300 "The Pit and the Pendulum" (The Fall of the House of Usher E7)

[00:00:00] Hey everybody, I'm Rima and I'm Pake. And this is Strange Indeed, a podcast dedicated

[00:00:17] to the Netflix show The Fall of the House of Usher.

[00:00:20] This week we are covering episode 7 titled The Pit and the Pendulum. Oh man, we'll

[00:00:28] submit episode. Pindulum. And not only that but just a quick shout out that it is our

[00:00:40] 300th episode for Strange Indeed. That's awesome, but I haven't been here for all 300

[00:00:47] you have though so that's an incredible feat. But I've been here for a while myself but

[00:00:53] yeah, yeah. That's, that's, yeah, Strange Indeed. Yeah, and yeah, I have been and I'm tired.

[00:01:01] No, you have been here for a lot of them. Of course, if people have been listening to us

[00:01:07] for a while they'll know this started with Sean and then you came on board and have

[00:01:14] been here for at least half or more. I could probably go back and count and figure that

[00:01:19] out. Honestly, I don't know but I'm so happy that you're here with me for the 300th episode

[00:01:25] and yeah, thank you to everyone who's been with us for the 300th. This is amazing. I didn't

[00:01:33] ever see getting here. So it feels, feels pretty amazing. So yeah, thank you to everyone. Thank

[00:01:40] you, Paik and thank you, Sean for being with me in the beginning. So the pit and the pendulum.

[00:01:49] What a hell of an episode. I just, I can barely get the words out. It's just, I thought it was great.

[00:01:54] Paik, do you have some like general thoughts? Yeah, I really like this one. There's a lot.

[00:02:02] It's interesting because each one has seemed focused very solely on like one story and this one

[00:02:08] definitely had, I mean it was the Frederick episode. But also there was a lot other stuff going

[00:02:15] on where there's other like the flashbacks and the stuff going on with Madeline and Rodric

[00:02:19] Vernon, all those storylines that have kind of been like puttering around in the background.

[00:02:24] Got a lot more focus in this one too. It seemed to like really vary and bounce around

[00:02:28] different stuff like we're clearly getting like everything crossing paths and getting ready to wrap

[00:02:34] up in the finale. So definitely excited for that.

[00:02:39] Me too. Yeah, there was this was the Frederick centric episode. However, like you said, so many other

[00:02:50] things that have that we've gotten a little pieces to. We got more of this week really driving

[00:02:59] the plot. Well, and thank goodness too driving things forward because we literally just have the

[00:03:03] finale now. So I'm like come on. You know, let's get some of those answers. I've just been,

[00:03:09] you know, since the beginning so unsettled trying to figure out what happens next. And I'll be

[00:03:16] honest, I'm completely clueless. I know we have some nuggets in this episode. I'm clueless. I don't

[00:03:22] know what the frig is going to happen next. So I'm really excited to get some of those answers.

[00:03:28] But I'm, you know, we'll focus on this episode and I get too far ahead of ourselves. So

[00:03:36] you mentioned you had before we start recording a lot of points tonight. So go ahead and kick us

[00:03:41] off. Yeah, I push some of them to more other notes because I could go on and on. It'd be like,

[00:03:46] I've got like six main points that's going to be me talking about everything tonight. So

[00:03:50] that's that's okay because I talk way too much a lot of time. So go for it.

[00:03:58] Yeah, so stick to kind of four main points. But then I've got backups and I'll have lots of

[00:04:03] extra notes. So it'll be fine. Yeah, the first one, I think I kind of coined this term last week

[00:04:08] and I liked it. But these scenes I'm referring to as the confession session between Rodric and

[00:04:14] August Dupin. I like it. And so again, there's some really good juicy stuff in there. So I just

[00:04:21] wanted to talk about the things that we got in those scenes together. I'll talk about the flashback

[00:04:28] stuff separately but through stuff that we saw in there, I like that August tells Rodric that he

[00:04:34] says the reason that he trusted Roddy back in the day before you know, he did what he did to him

[00:04:40] is he said he trusted him because Annabelle did and she was pure good. She was a pure soul and

[00:04:48] you know that because Annabelle loved him and trusted him that he saw no reason not to

[00:04:53] and boy did that bite him in the ass but I like when he says that and it gets Rodric off on this

[00:05:00] you know Annabelle Lee poem again that in this universe, he wrote. But there's that other half

[00:05:06] of it because it was the very romantic side that we saw in an earlier episode but those who know

[00:05:10] that poem is he's going to like this grave of his love and he's recounting the death of his love

[00:05:16] and it might be an actual literal death. We still don't know exactly what happened to Annabelle

[00:05:21] but we know at least the death of their love, the death of their marriage was something that was

[00:05:24] right around the corner. And so that kind of further part of that poem is where Rodric accept

[00:05:30] saying and this was the reason that long ago in this kingdom by the sea, a wind blew out of a cloud

[00:05:34] chilling my beautiful Annabelle Lee and I loved August's response who says you're the fucking wind

[00:05:41] Shakespeare. You're the chilling wind that blew her away, you're the reason it died, it's your fault

[00:05:50] which man August had some like punches today in this episode I loved. But then he goes on to say

[00:06:01] Annabelle Lee was the only good usher. They used to say there's no such thing as a good usher but

[00:06:06] she was the exception to that, she was the only good one. And then Rodric refutes that by saying what

[00:06:11] most of our listeners have said which is wrong my granddaughter Lenore the best of us and so much

[00:06:17] like her grandmother too all the best of Annabelle Lee without the without the broken heart

[00:06:23] which I don't know we'll see about the broken heart stuff after this episode what happens to

[00:06:27] Lenore here but um definitely I liked that he pointed out like no Lenore is also a very pure

[00:06:36] soul and good usher. A lot of people have brought out yeah I have so many quotes so much this

[00:06:43] episode had so much stuff that like my notes are full of like exact quotes where I'm having like

[00:06:47] pause and write things down because the dialogue is just incredible this week.

[00:06:52] It is always very very incredible I 100% agree with that statement that really fantastic writing.

[00:07:02] Yeah uh try to go a little quicker through these but yeah again the noises from the basement

[00:07:06] we get that in August. August speaking for us all again by saying like look I've got to tell you

[00:07:12] those noises are starting to really bother me. Hey so you say that's Madeline down there and I'm like

[00:07:19] thank you. Thank you we've all since the first episode been sitting here going oh my god

[00:07:24] oh what is happening and Roderick doesn't make us feel any better about it when then

[00:07:29] his way of getting August to turn back around and not leave he goes you'll have me on murder

[00:07:33] that's where we're going you'll have me dead to rights on murder more than one actually and I'm

[00:07:37] like oh that could mean so many things it adds to the Madeline question especially after what she

[00:07:43] did in this episode you're like no kidding what did he do to her? She even alive what about you know

[00:07:49] it could be so many things yeah I'm I'm I'm interpreting that to mean so many different things

[00:07:56] that I gotta know yeah I hear you uh and then his phone going off in that moment too and then he's

[00:08:02] oh and let me guess that's Lenore bingo and it's like that's also starting to bother me like is she

[00:08:07] okay she better be okay I man it's a lot of these little things and I'm sure we will get wrapped up

[00:08:15] in the finale but like they just keep reminding us of all these little lingering questions that are

[00:08:20] just like eating a la at us uh yeah August almost got up and left he almost got out of there because

[00:08:26] he was just tired of this long drawn out seemingly insane story that Roderick is telling without

[00:08:33] this clear point in view he's just like okay you're you're getting something out of this you're pulling

[00:08:38] my chain you're trying to scare me whatever you're getting out of this from just like wasting my time

[00:08:43] I'm done with it and I again with those cut punches that he's got he says goodnight Roderick

[00:08:48] and good luck with the dementia like damn that is cold he is out of sympathy at this point for sure

[00:08:57] yeah uh and then lastly of course we always get the ghost uh moments in these scenes

[00:09:04] and I liked the twist on it this time where it wasn't a huge big jump scare it was

[00:09:11] the pendulum in the clock starting up you know a little sign from Freddy and then instead of

[00:09:16] appearing as some mangled bloody gory specter whatever we get tiny little Freddy with his mama Annabelle

[00:09:24] you know it seems like a sweet memory of a loving little family long gone you know as not

[00:09:31] as Roderick says any minute now Freddy's gonna be peeking out from behind the chair to show off his

[00:09:36] c-section scar which no freaking morbid and and we're expecting the same when you get all the

[00:09:46] other episodes and what's happened each time he's talking to depend and what's happened to his

[00:09:51] children you know one by one that's like what we're expecting he's saying exactly what we're

[00:09:56] all expecting to happen and yeah a twist when we didn't get that right instead it's it's the

[00:10:01] the little little Freddy with Annabelle and then that seems like oh it's it to you know much nicer

[00:10:07] kind of moment for him until that definitely goes south in the fashion of sheer terror and horror as

[00:10:13] his little boy torn in half right in his arms and you're like yeah nope there's what we were waiting on um

[00:10:20] that was dark yeah that was dark you know to have the image of his child

[00:10:26] mm-hmm which I mean that's his first born that's his you know pride and joy that is his you know

[00:10:35] you know the the one that's supposed to carry on everything the legacy the family the heir apparent yeah

[00:10:41] um and so in it that I like how that ties right into that you know bitter sweet moment of

[00:10:48] that vision which I think he knew exactly when he says we're here to support daddy on his big day

[00:10:53] I feel like Roderick knew exactly where this was coming from and what was going on mentally what he's

[00:10:57] trying to you know whatever is happening to him what that's trying to convey because yeah that was his

[00:11:03] you know wife and children supporting him on his big day the day that he chose the path of selfishness

[00:11:08] and ruthlessness to become a heartless evil man that he is today uh that really was the day that

[00:11:14] set that emotion but we will talk about that more later I'm sure uh but yes so just last thing

[00:11:20] on that is the line that he has about his ghosts the ghosts of his children they've been appearing

[00:11:25] throughout all these episodes I just again quotes there's so many quotes because they've been at me

[00:11:30] all night making sure I get their stories right which is it's fantastic as my personal hell is being

[00:11:36] micro managed um so many great lines so many yeah so yeah I just wanted to point out those scenes and

[00:11:48] talk about that because they've been the through line I mean there's been a lot of through lines

[00:11:52] throughout this whole show that was definitely kind of where the story really started is this

[00:11:56] Roderick retelling the events to August in this confession and there's been some really good stuff

[00:12:03] all through this series in those scenes still going to point them out again because they're always

[00:12:08] important like they are always important uh and what I found interesting was

[00:12:18] and we've guessed a few times whether or not Depend can actually hear anything or see anything

[00:12:23] and come to find out that no he hasn't seen or witnessed anything that Roderick is seeing or hearing

[00:12:28] except for the noises in the basement uh but other than that it's all just been uh from Roderick's

[00:12:35] viewpoint only with the exception of the clock yeah so I found that interesting I don't I don't know

[00:12:43] that it means anything or not or if after all this time now it's starting to kind of break through

[00:12:50] enough whatever these whatever it is that's coming through to Roderick it's finally come through

[00:12:57] enough for Depend to hear it too I found that part interesting because I'm like oh he can hear the

[00:13:04] clock too and he's pretty freaked out about it um now he couldn't see Annabelle or the image of

[00:13:11] young Freddie there um and then what I also found interesting was Roderick's comment about

[00:13:19] you know seeing the the his children who are dead so we're gonna say I guess for the sake of

[00:13:25] argument ghosts that keep popping up and making sure that he's telling their story straight

[00:13:32] but he says he makes a point to say you know this cataclyl it's it's it's hell but this ain't it

[00:13:39] like what these like visions are not attributed to my diagnosis because I think we've talked about

[00:13:46] that like well is he really seeing these things I mean and I don't know that and I don't know

[00:13:51] that him saying that proves it one way or another but I just found it interesting that he's saying

[00:13:56] the distinction he's like yeah I have all of these issues because of my diagnosis I can have

[00:14:01] hallucinations or see your hear things but this is not the same thing so I find that interesting

[00:14:08] that we're we're kind of hearing him say that out loud now whether or not it's true I don't know

[00:14:14] but at least it's like being acknowledged yeah throughout all these like him telling the story so

[00:14:20] we're kind of seeing in that sort of flashback is we're watching the deaths of all the children

[00:14:24] happen this all in the aftermath of all that keeps telling Madeline it's because of the cataclyl

[00:14:30] I'm having hallucinations none of this is real there's no you know there's no curse that we're

[00:14:35] under you know this I'm not seeing these things or that thing it's it's this so for him to

[00:14:40] be kind of singing a different tune here with August saying no this is not the the diagnosis

[00:14:45] this isn't the mention this is something this is my reckoning said mm-hmm yeah very very interesting

[00:14:55] okay that was really great so you mentioned the flashback that is my first point is what turned

[00:15:04] Roderick and I've been questioning often on as we've been covering the series

[00:15:11] and I kept saying what where and what happens for Roderick to turn into this who seems to be a kind

[00:15:21] caring compassionate person and I think depend has a bit of a point like how could someone like

[00:15:30] Annabelle Lee like love you trust you and all of that if there wasn't something within you right so

[00:15:39] I feel like they're had to be a part of him there so what the hell you know happen to this

[00:15:44] kind compassionate loving father husband who at least what were shown anyway

[00:15:50] to then turn out to be the Roderick that we saw present day who is

[00:15:56] absolutely terrible I can't even think of other words to describe there's so many but that's

[00:16:01] all that's coming to me at the moment I mean he's he's he's pretty accurate I think is to what

[00:16:06] Juneau called him as a monster and I think with the exception of some of the parts where we've

[00:16:12] seen him interact with depend where he's finally getting that reckoning where he seems to like

[00:16:18] like wow I I screwed up we finally get to see that and and what happened I think there's more

[00:16:26] to see that hopefully we'll get in the next episode but we get to see the sin he committed

[00:16:33] that I think started this turn and I didn't see it coming I don't know if

[00:16:41] it was as plain as data everyone else or if it was just missed entirely by me but I totally

[00:16:47] didn't see this coming when depend has talked about losing his job and what was at the last episode

[00:16:52] when they were talking about Pym it still was not a clue that this is what was going to go that this

[00:16:58] is what was going to happen yeah that this whole deposition that they're practicing for

[00:17:04] that it wasn't going to happen the way that they were planning it out like this whole time

[00:17:09] I mean Madeline and Roderick have been like she's been whispered I know it was all her this has

[00:17:15] Madeline all over it I mean we've seen throughout the whole season how Madeline keeps whispering

[00:17:22] you know to Roderick and telling him this is what you should be doing I mean this has has her

[00:17:27] footprint all over it and I didn't see it coming did did you know that this was okay

[00:17:35] it was a good twist yeah it was really good you know something happened and they kind of on

[00:17:39] second watch again today to announce you kind of see Dupin like reference it because you know he's

[00:17:45] he's talking to Roderick there she's like again mentioning those like and then after I lost everything

[00:17:52] after what it they're kind of talking about it's like what what happened and then it kind

[00:17:57] of makes sense once you see you're like oh that's that's exactly what it is it was all this kind

[00:18:02] of long con on on Dupin even that I don't know I feel like yeah definitely orchestrated by Madeline

[00:18:10] that is her scheming that's her style but then a part of me also wonders like maybe this whole team

[00:18:16] player speech from Gris you that we saw even earlier on maybe that really did stick maybe there was

[00:18:22] this selfish entrepreneurial kind of like shark mentality within Roderick that really took that to

[00:18:31] heart and maybe maybe that's stuck with that as well yeah well I'm really curious to see if we'll

[00:18:38] get that interaction or whatever it was that cemented Roderick's decision in betraying Dupin during

[00:18:46] this deposition you know is did that have something to do with it and you're right it could when

[00:18:53] they're talking like hey Roderick's gonna get fired and he's gonna lose his job you know

[00:18:59] and Annabelle's pleading with Dupin like will you have our back when this is over because he's

[00:19:04] gonna get fired and I mean they're already struggling financially and they have two young children

[00:19:11] and she's very worried about you know their future and being able to care for their family and

[00:19:15] he's like you know yeah I'll I'll help you so clearly if something happened to them in that way

[00:19:24] hey what would they do right so was was the threat of you know not being able to support his family

[00:19:31] the threat of him getting fired but also like Madeline was telling Annabelle like they'll see

[00:19:38] you into the ground yeah you know you'll have absolutely nothing was that it was it also Madeline

[00:19:44] whispering in his ear you know this is how it's all gonna go you know she says later in the episode

[00:19:52] and I know we'll get there but you know she's like I've played out every scenario and I you know

[00:19:56] and this is the only outcome I think she was doing the same thing here in this flashback as she

[00:20:02] is playing out every scenario that if you don't do this this is exactly how it's going to play out

[00:20:10] this is the only way forward this is the only way for us to win um but I I think that in the

[00:20:16] beginning at least in these flashbacks she was more power hungry than what he was I think he

[00:20:24] he I think he wanted to be because Madeline was and he thought he should be that way too now I

[00:20:30] think he got there eventually maybe through Madeline and throughout the years but I think in the

[00:20:34] beginning these flashbacks she was the one that was more hardened um more power hungry and was

[00:20:40] you know using Rodric to kind of get there yeah in that way she is very much the textbook

[00:20:46] definition calculated very much yeah very much but I I liked I liked seeing all that I'm glad we got

[00:20:56] a bit of a reveal I'm glad we got some insight to that I hope we learn a little bit more about

[00:21:00] how it came into play and then of course the outcome of that and there's a lot I think this

[00:21:05] is going to happen next but it was definitely I think a big starting point of where we get started

[00:21:12] with this whole thing in this whole story and how we got to where we are in present day so really

[00:21:17] good stuff right I want to point out like some just really great acting choices on there first

[00:21:23] Zach Gelford again it's great with the story but then you see like when the episode first starts

[00:21:29] is they're rehearsing you know this like role is witness and he seems uh Rodric does like young Rodric

[00:21:35] seems very stressed and like oh it's so much for me and you're thinking oh he's about to lose his

[00:21:40] job because he's doing the right thing for other people and it's like no it's actually because he's

[00:21:45] has been building some of somewhat of a bond with Dupand even you know where Dupand kind of comes

[00:21:50] out to him as gay as I you know I am married to a man and you know there's this in the way that

[00:21:54] there's kind of this like understanding and bond and comfort between them and he knows he's about

[00:21:58] screw him to hell and I think that's also weighing on him and I think there's a lot of that in the

[00:22:04] subjects of the way he was performing there which was great it was great that's I think you're

[00:22:10] exactly right and it makes sense by the end of the episode because you would attribute how

[00:22:16] he he was acting in that scene to the stress of the enormity of what he's getting ready to do

[00:22:23] he's gonna be a whistle I mean that's I can't imagine being in that kind of a position being a whistle

[00:22:27] blower to this huge company he could lose everything all these bad things could happen so you're

[00:22:32] like oh that's why he's acting that way that's why he acted out that way towards Freddie but it's

[00:22:36] like no sounds like it's more of that he's very uncomfortable with what he knows he's gonna be

[00:22:41] doing in that in that room during the deposition you're right yeah and then the other shout out

[00:22:46] obviously to Machin Goodwin that played the young August Dupand as well in that deposition scene

[00:22:54] when they're in the boardroom wherever with the lawyers on both sides and Roderick starts yeah that's

[00:22:59] my signature and then when it starts flipping and he realizes the emotion on the face of Machin Goodwin

[00:23:06] as Dupand there without saying many words at all he's just got a few little whispers or a few little

[00:23:11] what about this but it's all the face acting where you see the emotions go change as everything

[00:23:18] that he's been working on is just being tanked in front of him where there's confusion to concern

[00:23:23] beer hurt sadness anger pity it's all like flashing across in different forms as he realizes

[00:23:30] what's going on and what Roderick is doing to him and I I had to just like keep watching that over

[00:23:35] because it's like man just the face acting on that alone again very very impressive

[00:23:42] I 100% agree everything was all those emotions conveyed on his face in just a short amount of

[00:23:49] frames there in that scene as he's getting stabbed in the back by someone he thought was I mean

[00:23:57] I don't know if friend was is maybe a stretch but someone he was building a rapport with and

[00:24:02] seemed to have like a common bond and they seem to have similar backgrounds they seem to have

[00:24:09] some commonalities and then you know boom you get stabbed in the back yeah that was he did an amazing

[00:24:15] job for sure but that was so far at least just my first point anyway just getting to see this

[00:24:23] this turn this sin Roderick committed that marked his turn into the the the guy terrible

[00:24:32] person we see today so what's your next point all right the next I want to talk about another not

[00:24:39] really arc just kind of the story we get this episode of Madeline talking more about Madeline you

[00:24:44] talked about how you felt that she was definitely more power hungry and more kind of you know

[00:24:52] the one pulling a lot of the strings and then you know Roderick definitely did come into his own

[00:24:56] CEO but we see here in this episode that she definitely still has that that hunger and that crave

[00:25:04] for power where when she realizes what's going on even after all these years she's ready to just

[00:25:11] throw Roderick under the bus throw him to the wolves do whatever she can that's why she goes to

[00:25:16] meet with Werna is she's like okay that's Roderick's situation you know what he can pay for whatever

[00:25:20] was it his deal or was it already like maybe it's just him and I can still come out on top with this

[00:25:25] she's still she's just vying for her own protection her own power she's talking to to him

[00:25:32] where she's ready just oust him right behind his back use the board's distrust and his diagnosis

[00:25:37] all against him and just I'll take over leave him out you know whatever happens happens let the

[00:25:41] cards lie where they fall and you know I'll move the company out of pharmaceuticals and into

[00:25:46] technology and I'll be the new face and CEO and you know she has this like oh it's the hardest

[00:25:51] thing I've ever had to say like she's like oh it's my twin brother and I love him but like really

[00:25:54] if you're looking at her she's ruthless she doesn't really yeah maybe it'll make her a little sad

[00:26:00] to treat her brother this way but like if she gets the power at the end of the day that's what

[00:26:04] she's after and so I think she still definitely has that in her and we see that this episode

[00:26:13] she does I said early on I don't remember which episodes specifically but it was early on that

[00:26:18] I felt very much that Madeline was the the brains and the motivations behind everything that we're

[00:26:26] seeing unfold throughout the series and it's definitely so clear in this episode and exactly

[00:26:33] what you said and I want to believe that with how she was willing to throw Rodric under the bus

[00:26:44] go and negotiate on her own behalf just be like hey you know like you said this this is all

[00:26:48] Rodric's thing let's let him just handle and handle all of that and deal with that let's talk about

[00:26:54] me now I want to renegotiate our terms here and and make sure that I still come out on top

[00:27:02] I still want to believe that she does love her brother now maybe it's in her own twisted

[00:27:10] screwed up way because I do feel she had emotion there when she was talking to Arthur and saying you

[00:27:18] know it's the hardest thing I've ever had to say out loud it sounded like her voice was cracking a

[00:27:22] little bit there like she like there was something behind that some real emotion real sadness or

[00:27:27] whatever it was within her that she is sad about her brother they do seem to have you know they

[00:27:34] Rodric and Madeline are the only two in the world it's like they're in their own little bubble

[00:27:38] in fact that I would almost go as far to say their relationships a little creepy and a little bit

[00:27:45] closer than maybe brothers and sisters should be I don't know maybe it's a twin thing I don't know

[00:27:52] but they do have a very kind of like unique brother sister relationship yeah so I want to believe

[00:28:02] that she does love her brother but with the way that she went at him in this episode I don't know

[00:28:09] she was free and ruthless she was definitely all about Madeline and looking out for Madeline

[00:28:16] in this in this episode yeah with her going to speak to Werner which she took off the wig it's

[00:28:24] getting serious it was an interesting scene I was like okay that really threw me I had been wondering

[00:28:31] if she and I didn't know if maybe it's just the actress wearing a wig for the part which is

[00:28:38] totally fine I'm a fan of wigs so I don't mean any negativity about that at all so I when she

[00:28:47] did that I was like oh my goodness is she is she going to like is that all of her hair that she's

[00:28:51] getting ready to take off is she what she got going on under there and no it was just some bangs

[00:28:57] and like a front piece but I I attribute it to like a part of her mask like she was removing

[00:29:03] a mask it's how I took it it fits her character a lot I mean that's what like Werner tells her as

[00:29:08] you're just like wearing a mask under a mask under a mask kind of because this is just what you are

[00:29:13] and that was that but then also this obsession she has with immortality were like even like

[00:29:17] these small little things just like just this little hair piece who likes me look that much younger

[00:29:21] and that's why I can't keep doing it and it's this it just it's that's her personality and her

[00:29:28] way so I thought it was interesting that yeah they just had that little moment of her removing that

[00:29:34] and kind of this vulnerability of like all right cards on the table let's take care of business

[00:29:39] and she goes to Werner there um interesting stuff in the house where she also hears sounds from

[00:29:45] the basement are this is before Roger in August were there uh but the sounds that she's hearing

[00:29:51] are those bells the same bells from behind the orchinato basement wall I believe so interesting

[00:29:58] interesting and then Werner says something to her about oh Roger has been coming and bringing more

[00:30:01] and more boxes and stuff down there which again what the heck I know that's in one of my nose

[00:30:06] what the hell is in the boxes why is it moving boxes into the basement what does that mean uh

[00:30:12] and then so again she's very like powerful she's trying to be on top and then I love the shift

[00:30:19] her entire demeanor changes while she's at the house is it's the moment after she snaps Werner's net

[00:30:26] and then Werner from behind her just like oh I'm sorry that's right that was too far in like realizing

[00:30:34] at that moment the Werner still alive Werner still there but Werner is something else

[00:30:39] I'll say what is Werner and you see her where she turns and she looks and goes I apologize

[00:30:47] and sits down and when her demeanor changes at that you realize she can't negotiate herself out of this

[00:30:54] for the first time in probably a very very very long time Madeline has no power she does not have

[00:31:02] the upper hand she's not in control and you see everything about her shift and change at that

[00:31:07] moment and I thought that was great there's a lot of great like body acting and face acting and

[00:31:13] just like performances in that uh I've got more thoughts about that scene but it's more on the

[00:31:20] Werner side of things so I'll come back to it I'll circle back around but sweet but yeah and then

[00:31:24] again this control over Rodric is at the end at the episode where she comes to him down in the

[00:31:30] basement as Freddy's dead that means it's just two of us left you remember the deal you remember

[00:31:36] the terms into the world together out of the world together or there is no deal and she's quoting

[00:31:42] Werner there so I'd again very intriguing I'm like okay so there was a deal made

[00:31:47] and they should have known the terms it had to do with the two of them left so there's a lot of stuff

[00:31:52] that we've kind of wondered about or talked about but haven't seen and still really haven't seen

[00:31:57] so I'm still curious to see if we'll get that full conversation between them and Werner in the finale

[00:32:02] I don't know but we got a lot of it there uh and then this is where again that power kind of thing

[00:32:10] that she has and she says oh you're gonna be the hero you're you're helping all of us but

[00:32:16] but is it really you're helping me this is my way out of it not your way out of it my way how do we

[00:32:22] make how do we end this which says it's the only way for for what or anything that Rodric would want

[00:32:29] to happen is it the only way for her to remain in power on top is she being selfish in this moment

[00:32:34] not sure but I wouldn't be surprised knowing Madeline um but yeah she convinces him to just OD on

[00:32:41] this entire bottle of ligadone it's the only way whatever that means and he does he does it and he

[00:32:48] would be dead except Werner's got other plans uh so more intrigue but yeah and then the last thing

[00:32:57] we get of her in this episode of course is before she walks off before we get that Werner reveal

[00:33:02] at the end we hear Madeline hears the bells behind that wall and it's the first time this series that

[00:33:08] she's heard them or at least that she has acknowledged that she hears them we've seen Rodric listening

[00:33:13] to him a lot throughout the series but it's the first time they jingle or whatever and she's

[00:33:17] the one that's hearing them and acknowledge it so that's how interesting yeah very interesting

[00:33:25] and yeah it's a good point is it the first time she's actually hearing them or just the first time

[00:33:29] she's acknowledging that she's hearing them because maybe she wasn't willing to play into

[00:33:36] you know what Rodric was saying before because she wanted to keep him on track with everything

[00:33:41] that was happening to the family and the company and you know things like that she's like trying

[00:33:47] to keep him on the straight straight and narrow but yeah good point

[00:33:51] yeah the the pact was my second point so I'll just add to that and then I'll go into one of my

[00:33:59] notes as a point I think you said a lot because we don't we don't really know a lot so you said a lot

[00:34:05] of what you know I had it in my point as well but it was interesting to at least confirm anyway

[00:34:13] that there was some sort of pact between them I mean I think we've just been kind of assuming

[00:34:18] the entire season that there has to be something there that happened between them and it

[00:34:24] had something to do with New Year's which we still haven't got to so I really do hope we hear

[00:34:29] the rest of that conversation that we got with them were they they sit at the table and

[00:34:32] Vern is talking to them and kind of understand what it all means and yeah when she said into the

[00:34:40] world together out of the world together where there is no deal whatever terms of this contract

[00:34:47] you know that they have you know does Madeline think that him overdosing on Ligodone

[00:34:58] that if he dies and they don't leave the world together that it somehow makes the deal null and

[00:35:05] void or something like because if into the world together out of the world together or there's no

[00:35:10] deal so if they don't both go together no deal and Madeline wins like she can then

[00:35:18] come out of that is that is that how you were taking it that's what it seems like

[00:35:23] that's the angle it seems she's yeah yeah because she tried to read she tried to renegotiate

[00:35:28] with Vern and that didn't work so sounds like this was her way of still screwing Rodric over

[00:35:37] and still trying to come out on top was by trying to somehow make the deal null and void

[00:35:43] if he if he goes out without Madeline it's the only thing I can think of and then of course Vern is

[00:35:49] like no no no no you're that's not how this works right but I'm so curious to see

[00:36:01] what happens does Vern is stay with Rodric here because what happened from that point

[00:36:05] to then where he goes to the house and depend meets him and we kind of get to where we are now

[00:36:12] you know she's had this hole in she tells Madeline like oh you know I'll talk with him later or

[00:36:18] you know we'll get there later and she seems already know you know oh this this will be

[00:36:24] set up for the boys later so she already knows that that's gonna happen yeah so interesting

[00:36:30] I just can't wait to see what happens next

[00:36:38] since she said most of my point there I'm gonna just jump into one of my notes it's gonna be

[00:36:43] short and sweet but it has to do with the color theory that I've mentioned often on

[00:36:49] you called it yeah Rodric's color is blue I think we had some other listeners and stuff too

[00:36:55] that mentioned they thought it was gonna be blue based on his clothing at least yeah so we did see

[00:37:02] a lot of blue in this episode he wears a lot of blue clothing throughout the series he is lit with

[00:37:09] blue when Vern comes to him there in the building and he's approaching his death blue I read can

[00:37:20] evoke beginnings we mentioned and I think this was way back in episode two mask of the red death it

[00:37:28] was Perry's episode yeah in that story those rooms at the mask were all different colored and

[00:37:39] the first room in the mask of the red death was blue which Fredrick's the first usher child so

[00:37:45] that checks out first room first child sometimes blue can represent purity the blue colors also associated

[00:37:57] with a deadly sin of lust but whatever I watch the scene a second time where Vern comes to him after

[00:38:07] he is then disabled by the night shade the room almost looks a little violet kind of purpley blue

[00:38:16] and violet is the color that represents the most deadly of sins and that's pride but violet also

[00:38:25] represents the color of kings and royalty which Fredrick being the family heir kind of fits as well

[00:38:34] so a little bit of color through there I have no idea if that means anything in the in the grand scheme

[00:38:43] of the series does any of that mean anything I don't know but it's really fun yeah it's attention

[00:38:51] to detail you know obviously all of these siblings had some colors you know that you can relate

[00:39:00] that whatever the colors might mean can kind of relate to the kids in some way so it's a nice

[00:39:06] little tie-in I don't know if it means anything to the grand scheme of the story itself and how it ends

[00:39:12] but I think it's kind of fun definitely a lot of blue for Fredrick's color in this episode

[00:39:18] so just thought I'd call that out yeah what's your next point all right I'm gonna dive into not

[00:39:28] the big big one but one that I want to talk about again um I'm gonna go ahead and just kind of like

[00:39:35] what I've noticed in this episode I think I think we got an answer without being given directly

[00:39:40] an answer oh okay what that means because you said you know who is Verna what is Verna I think we

[00:39:46] got the answer officially this episode without her spelling it directly out she tells Madeline

[00:39:53] I'll give you clarity and then when Madeline says I thought you're gonna say how you can give

[00:39:56] you clarity I didn't get that she goes oh it'll come to you so digging through some of the Verna

[00:40:01] scenes I think that's exactly what happened is you had to sit on it a little bit she she gave us

[00:40:07] clarity she gave us an answer on what she had in the poem yeah absolutely okay I think I know where

[00:40:15] you're going then I know where you're going let's let's do it so talking about Verna um of course

[00:40:21] we see and we'll talk about Freddie for sure later but we get the scene with you know while he's

[00:40:26] on the phone at his wife's bedside and he goes into that weird little trance which on first watch

[00:40:32] you like well that was weird but then yeah later we learned Verna was getting directly involved

[00:40:37] because you know uh you know someone is evil when the devil herself is horrified by your actions

[00:40:43] now again I don't know exactly if the who or what Verna is is the devil uh I just like that turn

[00:40:48] her phrase I saw somebody online saying I was like yeah that's great but when we get to again

[00:40:56] Madeline and Verna meeting up there's a lot of great stuff from Verna there I love the sass and

[00:41:01] it'll look the wording that she used in those scenes uh you know like the I gave you the address

[00:41:07] don't pat yourself too hard on the back uh it's just a nice snark yeah or that you know when

[00:41:15] when she's trying to negotiate and so well was that were those terms for for Rodric but not me

[00:41:21] and I love again the turn of phrase are you blaming Rodric or Redric uh

[00:41:29] and then a lot of those little cryptic things that she says you know the you know what I am and then

[00:41:33] even later saying I'm not a woman uh going on to say she's the witness of suffering which is a very

[00:41:41] intriguing thing to say uh you know I can see who someone was who they are and who they would have been

[00:41:48] uh I guess assuming that they didn't make some kind of deal with her then she sees what that

[00:41:55] kind of other reality would have been without that deal and she says the deal she made with Rodric

[00:42:00] and Madeline was to guarantee certainty which was interesting again what all that means um

[00:42:11] she says Verne or she says Rodric would have been a poet in his other life

[00:42:16] and say you know we're we're similar that way she goes language in its highest expression

[00:42:19] is musical and I was like okay Mike Lannigan uh that was that was a little

[00:42:26] pat on the back right Mike Lannigan was giving himself for sure I mean deservedly so

[00:42:31] the man is a master of language but uh yeah yeah I love that but yeah as you mentioned

[00:42:39] the poem she recites pose the city and the sea uh and that is the clarity

[00:42:46] that she's talking about she says that she wrote that to give Madeline clarity

[00:42:51] I referenced her as the devil earlier in that kind of little joke but I think she's definitely

[00:42:56] something else um she says that she wrote this poem as human started building city

[00:43:03] and the poem the city and the sea it is a personification of death watching over a city

[00:43:10] the city that it is created and how the city in a way is even more evil than hell because it holds

[00:43:17] death in reverence kind of one of the main like philosophical or whatever like suggestions about

[00:43:23] this poem is that it ends with the concept that death is worse than the devil so is Verne the devil

[00:43:31] or is she worse is she death uh I went there exactly yeah um at least it's my theory I don't know

[00:43:43] that obviously but I feel like we we keep getting these nuggets all throughout the series that tell

[00:43:50] us everything that we need to know without being obvious and I feel like that poem gave us a huge

[00:43:56] clue absolutely we keep asking that question and I feel like that that gave us the answer

[00:44:02] and then the clarity comes even a little bit longer with uh Frederick's death scene where

[00:44:08] she's sitting there with Freddie and has a lot of good things that she says to him you know the

[00:44:14] you dentist you would have been a dentist in the other life and a good one too it goes I guess

[00:44:17] that made what you did feel worse somehow uh you know and then the you had to bring her home you had

[00:44:24] to grab the pliers which oh chills yeah but but I think what really solidified this Verne is death

[00:44:31] idea is her saying you know you you've been scared all your life this and that you know and then

[00:44:38] with her saying to Frederick or Therothean she says but I'm finally finally here

[00:44:44] and yeah I mean what's there exactly exactly death death is there and I feel like the the way that she

[00:44:53] speaks about it like I could have done this anyway that I wanted to you know she says she says

[00:44:58] it to Camille you could have died in your sleep at home in your bed you know this could have been

[00:45:03] peaceful she mentions it a few times to the other siblings uh hints at it that it didn't have

[00:45:10] to be this way like their death was going to be inevitable and it is for everyone just let me

[00:45:15] be clear I know that but you know for everyone it happens but she has control over how it's going to

[00:45:22] happen you know and and when it's going to happen um and and that line with Freddie and when she

[00:45:32] says it to him I'm like she's saying it again like she is telling me that this could have ended

[00:45:38] differently you know you could have had a heart attack in your car which teed up nicely like she

[00:45:44] says with the coke and that he's just consuming obsessively and with that poem and I when I

[00:45:56] looked it up because I was like okay I'm a little bit rusty with my poetry so I did look up the

[00:46:01] summary for it and yeah exactly what you said it's it is that poem describes a doomed city of sin

[00:46:09] that seems to the bottom of the sea and it takes us through death's city he rules the place from

[00:46:16] a throne and towers over it giganically um the city is lit by nothing but light from the sea it follows

[00:46:22] the progression to see the towers the palaces um the spires and then towards the end of the poem

[00:46:29] a change comes over the ocean uh the city sinks slowly into the water consumed by the shining

[00:46:35] surface this um compares to a more terrible version of hell in the last lines a place that

[00:46:40] hell would worship is what I read so I feel like this is the only conclusion uh for me so I don't

[00:46:50] know well I guess we'll see in the final episode if if we get that finally in Serbed that's what it

[00:46:54] feels like yeah which I like you know she told Freddie that it could have been a different way

[00:47:00] but the one's different because you mentioned even with Camille he said oh you you can change your mind

[00:47:05] that I love that you know she really was in this episode Verna was very much like oh my god fuck

[00:47:10] this guy i'm gonna make sure he suffers because yeah like you suck dude yeah she gave all the other

[00:47:16] usher's those like last chance to do something different not Freddie she never gave him that

[00:47:21] opportunity and in fact it's the exact opposite she went out of her way to ensure that this was

[00:47:27] exactly what he deserved like um after his treatment of his wife with the pliers and everything

[00:47:33] that's where she's saying you had to bring her home we had to grab the pliers there was zero sympathy

[00:47:37] from death herself she was like oh no this guy's getting exactly what he deserved I'm not giving

[00:47:43] him a second opportunity because he is terrible yeah absolutely yeah I think if if he had made a

[00:47:53] different choice and left more in the hospital left her in carrying healing hands and had her

[00:48:01] best interest of heart instead of going down the path that he had he would have been presented

[00:48:07] you know with an option not that he would have I think taken it just like all the other usher siblings

[00:48:15] seem to continue going down that dark path and they ended up the way that they did

[00:48:22] but I think that it had he not made those decisions that he did with Mori and done what he done

[00:48:28] she would have presented him with a chance to still do the right thing but yeah even

[00:48:34] even that was too far the when death calls you out for being a piece of shit you got

[00:48:43] that's pretty bad

[00:48:44] yeah

[00:48:49] that is really great really great I just I want to say as a side note that if I could fall asleep

[00:48:58] every night to Karla Gagino reading poetry I would I would be extremely happy her or Bruce

[00:49:04] Bruce Greenwood I've really loved his quoting of various poem and especially Annabelle

[00:49:12] that was always one of my personal favorites growing up but yeah Karla Gagino quoting

[00:49:18] that poem was just yeah she's just a fantastic actress yes okay well I'm going for the big one

[00:49:31] all right I don't know if it's in your order if it's next or it's the last

[00:49:34] but it's the last one that I've got left it's a big one yeah I'm ready to go there

[00:49:42] with with my last point it's RIP Fredzo the Usher Ascended

[00:49:49] so Fredrick we've talked about him often throughout the series and as we've seen this progression

[00:49:58] since Mori's accident you know like and then when he's talked about bringing her home it's like

[00:50:03] oh my god why is he what is he gonna do why is he bringing her home this doesn't feel right

[00:50:11] and of course it wasn't nothing about this was right soon as he gets her home we can see this

[00:50:17] like this absolute madness that is bubbling under the surface with Fredrick and I've

[00:50:26] deduced this to feelings of inadequacy that has come to this crescendo of this full blown

[00:50:36] inferiority complex like this is how far far that it's gotten and I think that we get a good picture

[00:50:43] of that in the flashback when Depend and Rodrick are rehearsing for the deposition

[00:50:50] and Fredrick is playing with his little fire truck and the siren keeps going off constantly

[00:50:56] and Rodrick finally blows up at him and tells him to stop and essentially once Annabelle just

[00:51:04] to getting out of here like you know just will you come get him and take care of him I think we get

[00:51:10] a picture of it there and I think that in that moment and every moment since that time Fredrick

[00:51:20] has felt like he's in his father's way and that he can't measure up and all he's done is try to

[00:51:28] get love from his dad and I think he's probably even doing it in that moment where he's you know

[00:51:34] playing with this fire truck but if you can't get rid of those feelings you know feeling inferior

[00:51:43] then this is I think can happen you get this whole complex and I think he feels extremely inferior

[00:51:51] to his father and others around him I think even though he's older than his sister and even from his

[00:52:00] half siblings I think that Rodrick had some serious or had a serious lack of paternal instincts maybe

[00:52:11] I don't know we didn't see him a whole lot interact with his children I mean they were kind

[00:52:16] of around in there but we didn't really see a whole lot of interaction so I it's hard to

[00:52:22] to say what kind of a dad that he was we just kind of see this moment but I think that's what

[00:52:29] Rodrick or how Fredy kind of grew up with with Rodrick and then I think especially at this point

[00:52:35] when Fredy was so young and this is kind of seems to be around the same time that Rodrick kind

[00:52:40] of turns where we see this you know kind compassionate guy to now this ruthless person and probably

[00:52:46] also like whatever it is it happened to Annabelle Lee whether or not they just divorced and she went away

[00:52:52] which does not make sense I feel like something bad must have happened to Annabelle just as a side

[00:52:58] note because I don't believe she would ever abandon her children like how could she not be in

[00:53:02] their lives in some way so I do feel like something bad happened to her but the maybe the lack

[00:53:08] of his kind compassionate mother to his overbearing father who always made him feel inadequate and all

[00:53:17] I think he ever did was just crave his father's attention and the older that he got the less

[00:53:24] attention that he got and he it just developed all of this over time and in this scene or in a few

[00:53:31] of the scenes when Rodrick is telling Fredy hey you got a you got a soldier up which is so much

[00:53:39] of like what Rufus told Rodrick in flashbacks so to see this go from Rufus to Rodrick then to

[00:53:47] Fredrick you just really see that whole cycle yeah um so despite all of that though like when

[00:53:59] Verna tells him she's like you know despite all of that is no excuse for what you did right so

[00:54:08] I think that this whole complex that he has when he doesn't get what he wants and when he loses that

[00:54:17] control then that's how it manifested in this with with Mori and how he got so jealous

[00:54:28] uh over her going to this party and lying to him about it saying she was going to friends house

[00:54:33] and she ends up going to this party um and she never I don't know what she was gonna do when she got

[00:54:40] to the party you know um but regardless of what she did or what she didn't do

[00:54:46] did not deserve what happened to her I cannot imagine the absolute horror I mean when he grabbed

[00:54:51] those pliers and when I realized what the hell he was getting ready to do I was like oh my god

[00:54:58] like it was already totally um bananas that he was bringing her home not getting her any kind of

[00:55:04] treatment he's paralyzing her with this nightshade drug yeah um and then to do this

[00:55:14] it's scary to think how far he went and of course I'm sure the the drugs that he was taking just

[00:55:19] really brought it out to the surface even more and really escalated all of it um but yeah

[00:55:26] Freddie he he deserved everything that he got in that moment you know they were all terrible

[00:55:33] all the usher siblings were absolutely terrible but I don't know I think it was just really

[00:55:39] interesting to kind of see how Rodrick got to be who he was and at least that's how I think

[00:55:44] he got to that point anyway what are your thoughts oh I've got so many thoughts

[00:55:52] which uh yeah so I mean if I gotta just break it down like I do my point because yeah it's kind of

[00:55:59] talking about Freddie for sure but then as I like to do is really break down the title of the

[00:56:04] episode and you know what we get here the pit and the pendulum right um which I've been doing

[00:56:10] these finding these uh kind of synopsis of the stories uh which since I've been doing on this

[00:56:16] might be the last I feel like we might get one more in the finale because I have a feeling if

[00:56:19] they're gonna pull from a certain story actually there's like two stories they might pull from

[00:56:23] finale yeah so I might get them I'm not sure uh I don't go online because again I think I've

[00:56:29] called out before we even actually used to be an official podcast of the TV time app for a period

[00:56:34] of time um and so I uh still use TV time to kind of track stuff and I like to see what people are

[00:56:40] saying episode by episode when I watch so I will give credit to a user of the he may I think something

[00:56:47] like I don't know if they listen to this probably not but you know just in case hopefully I didn't

[00:56:51] butcher that but they're the one that has actually been I thought that maybe these were official

[00:56:55] Netflix or like house of us or like things but no apparently this user has been creating these

[00:57:00] themselves and been posting them on there and I've been using those so I'm gonna give credit to

[00:57:05] them for sure uh but yeah so the one here for uh the pit and the pendulum uh again just a little

[00:57:13] story about this you can see there where there's differences and then similarities but the pit

[00:57:16] and the pendulum is a short story written by a Grail and Poe first published 1842

[00:57:21] is a chilling tale of suspense and horror set during the Spanish in position

[00:57:24] the story is narrated by an unnamed protagonist who has been sentenced to death and find

[00:57:28] himself confined in a pitch black dungeon as he explores his surroundings he discovers a deep pit

[00:57:34] in the center of the room fearing falling into it he moves to the other side and stumbles upon a

[00:57:39] pendulum hanging from the ceiling slowly descending toward him as the pendulum swings closer

[00:57:45] the protagonist nearly avoids being sliced in half by smearing meat that his captors left him

[00:57:51] onto the ropes attracting rats that chew through them he's temporarily saved but then he faces another

[00:57:56] danger and a mint's heat that causes the walls to close in threatening to crush him just as he's

[00:58:02] about to be crushed French troops invade the dungeon rescuing him from his impending doom

[00:58:06] Frederick was not so lucky uh no the pit and the pendulum showcases Poe's mastery of suspense and

[00:58:13] the ability to create a sense of claustrophobia and impending doom and explore it explores the themes

[00:58:17] of fear torture and the triumph of human spirit and the face of extreme adversity again not so much

[00:58:23] for Frederick they took the the horror and stuff aspects of that without the uh the happy ending um

[00:58:33] but then I also realized that you know there's other stuff to this so then

[00:58:38] there's another short horror story by Edgar Allan Poe that is pulled

[00:58:43] uh for the story of ready and mori specifically and that is the story of Bernice or Baranice

[00:58:49] which is a short horror story by Edgar Allan Poe first published in the Southern literary messenger in 1835

[00:58:56] the story is narrated by aegis who is preparing to marry his cousin Baranice he tends to fall into

[00:59:04] periods of intense focus during which he seems to separate himself from the outside world

[00:59:08] Baranice begins to deteriorate from an unnamed disease until only her teeth remain healthy

[00:59:15] and aegis obsesses over when Baranice is buried uh he away uh yeah he continues to contemplate her teeth

[00:59:24] and one day he awakens with an uneasy feeling from a trance like state here's screen

[00:59:29] a servant reports that Baranice's grave has been disturbed and she's still alive

[00:59:34] beside aegis is a shovel a poem about visiting the grave of my beloved and a box containing 32 teeth

[00:59:45] yeah oh yeah was it an altowards box

[00:59:54] so yeah definitely another one that is pulled from heavily for this story as well not just the

[01:00:00] pit in the bingelon uh good call

[01:00:08] yeah so that's kind of like the main stories but then you had just other thoughts about

[01:00:12] Freddie in his situation i like that yeah beginning the episode opens with another foreshadowing

[01:00:17] now this time it's not just a sound like the shattering glass or the ticking heartbeat

[01:00:23] but it's this swinging pendulum on the tail of the cat clock that little Freddie is mesmerized by

[01:00:29] it's uh foreshadowing this grizzly fatie that is awaiting him many years later right

[01:00:34] it's a little dark uh yeah very dark but yeah i have that in my notes swinging

[01:00:43] the cats tail swinging like a pendulum the pendulum in the clock when depend and

[01:00:49] Roderick are at the old house the wrecking ball you can see it start to swing back and forth

[01:00:56] in the windows yeah that was so uh yeah it was really cool yeah Freddie just man

[01:01:05] yeah the torture of or Ella's just a whole new level like the wedding pictures tape all over the

[01:01:10] walls like pull on like psychopathic like serial killer mode it's raised like this obsession that

[01:01:18] comes from a that bear any story as well where it's just like intense focus and like out of body almost

[01:01:24] obsession and not himself he's got this session with the winning you imagine him asking an

[01:01:30] intern to like print those out for yeah he also has an obsession with the wedding ring which kind of

[01:01:45] did him in among other things i mean he was very special project for sure but you know because

[01:01:50] he goes back inside the building to look for that wedding ring uh now what he doesn't even get a

[01:01:55] chance to look he's trying to you know pay one last um disrespect to his brother and get stopped

[01:02:02] dead in his tracks but uh but i think this is in p but i think he was also going in to look for

[01:02:10] that wedding ring one last time which then just the evil uh that he has i mean with his you know

[01:02:20] he delivers threats with a smirk like you know talk about that wedding ring it's like if i find

[01:02:25] it i'll bring it back so if i don't find i'll get you new and but if i do i'll bring it back

[01:02:28] and i'll put it back on you and then if you ever take it off again i'll weld it to your fucking finger

[01:02:33] or when he's on the phone with the got the construction guy and like giving this little smile

[01:02:39] to mory as he's threatening to and i'll come over there and pull your teeth out with pliers like

[01:02:44] giving her this look like ha ha isn't that so funny and clever do you get it because i just did

[01:02:47] that to you ha ha ha like it's just evil um yeah absolutely diabolical

[01:02:56] you know has that even though other speech which i decided not to go word for word uh

[01:03:02] is it's a great speech even if it's absolutely horrible uh honestly just watch it against

[01:03:06] them and reciting it with a very short version he says you know we don't break the bond just

[01:03:10] crack it you want to test a bond in a relationship this put your house in order if you don't want to

[01:03:14] be consistently cruel be sufficiently brutal once i won't break our bond you already cracked it

[01:03:19] i don't want to be consistently cruel that's not me so i'll be sufficiently brutal once and then

[01:03:23] we can start to heal and then he pulls out her teeth with pliers because he can't stand that she

[01:03:28] was smiling in the security footage of the party like he's just completely gone off the deep

[01:03:36] in um now i think a lot of the mental stuff that plays in this you mentioned the inferiority kind

[01:03:43] of thing there's kind of a running theme in this episode of people going behind Roderick's back

[01:03:48] not only Madeline but also Juno for what's best for her but she goes behind his back try to

[01:03:56] get off the ligadone but there's also kind of an unspoken i read into it that Freddie is also

[01:04:03] stabbing his father in the back here because we have the moment where he's talking to Roderick in

[01:04:09] the office and he says you know if they call you just don't pick up that's the best message

[01:04:14] and if they coordinate in the street you tell him i'm Fredrick Usher i'm the repository of the hopes

[01:04:17] and dreams of a fucking empire so take your credit for this bullshit elsewhere can you do that

[01:04:20] as i can and then the next time we see him he's has answered the phone which he's told not to

[01:04:27] and he's giving this like watered down weaker version of that statement

[01:04:31] but also based on his response we don't hear what the board has to say on the other end of that

[01:04:36] phone but it seems like their pitch was to give Fredrick the CEO position have him replace his father

[01:04:44] as the head because when he gets off the phone he's like oh can you believe you know things are

[01:04:48] happening for me and then when he's on the phone with the construction crew he says i'm the Usher

[01:04:52] ascendant and he even refers to himself is already the CEO of the company now yeah like so it's just

[01:04:59] hot that yeah theme of like just going behind his father's back and stabbing it uh which seems

[01:05:04] to be the usher way for literally anyone they ever deal with or meet in their whole lives um

[01:05:10] including each other so

[01:05:13] yeah i picked up on that too i was like oh he's like madeline is looking to screw him over and go

[01:05:18] to the board and be like okay we're gonna push out Rodrick put place me in charge and you know

[01:05:24] we'll strip the you know the pharmaceutical side and become and rebrand as a technology

[01:05:32] you know a technological kind of brand and move forward with this AI but then you know Fred

[01:05:39] he's like oh well here's an opportunity you know the board is gonna vote all have them name me

[01:05:47] uh i don't think he's a match for Madeline though

[01:05:53] I know he knows that but yeah but he has the self inflated like ego

[01:06:02] you know to think that he would somehow you know be chosen right yeah i did pick up on that

[01:06:10] yeah and the last whole thing is about him of course you know let's go ahead and just get rid of any

[01:06:13] last remaining tiny bit of sympathy or care we could possibly have for Fredrick by

[01:06:18] having him be a threatening dick to his own daughter right uh wow nobody talks to me like this

[01:06:24] there will be repercussions i'll come back and deal with you although i will say i'd laugh

[01:06:29] it's again Henry Thomas our good best friend Henry Thomas and his delivery of things

[01:06:34] where that you know when she's talking about you know i talked to the doctor and they

[01:06:36] they'll accept her and they'll get her into this place and he goes why the fuck would you do that

[01:06:40] i'm sorry why the fuck would you do that sweetheart and i'm like oh much better that's

[01:06:47] that made all the difference yeah made all the difference yeah i i laugh he yeah he's

[01:06:54] he's done a really great job with the character and i sit here and wonder to myself is i'm watching

[01:06:59] him play such a despicable character and i'm like are you just really a thing to shed the whole

[01:07:06] hey i'm that cute little kid from et right or so because okay are you asking for roles and then

[01:07:14] Mike Flanagan's like i got you bro cuz he played a despicable character in jailed scheme too

[01:07:21] i won't talk about it or tell in case someone hasn't watched it please go back and watch that

[01:07:25] it's really fantastic um but i'm like you know are you are you just itching for these roles people

[01:07:32] are still referring to is the cute kid from eti i don't know i'll show them uh

[01:07:40] but yeah and then just his death uh we can go inside the building to look for the ring like i

[01:07:46] figured but uh you know he takes one little last bump of his uh white powder in his baggie and

[01:07:54] like he says to mory amazing how fast it works huh um this nightshade parallytic

[01:08:01] which dropped right the floor can't move can't speak but can see here and feel

[01:08:06] everything uh so brilliant what a great moment yeah not not a fun way to go out you know

[01:08:13] being completely paralyzed and then being slowly sawed in half by a giant swinging jagged piece

[01:08:18] of metal rest in pieces prodric um but yeah again it's just after everything that he did

[01:08:26] verna's like yeah no sympathy i could have made this easy on you but you don't deserve that uh

[01:08:32] which is interesting because we see when he was in that trance that verna was there i wonder how

[01:08:36] much more he saw i mean she clearly saw him kind of go into this weird trance and then like scoop

[01:08:41] nightshade into his baggie and like she's watching him put this parallytic into what she knows he's

[01:08:46] going to be snorning later mm-hmm and uh she can't say anything i don't know whether she would have

[01:08:52] anyway because karma uh you just finished ripping out her teeth so i'd be like yeah you get what you

[01:09:01] deserve sorry like i wonder if mory even saw verna standing behind him uh which is just like this

[01:09:09] nurses outfit which makes me think like that's probably how she would have come to him if she was

[01:09:14] gonna get him a choice is like if mory would have stayed in the hospital she would have been a nurse

[01:09:18] in the hospital that would have been like oh are you gonna do this or that or how are you going to

[01:09:22] treat your wife like i feel like that may have been the form she was gonna come to him in but then

[01:09:27] she kind of knew why he brought her home and knew what he was gonna do and was like yeah we're

[01:09:31] just gonna go full out on this guy no no worry about giving him any chances

[01:09:36] and you know what i find interesting about what verna said to

[01:09:45] Freddie when she tells him you know typically i don't get involved directly

[01:09:52] uh and but in this case because he got so violent and abusive she did step in like she did

[01:09:59] so then i think you know as we've talked about with some of the other siblings how much

[01:10:04] of a role did verna play into what happened to them like with

[01:10:12] vick or with tammy um trying to think about played out with the others but like vick you know we

[01:10:22] talked about they're at the end before she stabbed herself did which i still believe that some

[01:10:30] based on what she said to rod to rodric when she said i should have let you jump

[01:10:37] i still think that was verna coming out a little bit but i was the rest of it i guess vick like all

[01:10:43] of like that means that the other siblings really were just that messed up

[01:10:49] that she didn't have to intervene in any way to get them there she just simply put them in

[01:10:54] maybe situations that you know kind of put them in the situations but their actions were their own

[01:11:02] is what i'm trying to say yeah like even liao it's like she was there it was because of her that

[01:11:07] it happened but like he was reacting to her at any point he could have stopped he was doing and been

[01:11:14] you know more logic you know there's a lot of choices and choices that people made vick is an interesting

[01:11:21] one yeah because that shit but even like with tammy and stuff like there could have been a moment

[01:11:26] where tammy could have stopped smashing mirrors and had a like personal understanding of herself

[01:11:33] moment and like figured some stuff out and like stop like there's always like it's their own reaction

[01:11:40] so like she was definitely involved in all of them so she says i don't get personally involved

[01:11:44] oh she gets personally involved but like to this level where she literally took this guy's like

[01:11:50] brain over for a second to make him drug himself and then like puts him in position and it's like

[01:11:56] no i orchestrated this specifically where you have no choice exactly yeah i thought it was interesting

[01:12:03] that we kind of get that revelation so it kind of makes you you know think you know how much

[01:12:10] or what little she may have had to do with the others i mean obviously yes she put them in or help

[01:12:17] put get them in situations but they still could decide what how they were going to react or act in

[01:12:22] those situations and what they did was under their own influence versus any influence that she had

[01:12:28] over them and clearly she's capable of because we did see her do it with with Freddy so she's capable

[01:12:33] of like kind of forcing the hand a little bit um but but only with him did she do that because

[01:12:42] he's such a piece of shit all interesting thoughts

[01:12:51] i mostly just have notes left do you want to just cover your other points as notes or do you

[01:12:59] want to go ahead and continue with your points uh that's really all the points mean

[01:13:04] okay like i said i had like two other like it could be points but i say them for notes one of them

[01:13:08] being the flashback and stuff with Roderick that we you covered great so we're good uh

[01:13:14] so the other one was like a short one with like uh Juno just talking a little bit more about her

[01:13:19] again going behind Roderick's back the theme of the episode uh in being pissed off and people go

[01:13:25] behind his back um as she's trying to get off of the ligadone uh the family doctor so to speak that

[01:13:31] she sees you know says like oh can't say that she she should get off of it but but if she did it

[01:13:37] here's a certain way that she would have to do it you have to wean yourself off of it slowly over time

[01:13:42] with differing levels of withdrawals and severe pain and suffering for this drug that's totally

[01:13:47] completely non-addictive safe right um that's the theme hopefully nothing wrong going on here

[01:13:53] right yeah yeah and then she confronts Roderick with the same thing tells him even i want to get off

[01:13:59] of it and of course he's gonna react poorly to that as is expected she's his pet project his

[01:14:05] proof of concept he's you know she's a poster child yeah for yeah for ligadone yeah

[01:14:15] and she's tired of being that and again he explains how much of a nightmare it's gonna be to get

[01:14:21] clean from this completely safe and non-addictive drug no no no it's not addictive here's just all

[01:14:27] of the side effects you're like wait those are side effects of withdrawals and withdrawals

[01:14:30] from the addiction yeah sorry say again it's not addictive however there's all these side effects

[01:14:39] uh but yeah she's not gonna be this walking commercial that he wants anymore and i like that

[01:14:45] she's not taking shit she lays it right out and that's you know she's you're a monster you know

[01:14:48] that i'm married a monster and then his response is just awful where yeah we see who Roderick is

[01:14:55] because no deer i'm victor frankenstein you're the monster you are my perfect creation what was left

[01:15:01] of you after that accident was a corpse on a slab and ligadone was the lightning i threw the switch

[01:15:06] you set up and look it's alive he's so gross yeah and we see he never loved Juno for for Juno he never

[01:15:19] loved her for her for who she is what he loved was what she meant as PR for his drug she was a living

[01:15:26] testament to his brilliance and that's what he loved uh and then she gives just like the best

[01:15:32] mic drop kind of paraphrased or shortened i cut out some of the middle part of it but basically

[01:15:36] her answer then she goes three years okay i can do three years i will take three years of hell

[01:15:42] over lifetime with you easy and walks off which i want to feel like good for her exit stage right Juno

[01:15:49] never to be seen again except we know that the funerals of Freddie Tammy and Vic are yet to still

[01:15:56] happen and she was at those funerals so she does still come back and sit but what's she sitting on

[01:16:02] the opposite side of the aisle or next to him i'm trying to remember i i need to go back and watch

[01:16:06] i don't know yeah i don't or maybe we'll see it in the final episode i don't know if we see it

[01:16:11] again but yeah i don't recall but i do remember her being there so i was just glad to see her and

[01:16:20] also she looked healthy like the worst she got from that freaking mic stand

[01:16:26] right step-and-step episode was this like black eye which looked not as bad as i expected

[01:16:34] i expected her to be like completely concussed and have a huge like bruise on the side of her face

[01:16:39] but the damage actually looked fairly minimal for right you know that what i assumed for that

[01:16:45] type of injury getting discompletely whacked who knew that a yeah mic stand yeeted directly into her

[01:16:51] face was the wake up call she needed but it was i want to know who the hell was on

[01:17:00] their what 1300 milligrams of freaking ligadone oh yeah like she's on like the second highest dose

[01:17:06] that they've they've had who the hell was on on that match as she's talking with that doctor

[01:17:12] right crazy yeah i'm glad glad you know still with us and that she seemed to be okay

[01:17:20] and seems to want to get her life together like she was so perplexed that

[01:17:24] Roderick's like mad at her because she wants to get clean yeah

[01:17:33] yes that's uh i'm then the other thing i've just got a few other like little red notes

[01:17:39] i don't know if i can do those now or you we'll let you if you've got other notes too

[01:17:43] let's see yeah why not i only have a few i think that we haven't already talked about you you

[01:17:49] mentioned uh in the flashback to pen kind of just casually came out to Roderick this was in like

[01:17:56] the early 1980s that for someone at that time was a really big deal and that Roderick didn't have

[01:18:04] like a seven days i guess if this was before that's true nice and 79 wasn't it yeah 1979 almost

[01:18:11] 1980 that's that that was you know just not common at all and to see that Roderick didn't make like a

[01:18:17] big deal about it he was like chill so i love that i made a note i don't know that it's always but

[01:18:28] it's often are there pims always wearing gloves um i don't know why it may not mean anything maybe

[01:18:35] it just adds to his character this mysterious like i mean you know ambiance he has but he's often

[01:18:42] wearing gloves even just standing there in the board room and i'm like okay so he's not out i get it

[01:18:48] you know i like driving gloves if you're out just you know out out running around and i like driving

[01:18:53] gloves no he's inside in like the conference room and he's he's wearing these black gloves all the

[01:18:57] time i don't i don't know if if it means anything it just kind of stood out to me uh talked about the

[01:19:05] boxes with the hell of the boxes in the house um that's it we've talked about all my other notes

[01:19:12] already so yeah go ahead with yours uh all right just a few little things first uh we see the

[01:19:19] the office with Madeline Pym and uh Roderick standing there and just some some again turns a phrase

[01:19:26] the dialogue uh wording phrasing uh in some of these things but um first i just like the you know

[01:19:33] they're talking about the board and Roderick says we've got black male strangling the crib and

[01:19:38] Arthur's responses oh it's out of the crib it's starting college uh great Pym line um

[01:19:48] but then also to some of the the wording uh you know Tammy's dead so Roderick is pissed uh

[01:19:53] still doesn't want to listen to Madeline about any of the verna stuff his his airs on the board

[01:19:58] are disappearing now between Vic and Tammy and now um he's he could lose his place on top

[01:20:05] and Freddie is the swing vote uh swing uh very on the nose we're swinging in this episode yeah

[01:20:15] it's a type very on the nose and that auto corrected it first to end the nose which then I figured

[01:20:20] it was also fitting for Freddie so um he was definitely a lot in the nose uh

[01:20:26] uh also he just when they're talking about getting the board in line after Tammy's death

[01:20:34] and he what is what is the the turn of phrase that he uses with Pym to get the board uh in line

[01:20:40] is to break glass uh again phrasing too soon oh uh phrasing no it's and that brings up another thing

[01:20:48] like nobody's really mourning Tammy like she just died you know Roderick is going off about where

[01:20:56] the hell was security how did this happen Fredrick's like Tammy apparently killed herself by a fire

[01:21:03] poker I don't even know how the hell or what that even means right and it's like that's pretty much

[01:21:08] all the mentions that she that she gets and it's you know a little different than some of the other

[01:21:12] not that everyone was mourning all the siblings but there there was a little bit of at least

[01:21:17] something either from Roderick or Madeline or some of the other siblings Leo was slightly more

[01:21:23] compassionate towards the siblings you know um so yeah it was like oh Tammy Tammy's gone okay oh no

[01:21:30] it's the word vote you know yeah and then lastly I just wanted to talk about Lenore a little bit her

[01:21:39] she knows her dad is lying and she's worried as she confronts him and is kind of like yelling at him

[01:21:46] which then we saw how he reacts to that just very coked out and like threatening her

[01:21:50] uh she had no idea how bad things really were until you know luckily after he leaves

[01:21:57] she ends up having to break into her mom's hospital room which is funny that like that scene

[01:22:02] comes right after again Verna and Madeline are talking and she's like you come across a locked

[01:22:07] door you pride open and then it cuts to her pride open the locked door which is like that's fun

[01:22:11] yeah um which you know the fact that Fredrick locked that door is already a point of concern for Lenore

[01:22:19] so she just she breaks in there and sees the horrifying state that her mother has been left in

[01:22:24] and so just kind of sprinkled throughout the episode we do see that yes she calls 911

[01:22:30] paramedics and stuff come and rescue Mori thank god hopefully she gets some better care

[01:22:35] and some kind of healing can go to her I mean it's it's a lot she still got to go through but

[01:22:40] we see Lenore being there for her mom and it's again kind of pinpointing this the one good usher

[01:22:46] right I hope so but I worry about Lenore yeah and that's all the notes I've got

[01:22:58] good stuff very good stuff so much in this episode um it was interesting how they were able to pack

[01:23:07] all of that in and including you know Roger or um Frederick staff yeah excited

[01:23:16] excited to get to the next episode and see how this all ends up but first let's get to our listener

[01:23:24] feedback we got some really great feedback this week from our amazing listeners uh do you want to start

[01:23:29] us off sure start off with Alma Contreras who said oh probably the worst usher death can you imagine

[01:23:37] being aware but immobilized as you watch the pendulum coming for you eat I will probably have

[01:23:42] nightmares about this scene I do feel that Freddy's descent and the madness went pretty fast

[01:23:46] in Portland or watching that part I'm loving how this story seems to be taking its time to unfold

[01:23:52] plan again sure did a good job keeping us guessing and wondering this far into the story by the way

[01:23:56] I just want to let you know that I truly enjoy listening to pass so much guys are awesome thanks you are

[01:24:02] awesome for listening thank you what a lovely thing uh to say and just you know throwing that out

[01:24:09] there appreciate you Lindsay Schlich says me so much talking I was doing better with the episodes

[01:24:21] lately but man this one drove me nuts talking talking talking I love this talking

[01:24:26] I know I'm sorry Lindsay but you know last you know love this talking

[01:24:34] she goes on so we're Roderick and Madeline playing Augie the entire time if they were Roderick definitely

[01:24:42] had me fold I thought for sure he used to be a good guy I'm glad Lenore finally took charge

[01:24:47] and called the police took her long enough little Freddy tearing in half was pretty freaky the

[01:24:53] scares on the series have been weak for me so that one was probably the best I left out loud when

[01:24:58] Verna finished her five minute long monologue and Madeline said I thought you were gonna provide

[01:25:02] clarity same girl same Carla did look beautiful in her close-up I'll give her that

[01:25:09] Freddy's death was fantastic very much deserved horrifying to consider the drag switch so he could

[01:25:15] live out what he'd done to Mori was a nice touch pretty glad we're finishing up I'm not gonna lie

[01:25:21] Rema I also thought of hateable last week having an old friend for dinner oh yeah

[01:25:27] thanks I'm glad I remembered that correctly thank you Lindsay

[01:25:33] all right this one comes from Donnellism it derrites these episodes get darker and dark

[01:25:38] what a horrible way to go but it mirrors what Frederick was doing with his wife so it was appropriate

[01:25:43] even Verna sounded a bit shocked she orchestrated it she didn't give him a choice to back out did she

[01:25:48] like she offered some of the other kids I've really enjoyed watching Henry Thomas in this series he

[01:25:53] can play the sweet supportive father so well and then instantly switch to the nasty and indicative

[01:25:57] there way he pulls down the right side of his mouth really works for me I'm glad we saw the scene

[01:26:02] when he was on the phone and time stopped I noticed it and thought maybe my screen had frozen

[01:26:06] I thought he was giving Mori the cocaine he got from Leo where did nightshade parallel it come into

[01:26:11] it uh break into that to answer that was uh yeah Vic was using that her chimpanzee trials again I don't

[01:26:17] know how he got hold of that but that's where that came into the story bigger he just got access to

[01:26:23] anything at FortiNaro I'm guessing but she goes on to say I'm so glad that Lenore finally defied

[01:26:28] her father and is getting her poor mother out I didn't trust Lenore at the beginning but she's

[01:26:32] turning or really turning out to be the one good usher yet why does Roger keep ignoring her called

[01:26:37] where where he when he is with August I'm now wondering of the conversations that we

[01:26:42] and seeing between the two of them a hallucination I began wondering about this when August saw the

[01:26:46] clock pendulum moving because I don't think he saw anything up now that Roger can see

[01:26:51] Roger tells Ogi that he will have him dead to rights on two murders Annabelle Lee and Griswell

[01:26:57] apparently it's not Madeline Brichtep in the basement I was surprised by the courtroom scene when

[01:27:02] Roger totally pulled a rug out from under Ogi that he do that so he would get Griswell's trust

[01:27:06] in approval and so advance in the company I think this may be his first step being the kind young

[01:27:11] husband and father to the ruthless usher that we see being played by the screen and poor Juneau

[01:27:17] I'm rooting for her to get off Liga Don and get out of that family alive

[01:27:21] edit sorry this is so long I wanted to add what the hell Madeline sounds like she

[01:27:26] and Roger are supposed to go out together yet she tries to kill Roger Bernad is

[01:27:31] isn't taking that lightly I don't think since we see her bring him back can't wait to see how it all

[01:27:35] wraps up me too thank you Dawn

[01:27:42] next one is from Marine Favo says wow Madeline Verna face to face first ran through of the city

[01:27:50] in the sea I was too focused on images replayed to focus on words read it two more times to help

[01:27:56] it steep do we really know what Verna is now I've concluded she is death and her city is this

[01:28:03] earth where usher exists where hell holds it in reverence did you know Poe had published poem with

[01:28:09] previous titles of the doomed city and city of death no I did not whole episode was great definitely

[01:28:16] required multiple watches to get to depth lots of answered but still few questions left we still

[01:28:23] don't know terms of the deal with death Madeline trying to renegotiate means she thinks she can

[01:28:28] salvage what Lenore company legacy behind wall has to be ruthless right has to be murder

[01:28:37] Roger confesses only explanation for how Roger got to power betraying to pen open doors at

[01:28:42] fortuneato but something else got him to power pym and verna meeting we have been teased can't wait

[01:28:50] how remitting remaining usher's meet their death what happened to Annabelle Lee Rodrick must have

[01:28:55] destroyed her because that explains Tammy and Freddie so many questions about Freddy's crazy

[01:29:00] what is with the photos did he really call himself Fred so usher ascended he certainly did

[01:29:08] the teeth establish authority whole discussion with Lenore sweet heart cringy also exceptional

[01:29:15] acting can't believe verna caused him to dose himself with nightshade parolitic and

[01:29:20] more witness to happening karma think we need to rank the deaths at the end of the series

[01:29:26] Tammy's still slightly holding first place for me point of view of Freddy's was amazing

[01:29:31] haven't discussed this much but Flanagan's use of time shifts to tell story is remarkable

[01:29:35] when confusing it as purposeful he had flashbacks and always had preview of kids death

[01:29:40] with depend discussion before showing us wondering about Madeline's timeline in this episode

[01:29:46] did she talk Rodrick into taking pills before she met with verna or after she doesn't have her

[01:29:52] bangs hair piece when talking to Rodrick by wall so is it after and Madeline's takeaway from

[01:29:56] verna meet was to control or spare Rodrick's death how will Rodrick die another assure resurrection

[01:30:03] so looking forward to your takes thank you yeah thank all good thoughts and observations

[01:30:12] all right and we got one email from Daphne always coming through the emails

[01:30:19] uh says hi remain pake r-i-h rest in hell Frederick usher he deserves everything that came to him

[01:30:25] this episode the pit and the pendulum is perfect for his demise and how it was creatively added

[01:30:30] was fantastic he turned out to be a vial specimen of a man who was irredeemable seeing Rodrick throw away

[01:30:37] all the work he invested in with do pan was heartbreaking especially for Annabelle just reinforces

[01:30:42] that Roddy and Madeline were only really committed to each other and they just thirsted for power

[01:30:46] at any price however you question the commitment when in the present day Madeline finally makes the

[01:30:51] power play to take over the company while Rodrick continues to decline it all makes you wonder

[01:30:56] just how different things would have been if Rodrick had followed through with do pan's plan

[01:31:00] i've come to the decision that Rodrick and Madeline deserve everything that verna has planned for

[01:31:05] i only hope that it doesn't cause harm to the nor or more devastation from her ela they have been

[01:31:10] through enough one more to go can't wait to find out what the deal was there what deal was struck

[01:31:14] between the raven and the esters and why all of this happened

[01:31:19] yeah same and i want to know and maybe it's not important but when verna talks about what

[01:31:29] Freddy was gonna be she said Rodrick was gonna be a poet a broke poet but a poet nonetheless

[01:31:36] which makes sense when he spouts you know his poetry throughout the series she never says what

[01:31:42] malin was gonna be yeah curious doesn't speak a metal doesn't say what Tammy would have been

[01:31:50] um which i mean maybe not important and then it did it made me think i was like well what about

[01:31:55] them and then i was like well about the other kids and i was like i bet you none of the other

[01:31:58] kids would even have been born or exist past Tammy in that other timeline uh yeah i don't like

[01:32:04] likelihood that that's the case too yeah i wonder if that's the case too but i am curious because she

[01:32:10] didn't say out loud what because she's like i've seen who you were i see who you are now and i

[01:32:16] see what you could have been but she never mentions it like she did with Rodrick or ready so interesting

[01:32:24] thank you Daphne as always you have great observations we also have a couple of voice

[01:32:32] smells from Steve uh so he has a voice mail for last week's episode gold bug i'll play that one first

[01:32:40] and then he has one for this week's episode as well and i'll play that one um right after

[01:32:46] hello strange indeed this is Steve and this is for uh gold bug i don't know how i missed the deadline

[01:32:52] i think it's with the holiday and everything happening in my life you know everything is going on

[01:32:57] i just missed it but i watched the episode and well i wish i had been live steeting because when

[01:33:02] uh Rodrick has that that hallucination and he the body comes through the and all the glasses

[01:33:07] is around him and august doesn't see it with i'm sure i jumped by jumped i jumped when i was

[01:33:12] watching the episode so i'm sure i would have jumped on the live steve as well but uh to the moment when

[01:33:17] Fredrick his playing is bowling and he's got the bumpers up and he's bowling and he's an adult man

[01:33:24] who's bowling on his own bowling alley and he's got the bumpers up like he's a child uh you know um

[01:33:29] and then the reveal that he's drugging his wife to keep her asleep was just heartbreaking um and uh

[01:33:37] this week episode had some heart to it but also uh was another one where we saw

[01:33:42] Verna gave her chances you know pick up the phone call bill you know apologize and it won't be so bad

[01:33:49] for you and then i wonder what happened to Juno did she kill Juno when she threw that mic stand

[01:33:53] at her we don't we don't see all we see is it it cuts to um Tammy coming home so wow anyway

[01:34:01] i'm gonna watch the next episode right now and uh live steve it so uh talk to you later

[01:34:06] i don't think i heard some comments i didn't notice the bumpers either but that's an incredible catch

[01:34:15] thank you steve for pointing that and i just really sums up Fredrick's character

[01:34:23] oh gosh all right let's see what he thinks about this episode

[01:34:31] hello peykin reima this is steve and this is gonna be for the penultimate episode the pit

[01:34:36] and the pendulum there's a whole lot of peas right there penultimate pin and pin and

[01:34:40] i think i see where this marriage is going to go down the hill between him and anali uh because

[01:34:46] uh he's the pressure of being this kind of inside man is getting to roger young roger

[01:34:51] we see how much the wife cares about what's happening to rogerick and that he's gonna be taken care

[01:34:55] of afterwards she makes young august get his word where's maddie in all this

[01:34:59] let me figure out what rogerick did was he ended up not testifying or something like that taking a

[01:35:04] payoff and that left august exposed and why he lost his career and then he started coming after

[01:35:10] them so hard for these 40 years pit and the pinultimate i think that was the movie that

[01:35:14] Lenora was watching with her mom right the black and white movie the in the last episode okay so it

[01:35:19] looks like she just bruised her head do you know i mean i mean it was a pretty bad bruise but

[01:35:23] yeah all man he is just gonna he's gonna overdose her or give her an air bubble or something

[01:35:27] when you're all these drugs on this syringe oh did he cut her oh wow this Henry Thomas playing

[01:35:34] Frederick is just chilling chill Ling okay rogerick is playing the audience here now because all

[01:35:40] all these jumping that we've been doing when his kids confront him the ghostly delusions

[01:35:47] oh they're gonna show us the court scene i guess they just said the date so this is before

[01:35:51] the new year's eve party did we already established that and he's doing it he's not he's not

[01:35:57] doing what he said he'd do in rehearsal here in fact he's even throwing august under the bus

[01:36:01] completely here also now we have verna and madeline together how does she find this house oh this

[01:36:07] is the house where he's meeting with august and it's all dilapidated it's not i don't understand

[01:36:13] okay so it was some sort of deal struck on that new year's eve night and they were gonna find it

[01:36:17] out now gay rogerick you just listed all the things is gonna happen to someone when they try to come

[01:36:21] off drugs to juno yeah she knows okay so he just passed out and he told them five minutes sure

[01:36:28] they would come in after him right they wouldn't just start destroying the building oh so she's

[01:36:33] interfering she says she doesn't like the interview directly but now she is oh and as the ball swings

[01:36:39] just like the pendulum from the pin the pendulum oh oh i see it is an actual pendulum that he's got

[01:36:45] hanging over him oh from the way the raptors fell at everything oh man this is gonna split a

[01:36:51] bit half just like the the kid in the vision oh this is gonna be gross i was just with the

[01:36:56] in my recording but realized there's like eight minutes left okay wait is this really maddy

[01:36:59] that's giving him the pills or is it verna because it looks like it might be or did he what yeah i

[01:37:06] don't get it who's meeting with japan if rogerick is dead and what still we don't know what this behind

[01:37:13] the bricks is right i'm so confused oh verna's bringing him back to life oh sorry about how long

[01:37:25] this went but i guess now we're at the end all right thanks that was great steve it's like

[01:37:35] he'll get there he'll get there there it is yeah you're almost there yep thank you Steve that was great as

[01:37:45] always wow one more episode one more episode stick with us y'all and be sure to write in and

[01:37:59] let us know go stay on the journey with us because next week we are covering the finale

[01:38:08] episode eight of the fall of the house of usher titled the raven whoo whoo

[01:38:16] because of course it's gonna be titled the raven yes i don't know what that means but just so

[01:38:22] apropos since we're referring all of pose work i'm excited i can't wait to watch it later tonight

[01:38:32] um yeah as soon as we're done here that's running straight to living room nap flex hit play i need it

[01:38:44] don't forget the snacks don't forget the snacks oh yeah

[01:38:49] oh that might be a good idea i've got like a convenient store right around the corner maybe

[01:38:53] we'll get some ice cream or something i know it's like 40 degrees outside but you know what i can

[01:38:58] still have ice cream at that time uh ice cream anytime yeah i'm excited to get into that it's gonna be

[01:39:08] great of course hopefully all of you are riding it out the rest of us and we would love to hear all

[01:39:13] of your thoughts on that finale as well so thanks so much everybody for the feedback this week

[01:39:19] and i hope we get to hear from a lot more of you for the finale hopefully there's people

[01:39:23] just kind of been holding off so the last episode give us your thoughts on the whole series the

[01:39:27] whole the episode whatever you got love to hear from you on that one finale is usually real fun

[01:39:31] with feedback so hope to hear from you it'll be great and of course if you want to do that again

[01:39:36] on facebook email voice mails you can find out how to do all that on patastica.com

[01:39:42] and while you're there be sure to check out our other shows so what's up with run for your lives

[01:39:50] this week any updates or announcements yes we will be back on i want to say December 8

[01:40:01] i'm gonna make sure yes yes December 8 we will be back with the return of the new season

[01:40:09] we'll be covering some fun stuff i want to say because i think i yeah i think

[01:40:17] i'll go ahead and mention it maybe we haven't posted it on our stuff but

[01:40:20] oh are we getting a sneak peek because i almost dropped it last week and then i stopped myself

[01:40:25] yeah a great uh kind of indie uh horror comedy ridiculous movie tucker and dail versus evil

[01:40:32] i think is where we're gonna start off in this next season uh it's just it's a ridiculous movie i love

[01:40:38] it hopefully people have seen it i don't want to give too much away but it's it's kind of like your

[01:40:42] classic cabin in the woods like um slasher horror movie except it's not at all there's a huge

[01:40:50] comedic twist to it it's it's great uh awesome well that'll be fun for y'all's return after your

[01:41:00] little break so while you're there to be sure to check out run for your lives with pagan daffini

[01:41:06] check out the cast of us uh where jason and lucy are doing their walking dead rewatch they

[01:41:14] just released season one episode five so that's been super fun to kind of go back and

[01:41:20] and revisit um the early days of the walking deb um ben and mark our friends are covering monarch

[01:41:29] legacy of monsters on apple tv uh they just released the third episode um ben and christian are covering

[01:41:38] the revisited podcast covering um the rewatch of ted lasso oh so freaking good where in my

[01:41:45] ted lasso shirt right i only read my kinshi that but i got oh yeah i love it believe that's right

[01:41:54] so yeah um and then the uh buffy rewatch um there's a lot of awesome things happening be sure to check

[01:42:03] out all of our friends um we and they all appreciate it make sure go check all those out and if you

[01:42:12] find the ones you love which hopefully is all of us then make sure to give you know ratings reviews

[01:42:19] like follow subscribe whatever you do on your podcast player of choice that helps us out a ton

[01:42:23] and really yeah thank you in advance all right that is our show thanks for listening everyone

[01:42:31] until next time i'm rima and i'm big and chris lipo is strange indeed