very interesting the Kaplan parents are.

[00:20:52] Like there's hardly any decor in their house.

[00:20:54] Everything is really muted and, and they're just like, they're, they're just pleasant,

[00:21:00] nice people.

[00:21:01] There's nothing really remarkable about them.

[00:21:04] Other than dad's cooking.

[00:21:08] Dad's cooking, which if you remember, like you mentioned this in episode three, when Jen was,

[00:21:17] was doing her potions.

[00:21:22] The teen goes and grabs the.

[00:21:25] Oh, the sous vide.

[00:21:26] The sous vide.

[00:21:27] And he mentioned that his dad had taught him what that was for.

[00:21:31] And you had mentioned in the podcast that I'll bet his dad is a cook or something like that.

[00:21:36] And sure enough, they tie again, but.

[00:21:38] And a gadget guy.

[00:21:39] Yeah.

[00:21:40] Just a very small, but you're, I, I, and I love.

[00:21:43] Yeah.

[00:21:44] I know him.

[00:21:45] I, the, the man that Paul Adelstein, like he's been in a lot of like TV shows over the years

[00:21:50] and they portrayed that simpleness very well.

[00:21:55] I thought, um, there, they portrayed the pain of having partially been responsible for

[00:22:03] the car accident, even though they weren't.

[00:22:05] Um, but you know, any good, any good parent who's driving a car will, will probably blame

[00:22:10] themselves for that accident.

[00:22:11] Trying to figure out why their son is, is gone.

[00:22:13] And I, I, I found myself as the show proceeded trying to figure out if they were living in

[00:22:21] an area of, okay, the parents are, they think that their son is, is, is back to normal and

[00:22:27] everything's good.

[00:22:28] And then when I found myself wondering if, if that was the way it was, or if they were

[00:22:33] all kind of living on, on those tiptoes that you might have, if you know, your son isn't

[00:22:38] quite who he think, who you think he was.

[00:22:40] And obviously he was pretending to be, to be William.

[00:22:44] I just found that fascinating kind of as a, as a kind of the backstory of that episode

[00:22:49] as, you know, three years later, he's just pretending to be William with this insane room,

[00:22:55] which we'll get to in a few minutes, but.

[00:22:58] Oh my God.

[00:22:59] His room, the room is so great.

[00:23:02] All right.

[00:23:03] Let's just go there.

[00:23:04] Cause we've talked about the parents.

[00:23:05] So we see his room when, as William Kaplan's room, and then we see it three years later

[00:23:11] as Billy's room.

[00:23:13] Right.

[00:23:13] So when we first see it as William's room, first of all, it is so blue.

[00:23:18] It could not be more blue.

[00:23:19] There's so much blue in that room.

[00:23:21] It's like blue on top of blue on top of blue.

[00:23:23] All right.

[00:23:23] We get it.

[00:23:24] His color is blue.

[00:23:25] He's into magic and Houdini.

[00:23:27] He's got a couple of different Houdini posters.

[00:23:29] What I could clock.

[00:23:30] There was a lot of stuff that was soft focus.

[00:23:32] So I just, I could not tell what it was, but the ones I could read, there's a poster

[00:23:36] for Assateague Island, which is a place I have always wanted to go my whole life.

[00:23:41] I don't know what that has to do with witchcraft, but I'm like, Assateague Island.

[00:23:44] So cool.

[00:23:46] Um, the Alice in Wonderland Disney movie.

[00:23:49] Yes.

[00:23:50] The wonderful wizard of Oz looked very much like the books.

[00:23:53] I don't think that poster had anything to do with the movies.

[00:23:56] It definitely was the, I think the original book cover.

[00:23:59] I, I, I used to have the original, not the original, obviously not a first edition or

[00:24:05] anything like that, but I, my first wizard of Oz book had that cover, that same cover

[00:24:10] on it.

[00:24:10] So either it was that original cover or whatever version cover that I had when I was a kid.

[00:24:16] Yeah.

[00:24:16] Um, there was a poster for the Disney movie, the black cauldron, um, a pennant about East

[00:24:23] view, a bunch of pictures of his family.

[00:24:26] There's like a, a framed image of an old man surrounded by books and globes.

[00:24:31] I couldn't tell if that man was meant to be a wizard or like someone famous that I just

[00:24:35] didn't recognize.

[00:24:36] That's, um, I feel like it's one of those paintings that I've seen.

[00:24:42] Um, yeah.

[00:24:43] You know, kind of flipping through maybe, maybe paintings that are in like the Louvre or something.

[00:24:47] I think it's a famous painting, but I don't know much about it and I tried to find it,

[00:24:52] but I just couldn't.

[00:24:53] And I, I kind of stayed away from, you know, I didn't want to connect it to the show in

[00:24:58] any way, cause I didn't want any spoilers.

[00:25:00] So I, um, but I, I, that looked familiar to me and I, I, I don't know if they were just

[00:25:05] trying to get us in the theme of wizardry, but that's what it, that's what it put in my

[00:25:09] head.

[00:25:09] I mean, this, this seemed to be a kid who, you know, I'm surprised there wasn't like Lord

[00:25:15] of the Rings stuff sitting there.

[00:25:16] So, um, well, they probably couldn't get the rights.

[00:25:19] Yes.

[00:25:19] Yeah.

[00:25:19] Um, well most, there was a lot of Disney, a lot of Disney connections.

[00:25:23] Yeah.

[00:25:24] Yeah.

[00:25:24] And also, uh, there were a couple of things that I was like, oh, they're just doing like

[00:25:29] there was a poster for a movie called Goofballs.

[00:25:31] And I was like, is that Goonies?

[00:25:33] Is that Goonies?

[00:25:35] Um, well, there was a poster for something like Mystic Rock.

[00:25:38] It said it's every Friday.

[00:25:40] So that seems like a radio show or something.

[00:25:43] Um, Harry Houdini, King of Cards.

[00:25:46] I didn't see that.

[00:25:46] Another Harry Houdini poster that said Master Mystifier, a whole mess of board games.

[00:25:52] The ones I could read were Stay Alive, Operation, Carcassonne, Hang on Harvey.

[00:25:58] There was this like medieval-ish looking illustrated map, uh, a movie poster for Goofballs, Wizard

[00:26:05] of Oz figurines.

[00:26:06] Yes.

[00:26:06] I saw the witch, Dorothy, the scarecrow, and the lion.

[00:26:09] A box set of all of the Wizard of Oz books.

[00:26:13] They were centered on his dresser, like place of honor.

[00:26:17] And there, um, was a moon, like globe light, like pendant lamp that I was like, oh, I want

[00:26:23] that.

[00:26:23] That's cool.

[00:26:24] Um, they did a really cool mirror shot where he's like looking in the floor length mirror

[00:26:30] at himself and he says, William Kaplan.

[00:26:32] Yes.

[00:26:32] I'm William Kaplan.

[00:26:34] And there's a small mirror on the dresser.

[00:26:35] So you get, you get two shots of him.

[00:26:38] Yes.

[00:26:39] Of his face.

[00:26:40] Of him looking at himself.

[00:26:41] And he looks from one mirror to the other.

[00:26:43] And I watched it several times.

[00:26:45] I don't think either of those reflections does something weird.

[00:26:48] Yeah.

[00:26:48] But, um, it did sort of suggest visually that there's like a split personality situation going

[00:26:55] on there.

[00:26:56] Um, I, it was just beautiful photography.

[00:26:59] And I was thinking about how mirrors were used in, um, uh, Dr. Strange multiverse of madness

[00:27:06] and, and how like Scarlet Witch moved through mirrors and stuff.

[00:27:09] And so I was like, maybe that's just a, a little homage.

[00:27:13] Well, and I, I connected those two shots too, to that initial, um, shot where they, where

[00:27:19] he was flipped upside down.

[00:27:20] Like they definitely were doing some things with mirrors and reflections and windows.

[00:27:25] And, um, we get to, we, we get to see him through some windows in this, this, when he

[00:27:30] was in, when he going back to the initial, like five minutes, when he was in the, the hospital

[00:27:35] after he, um, became Billy, uh, we, we see him through initially, we see him through the

[00:27:44] windows of the, uh, hospital room.

[00:27:47] And then as he comes home, that really kind of creepy scene where he walks up to the door

[00:27:52] and we see those balloons kind of creep up to the window and we see him through that little

[00:27:57] window.

[00:27:58] So there, there was a lot of, um, that window and reflection things.

[00:28:02] And I, there was somebody, um, you know, uh, Ben and Kristen, um, did a lost rewatch and

[00:28:10] there was someone who was calling in and lost depended a lot on, on, and I got to find out

[00:28:15] who that was because he did these like really in depth, like sort of, um, watch alongs with

[00:28:20] these mirror reflections and lost.

[00:28:23] And I kind of want, I kind of want to get him to watch that up this episode to see what

[00:28:26] he thinks, because it seemed like this dealt a lot with screens and windows and mirrors.

[00:28:35] Yeah.

[00:28:35] There was definitely something going on with, with reflections and, um, I'm there for it.

[00:28:41] I love mirror shots.

[00:28:42] I'm sort of known for, um, taking mirror selfies with, uh, with convex mirrors, because I think

[00:28:52] they're fun.

[00:28:53] Yeah.

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[00:29:53] There were two things that struck me about, you mentioned the Black Cauldron and I, the

[00:29:59] minute I saw that poster, that movie jumped out to me because that movie in the lore of

[00:30:05] Disney is a kind of a, it carries a lot of weight because there's a lot of firsts that

[00:30:12] came out in 1985.

[00:30:13] You know, when I was still quote, actually, I think I was 14 when that movie came out

[00:30:18] and I remember seeing it and being mortified by the movie.

[00:30:22] But the movie has a ton of history.

[00:30:24] Just some fun little facts.

[00:30:26] That was a movie that Tim Burton was working on, not as a director, but he was, he was

[00:30:32] part of, I think just, I can't remember what his role, because he was an artist or conceptual

[00:30:37] artist in that film, but that movie was initially, so PG-13 came out in July of 84 and Disney

[00:30:46] had never done a movie that wasn't a musical and had never done a movie that wasn't rated

[00:30:51] G.

[00:30:52] This movie, when it first got screened, was going to get screened as a rated R movie and

[00:30:57] Disney didn't want to have anything.

[00:30:59] Yeah.

[00:31:00] Didn't want to have anything to do with that.

[00:31:02] The second two times it got screened, they were going to PG-13 it.

[00:31:05] Uh, so they had to edit it down and they took out a lot of, um, hidden foot.

[00:31:12] They took out a lot of footage, which has become like hidden footage that everybody will kind

[00:31:15] of want ads added to the movie.

[00:31:17] But, um, the movie itself came out.

[00:31:20] So fought the PG-13, it became the first PG movie that Disney put out.

[00:31:26] Um, and if you ever watch it, it is one of the creepiest animated movies that they've

[00:31:34] ever put out at its current state, let alone some of the snippets that have come out over

[00:31:39] time.

[00:31:40] There's lots of death in it that could have been in it.

[00:31:42] They got taken out, but the movie is about three witches, um, which I again, kind of connects

[00:31:47] to, to us.

[00:31:48] And, and again, if you haven't seen black cauldron, um, it didn't do very well at the box

[00:31:53] office back in the day because it just definitely wasn't, it didn't fit into the confines of,

[00:31:59] of a Disney movie.

[00:32:00] And, um, it's just super creepy.

[00:32:03] I haven't seen it in a, it's one of my favorite books.

[00:32:07] Um, I read the, those books, the Lloyd Alexander.

[00:32:13] It's Lloyd Alexander.

[00:32:14] That's right.

[00:32:15] It's the first book of the series called the Chronicles of Prydain.

[00:32:19] And they're, um, it's an adventure story, you know, coming of age, sort of magical fantasy

[00:32:26] story, um, based on Welsh folklore.

[00:32:30] Uh, and I remember, I haven't seen the movie in a really long time because I remember seeing

[00:32:35] it and being like, they missed the point of the book.

[00:32:38] This isn't even close to the book.

[00:32:40] I love the book.

[00:32:42] This is, I don't want to watch this, but now I'm curious because I'm like, first of all,

[00:32:47] I love the art of adaptation and seeing how things go from book to screen is really interesting

[00:32:54] to me.

[00:32:54] They, and when they screw up, it's almost more edifying because you can see all the

[00:33:00] edges in the decisions.

[00:33:01] You can really see them when a movie is seamless and, and, you know, like translates to screen

[00:33:07] from a book really well, you don't see as many of the edges, right?

[00:33:12] Cause you get swept up in the thing.

[00:33:13] That's how it's supposed to work.

[00:33:14] So when they're bad, I almost like bad movies in a different way for a specific reason that

[00:33:20] I'm like, Oh, I can see exactly what decisions they made along the way, wherever the movie

[00:33:25] is like a little like clumsy or creepy when it shouldn't be like that gives you insight

[00:33:32] into what was going on behind the scenes.

[00:33:34] Oh, well, and this was one of those very typical Disney.

[00:33:38] There was a switch in power at the time.

[00:33:41] And I know that Katzenberg was involved in it, but I can't remember if he was there and

[00:33:45] then someone else took over.

[00:33:46] If he's the one that took over, saw the movie and didn't like it, but this is, this

[00:33:50] is one of those where not only did they take scenes out, but they also re-edited a lot

[00:33:53] of it.

[00:33:54] They tried to put some, um, some of it, their old, like they clipped in some, some shots

[00:34:00] from, um, some of their other movies just to kind of give it that old flair and that

[00:34:05] old flavor.

[00:34:05] But I'm, I am now curious that to see if, if the initial movie might be more to your

[00:34:10] taste, but it's never been out.

[00:34:12] This is another one of those movies that once it was out of the movies, it bombed so badly.

[00:34:16] That Disney had nothing to do with it for well over a decade before they put it out

[00:34:20] again.

[00:34:20] And, and, and I remember when it came out, it was like right around the, um, during Y2K

[00:34:26] somewhere around there, it came out.

[00:34:27] And I remember it was such a big deal because everybody thought it would be a director's cut

[00:34:30] version where they would just put out the original, which they didn't do.

[00:34:33] And I don't, the R rated version.

[00:34:35] Yes.

[00:34:36] Which, which is insane to me.

[00:34:37] Like I would have seen that.

[00:34:38] Oh, come on.

[00:34:39] Give me, give me that.

[00:34:40] Especially now, now they should put it out, especially since they dipped it in here.

[00:34:44] Um, the other thing I wanted to mention was that goofballs poster because.

[00:34:49] Oh yeah.

[00:34:49] Is that a real movie or is that?

[00:34:51] No, no, no, no, no.

[00:34:52] That is definitely Goonies.

[00:34:53] And I don't know why they did.

[00:34:54] I don't know if they, I don't, was Goonies a Disney movie?

[00:34:59] I don't know.

[00:35:00] I, so I'm surprised they didn't.

[00:35:01] I assume it's a rights issue.

[00:35:03] Yeah.

[00:35:03] Uh, if they didn't go with the real thing, cause they did the real thing on, on other stuff.

[00:35:08] Yeah.

[00:35:08] Well, so in this one, I think may have just been an homage to like Matt Shackman.

[00:35:14] I, I saw an interview that he had done.

[00:35:16] Uh, I believe it was with Kevin Smith, but I can't remember now if it was on Kevin Smith's, um, Fat Man on Batman podcast or just Kevin Smith talking to him at a con.

[00:35:27] Um, but Shackman's intention with the last episode of the last two episodes of WandaVision was to sort of create an homage to Goonies using the two boys, uh, and, uh, uh, our wonderful Ralph Boner, um, going down into the basement, looking to try to steal the book.

[00:35:48] Like the whole thing was going to be a journey.

[00:35:50] Um, and I don't know why they changed that.

[00:35:52] Um, maybe it just didn't fit the tone, but I think that that might've been put in there as kind of an homage to that, but that's just a guess on my part.

[00:36:01] I just remembered, I just remembered seeing that podcast and, um, I, I, um, in Ralph, since Ralph Boner was used in this, it just, it, it got me thinking that I might've been the connection.

[00:36:12] But if you look at the poster that's on the wall and you look at the Goonies poster, they're nearly identical.

[00:36:19] Um, I can't quite make out the characters though.

[00:36:22] I, I, I wonder if the characters that are on that goofballs poster or aren't something familiar to us, but I couldn't, I couldn't get it zoomed in enough to see.

[00:36:31] Yeah.

[00:36:31] And a lot of it was in a soft focus while he's walking around the room.

[00:36:36] The, the vibe was very much like, this is a blur to him.

[00:36:40] Yes.

[00:36:41] Right.

[00:36:41] So we just, we just didn't get a lot of, of closeups or, or clear clarity.

[00:36:47] The room was also always kind of dark.

[00:36:49] Yes.

[00:36:50] You know, it was like, like there were times, there were stuff I paused and I walked right

[00:36:53] up, put my face right up against my giant TV.

[00:36:56] And I was like, I still can't tell what that is.

[00:36:58] Like it's so dark and blurry.

[00:37:00] I have no idea what that is.

[00:37:02] Um, it was, uh, it was such a, um, I don't know.

[00:37:08] It was such a tempting thing too.

[00:37:10] Cause every inch of space in that room was covered.

[00:37:12] And I was like, ah, there's so much detail here and I'm sure some of it is going to matter.

[00:37:17] And I, I want to see it.

[00:37:19] Well, we'll probably get to see more of it when the series is over and they put out some

[00:37:24] materials that go along with it because I can't imagine that we saw even a quarter of

[00:37:29] the detail.

[00:37:31] I, I, the way that the show is put together, I have a feeling that there's so many things

[00:37:34] that we've missed that are going to, when we see them in whatever form we see them in,

[00:37:38] it's going to be so frustrating.

[00:37:41] Oh my God.

[00:37:41] We didn't even know that was there.

[00:37:43] Yeah.

[00:37:43] Uh, all right.

[00:37:45] Future room.

[00:37:46] You want to go ahead to the three years later?

[00:37:47] Yeah.

[00:37:48] Yeah.

[00:37:48] Yeah.

[00:37:49] So Billy's room, 16 year old William's room has a lot of the same stuff up, but there

[00:37:55] are new things.

[00:37:57] Uh, before we get there though, there's a scene, a really, really cute scene with Billy and

[00:38:03] or William and his, his boy, uh, Eddie in the car.

[00:38:09] And, um, you know, they're, I like you.

[00:38:12] I really like you.

[00:38:13] Like it's really, it's adorable teenage romance stuff.

[00:38:16] And, um, I, uh, I clipped a little bit of it.

[00:38:21] The car accident.

[00:38:22] I, I never told you about it, but, uh, Eddie, I, I died that night.

[00:38:33] And when I came back, I was different.

[00:38:37] Something else.

[00:38:38] Something more.

[00:38:42] I'm not William Kaplan.

[00:38:43] At least not entirely.

[00:38:45] If you're not William Kaplan.

[00:38:51] Who are you?

[00:38:55] And the boyfriend handles it so well.

[00:38:58] And it's hard for me to tell if Eddie is like, all right, well, I met you two years ago.

[00:39:04] So whoever you are now is who I know.

[00:39:06] So fine.

[00:39:07] Or if he's like, wow, my boyfriend is all into this spooky magic stuff.

[00:39:12] And now he's convinced himself that he's like some other person, whatever.

[00:39:17] Um, either way that.

[00:39:19] Yeah.

[00:39:20] He handled it well.

[00:39:21] It was, I loved it because it's a tricky situation to handle on any TV show because you could go a bunch of different ways with it.

[00:39:30] But what it gave us is I love you for who you are, whatever you're going through, why ever you said that, whatever is actually true, it doesn't really matter.

[00:39:41] I love you.

[00:39:42] And I loved that.

[00:39:44] Yeah.

[00:39:44] I love that little dance that we got, um, throughout that segment, because again, this is wonderful.

[00:39:51] Um, storytelling because what it's giving us is in the 48 or however many actual minutes this episode was in the 40 minutes of this episode, we got the depth of, of all of his relationships prior to present.

[00:40:07] Which I think plays such an important part in what we end up getting to.

[00:40:11] So, so yeah, that was a beautiful, that they, they cast it so well, what he did such a nice job being.

[00:40:17] Um, uh, uh, very important part of, of Billy's life and becoming a very important character in this show, which is hard to do in such a short amount of time.

[00:40:29] He, uh, was extremely charming.

[00:40:31] I thought, and I, I just love seeing gay character whose stories are not about being gay.

[00:40:38] No.

[00:40:39] Right.

[00:40:39] They just are gay.

[00:40:40] Yeah.

[00:40:41] There's no coming out.

[00:40:42] There's no drama with their parents about them being gay.

[00:40:45] They just are.

[00:40:46] And it's, it doesn't, it's not narratively important that he has a boyfriend as opposed to a girlfriend.

[00:40:52] And I, I know maybe I'm being annoying by calling it out, but I feel like we've come a long way.

[00:40:58] Yeah.

[00:40:59] Because there was a time when if there was a gay character, A, he was miserable.

[00:41:03] B, his entire story was about him being gay.

[00:41:05] And in this case, it's just not.

[00:41:07] I thought it was really interesting that when he's trying to explain his telepathy, which he never quite does,

[00:41:12] to Eddie, he says, it's a thing that happens to him when he's, when he's around people, he cares about a lot and they're feeling strong feelings.

[00:41:23] But when they went to meet with Ralph Boner or Bonermatic 73 or whatever the guy called himself.

[00:41:30] I'm pretty sure it was, it was, it was, was it Bonermatic 69?

[00:41:36] I believe it was.

[00:41:38] Or Bonerific.

[00:41:39] Yeah.

[00:41:39] But Bonerific 69.

[00:41:42] Yeah.

[00:41:43] I didn't, I, by the way, I, I didn't write that down on purpose.

[00:41:47] Yeah.

[00:41:47] Yeah.

[00:41:48] You were like, all right, I get it.

[00:41:49] Like he's a child.

[00:41:50] All right.

[00:41:51] He heard Boner thinking, please don't ask about Agatha Harkness.

[00:41:54] Please don't think about Agatha Harkness.

[00:41:56] And I'm like, he doesn't care about this guy.

[00:41:59] So the telepathy is more about strong emotions, I think.

[00:42:02] But he doesn't know yet.

[00:42:04] Right.

[00:42:04] He's still, I think the important thing we learned from this scene, all these scenes, is that he is not a, like a mature magic user who's in control of his powers.

[00:42:14] He is just starting his journey as a magic user.

[00:42:19] Well, and, and we know Wanda is somebody who accesses her power through emotion a lot of the time.

[00:42:26] Is he that way or isn't he?

[00:42:27] And they've done a nice job sort of portraying him last week as that, as, as a character who, or maybe two weeks ago, as a character who, when he gets angry, we see the power.

[00:42:38] At least that's what we think.

[00:42:39] But I think it's probably going to turn out to be a lot more complex than that.

[00:42:44] He definitely seems, and I'm not yet, by the way, convinced that the first time he uses his, his power is the first time he's ever used his power.

[00:42:55] But we can get into that later.

[00:42:56] Yeah.

[00:42:57] I, but it's clear to me that he's not in control of it and he doesn't completely understand it.

[00:43:03] And I think that his, his use of it is instinctive at first, right?

[00:43:09] It's just like, it's more blunt.

[00:43:11] It's the same thing Wanda went through where at first it was about, you know, being able to move objects with her mind in a very broad way, right?

[00:43:19] Like throwing.

[00:43:20] But like, as she got more practiced, she became more fine tuned.

[00:43:25] And once she got the dark home, she was able to like really hone her magic and her skills.

[00:43:30] And this raw power that she was sitting on all along, right?

[00:43:34] She had raw power.

[00:43:35] She had to learn skills to access it safely or whatever.

[00:43:39] So we get to see Billy takes, or William, I still don't really know what to call him, takes Eddie up to his room and shows him his like, his like dossier, he calls it, of all this information he's gathered.

[00:43:52] And it's, you know, it's a lot of like newspaper clippings of things about Westview and, and the magic that happened in Westview.

[00:43:59] I mean, it's way too big of a coincidence, even if you haven't seen WandaVision, that there was this big event that happened on the same day that he hit his head and was in a car accident and woke up with amnesia.

[00:44:11] Like, obviously those things are related.

[00:44:12] The fact that his parents aren't doing the same research, as far as we know, is wild.

[00:44:17] Because I would be like, well, those things are probably related.

[00:44:20] The thing about that too, though, is I have this thing that I, you know, when I talk about people who, especially as a teacher in my classroom, whether it be parents or students who try to, who know that there's something going on, but try to not see it.

[00:44:38] I call it the build collector mentality.

[00:44:40] And I think, I think what I was trying to get out with the parents is that I think they know that their son isn't their son, but I think they don't want to know that their son isn't their son.

[00:44:55] So I really believe that they live in this world that the, to be honest with you, that sword to pull in the MCU.

[00:45:05] And I apologize for those that don't want that to happen.

[00:45:08] I think sword very much wants that Westview situation to go away.

[00:45:13] And I think that the parents are fine with that.

[00:45:16] This may not be our son, but he loves, he seems to love us.

[00:45:20] We don't quite get it.

[00:45:21] We're going to keep being his parents.

[00:45:23] And I, I, I do think that that's important because here we've got, and I'm sorry, like I immediately flip into Buffy mode and we've got like Billy portraying all three of the trio and their conspiracies.

[00:45:35] Like I, I just, he pulls out, you know, he walks into this room and I'm thinking how in land's hell did his parents not know about this?

[00:45:43] And, and of course they, they probably do and just don't care.

[00:45:47] They just don't care.

[00:45:47] They have their son.

[00:45:48] That's all they care about.

[00:45:49] They don't want to know.

[00:45:49] By the way too, when the minute we saw that floor, I immediately, you know, as we talk about the end credit scenes that we don't quite understand.

[00:45:58] Well, one whole segment of that now becomes perfectly clear because of course we have that one post credit scene where we have not at the end credit scene where we have all those clippings.

[00:46:10] One of which it says near death, which obviously was talking about Billy.

[00:46:14] So we, we've seen some of these clippings already.

[00:46:17] But yeah, I, I just, I thought here they are just laying all over his floor.

[00:46:22] Like they've been there for years and apparently nobody, nobody's been paying attention to them.

[00:46:29] I don't know if I thought they'd been in that spot for years because laying out papers on the floor like that is not a good way to keep things organized for very long.

[00:46:36] Right.

[00:46:37] You just walk around the room and things are going to move.

[00:46:39] Yeah.

[00:46:39] But I could believe that he, you know, takes them out from his folder and lays them out when he wants to think about them.

[00:46:45] I noticed in his room that he had like garlands made out of triangles.

[00:46:51] Yes.

[00:46:51] There were little tiny triangles that were either lights or they were reflective because they were catching the light.

[00:46:57] Right.

[00:46:58] And they look so much like the lights in the cabin last week.

[00:47:02] Oh, I have also like little, they were little pyramid shapes.

[00:47:05] I have a point.

[00:47:05] I have a point for that, but keep going.

[00:47:07] Keep going.

[00:47:08] Yeah.

[00:47:08] Yeah.

[00:47:09] Yeah.

[00:47:09] You've actually mentioned a couple of them and I don't think you realized it yet, but we'll get there.

[00:47:13] He also had a bunch of like, they look like sort of paper leaf garlands that look like fall leaves.

[00:47:20] They very much resembled the leaves that are on the road, the ones that were red and the ones that were blue.

[00:47:26] He also has like a poster of Lorna Wu.

[00:47:30] Oh, and we, we got to hear that.

[00:47:31] We got to hear that version.

[00:47:33] Yeah.

[00:47:33] The actual version.

[00:47:35] He has her record playing.

[00:47:36] He has another, by the way, Wizard of Oz poster.

[00:47:40] Yeah.

[00:47:40] Couldn't that record have been the record in Alice's.

[00:47:47] In episode four.

[00:47:48] Yeah.

[00:47:48] I've just thrown it out there.

[00:47:49] I mean, it was the exact same record, whether or not it was like the, the same record or not.

[00:47:54] I don't know.

[00:47:55] Okay.

[00:47:55] Don't worry.

[00:47:55] We're, we're heading, we're heading down the road to my point.

[00:47:58] So you keep on going.

[00:47:59] We're almost there.

[00:48:01] He had lots of, there was, first of all, there was lots of stuff on the walls, lots of little pictures, big pictures everywhere.

[00:48:08] Tons of it.

[00:48:08] There were a lot of things that were like sort of celestial.

[00:48:12] There's like a few different cases of like the phases of the moon.

[00:48:15] That has been coming up a ton.

[00:48:17] There was a deck of tarot cards or a book about tarot cards.

[00:48:21] There were a bunch of books about witchcraft.

[00:48:23] Tons of candles.

[00:48:25] A version of Monopoly that's for the night sky.

[00:48:28] I've never heard of night sky Monopoly, but fine.

[00:48:31] A game called Outburst.

[00:48:33] A game called Lotto.

[00:48:34] A game called Space Spinners.

[00:48:36] A version of Cranium.

[00:48:37] An old version of Trivial Pursuit.

[00:48:40] A band poster for a band called Brutalitat, which appears to be a real German band that does sort of like angry German kind of metal music.

[00:48:49] Yeah.

[00:48:51] Let's see.

[00:48:52] Candles, I said.

[00:48:54] A bunch of witchy looking symbols.

[00:48:56] A drawing of a cicada.

[00:48:58] Yeah.

[00:48:58] Some pictures that look like very old like tin types or something of some old women.

[00:49:04] A Fleetwood Mac poster.

[00:49:07] Like pentacles.

[00:49:08] Books on like astrology or astronomy.

[00:49:10] It was hard to tell.

[00:49:12] Hourglasses.

[00:49:13] A bunch of rocks and crystals.

[00:49:15] Some small animal skulls.

[00:49:17] And a poster for the craft.

[00:49:20] Saw and Carrie.

[00:49:22] And there was Jennifer's body as well, which I thought.

[00:49:25] Oh, I didn't see that one.

[00:49:27] That's the one that caught me the most.

[00:49:28] Just because that's there's a couple of scenes in there again that addresses like the LGBTQ plus community in a way similar to this movie.

[00:49:37] So that's the one that I noticed initially, which I thought was actually awesome homage.

[00:49:42] And then, of course, the craft, which, again, talking about the end credits scene, the end credits.

[00:49:48] Again, there's that scene from the craft in there.

[00:49:51] So we kind of get to see that connection as well.

[00:49:54] And the craft is all about a coven and forming a coven.

[00:49:58] Yeah.

[00:49:58] And what are the rules of a coven?

[00:50:01] And that has been so critical for this whole show.

[00:50:05] Yes.

[00:50:06] So let me let me just let's we'll come back to this.

[00:50:10] But I want to talk about several things that you have mentioned.

[00:50:12] And I'm going to put them all together and see what you think.

[00:50:15] You mentioned the globe in his room prior.

[00:50:20] You mentioned the triangular orange lights that are either similar or the same as the ones we saw.

[00:50:29] So the globe, I'll get to that one in a second.

[00:50:31] You mentioned the angular like orange lights that we saw for sure.

[00:50:35] And Agatha's cabin.

[00:50:38] You mentioned the Fleetwood Mac poster, which, if you remember, is the exact same poster we see in Alice's room.

[00:50:48] When when when Alice is looking at all the posters, that fleet, that same Fleetwood Mac poster is on the wall there next to her mom's.

[00:50:59] Let's see what else.

[00:51:00] What else?

[00:51:01] What else?

[00:51:01] The globe.

[00:51:03] Now, this one might just mean me pulling something out of my butt.

[00:51:07] I believe that globe is are the same globes that are lighting up that house in Jen's house.

[00:51:14] So now you have to go.

[00:51:15] Oh, because there were globe lights.

[00:51:17] Yeah.

[00:51:18] So I got to go back and look at that.

[00:51:19] And then, of course, you mentioned what was the other thing for Alice?

[00:51:24] Oh, the record that that the teen and the poster of her mother poster of her mother.

[00:51:30] So last week and the reason why I'm bringing this up now is because.

[00:51:35] I do believe that the teen is.

[00:51:40] OK, I do believe that Billy knows more than he's letting on.

[00:51:45] I don't think that all of these things are randomly just in his room and also in all of these other rooms.

[00:51:51] So I know I it's I really think he's influencing the road.

[00:51:57] Yes.

[00:51:57] And I can't tell.

[00:52:00] I can't tell if it's on purpose or if it's by accident.

[00:52:04] I don't.

[00:52:05] But either way, I don't think it is on purpose.

[00:52:08] Well, I don't you think that we're heading to a place and you may know more about backstory than I do, because I just really today have sort of to dive into the comic book side of Billy.

[00:52:18] But I'm starting to really get the impression and agree with you that that perhaps the strength of Billy.

[00:52:29] Might at least be on the same playing field as some of our other witches, perhaps mom, of course, and maybe Dr.

[00:52:38] Strange as well, but I do start I'm starting to get the impression that there's a lot more to Billy that that meets the eye and that this is a character that.

[00:52:46] That really could carry a lot of weight in this universe that they're building forward.

[00:52:50] Anyways, I just wanted to throw that out there because there's lots of little connections to that room.

[00:52:54] And that's why I'm pre show when we were talking about I'm so glad that you don't because I just noticed a few of these things.

[00:53:00] And the more you keep talking about this room, the more I start thinking, oh, boy, especially when you started naming all those Wizard of Oz things.

[00:53:07] I'm really starting to think that there's there's more at play here.

[00:53:10] And I'm really intrigued with Billy slash William and how much of William is actually still left, because I do feel like Billy isn't full on Billy, that we still have a little bit of William in there.

[00:53:22] I'm sorry.

[00:53:22] Go back to the room, too.

[00:53:23] I don't want to.

[00:53:24] I just you had named all the little points that I had seen.

[00:53:27] And I just thought, oh, my gosh, that he definitely has something to this.

[00:53:33] I feel like there's there's a lot of overlap or similarities or thematic relations between what we've seen on the road so far and all these things that are in Billy's road, Billy's room.

[00:53:44] But I don't think it's intentional.

[00:53:49] So I actually had a little bit of time this week to waste or spend wisely, depending on how you look at it.

[00:53:56] And I went back and rewatched episodes two, three, four and five.

[00:54:01] And then again, went back and watched a bunch of episode one.

[00:54:05] And I noticed a few things.

[00:54:08] Can I ask you a quick question?

[00:54:10] When you rewatched, did you like those episodes better than the first time you watched them?

[00:54:19] Hmm.

[00:54:20] I don't know how to rank that.

[00:54:22] I enjoyed them in a different way because now I know more about the characters.

[00:54:29] But I didn't enjoy them the same way because before it was all like, oh, my God, I didn't see this coming.

[00:54:34] And now it's like, well, I know what happens.

[00:54:36] It's just hard to compare.

[00:54:37] OK, that's a good.

[00:54:39] No, that's a good answer, because I think probably what you're trying to say is they carry like probably on in the land of like weighing the first time you watched it versus the second.

[00:54:48] Or the third time they carry the same weight just for different reasons, which is what makes this show so special to me.

[00:54:55] Yeah, it is very rewatchable.

[00:54:57] So at the very beginning of episode three, when they're first starting out on the road, he says, it's exactly how I pictured it.

[00:55:04] And Agatha says to him, yes, it suits you.

[00:55:10] And she sort of gives him a knowing look and he's not looking back at her when she does it.

[00:55:14] He's she's like, yeah, it suits you.

[00:55:17] Like, oh, no, duh, because, you know, this is the road you've chosen or something.

[00:55:22] I don't know.

[00:55:23] And then, you know, he finds the invitation.

[00:55:26] Jen reads the invitation.

[00:55:27] Then when they go to the beginning of episode four and Sharon has died and after they've buried her, they're talking and teen says, I wish we could go home.

[00:55:38] And Agatha looks at him and narrows her eyes at him like, do you now?

[00:55:43] Interesting.

[00:55:43] And then and then they go and they have Alice's whole adventure.

[00:55:51] And then in episode five, Billy's outfit looks like his little kid Halloween costume from WandaVision.

[00:56:03] Most identical.

[00:56:04] So much.

[00:56:06] And there were things in that cabin that looked a lot like things in his room.

[00:56:11] And you had said, why is this Agatha's trial?

[00:56:14] Like, why is Agatha's trial taking place in an 80s horror movie?

[00:56:17] Like that didn't make any sense.

[00:56:19] But if it was some kind of if it's Billy just like influencing the road with his reality affecting powers.

[00:56:27] Right.

[00:56:28] Like similar to Scarlet Witch, when she did things she didn't even realize she was doing.

[00:56:32] It it it would make sense that all of the trials either they're not happening at all.

[00:56:40] And it's all in his head or they are happening.

[00:56:42] But he's making parts of them happen.

[00:56:45] But it's imperfect because he doesn't have complete control over his powers.

[00:56:48] Yeah.

[00:56:49] When they leave the horror cabin at the end of episode five and he has that showdown with with Agatha and everything.

[00:56:58] The road is no longer blue or red.

[00:57:00] It's like gray, khaki tan, like neutral colors.

[00:57:05] And again, in episode six, the road doesn't have any color.

[00:57:08] So.

[00:57:10] Because he's like claimed his power or something, maybe he's no longer unintentionally influencing the road with all his like blue magic or something.

[00:57:19] But there's definitely a significance to the fact that all the colors drained out.

[00:57:22] Yes.

[00:57:23] Well, and I mean, at the end of.

[00:57:26] The end of episode six.

[00:57:30] The it has regained color.

[00:57:33] Do you remember what color it was?

[00:57:36] As they were.

[00:57:37] It was color at the end of episode six.

[00:57:39] Yeah.

[00:57:40] How did I miss that?

[00:57:41] It was yellow.

[00:57:42] It was yellow.

[00:57:45] Maybe Lilia.

[00:57:46] Or.

[00:57:47] Her color is yellow.

[00:57:47] Or maybe it's just the yellow brick road because.

[00:57:52] So many homages to.

[00:57:54] To.

[00:57:56] Wizard of Oz.

[00:57:57] The Williams side of it, especially.

[00:57:59] But yeah, but I would agree with you.

[00:58:01] I think we're heading down the road to Lilia, even though Lilia has.

[00:58:05] Not quite.

[00:58:06] Been.

[00:58:09] Brought back from whatever happened to her.

[00:58:11] I.

[00:58:12] I have trouble believing that Jen and Lilia are gone, gone.

[00:58:16] I just.

[00:58:17] It's.

[00:58:17] They wouldn't.

[00:58:19] Narratively.

[00:58:20] Like just.

[00:58:21] Write them out like that.

[00:58:22] So they're coming back.

[00:58:23] I think they're all.

[00:58:24] I.

[00:58:25] So.

[00:58:26] I.

[00:58:27] I can't.

[00:58:29] I think it was episode three.

[00:58:31] Maybe it was episode four.

[00:58:33] Where.

[00:58:34] Maybe it was episode two.

[00:58:35] I don't know.

[00:58:36] It was the episode where.

[00:58:38] I think it was episode two.

[00:58:40] When Rio was trying to kill.

[00:58:44] Well, they were.

[00:58:45] They were fighting.

[00:58:46] In.

[00:58:47] Agatha's house.

[00:58:49] Oh, episode one.

[00:58:49] Episode one.

[00:58:50] So.

[00:58:54] Rio is.

[00:58:55] Supposedly trying to kill her.

[00:58:56] And Agatha says.

[00:58:58] You can't kill me.

[00:58:59] Or something like that.

[00:59:00] I can't remember exactly what she said.

[00:59:02] Maybe you saw it in one of your watches and remember.

[00:59:04] But.

[00:59:05] I just remember thinking.

[00:59:07] Oh.

[00:59:07] Is Agatha.

[00:59:09] Unkillable.

[00:59:11] And that.

[00:59:12] This is long before I thought Rio was.

[00:59:14] Was death.

[00:59:15] But.

[00:59:16] Yeah.

[00:59:17] I'm.

[00:59:17] She says.

[00:59:18] You can't kill me.

[00:59:19] It's against the rules.

[00:59:20] Yes.

[00:59:21] Yes.

[00:59:22] And that was the weird thing about it.

[00:59:24] So.

[00:59:24] I.

[00:59:24] I mean.

[00:59:25] I.

[00:59:25] And also.

[00:59:26] Then Rio says.

[00:59:28] I'm not the only one who wants to see you dead.

[00:59:32] Not kill you.

[00:59:34] See you dead.

[00:59:35] Yes.

[00:59:36] So.

[00:59:37] That could mean anyone really.

[00:59:40] It could mean.

[00:59:41] Yeah.

[00:59:41] But.

[00:59:41] It could mean.

[00:59:41] But Rio.

[00:59:44] Rio wants Agatha to be dead for her own reasons.

[00:59:47] And if she is death.

[00:59:49] I think it's so that Agatha will be with her.

[00:59:52] Yes.

[00:59:53] Well.

[00:59:54] I mean.

[00:59:54] I think that's also why Rio hates ghosts.

[00:59:57] Because ghosts are dead people that have resisted her power.

[00:59:59] Yes.

[01:00:01] Well.

[01:00:02] Why don't we.

[01:00:03] Why don't we.

[01:00:04] Why don't we talk about.

[01:00:05] Let's talk about Agatha a bit.

[01:00:06] Because.

[01:00:07] We find out.

[01:00:08] Yeah.

[01:00:09] Some funny things.

[01:00:10] And we find out some super important things.

[01:00:12] And then we can blend them together here at the end.

[01:00:14] But.

[01:00:14] We do get.

[01:00:15] As Billy is doing.

[01:00:18] His research.

[01:00:20] He.

[01:00:21] Of course.

[01:00:22] Types.

[01:00:23] Agatha's name into.

[01:00:25] Google.

[01:00:28] Which.

[01:00:29] Which.

[01:00:29] Which is probably what everybody else has been doing.

[01:00:32] Which I have had to fight against.

[01:00:33] Over the past few weeks.

[01:00:35] But.

[01:00:35] Yeah.

[01:00:36] And we find.

[01:00:38] Several.

[01:00:38] Interesting pieces of information.

[01:00:40] I'm going to mention the information.

[01:00:41] I have some thoughts on it.

[01:00:42] But.

[01:00:43] Maybe we'll do this as.

[01:00:44] As kind of a.

[01:00:45] I'm kind of curious at what you thought.

[01:00:47] Because.

[01:00:47] One of the first things we see.

[01:00:48] Aside from her pictures.

[01:00:49] We get to see this.

[01:00:51] Singular picture of her.

[01:00:52] From a long time ago.

[01:00:54] Um.

[01:00:55] Like.

[01:00:56] Either.

[01:00:56] Like mid-18th.

[01:00:57] Late 1800s.

[01:00:58] But then we see these headlines.

[01:01:00] Um.

[01:01:00] That note.

[01:01:01] That she was.

[01:01:02] Part of a couple of disasters.

[01:01:04] Uh.

[01:01:04] One being the Titanic.

[01:01:05] And one being the.

[01:01:08] Um.

[01:01:08] Hindenburg.

[01:01:09] And I immediately had some thoughts.

[01:01:12] About why.

[01:01:13] Because I don't.

[01:01:14] I.

[01:01:15] I mean.

[01:01:16] I.

[01:01:16] I don't think that those articles.

[01:01:18] Were trying.

[01:01:18] Or maybe they were.

[01:01:19] Trying to.

[01:01:20] Lead us to believe.

[01:01:21] That she had a hand in that.

[01:01:22] But I actually.

[01:01:23] I actually don't think that's true.

[01:01:25] Did you have any thoughts about that?

[01:01:26] I mean.

[01:01:28] It could have been during the period of her life.

[01:01:31] When she and Rio.

[01:01:32] Yes.

[01:01:32] Were going around.

[01:01:33] Having adventures.

[01:01:34] Yes.

[01:01:35] And.

[01:01:35] If you're having adventures.

[01:01:37] With a witch.

[01:01:37] And death.

[01:01:39] Probably bad stuff happened.

[01:01:41] Yes.

[01:01:42] Like.

[01:01:42] See that's what.

[01:01:43] So we're thinking the same thoughts.

[01:01:44] Because that's.

[01:01:45] Yeah.

[01:01:46] Yeah.

[01:01:46] Like.

[01:01:47] Maybe.

[01:01:49] Agatha.

[01:01:49] Is a vehicle for Rio.

[01:01:52] Or maybe.

[01:01:55] Agatha.

[01:01:55] Just happens to be tagging along.

[01:01:57] And having fun along the way.

[01:01:58] But I definitely think that.

[01:02:00] These.

[01:02:00] These periods are.

[01:02:01] Are definitely periods.

[01:02:03] That she was with Rio.

[01:02:04] That's what.

[01:02:05] That's what I.

[01:02:05] That's what I would guess.

[01:02:07] And I did.

[01:02:08] I did.

[01:02:08] There's that funny one.

[01:02:09] Where she's Jolene.

[01:02:10] From the Dolly Parton song.

[01:02:12] It was like.

[01:02:13] Of course Agatha is Jolene.

[01:02:15] And people were like.

[01:02:16] You know.

[01:02:17] Piling on there.

[01:02:18] And I was like.

[01:02:18] I don't know.

[01:02:19] That doesn't seem like Agatha.

[01:02:22] I mean.

[01:02:23] One thing about the song Jolene.

[01:02:25] Is that.

[01:02:26] The Jolene character.

[01:02:27] Is passive.

[01:02:28] Yes.

[01:02:28] Right.

[01:02:29] Yeah.

[01:02:29] It's like.

[01:02:30] It's like.

[01:02:30] She's so beautiful.

[01:02:31] My husband.

[01:02:32] Her boyfriend.

[01:02:33] Wants her.

[01:02:33] And talks about her in his sleep.

[01:02:35] But.

[01:02:35] There's no indication in the song.

[01:02:37] That Jolene.

[01:02:38] Is reciprocating in any way.

[01:02:40] But.

[01:02:41] Oh.

[01:02:41] I don't know.

[01:02:41] There's a movie.

[01:02:42] I haven't seen it.

[01:02:43] I.

[01:02:43] I.

[01:02:43] I love it so much.

[01:02:45] And now.

[01:02:45] I definitely want to see an episode.

[01:02:48] Where we get to see just the touch of that.

[01:02:50] Yeah.

[01:02:52] I mean.

[01:02:52] If they can get the actual Dolly Parton to guess.

[01:02:55] Let's go.

[01:02:56] That would be amazing.

[01:02:56] Let's go.

[01:02:57] Oh my god.

[01:02:58] I would lose my mind.

[01:02:59] We find out.

[01:03:00] Maybe she's the one at the.

[01:03:01] At the pure center of all this.

[01:03:02] I don't know.

[01:03:04] She's Mephisto.

[01:03:05] No.

[01:03:05] Oh my god.

[01:03:09] Well.

[01:03:10] That's going to leave.

[01:03:10] That's going to live rent free.

[01:03:12] Every time someone mentions Mephisto now.

[01:03:13] I'm going to think Dolly Parton.

[01:03:14] So that's a good thing.

[01:03:18] All right.

[01:03:18] I.

[01:03:19] I love that he googled her.

[01:03:21] That actually found stuff.

[01:03:22] That was like.

[01:03:24] Like useful.

[01:03:25] And.

[01:03:25] And relevant.

[01:03:27] And it didn't take all that long.

[01:03:28] Like he was like.

[01:03:29] I'll go in this website.

[01:03:30] Yes.

[01:03:30] This has something in it that I want.

[01:03:32] Like.

[01:03:33] I don't know.

[01:03:33] Whenever that happens on.

[01:03:35] On a movie or a TV show.

[01:03:36] I'm always like.

[01:03:37] Come on.

[01:03:38] Well.

[01:03:38] He goes.

[01:03:39] He didn't like accidentally click into porn.

[01:03:42] Like.

[01:03:42] He didn't get like.

[01:03:43] A bunch of pop-ups.

[01:03:44] Someone trying to sell him.

[01:03:45] Some stupid finance scam.

[01:03:47] Like.

[01:03:48] All the stuff that happens.

[01:03:49] When I'm trying to do research online.

[01:03:50] Like.

[01:03:51] He didn't get any of that.

[01:03:52] No.

[01:03:52] He just.

[01:03:53] He just went right into catfish mode.

[01:03:55] Penny.

[01:03:55] He just.

[01:03:55] He found that picture.

[01:03:58] Dragged that picture right into the Google search.

[01:04:00] And all those other pictures came up.

[01:04:01] And I was like.

[01:04:02] Okay.

[01:04:03] Okay.

[01:04:04] Yeah.

[01:04:04] We could have saved ourselves a lot of episodes.

[01:04:06] I guess in the.

[01:04:08] On.

[01:04:08] On Earth.

[01:04:09] Okay.

[01:04:10] The Earth that most of the MCU takes place on is Earth 616.

[01:04:14] Right?

[01:04:15] 616.

[01:04:15] Yep.

[01:04:15] So.

[01:04:16] I think the Google on Earth 616 is better than Google in our Earth.

[01:04:22] Yes.

[01:04:22] Better Google.

[01:04:24] Well.

[01:04:25] And maybe he was using a little witchcraft and we.

[01:04:27] He didn't know it.

[01:04:29] Yeah.

[01:04:30] Yeah.

[01:04:31] And he.

[01:04:31] And he's like.

[01:04:33] So when we first met him and he was.

[01:04:35] Says to Agatha things like.

[01:04:36] I know a lot about you.

[01:04:38] And he says to Jen like.

[01:04:39] I know how people feel about Agatha.

[01:04:41] I got the sense that he had been.

[01:04:43] Like researching her for kind of a long time.

[01:04:46] Not one night.

[01:04:52] I was like.

[01:04:53] Wait.

[01:04:54] Is it the same night?

[01:04:55] He's going to break into her house the same night?

[01:04:58] Nope.

[01:04:59] Okay.

[01:05:00] The.

[01:05:01] The.

[01:05:02] Complete.

[01:05:02] And utter.

[01:05:03] Like.

[01:05:04] Tact.

[01:05:04] Tact and whole mood of the show.

[01:05:07] When we get that scene.

[01:05:09] The scenes we've been hoping we would get.

[01:05:10] Of.

[01:05:11] Of the teen.

[01:05:13] Breaking into her house.

[01:05:15] And then.

[01:05:16] Penny.

[01:05:17] This is not hyperbole when I tell you.

[01:05:19] Oh.

[01:05:20] Perhaps some of the.

[01:05:21] It was so funny.

[01:05:23] Television I have ever seen.

[01:05:25] Is Agatha.

[01:05:27] Dressed in the.

[01:05:29] The boner family reunion.

[01:05:32] Pitching a tent shirt.

[01:05:34] With a.

[01:05:35] Yeah.

[01:05:36] With a hose nozzle.

[01:05:37] For her gun.

[01:05:38] And she was.

[01:05:39] Fingering that gun.

[01:05:41] And I'm just thinking.

[01:05:43] And it.

[01:05:44] We look at the teen.

[01:05:45] In that moment.

[01:05:46] And the teen is like.

[01:05:47] What?

[01:05:48] In God's name.

[01:05:50] Is happening right here.

[01:05:51] But what I also love.

[01:05:53] Is.

[01:05:54] Did you go back and watch those initial scenes.

[01:05:56] Back in episode one?

[01:05:58] Yeah.

[01:05:58] I did.

[01:05:58] It's funny because we.

[01:06:00] Correct me.

[01:06:00] If we get to see the perspectives.

[01:06:02] Right.

[01:06:02] Because he was.

[01:06:03] Yeah.

[01:06:04] He was kind of an ass in episode one.

[01:06:06] In this episode.

[01:06:08] He was the teen that we know.

[01:06:09] He's polite.

[01:06:10] Yeah.

[01:06:11] Yeah.

[01:06:12] So.

[01:06:12] And he's like.

[01:06:13] I see you've cast me as the mouthy teen.

[01:06:15] Who's guilty of some B plot crime.

[01:06:18] And I'm like.

[01:06:19] Oh my God.

[01:06:19] I love this kid.

[01:06:20] I love him.

[01:06:21] And in the first episode.

[01:06:22] I just.

[01:06:23] Was like.

[01:06:23] Yeah.

[01:06:24] He's some kid.

[01:06:24] Yeah.

[01:06:25] But.

[01:06:25] This kid is hilarious and precocious.

[01:06:27] Oh.

[01:06:27] My favorite.

[01:06:28] My favorite quote.

[01:06:29] Of the entire.

[01:06:31] And this says a lot.

[01:06:31] Because there are so many good ones.

[01:06:33] Is.

[01:06:34] She's.

[01:06:34] Throwing him back in the closet.

[01:06:36] And he goes.

[01:06:37] Please don't put me.

[01:06:38] I don't want to go back in the closet.

[01:06:42] Again.

[01:06:43] It's so brilliant.

[01:06:44] Because.

[01:06:45] We laugh at it.

[01:06:46] With all the measured levels.

[01:06:48] And people probably just laugh at it.

[01:06:49] Because.

[01:06:49] Oh.

[01:06:50] That's funny.

[01:06:50] But that's what I'm talking about.

[01:06:52] With this show.

[01:06:53] And.

[01:06:53] In a show that.

[01:06:54] So funny.

[01:06:55] Is so weighted in the death of a character.

[01:06:57] And the creation of another.

[01:07:00] And the discovery of.

[01:07:02] So much.

[01:07:03] We have that segment.

[01:07:05] That we've been waiting for.

[01:07:06] Where we get to see Catherine Han.

[01:07:08] Play this comedic character.

[01:07:10] And we get to see the teen.

[01:07:11] Sort of playing the straight man.

[01:07:13] Opposite of her.

[01:07:15] And then.

[01:07:16] Oh my god.

[01:07:17] And then.

[01:07:17] Which leads us.

[01:07:18] To the end.

[01:07:20] Where again.

[01:07:22] Catherine Han.

[01:07:24] In these small parts.

[01:07:26] I gotta tell you.

[01:07:27] If she doesn't win an Emmy for this.

[01:07:29] Because it's an MCU television show.

[01:07:32] It is a travesty.

[01:07:33] Because.

[01:07:34] She again.

[01:07:35] Flips that switch.

[01:07:36] And.

[01:07:37] It occurred to me.

[01:07:39] Before this.

[01:07:40] But maybe especially.

[01:07:41] Because of this episode.

[01:07:43] This evil that she shows.

[01:07:46] You had mentioned it being a habit.

[01:07:48] That she is.

[01:07:49] Has created over the years.

[01:07:50] And.

[01:07:51] And I think that.

[01:07:52] I do believe that.

[01:07:53] The evil that we see.

[01:07:55] I'm not saying that she's.

[01:07:56] I mean.

[01:07:56] I do think.

[01:07:56] In my.

[01:07:57] I do think she's the big bad.

[01:07:59] Although that big twist.

[01:08:00] Is still out there in the wind.

[01:08:02] In this show.

[01:08:03] It does seem like.

[01:08:04] Billy is.

[01:08:07] Maybe the main character.

[01:08:08] At this point.

[01:08:09] But.

[01:08:09] But.

[01:08:09] I'll let you throw.

[01:08:10] Out what you think.

[01:08:11] I just.

[01:08:12] Her being evil.

[01:08:13] At the tail end of this.

[01:08:14] And I do wonder.

[01:08:15] Like.

[01:08:16] It.

[01:08:16] I feel like she's created.

[01:08:17] Kind of this.

[01:08:19] This.

[01:08:19] Evil side of her.

[01:08:21] To mask.

[01:08:22] Like how she feels.

[01:08:23] Because she's.

[01:08:24] She's been.

[01:08:24] Yeah.

[01:08:25] It's.

[01:08:25] It's a trauma response.

[01:08:27] Yes.

[01:08:27] Yeah.

[01:08:28] She's.

[01:08:28] She's put up.

[01:08:29] A facade.

[01:08:31] Of being.

[01:08:32] I don't care about other people.

[01:08:34] I'm tough.

[01:08:35] I've killed people.

[01:08:36] And doesn't even bother me.

[01:08:37] Ha ha ha ha ha.

[01:08:38] Like.

[01:08:39] That is a performance.

[01:08:41] And.

[01:08:42] Every now and then.

[01:08:43] We see.

[01:08:44] Agatha.

[01:08:45] Behind the performance.

[01:08:46] And.

[01:08:47] She's.

[01:08:48] Scared.

[01:08:49] And hurting.

[01:08:49] Like when her mother was going to keep her in that cabin.

[01:08:52] That.

[01:08:52] I think that was.

[01:08:53] That was.

[01:08:54] Like her quote unquote inner child.

[01:08:56] That was the Agatha.

[01:08:58] That was tormented by her very mean mother.

[01:09:01] And.

[01:09:03] Like.

[01:09:04] As powerful as she is.

[01:09:06] As many centuries as she's lived.

[01:09:07] Her mother is still the thing that scares her more than anything else.

[01:09:10] Yeah.

[01:09:11] Because.

[01:09:11] Her mother is the person who hurt her before she had the defenses.

[01:09:14] To stop that from happening to her again.

[01:09:16] Yes.

[01:09:17] So.

[01:09:18] I think that.

[01:09:19] I've always thought that Agatha isn't.

[01:09:22] Evil in the like.

[01:09:23] Like.

[01:09:24] Mwahaha.

[01:09:24] I want to run the world.

[01:09:25] Or.

[01:09:26] I want to destroy the world kind of way.

[01:09:28] I think she is.

[01:09:29] I want as much power as possible.

[01:09:31] So no one can touch me.

[01:09:32] Well.

[01:09:33] And that.

[01:09:33] In pursuit of that power.

[01:09:35] She has done some really.

[01:09:37] Hideous.

[01:09:37] Evil things.

[01:09:38] Yeah.

[01:09:39] And.

[01:09:39] And.

[01:09:40] I mean.

[01:09:41] We see it.

[01:09:42] When she's sitting in front of that.

[01:09:45] That bassinet.

[01:09:47] Where her son.

[01:09:48] Her.

[01:09:49] Her son.

[01:09:50] Was.

[01:09:50] When he was little.

[01:09:51] And we see that look on her face.

[01:09:52] Of.

[01:09:53] Of a mother losing her son.

[01:09:54] When she hears his voice again.

[01:09:56] We get to see it.

[01:09:57] Honestly.

[01:09:58] When we see.

[01:09:59] Her.

[01:10:00] When she sees Billy.

[01:10:02] For the first time.

[01:10:04] In this episode.

[01:10:05] She has kind of an authentic.

[01:10:09] Sort of.

[01:10:10] Like.

[01:10:10] I missed you.

[01:10:11] From.

[01:10:12] The WandaVision.

[01:10:13] Series.

[01:10:14] Yeah.

[01:10:15] There was that kind of.

[01:10:15] She's.

[01:10:16] Yeah.

[01:10:17] She's not mad at him.

[01:10:18] At all.

[01:10:18] Yeah.

[01:10:19] About throwing her in the muck.

[01:10:21] Yeah.

[01:10:21] She's just like.

[01:10:22] Well there you go.

[01:10:23] Yeah.

[01:10:24] I knew there was something in there.

[01:10:25] She's.

[01:10:25] She's like impressed.

[01:10:27] She's curious.

[01:10:28] She's super curious about him.

[01:10:31] When she trapped Wanda in WandaVision.

[01:10:33] It was all like.

[01:10:35] I want to know everything about how you came to be in this place.

[01:10:38] I want to understand your power.

[01:10:39] So with Billy.

[01:10:40] It's the same thing.

[01:10:41] She's like.

[01:10:41] You're a powerful being.

[01:10:43] And.

[01:10:44] I.

[01:10:45] Am so into it.

[01:10:46] Like.

[01:10:47] She's so there for it.

[01:10:48] And he's like.

[01:10:49] I don't trust you.

[01:10:50] And she's.

[01:10:50] She almost.

[01:10:51] I wanted her to be like.

[01:10:52] Nobody does.

[01:10:53] Yeah.

[01:10:53] Like.

[01:10:54] That's my thing.

[01:10:56] So big surprise.

[01:10:57] Oh.

[01:10:58] You don't trust me.

[01:10:58] Like.

[01:10:59] But she's like.

[01:11:00] Got it.

[01:11:00] And then like.

[01:11:01] I love when she's like.

[01:11:02] Last one there is a nice person.

[01:11:04] It's like.

[01:11:05] It's like the meanest thing she could think of.

[01:11:07] To call someone.

[01:11:08] Well.

[01:11:09] I.

[01:11:09] She.

[01:11:10] She.

[01:11:10] She.

[01:11:11] Feels like she can mentor him too.

[01:11:13] Which is kind of interesting.

[01:11:15] I.

[01:11:15] I love when she walked up to him.

[01:11:17] Yeah.

[01:11:17] And said.

[01:11:17] Don't you dare.

[01:11:19] Feel guilty about.

[01:11:20] Your.

[01:11:21] Talent.

[01:11:22] Your talent.

[01:11:22] Yeah.

[01:11:23] I clipped it.

[01:11:24] You want to hear it?

[01:11:24] Yes.

[01:11:25] Lilia and Jen.

[01:11:28] Yeah.

[01:11:29] Well.

[01:11:29] What you did was.

[01:11:34] But life goes on.

[01:11:37] Yours.

[01:11:38] Anyway.

[01:11:39] I mean.

[01:11:40] I've killed.

[01:11:42] Uh.

[01:11:49] My share.

[01:11:50] But you don't see it holding me back.

[01:11:52] I'm not like you.

[01:11:54] Where have I heard that before?

[01:11:56] Where did you come by this fresh body or what?

[01:12:12] Don't you dare feel guilty about your talent.

[01:12:17] You survived.

[01:12:19] Like witches have been doing for centuries.

[01:12:24] You saw an opportunity.

[01:12:25] An empty vessel.

[01:12:26] And you moved in.

[01:12:28] So you broke the rules.

[01:12:30] Big deal.

[01:12:32] That's what kept you alive.

[01:12:35] That's what makes you special.

[01:12:40] That's what makes you a witch.

[01:12:45] I'm not like you.

[01:12:46] Yeah.

[01:12:47] Where have I heard that before?

[01:12:51] I.

[01:12:52] That's one of my favorite Agatha quotes.

[01:12:57] In the enigma of Agatha.

[01:13:00] Of her playing a villain.

[01:13:02] Of her playing a mother.

[01:13:04] Of her playing a friend.

[01:13:06] And her playing a mentor.

[01:13:08] I.

[01:13:09] Thoroughly.

[01:13:10] Love watching.

[01:13:12] Her.

[01:13:13] As we sort of head towards her crescendo.

[01:13:15] Because.

[01:13:16] Of all the questions.

[01:13:18] That we have left.

[01:13:19] The biggest questions.

[01:13:20] I think remain with her.

[01:13:21] What happened to her son?

[01:13:23] What's.

[01:13:24] What happened to her.

[01:13:25] That first time down the road.

[01:13:27] And.

[01:13:28] What is she really trying to get?

[01:13:29] Is she trying to get power?

[01:13:31] Because she wants more power?

[01:13:32] Is she trying to save her son?

[01:13:34] Or is she trying.

[01:13:36] Wouldn't it be something.

[01:13:38] If she was trying to.

[01:13:40] If.

[01:13:41] She was trying.

[01:13:42] If.

[01:13:43] If perhaps.

[01:13:44] This road.

[01:13:45] Was.

[01:13:46] More salvation.

[01:13:48] Connected to WandaVision.

[01:13:49] Than we know.

[01:13:49] Especially now.

[01:13:50] I don't know.

[01:13:52] All's I can tell.

[01:13:53] Redemption.

[01:13:53] Yeah.

[01:13:53] I also was wondering.

[01:13:55] So.

[01:13:56] When.

[01:13:57] When we saw Billy's like research about the road.

[01:13:59] It said the road.

[01:14:00] Will.

[01:14:01] Will provide.

[01:14:02] Or will give you what's missing.

[01:14:03] Yeah.

[01:14:04] And.

[01:14:04] They talk a lot about what each of them wants from the road.

[01:14:07] But.

[01:14:08] I don't.

[01:14:09] Know for sure that the road gives you what you want.

[01:14:12] But.

[01:14:13] Rather what the road thinks you are missing.

[01:14:15] Hmm.

[01:14:15] Right.

[01:14:16] Like.

[01:14:16] Who decides what that thing is.

[01:14:18] Does it have to do with the person's intentions.

[01:14:20] Like.

[01:14:21] Or.

[01:14:22] Is the road going to give.

[01:14:23] And is there a trick to it.

[01:14:25] Like a monkey's paw trick.

[01:14:26] Where you get what you wanted.

[01:14:27] But.

[01:14:27] It had a horrible cost.

[01:14:29] Like Wanda losing her son.

[01:14:30] Was that what she got from the road last time.

[01:14:32] Or.

[01:14:34] Is there.

[01:14:35] You know.

[01:14:35] Just the road say like.

[01:14:36] Oh you're not missing.

[01:14:38] You know.

[01:14:39] X.

[01:14:39] You're missing Y.

[01:14:40] Like.

[01:14:40] It's this other thing that you need.

[01:14:42] Like.

[01:14:42] Billy wants to find his brother.

[01:14:44] But is that what the road is going to give him.

[01:14:46] If he gets to the end.

[01:14:47] There's no.

[01:14:48] Guarantee.

[01:14:51] Boy.

[01:14:51] You've cracked open something that people have been talking about.

[01:14:54] This whole series.

[01:14:56] Yeah.

[01:14:56] Because maybe.

[01:14:56] Also.

[01:14:57] I've been thinking a lot about.

[01:14:58] About the Wizard of Oz.

[01:14:59] And.

[01:15:00] And I've been thinking about this a lot lately in general.

[01:15:03] There's the whole part of the Wizard of Oz where.

[01:15:06] You know.

[01:15:07] The Scarecrow wants a brain.

[01:15:08] And the Tin Man wants a heart.

[01:15:10] And.

[01:15:11] The Lion wants courage.

[01:15:13] And instead of giving them those things.

[01:15:16] The Wizard gives them.

[01:15:18] He gives the Scarecrow.

[01:15:19] A diploma.

[01:15:21] Right.

[01:15:21] It's like.

[01:15:21] This is how you know you're smart.

[01:15:22] Because you have a diploma.

[01:15:23] That shows it.

[01:15:24] And I think there are people who really do believe.

[01:15:26] There's no difference between.

[01:15:29] Intelligence.

[01:15:31] A certification of it.

[01:15:33] Of it.

[01:15:33] You know.

[01:15:33] Like.

[01:15:34] So they're willing to like.

[01:15:36] Get.

[01:15:36] A facsimile of the thing they want.

[01:15:39] And that.

[01:15:39] They don't really understand.

[01:15:40] There's a difference between those two things.

[01:15:43] So.

[01:15:44] Is the road going to really give them.

[01:15:46] What they're looking for.

[01:15:47] Or is it going to give them some kind of superficial.

[01:15:51] Like.

[01:15:52] You know.

[01:15:52] A medal that says you're courageous.

[01:15:54] Instead of.

[01:15:55] Feeling courageous.

[01:15:57] I mean.

[01:15:57] The point.

[01:15:58] In the movie.

[01:15:59] At least version of Wizard of Oz.

[01:16:00] Is that those people.

[01:16:01] That the Tin Man.

[01:16:02] The Scarecrow.

[01:16:02] The Lion.

[01:16:03] Had those things all along.

[01:16:04] They just didn't.

[01:16:05] They didn't believe in themselves.

[01:16:07] Until they went through this adventure.

[01:16:08] Right.

[01:16:08] So like.

[01:16:09] The Scarecrow's not stupid.

[01:16:10] He just thinks he is.

[01:16:11] He's.

[01:16:12] And so the diploma.

[01:16:13] Is to make him feel confident.

[01:16:14] But.

[01:16:15] I think there are a lot of people.

[01:16:17] Who really do believe.

[01:16:18] Like.

[01:16:18] If you get the diploma.

[01:16:19] You don't need the intelligence.

[01:16:20] Interesting.

[01:16:21] And if you get the medal.

[01:16:22] You don't need to have been brave.

[01:16:24] Because you have a medal.

[01:16:24] And that's the thing you wanted.

[01:16:25] That's the result.

[01:16:27] So.

[01:16:27] I don't know what the road.

[01:16:29] There's so many.

[01:16:30] Wizard of Oz references.

[01:16:31] Like.

[01:16:31] Is the road going to give them.

[01:16:33] What they want.

[01:16:34] Or is it going to give them.

[01:16:37] What it thinks they need.

[01:16:38] Or is it going to give them.

[01:16:40] Some shallow.

[01:16:42] Facsimile.

[01:16:42] Of what they think they want.

[01:16:46] Oh boy.

[01:16:47] Now you've bent my mind.

[01:16:48] You've hurt my mind.

[01:16:50] Yeah.

[01:16:50] I messed with your head.

[01:16:51] Yeah.

[01:16:51] I was so zeroed in.

[01:16:54] On just the simple.

[01:16:55] The simpleness of him.

[01:16:56] Looking for his brother.

[01:16:59] But this is such a complex story.

[01:17:01] Of all these characters.

[01:17:02] Looking for something.

[01:17:03] And what are they going to get.

[01:17:04] At the end of it.

[01:17:05] And is it.

[01:17:06] Going to be.

[01:17:08] Satisfying to them.

[01:17:09] Or unsatisfying to them.

[01:17:14] And how is that going to.

[01:17:16] Portray itself.

[01:17:17] And who.

[01:17:18] Is the wizard.

[01:17:20] In this case.

[01:17:21] Um.

[01:17:23] Which I.

[01:17:24] I don't really have.

[01:17:26] Good answers to.

[01:17:27] Other than the obvious.

[01:17:28] But.

[01:17:29] I.

[01:17:30] Boy.

[01:17:30] I don't.

[01:17:31] I.

[01:17:33] I think that.

[01:17:35] This show has done.

[01:17:36] A really nice job.

[01:17:37] Of satisfying.

[01:17:38] Us.

[01:17:39] As viewers.

[01:17:41] Which leads me.

[01:17:42] To believe that.

[01:17:43] The end will be.

[01:17:44] Satisfying.

[01:17:46] But.

[01:17:47] That doesn't help me.

[01:17:48] Answer your question.

[01:17:49] Of which one of those.

[01:17:50] That we're going to get.

[01:17:51] Because.

[01:17:53] I don't really know.

[01:17:54] What I want this end to be.

[01:17:56] I.

[01:17:56] I just want these.

[01:17:57] I want these.

[01:17:59] I want these characters.

[01:18:00] To make it.

[01:18:01] Because I don't want that.

[01:18:03] Yeah.

[01:18:03] Part to end.

[01:18:04] So maybe that will be the.

[01:18:06] Unsatisfying part.

[01:18:07] But I do feel like.

[01:18:08] Some of these characters.

[01:18:10] Can.

[01:18:11] Finish their.

[01:18:12] Time in the MCU.

[01:18:14] And still.

[01:18:15] Be satisfying.

[01:18:16] And maybe get what they want.

[01:18:17] Want.

[01:18:18] But it's not what they expect.

[01:18:19] Because.

[01:18:20] If.

[01:18:22] Wanda thinks she wants power.

[01:18:24] But ends up.

[01:18:26] Being united with her son.

[01:18:28] And if that means.

[01:18:30] You mean Agatha.

[01:18:30] Agatha.

[01:18:31] Yes.

[01:18:31] Yes.

[01:18:31] Yes.

[01:18:32] If Agatha.

[01:18:33] Agatha.

[01:18:34] Wants power.

[01:18:35] But ultimately.

[01:18:36] Is reunited with her son.

[01:18:38] And the only way.

[01:18:39] That she can reunite with her son.

[01:18:40] Perhaps is.

[01:18:42] Death.

[01:18:43] I don't know.

[01:18:44] I mean.

[01:18:44] Yeah.

[01:18:44] I don't know.

[01:18:45] There's.

[01:18:45] I think that.

[01:18:46] There's lots of ways.

[01:18:47] To.

[01:18:48] To.

[01:18:48] To.

[01:18:49] Do all of the things.

[01:18:50] That you said.

[01:18:51] Because all of these characters.

[01:18:53] Have so many.

[01:18:55] So many unanswered questions.

[01:18:57] We don't really know.

[01:18:58] Why many of them.

[01:18:59] Are walking down this path still.

[01:19:01] And it seems like.

[01:19:02] Some have.

[01:19:03] Maybe.

[01:19:04] Like it's.

[01:19:04] I really was feeling like.

[01:19:06] Jen.

[01:19:07] And Alice.

[01:19:08] Had.

[01:19:08] Found what they needed.

[01:19:10] And maybe that's why.

[01:19:11] Alice.

[01:19:12] Died.

[01:19:13] Maybe that's potentially.

[01:19:14] Why Jen.

[01:19:14] I don't know.

[01:19:14] There's.

[01:19:15] I don't know.

[01:19:16] Like now my head is spinning.

[01:19:17] Penny.

[01:19:18] Thanks.

[01:19:20] I don't think that.

[01:19:21] Lilia and Jen are dead.

[01:19:23] And also remember.

[01:19:24] Rio is not dead.

[01:19:25] Yes.

[01:19:25] So we don't know.

[01:19:27] What Rio is up to right now.

[01:19:29] We haven't seen her.

[01:19:30] This.

[01:19:30] You know.

[01:19:30] Since last week.

[01:19:31] Since Alice.

[01:19:32] In the cabin still.

[01:19:33] Yeah.

[01:19:34] I.

[01:19:35] I.

[01:19:36] If.

[01:19:36] If Agatha pulled herself out of the muck.

[01:19:39] Jen and Lilia probably can pull themselves out of the muck.

[01:19:42] I.

[01:19:43] I.

[01:19:44] I don't think that that was a death sentence.

[01:19:47] But.

[01:19:48] He thinks he killed them.

[01:19:50] Yeah.

[01:19:50] And Agatha was teasing him about it.

[01:19:53] Yes.

[01:19:54] I don't know if she necessarily thinks they're dead either.

[01:19:57] Right.

[01:19:57] She's just messing with him.

[01:19:58] Because that's what she does.

[01:20:00] Yeah.

[01:20:00] She messes with people.

[01:20:01] She pokes at them.

[01:20:03] She makes them angry.

[01:20:04] So they blast her with their magic.

[01:20:06] And then she can steal it.

[01:20:07] If that's her MO.

[01:20:08] Right.

[01:20:09] And she makes people uncomfortable.

[01:20:10] She performs as this like who they expect to see.

[01:20:14] This like mean cackling Agatha witch.

[01:20:17] But.

[01:20:19] I don't know how much of that is real.

[01:20:20] How much of that is.

[01:20:21] Is a conscious.

[01:20:24] Conscious performance.

[01:20:26] Or how much of it is.

[01:20:27] Habit.

[01:20:28] That she's been doing this for years.

[01:20:30] And it's a mask.

[01:20:30] She doesn't know how to take off.

[01:20:32] There's a lot of.

[01:20:33] Of complexity.

[01:20:35] To who she is.

[01:20:36] And who she is with different people.

[01:20:38] And who she is with teen right now.

[01:20:40] Is a little.

[01:20:41] Like snarky.

[01:20:43] Right.

[01:20:43] Yeah.

[01:20:43] Like.

[01:20:44] Oh you think you don't need me anymore.

[01:20:46] You need to throw a temper tantrum.

[01:20:47] To use your power.

[01:20:49] Like whatever.

[01:20:49] And then.

[01:20:50] She just saunters.

[01:20:51] Off.

[01:20:52] Down the road.

[01:20:52] Ahead of him.

[01:20:53] Like.

[01:20:54] She doesn't have a care in the world.

[01:20:56] I mean.

[01:20:57] She's the only person I've ever seen.

[01:20:58] Who can look.

[01:20:59] That.

[01:21:01] Like.

[01:21:02] Carefree.

[01:21:03] Covered in mud.

[01:21:04] Yes.

[01:21:05] Like.

[01:21:06] She just is like.

[01:21:07] This is who I am.

[01:21:08] I'm in mud.

[01:21:08] It's fine.

[01:21:10] She is portraying a lot.

[01:21:12] Yeah.

[01:21:12] Too.

[01:21:12] Like she.

[01:21:14] Definitely.

[01:21:15] Has.

[01:21:16] Anger.

[01:21:17] For Billy.

[01:21:19] That probably stems.

[01:21:20] Back to Wanda.

[01:21:21] She has.

[01:21:23] A mentory feel.

[01:21:25] Towards him.

[01:21:26] Because obviously.

[01:21:27] When she was.

[01:21:28] When they were in Westview.

[01:21:29] She did get to spend.

[01:21:31] You know.

[01:21:32] Some.

[01:21:33] Babysitting time with them.

[01:21:35] That we have already talked about.

[01:21:36] Had value.

[01:21:37] She.

[01:21:38] Yeah.

[01:21:38] So.

[01:21:39] She.

[01:21:39] She's.

[01:21:40] Portraying that.

[01:21:41] Also.

[01:21:41] I think that.

[01:21:42] The history of witchcraft.

[01:21:43] Is one of.

[01:21:45] Masters and apprentices.

[01:21:47] Yes.

[01:21:47] So.

[01:21:47] It's just a natural role for her.

[01:21:49] To see herself in.

[01:21:50] Like this is a new magic user.

[01:21:52] Mm-hmm.

[01:21:53] I could teach him.

[01:21:54] Slash control him.

[01:21:55] Yeah.

[01:21:55] And his power could become my power.

[01:21:57] Yeah.

[01:21:58] Like that's.

[01:21:59] That's a.

[01:21:59] You know.

[01:22:00] Story as old as time.

[01:22:01] Sure.

[01:22:02] Well and I guess maybe her way around.

[01:22:07] Wanda.

[01:22:07] Not getting Wanda's power.

[01:22:09] I mean maybe this is her work around for it.

[01:22:11] Now she can mentor him.

[01:22:12] Yeah.

[01:22:13] Until she can figure it.

[01:22:14] Figure it out.

[01:22:15] I love her inquisitiveness.

[01:22:17] She is one of the most curious people that.

[01:22:19] The MCU has ever had.

[01:22:21] We got to see that in WandaVision where she literally could have just taken Wanda's power.

[01:22:26] And instead we get a whole entire episode of her trying to find out.

[01:22:31] Out of true curiosity where she got that power from.

[01:22:35] And now.

[01:22:36] She has her.

[01:22:38] Her son.

[01:22:39] Who is now just discovering the power.

[01:22:41] So now she can walk.

[01:22:43] No pun intended.

[01:22:44] She can kind of walk that road with him.

[01:22:46] And then take it.

[01:22:47] Which is kind of.

[01:22:49] All of that.

[01:22:50] You know.

[01:22:51] All balled up in one.

[01:22:52] And what's funny about this too is.

[01:22:55] There is.

[01:22:57] A quality to the taking of that power.

[01:23:00] That isn't evil.

[01:23:02] And again we talked about this before.

[01:23:04] Like she does see it as.

[01:23:06] This is what needs to happen.

[01:23:08] Because he can't control it.

[01:23:10] All I need to do is learn how he got it.

[01:23:12] So then I can have it.

[01:23:14] And make sure it doesn't happen again.

[01:23:15] Like there's a true earnestness to that.

[01:23:17] Which is weird.

[01:23:18] And I can't believe that I'm agreeing with it.

[01:23:21] But she's.

[01:23:22] If she is the big bad.

[01:23:23] And I do think she is in a lot of ways.

[01:23:26] But again we have a twist coming.

[01:23:28] I'm sure.

[01:23:30] But she's portraying it in a really neat way.

[01:23:33] And I love it so much.

[01:23:34] And I.

[01:23:34] Again when I say the big bad.

[01:23:36] I think this show is too complicated.

[01:23:38] To have one hero.

[01:23:41] And one protagonist.

[01:23:43] And one antagonist.

[01:23:44] I think you know.

[01:23:44] We've been talking about this all along.

[01:23:46] That this is more complex than that.

[01:23:49] So different episodes.

[01:23:51] Have different stories to tell.

[01:23:53] With different protagonists and antagonists.

[01:23:55] And we're finding out that a lot of that.

[01:23:56] Is internal.

[01:23:58] Much like the Wizard of Oz.

[01:23:59] As you mentioned.

[01:24:00] So.

[01:24:01] But yeah.

[01:24:02] Her.

[01:24:02] Brief role in this.

[01:24:04] Was so fantastic.

[01:24:06] I have a couple of things we haven't talked about yet.

[01:24:08] I just want to throw out there.

[01:24:10] First of all.

[01:24:11] Everything that happened with Ralph Boner.

[01:24:14] In that parking garage was hilarious.

[01:24:16] I love it.

[01:24:18] I love that people on the internet.

[01:24:19] Have been like.

[01:24:20] Whatever happened to Ralph?

[01:24:22] And we got the answer.

[01:24:23] So awesome.

[01:24:24] His best line was.

[01:24:25] You seriously do not know.

[01:24:27] What kind of crazy that lady eats for breakfast.

[01:24:30] And I was like.

[01:24:31] I'm going to put that on a t-shirt.

[01:24:33] That is hilarious.

[01:24:35] I thought that was so great.

[01:24:36] I loved his witch repellent spray.

[01:24:38] I loved his like little bone cross.

[01:24:40] Sewn into his hat.

[01:24:41] And the like.

[01:24:42] Whatever that rattly dead animal thing.

[01:24:45] All of that was so funny.

[01:24:46] He was so terrified.

[01:24:48] But then he's also like.

[01:24:49] You got to come to my show.

[01:24:50] And Paramus.

[01:24:51] Like.

[01:24:51] Oh my God.

[01:24:52] He's still acting.

[01:24:53] Hey.

[01:24:53] So there's that.

[01:24:55] Yeah.

[01:24:56] There's that.

[01:24:56] The boyfriend texts.

[01:24:59] Billy.

[01:25:01] You're my heart.

[01:25:03] And he uses a black heart emoji.

[01:25:05] So this is the third reference to a black heart we've had on the show.

[01:25:09] Right.

[01:25:09] First there was when Rio said.

[01:25:11] I have a heart.

[01:25:11] It's black.

[01:25:12] And it beats for you.

[01:25:13] The other one was when.

[01:25:15] Lilia drew a little black heart.

[01:25:17] Instead of using Rio's name on her list.

[01:25:19] And then now a black heart.

[01:25:21] There is a Marvel character named Black Heart.

[01:25:23] Black Heart.

[01:25:24] And it is related to Mephisto.

[01:25:26] It's Mephisto's son.

[01:25:27] So.

[01:25:28] I.

[01:25:29] I don't know where they're going.

[01:25:30] Because it's been like.

[01:25:31] Is it Rio?

[01:25:32] Is it Billy?

[01:25:34] Like who is the black heart?

[01:25:35] But.

[01:25:36] Black Heart is out there.

[01:25:38] Um.

[01:25:39] Just.

[01:25:40] It's.

[01:25:40] It's just.

[01:25:42] It's.

[01:25:42] They keep bringing it up.

[01:25:44] It means something.

[01:25:45] Um.

[01:25:46] I.

[01:25:47] I love that Agatha said that he has the same tell as his mother.

[01:25:51] And he goes.

[01:25:52] Which is.

[01:25:52] And she says.

[01:25:53] Very inconvenient for you.

[01:25:56] Um.

[01:25:57] Just.

[01:25:58] Great dialogue.

[01:25:59] Really funny.

[01:25:59] And also.

[01:26:00] I.

[01:26:01] Don't know what the tell is.

[01:26:02] And I'm going to have to go back and watch WandaVision now.

[01:26:04] And try to figure out.

[01:26:06] What the tell is.

[01:26:07] Um.

[01:26:07] Because I'm sure that there is something that he did that is specific that we could.

[01:26:12] Um.

[01:26:13] We could.

[01:26:13] You know.

[01:26:14] Relate.

[01:26:14] He definitely moves.

[01:26:15] And I loved her line.

[01:26:17] He definitely moves.

[01:26:19] His magic.

[01:26:20] The way that Wanda does.

[01:26:23] And now.

[01:26:24] We have a new story about that.

[01:26:25] Yeah.

[01:26:26] Well.

[01:26:26] Knowing this.

[01:26:27] Well.

[01:26:27] I haven't read that yet.

[01:26:29] But knowing the story.

[01:26:31] That we do.

[01:26:33] Um.

[01:26:33] It does.

[01:26:34] Sort of feel like.

[01:26:36] Um.

[01:26:37] It does sort of feel like.

[01:26:39] That that's a natural occurrence.

[01:26:40] I mean.

[01:26:41] Obviously.

[01:26:41] He never.

[01:26:42] This version of Billy.

[01:26:44] Has never.

[01:26:46] Met his mother.

[01:26:47] Um.

[01:26:47] Or.

[01:26:48] Yeah.

[01:26:48] Maybe vaguely remembers her.

[01:26:50] But.

[01:26:50] Um.

[01:26:50] So I.

[01:26:51] I.

[01:26:51] I am intrigued by that.

[01:26:52] So the tell.

[01:26:53] Tell has to be kind of.

[01:26:54] Interwrapped into that.

[01:26:54] Somehow.

[01:26:55] I guess.

[01:26:57] Yeah.

[01:26:58] And I loved her line.

[01:26:59] Gosh.

[01:26:59] You really are a Maximoff.

[01:27:01] Otherwise.

[01:27:01] None of this would be nearly as dramatic.

[01:27:03] It's just.

[01:27:05] Like.

[01:27:05] It's.

[01:27:06] I don't know.

[01:27:06] How do you come back to that?

[01:27:08] That's like such a.

[01:27:09] A line that kills.

[01:27:10] Any kind of rebuttal.

[01:27:12] You'd be like.

[01:27:12] But.

[01:27:13] Uh.

[01:27:13] Yeah.

[01:27:14] Mm.

[01:27:14] Well.

[01:27:15] But.

[01:27:15] We're.

[01:27:16] We're.

[01:27:16] We're.

[01:27:17] We're.

[01:27:17] We're left here thinking.

[01:27:19] Though.

[01:27:19] Boy.

[01:27:20] You want to talk about.

[01:27:21] Again.

[01:27:21] No pun intended.

[01:27:22] The pot calling the kettle black.

[01:27:24] Like.

[01:27:24] You want to talk about someone who.

[01:27:26] We.

[01:27:26] This is a woman who.

[01:27:29] Created her own theme song.

[01:27:31] In the.

[01:27:32] Yeah.

[01:27:33] So.

[01:27:34] She's.

[01:27:34] She's just as dramatic as the Maximoffs.

[01:27:37] But.

[01:27:37] I guess it takes one to know one.

[01:27:39] Yeah.

[01:27:40] Exactly.

[01:27:40] And also.

[01:27:41] She likes to be the.

[01:27:42] Center.

[01:27:44] For sure.

[01:27:46] It's the Agatha show.

[01:27:47] It's not the.

[01:27:47] Wiccan show.

[01:27:49] Um.

[01:27:50] There's.

[01:27:50] So there's probably a part of her.

[01:27:51] That's like.

[01:27:52] Stop stealing my thunder kid.

[01:27:53] You know.

[01:27:55] Uh.

[01:27:57] I have a whole bunch of.

[01:27:58] Other.

[01:27:59] Observations.

[01:27:59] From my rewatch.

[01:28:00] But I think.

[01:28:01] Uh.

[01:28:02] I think I'll.

[01:28:03] Bring those to next time.

[01:28:05] Yeah.

[01:28:05] Well.

[01:28:05] Listen.

[01:28:06] My two points were.

[01:28:07] And this is where.

[01:28:08] You know.

[01:28:09] We.

[01:28:09] This is our.

[01:28:11] I don't know.

[01:28:11] Probably our 10th total podcast together.

[01:28:13] My two points were.

[01:28:14] I loved.

[01:28:15] Ralph Boner.

[01:28:16] Making.

[01:28:16] A reintroduction.

[01:28:17] It did occur to me.

[01:28:19] Yeah.

[01:28:19] That maybe she can hear.

[01:28:21] Or maybe he can hear him.

[01:28:23] Because.

[01:28:24] In another universe.

[01:28:25] They're related.

[01:28:28] I thought they were at least.

[01:28:29] Yeah.

[01:28:30] Yeah.

[01:28:30] I mean.

[01:28:30] They did bond.

[01:28:31] During that time.

[01:28:32] Well.

[01:28:33] I mean.

[01:28:33] I'm.

[01:28:33] I'm thinking like.

[01:28:34] You know.

[01:28:35] He was.

[01:28:36] You know.

[01:28:36] In.

[01:28:38] In another universe.

[01:28:39] He was.

[01:28:41] Wanda's.

[01:28:41] Brother.

[01:28:43] So.

[01:28:46] Maybe.

[01:28:46] Maybe.

[01:28:47] They're just kind of playing off of that a little bit.

[01:28:49] But I.

[01:28:50] I just loved Ralph's.

[01:28:51] Ralph's characters.

[01:28:52] For all the reasons you mentioned.

[01:28:53] And then my other note.

[01:28:54] Was the black heart.

[01:28:55] And.

[01:28:56] And I actually was going to.

[01:28:57] I tied it to something a little different though.

[01:28:58] I.

[01:28:59] I.

[01:28:59] Um.

[01:29:00] Since Lilia was the first person that we see.

[01:29:02] And she's the one who puts.

[01:29:04] Um.

[01:29:05] The spell on him early on.

[01:29:07] Uh.

[01:29:09] I connected it right to that.

[01:29:11] The.

[01:29:12] She had written down several names.

[01:29:14] Um.

[01:29:14] In the second episode.

[01:29:15] Mm-hmm.

[01:29:16] And the last one was black heart.

[01:29:18] And here.

[01:29:18] I think we were assuming that.

[01:29:20] Through this whole time.

[01:29:21] That it was Rio.

[01:29:22] It turns out.

[01:29:23] It might not have been Rio at all.

[01:29:24] It might have.

[01:29:25] It might have been him.

[01:29:26] So.

[01:29:27] The fun play with that is.

[01:29:29] That would make.

[01:29:31] Rio.

[01:29:32] The person who's not supposed to be there.

[01:29:34] As opposed to the teen.

[01:29:37] Which I think.

[01:29:38] Either one.

[01:29:40] It's kind of a fun little teeter-totter.

[01:29:41] To think about.

[01:29:42] If it's Rio.

[01:29:43] Who's not supposed to be there.

[01:29:44] That brings its own little bags with it.

[01:29:46] If it's.

[01:29:47] The teen who's not supposed to be there.

[01:29:49] That brings some other stuff along with it.

[01:29:52] Uh.

[01:29:52] And of course.

[01:29:52] It might not be either one.

[01:29:54] Uh.

[01:29:54] But.

[01:29:55] Uh.

[01:29:55] I do like the interplay with that.

[01:29:56] Again.

[01:29:57] Just good writing.

[01:29:57] Where.

[01:29:58] Um.

[01:29:58] You can have all of these open questions.

[01:30:00] And.

[01:30:01] Um.

[01:30:02] It really tells an amazing story.

[01:30:04] So.

[01:30:04] So those are my two points.

[01:30:05] And again.

[01:30:06] Uh.

[01:30:07] As I keep saying from episode to episode.

[01:30:09] This was.

[01:30:10] My favorite episode so far.

[01:30:12] And I don't know if it was because.

[01:30:14] Yeah.

[01:30:15] It was better.

[01:30:16] Yeah.

[01:30:16] Or because.

[01:30:18] In really neat ways.

[01:30:20] Each episode leads into another.

[01:30:22] And this one again.

[01:30:23] Brilliantly done.

[01:30:24] Uh.

[01:30:25] And I have no iota of a clue.

[01:30:27] Where we're going next.

[01:30:28] Other than down.

[01:30:29] A yellow leaf road.

[01:30:30] In this case.

[01:30:31] Um.

[01:30:32] Which.

[01:30:32] Hopefully brings back some of our other characters.

[01:30:34] So.

[01:30:35] Yeah.

[01:30:35] I.

[01:30:36] Uh.

[01:30:37] Uh.

[01:30:37] Again.

[01:30:37] Just another.

[01:30:39] Beautifully.

[01:30:40] Told story.

[01:30:41] And.

[01:30:41] And.

[01:30:41] I don't know.

[01:30:42] What kind of reviews or ratings.

[01:30:44] That this show is getting.

[01:30:45] But my goodness.

[01:30:46] Is the storytelling amazing.

[01:30:47] And.

[01:30:48] With three episodes left.

[01:30:50] With lots of answers.

[01:30:51] With lots of questions.

[01:30:52] Still out there.

[01:30:53] So much fun to be had.

[01:30:54] In the next three episodes.

[01:30:55] And I'm so happy.

[01:30:56] That it wasn't just 30 minutes.

[01:30:57] I was so scared.

[01:30:59] Um.

[01:31:00] Everybody in our crew.

[01:31:01] Had finished it so fast.

[01:31:02] I was like.

[01:31:03] Oh no.

[01:31:03] It's 30 minutes again.

[01:31:04] But you guys just watched it quickly.

[01:31:07] Yeah.

[01:31:07] We just.

[01:31:08] We just got.

[01:31:09] Got down to business right away.

[01:31:15] All right.

[01:31:15] We're going to take a little break.

[01:31:16] And we'll be back with some news.

[01:31:18] And listener feedback.

[01:31:25] And we're back.

[01:31:26] And it's time for just a little bit of news.

[01:31:28] Jim.

[01:31:29] All right.

[01:31:30] So.

[01:31:30] The first bit of news that we have.

[01:31:32] Is really interconnected.

[01:31:33] With what we were just talking about.

[01:31:36] Um.

[01:31:37] Uh.

[01:31:37] Joe Locke.

[01:31:38] Who portrays.

[01:31:39] Wiccan.

[01:31:39] Billy.

[01:31:40] William.

[01:31:41] Teen.

[01:31:42] Goodness gracious.

[01:31:43] Uh.

[01:31:44] He.

[01:31:44] Uh.

[01:31:44] The article is from Variety.

[01:31:46] And the title of the article is.

[01:31:48] Locke became Wiccan and Agatha all along.

[01:31:50] By using Elizabeth Olsen's.

[01:31:52] Scarlet Witch Movement Coach.

[01:31:54] The way they use their magic.

[01:31:56] Is similar.

[01:31:57] And.

[01:31:58] You know.

[01:31:58] If you were watching.

[01:31:59] You can see.

[01:32:00] A lot of Wanda.

[01:32:02] In the way that.

[01:32:03] Billy moves.

[01:32:04] Before he uses power.

[01:32:05] And.

[01:32:05] Uh.

[01:32:06] The article goes on to say.

[01:32:07] Given that Billy is Wanda's son.

[01:32:09] And they share similar superpowers.

[01:32:10] It was important for Locke.

[01:32:11] To study Olsen's movements.

[01:32:13] As the Scarlet Witch.

[01:32:14] The key to achieving that goal.

[01:32:16] Was working with Jennifer White.

[01:32:17] Olsen's movement coach.

[01:32:18] Who helped develop the hand gestures.

[01:32:20] For Scarlet Witch's abilities.

[01:32:22] Uh.

[01:32:23] Quote.

[01:32:23] Quote.

[01:32:23] We worked.

[01:32:24] To find similarities in both Billy and Wanda.

[01:32:26] The way they use their magic.

[01:32:28] Unquote.

[01:32:28] Locke told Entertainment Weekly.

[01:32:30] Um.

[01:32:30] Fans of the comic corner know that Billy's powers are pretty much the same as Wanda's.

[01:32:34] With a few differences.

[01:32:35] So we wanted to find similarities with that.

[01:32:38] But also his own finesse.

[01:32:41] And.

[01:32:41] They're.

[01:32:42] They're very similar.

[01:32:43] Um.

[01:32:44] They do have some slight differences between the two.

[01:32:46] But.

[01:32:47] I.

[01:32:47] A.

[01:32:48] Love the fact.

[01:32:49] That they're movement coaches for this.

[01:32:51] Again.

[01:32:51] It's something I think you overlook.

[01:32:52] You know.

[01:32:53] It's obvious.

[01:32:53] Like if you're going to lightsaber duel.

[01:32:55] You have to learn how to do it.

[01:32:56] But the subtle movements of.

[01:32:59] Of using these powers.

[01:33:00] The fact that they.

[01:33:01] They have a movement coach.

[01:33:03] And use the same one.

[01:33:04] Is.

[01:33:04] Again.

[01:33:05] Paying really great attention to the detail.

[01:33:07] And of course Jack Schafer.

[01:33:09] Probably had a lot of insight into that.

[01:33:10] Being that she was.

[01:33:11] So integral to both shows.

[01:33:13] So yeah.

[01:33:13] I.

[01:33:14] If you go back and watch WandaVision.

[01:33:16] To anybody who's listening.

[01:33:17] And I highly recommend it.

[01:33:18] Especially those last few episodes.

[01:33:20] Watching Wanda.

[01:33:22] Using her power.

[01:33:23] And then.

[01:33:24] Cutting to.

[01:33:26] Episode five.

[01:33:27] Where Billy first uses his power.

[01:33:28] It's.

[01:33:29] It's really kind of amazing.

[01:33:30] How similar they are.

[01:33:31] With a little bit of difference.

[01:33:33] But.

[01:33:34] I love it when they tie it together.

[01:33:37] And they're paying attention to that kind of detail.

[01:33:39] Me too.

[01:33:41] Our second article comes from Out Magazine.

[01:33:44] And it says.

[01:33:45] It's titled.

[01:33:46] Smile 2's.

[01:33:47] Miles Gutierrez Riley.

[01:33:48] Talks playing Joe Locke's.

[01:33:50] Agatha All Along love interest.

[01:33:52] And queering the MCU.

[01:33:55] And.

[01:33:56] You know.

[01:33:56] Excerpts as usual.

[01:33:58] Out's Rafi Ermac.

[01:33:59] Got to chat with Smile 2 star.

[01:34:01] Miles Gutierrez Riley.

[01:34:03] About playing Joe Locke's love interest.

[01:34:04] In Disney Pluses.

[01:34:06] Agatha All Along.

[01:34:07] And bringing more queer representation.

[01:34:09] To the MCU.

[01:34:10] With the debut of Agatha All Along.

[01:34:12] The Marvel world is gayer than ever before.

[01:34:14] And Gutierrez Riley.

[01:34:16] Is contributing to the new era in Marvel.

[01:34:18] Alongside Locke.

[01:34:20] Miles Gutierrez Riley.

[01:34:21] Had nothing but praise for Locke.

[01:34:23] Calling him the industry's new it boy.

[01:34:25] Adding.

[01:34:26] People love Heartstopper.

[01:34:27] Heartstopper.

[01:34:27] It was amazing to work alongside him.

[01:34:29] He's so young and so wise.

[01:34:31] He really has a great head on his shoulders.

[01:34:33] I learned so much working with him.

[01:34:35] He made me laugh all the time.

[01:34:37] On being part of the new era in Marvel.

[01:34:40] Gutierrez Riley said.

[01:34:41] It means the world.

[01:34:42] The MCU is massive.

[01:34:43] And it touches so many people.

[01:34:45] Because it's personal.

[01:34:47] And the fact that representation is authentic.

[01:34:49] And coming from creators that actually care about the stories they're telling.

[01:34:52] And can relate to them.

[01:34:53] It means the world.

[01:34:55] And I haven't taken it for granted from the second I got the call.

[01:34:58] I'm really honored to be a part of it in this way.

[01:35:02] With both Gutierrez Riley and Locke leading the way.

[01:35:05] It's clear the MCU is headed for a very gay future.

[01:35:08] And all we can say is.

[01:35:09] It's about damn time.

[01:35:14] I really enjoyed that article.

[01:35:16] I just thought it was so cute.

[01:35:20] They're an adorable couple.

[01:35:25] And I just.

[01:35:26] I don't know.

[01:35:27] I'm really enjoying just out representation.

[01:35:30] And not just having to wait for something to be queer coded.

[01:35:32] Or to read gayness into a relationship that doesn't have it there.

[01:35:37] Or whatever.

[01:35:37] It's just.

[01:35:38] It's really refreshing.

[01:35:40] Yes.

[01:35:41] And just doing it.

[01:35:46] Doing it in a way that.

[01:35:51] The story that they're telling.

[01:35:54] It's a story about.

[01:35:56] You know.

[01:35:56] Loving each other.

[01:35:57] Between these two.

[01:35:58] It's not a story about anything more than that.

[01:36:00] You go back to the parents.

[01:36:02] I love that the parents.

[01:36:03] There was.

[01:36:04] That wasn't.

[01:36:05] That wasn't even.

[01:36:05] The story was.

[01:36:07] You know.

[01:36:09] Where's Eddie?

[01:36:09] You know.

[01:36:10] It wasn't.

[01:36:11] Yeah.

[01:36:11] Why isn't Eddie?

[01:36:12] Yeah.

[01:36:13] Yeah.

[01:36:13] It just.

[01:36:13] There wasn't anything more to it than that.

[01:36:15] And I just love.

[01:36:16] And that's really how the show has handled.

[01:36:18] All of the relationships.

[01:36:20] And how everybody thinks everybody else is attractive.

[01:36:23] And it's just kind of part of the intermix of the show.

[01:36:26] Just the way it's a part of life.

[01:36:28] I also.

[01:36:30] I can't fathom that these characters are going anywhere.

[01:36:34] And again.

[01:36:35] I'm not going to spoil anything for anybody.

[01:36:37] Because I don't know what the future holds for.

[01:36:39] For Eddie.

[01:36:40] Let alone for.

[01:36:42] Billy.

[01:36:43] But you know.

[01:36:44] If.

[01:36:44] If you even dip your nose.

[01:36:47] Into the comic book lore.

[01:36:48] Of Billy.

[01:36:50] And you find out.

[01:36:52] His.

[01:36:52] Anything about his relationships.

[01:36:54] There obviously is.

[01:36:57] Some interconnectivity with.

[01:37:00] Some characters that could be a part of the MCU in the future.

[01:37:03] So.

[01:37:04] If you're so interested.

[01:37:05] You know.

[01:37:06] Take it.

[01:37:06] Take a deep look into that.

[01:37:07] And I do think.

[01:37:09] His.

[01:37:10] His.

[01:37:10] His acting in this episode.

[01:37:11] And I don't know.

[01:37:15] I don't know.

[01:37:16] Miles Gutierrez.

[01:37:17] Riley.

[01:37:17] At all.

[01:37:18] From.

[01:37:18] From any other shows.

[01:37:19] Although now.

[01:37:20] I'll have to watch Smile 2.

[01:37:21] Although.

[01:37:22] That will scare me.

[01:37:23] And I don't want to be scared.

[01:37:24] But.

[01:37:25] Thank you.

[01:37:26] I.

[01:37:27] I.

[01:37:27] I.

[01:37:28] I was very impressed.

[01:37:30] With.

[01:37:30] I think it's hard.

[01:37:32] It's hard to do.

[01:37:33] What he did in this episode.

[01:37:35] Act like you've been together for a while.

[01:37:38] Show.

[01:37:39] Like growing love.

[01:37:41] I think that's hard for any actor to do.

[01:37:43] And.

[01:37:44] Both Joe Locke and.

[01:37:46] And.

[01:37:47] Gutierrez Riley.

[01:37:47] Did such an amazing job of.

[01:37:51] Giving weight to.

[01:37:52] To that early teenage romance.

[01:37:54] That.

[01:37:55] That.

[01:37:56] Made it feel real.

[01:37:56] In such a short amount of time.

[01:37:58] So.

[01:37:58] So I hope that he's an actor that we get to see again.

[01:38:02] Yeah.

[01:38:02] I think he's.

[01:38:03] He's been great.

[01:38:06] I saw one article.

[01:38:08] That was about some of the.

[01:38:09] Sort of.

[01:38:10] Homophobic stuff that happened.

[01:38:12] When Joe Locke was first announced.

[01:38:14] And at the beginning of the series.

[01:38:16] And there were.

[01:38:17] There were people.

[01:38:19] You know.

[01:38:19] There always are some people.

[01:38:20] Who are like.

[01:38:21] Why do they have to make the character gay?

[01:38:23] It's like.

[01:38:24] Clearly you didn't read the comic books.

[01:38:27] He's very much a gay character in the comics.

[01:38:29] There's no question about it.

[01:38:31] And.

[01:38:32] There are.

[01:38:33] There are just some people.

[01:38:35] Who want to be upset about representation.

[01:38:37] And.

[01:38:38] They.

[01:38:39] They don't care.

[01:38:40] That they're not making a logical.

[01:38:43] Argument.

[01:38:43] Like.

[01:38:47] They're just mad about it.

[01:38:48] And.

[01:38:49] I like to think that those people.

[01:38:51] Are.

[01:38:52] Diminishing.

[01:38:52] And there's fewer and fewer of them all the time.

[01:38:55] And that the ones that are left.

[01:38:56] Are just really loud.

[01:38:57] And that's why it seems like it hasn't changed.

[01:39:00] Because.

[01:39:04] Obviously I'm pro representation.

[01:39:06] Yeah.

[01:39:06] That's enough to say about that.

[01:39:07] Well.

[01:39:08] I do.

[01:39:08] I.

[01:39:09] Let me just.

[01:39:09] Yeah.

[01:39:10] Before we move on.

[01:39:11] I just want to say.

[01:39:12] And I don't know.

[01:39:12] I don't think.

[01:39:15] Just.

[01:39:15] You know.

[01:39:16] Anybody.

[01:39:17] Who.

[01:39:18] You know.

[01:39:18] Just looks.

[01:39:19] Out the window.

[01:39:21] Or.

[01:39:21] Through a TV set.

[01:39:22] You know.

[01:39:23] I think that.

[01:39:24] Thinking that.

[01:39:28] The landscape.

[01:39:29] For.

[01:39:30] LGBTQ plus.

[01:39:31] Is.

[01:39:31] Is getting better.

[01:39:32] I think.

[01:39:33] There's part of me.

[01:39:34] That thinks that there is definitely.

[01:39:36] Movements.

[01:39:37] That are growing.

[01:39:38] To.

[01:39:39] Just.

[01:39:40] Make life.

[01:39:41] Acceptable.

[01:39:42] But I also feel like.

[01:39:43] The.

[01:39:44] Opposing force to that.

[01:39:45] Is also.

[01:39:47] Growing.

[01:39:47] And I don't know whether it's just.

[01:39:49] Noise level.

[01:39:49] Or.

[01:39:50] People level.

[01:39:51] But.

[01:39:52] I will say.

[01:39:53] The one thing that I.

[01:39:54] Cannot.

[01:39:55] Quite.

[01:39:55] Comprehend about the show.

[01:39:56] Is how.

[01:39:58] For the most part.

[01:39:59] Up to this point.

[01:40:00] With as many viewers.

[01:40:02] As it's been getting.

[01:40:03] How it has avoided.

[01:40:05] Kind of a continuation.

[01:40:06] Of that initial volley.

[01:40:08] After lock was cast.

[01:40:09] Because.

[01:40:11] There just isn't.

[01:40:11] A whole lot of it.

[01:40:12] And.

[01:40:13] Whatever the reason is.

[01:40:15] I'm for it.

[01:40:16] Let's keep that ball rolling.

[01:40:17] And.

[01:40:19] Hopefully.

[01:40:20] As we head down.

[01:40:20] This new version.

[01:40:21] Of the MCU.

[01:40:22] Hopefully that.

[01:40:23] That noise.

[01:40:24] Will start to diminish.

[01:40:25] More and more.

[01:40:28] Now let's get away from it.

[01:40:29] As far as.

[01:40:30] As far as possible.

[01:40:31] But I just.

[01:40:31] It's.

[01:40:32] It's so good to see a show.

[01:40:33] That can address.

[01:40:34] It.

[01:40:35] And it's good to see.

[01:40:36] That the public.

[01:40:36] Is accepting it.

[01:40:37] And maybe we just.

[01:40:38] Got rid of all the people.

[01:40:39] That.

[01:40:40] Like to whine and moan.

[01:40:42] Yeah.

[01:40:43] Go whine and moan.

[01:40:44] To yourself.

[01:40:44] We don't want to hear.

[01:40:47] All right.

[01:40:48] Let's talk.

[01:40:48] Witchy question.

[01:40:49] Of the week.

[01:40:51] We got.

[01:40:52] We got one response.

[01:40:53] From a listener.

[01:40:54] Slash.

[01:40:55] Guest host.

[01:40:56] Kara.

[01:40:57] Who says.

[01:40:57] I still have to get my thoughts together.

[01:40:59] For official feedback.

[01:41:00] Which she did not send in.

[01:41:02] But here is my dream coven.

[01:41:05] One.

[01:41:06] And I knew this was going to be on her list.

[01:41:08] Taylor Swift.

[01:41:09] She put Taylor Swift.

[01:41:10] In divination.

[01:41:11] And said.

[01:41:12] That woman is also the queen.

[01:41:14] Of manifestation.

[01:41:14] And I cannot argue with that.

[01:41:17] Hermione Granger.

[01:41:18] Potions.

[01:41:19] I love that she's mixing.

[01:41:20] Real people.

[01:41:21] With fictional people.

[01:41:22] Three.

[01:41:23] Buffy Summers.

[01:41:24] Protection.

[01:41:25] I mean.

[01:41:25] It's Buffy.

[01:41:27] Snoop Dogg.

[01:41:28] In the green witch category.

[01:41:30] Alternate.

[01:41:30] Martha Stewart.

[01:41:32] And.

[01:41:33] Stevie Nicks.

[01:41:34] As the spirit witch.

[01:41:38] I love it.

[01:41:39] I love that.

[01:41:40] It's a great.

[01:41:40] It's a great lineup.

[01:41:41] Kara.

[01:41:42] You left yourself out of the lineup though.

[01:41:44] So.

[01:41:44] Oh.

[01:41:45] What kind of witch are you?

[01:41:46] Oh dear.

[01:41:47] Okay.

[01:41:48] Yeah.

[01:41:51] Do you have yours Jim?

[01:41:52] I do.

[01:41:53] But now I have to figure out.

[01:41:54] Where I'm going to supplant somebody.

[01:41:56] So.

[01:41:56] All right.

[01:41:57] Let me go through it.

[01:41:58] Okay.

[01:41:58] All right.

[01:41:59] So I'm going to give you.

[01:41:59] What I have right now.

[01:42:00] And I'm going to try to figure out.

[01:42:01] Which one of these people.

[01:42:03] I'm going to.

[01:42:04] Kick out of this group.

[01:42:05] Which is going to be very difficult.

[01:42:07] So I decided to.

[01:42:08] I was very much.

[01:42:10] Moved by Alice's episode.

[01:42:12] And I love the idea.

[01:42:13] Of the band concept.

[01:42:15] So I went all musical on this one.

[01:42:18] So here we go.

[01:42:19] My divination.

[01:42:21] Which was Robert Plant.

[01:42:24] I.

[01:42:25] Have always thought that.

[01:42:27] Robert Plant was a witch.

[01:42:29] If you ever pay attention to Led Zeppelin.

[01:42:31] And the runes.

[01:42:32] And the.

[01:42:33] The mystical side of their band.

[01:42:35] And I think Robert Plant was at the center of that.

[01:42:37] My potions.

[01:42:40] This.

[01:42:41] This.

[01:42:41] This man has made me feel better.

[01:42:43] Since I was a youngster.

[01:42:46] With his guitar playing.

[01:42:47] And that's Edward Van Halen.

[01:42:48] I found his music when I was.

[01:42:50] Less than 10.

[01:42:52] And if I told you how many times.

[01:42:53] His guitar playing has made me feel better.

[01:42:56] That certainly.

[01:42:57] I couldn't count that in hundreds.

[01:43:00] Or maybe even thousands.

[01:43:01] My protection witch.

[01:43:03] Would be Freddie Mercury.

[01:43:04] Freddie Mercury has.

[01:43:07] A voice that could stop a stampede.

[01:43:09] It's so beautiful.

[01:43:11] He would.

[01:43:12] Without a doubt.

[01:43:13] Be the protection witch.

[01:43:14] My green witch.

[01:43:15] This would be the one.

[01:43:16] That I would take the place of.

[01:43:19] Would be Michael Stipe.

[01:43:21] Lead singer of REM.

[01:43:22] Back in the day.

[01:43:22] And he was.

[01:43:24] One of the first people.

[01:43:27] To.

[01:43:28] And this was.

[01:43:29] Gosh.

[01:43:29] Maybe 30 years ago.

[01:43:30] And he was talking about his house in Georgia.

[01:43:32] About how green his house was.

[01:43:34] And how earthly.

[01:43:35] That he wanted it to be.

[01:43:36] To the point where he.

[01:43:39] Doesn't have paper.

[01:43:41] In his entire house.

[01:43:42] Like.

[01:43:42] Everything in his house.

[01:43:44] Is something that he can reuse.

[01:43:46] And I just.

[01:43:47] I remember being struck by.

[01:43:49] Someone with that much money.

[01:43:52] Doing things the right way.

[01:43:54] That's the person.

[01:43:55] That I would take the place of.

[01:43:56] Because I would aspire to do that.

[01:43:58] And then.

[01:43:58] My spirit witch.

[01:44:00] This is somebody.

[01:44:01] Who passed away.

[01:44:02] Within the past five years.

[01:44:04] Who.

[01:44:05] I think probably.

[01:44:07] With all of his talents.

[01:44:08] And abilities.

[01:44:09] Could conjure.

[01:44:09] Plus his.

[01:44:10] Favorite color was purple.

[01:44:11] And that's where I started with this.

[01:44:13] And.

[01:44:13] And my spirit witch.

[01:44:14] Would be Prince.

[01:44:15] I mean.

[01:44:16] Come on.

[01:44:16] Purple rain.

[01:44:17] I mean.

[01:44:17] Come on.

[01:44:18] I mean.

[01:44:18] Agatha.

[01:44:18] Let's go.

[01:44:19] Yeah.

[01:44:19] So that would be mine.

[01:44:20] My musical version of this.

[01:44:22] And.

[01:44:23] I have a feeling that.

[01:44:24] I'm going to come up with several versions of this.

[01:44:27] Because that was a lot of fun.

[01:44:28] All right.

[01:44:28] Penny.

[01:44:28] But now it's your turn.

[01:44:29] It's a fun question.

[01:44:30] Yeah.

[01:44:30] For sure.

[01:44:31] So.

[01:44:32] Thinking I was so clever and original.

[01:44:35] In the potions witch position.

[01:44:37] I put.

[01:44:37] Martha Stewart.

[01:44:38] And then when I saw Kara's comments.

[01:44:40] I was like.

[01:44:41] Oh man.

[01:44:43] I mean.

[01:44:43] Come on.

[01:44:43] Penny.

[01:44:44] I guess.

[01:44:44] I was going to say.

[01:44:45] Like.

[01:44:45] Come on.

[01:44:47] And I.

[01:44:48] Specifically said.

[01:44:49] Martha Stewart.

[01:44:50] With Snoop Dogg.

[01:44:51] As her familiar.

[01:44:52] Are you kidding?

[01:44:53] Right.

[01:44:53] Because.

[01:44:54] Those two come together.

[01:44:55] Yes.

[01:44:55] They do come together quite well.

[01:44:57] That's awesome.

[01:44:58] Yeah.

[01:44:59] My green witch.

[01:45:01] Greta Thunberg.

[01:45:02] Oh yeah.

[01:45:02] The climate activist.

[01:45:04] I.

[01:45:05] I think that girl has.

[01:45:06] Magical powers.

[01:45:07] Yes.

[01:45:08] I believe in her.

[01:45:09] Protection witch.

[01:45:11] Alexandria.

[01:45:11] Ocasio-Cortez.

[01:45:13] Because she is fierce.

[01:45:15] For sure.

[01:45:16] She is fierce.

[01:45:17] And extremely smart.

[01:45:19] She knows how to play the game.

[01:45:20] I like it.

[01:45:21] Yeah.

[01:45:22] I love her.

[01:45:23] Spirit witch.

[01:45:24] That's where I put myself.

[01:45:26] I think I'm a pretty good communicator.

[01:45:29] And.

[01:45:30] People in the past have thought I was.

[01:45:32] Psychic.

[01:45:33] So.

[01:45:34] I'll take it.

[01:45:35] And for divination.

[01:45:36] I really struggled.

[01:45:37] I struggled with this one.

[01:45:38] And I.

[01:45:39] Eventually decided on Maya Angelou.

[01:45:41] Oh.

[01:45:42] Because.

[01:45:42] While she may not have visions.

[01:45:46] She's definitely a visionary.

[01:45:48] Yes.

[01:45:50] Yes.

[01:45:50] But I had also in the running.

[01:45:54] Vanita Gupta.

[01:45:55] Who is.

[01:45:56] Um.

[01:45:56] A civil rights attorney.

[01:45:57] Who I admire.

[01:45:59] Catherine Hahn.

[01:46:00] Aubrey Plaza.

[01:46:01] Meryl Streep.

[01:46:03] Uh.

[01:46:03] Maya Angelou.

[01:46:04] Okay.

[01:46:04] Wanda Sykes.

[01:46:05] Megan Rapinoe.

[01:46:07] You know the soccer player.

[01:46:09] Uh.

[01:46:09] Jane Fonda.

[01:46:11] Frida Kahlo.

[01:46:13] And Michelle Obama.

[01:46:14] Yes.

[01:46:14] Mostly because I just want to be friends with Michelle Obama.

[01:46:17] Oh man.

[01:46:19] I just want to hang out with her.

[01:46:20] Here's what we need to do.

[01:46:21] We need to.

[01:46:21] We need to figure out a way to go and have drinks with Michelle and Barack Obama.

[01:46:27] That would be.

[01:46:27] Yeah.

[01:46:27] I would be so satisfied with my year at that point.

[01:46:30] Like that would be.

[01:46:31] I would be satisfied with like the decade.

[01:46:33] Yes.

[01:46:34] I would be so excited.

[01:46:35] It would probably be.

[01:46:36] Yeah.

[01:46:36] You could probably convince me that my life would be.

[01:46:38] Not.

[01:46:38] I mean I'd still have plenty to live for.

[01:46:40] But.

[01:46:41] I'd be okay with that.

[01:46:42] Yeah.

[01:46:43] That.

[01:46:44] I mean that's like the bucket list.

[01:46:46] Uh.

[01:46:46] Celebrities to meet.

[01:46:47] I would love to meet them.

[01:46:49] Um.

[01:46:49] I also.

[01:46:50] Suspect that once there's no cameras on them.

[01:46:53] They're hilarious.

[01:46:54] Oh.

[01:46:54] Because they're pretty funny when they're being politic.

[01:46:57] And diplomatic.

[01:46:58] With cameras off.

[01:47:00] I think they must be some of the funniest people on earth.

[01:47:04] I.

[01:47:05] Just watching them interact with each other.

[01:47:09] Just in those brief moments of.

[01:47:12] How they honor each other.

[01:47:14] The way that I think.

[01:47:15] Any good.

[01:47:17] Any good friends would honor each other.

[01:47:20] Whether the cameras are on them.

[01:47:21] Or off of them.

[01:47:22] I.

[01:47:23] I.

[01:47:23] Have laughed so much.

[01:47:24] At.

[01:47:25] That power that they have.

[01:47:28] It's funny.

[01:47:29] When you talk about couples.

[01:47:31] And you talk about.

[01:47:32] Politicians specifically.

[01:47:34] And their marriages.

[01:47:35] And morality.

[01:47:36] And.

[01:47:37] Those two.

[01:47:38] I don't know that I've ever seen.

[01:47:40] Two closer people in my life.

[01:47:41] That.

[01:47:42] Not only.

[01:47:43] Love each other.

[01:47:44] But also honor each other's.

[01:47:46] Strength and power.

[01:47:47] And like each other too.

[01:47:48] Independent.

[01:47:49] Yeah.

[01:47:49] Well.

[01:47:49] And.

[01:47:50] And they don't see.

[01:47:51] The other one.

[01:47:52] Just as.

[01:47:53] Part of a couple.

[01:47:55] They see that.

[01:47:56] Of course.

[01:47:56] They see them as a family unit.

[01:47:58] But they also understand.

[01:48:00] Their singular.

[01:48:01] Power as well.

[01:48:02] And I think that's rare.

[01:48:04] In.

[01:48:05] Yeah.

[01:48:06] Any relationship.

[01:48:07] So.

[01:48:07] Admirable.

[01:48:08] Yes.

[01:48:08] Yeah.

[01:48:10] So our next witchy question.

[01:48:11] Of the week.

[01:48:13] Is.

[01:48:14] What is missing.

[01:48:16] For you.

[01:48:16] Or from your life.

[01:48:17] That you hope.

[01:48:18] You would find.

[01:48:19] If you made it to the end of the road.

[01:48:24] Oh boy.

[01:48:25] Now.

[01:48:27] I have a feeling.

[01:48:28] It's going to sponsor.

[01:48:29] Some deep thoughts.

[01:48:31] And.

[01:48:32] If you don't want to share.

[01:48:34] The real answer with us.

[01:48:35] Feel free to send in.

[01:48:36] A joke answer.

[01:48:37] But.

[01:48:38] I do challenge people.

[01:48:39] To think about.

[01:48:40] What they actually.

[01:48:41] Would try to find.

[01:48:41] On the road.

[01:48:42] Because I think.

[01:48:43] Interesting.

[01:48:44] Question for yourself.

[01:48:46] I don't know about you.

[01:48:47] But immediately.

[01:48:50] People pop into my head.

[01:48:52] And.

[01:48:53] Once I go through those names.

[01:48:55] Then.

[01:48:55] All of a sudden.

[01:48:56] The other.

[01:48:58] Things start.

[01:48:59] Growing into my head.

[01:49:00] This could be an interesting conversation.

[01:49:02] I think I'm going to come up with a funny one too.

[01:49:04] Just for the heck of it.

[01:49:05] Because.

[01:49:06] Who knows where this conversation is going to go next week.

[01:49:09] Yeah.

[01:49:09] Could get.

[01:49:10] It could get pretty heavy.

[01:49:11] Yeah.

[01:49:12] With that said.

[01:49:12] Let's move on to listener feedback.

[01:49:15] And.

[01:49:17] Jim.

[01:49:17] Why don't you read that first one.

[01:49:18] All right.

[01:49:19] The first one comes from.

[01:49:21] Paik.

[01:49:22] Paik Allen.

[01:49:23] Who by the way.

[01:49:24] Has a fantastic podcast.

[01:49:25] But we can get to that later.

[01:49:27] Paik Allen said.

[01:49:28] That episode was incredible.

[01:49:30] I was already super attached to the character of Billy.

[01:49:32] With a personal connection to the young actor who played him before.

[01:49:35] But Joe Locke has blown me away with his portrayal of the character now.

[01:49:39] What a backstory episode full of reveals.

[01:49:43] Billy lives.

[01:49:44] R.I.P.

[01:49:45] William Kaplan.

[01:49:45] We literally hardly knew ye.

[01:49:47] And the whole ordeal ended up being a journey to find his brother.

[01:49:50] I legitimately teared up.

[01:49:52] And I need that reunion.

[01:49:54] Also.

[01:49:54] Billy and his boy.

[01:49:56] Were ridiculously adorable together.

[01:49:58] And the actual banter and dialogue during the interrogation seems.

[01:50:02] Comedy gold.

[01:50:03] Boy do I agree with that.

[01:50:04] Paik.

[01:50:05] The episode has fully solidified this show.

[01:50:07] Is one of.

[01:50:09] If not my favorite of the year.

[01:50:11] Bravo.

[01:50:13] Oh.

[01:50:13] Paik.

[01:50:14] High praise.

[01:50:14] How I.

[01:50:15] Yeah.

[01:50:16] I mean.

[01:50:16] I definitely agree with you though.

[01:50:19] I mean.

[01:50:20] I'm loving it.

[01:50:21] So much.

[01:50:22] But it might as well have been written.

[01:50:23] Like.

[01:50:23] Let's write a show that Penny will like.

[01:50:25] You know what I mean?

[01:50:26] Like I.

[01:50:27] The fact that other people are liking it.

[01:50:29] As much as I do.

[01:50:30] Is like this pleasant surprise.

[01:50:32] I'm like.

[01:50:32] Really?

[01:50:33] It's so.

[01:50:34] It's funny.

[01:50:35] Because.

[01:50:35] Getting to know you.

[01:50:37] Just guesting on Buffy.

[01:50:40] This literally.

[01:50:41] Could be.

[01:50:42] A show.

[01:50:43] Like if.

[01:50:43] If.

[01:50:44] All of the guest hosts got together.

[01:50:46] And wanted to surprise you with a show.

[01:50:48] I'm pretty sure this would be the show.

[01:50:51] It really is.

[01:50:53] It's like relevant to like all my interests.

[01:50:55] I.

[01:50:55] I love it on so many levels.

[01:50:58] We also heard from Danielle.

[01:51:00] And she said first.

[01:51:01] I had to share this screenshot of my Facebook feed.

[01:51:04] LOL.

[01:51:05] The top half of the screenshot is.

[01:51:07] A picture of Billy from like the shoulders up.

[01:51:10] And the bottom half is a Petco ad about.

[01:51:14] Somebody scooping kitty litter.

[01:51:15] That's like hands and waist.

[01:51:18] And then like.

[01:51:19] And so it looks like it's all Billy.

[01:51:21] So Billy is like selling kitty litter.

[01:51:24] It's a very silly picture.

[01:51:28] It looks so much like it's him.

[01:51:30] She goes on to say.

[01:51:31] Oh my gosh.

[01:51:31] Yeah.

[01:51:32] It really merges like seamlessly into one image.

[01:51:35] It's really funny.

[01:51:37] She says.

[01:51:38] I see the world through the eyes of a mother among other things and feel so bad for William's parents.

[01:51:43] Even now.

[01:51:44] I imagine they are searching for their missing son.

[01:51:47] I see the world through the.

[01:51:48] Oh wait.

[01:51:49] I apparently I copied that twice.

[01:51:54] Thank you Danielle.

[01:51:56] That is excellent feedback.

[01:51:58] And the picture is obviously hilarious.

[01:52:00] And it's on Facebook.

[01:52:02] If you guys want to see it.

[01:52:03] You could go see.

[01:52:03] She posted it on the Facebook feed.

[01:52:06] Jim you want to read this email from Amelia?

[01:52:09] Amelia.

[01:52:09] Hi Penny and Jim.

[01:52:11] I listened to the podcast each week and thought I'd have a go at sending in some feedback.

[01:52:15] Keep it coming.

[01:52:16] Thank you so much.

[01:52:17] I really enjoyed the episode.

[01:52:18] We love new people.

[01:52:19] Yes.

[01:52:20] Yes.

[01:52:20] Please.

[01:52:21] Maybe tell a friend.

[01:52:24] Maybe tell a friend and you know.

[01:52:26] Just like.

[01:52:27] Just like.

[01:52:28] You know how you're supposed to get someone else to vote.

[01:52:30] Get someone else to give some feedback.

[01:52:31] All right.

[01:52:31] I'm sorry.

[01:52:32] I really enjoyed the longer episode this week.

[01:52:34] It was great to delve into the teen's past and watch from his perspective when he first met Agatha.

[01:52:39] I really hope Jen and Lilia aren't dead.

[01:52:41] They both deserve a better send off.

[01:52:43] I was really looking forward to Lilia's trial and learning more about her backstory.

[01:52:48] I'm hoping Rhea did a bit of life saving off camera whilst Agatha and teen Billy slash William talk things out.

[01:52:54] Thanks for doing this podcast.

[01:52:56] You both do a great job.

[01:52:57] Amelia.

[01:52:58] Oh thank you so much.

[01:53:00] We love doing it.

[01:53:01] Thank you Amelia.

[01:53:01] Yay.

[01:53:02] And like I said we love when we hear from people we haven't heard from before.

[01:53:06] It's just.

[01:53:07] I don't know.

[01:53:08] It's so exciting to know that we're reaching new voices and we're not just talking to each other.

[01:53:12] Yeah.

[01:53:13] Although we like doing that too.

[01:53:15] And we got one voicemail from friend of the podcast Greg.

[01:53:19] Here we go.

[01:53:20] Hey Jim.

[01:53:20] Hey Penny.

[01:53:21] This is Greg.

[01:53:22] This is going to be a quick little note for Agatha episode six.

[01:53:27] Um, I really loved this backstory.

[01:53:31] Um, like, and then as you go, if you went, as you go back and watch it again, um, and you know, oh, your lifeline's broken into.

[01:53:39] And you're like, oh, that's unfortunate.

[01:53:41] And then I don't know why Lilia put the sigil on him.

[01:53:44] Maybe to like, I mean, I don't know.

[01:53:47] Was it maybe in order?

[01:53:49] Like, it's kind of, I have no idea.

[01:53:51] It's, I really want to know, but she's not going to be able to tell us.

[01:53:53] I don't think, or whatever.

[01:53:55] But anyway, um, the, the fact that, uh, Tommy's consciousness just like took over this body that they found.

[01:54:04] Like, like Agatha said, like, that's what makes her a witch, uh, or makes him a witch.

[01:54:09] Um, I thought it was awesome.

[01:54:11] Um, uh, one other aspect to this is that Agatha was so dark at the end of this, like dark, dark, like, like WandaVision dark,

[01:54:22] not funny dark, but Catherine Hahn played it so straight.

[01:54:27] I was amazed.

[01:54:30] And like, she was just flat out like, this is what I am.

[01:54:34] Let's go take care of this business right now.

[01:54:36] Oh man.

[01:54:36] Anyway, I thought it was great.

[01:54:38] Uh, talk to you guys later.

[01:54:39] Bye.

[01:54:40] Awesome.

[01:54:41] Thanks, Greg.

[01:54:42] You know, I don't know why Lilia put the sigil on him.

[01:54:46] There was part of it that looked like it wasn't even something she was consciously doing.

[01:54:50] It seemed like she might've been channeling again because she did it so fast.

[01:54:56] Like she was like, she picked up the pen, did the sigil, dropped it in his pocket.

[01:55:00] And then immediately was like, whose code is this?

[01:55:02] And immediately didn't know a thing about it.

[01:55:04] Um, and I, I've thought about this a lot and it could just be as simple as the fact that she,

[01:55:12] you know, she can obviously get a sense for these things, but it certainly seemed almost

[01:55:18] almost like someone was kind of leading her through it.

[01:55:23] Um, so, so I think there's, there's more at play here.

[01:55:27] I think how he handled the sigil throughout the episode was kind of interesting as well,

[01:55:32] because he didn't break the bond of the sigil until the very, almost the very end of the episode.

[01:55:39] We see him break it in his hand, um, which I thought was interesting as well.

[01:55:43] And, and, um, I need to know that symbol more.

[01:55:50] Like, is that a Lily a symbol?

[01:55:52] Are we going to get to see that symbol again?

[01:55:54] When we get her episode, if we get an episode by her, then, um, are we going to get to learn

[01:56:00] more about that?

[01:56:01] And are we going to find out that she was interconnected to all of these characters in a similar fashion

[01:56:08] as teen, who we find out in some serious and not so serious ways that he was interconnected

[01:56:13] with all of our witches as well.

[01:56:15] So I don't know.

[01:56:17] I, we didn't really talk a lot about the sigil, but I think it's just based simply on the fact

[01:56:21] that much like you, Greg, we didn't, I don't, I don't know yet.

[01:56:27] Yeah.

[01:56:27] Yeah.

[01:56:27] I don't have a good theory for why she did it.

[01:56:29] So I think that there's more information to come.

[01:56:33] At least I hope there is.

[01:56:35] I assume there is.

[01:56:38] Well, that, that is our show.

[01:56:42] Next time we'll be episode seven.

[01:56:43] We still don't know what the title will be of that episode.

[01:56:46] So.

[01:56:48] And I checked.

[01:56:49] It's still not there yet.

[01:56:50] Episode seven.

[01:56:51] If you want to join the conversation, you can email or send a voice memo to agatha

[01:56:56] at podcast.com and we'll put feedback posts up on the podcast, podcast feedback feedback

[01:57:01] page, or you can find us at podcast.com.

[01:57:04] And thanks for all the feedback this week.

[01:57:06] That was awesome.

[01:57:07] It's so good.

[01:57:09] While you're out there, look around and check out the other podcast shows.

[01:57:14] So Peck, who wrote in this week, he has a couple of podcasts.

[01:57:17] One is called run for your lives where he and Daphne talk about movies where you have to

[01:57:25] run for your life.

[01:57:26] So it's disaster movies.

[01:57:28] It's horror movies.

[01:57:30] They cover serious, silly, all kinds of stuff on there.

[01:57:34] He also does a podcast with Rima called Strange Indeed that started as a Stranger Things podcast,

[01:57:40] but now they cover all kinds of other shows that are on Netflix, including every Mike Flanagan show.

[01:57:47] So if you are a fan of spooky stuff and you aren't watching Mike Flanagan shows yet, you should start because they are so good.

[01:57:56] They are so good.

[01:57:56] So that would be Midnight Mass.

[01:57:59] Yes.

[01:57:59] Haunting of Hill House.

[01:58:00] Haunting of Bly Manor.

[01:58:03] The Fall of the House of Usher.

[01:58:05] And I'm forgetting one.

[01:58:06] Midnight Club.

[01:58:07] Midnight Club.

[01:58:08] Yeah.

[01:58:09] And they're also, again, to really tie it all together with a bow, they're also doing the Great British Bake Off, which they're currently doing right now.

[01:58:17] So maybe they're trying to tell us that there's some witchcraft in there.

[01:58:20] But they do a great bit of coverage with that as well.

[01:58:21] And that's not Bake, but it is Greg who you just heard.

[01:58:25] Yes.

[01:58:26] Yeah, that's Great British Bake Off.

[01:58:28] Yeah.

[01:58:29] And there's so many other podcasts going on right now.

[01:58:31] There's the Daryl Dixon show and we just finished Rings of Power and there's just a lot going on at Podcastica and there's new stuff coming up soon.

[01:58:43] So it's worth a visit to that website.

[01:58:45] Yeah.

[01:58:46] Check it out at Podcastica.com.

[01:58:48] There's so much, including sports podcasts, but I digress.

[01:58:52] Oh yeah, I haven't started listening to that yet.

[01:58:53] Thanks for listening.

[01:58:54] And until next time.

[01:58:55] I'm Jim.

[01:58:57] And I'm Penny.

[01:58:58] Get witchy with it.

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