585: "Beside the Dying Fire" (TWD S2E13 Rewatch)

[00:00:00] We're not splitting up. Please, keep your boy safe. I'll hide in one of the cars if a walker gets me so bit. I've lost my farm. I've lost my wife, maybe my daughters. You don't know that. They'll be here. And you don't know that.

[00:00:29] You're a man of God. Have some faith. I can't profess to understand God's plan. But Christ promised the resurrection of the dead. I just thought he had something a little different in mind. And I'm Lucy. And I'm Grace. And this is The Cast of Us, episode 585.

[00:01:31] And this episode we're covering The Walking Dead, season two, episode 13, Beside the Dying Fire, aka the season two finale. Some of you might have recognized that voice. It's our friend, Gracie Lu. Welcome to the podcast, Grace. Oh, thanks for having me.

[00:01:48] It feels so weird being behind the microphone. It's been like, I don't know, five years or something. I don't even know. We'll see if it comes back or not. I'm like geeking out. I'm such a fan. I'm just like, oh, when I was a little girl.

[00:01:55] Did you listen to Under the Comic Covers? Yes. Oh my goodness. Yes. That's how we got into Saga, which we were under the cover of. And I was like, oh, I'm so excited. I'm so excited. I'm so excited. I'm so excited. I'm so excited. I'm so excited.

[00:02:06] I'm so excited. I think I can say it's not where Andrea died. I remember writing in about that one. It was such a good podcast. Grace, I miss it. I do miss doing it, I have to say. And I miss Mr. Blog too.

[00:02:32] He wanted to jump on and give you a bad time, but I said no. No, I'm nervous enough as it is. I don't need any harassment. That's right. That's what I figured.

[00:02:50] Well, in case you didn't figure it out, Grace was an early listener of the podcast and you and I kind of became friends. You wrote in some fun stuff and then you ended up co-hosting Game of Microphones with us when we used to talk about Game of Thrones.

[00:03:06] And then you started Under the Comic Covers with Eric Featon, aka Mr. Blog, where you guys would talk mostly about image and other indie comics. And you guys actually were getting noticed by comic writers and artists.

[00:03:17] I saw like they would even ask, I think they would ask to come on and be interviewed by you guys. That was part of it. That was so fun. And when we would go to Comic Con and we would talk to them and like hang out, like literally

[00:03:30] hang out with some of these creators. It was mind blowing really. I mean, Chip Zdarsky, he's like writing all the Marvel comics now. He's like one of their top guys. And I know like didn't Eric kiss him on the head or something?

[00:03:46] Or he kissed Eric on the head? No, I think it was the other way around maybe. And also the main reason why I asked Grace to come on is because she's the reason that I got to be a walker on The Walking Dead back in season two.

[00:04:02] And she and I, you and I were there together for four 12 to 14 hour days, mostly at night filming the segment where the zombies storm Herschel's farm. And so I thought it'd be fun to cover the episode with you and then talk about our experiences filming it.

[00:04:20] Yeah, watching the episode like everything was like rushing back. It's oh my God, what a great experience. Yeah, yeah, such a good one. I figure we will go over the episode like we always do.

[00:04:31] But while we're talking, either one of us can feel free to mention any personal experience as we go along. But then we'll have a segment dedicated where we talk more about what the whole thing was

[00:04:42] like and some listeners wrote in some questions so we can answer those too. Oh fun. So it's The Walking Dead season two, episode 13. Beside the dying fire. I've been looking forward to this one. As always, what did you think in general, Grace guest of honor?

[00:04:59] Oh, um, you know, I loved it. And one of the most fun things of rewatching this episode is I didn't realize how much I had forgotten. So some of the some of the things that happened really hit me or some of the visuals like

[00:05:16] it just really hit me. I'm like, Oh my God, I forgot, you know, I forgot that was coming. And so part of it was felt new again. And you know, it's such a fun action packed episode anyway. But yeah, I liked it.

[00:05:31] You haven't watched in a long time, right? And did you you didn't watch any like, season two episodes to get ready for this or anything. This is just like, no, and that's like, I was gonna do that.

[00:05:43] And I was like, Oh, you don't have to and I was like, Okay, I don't have to. And then when I was watching, I was like, wow, that was a really bad idea. And for me not because I didn't realize how much you know, it made things fresh.

[00:05:55] But also, I was like, Wow, you know, there were some things I was missing out on. I'm just trying to get a sense of where you are. Because I decided a while back not to go back and watch any rewatch any early walking dead

[00:06:08] as we went along podcasting over the years because I wanted to do this rewatch and come to it after a long time away. So we have of course, you know, we're doing this rewatch. So we've gotten all the way through season one and two.

[00:06:20] But yeah, stuff I forgot stuff too. Like I didn't remember how much of a how fucking out of it Rick was at the end just so aggro you know, I did not remember I remember him saying this is not a democracy anymore.

[00:06:35] But in my mind, that was kind of a almost a strong powerful moment. And here I'm just like he's totally lost his shit. Everyone is literally like, Like who this guy like, what the hell are we doing? But anyway, I don't want to get too deep into it.

[00:06:49] I thought it was great. To me, this episode always felt like the zombie storm the farm and then some other stuff that I don't care about happens. That may be a personal thing. It surprised me how this and the story of the farms over by 50% of the episode.

[00:07:06] It surprised me too, given that we were so many hours on it. And then when we went back and watched it. It does even just trying to take an objective view, it feels like wow, there's this big climactic seasonal climactic moment.

[00:07:18] And then there's the aftermath, which is like the second, you know, 60% of the episode. It does kind of feel like almost epilogue kind of a feel. But it was really, really setting up for season three though, isn't it? It's really table saying, yeah. What about you, Lucy?

[00:07:34] Oh, I liked it. Yeah, we had fun playing spot Jason. Why didn't you just bite Carl? He was like that close. I'm like, I will ask. I will ask that. I definitely could have reached out and grabbed them, but I didn't want to get fired.

[00:07:52] So no, it was good. It's great. I think it's one of those ones that like knowing some of the zombie logic and some of the tactics of the group have now it's it's kind of like really that that lost you the farm.

[00:08:06] Like if that had happened in like season nine, you'd be like, oh yeah, that's nothing. But it also makes sense. Like one of the things Peter pointed out when we were watching it is like the greens haven't actually seen any of the devastation.

[00:08:18] So like the survivors that have come through Atlanta, this won't be the first time they've seen like absolute scenes. But like the greens and even Rick have not really seen chaotic downfalls like this because Rick was in a coma and the greens were secluded on the farm.

[00:08:33] So that kind of made me a bit more sympathetic towards it. Yeah, that's interesting you put that way, because I've always thought during the course of The Walking Dead, they always seem to come upon these people who somehow escaped a lot of trauma.

[00:08:46] You know, even in Alexandria, it seems like they were sort of secluded from it until until Rick comes and then the shit always hits the fan. But actually, even Rick is like that a little bit. He escaped it for that month there. The main part of it.

[00:09:02] Yeah, he did. Millions of people died. So Grace, then do you just want to sort of jump in? Or do you have points to go over? Oh, I did write down some points.

[00:09:12] But okay, well, and this is I don't know if this is smack in the middle or not. But one thing I really enjoyed this time watching was just the rise of Herschel.

[00:09:24] I was thinking of it as you know, and it's not, you know, just because of his badass rifle with, you know, unlimited bullets, but it was just it was really his determination and his strength.

[00:09:33] And I feel like it's really was kind of coming out for the first time or I really, this is where I started to get invested in his character. And I think part of it is that with TV Dale dying, TV Herschel kind of gets to step into

[00:09:51] some of Dale, comic Dale's characteristics. He's becoming more of that but I just liked his you know, this is my farm. I'll die here. And even if that wasn't the greatest decision, you know, he just had that determination and

[00:10:10] for looking at looking at for his goals and all that. And, you know, and he's funny because he still he was he's still Herschel and that religious guy and, you know, and I think that's really also why I liked to see this is because, you

[00:10:27] know, he starts off as kind of this crazy, you know, old man. But now we see more of the wise and old man come out. But, you know, we still we still have that Herschel, you know, he's still true to himself

[00:10:39] where, you know, Maggie's like, you know, she says a swear word or something when they're on their own. He's like, watch your mouth. I don't care if it's the zombie apocalypse. Yeah, he says we'll be sitting there having our asses hanging out or something with our

[00:10:53] asses hanging out. He's like, watch your mouth. But yet, like he's just visually the way he plants himself right front and center in front of his farmhouse. And he's got that magic shotgun and just blowing zombies away for a good portion of it.

[00:11:12] It just feels like such a strong stance that he's putting on, you know, and even when Rick's dragging him away, but it's my farm. But I got shot right in the head and he's standing there and you see all the Zeds coming

[00:11:29] up and the farm is burning in the background. And you can see my head framed by the loft that's on fire, the opening to the loft of the barn. And then Herschel shoots me and you can see the CG blood splatter as my head explodes and

[00:11:42] I fall to the ground. That was like the most I felt the most honored in that part because somebody did CG on me afterwards, you know? Yeah, I think that was one of the special things, you know, watching is getting to see

[00:11:55] our own heads explode at one point or another in the show. It was crazy. Okay, Lucy, what about you? I quite like the cold open. I'd forgotten about the cold open, but I loved the silent way that it followed the herd formation

[00:12:13] and it kind of tied seasons one and two together because I'm pretty sure they were eating Rick's horse when we first see them and going through the timeline. That would make sense because we see a very prominent bull moon in last week's episode

[00:12:29] and again in this week's episode. And as the zombies are moving, you see the moon getting bigger. Like there's a point where it's a half crescent moon and things like that. And I'm like, Oh, that's actually quite a neat way to track the time because Rick's

[00:12:40] been awake for about three weeks. So we're seeing, I think, three weeks of herd formation here. So they start by following a helicopter, which Rick saw in or at least he saw a helicopter at the start of that series premiere. Yeah, he did.

[00:12:57] So then we see them start to fall that we see them walking on the highway. We see them scattered in a field near the farm and then they reach a fence and sort of the dead mass collapses it.

[00:13:06] I think it says trespass is your ass, which is quite funny. I don't know if that's a Herschel sign or not. And we see them kind of dispersed Maggie probably. And then the gunshot. So it's Carl shooting Shane that gets their attention.

[00:13:24] And then we see this amazing shot, the reverse of what we saw at the end of last week's episode with Carl and Rick from behind on the farm in front of them and this herd towards them.

[00:13:34] And I think the introduction and Rick like Rick Carl's like, what happened to Shane? Like why did you do? And then Rick's like, Oh, thank you. There's a herd of zombies here. I think like the introduction of herds as well starts to up the stakes a little bit.

[00:13:54] And we see, I think at the start of season three that herds, they start getting cut off from certain routes due to herds forming and things like that. So herds are something that are going to come back again and again throughout the show.

[00:14:06] And this is the first one that we see. And I like that we get to see how it comes to be. Is it herd or horde? I'd say herd. It wouldn't be a horde. They call them herds.

[00:14:13] A horde is more like, it feels like an active group of crazy warriors or something. A horde of monsters. But herd is more like animals, you know, more mindless, I would say. I think that tracks.

[00:14:33] So yeah, for me, I thought the cold open was actually a nice way to sort of situate how did we get here? How did this happen? And it seems logical to me that over the course of the three weeks that that could have come

[00:14:43] to pass and they could have masked together. So I like that they answered that question that they'd only just asked. You just cleared it up for me because I stupidly had just been thinking this all happened within

[00:14:56] a day or something, but no, it took a while to get there. Yeah, I think what I liked is that they showed it kind of incrementally. Like it starts with just a few following the helicopter and then they kind of gather

[00:15:10] more momentum and they're clearly quite aimless until they hear a big noise or something to drive their attention. And yes, it makes to me seems reasonable knowing what we know about where the group have traveled from and so on. So yeah. Yeah.

[00:15:25] I wonder if Gimple intended sort of in a retcon for this helicopter to be a CRM helicopter. What do you think? So I wondered that, but then I remembered in season three the governor has a helicopter or there's something about a helicopter. Yes, there is.

[00:15:45] But both could be that. Military. So I don't know. It could be. I'd love it if they went back and like retouched them like they did with the Star Wars films like adding Hayden Christensen at the end.

[00:15:55] I just like put the fucking CRM logo on them like it was there all the time. Well they could then put Danai Gurira's face on Michonne if they were going to do that. Right. All right.

[00:16:07] So my first one was going to be what you just said, but I'll just skip over that and go straight to my number two point Zeds attack the farm slash go Zeds. Because I'm on the zombie side. Yeah, we're totally on the zombie side.

[00:16:26] How many of you, sorry this is probably a question for Greg's mind, but how many of you were there? Was everyone that we saw a real person? Was there any CGI zombie making? I don't think so. In the, not on the farm I don't think.

[00:16:44] I think everybody was a real person. And actually some of the people in the very, very back, they were in costume, but they didn't even have their face done or anything. Interesting. Some people on the way back.

[00:16:57] But there were CGI moments because I was on the scene, I think it was the day before Jason got there, the one where they break down that fence and they're in that horse field and

[00:17:08] there was actually horse manure there on the ground that we had to step around, FYI. But when they show that scene from overhead, those are CGI zombies. So you were there, I was going to ask you that, when they broke through the fence, you were one of those?

[00:17:25] Yes. And actually a split second before the scene changes, I bump into the fence. I have this really oddly black nose. So were you all, I mean, it was like a situation like at a concert when everybody's trying

[00:17:45] to push up to the stage and they get squished together. Was it uncomfortable? It was actually semi treacherous because the ground was not even at all. There was the horse manure and then on the other side of the fence, and they didn't show

[00:18:00] this, I guess it got cut, but they had these fake bodies just laying on the ground. I guess they were supposed to be trampled zombies that there were so many, the force was so huge that some were getting trampled.

[00:18:11] So we also had to navigate around those and not trip. So it was a little scary. I don't want to be the one that falls and actually get trampled. Right. They're like, well, there's one extra body, what happens? I felt it was a little, just a little treacherous.

[00:18:36] I remember one time when we had to go a little faster than normal and the ground was muddy and I was kind of slipping around, but I was trying to slip how a zombie would slip and not a person.

[00:18:49] And I thought I was going to fall on my ass. But then another time when we were all like Glenn and Maggie were in the Hyundai and they had to stop at one point because all the zombies were right in front of them, clawing at the

[00:19:06] windshield and I was one of those. And we sat there for a while just waiting for them to do the shot. And you know, just kind of weird, just staring right at Steven Yeun and Lauren Cohan sitting there in the car chatting with each other. Right.

[00:19:21] And then we tried to like get their attention. They would kind of laugh, but they were cool. And then, but anyway, when the car drove off, like kind of sped away, I remember like Greg

[00:19:30] Nicotero was directing that little part and he was all, oh, let's do it like this. He was really excited about it. He was such a fan. But anyways, I was afraid that the car was going to run over my feet, but it didn't.

[00:19:43] Because it was just kind of like, they didn't give us any instructions. I'm like, well, I guess you should just take it for granted not to let the car run over your feet. Anyway, let's see.

[00:19:54] So when Herschel and Lori and everyone saw the Zeds coming, they like turn out the lights, but they get ready to fight. And my first thought having watched the whole series is get in a car, drive away a little

[00:20:08] bit, blast the stereo, you know, lure them away with sound. And Andrea did say we kill as many as we can. And then we use the cars to lead the rest of them off the farm. And I'm like, okay, so what went wrong with that?

[00:20:20] They didn't use sound. And I think there were just too many of them to handle. But if they had used sound, then maybe they could have done a better job, you know? And I also always think, why didn't you just go back to the farm after they passed?

[00:20:35] At least go check and see if they just went right through because they came from Atlanta. So did they just be like, oh, this seems like a nice place to settle forever? Yeah, in the comics, they go back. Well, Glenn goes back, I think to the Greens.

[00:20:49] I'll go back as well. Grace. I feel like people remember. Yeah, I feel like there is a there's farm 2.0. Um, yeah, yeah. I feel like that's what they're trying to cover their asses with when they're like, oh, the herds kept cutting us up. And I'm like, yeah.

[00:21:08] So then Rick and Carl run to the barn and his plan is to light it up, light up the barn to stop some from reaching the house and distract the others. And as far as I could tell, we didn't see any Zeds actually distracted by the fire. No.

[00:21:23] A little later, Beth says the barns on fire and Patricia says they're headed for it. Maybe Rick said to draw them in. So maybe it was working. But maybe I was thinking maybe I'm thinking too much probably.

[00:21:34] But maybe the gunfire from everybody else pulled them away from the fire. If they would have just not fired at them, maybe they because there's a three episode run in season six, episode seven, eight and nine where walkers have stormed Alexandria

[00:21:49] and in episode nine, Darrell fills a pond with fuel and ignites it with that RPG and a big pool of a big thing of fire comes up and most of them just go right into it. They're like fire.

[00:22:03] And I always felt like that contradicted our episode because when the barn went up in flames, we didn't care. We're just like, no, we want to eat the people. So it's a little bit of a flub there. I feel like I don't know.

[00:22:19] But then a few of them get into their vehicles and start firing. And I remember watching that Rita's driving around on his motorcycle and Steven and Yon and Lauren Cohan in the Hyundai and Andrea and T-dog in the big blue truck.

[00:22:35] I'm pretty sure it was, I don't know for sure, but I'm pretty sure it was them driving the whole time. Right. I don't remember any stunt drivers or anything. No, it was them the whole time.

[00:22:45] And you know, we have to shoot it so many times that they really went around a lot, you know, for like hours. It felt like they had to like, I remember like they were trying because it was new. The show was new then.

[00:22:58] So this was like the first big hurt and they were trying to figure out how to get the right zombies to drop when you got shot. And I think they gave us all numbers and they would scream out a number, number five, but

[00:23:10] then two zombies would drop because somebody forgot their number. And so I think they just ended up started pointing at us. That's what I remember, but I don't, I don't know. Yeah.

[00:23:20] And I think it was, or what I remember, and I don't know how accurate it is, but I remember it was kind of like, and maybe it just got to this point where we would be walking forward, walking forward.

[00:23:32] And if you see the gun pointed at you, you know, in your general direction, you just fall, you know, you fall. And it did make a sound when it fired, right? It was like blanks. Yeah. Yeah. I think it was. Yeah.

[00:23:46] They changed that after a while, like with all the accidents and things they, I think they just had rubber guns after a while, but when we were there, it was, oh really? Yeah. It was definitely, it was loud if you're close.

[00:23:58] But you know, the part about that, and I don't know how much we should talk about our experience right now, but like because they were going to burn the barn, they had hosed down, the fire department had hosed down the entire surrounding area because there was like tall

[00:24:16] grass and all that. And it was freezing. So it all had iced over this tall grass had iced over. And so when you fell, you would have to like, I would fall because Glenn shot me and I actually was on camera.

[00:24:30] And that's really my super favorite, you know, memory. You feel honored to be shot by these guys. Yeah. Like especially with my favorite character. And but anyway, I would, I would fall and then I would have to wait there for like in

[00:24:45] the freezing cold grass for like two minutes until the scene ended and then do it again. You know, so I'm just like laying in the grass, laying in this frozen grass and like wearing a shirt and a dress, you know, and no jacket or anything.

[00:25:02] But yeah, that's amazing. It was cold. It was very cold. And we were in not wearing not much. We had a long sleeve, but it was just one layer. And it was like, I don't know, like 14 degrees or something. And they would bring out maybe not that cold.

[00:25:21] Maybe that I don't know, we could see our breath. I know that. And so they would bring out, I probably told the story before, but they had like carts of like fuzzy snuggy. And they were kind of bright colored and we would put them on in between shots.

[00:25:36] Right. And I remember one time when you and I were talking or something and then they said, background, which means we're filming go. And we had our snuggies on. We're still wearing our snuggies. We're like, oh shit.

[00:25:50] So we're like, I just like pretended to be a zombie in a snuggie. Aww. And I don't know what happened with that. It's got to be on camera. Like, oh, what are these two idiots doing?

[00:26:04] Yeah, who knows if it made it in, but that would be so funny. But I remember and this was another time, because when I was in prosthetic, one night I was in prosthetic makeup.

[00:26:14] And so I was a little closer up to the front and that was the night I got shot. They filmed the cars and I got shot by Glenn. But like we were just waiting there in between scenes or, you know, for it to go again.

[00:26:31] And I'm just shivering. Like I, the worst part where my, was my feet because I was just in these like little like ballet flats, you know, like no insulation whatsoever standing in that frozen grass. And I'm just, I don't have a snuggie because there wasn't enough for everybody.

[00:26:46] And Greg Nicotero comes over and he's like, you know, why don't you have a blanket? You know, you're cold. He's like rubbing my arm. And I'm like, there's not enough for everybody, you know, because you really have to had to

[00:26:57] be by what do they call them a snuggie buggy or something like that. You had to be by the wagon in order to grab one quickly or whatever. So but it was like, yeah, Greg, Greg's keeping me warm up there. That felt like cool and special for me.

[00:27:13] Yeah. And I remember we used to, the farm, it was just beautiful at night. The house was beautiful and they had these big lights high up that would shine down on it and just make it feel like a special place. And there was a lot of waiting around.

[00:27:30] So I would just go like sit on like a tractor tire or something and just look around and take in the scene and be in kind of awe. But then when it got really cold, we all piled in.

[00:27:39] I think there was a bus there and we would just like snuggle up in the bus. That's amazing. I remember one time because it got to be they sort of had to ask who wants to come out of a warm, warmish bus and work.

[00:27:55] And I was like, I'm dead right now. I need to I need to warm up. But you went out. You were like a trooper. Every time they asked for volunteers, I did.

[00:28:04] And so that's why if you know where to look, you can see me in about five or six different places around the farm. That's incredible. There were about 100 I think they called in 100 extras. And how long were you actually? No, I'm going to save my questions.

[00:28:20] I will hold my question. Yeah, let me go. Let me. OK, but jump in, you guys. If I was just going to go through this whole battle. Yes. Is that too much? No, that's perfect.

[00:28:30] So Jimmy was trying to save Rick and he thought Shane, which Darryl told him, you know, go to the barn and get them. And he drives the RV over and Jimmy, poor Jimmy was zombie fodder. And James McHugh is the actor. Super nice guy.

[00:28:47] He ended up coming to Walker Stalkers, one of the nicest ones. But I remember that night hearing his screams coming out of that RV. It was chilling. Well, according to IMDB, he is phobic of being eaten alive.

[00:28:59] I'm a bit like, is that phobia or is that just like a normal fear that we all have? Right. Apparently. I think that's his worst fear. You know, according to IMDB. Before or after? Before. Like he thought about it. That's what I always heard.

[00:29:12] Like so he could really draw on that. Like, of course, no one wants to be eaten alive. But he was a person who apparently had thought about that. I've just imagined you chat with this agent and they're like, so they want you for the show, Jimmy.

[00:29:24] It's called The Walking Dead. And he's like, that's great. Will I be eaten? And they're like, no, no. It's a zombie show, though. They're like, no, no. His agent's like, why do you ask that before every role? This guy, am I right?

[00:29:38] And he went down in a massively gory manner too. I mean, that was a good gory scene. That moment where Rick looks with Carl, just like with blood and Rick's like, yeah, he's gone by. And I'm like, this is great. I love it. What was his name again?

[00:29:56] James Allen McKeown. He starred in the Blair Witch reboot too in 2016. But I don't know if he's been working much. I don't know lately. Huh. Yeah, he was good. So then Herschel's there firing off rounds with his what became known as his magic shotgun.

[00:30:14] And there is a scene of him later frantically trying to reload. And there's a walker about to eat him from behind and Rick shoots it. So I guess the magic shotgun only needs reloading when it's most dramatic.

[00:30:27] But during that scene, I was actually coming up in front of him, but it was off camera. And I remember I was going too fast. I couldn't, I was so excited. I just couldn't go slow enough.

[00:30:40] And he, I remember him saying at one point, I can't, I can't reload fast enough. Like I was going to get him before he could reload it because he was actually reloading it, you know? And Scott Wilson's like, you're too fast. I can't. I'm like, I'm sorry.

[00:30:52] That's amazing. So you could have changed the whole course of the show and like, you could have just been like, again, I mean, I was pretty close to him and definitely Rick and Carl when they were coming down off the RV.

[00:31:07] Also Shane, I mean, not Shane, um, uh, Glenn and Maggie, except they weren't safely in the car. And then I was right next to the big blue truck to the T-dog and Beth and Lori were in.

[00:31:20] I like Lori was just right there on the other side of the windshield. I mean, the window for me. That is wild. And then Daryl, well, gosh, Patricia gets snagged when she's holding Beth's hand and poor Beth has to suffer another loss.

[00:31:37] And then a bunch of Zed swarmed onto her and started chowing down. And I was, I didn't get to grab her, but we chowed down on this like dummy on the ground that was supposed to be Patricia. Yeah, I was right there. I was right there too.

[00:31:52] And then, um, Daryl ends up riding off with Carol, which I thought was cool. Just we were watching their budding friendship over the course of this and he's like, come on, ain't got all day.

[00:32:08] And uh, but we didn't really talk about why Daryl went from being all pissy and not wanting to be involved or help to being a team member again. Was it just because he saw that Shane status was going down or he just needed a couple

[00:32:20] of days to process or something? Rick? Well, Dale told him he was a good man, which galvanized him a bit. And I think Rick trusting him to go out on point with him and thanking him for shooting Sophia.

[00:32:33] I think he's, he's just ready to step up into the mix or he's just a chaos merchant. Like both can be true. Yeah. When, when the shit really hits the fan, maybe he's there.

[00:32:42] Did you, by the way, Grace, cause I, when I came in, you know, they'd, we were filming this but we hadn't seen, we hadn't seen Sophia come out of the barn yet because that hadn't aired yet when we were filming this.

[00:32:54] And so the extras were like, oh yeah, Sophia was in the bar and I was like, what? So I got spoiled. We both got spoiled on that. But I, then after that I was trying not to get spoiled on anything else, but I did notice

[00:33:05] that there was no Dale around and no Shane around. But did you know the details of anything else? I, I did know about Sophia. I can't remember about, I think it was the same with Dale. We just kind of noticed he wasn't there.

[00:33:21] So it was obvious that he was dead. And like as far as Shane, we kind of knew that coming because of the comics anyway. So yeah, figured. I think we just assumed, assumed that was going to happen this season anyway, because

[00:33:35] it was really, well, I can't remember what episode it was, like in November, what had come out like, so I can't remember how far behind we were. But you know, I think as comic readers, we kind of assumed Shane would go sooner than

[00:33:51] later but Dale was definitely I think a surprise. Yes. Yeah, that would be. And I was bummed. His absence. Because I was like, my view of this show is very much colored by the comic in a way that it's not now because I've forgotten most of it.

[00:34:07] So I see things differently. Like I'm a little more annoyed with Dale now than I was back then, because I liked him so much in the comic. But anyway, I mean, that's about all I had for the fight. The zombie fight. Very good. Yeah.

[00:34:22] And I don't know if you mentioned this the first time, but like when we were filming, they did have, they did have Herschel reload several times. Like he was reloading, they just like that just ended up on the editing floor.

[00:34:37] So you know, which is kind of I don't think they realized that how much of a joke that was going to become. In defense of, you know, writers and whomever. I'd forgotten that. But it makes sense. Because when you watch it, it's pretty, you know, more boring.

[00:34:55] Unless you said like, it's imminent, you know, he's an imminent danger, you know? So what else, Grace? Your turn. Oh, is it my turn again? I think just the visuals like what and that's I think during this rewatch, what I really

[00:35:13] hit me is just how gorgeous some of it was. Or you know, just how cool just kind of like the at first I think the first thing would be like that zombie cam like view when you you're kind of it's us looking out at Rick

[00:35:30] and Carl from behind. Yeah, you know, you see the house and everything. That's just such a cool because you know, we know what's coming because we just saw this herd forming and but they're yet to, you know, it's yet to turn around. And then like the barn burning.

[00:35:49] And I think it was kind of even like this like kind of slow mo or is that just in my head but you know, it's like slow mo and they catch it falling. I think it's slow.

[00:35:59] I do have a question about the barn that I feel is relevant here. Is it? Did they really burn? Did they build? Did they build something to burn because it looked really real. It didn't look like the fire was fake or anything like that.

[00:36:11] Like was that for real a barn on fire? It was. Well, they built the entire barn just to burn. Oh my. There was no bar in there before filming. They built that barn with the intention of burning it. Oh my gosh.

[00:36:24] And the whole time we were filming over those, there was like some kind of controlled fire inside the barn so you could see it coming through the windows. You know, of course they have the scenes inside the barn when Rick brought the zombies in

[00:36:38] which I forgot to mention that was really cool too. But yeah, then when they lit it on fire at the end, I think they may have added a little bit of CG to make it a little bigger than it was but it was pretty big.

[00:36:53] The thing I remember the most is we were like, oh, this is so warm. Yes, it was so nice. And actually like some people were kind of getting, some extras were getting yelled at. They're like, don't go so close to the barn.

[00:37:06] But you know, it really did feel nice. Zed heads are really, Zeds are really drawn to the fire. They are. I mean, it was hot if you got too close. It was like, it was not even all that close.

[00:37:19] Like if you were, because it was such a big fire. You didn't have to get that close for it to be too hot to handle. But when you're just the right distance away, it was such a relief. It was a pleasant warm. Yeah.

[00:37:31] And they had the fire trucks there, you know, off, you know, there in case anything went awry. And then I remember as it started to fall, I think, I think like Nika Tara or somebody was like, oh, let's get another shot so we can get it. Run out.

[00:37:48] So we ran out there like super quickly to do it one more time. Because we thought we were done. That's amazing. It was, I mean, that was perfect. That was so awesome that they were able to catch that on camera. It was, yeah, the visual was great.

[00:38:04] And then the last one that I kind of had written down is, and I had completely forgotten about this is just when they kind of show off into the distance and show the lovely CGI prison. But I was, oh, I totally forgot about that.

[00:38:19] And just the like, I felt like each one of these scenes, like really kind of evoke a different, you know, these different emotions, you know, whether it's the dread with, you

[00:38:28] know, seeing the the zombie view or, you know, and then the hope kind of when you see the prison and okay, there's a safe, you know, thing to hear just some hope of the future of what's coming.

[00:38:43] Yeah, I just, you know, I was just kind of amazed all over again by the by those visuals. And for me, like watching it, as I said, with the comic way more in mind, it was just

[00:38:56] exciting to see the prison because you they spent so much time there and they're like, yeah, that's good. Next season. Yeah. Although I'm going to be a Debbie downer and just say it doesn't look much like the prison that we end up being in.

[00:39:09] The same one because to get there, it looks very comic accurate. But I'm like, yeah, oh, it's they hadn't built it yet at the studio. No, it's. But like, I forgive it because it's such a cool sweeping shot and it's such a cool taste

[00:39:25] of what's to come that I'm like, it's fine. You're right, though. Yeah. Looks like. Yeah. All right. What do you got next, Lucy? What have I got next? I've got a whole rundown about the fall of the farm.

[00:39:38] It's it's such a shock at the start of this episode when you're back in the house and everyone's worried about Randall because it feels like Randall's like a lifetime away. So everyone in the house is worried about Randall coming back.

[00:39:50] I'm going to name it and say, I don't think Norman Reedus gives his best performance when he comes back and he's like, oh, yes, his neck was broke. Shane's no tracker. I'm like, oh, this isn't great. I like Darryl.

[00:40:02] I like Reedus, but I'm just like, oh, what stood out to me is because he develops this gravelly, sexy, whispery voice that he uses all the time. And it's so it stands out so much these early episodes because he's like, yeah, it seems like a good time, Zanny.

[00:40:20] It's like Shane wasn't there. And I'm like, oh, OK. But I did also know a sweet moment where Laurie asks him to go out and check they're OK. And rather than saying like, fuck off all of oil or whatever, he's like, I will do that.

[00:40:34] So I love the awkward conversation with Carl and Rick where Carl's like, were you bit? What happened to Shane? And Carl's like doing what like all kids do, which is try and construct a narrative to make sense of what he's seen, like telling himself a little story.

[00:40:49] Well, yeah, I was thinking because poor Carl, like not only the thing that we're thinking about, he comes upon his father who just killed his father figure and then he has to shoot the zombie version. But he thinks that Shane was bitten.

[00:41:03] And so he's just as they're walking back, just wondering, did my dad get bit too? Which would totally be the thing to wonder. Which, yeah, because no one knows at this point.

[00:41:13] And so Darrell, that says he thinks the herd is going to rip the house down because they do say, well, don't we just batten down the hatches? And he's like, no, unless there's a tunnel I don't know about.

[00:41:24] Carl essentially ruins everything by not being in his room when he's supposed to be, because that's where some of the hysteria comes from. From Laurie is not knowing where he is and that's where the group kind of diverges a little bit. But he also saved his dad's life.

[00:41:36] So we'll forgive you, Carl. I love the line, as you say, that Darrell says, it's as good night as any to die. I also thought it was really nice that Rick told Carl he loved him.

[00:41:46] I was like, oh, that's just nice parenting in the middle of the zombie apocalypse when you're about to commit arson and zombie murder with your dad who loves you. I don't know. It gave me the feeling that he didn't really believe in this plan with the lighter and

[00:42:00] the gasoline. You know, I just want to say if this is the last time we talk, I love you. I love you. I'll fuck it up, Carl. You'll fuck it up, you little dickhead. Like, oh, no.

[00:42:11] I really kind of thought, Rick, maybe you should also like the lighter. Just climb up the ladder and do the lighter part yourself, too. Yeah. I mean, Carl's getting a bit literal baptism by fire here.

[00:42:23] There's some really cool shots of Glenn shooting from the car where I think the cameras on the roof of the car. So we're seeing Steven Yeun shooting as he's being driven around, which is really cool.

[00:42:35] I've written that Darrell essentially sends Jimmy to his death by being like, I was like, oh, but he gets Rick and see where all those zombies are. Go there. Yeah. It's over there. Jimmy and Jimmy's like, oh, you have to like open the door or whatever. Hello.

[00:42:52] We we shouted out Jason, bite Carl. That's in my notes. Kabassi, bite Carl. Maybe Jimmy, Jimmy and he helped Carl and Rick. He did. They got through. But I don't know if that was necessary. They could maybe just jump down or something.

[00:43:07] I think if Jimmy had had the choice, he probably would not have done it. Andrea clocks that they're going to run out of ammo before they even make a dent. I thought he and I were still getting some really good product placement in this episode.

[00:43:20] I thought that car did a fantastic job of not being too dirty and still driving very well in all the situations. Carol talks Laurie round about leaving without Carl. And there's this moment where Sarah Waine Callies is standing on the porch and just kind of screams, Carl.

[00:43:36] And I think it's one of the best Carl's that we get in the show. Laurie also kind of condemns Andrea's fate a little bit because she assumes that Andrea has been bit. You know, she says, Andrea, go get Carl. And then it looks like they're both dead.

[00:43:52] So they decide to leave. I'm glad and Maggie follow. I thought it was really interesting seeing Maggie freak out so much. But again, when Peter can talk me through the context, though, she's not really seen this kind of carnage on the scale before.

[00:44:06] It made a lot more sense. And I thought there was a lot of really good screaming in this episode. People don't scream in later seasons of The Walking Dead, whereas this is some good horror films.

[00:44:17] I think our first reaction as fans a lot of times, we don't want to see the characters that we like handling things badly. But it really makes sense for people to handle things, this kind of thing poorly, you know?

[00:44:28] I mean, because she's coming down and having to get all those emotions out of her body. They were just literally, you know, fighting for their lives and trying to save the farm and do all this. Your adrenaline's up and all this, you know, you need to come down.

[00:44:44] And, you know, she doesn't know if her family's dead either. Yeah, right. Right. I thought Lauren Cohen did a great job and I loved it thinking about where she ends up and how hardened Maggie becomes.

[00:44:54] But seeing her in this kind of much more young and vulnerable state was just kind of nice to think about that arc, although horrible thinking about how she gets to that arc.

[00:45:03] And yeah, the last kind of things we see are Herschel very early a goner until Rick does a kind of iconic entrance and then Rick, Herschel and Carl leave. Andrea's left behind. I feel so bad for Andrea in this episode. She's like, wait, wait, wait, wait. We assholes!

[00:45:19] Poor Andrea. And then Daryl's kind of pondering watching the barn burn, but hears Carol and goes to rescue her. And then the barn collapses and flames behind them. And it's just, it's so quick, but it's so well done and well orchestrated.

[00:45:33] And just the complete decimation of the safe haven and the kind of false sense of security they've had. Oh, brilliant, brilliant stuff. Iconic. Just what the only thing that would have made it perfect is if we would have gotten to crawl

[00:45:48] into those windows and just fuck up that farmhouse because you couldn't. I think I've said this enough that everyone knows, but the people who own the house said you can use our property, but zombies aren't allowed on the porch or in the house because

[00:46:01] I think because they were religious. And it just, it would have made it so much better if you could have seen us crawling in there, you know? And I think it would have made maybe a little more sense that it or made it seem overrun more. Exactly. Absolutely.

[00:46:18] But you know, you're playing by the rules. All right. So my next one is the aftermath, which is, uh, I mean it really hit home this time that they, this whole season, like their safe space has been wrecked.

[00:46:35] Herschel's farm and they're like ants scattering when someone stepped on the ant hill and the zombie threat this season was mostly pretty contained. A few strays ads here and there, some locked in a barn, uh, from the most, for the most

[00:46:48] part, there are like a potential threat or a looming threat than an actual threat except for Dale. But beside that, and then there's Randall and his group, which is also most of the time more of a potential threat or a looming threat.

[00:47:00] So most of the conflicts and instability this season comes from the disagreements among the group leaders, Rick Shane and Herschel on how to handle these threats. And so aside from the conflict within their own group, they've mostly been in this calm, temporarily safe confines of the farm.

[00:47:19] But now that ends, they're confronted with the reality of the Zeds. It throws everything into disarray. It kind of, I mean this, I don't want to trivialize this, but it reminds me a little bit of September 11th where it's like, Oh shit, we can actually be harmed.

[00:47:31] And then you start to panic like, Oh wait, reality isn't what I thought it was. We're, we're, we're, there's potential danger and they all have that vibe like, what the fuck do we do? We got to scatter.

[00:47:43] Well, I don't care about anybody else or no, we got to go back. And they're just all sort of panicking, you know? And Carl wants to go back and try to get his mom and Rick doesn't want to. And Carl's disgusted by that.

[00:47:54] And I did sort of think, wait a minute, Rick, aren't you the one that wants to go charge into danger all the time? Is it kind of funny that the one time you don't is when it's Lori? I guess he wanted to wait there.

[00:48:05] He thought she would be back. I don't know how to tell you this, Carl, but your mom's a righto. And then T-Dog does, I thought it was so funny. He's like, I got these two women, let's just get out of here. Oh yeah.

[00:48:20] He was like, one head for the coast. He was like, they're on their own. Too bad for them. Yeah. And then, and it's funny because Lori said, you know, we should go to the place where Sophia we were going to rendezvous with her. That's probably where they'll meet.

[00:48:33] And then just like two seconds later, he's like, there's no way to even begin to start looking. I'm like, well, maybe you should start at that rendezvous place. She just gave you a suggestion. Yeah, it's like literally not that far away.

[00:48:44] It's not like you're going back to Atlanta. It's like, it's there man. You're fine. Yeah. Well, and the funny thing is, you know, with T-Dog trying to act like they were crazy for

[00:48:53] wanting to go back and like, he's talking to the two people that have family back there. I was kind of disappointed. If it was Carol or something. Yeah. But no, it's, it's, uh, you know, Beth and Lori who both have family they're worried about.

[00:49:09] You're just like T-Dog read the room man. Read the room. I was just trying to get into his head because we didn't get enough T-Dog. I think Irony Singleton was good and they should have given him more.

[00:49:20] And so we don't quite know his character as well as we could have, but I'm just trying to think how this makes sense. And it almost makes sense because of that, because he didn't get a lot to do. And so he didn't feel as integrated into the group.

[00:49:33] He didn't make those connections like everyone else did. And so it was easier for him to just be like, Nope, let's just get out of here. Cut our losses, you know, because he didn't have that connection. Let's call it. Yeah.

[00:49:46] And then Herschel, he, for some reason just wanted to sit in a car and if a zombie gets me, that's okay. Herschel's having a day. Herschel's like, you take your boy. And then he delivers his classic line.

[00:50:02] I can't profess to understand God's plan, but Christ promised the resurrection of the dead. I just thought he had something a little different in mind. I always love that. But then he's telling Carl, Rick, you just need to take care of Carl.

[00:50:21] And then a zombie walks through so they know they're not safe there. They're all worried about what to do. And then Rick's about to tell Carl they can't wait for his mom. And then just then everybody drives up all at the same time and there's hugs all around.

[00:50:34] It was such a great moment because I guess Darryl's the one who rounded them up because Rick says, Where'd you find everyone? And he goes, These guys tail lights zigzagging all over the road figure you had to be Asian driving like that. Which felt like a mild racism.

[00:50:49] It's a little brotherly love. I feel like. Yeah, good one. But anyway, it's a great moment because they're so happy to see each other and the people who care about each other the most group together. Herschel's family and Rick's family.

[00:51:05] But then they take stock of who they lost. Jimmy, Patricia, possibly Andrea. So it was like a little bit of a roller coaster there. Excellent. Yeah, they all wrote Andrea off pretty quickly. She's either dead or she's somewhere else.

[00:51:20] Like yes, those are the two things that can happen. So do you have any more Grace? I mean, the only other thing I've had written down, we kind of touched on it, I think earlier, but just the whole death of democracy and everyone basically is questioning Rick's calls.

[00:51:41] And like you say, he becomes a little unhinged. I think that was just a moment for sure. He's like, You can leave if you want or you can listen to me. He wasn't having any of this discussion anymore. Nothing was up for discussion.

[00:52:01] Why do you think he's like that? Was he just like, I'm tired of everyone questioning me all the time or? Yeah, I think so. And especially, you know, everyone was pissed, I think, because he had made, I don't know, that decision.

[00:52:19] Everyone was mad that he had made the decision about not telling them that everyone was infected. And I think he really felt strongly about that he had made that right decision. And because he really comes at Glenn when Glenn said, you know, Glenn was questioning him.

[00:52:39] He's like, you know, I thought it was the right call at the time or whatever. I don't know the exact quote. But so I think he was pissed. He was like, you know, I'm just doing my best. And everyone's giving me shit.

[00:52:52] I mean, he just had to kill Shane or he would say he had to. And I agree. But he didn't want to have to do that. And the zombies just stormed the farm. And that was quite an event to go through.

[00:53:06] So I could see being kind of fucked up from all that. Then when he told Lori that he killed Shane, she doesn't even want to have anything to do with him. Carl's kind of disgusted with him.

[00:53:18] So I think, yeah, he's just at the end of his rope, you know. Understandably. Yeah, it really does feel like that. It feels that, you know, we were just I just cracked up when he's like, I killed my best friend for you. And everyone's like, what the fuck?

[00:53:34] Yeah, you did. Wait, what? What? It's a good moment. Um, yeah. Even Carl's like, okay. Carl just like, that's really what happened. I'm like, that did not land how you thought it would. Yeah, I had a point about the kind of dictatorship when the convoys stops.

[00:53:53] Rick doesn't want the group to split up. And it's the start of his quest, I think, that doesn't really ever end until they hit Alexandria, which is for shelter and for somewhere safe to be. But everyone is at odds with Rick here.

[00:54:07] Everyone is, you know, Carol tries to talk Darrell into sort of running away. Glenn is upset with him. He's very raging because he told about the barn and Rick didn't tell him about this. And I think Laurie has an inkling of what might have happened with Shane.

[00:54:25] And I find the scene with Laurie and Rick so interesting because this is like the the crack from which their relationship never recovers. And Laurie, she looks horrified when he says that he did it. But Rick, to be fair to him, explains he had no choice.

[00:54:40] He gave him every chance. He was actually like Rick was in the way. I think Sarah Wayne Cowleys is really good in this scene. But where it starts to turn is when Rick says, I wanted it over. I just want it over. I wanted him dead.

[00:54:51] And then the bit where it's like the absolute fucking final straw is when he says that Carl put him down. And I think at that point, it's just gone beyond anything that Laurie can forgive. That's a lesson for anyone in our argument.

[00:55:03] If you have something that will escalate the argument and you can save it for later, maybe save it. Maybe just don't ask Carl how his day was. So I feel that that moment that to me is like that's the death of the Grimes marriage right there.

[00:55:19] Like when we see them in season three and things are so bad between them. I don't I mean, I doubt they have a conversation after this point. Like I really I think that's it. And it's so tragic.

[00:55:28] And I remember the first time I watched it being really pissed off with Laurie and being like, but that's what you wanted. Like and he did it. So why are you being like this now?

[00:55:37] But now I think I was trying to see where the moment really is for her that it that it comes apart. And it really is when he says that Carl got involved. And maybe in that sense, it's a bit more understanding.

[00:55:46] Well, who let who who let Carl out? Who wasn't watching Carl? Probably fucking Andrea. But I think she was projecting a bit, you know? Yeah. I think she was projecting a bit with the anger that Carl got involved. And yeah, yeah. Right.

[00:56:05] He should have been keeping an eye on him in the house, though. I did have a lot of empathy for Laurie. I can't remember if I did originally or not. But even though, you know, the point that she did ask, you know, he she did want Shane

[00:56:19] dead just an episode or so before is a very good point. But I wasn't really thinking about that last night when I was like, well, you know, he's ranting and acting a little scary. And so I could kind of understand.

[00:56:33] Yeah, it's a lot about with Rick in this whole sequence. It's a lot about how he's saying it versus what he's saying. Because a lot of the things he's saying make sense. But he's just right. He's on a crazy rant. Oh, yeah. Yeah.

[00:56:49] He thinks she has this who are you kind of moment like this is not the Rick I know kind of right now. Who've you become? He's like Pete. Local man shows that sky like he's like, like if you saw him on a news bite, you'd be like,

[00:57:03] oh, wow. OK. But I thought I thought was interesting. Darryl still in Rick's corner, like kind of trying to win Darryl over. And Darryl says he's done all right by me. He has like anything that's that's kind of answers your question earlier about what's

[00:57:18] brought Darryl back into the group. And I think he does have faith in Rick, which given that, like the first time they met, Rick had just handcuffed his brother to a roof and left him there to die. Is pretty, pretty strong, you know.

[00:57:33] And Darryl can identify, too, with feeling angry sometimes, you know. Yeah. And Rick, like the bit where he loses it, he's you know, he gave me no choice. I killed my best friend for you people for Christ's sake. My hands are clean.

[00:57:46] Send me a postcard like top Rick sass. He's like, yeah, you find that place. Send me a postcard. So I think he's just frustrated that he did probably the hardest thing he's done in his life up to that point. Yeah. And he's not getting backed up on it.

[00:57:59] He needs someone to tell him you did the right thing. And yes, willing to do that. Nobody, nobody is because he's always this whole season. He's been making big decisions and then going back to Laurie and kind of fretting about it. And sometimes she will support him.

[00:58:11] But this is like, absolutely not. Yeah, it's rough. It's really rough. It's hard to watch for sure. Yeah. Okay, well, that's my my point is Rick kind of loses his shit. And they're like, Rick is saying we need to find a good place can be fortified to settle,

[00:58:28] which is like, yeah, that makes sense. But he's not saying it in an inspiring way. He's saying we just have to find it like, yeah, he needs to work on his delivery. Yeah. Like, I don't even remember that from the first time.

[00:58:45] I think I just was blinded by the comic and or maybe I just I did feel that way, but I forgot but watching it now. I'd be like, yeah, if I came upon this group right now, and I saw this guy, I'd be like,

[00:58:56] who the fuck is this guy? We get away from this guy. And then they're asking questions about Randall having turned but not bitten any tells them when they're all infected, and then they're upset.

[00:59:07] And I would be too if I found that out and Rick had kept it to himself. I don't know if it really matters practically all that much. But one way it matters is if somebody dies, you need to, you know, knife him in the brain

[00:59:19] or else you could be in danger. Rick's defense. He didn't know for sure until Shane. Yeah. And I, for me, the I think the biggest difference it would make is in like morale. Yeah.

[00:59:35] Um, you know, as someone who loves, you know, I really like this like post apocalyptic kind of stuff, but like I really I would be the first to like jump off a cliff or something like that.

[00:59:47] So I think news like that, that it's not like this temporary thing that is gonna, you know, be over in a year or something like this is always going to be the case or so it seems.

[01:00:02] It's not not that it's easily escapable, but it's just I don't know, it just seems so much more heavy when you know that just anyone it's in you, anyone who does. Yeah. It's something psychologically to come to terms with.

[01:00:18] And also if you just don't, you're like, fuck man, I'm going to be a zombie when I die. You have to like make an agreement with each other. Don't let that happen to me. Just you have to think about all that kinds of stuff. Yeah. It's dark.

[01:00:32] It's really dark. So then Rick's alone with Laurie and he as always, bills his guts. He says, I killed him. And you know, the things he's saying, I think are right. Shane made a plan to kill Rick. You can't let that stand.

[01:00:45] And he says, I gave him every chance. And then Laurie's upset. And yeah, she's especially upset that Carl was the one to put Shane down, but she should have been looking out for Carl.

[01:00:53] And now she's pissed and won't even let Rick touch her and giving him dirty looks. And I don't really sympathize with her. I mean, only in that this is just a really hard time right now. And people aren't their best selves.

[01:01:06] Laurie said in episode nine, you know, when he found out that Rick killed those two guys in the bar, Tony and Dave, you killed the living to protect what's yours. Rick says, that's right. Shane thinks I'm his. He thinks the baby's his.

[01:01:22] And he says, you can't protect us that you're going to get us killed. He's dangerous, Rick, and he won't stop. So it sure sounds like she's telling Rick, you killed someone to protect us from danger while Shane's dangerous. That's what it sounds like.

[01:01:33] So then to have this reaction is feels like such a betrayal. And I don't know if it's inconsistent writing or I mean, she's kind of flip flopped all over the place with Shane, like lashing out at him one moment and then asking him to stay

[01:01:45] and not leave the group and apologizing to him and then telling Rick he should kill him. So it could be that she still has feelings for him, but she's trying to repress them and just kind of all over the place. I don't know. It's it's sloppy.

[01:02:00] I think it is a bit. Yeah, but it's like a contrived way to set Rick off in this moment. Maybe. Yeah, maybe. Though, you know, life and love is kind of sloppy too at times. It's true. You know what? It's very true. Yep.

[01:02:16] But the way she pushes him away, man, it's like he's oh my God, it's brutal. Like it's really brutal. You feel it. Yeah. Yeah. Like she is disgusted, you know, like. Yeah. I mean, I think that's why Sarah Wayne Kelly has been in that situation before.

[01:02:30] She knows how to play it. So they're all deciding whether they should follow Rick and Carol's like to Darryl, we're not safe with him. Keep something like that from us. Why do you need him? He's just going to pull you down. And Rick's like right there.

[01:02:44] He's like, I can hear you. And then Darryl says no, he has honor. And then they hear noise and they're panicked and freaked. And Rick's like, no one's going anywhere. And Carol's like, do something. I am doing something. He's just screaming. I've been doing something.

[01:03:01] I didn't ask for this. I've killed my best friend for you. And they're all staring at him and he compromised. You know what he's like. That's true. He compromised us. He threatened us. He's good at sort of boiling it down.

[01:03:13] He staged the whole Randall thing, led me out to put a bullet in my back. He gave me no choice. He was my friend, but he came after me. All true. But he's not saying it calmly.

[01:03:22] He should be like, he should just if he just said he, you know what he's like, he came after me and tried to kill me, but he's like, hey, you know, and here's the thing, what I think. And then he's like, this is this is not a democracy.

[01:03:35] You know, if you think you can do better, there's the door. Like, I feel like most of the time, Rick, and this is just my opinion, but he's not a man with a lot of ego about his decisions and stuff.

[01:03:50] He's just trying to do he's trying to take responsibility for everyone, protect everyone. But when people complain, he it rolls off or I don't know, he doesn't seem like the kind of guy that's so defensive. But here he's very defensive. And he's also he's he's Shane.

[01:04:07] Like I think that's the point of this is that he's taken on characteristics of Shane erratic, aggressive, ruthless, a hothead and domineering. This is not a democracy anymore. So people like listeners and fans would often say, Rick takes on the characteristics of

[01:04:21] the people that he kills or that he goes up against. And I sort of thought that was a cute idea, but I didn't really think too deeply about it. But here it does feel like that, that he's really taking on Shane's persona here.

[01:04:34] To me, he's just a man on the absolute end of his tether. He's just absolutely like, and yeah, doing doing something that literally ripped his heart out, you know, and then having people be like, not impressed or even willing to be like, yeah, that makes sense.

[01:04:55] We're all just like, what? I think a little too much came out at once for, you know, yeah, for everyone to handle. It was an ugly scene. It was a bad scene. For sure.

[01:05:09] And then and then so you're, you know, Grace, you said when they see their prison, it's like hope. And I think that's how I saw it when I first watched this. But here there's also a hint, I think, of because he's just now saying, you guys think

[01:05:22] you can do better out there? Go on ahead. But if you're going to stay, then it's my way. It's not a democracy. And then they show this prison and maybe that's like a metaphorical prison that they're finding themselves in, you know, like stuck with this guy.

[01:05:34] So my last one is Andrea's scorecard, because we've been watching Andrea and Laurie because they're very hated. And I want to make sure that we acknowledge when they do good things. And I think Andrea was great in this episode.

[01:05:48] She was cool and collected, used the skills that Shane taught her with the gun to help protect the group. Even before the zombie attack, when they're all nervous about Rick and Shane, they're looking for Randall. Andrea wants to go look for them. Laurie doesn't want her to.

[01:06:05] He says, if Randall comes back, we're going to need you. Does that mean that she's accepted that Andrea is capable protector? You know, that maybe it's a good thing she wanted to focus on shooting rather than cooking and cleaning, maybe? Yeah, I think so. Yeah.

[01:06:18] Then behind the farmhouse, there's two Zeds headed towards Carol and had her cornered and she grabbed this stick and she was freaking out. And Andrea shot her in the head. She grabbed this stick and she was freaking out. And Andrea shot them both.

[01:06:31] And I think, you know, Carol later, of course, would have been able to handle that. But now she's not there yet. And I think there's a decent chance that Andrea just saved Carol's life. So she really, if not for Andrea, we might not have Carol. Yeah. 100%.

[01:06:45] And then at the end, she's separated and running for her life in the woods. And she shoots a bunch of them. And if she hadn't learned to use a gun, she'd probably be dead right there. Runs out of ammo.

[01:06:54] She stabbed one, I think right in the nose, the nasal cavity with a knife. I don't know if she's the first one to ever do that. I don't know. Maybe not. But then of course, there's, she's about to die.

[01:07:07] And then there's a hooded figure there with a katana and her two armless pets. Best person ever. First Michonne. Not Danai Gurira, if people didn't know. She wasn't cast yet. And then I just had it down to mention that we see, excuse me,

[01:07:24] we see another version of the scene in season 10, episode 13. Michonne's final episode when she's been drugged with a hallucinogen and imagines this alternate version of her life where she ignored Andrea's cries for help and ended up joining the saviors.

[01:07:39] And I remember wondering if Lori Holden had come back to film that, but then going back and checking and they just repurposed clips from this scene, but then Danai Gurira in there doing other things. Maeven doing her thing. So yeah, points for Andrea this time.

[01:07:57] Maeven Yeah, I think Andrea did pretty well. I mean, I would be fucking so dead. I am not good at running. I was very impressed that she kept going. I was like, this girl jogs. It's like, she knows.

[01:08:11] I did think for someone who's suicidal, like five minutes ago, this was quite the turnaround, but I was glad to see it. I was glad that Andrea was still fighting and that entrance for Michonne is just so cool. It's so cool. All right. Notes, any notes, Grace?

[01:08:31] Ah, no, I'll just chime in with you guys. Maggie can shoot. You grow up country, you learn a thing or two. I like this. The women are coming to the fore and I'm enjoying it.

[01:08:44] I guess I have like, maybe this is a point or I don't know, but it's interesting. So everything kind of leads back to the road and the cars and the focus on the Sophia message and the focus in particular on her name.

[01:08:58] And I guess it sort of leads me to the question of, is season two bad? Is it one in which we just circle and circle and don't ultimately get anywhere? Or how do we feel after a rewatch?

[01:09:09] Because after a rewatch, I think I like it better than I did. But I can still see the argument of like, there's a lot of futility in season two and a lot of kind of false security that doesn't really pay off in the end. So I don't know.

[01:09:21] I just kind of wanted to open up the question is, was season two bad? Was it good? I don't know. I mean, I think it's pushing the characters in the direction where we need and want them to go

[01:09:33] or kind of what really makes them who they end up being in a big part. This is like the little first seeds in a way of them really being tested and you know. Yeah, I agree with that.

[01:09:50] Knowing where Rick's story goes, this is a good beginning to how dark he gets, you know, and then trying to come back from that. Yeah. Yeah, and Andrea's whole arc with the gun, you know, training and. Yeah, yeah, the characters. Yeah. And Maggie and Glenn getting together.

[01:10:13] I know you don't like that part, Grace, but. I was in full support. Little jealous, but full support. But so season two hasn't been one of my favorites. And that's mostly because I feel like it repeats emotional beats and it doesn't move quickly enough.

[01:10:36] Things escalate slowly, but I do like it more after we've covered it. And I especially appreciate Jon Bernthal's performance more and more things about it. So yeah, I think, I don't know, maybe this is trite to say, but it could have been

[01:10:56] more of a half season to get to this point, you know, but I don't know. That makes sense. Yeah, I feel a bit dragged out, but otherwise good. The only other thing I had was that it's cute that Glenn finally tells Maggie that he loves

[01:11:12] her, but probably quite a traumatic situation in which to be told that for the first time. It seemed to calm her down a little. She was like, I think the best thing he said was, hey, we made it. We're alive.

[01:11:27] They probably are too, which is probably the best thing you could do. You know? Yeah, he did. Glenn did good. All right. So my notes, you know, they're talking about how great this farm is and I'm like, where's the crops? We don't see any crops, right?

[01:11:46] There are crops. Good question. But we never see them. We don't really see them. Talk at some point about some crops, because if there's no crops, there's like no chickens or anything. There's one cow. He's dead. She's dead, I should say. All right.

[01:12:04] So next, I just wanted to mention that Grace and I interviewed Lauren Cohan during this season. I think it was during the midseason break. It's episode 51 in the feed, if anybody wants to go back and listen to that. Excellent. I don't remember what she said.

[01:12:21] And then they run low on gas and they decide to set up camp and look for gas in the morning. And I'm like, you guys didn't manage your time well because they all came together and it took them until daylight to get there.

[01:12:38] But I can't imagine they were just like driving around for 12 hours or something. So it seems like they had many hours left in the day to go and look for gas, maybe. Maybe they didn't. I don't know. Just seemed like that day went by pretty quickly after that.

[01:12:54] And with the gas thing, it's... Who was it? Glenn's. It was like, we can't all fit in one car. They could have totally... You had two people on the motorcycle. You could have like siphoned the gas out of the Hyundai until you found a better...

[01:13:11] And just piled everyone in that huge ass SUV thing. Yeah, I went to India. I saw whole families on one scooter. Like five people. All right, let's move on to Only on The Walking Dead. I'll go first.

[01:13:31] Only on The Walking Dead would zombies not get to crawl through the windows of an inviting farmhouse. Totally not fair. I said only in The Walking Dead would they get so many headshots while riding in a vehicle going unnecessarily fast. Yeah, that's right. I forgot.

[01:13:50] We used to talk a lot about how great they were at shooting, getting headshots. Only on The Walking Dead would you declare your love in a Hyundai that's probably covered with things from Shane and Andrea that we don't want to think about. Oh, God.

[01:14:06] Do not shine a UV light in their glance. All I'm saying. Ew. I think we just lost our last listener.

[01:14:46] All right, we're back. We're going to do a little Q&A and talk about our experience filming this episode beside the dying fire. I have a couple questions for you, Grace.

[01:14:56] I wanted to know if you were surprised at all by how it turned out when you watched it, if you remember that. I was. Well, I was surprised at the number of things that didn't make it in, including one very

[01:15:13] close up of me and two other zombies right in the camera that I was disappointed not to see. What I was most surprised of, and it was a cool effect, but as a person who wanted to find myself, very disappointing is how dark they made it.

[01:15:32] It wasn't that dark in real life, so I didn't expect it to be so dark on the screen that you could barely see individual zombies and what was going on. So that surprised me.

[01:15:45] Yeah, I was sitting there looking for myself and I could see, I was watching it with friends and I'd be like, oh, I'm one of those stumbling ones over there and you can't really see anything.

[01:15:54] And so then when it got to the scene where they're all reaching out for Rick and Carl and you could totally see me there, I was so stoked. Like, oh yes, it's a clear shot. Yeah, that was so clear.

[01:16:05] And it was cool that they had that in the big photo of that was like around. Yeah, it was on the, because this was the season finale. So on the AMC website, they had the photo of all those zombies reaching out for Rick and

[01:16:20] Carl, except the Talking Dead logo covered up all those zombies except for me. So you just see me and Rick. Okay, okay. I knew I had seen it around, so that must have been where it was from.

[01:16:31] And I know you grabbed it and you had it on your page the longest. So, and you did more episodes, right? And what was like, tell me about one of those, like the best one, the most prominent one, I guess. Um, oh gosh, and I don't remember then.

[01:16:51] I know I was on Home, but I can't remember if that was what the one where Darryl was looking for Carol, I guess it was. Anyway, I'm there and that was the one where they had the shot of Darryl.

[01:17:05] He said like in the halls of the prison, he's down on the ground. And I'm like, it was kind of the same thing where it was all over AMC that shot. And I'm like laying dead in the background.

[01:17:15] But that was the coolest of any experience I had, because it was just two me and one other zombie. So it was like we were just totally a part of the crew. You know, it wasn't like we were separated.

[01:17:31] Like on the season two finale, there was like so many people. We were just totally separated from everybody when we weren't filming. And you know, with this one, we're eating right next to them. You know, chit chatting a little bit between scenes or whatever.

[01:17:47] And like I remember one time I was just waiting in the hallway for my scene and Michael Rooker wasn't in, you know, filming that day, but he like just kind of strides on set. He comes over and he starts talking to me and the other zombie.

[01:18:02] And that was super cool. So but you know, I've had a lot of, you know, I had a lot of fun times doing it. Yeah, that reminded me what I was gonna say earlier that when we so we would all get in

[01:18:17] these shuttles and they would drive us over to the farm, which is really kind of off the beaten path. And I remember when we were driving down one of those dark country roads, I saw John Bernthal and Sarah Wayne Kelly's doing it doggy style. No, I'm just kidding.

[01:18:34] I saw them walking along. And it was interesting because Bernthal was done filming, but I guess he wanted to stick around for the end, which I think is a testament to how much they all loved it.

[01:18:46] Jason, I realized I didn't do my IMDb dive this week, but there is a fact in there that John Bernthal did come to the set to watch the shooting of the finale. According to IMDb, he was too emotional. So he watched from the woods on the farm property.

[01:18:59] Cannot verify, but that is that is listed as a thing. Yeah, I mean, I saw him. Yeah, he was there. Yeah, he was there. I'll do it. Do you look emotional? Uh, he was just chatting, chatting with Sarah Wayne Kelly's.

[01:19:16] So I'm going to go through a few listener questions and then maybe we'll talk a little bit more. But Randy Stevenson, first question, which of you has the most screen time in this episode? I don't know. Probably me, right? I don't know because I mean, I'm.

[01:19:32] I mean, you had a really long bit of time there with the whole Rick and Carl thing, so maybe I don't know. But, you know, my fall and if you guys want to look for me, it's like when Maggie is driving

[01:19:45] and Glenn's hanging out the window of the Hyundai. Glenn goes, keep it steady. And she's like, I'm trying. He shoots two shots and the second shot is the one that kills me. And you see me go down and, uh, you know, my brain's explode.

[01:20:04] I got to go watch that. Yeah. So, um, you know, that was, that was super cool. That was a good moment. And you can see me pretty well when Patricia is being eaten.

[01:20:15] I come, but if you don't know who I am and then you can see me really well when, um, when, uh, Daryl and Carol are going off in the bike and the zombies are kind of going pretty quickly after them. I'm wearing it.

[01:20:28] It's like a Navy blue sleeveless dress, long dress and this like kind of a beige shirt. So you can really see the beige of my shirt and my blonde hair. Um, when we're kind of going very quickly after, uh, trying to run after their own motorcycle. Carol. Yeah.

[01:20:45] We got yelled at a couple of times for going too fast. That's amazing. That's funny. Yeah. Cause it was, there was a hundred of us. There was a hundred of us. And so there's three levels of zombies.

[01:20:57] Basically there's the, uh, ones that Grace mentioned earlier in the very back that don't even have anything, just the clothes. And then they're so far back that you can't see. Then there's the mid grounds and that's sort of most of us.

[01:21:13] And we have, uh, like spray on makeup. And then there's the hero zombies that get their prosthetics. They go into the makeup trailer for, you know, three, three to six hours or something like that and get the full thing. Yeah.

[01:21:25] And one of the nights I was a hero, I did get the prosthetics. You remember? You looked gross. I did look gross. So, and that was one of only two times that I worked that I got the prosthetic mask makeup.

[01:21:40] But the funny thing is, is, um, the, the extras passing, um, Atlanta lady, I can't remember her name, but she kind of got to choose who, you know, when they needed some extra people. And so she chose me.

[01:21:55] And when I was like about to leave, I don't know exactly what she said, but it was kind of like with the feeling of like, don't embarrass us kind of like, you don't fuck this up. This opportunity.

[01:22:09] But, um, that's very RuPaul stay zombie and don't fuck it up. Fuck it up. But, you know, having that whole experience of going through and getting the prosthetic makeup was amazing.

[01:22:21] You know, I want to say that time it took, I went, I think about three and a half hours and, um, you know, some people took much longer than that, you know, some of the really super

[01:22:32] involved scenes, you know, um, but mine, it was about three and a half hours. Yeah. It looked great. So there was like a hundred of us and any time there was, um, you know, they would ask for volunteers. We need somebody over here.

[01:22:48] And there were a lot of extras who seemed either just not that engaged or jaded or maybe just whatever. They didn't care. And they would just go and they were specifically called. And, but there were some of us who just wanted to be in every shot.

[01:23:06] And, and, um, when we were over by the barn, I remember in particular, it felt like there was six or seven of us right there. And we were all like trying to get to be the one in the shot, you know, it was a little

[01:23:19] bit like you're kind of competing that feeling of competing just a little bit. Yeah. Which, you know, that's, that's naturally Pete compete for the food and everything. So it goes along with it.

[01:23:30] But do you remember the one dude was like asleep in the backseat of the bus, like actively snoring? Do you remember when they were like trying to get people to come out and yeah, that,

[01:23:42] that one time when you were a trooper, I was like, my feet were like totally frozen. I was like, I just can't do it this, this time. Yeah. That was like probably on the last night. Yeah.

[01:23:50] Cause the whole thing, it was like, if I remember right, 12 to 14 hours, mostly at night. So then we would get done and go over to this trough and there was a shaving cream and you just rub your skin raw to get that freaking makeup off. Yeah.

[01:24:06] Cause they would not let you leave in the zombie makeup. Yeah. So there, there were just a bunch of us trying to get it off and as quickly as possible cause we were tired as hell and just want to get to sleep.

[01:24:15] And I had a hotel room pretty close by. I'd go there. I remember going to McDonald's afterwards and they were looking at me funny. And when I got back to the hotel, I saw that I still had a bunch of blood on my ear coming down. Yeah.

[01:24:28] You weren't all that good at washing it off a time or two, you know? Yeah. Made it made the makeup people's job a little easier the second time. And then I would just sleep and then I felt like I wasn't doing much for those four days,

[01:24:42] but sleeping and being a zombie. Yeah. I mean, I had an hour and a half drive home and then back. So yeah, I don't recall doing anything besides that and coming home and sleeping. Yeah. I was exhausted. So Randy asked another question.

[01:25:00] At any point, did you get wrapped up in the ambience of the whole scene? Being surrounded by that many zombie actors is jokingly one of my biggest fears. What if an actual zombie apocalypse happened right then? So I guess I'm asking, did you ever feel scared on set?

[01:25:14] I definitely got wrapped up in the ambience, but I don't think I ever felt scared. I was the scary person. So I felt hungry. Yeah. Yeah. I was never scared, but it was extremely surreal.

[01:25:29] I mean, just being in there and on those breaks like you talked about and just looking around and just being surrounded by all these zombies and it's kind of dark and it was amazing. And just the whole, I just cannot believe I'm here.

[01:25:48] Have I ever talked about this? I feel like I've talked about this before, but one time when it really hit me and this is on the surrealness, not about the being afraid thing, so I'm going off my own tangent.

[01:25:59] But when Rick and Carl are on top of the RV and it was during kind of a break and Chandler Riggs is kind of looking down, there's light coming from the top.

[01:26:11] So his face is a little bit half shaded and it was just so cool because it's such the look that Carl would have in the comics with the hat and the shade on his face. This is so just, it was surreal. It was crazy. But no, not scared.

[01:26:30] And I remember when I first got to the studios and it's like you see in Hollywood, there's all these sort of warehouses and little like golf cart type deal. And then I walk around and trying to find the warehouse where they sent me to

[01:26:46] and I came around the corner and I just saw inside this open warehouse, this line of people in various stages of zombie makeup. And it's like a assembly line, you know, they spray you with a certain thing at one part

[01:27:02] and then send you to the next one and get splattered with some gunk here and get some junk in your hair. And it was just, I just felt a rush like seeing that like, oh my God, I'm actually here. Look at all these zombies. It's amazing.

[01:27:15] That was the first thing I remember. And then not too long after that, Grace come up to me and that was the first time we actually met in person. And she was like, hi. Oh, that's so cool. That was weird too.

[01:27:26] Like I remember one time you were like walking behind me, like talking to someone else. So I couldn't see you, but I could just hear your voice that I was just so familiar with.

[01:27:34] And that was part of the surrealness too, was just meeting you for the first time after only really hearing you and everything. But talking about the assembly line, it's funny because even like many, many years later,

[01:27:49] like the smell of rubbing alcohol or the smell of Tresemme conditioner, which is what they would put in our hair to make it kind of look dirty and greasy, like would just send me back there. I loved it. I love that smell. Oh yeah.

[01:28:05] I mean, well, the Tresemme was a little strong for me, but like I'm kind of sensitive, but the alcohol smell of the makeup, I just, yeah, that's just such good memories. And that leads into the next Alex Kruger says, I've been so excited to hear you recover your

[01:28:21] experience. So adding the infamous Gracie Liu is just so much better. He says, all right, so this is going to sound crazy, but I've always hated the sensation of feeling sticky or caked on with anything.

[01:28:33] What was the makeup like and how uncomfortable slash in what ways were they uncomfortable when they were asking for extras for the ones who live? I considered it since I'm so close to Philly and Jersey, but I just couldn't bring myself to check it out for fear.

[01:28:45] I'd be uncomfortable for 14 hours a day for four days, LOL. And I, if I remember right, because it's this alcohol based stuff, it's very dry and it didn't feel to me like that much of anything caked on.

[01:29:02] It was a lot cleaner feeling than I thought it was going to be. Yeah. It's very, very lightweight. I mean the prosthetics, um, they, it's different cause you kind of get a little bit itchy and you don't want to mess with it too much.

[01:29:15] But, um, yeah, I think that the airbrush makeup, it was, it's pretty comfortable. Um, and especially because for this episode, it's so cold, you're not sweating or anything, but you know, I was, I did the prison, um, some prison episodes where you're outside

[01:29:31] and it's like 90 degrees and you're just sweating and sweating. So you're sweating off the makeup, you know, it gets in your eye and, and they're having to retouch the makeup on constantly because of all the, the sweating. It's kind of a pain, but it's pretty comfortable. I'd say.

[01:29:48] Yeah. I was surprised. Uh, I'll make a trace. How long did the makeup take and what kind of directions? Wait, that's just one question. How long did the makeup take? I can't remember cause uh, I, I did get to do the prosthetics the next time I was on

[01:30:03] in the season three finale. And I think that took about three hours, but the assembly line just spray on for the mid ground zombies. I think that just took like 15 minutes, right? 15, 20 minutes. Yeah. It was just like 15, 20 minutes.

[01:30:14] I mean, I feel like, um, getting wardrobe the first time that you just kind of have your outfit and you have to, you would, then you wear it for the every other filming.

[01:30:24] So, but the first time you get it and they're like making dirty and, um, you know, just picking it out and making sure things fit and all that, that took much longer than the makeup. Yeah.

[01:30:35] Because they, they did, they had it down pat, get your base layer and then you get the dark and then you get your hair done and yeah. And then she asked, uh, what kind of directions did they give you as far as how to act like a Zed?

[01:30:52] I don't remember getting any direction. No, like I didn't like every, I think that's the number one question I get is, um, about zombie school and I didn't go to zombie school.

[01:31:02] I, I, but you know, I've seen videos of zombie school and I'm like, Oh my God, those people are terrible. How did you like, there's some really bad guy. The night that we were there was just so bad. He, he looked so weird.

[01:31:16] I was like, what the fuck are you doing? And, and I, and Greg Nicotero just kept coaching him and I'm like, if I think Greg's a really nice guy, cause I would have just subbed him out at this point. Yeah.

[01:31:27] I was actually, um, one time on home, I think it was, or one of the prison ones. Um, you know, there was like this, this younger guy and I don't know if he had this his first

[01:31:40] time or what, but he was out front and I was kind of out in the back, whatever they had sent me out in the back and I couldn't see what was going on, but you know, we went through

[01:31:49] a few things and all of a sudden they're like, Hey you, and pointing to me, they're like, you know, switch out with this guy. And then they put me up front and I'm like, Oh, obviously he was like a big fail of his long zombie walk.

[01:32:00] I don't know. I couldn't see what was going on, but I'm like that, that's pretty bad. Yeah. I don't know if you, I probably told you the story if you didn't witness it, but I was,

[01:32:11] um, there were five of us and we were all coming for Herschel and he was supposed to shoot each one of us, um, in succession and I was number five and I'm pretty sure he was

[01:32:25] cause we do a few takes usually of each scene and he was only shooting four times. So I wasn't falling down because he wasn't shooting me and they told me he was going to.

[01:32:35] So I raised my hand to the assistant director who was directing that sequence and I was like, excuse me, but he's not shooting me. And so I, I, I don't know if I should follow or what.

[01:32:46] And she's like, are you trying to tell me how to do my job? Like that? I was like, Oh God. And I didn't realize it, but I figured it out after a while that if you're an extra,

[01:32:55] you just need to keep your mouth closed and do what you're told. That's Polly. She was actually pretty sweet. So she, that was, um, she was frustrated or something. And I, um, I was like, Oh, I'm so sorry. I'm so sorry.

[01:33:06] And then after that, the other extras who were around, they were like kind of shunning me a little bit, like, Oh, this is from this guy. And then, uh, like a scene right after that, I stumbled out to go after Herschel.

[01:33:20] And when they broke the Polly, the assistant director came over to me and she goes, I think that's one of the best zombie walks I've ever seen. And I think she felt bad about dressing me down.

[01:33:31] And so then all the other extras around were like, what were you doing? Show me. That was kind of, that was kind of traumatic actually. Yeah. Yeah. That would be. Yeah. I'm glad she did that. At least she made up for it. Okay. Let's see.

[01:33:52] Oh, I guess that's, that's all the questions. There weren't a whole lot, but I was just gonna, um, see if we had any other like random memories that stood out. Anything else come to mind for you? I don't know.

[01:34:06] I mean, I think some of my most favorite memories are, or, or some two that I didn't like, but, um, was the whole, uh, picking out the wardrobe process and everything. And, um, Eulen Womble was, was the one in charge back in those days.

[01:34:23] And, um, you know, just how, how they go about doing it and they get a character. I remember one time, um, it wasn't this episode. It was a different one. They got all dressed and I was feeling like I was feeling myself. I thought I looked pretty cool.

[01:34:37] And, and Eulen's like, Oh, I like that. You look, you know, you look like a soccer mom. And I was like, she could have just shot me and I would have felt better. I was like, that just brought me down. I was just so sad.

[01:34:47] I was like, I look like a soccer ball. I don't want to look like, and I want to look like myself, you know, basically. She's Eulen Womble. Yeah. She, I think she was South African or something.

[01:34:59] This beautiful woman with lots of style and she was like really cool. She went to a Walker's school. And she always had her, um, little black and white shih tzu there. Uh, Pablo, I think it was.

[01:35:12] And like on some of the, some of the sets when, um, there weren't very many people like, you know, Pablo would just be trotting around, you know, back there in wardrobe and back where we're like waiting.

[01:35:21] And so I would like, uh, kill some time, you know, playing with Pablo and scratching them. But, you know, I just like the whole experience of, you know, getting having to get dirty and they would really look at you. I mean, they're like, oh no, that's not enough.

[01:35:36] And they put a little splatters on you. And that was just, I think it's like you're the canvas and they were the artist. Yeah. Then they were, they were total artists.

[01:35:46] It was, it was a great, I think the whole process of just getting in costume and, and the makeup too was just so much fun. Cause I, um, you weren't supposed to take any pictures, but I think later they started

[01:36:01] taking people's cell phones away, but they didn't back then. So I went in the little like, you know, was it like an outhouse or something or a bathroom? And the trailer, the bathroom trailer.

[01:36:12] And I took pictures of myself in there cause I wanted to have something to remember it. And I'm so glad I did that. And then I took one picture of the farmhouse too.

[01:36:21] But, um, yeah, I was just so impressed when I went in there of how cool it looked. And, and that reminds me too, when some, when a shot looked good, they would always tell

[01:36:32] us after, or sometimes you could even tell by their reactions, they were just like, oh, yeah, that looks so good. So I enjoyed that. Like they would just like, when we were reaching out for them from the barn or, um, one time

[01:36:45] me and a couple other zombies, when we were approaching from far out in the grass, we would stumble over this wire fence and they, they would say, that looks good. What you guys are doing, keep doing that. So I thought that was really neat. They would do that.

[01:36:57] What about you, Lucy? Do you have any questions about any of this? No, it's just been amazing to listen. I've wondered about the barn. Um, did you get paid? Yeah, we did. It was like eight bucks an hour. Yeah.

[01:37:11] Oh, just like a year or two ago, I was cleaning out this dresser of mine and I found a couple like uncashed checked and I was like, oh man, I should go cash these.

[01:37:20] And then I thought it was like, you know, within 90 days, I was like, damn, you know, that $50 or whatever it was. Yeah. I think I made like maybe $500 for the four days and I was so stoked to have a check that

[01:37:34] said walking dead on it and I would have totally paid to do that. So yeah, it wasn't about getting paid at all. And when I did the seed three finale, I had to fall backwards and they gave me an extra 50 bucks for that.

[01:37:49] Well, how come we didn't get any extra money on season this one? Yeah, I think they didn't. I can't tell you how many times I fell. I know. I think that came later. I didn't get any bumps nor did I get any training on how to fall properly.

[01:38:04] Yeah. But I was fine. There was so much grass there. Yeah. So when were you, what other appearances did you both make? So Jason, you did the season three finale. Was that your final one? That's it. Yeah. What about you, Grace? When?

[01:38:17] Yeah, I don't know the exact episodes, but it was all season three, but I was, you know, like at the prison, mostly all prison stuff. And then that one where Michonne gets the second set of walkers. Do you remember that?

[01:38:32] And there's some really, I get a lot of face time in that one and some good shots. Oh, I'm going to be looking out for you now. But mostly everything was either in the prison or outside the prison fence or inside the prison. Yeah.

[01:38:50] Just outside of the building. Yeah. Brilliant. So I made a few just random notes. I'll just go through. So one time I was walking around the lot looking for a bathroom and I couldn't find it.

[01:39:04] And someone just happened to come out of one of the buildings and I was like, excuse me, do you know where the bathroom is? And she pointed it out to me and I realized right after she pointed it out and I started

[01:39:13] walking away that it was Melissa McBride. So I got directions to the bathroom. Andrew Lincoln was super nice. He at one point stopped everything and said, I don't think these extras have earplugs and we're about to start firing our guns. Oh yeah, yeah. So we got earplugs.

[01:39:32] That was when we were like in that little corral area. Yes. Right by the, yes. Really nice. And he would like tease us and pretend to shoot at us in between and stuff like that.

[01:39:43] Irony Singleton, I remember at one point we were all just sort of milling around and he came out and I was just like, there's T-Dog. That is so cool.

[01:39:52] I just was looking at him and he looked over and saw me and I guess he could just tell by the look on my face. He just came, walked through a few other people and gave me a hug without even saying a word. Sweet. He's a hugger.

[01:40:05] That was pretty cool. And yeah, I guess that's about it for that. The only other note I had to mention is for Patreon a couple of years ago or so, I did a video where I went through all my scenes and showed the images and talked a little

[01:40:20] bit about it like we're doing now. So if you guys want to see that, it's on the Patreon. I'll put a link in the show notes. Can I ask a non-extras related question for Grace? Sure. Yeah. Did you fall off the show, Grace?

[01:40:37] Did you finish watching the series as a whole? If you did, what did you think? I know I fell off the show, I should say. Yeah, it was, I think Jason remembers when I got disillusioned or whatever.

[01:40:51] It was like right around the time some things were going down with Carl that didn't happen in the comic and all that. And Jason was like, what season? You don't have to worry about spoilers, by the way. Oh, yeah. So when they killed off Carl.

[01:41:06] But Jason tried to get me to come back. I think the whole garbage people and the bad CGI and then stuff with Carl. And I don't know that I even though I was a comic reader, I don't think I fully recovered from Glenn's death either.

[01:41:26] A lot of people are like that. But yeah, see, the thing is, season seven and eight are universally acknowledged to be the worst of the series. And then when Angela Kang came in as showrunner for season nine, and it changed it. She really refreshed it.

[01:41:41] She's a horror fan. So there was more like horror feel to it and different themes and a faster pace. And they brought in the whispers, which I didn't know if they would translate well to the screen, but they were better on screen than they were in the comic.

[01:41:53] So if you ever get the bug, I would recommend at least checking it out. I mean, I should. It's so wrong to just leave it unfinished. But that's kind of my personality.

[01:42:03] You know, when I get really deep into things and then when the joy is gone, I just leave it and don't really look back. But talking about it, I'm like, yeah, I wish I had that behind me.

[01:42:19] You could honestly start episode one of season nine and not have missed much. Yeah, and I think if you went to season nine, episode one and watched it, you would know whether you want to keep going or not. Probably. I'll have to try it. Yeah.

[01:42:32] But you know, also, like, life is short. Protect your energy. Yeah. Yeah, no shame at all. All right. Let's get into some Lister Mone's Growns Grunts. We'll start off with a little live Steve. Hello, the cast of us.

[01:42:53] This is Steve and this is for Beside a Dying Fire, the season finale of season two of The Walking Dead. OK, where is this? Is this Atlanta that we're starting at? We're oh, and we have a helicopter. That's a lot of walkers breaking down this fence.

[01:43:09] And it was the gunshot that killed Walker Shane that attracted them. I forgot about that. Whoa, Rick and Carl are stuck in the barn and they just lit it on fire and everybody else is in the house. I guess they're not in the house anymore.

[01:43:23] They're on the vehicles because they know they got to get out. I mean, technically, Carl did set the fire and there goes Jimmy. I shouldn't have opened that door, man. I just saw zombie Jason reaching for Rick. And now Patricia.

[01:43:37] I know I went radio silent for a little bit, but Lori and Andrea are going to escape. Not Andrea, Beth. OK, so Andrea is by herself. What happened to Carol? Wasn't Andrea trying to save Carol? I'm confused. I guess that's what we're meant to feel, right? Confusion.

[01:43:51] There's Carol. Daryl's about to get her scene between Maggie and and Glenn. Wow, so good. And Glenn saying that he loves her and he's loved her for a long time. But how long have they actually really known each other? Like two weeks.

[01:44:04] Not to get to the origin of it, but no, Herschel, this is not the resurrection that Christ talked about. OK, just to be clear. And everybody's back together except Andrea. And we're just going to leave her because, you know, just one person. Right.

[01:44:17] But Andrea is alive and she's being chased by walkers through the woods. Now the truth comes out. Rick telling all of them that they're infected. I just realized that Rick was about to say mofo referring to Jenner and they stopped him. All he got was mo out.

[01:44:34] Wow, Rick, that's a lot to hit Lori with all at once. You killed Shane. He wanted it over. Jenner was right. And oh, by the way, Carl had to put Shane down. Oh, that's right. I forgot. Andrea is saved by Michonne.

[01:44:47] How Andrew Lincoln just delivered the this isn't a democracy. This is a dictatorship speech. Great. And we get the final shot of season two of The Prison on to season three. That would have been awesome if he actually said this is a dictatorship. Amazing.

[01:45:05] Where did that term come from? Because I can't think of it as anything else, you know. I don't know. Probably some fan. It's just organic, I guess. It just rolls off the tongue. It does. It rolls off. All right, let's take turns going through these.

[01:45:21] We'll go first, Grace. Okay, this is from Nathan Eshelman. Rest in peace to the season one and two opening credits. This is the last time we'll see Rick in a newspaper and Shane and Lori through broken picture frames.

[01:45:36] I always love the green tint of this opening and the camera sprawling across abandoned Atlanta. Yeah. Can't even remember what's next. Isn't it pretty similar with just different? No more faces. No more faces. Okay.

[01:45:52] Jennifer McGinley says, See when I recently watched a season two finale of another show with a mainly female cast, I did note the similarity between that and the season two finale. Think she might be talking about yellow jackets.

[01:46:04] Season two and season three are by far my most favorite Walking Deads. Be hard pushed to choose between the two. Maybe season three because we no longer have Dale pushing his sanctimonious narrative on everyone.

[01:46:16] Yeah, we're going to just go right into season three since we covered Furiosa a couple weeks ago. So next week, season three, episode one, one of the best. Michelle Jones says, I love the ending of this finale.

[01:46:29] I mean, the whole episode is epic and was absolutely what I was looking for when watching a show about zombies, the big horde of zombies, how you can feel the feeling of terror and being completely overwhelmed and scared beyond belief at what you're seeing.

[01:46:42] But I love the end when the group is around the fire and it pans up to show the prison in the distance, plus the music score behind it. It really made a person excited and hyped for season three. At least it did me.

[01:46:53] Plus the visual was just awesome. I feel like the season two finale was one of the better ones. Nice. Okay, this next one is from Eric Featon. Jason, you and your raccoon eyes deserved an Emmy. Sure.

[01:47:11] Grace, fondest former co-host of mine, you should have received an Oscar for your star turn as Dead Zed behind Reedus. Don't think it was this episode or even the season. I forget. Yeah, definitely not.

[01:47:24] But I can't forget the performance as well as your screen debut and what to expect when you're expecting. I've actually never seen my ever like my family, my friends have seen me in that one. I have. I never went to watch an extra. Yeah.

[01:47:39] I was like trying to get experience so I could, you know, hopefully get on The Walking Dead. Anyway, okay. The RV, rest in peace, gave the finest spoken word essay on the existential meaning of being considered recreational. Earning the first Grammy awarded to a motor vehicle.

[01:47:58] Miss you all. Miss you too, Mr. Blog. And it was sad. We didn't really talk about the RV, but it was sad that something, you know, so iconic from the comic died. All right. Here's a call from Renee. Renee. Hi guys.

[01:48:20] This is Renee calling in about The Walking Dead about Beside the Dying Fire. First of all, I wanted to say, Erin, you did an awesome job. Great job. Love your feedback. Love your perspective. Of course, I don't agree with you.

[01:48:33] Shane could never, ever, ever, ever be a better father than Rick Grimes. Shane was clearly unhinged and he was awful. Just like his girlfriend, Lori. Both of them awful, awful, awful, awful, awful.

[01:48:45] I did not like the way that she reacted towards Rick when Rick told her that he had to put Shane down. For her to react the way that she did on this episode really pissed me off.

[01:48:59] And I wanted to call this call in a couple of weeks ago and he was saying, you know, how his mindset had changed from 14 years ago. Mine as well, because I just don't remember this aggravating me so much like it aggravates me now. Like it really aggravates me.

[01:49:17] Like how could this lady do what she did? And just to think about Carl. Carl. Like, did he know about Shane and his mother? Like, I'm trying to figure that out because, you know, the camp was so small. Were they, did they just let it be known?

[01:49:35] Because it seemed like other people knew or did they keep that from Carl? Because how do you think that made him feel? And it's like, girl, why are you off in the woods doing what you do and calling someone else if you're so concerned?

[01:49:47] I don't understand people saying that she wanted to feel something. At the time, a zombie apocalypse just started three weeks. I'm not feeling shit, but me and my son like glued at the hip to each other. I don't want to feel nothing until we somewhere safe.

[01:50:02] Then I may be able to think about feeling something. But at that time, only thing I'm thinking about is my child and my child's safety. And she is the reason that Carl had to take down Shane because she was supposed to be watching Carl.

[01:50:20] And Carl got out of the house and went to go look for his daddy or whatever the hell Carl went to do because he was always going to do stuff. But yes, Laurie, it was your fault.

[01:50:29] So I'm trying to figure out how in the hell you're going to be mad at Rick and react like react the way that you did. What type of wife are you? You never show no remorse. You never was apologetic.

[01:50:40] And you're going to sit up there like a damn duck and look like a duck. I didn't like that. And I was glad that they cut to Michonne. And I'm glad that he found Michonne because Michonne is his piece and he is Michonne piece.

[01:50:51] And Michonne made sure that his kids was taken care of. And Michonne made sure that she was always there for Rick, even though she didn't agree with everything that Rick did. She would let Rick know that, but she still would be right there beside him, not behind

[01:51:07] him, but right beside him. That is why Laurie and Shane is for the streets. They from the 304. All right. Peace and love. Talk to you guys later. Bye. And my zombie apoca, my zombie sound.

[01:51:25] I really can do it now because that's how I feel about Laurie and Shane. That's amazing. One thing though, like, God, I was pretty much with you the whole way there until you

[01:51:37] got to Michonne making sure the kids were taken care of, because that's the thing about Michonne is she left with, you know, just saying over the walkie talkie, is it all right? Like with Judith and RJ.

[01:51:51] And I always felt like that was just because Denia Grier, of course, wanted to go off and do things, which is totally fine. But then it had this story impact that made it look kind of sketchy to me. But otherwise. Always love to hear from Renee.

[01:52:06] We've got Billy Thompson. He says, love the opening to this one. Also love the trespasses. You're saying I'd love some props from the Walking Dead sets, which makes me wonder. Did you Jason or Grace accidentally, maybe without knowing, acquire anything from the set when you were walkers?

[01:52:20] Did we? I did not. Aside from a couple of pictures of myself. I didn't take anything. Yeah, I don't think I did either. No, I don't know what I would have. But we don't really have access to. I mean, there wasn't really cool stuff you could take. Yeah.

[01:52:41] Yep. Just pictures. Yep. Just memories. Billy goes on to say, Herschel was so badass in this episode, like a captain going down with his ship. And he says one of my favorite Walking Dead quotes to Christ promised a resurrection of the dead.

[01:52:54] I just thought he had something a little different in mind. This is Laurie's worst episode by far to act like that towards Rick after him doing what you asked is ridiculous and unfair.

[01:53:03] I still can't think of a good reason why Rick wouldn't tell them what Jenner told him straight away. Maybe, maybe to keep up morale. But it's so dangerous to get that sort of information from the group and could have led

[01:53:13] to even more deaths if someone were to come back overall great season in my opinion. Can't wait for season three rewatch. Thanks guys. Thanks, Billy. Thanks, Billy. Okay, Elizabeth Schwartz says a few notes I wrote down while watching Jimmy drives up

[01:53:26] the RV to the barn gets surrounded by walkers and then slowly gets out of his seat and goes to the door to look. What do you think was going to happen? You were you weren't meant for this world, my guy. Did nervous Nellie make it off the farm?

[01:53:40] Oh, nervous Nellie. What's originally? Oh, yeah. We don't know. Huh? No, we'll never know. It's walking dead. No. She's either dead or somewhere else. Exactly. Laurie says we have to go and find Carl T dog says they're on their own.

[01:53:59] Absolutely savage response to dog watching Laurie's incredibly sus reaction to Rick killing Shane even after being told that Shane was trying to kill Rick made Michonne's appearance 30 seconds later, even better. That's a good point.

[01:54:12] Carol's a quote man of honor while staring at Darrell with big wet eyes made me so uncomfortable. I'm glad season three puts an end to this strange potential romance and switches focus to the friendship.

[01:54:24] It is season three where she asked him if he wants to go fool around if I remember right. And then our IP officer friendly. Hello, rictatorship. He. All right, that's great. Here is Archmester Renny. Renny. Hi all this is Renny.

[01:54:40] So first I would just like to appreciate the conversation that's been going on about the controversial issues in this show. And I just wish that it would was more possible to get students in university classes as

[01:55:00] I'm involved in an engaged conversation over issues as this fandom has been. It's great. And I appreciate everybody who's written in and called in and Jason and Lucy and their parts in the conversation.

[01:55:18] I think it's really important for us to have these conversations where we can express different points of view, different perspectives and insights and not get mad at each other. And it's awesome. And I just appreciate the whole conversation. Thank you, everyone. Yeah.

[01:55:36] Yeah, we're talking about whether you should have pineapple on pizza and it just got so he really emotional, really emotional. Thank you. Ready? I'm so glad you called it with that. I mean, yeah, and I'm glad you brought the whole thing up.

[01:55:50] And here's the rest of what she had to say. Now I want to change the subject and say another really big thank you to grace. So glad that you're a co-host on this episode.

[01:56:00] It was your comic talk segments that made me read start reading the Walking Dead comics after I had watched the first few seasons of the show. And then I followed you and Mr. Blog into under the comic covers.

[01:56:16] And I read several more of the comics that you were reading on that podcast. And it was great. It got me into a whole new media. So thank you. Amazing. Finally, I have just one word to say about this episode. Michonne! That's her favorite. Yes. All for now.

[01:56:42] Bye. Bye. That was great. Thank you. Okay, our next letter here is from Rachel Teal Edwards. The most perfect couplet of dialogue to kick off the best action sequence yet. This is my farm and I'll die here. All right, as good a night as any.

[01:57:00] Darryl, that was a good line. There are so many awesome moments, but I especially love Patricia being ripped apart while she and Beth are still holding hands and screaming in terror. Jason, I'm excited to hear about your experience again.

[01:57:14] One of the most epic episodes and you were there. We've all been waiting for this moment of Lori's utter shock and disgust that Rick killed Shane. She's awful. Let's focus on Rick. Rick seems understandably confused at first, but as he processes her reaction, he hardens.

[01:57:32] This must have been the purpose behind her over-the-top response. Rick just realized that even his wife doesn't have his back despite his efforts to lead according to the will of the people. He just realized he'll never please everybody and in fact, no matter what he does, some

[01:57:48] will inevitably hate him. So he immediately makes the decision to lead his way to be the leader of the group needs, not the leader each person thinks they want. So fuck you all. This is not a democracy anymore.

[01:58:04] This is why in the words of the early 2000s superstar, Jerule, every thug needs a lady. Enter Michonne. Darryl once again comes through for Rick. Darryl never depended on Shane for survival and read Shane for what he was a long time ago.

[01:58:23] So I'm sure he wasn't surprised at all to hear what Shane did to Rick. It makes the heart. It makes my heart happy to hear Darryl defend Rick so openly and directly. Rick has honor. Damn right. Love the beautiful beginning of their brotherhood.

[01:58:38] Love the beautiful beginning of their brotherhood. It's the real love story of the walking dead. It was Shane and Rick, but that ended tragically. Here's Wendy. Hey, Jason and Lucy. It's Wendy. I wanted to give my feedback for season two, episode 13, beside the dying fire.

[01:59:05] I've really been enjoying the rewatch. Thanks for doing that. I love this episode. I feel like this was the most action we've seen truly since the beginning of the series. It was just an action packed episode. Loved the running from the farm. Loved all of those parts.

[01:59:30] Really cool to know that Gracie and Jason were extras in these scenes. I think that's just so cool. The very ending, which feels like the beginning of the Ricktatorship, kind of felt like manufactured drama. It didn't fit with what had just happened.

[01:59:56] And it kind of felt a little odd and disjointed. I think they were trying to get to the next part of the story. So they needed that to happen, but it just didn't make a lot of sense to me.

[02:00:13] Like Carol trying to convince Daryl to go off on their own. That just seems like something that wouldn't have happened. And I know Lori was upset by what Rick was telling her. And again, a lot of that felt manufactured.

[02:00:31] It didn't feel like that's how she would really respond. So I did feel like the end was just a little disjointed, but I've been loving the rewatch. This episode was just amazing with all the zombie action. Really loved the cold opening.

[02:00:50] Really loved the cold open with seeing the zombies and their behavior. I thought that was really cool and something we didn't get to see enough of in the beginning. So looking forward to all the next episodes.

[02:01:07] Yeah, another thing this season did was kind of starve us for zombie action because it's probably the most zombie-lite season of the show. So when they all came at the end, it was such a rush. Um, Nevada has written in and says,

[02:01:24] Hi Jason and Lucy. This is Nevada from Queensland, Australia. This is my first email to you. Hello, Nevada. I love how this episode starts us right back in the city, a reminder of civilisation lost.

[02:01:35] Then we follow the horde to the farm where we see that chilling shot of Rick and Carl walking away from the camera with the horde following. Creepy and yet exciting. Daryl is talking so much now and he has an air of confidence about him

[02:01:47] as he helps make plans in the house before it all goes to hell. The first time I saw Daryl and everyone else was season four. I was introduced to the school by my teenage daughter who would watch it after high school while I prepped dinner.

[02:01:59] I went from passive watching to full on invested. So I never saw the early Daryl until I went back and binged from the start by myself. Losing the farm would have been a tragedy to Herschel and his family and everyone really.

[02:02:11] They probably thought that it would be where they were staying for an indefinite amount of time. Then they get run off, which would be the way things were from then till the present. For a short time anyway.

[02:02:21] I totally forgot that this was the episode where Rick tells them we are all infected. That was a shocking revelation for him. I've forgotten more than I'd realised. It's still nice to… it's nice to still be surprised after all these years.

[02:02:33] This is my third time through the series but my first time through with you lovely people. When Rick tells Laurie about Shane, I think she's shocked about the reality of Rick killing him, even though she asked for it.

[02:02:43] But I think she's devastated when he says Carl put him down. This apocalypse is turning her little boy into a killer. As a mother, I can empathise, though Laurie really rubs me the wrong way most of the time.

[02:02:55] In the scene at the fire where Rick tells everyone he killed Shane for them, I would be freaking out if I was in that group. The way he tries to justify his reasons, he just sounds unhinged.

[02:03:04] Though I suspect guilt is playing a big role in his emotional state of mind at this point. He emits a scary vibe that gives me the chills. I'd be thinking, could I just leave and go out on my own?

[02:03:14] I'm sure the answer would be no, I'm stuck here. I can't fend for myself and crazy or not this guy knows how to kill. So my chances of survival are greater with this group. Although I'd have to fight my flight response. Nervous laugh.

[02:03:26] Then that amazing pan to the prison just over in the background. They were so close. Maps people, look at your map. One of the best parts of this episode is the introduction of Michonne. Hell yeah. One of the best thought out characters in the series in my opinion.

[02:03:40] She's such an engaging character to watch. I'm excited to get to know her all over again. It was a loss to the depths of the show when Michonne went looking for Rick. I'm really enjoying this rewatch with everyone.

[02:03:51] I always felt like I missed the early years connection with all the fans and you when I found this podcast. Now we get to join in. I enjoy listening to you both and hearing the points of view of you and other fans.

[02:04:01] It's always interesting to hear how other people interpret what they see. Oh, thanks. Nevarda. What a lovely email. It's so good to have you. That's so sweet. Glad you're joining us. I would go back if you're interested because we used to interview the actors in the early seasons

[02:04:18] more and that might be kind of fun. If you go to podcastica.com and just search in with a little search box for any of the actors names, stuff might come up. But anyway, that was great.

[02:04:29] It really brings to mind how in the early parts of the season, like getting to experience it with you and Karen and everybody else. It was such an amazing community and it really, I think, brought so much more,

[02:04:44] you know, just fun and enjoyment of the show, you know, having the whole community. Yeah, it's a whole thing. Yeah, totally. All right. One more call and that's Owen from Leeds. On today's episode of walking with walkers, we see them having a nice time in Atlanta.

[02:05:04] They've finished feasting on a horse and they've been disturbed by a helicopter. Maybe it wasn't a hallucination, one walker thought. We have then wandered and wandered and shambled and wandered and walked and wandered and feasted on a squirrel or two.

[02:05:28] And we're now having a closer look and we are having some more wandering. We're going through the countryside. We've come up on a fence and that fence won't stop our intrepid wanderers. And on the latest moments, do the high tech cameras we have here on walking with wanderers.

[02:05:54] Was it wandering with walkers? I've forgotten the show title now. We can see they are going through the forest in the darkness and they're having a lovely time, perhaps walking towards a stream and a bang goes off in the distance.

[02:06:12] Well, I guess that's it for today's episode of walking with walkers. And we shall get back in touch with them on tomorrow's episode. I'm sure that bang was nothing to worry about and all our intrepid walkers will be perfectly fine.

[02:06:31] And the villainous Shanes and Ricks and Carl's of the world won't harm them, nor will Hershel with his unlimited amount of bullets in his magic rifle. Enjoy another episode of walking with walkers next week. I love it. That was different. I think that Owen is our UK Randy.

[02:07:00] I think Randy should team up. They should team up. Yeah, do something guys. That shows me why this show is not from the point of view of the walkers. But I also know I loved it. I'm just kidding. But I do.

[02:07:15] I always did wish that they would have done an episode mostly from the point of view of a zombie. I don't know how they could have done it, but if they got really creative with it, but they never did. All right. That is our show. Episode 585.

[02:07:32] Thanks as always for listening, everybody. Grace, thanks a lot for coming on. I'm so glad that you wanted to do it. And it was just really fun to have you talk about it and everything and relive the memories.

[02:07:43] I really, you know, just doing that, having you there really did make it a lot better because I felt like we were just kind of giddy to experience it together. And it was great to have someone I knew there.

[02:07:56] Yeah, it was so nice to be able to experience it with someone else. And man, but who is it? Was it Renee? 14 years? Has it really been 14? I think it's been like 12. Yeah, 12. 12. I mean, I can't believe it's been that long.

[02:08:15] Anyway, it was great to like for moments, I felt like I was back there, you know? It was great to relive it. It's cool. All right. So next episode of the podcast, we're going to go right into The Walking Dead season three, episode one, Seed.

[02:08:33] If you want to write in or leave us a voice message about it, you can find all our contact information at podcastgo.com. While you're there, please check out our other podcast. House of the Dragon just started up.

[02:08:45] By the time most of you will be hearing this, season two, episode one will be out. And we have a podcast episode already out about, you know, like a pregame for the series with Wendy and Renny is on there and Veronica.

[02:09:01] And they're going to be hosting this season, you know, weekly. And they'll be doing like a book talk section and everything. So if you're into that show, highly recommend checking out our podcast on it, which is called Dragon Cast.

[02:09:11] I also want to mention this episode is made possible by Patreon supporters like Kelly who've pledged their support at patreon.com slash Jason Kabassi. So thank you to Kelly.

[02:09:20] As I mentioned, I did a video where I went through a bunch of clips and images of me as a Zedd and talked about where exactly they are in each episode. So anyone who pledges to Patreon can see that.

[02:09:28] And also I want to mention this is actually not kind of not totally a Patreon thing. Anyone can get in on this. Recently, everyone in the Patreon group made a list of over 100 favorite characters from shows that Podcastica has covered.

[02:09:41] And now in the Podcastica Facebook group, we're doing a bracket style tournament where we vote in rounds on pairs of characters and we're going to winnow it down to see who the favorite is. And then they'll go up against whoever that is.

[02:09:53] We'll go up against the reigning champ for when we did this a couple of years back. And that was Rick Grimes. So we'll see who it is. But we've got Yellow Jackets characters, Game of Thrones, you know, Rings of Powers,

[02:10:04] from all the different shows going up against each other. We have Randy, I mean, not Randy, Margaret's up there. Poor, all the Welcome to the Apocalypse people had to go up against House of the Dragon people. So it's kind of a red wedding over there.

[02:10:19] What if it's Rick versus Rick? No, because Rick's not in it. Oh, he's not in it. I left him out. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Rick versus Rick. Which one would you rather see? But anyway, if you want to find that, just go to Facebook and search for

[02:10:33] Podcast Tico or there's also a link in the show notes. All right, that is our show. Thanks for listening. Don't get bit, Eric Featon.