Lanterns S1E1 "Pilot"

[00:00:00] Hmm? Ah! Huh. But why did you stick around? What were you looking for? I mean, I get when I showed up, you couldn't run, you had to blend in. But before that... I just went to a high school football game, man. With the other Kimball fans who are all dead now. I don't know them, okay? I told you, I drive a truck. Yeah, I'm sure you can tell me a lot about that truck, but I bet you can't tell me about the Boston Tea Party.

[00:00:27] Kelly Clarkson, Barack Obama, or Root... Barack Obama is the President of the United States. That's it? As a rural Nebraskan, that's the breadth of your opinion of Barack Hussein Obama. He's the 44th President, he followed George W. Bush, there's some controversy surrounding his birth certificate. Holy shit, you are an alien.

[00:01:01] Hey everybody, welcome to the podcast. I'm Jason. And I'm Kirk. And I'm Jim. And this is Wax Episodic. And this episode, we're covering Lanterns, Season 1, Episode 1, Pilot. Pilot. Because he's a pilot. Yeah. It's very clever. And this is... And the first episode is kind of like a pilot.

[00:01:29] It's kind of like our pilot, except we did do an intro podcast with background on this show and why we wanted a podcast about it. So we won't go over that again. But just briefly, we're all longtime comic readers. We like the Green Lanterns. And we're fans of the creators of the show, Chris Mundy, who did Ozark and True Detective. Damon Lindelof, who did Lost and Watchmen and The Leftovers. And Tom King, who did The Vision and Mr. Miracle and a bunch of other cool comics. So that's why we're doing it.

[00:01:59] And now that we've seen the first episode, we'll tell you if we're glad we made that decision. Let's read the plot summary first. All right. So the plot summary. 1986, Hal Jordan is chosen as the successor of Green Lantern, Abin Sir, after he crashes his ship and dies.

[00:02:20] In 2016, Hal and John Stewart have a mentor-mentee relationship and travel to Rushville, Nebraska, after Jon receives a cryptic message from a holographic projection of Hal's younger consciousness within his ring. John helps Sheriff Kerry Kane capture a suspect involved in a mass shooting. But Kerry forbids Hal from joining the investigation, believing the case has no extraterrestrial connection. Hal gets himself arrested for a bar fight and is bailed out by lawyer Billy Macon, Kerry's husband.

[00:02:50] In return, he agrees to meet Kerry's father-in-law, William, who arranges for Hal to interrogate the suspect, Waylon Sanders. During the interrogation, Hal exposes Sanders as an alien. Sanders detonates a bomb in his body, but Hal uses the last of his ring power to contain the damage. In 2026, John returns to Rushville, where Kerry shows him a dead and frozen Hal who is also missing his ring.

[00:03:16] We were speculating that he may, like, Hal might end up dying in this at some point. What? No mystery. No mystery there. At least we can talk about it now. Yeah, because now we can talk about it. I'm watching the episode. I'm watching the episode, writing all the notes down like, ooh, look, there's an illusion to him, Mike dying at the end of the series. And I was like, what the? Now, I agree. I believe he's dead. Yeah.

[00:03:46] But you never know. They went to great lengths to show us that holographic message and the fact that it looks like him and it's three-dimensional and everything else. So, who knows? It's comics. You know what I mean? It's comics, right. Did he have a bullet hole in his head? He had a bullet hole in his head and there was a little bit of blood coming down. Yeah. But again, that could be a holographic projection, I suppose. Although it seemed like he was 3D and holographs are usually light only.

[00:04:12] But us and a lot of others, we thought that it seemed like this series was setting it up for the passing of the torch. Yeah. So, he could be dead, but we don't know. For sure. For sure. I just, when you talk about these three showrunners though, and you talk about the feels of their series and the things that they do and the red herrings that they use, the best part about it.

[00:04:40] And we're going to talk about how we feel about the episode, but I thought, as I was watching this show, I kept thinking about all of the little red herrings that were kind of like placed in there all the way. And I was just so excited because I'm like, oh, that's probably a Lindelof thing. And oh gosh, that's probably a King thing. And I'm just like, at the end of it, I'm like, oh, this is like all of them. Like, this is what they all sat down and we're talking about. It's like an orchestra. Yeah.

[00:05:04] Those guys are like, I'm sure, I know that when they decided to have Hal killed at the end, all three of them were giddy about that. They're like, oh yeah, this is why we want to do this. Let's just do it in the first episode. That's really fuck with them. Yeah, exactly. So there are a couple, I mean, it's kind of funny. We're starting at the end. And first of all, the lead up to it was pretty crucial because for instance, John is driving. He's not flying.

[00:05:34] So he doesn't have a ring yet. Yeah. Right. Two, he passes by the... The Macon farm. Yeah, the farm and it's destroyed. Mm-hmm. So we know a lot of shit went down. She greets him very affectionately. So they now have a rapport and a relationship, whereas it's pretty animosity. There's a lot of animosity in the beginning. Mm-hmm. So, but then the ring... And then the ring is not there.

[00:06:03] Hal doesn't have the ring either, yeah. He doesn't have the ring and Hal doesn't have the ring. Did that ring go to Guy Gardner? The Guy Gardner's ring looks different. Mm-hmm. Oh, it does? Yeah. I looked it up because I wanted the same thing. So, I don't think so. Just very interesting. Yeah. Great, great, great, great episode. It's a mystery. Yep. That's what we want. Well, what do you guys think of the episode? You just said it. Great, great, great. Yeah.

[00:06:29] I love the way the story's structured, the time jumps, the learning as we go instead of explaining everything. You know what I mean? That's always greatly appreciated in a show. You know, show me, don't tell me. Yeah. And where you get to kind of figure things out a little bit. Yeah. One episode in, and I'd say it's on par with Superman in regards of how good it is. I was like really, really pleasantly surprised. I wish Supergirl had had this kind of clarity of writing and vision and execution.

[00:06:58] And I wondered if they should have made this as a film instead of a series. You know? It's really good. I mean, the fact that we're one episode in and the questions that we have, the, you know, the true detective part of this, which we would assume was the mass shooting. And now it turns out that it's not necessarily that. And there's still all of these underlying questions that they laid out so well in the first episode. So methodically told. And you can do an episode like this really wrong.

[00:07:29] But there was not a moment where the, the, the, the pacing was so intensely steady that I just was riveted. I mean, I, I granted, I was, I was pretty pumped up about this series. So I might be a little biased, but I think there's a reason. I mean, there's a reason why shows on HBO show up at Sunday at nine o'clock. And this one, this one, clearly the executives at HBO said, this is a nine o'clock show. We need to do this.

[00:07:58] So I just, every, and we'll get into the points that we've all kind of alluded to, but I, I just, the, everything, the acting, the way that the episodes were staged, the cartoon parts of it, the comic parts of it. Versus the true detective parts of it. They did so well. I just, everything I think that we needed to see in this episode, we got to see, but it was only, it was like getting that for, like you're sitting at Thanksgiving and you smell all the food all day long. That's what we're doing right now. We're smelling all the food.

[00:08:27] It smells really, really freaking good. They're setting the table. Um, I liked it. It, it, it took me most of the first episode, maybe a little over halfway, 60% of the way through where I really started to feel hooked in. And then second watch, I liked it a lot better.

[00:08:49] Um, there were a couple of problems for me on first watch where I thought people were acting so, uh, out of bounds or ridiculous that ridiculously reckless that it took me out of it a little bit. But, um, there's, that's just like two or three different things. And aside from that, I love the way it came together. And when I did start getting into it, I was like, okay, good, good, good. I'm really, really getting hooked in now. This is such a great scene.

[00:09:16] And then that made me appreciate the beginning more when I watched a second time. Um, I, I love the characters. I like the tone a lot, the intrigue, and I'm a huge fan of Ozark and, uh, what's his name? Chris Mundy. He was the showrunner of that. He's the main, I think of the three, the main showrunner of this. The actual showrunner. It really felt a lot like Ozark to me in a lot of ways. And so I appreciated that.

[00:09:40] And, you know, I'm on board some more of that with, you know, some, uh, Damon Lindelof and, and, uh, Tom King and comic bookness added in. So, yeah, I, I was relieved when, once I really started to get hooked into it. Performances were awesome, you know, really good. Oh. Really good writing. Yeah. I mean, the dialogue was excellent.

[00:10:02] The way things progressed, they weren't dragged out, but yet they weren't so fast, they weren't comfortable. You know what I mean? Like the, the, the chemistry between the two of the two leads between John and, and how it was just fantastic. But it was very, you know, there was a lot of animosity and, you know, one didn't respect the other. But within the first episode, you see that change. Yeah.

[00:10:30] I mean, by the end of the episode, both of them are starting to develop respect for each other already. You know what I mean? And I also think even from the start, it's complicated because I feel like Hal is testing John by being poking at him and stuff, but also that's coming from a place of resentment because he doesn't want someone to take over his job. So it's kind of both.

[00:10:53] And I also think that John is kind of exasperated with how his recklessness and his like, cause John, I mean, John is a rule follower and he says, you know, everybody has a boss and he's like by the book. And he wants to check with the sheriff before he goes out on the field, the chain of command.

[00:11:11] And he, he doesn't like it that Hal just flouts all of that, but yet he's still from the beginning has a level of huge respect for Hal and he, the house like his hero.

[00:11:24] So I feel like all of that's going on all at once for both of them, you know, the pair Aaron Pierre, Aaron Pierre to me, I mean, there were a lot of great performances, but the difference between his character and every scene that we see from you, even if you start at the end, like the love that he's showing, uh, Carrie Kane and that scene. And it's so different from who we see when they first meet.

[00:11:49] Uh, and, and the funny thing is when, when he's asked like, do you even like him? And, and he's like, yeah, I respect him. And you think of that parallel to his father, by the way, I mean, that's three dads. That was one of the big things that took me out of it.

[00:12:13] I mean, you know, yeah, I mean, I, so, but, but the parallel of his dad, you know, I was expecting him to take him out and like lash him or something like that.

[00:12:31] Anyways, you can see though, what he took from his relationship with his father to how, you know, how is, as confounding as he is, he is still his mentor and he still treats him with respect. And when he, when he flies, when he flies off to Rushville, he's still just, okay, motherfucker gets in the car, goes to the airport, gets on the plane. Yeah, exactly. Does what he's supposed to do. Yeah. And, and his dad would always coach him to keep his cool. Right.

[00:13:00] Even when he called up his dad, he just tried to kill me. He, that's just a test, you know, or whatever. You got to be cool. You got, and he, he did keep his cool with every single other person all the time. The only time he lost his cool was when he was on his phone with his dad, because I think he feels like, oh, this is the only person I can be totally comfortable with. Yeah. I'm safe with this guy. That just shows the bond that they have together, despite what we saw in 1996.

[00:13:25] I got to ask though, you know, like it, it seems to me that the, the father and the son were already on a mission. Yeah. Before, before how was he just, you know, as soon as how came on the scene or even before he was even interviewed in that TV thing. Cause he came in and he said, do you know his name now? And he said, how? Yeah. And he said, you know. How something. How something. Are you afraid?

[00:13:55] Yeah. And he said, are you afraid? So he'd been working with him on conquering his fear, which he, they knew already. So that was, I thought, interesting. You know what I mean? That they, and then they're still right up to this point when he calls him, like you said, he's, he's still consulting with his father. It's almost like a, a father, son coach kind of relationship. Yeah. You got this job. You just, it's yours to lose or whatever. But he's been, but he's been going for it since he was a kid.

[00:14:24] And it makes me wonder, cause we learn that the guardians chose John to be Hal's backup or replacement or whatever, but we don't see that. And we don't really, it's very vague, but it makes me wonder if they chose him when he was a child and he already knew that. And that's why his father's training him or did they choose him because his father was already training him? And then he became, I mean, it seems more likely that they chose him when he was a child. Right. But we don't know.

[00:14:55] Yeah. I mean, and yeah, that's a great point. I hadn't thought of what are they conspiring to do to get him chosen? I just, my first point was the layers of it all. And this is one of those layers, right? To the show where everything has depth, like all of these things that we find out has this depth to it. When we meet this random lady in the bar, by the way, how, how great was that film? As you're watching it, you see this like hazy lady in the back who turns out to be William Macon there. So what's her plot in this?

[00:15:23] Like when, when he meets Will Macon's wife and I can't remember her name off the top of my head, you've, you've got, you've got the layer of who William Macon is. Like what, what, what's he do? You know, he's, he's talking about essentially like xenophobia. He's talking about, you know, this, this militia that he's creating and he's not the boss. And then you start thinking, well, wait a second, who's funding all this? And then maybe you make some connections to Superman or something like that. They layer this so well.

[00:15:51] And, and you're watching that scene with, with, um, you know, the father and the son with him shooting the apple. And you're thinking that there definitely seems something nefarious about that now. But there's layers to that too. Is it nefarious? Was he already picked? If he was already picked, why didn't they know how Jordan's name? I mean, in hindsight, it seems pretty clear that he was training him to be fearless. Are you afraid? And it seems like that's related to becoming the next Green Lantern.

[00:16:20] Cause then he was like, well, what's his name? But yeah. Well, it would make sense that he didn't know his name too, because remember that interview was the first time they, they interviewed a superhero. So yeah. I'm going to go into my first point, which is kind of laying out the backstory in case anybody isn't familiar. Cause there was a lot of exposition in this one of setting the table, like we said, and maybe people aren't totally familiar with it. And some of it might've slipped by and you guys let me know if I, if I miss anything.

[00:16:48] But, um, so how Jordan saw his father die in a plane crash at a young age, it was kind of morbid that they show it in the news report. Yeah. So here's the picture of his father dying. Boom, plane exploding. Um, and then, uh, towel later went into the air force and became a test pilot. It was a very interesting to do thing to do when you saw your father die in a plane. And I think that's a very relevant to the whole story actually, that he chose to do that.

[00:17:16] Um, at some point, if you believe what he said, what house said to John, he was abducted from his room by a green glowing thing and asked if he was afraid. And when he said no, it zipped him a couple hundred miles away to Rushville, Nebraska, where he found a pink injured barfing alien, uh, Abin Sur, who I guess had crash landed. Right. Yeah.

[00:17:41] Abin Sur gave him the ring and told him the ring chosen to be his successor, to maintain the peace and sovereignty of sector two eight one four. So he became a green lantern, which is a member of a group of other beings from around the universe with powered rings charged with protecting the universe and maintaining peace. Hal says we're beat cops, except each one of us has a chunk of the galaxy.

[00:18:03] So then we see in 1996, young John Stewart watching the first interview with Hal on TV. First ever interview with a superhero of any kind. Wait a minute. Wait a minute. You're not going to mention the whispered words that I'll, I'll just send. The last, his final words were either good luck or off. Classic. Sure. Which it's, you thought it was going to be something really poignant when he started going into that.

[00:18:33] Uh, so the interviewer says that how Jordan appeared as green lantern 10 years earlier when he like diverted a meteor that was going to crash into earth. So from the 2025 Superman movie, we know that Superman appeared in 2022. So green lantern had been there for like 35 years or so before.

[00:18:55] And by the way, for people who don't know, this show is part of the new DCU, you know, the movie DC universe headed up by James Gunn. This Superman from 2025 peacemaker, the Supergirl movie that just came out and the creature commandos cartoon.

[00:19:14] And so, and the clay face movie that's coming up and Superman, uh, in that movie, it said that the first superpower beings called meta humans appeared on earth three centuries ago. Um, and then three years prior to this movie, which is set in 2025, a grown Kal-El refilled himself publicly as Superman. And so now we know that green lantern had been around for a while before that, and it was kind of considered the first superhero.

[00:19:42] So even though there were super powered beings, I guess he's the first one that had this costume and flew around protecting people and stuff. Well, he's, he's not an eight, but he's not an alien. He's not a super, he's not a meta human. And the ring gives him the power. It's not like he gets. He's not like Superman. Meta humans, even if their power power comes from some, something else. Maybe not. Yeah. I wouldn't think so. No. Okay. I'm not sure about that. Yeah. Yeah.

[00:20:10] Uh, but he is, the reporter does call him the first superhero. Yes. Then at some point, John Stewart was chosen by the guardians of the universe to replace Hal Jordan. Uh, I guess the way they put it is if anything happened to Hal. Hal. And, um, it seems like his father's training.

[00:20:30] And for that, as we said, you mentioned this before, but we're not sure what John being chosen as backup for Hal means for Guy Gardner, who we see as the green lantern in Superman in 2025. Right. Because John tells that woman, Zoe here, earth has one lantern and someone else says to John, one of those cops, I thought there was only one green lantern.

[00:20:51] So when we see neither John nor Hal having the ring at the flash forward to 2026 in this episode, you wonder if maybe Guy is the only green lantern. But as I said, his ring looks different, but also in this episode, that hologram or whatever of Hal said lanterns don't have trainees from their own sector. And John says they do now. So maybe the rules are changing and maybe there will be multiple lanterns at once.

[00:21:17] Well, I think it lays out a nice mystery about that and question about that. Like, why are they changing this now? And why with Hal? And why aren't they just replacing him and everything else? Yeah. And I think that's going to all— Do they think they made a mistake with Hal and they're correcting it or something? Yeah, I think that's going to be—well, I don't know about that, but I think it's all tied in with Sinestro.

[00:21:39] And I think the fact that Sinestro is, at least in the comics and in the traditional story, that's who trains Hal. Well, so we're going to do a comic talk section at the end. And I feel like if there's any story points that might—from the comics that might hint at future storylines in the show, we can talk about it specifically there in case people don't want spoilers.

[00:22:07] But that's all I had for just sort of the backstory of these two characters, the comic bookiness of it all. I do just want to say, I listened to the pod—there's an official podcast. In the podcast, Tom King said that the ring that Guy Gardner has is Hal's ring. Oh, he did? He did. Oh, okay. So maybe he can make it look different? It was—yeah, that must be it.

[00:22:35] But he said one of the big parts of this series is that at the end of the episode, we see that John doesn't have the ring. And why does Guy end up with the ring? And where do we go from here? And we know that from trailers that Guy Gardner does show up at some point. What timeline are we on when we see him? What's going on here?

[00:23:00] And I think, you know, when we get to the comic talk, we can talk a little bit about maybe the comic book. I feel nervous. I don't like talking about stuff that wasn't in the episode because I don't want people to be like, you're spoiling future things what are you talking about? You sons of bitches. But it's all relevant. Yeah. I just want to be—I want to be really careful about that, you know? Yeah, of course.

[00:23:22] To the point, to just the backstory, I did think that they did a nice job of, like, lore building. I think that having Hal as the first superhero in this. And, you know, we do get to see a little bit of him kind of—you know, he's sitting there at that taco stand. And everybody loves him there.

[00:23:46] So we see this, like, crass, like, this, you know, guy who swears every three seconds, who's driving John nuts, who, you know, is driving around this, like, you know, this beautiful, you know, Buick. And he's just not, you know, who you picture as a superhero. And then we see him at this taco stand where everybody there loves him.

[00:24:08] And you can see that they—I think they just did a really nice job of lore building by explaining it a bit to us, but also showing who these characters are. And I thought—maybe I misread it, but the way Kyle Chandler played it, he enjoyed the attention, but he wasn't—you didn't feel like he was doing it for the intention or that he was a narcissist or anything. He was just being a good— No. Just being a good—like a good celebrity, you know? Yeah. Being cool to his fans.

[00:24:39] Yeah, definitely. I definitely got that vibe. Also, I liked how that—the James Gunn universe is approaching the relationship between the heroes and the people of the world, similar to the way the MCU does it. And DC had never done that, you know what I mean? I mean, the relationship between the average guy on the street and Batman and Superman from Snyder—Snyderverse movies.

[00:25:08] They were a non-factor. They were rubble. They were buried under the rubble of his destruction. They're afraid of him. Or with Superman, sometimes they treat him like a god. Yeah. Yeah. So, and this was much more like, you know, he's a hero. He's like, you know, Captain America showed up and, you know, so I like that change to the DCU, you know?

[00:25:32] Which is definitely connected to your point, to Superman, how they portrayed Superman in the movie, where he could be a god, but he chose to follow the rules of, you know, of where he lives. And that gives that— In spite of his parents' wishes. Yeah. Well, and I think that, you know, the problem with Superman over the years has been a simple one to solve.

[00:26:00] Like, he—and I think Christopher Reeve, like, did this really well, and I think we're seeing it now with these heroes, with starting with Superman and now with Green Lantern, where they understand who they are and the roles that they are. And their power isn't consuming. It's morally given, and they use it in a moral sense. So, I do think—I really enjoyed that small little snippet of a scene with him at the taco stand because he felt—he's human, don't get me wrong, but he didn't feel like a superhero.

[00:26:30] He felt like a superhero who was, like, giving back a little bit and eating some tacos and drinking some beer. But that's, you know. All right. What else do you want to talk about? One other thing that I wanted to comment on from the last segment, because we didn't just touch on it, but the bullet hole in his head.

[00:26:53] First of all, he certainly doesn't look like he, you know, was in the middle of a battle or distressed or it's like—that was like a sniper bullet. Mm. He was sitting there, and someone popped him. And the fact that it looked like a long-range sniper type of hit is kind of interesting because John's a sniper.

[00:27:22] And they make sure to tell us that. Yeah, that's true. Yeah. Yeah. You know, because there could be a twist just to—I wonder if they haven't plotted this, the two of them, together. Hmm. This death in order to—or faked it, or he chose to go out this way and, you know, because of some thing we're going to learn in terms of their, you know, way of dealing with whatever it is they're dealing with that we haven't even seen yet.

[00:27:52] But I just thought it was interesting that it was that kind of a kill. Yeah. And that John happens to be a sniper. But just a little— Yeah, I just—I can't decide, like, did they put that at the end of the first episode to be a MacGuffin, or did they do it because there's something more to it? I—yeah, I don't know. I love it, though. Well, with Lindelof, that's the kind of thing Lindelof would do. Yeah. That's a lost type thing, you know what I mean? Oh, for sure. Oh, for sure.

[00:28:21] And it had that feel to me. It so had that feel. Yeah. I do want to talk about—I think the thing that impressed me the most for my first point here is the pacing of the episode. When I see that a show is going to use timeline storytelling where you're jumping back and forth, there's ways you can—I mean, it's almost a cliche to do it now. There's been so many different series that have done it, and we've been pounded with this is going to be another true detective series.

[00:28:50] This is going to be another true—and it's so hard to run that fine line. But the pacing of this show, which at first I thought was going too slow. And when I was listening to you, Jason, talk about how it took you to maybe 60% into the show, I totally understand that. And it sort of felt like we were kind of out in the ocean, you know, getting the first signs of that tsunami when it's not so high, and it just kept building and building and building. Yeah. I was trying to get that, too, I remember. It took me a while to get hooked into that show, and then I was.

[00:29:19] And it wasn't that it was building faster. It was moving at the same speed the whole time. And I just—there was nothing abrupt to the time jumps. There was nothing to the time jumps that were confusing. It was very clear that they were jumping times. We actually got to see 96. We got to see 06 because we saw the 06 version of him. The 06 version of him was the one that showed up to see John. We got to see 2016.

[00:29:47] We got to see 2026, which lets me think that we're going to get to see versions of all of these characters in those timelines at some point, which is hard to do. But I think that they're setting the stage to do it really well. The fact that we have a little bit of detail now for really three different timelines in one episode and 56 minutes—well, really, 52 minutes, I think it was the end run time before the credits started rolling.

[00:30:14] I just—when you're telling a story like this, you have to be really careful to—you're telling all of these overlapping stories. And I think the one thing that Lindelof learned with Lost is that if you lose that pacing, you can lose the story pretty quickly. I think they're setting up the stage for just a lot of really good stories. If Jon Stewart's the one who comes out of this as the Green Lantern, the story is really interesting on how we get there.

[00:30:41] We've already seen Guy Gardner with the ring, if it's the same ring. We've now seen Hal with the ring, and we now know that Hal is dead. So if you just put together the things that we know, how does Guy get the ring? Does Jon ever get the ring? What's Jon's part in all this? Because we don't know yet.

[00:31:02] Like, he's never—the only time he's gotten the ring is when he got shot off a—when he got shot off a mountain and when Hal went to have a fight. And he made bubble wrap. That's another thing. Like, we were talking about how they maybe grew to respect each other, but that's another thing that makes me think Hal already respects Jon to a certain extent. Because twice he gave him the ring.

[00:31:31] And you'd think if you had this power ring for the last 30 years that you wouldn't just casually toss it to anybody. It wouldn't be flipped. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So just—he's the one that he entrusted it to both times. What was the second one? When he went to get in the fight with the bar. Oh. The first one was the car. The second one was the—yeah, he's like, hold on to this. Yeah. Okay. And it's going to look like I'm not going to win. Right.

[00:31:59] But you just have to—you just have to let me go. Okay. All right. No problem. Okay. Thanks. And how they handled that fight. He was enjoying that. Yeah. And again, that was a scene that we've seen before in other shows. But it was done so well. It was done so well. Yeah. Like what I love about—because Chandler, Kyle Chandler is so great at those like double take moments. And just he's so charismatic and fun to watch.

[00:32:28] But this guy, Aaron Pierre, who plays John, I've never seen before. And I was a little worried that he was just going to be so stiff that I wouldn't want to see him as the main character. He was very controlled. But when he would have a little arched eyebrow or a little bit of vulnerability, then it really went a long way. And I thought, yeah, he's got it. So I'm assuming he had to give up the ring because the ring would protect him without— Yeah. If he had it on. Yeah. I think so. Yeah. That's what I thought.

[00:32:56] Which does make the last scene interesting when you take that into account. But— Especially considering what we've seen in previews. Yeah. In trailers. I don't know. Is that okay to talk about? I don't know what you're talking about, Kirk. No? I don't know what you're talking about. Nothing. No, no, nothing that's coming up in the future like that. The scene between the two of them, when they're outside, they come outside of the bar—or no, they come outside. They finish eating at the ranch.

[00:33:25] And the scene with Garrett Dillon Hunt and Aaron Pierre where they're talking about—he's talking about eating off another man's grill. Yep. And there's that scene between Hal and John when they're standing opposite of the car and they're talking about what had just happened. And Hal can tell something was going on and, you know, he tells him, well, I kind of slept with his wife. Yeah. I might know. He says, I might have. I might have.

[00:33:55] I might have slept with his wife. I definitely did. He's like, you might have. I definitely did. And so, and he's such a serious character to see that little playfulness in him. And then to see how to respond to it and say, you know, we've only been here 24 hours and you already slept something. I'm impressed. I'm impressed. All right. I'm going to jump in here on that because that was, if I had any crit of the whole episode, that was the one thing I felt.

[00:34:23] Now, I could see how it was important because clearly when the, what's the guy's name? The- Macon. Macon. When Macon says that to him, it's clear that not only does he know, but most likely this was so that they now have something on John. Oh. Just like they got the money, they have the money on how, because they bailed him out and now they've got the fact that he slept with his wife. All right.

[00:34:52] Because I wouldn't understand, yeah, why he knew. They're working as a team. The wife and the husband are working as a team. Okay. But what bothered me- Suspicious. By the way, we don't know that for sure, but it makes sense. Correct. Correct. Correct. That's my theory. And I'm so always on target with my theories. It's true. Every, pretty much every time. The thing that bothered me though was, is that the scene, it was hard for me to believe

[00:35:21] that he would let that happen, that he would do that, that he would take advantage of that opportunity at that moment. He was drinking Coke. She says, can we buy you a drink? He's like, no, Coke, I'll have Coke. She's like, what do you want in it? Coke. Coke. Because he's on the job, he said. I'm on the job. He's on the clock. And it's like, so in his mind, and we've been shown this personality trait for him from the beginning of the episode, that he's very much a play-by-the-book kind of guy. Discipline.

[00:35:49] And she was clearly gunning for him and on the hunt. You could just, you know, you could tell by the forwardness of it that she was, and he just went ahead with it. And I just didn't see that as part of his personality based on what we had been shown. It seemed like a real divergence of irresponsibility. And, you know, especially in the middle, his other guy's, you know, not his boss, but

[00:36:16] his teacher or mentor or whatever is getting his ass kicked and then brought to jail. And he goes off into it. I just didn't think that it was, it felt forced into it just so that they could have a sex scene. You know what I mean? Yeah. They could have gotten something else over him. Because, you know what? I feel exactly the same. And it's not even a judgment against somebody who would hook up at a bar. Fine. No, no, no, no. Not at all. But it just didn't fit his character. I mean, like you said, he just got through saying, I'm on the job, so I'm not drinking. Yeah.

[00:36:45] So then he's going to go. I'm a Boy Scout, but let me bang you in the car in the parking lot while my mentor is in jail. In jail, yeah. But then also it didn't, like she was gunning for him kind of, but she was just asking him kind of mundane questions. I'm not saying she wasn't gunning for him. Even my wife. But my point in talking about this is like it didn't, I didn't feel a whole lot of heat between them. Yeah, right. Enough to go sleep in the car. I felt like a little, a little bit.

[00:37:13] I felt, again, I felt from her that she was on a mission with him. But I didn't see, I didn't feel it from him. But to your point, Jason, I don't know, like you kind of put yourself in perspective. Like if I'm sitting there, is she doing enough to make me go, especially if I'm Jon Stewart, is she making me enough to go, okay, I'm in? Yeah. Like when she said, you want to walk me to my car, then if I was him, I would have thought,

[00:37:41] I don't, I wouldn't have thought, oh, she wants to have sex with me right now. Maybe that's just me. Well, he may not have. He will, he may not have. Maybe he thought that was honest. And then when they got there, she, you know, threw herself out. Who knows? I would have thought she wants to talk to me some more and see if it goes anywhere, you know, not let's go right now, but whatever. Also, how did he know that her, that his ring would work as a cigarette lighter? He's never used it before, but he's sure acted like a guy who knows, maybe he's seen Hal do it. I don't know.

[00:38:11] Well, he knows the powers of the ring. He's obviously been studying that and, you know, he was able to save himself in the car. So he clearly knows how to use it. He's just not, he's just not proficient at it. Page four of the manual, cigarette lighter. Generator. Should we, should we, should we talk about the ring right now? Because I've got a list. Here's our list. The ring. What does it do? All right. In order, we see Hal fly.

[00:38:42] We hear about the bubble wrap. Which was great, by the way. No shame at all. Especially if it's your first time grabbing the ring. Yeah. And you just want to protect yourself. Like Hal mocked him for that. Come on. That was great. Hell yeah. Yeah. We have a very detailed, we have very detailed money that works so that he can play. Now here's the, here's the interesting twist though. The money was used for a very specific reason.

[00:39:10] Cause I, when he put the money in and he started playing, you could tell he was playing a bunch of songs and I was like, where are we going with this? And that's what led to the fight. That was the point. We got the, the, the cigarette lighter, uh, the bottle opener. And then the, the, the, in this episode to me, the most, um, green Lantern thing that we saw was him protecting the town from the bomb. Yeah. That's so cool. Yeah.

[00:39:39] And, and I, I guess I was like going into this as a green Lantern fan is someone who as a kid would run around with every ring that he could get, pretending that he was green Lantern. This was what I was looking most forward to the kid version of Jim Pete. Like what, what are we going to get to see this ring do? And I'll be honest with you. All of it made me happy. And I know that maybe I, even when he did, I'm like, he, he, he like pulled it out and

[00:40:07] he was using it as a lighter and I'm like, yeah. Okay. Yeah. Okay. When he made the dollar, when he made the dollar bill, that was pretty funny. I, I just, yeah, well, and, and he makes that bottle opener and then, you know, you can, you can kind of see like how likes this police officer and he, he makes that bottle opener. If he gives her a beer, he makes the bottle opener and then he blows it out of his hand into a little green Lantern dust. Yeah.

[00:40:32] But I, the, the power that he, he showed knowing that the, the alien was right, that he hadn't charged the ring, but he knew he knew and, and the power that he showed and what it did to the town anyways. We got to see green Lantern be green Lantern and we still haven't gotten the suit. We still haven't gotten, but we can split a fist the ring.

[00:41:00] And yes, a big green fist. We saw it used so many times. I forget how many that was. So many times. I don't want him. Yeah. I want him to do judiciously so they don't sort of blow their wad, you know? Yeah. Well, no. And that's what I thought we got. We got the subtleness of here's the ring. We haven't seen the Lantern yet. We got a taste of its power. We got, we got a little, a little bit of dialogue explaining, you know, you need that to charge a ring. So, so people who didn't know.

[00:41:30] And he can't leave town by the way. So it makes me wonder if that weakened his ring to the point where it needs to be charged and maybe John will have to go charge it or something like that, you know? So I, I, yeah, I really enjoyed what they did with the ring. I love the way that the ring looks. I love, I, I, I cannot wait to see how, and Kirk, you talked about this in our introduction podcast, the way that each of these two individuals use the ring.

[00:41:57] Uh, I, you know, and we'll maybe talk a little bit about it in a comic talk, but I, seeing how their personalities come out, um, of this ring is, is really exciting to me. And it was always one of my favorite part of the comics is, uh, especially dependent on the artist. Uh, what, what were we going to get to see come out? And we've got these three super creative writers who, and I don't mean to laugh, but who killed Hal at the end of the first episode, who were probably, who were probably just thinking

[00:42:25] like, we have unlimited power here. No pun intended with this ring. And these two amazing, well, these three amazing characters, I thought they did such a great job with Guy Gardner and Superman's ring. And what he did of that scene where he's kind of spinning around. Yeah. The, the, the spinning hand. Um, I, I just, I'm so excited about what they did here. And, and of course, you know, alluding to the fact that, um, that Hal has no idea how to, how to fly with a ring.

[00:42:53] I, I, I, I just sort of, or not how, but, uh, John, John, I, yeah, I really love that. Yeah, I, I agree with you completely. And I think that I, and I agree with you too, that, um, Jason, that I don't, I wouldn't want them to have shown us, you know, some huge use of the, of the ring because what was important is the, for a good show, what's important is the development of the characters, the relationships and the unfolding of the story. The ring, everybody knows what the ring is.

[00:43:23] Everybody knows the power of the ring. Everybody knows it's going to be this huge weapon. And we'll get to that. You know what I mean? But the, the, the story doesn't depend on that. The story depends on the people, the, the characters, their interactions, the events as they're unfolding, et cetera, et cetera. And so I think that was smart. They gave us a lot of ring, but not in a way that made the ring the focus. Yeah. That ring is not the focus. The relationship between the two of them was the focus.

[00:43:52] I did think it was, I don't know, like kind of too cute when John said, wait, you could stop this bomb like that, but you didn't stop the guy that was running away from me. And how's like, Hey, junior, you have to know the thing about the ring is knowing when to use it. Meanwhile, he's making bottle openers and counterfeit cash. I'm like, that would have been a good time to use it to catch that guy because it's the alien that he wanted.

[00:44:19] So it didn't really make sense that you didn't go after him. You know? Um, I'm going to, I'm going to be an, uh, I'm going to, I'm going to argue that point. The amount of energy that's used to make a can opener versus to have hunted that guy down. Probably. He probably was aware that that ring was getting low on power and that it hasn't been charged and he might need that. And he's learned over the years to keep a reserve of that, not use it foolishly.

[00:44:50] Obviously can opener is pretty foolish dollar for the thing is foolish, but he knows how much energy that depletes. All right. I'll take that. So there you go. Okay. Let me go on another point. I wanted to talk about this whole mystery and what's up with the aliens. And, uh, and, and first we see this whole crime scene with the cops at the football field and it's a mass shooting and there's dead bodies with sheets over them with blood.

[00:45:16] And John lays out what he thinks happened, but that's just what he thinks. And who knows? But I guess there was a football game rush fills at home. They scored the game winning field goal. The fences broke home. Fans rushed the field fans of the rival visitor team wandered onto the field. It's Nebraska. So everyone, people were carrying tensions mounted and then there's sort of yada, yada, yada. There's four dead all in, in the visitors sweatshirts. Nobody knows them from the town of Rushville.

[00:45:47] Um, but then later William Macon says two of his guys almost got killed last night in a shootout with men we'd never seen before. So unless I miss something, we really don't know the details of the shoot. We don't even know as much as like that deputy Carrie Kane knows. Uh, cause that was when William Macon said shootout, that was the first we'd heard about it. We don't know who started it. If it was Macon's guys. She's the sheriff. Yeah.

[00:46:14] I'm just saying as viewers of the show, Oh, I think she's deputy. That's what says in the wiki anyway, maybe it's wrong. Um, she's so one guy who was wearing the visitor sweatshirt ran. We find out that was an alien and how thinks they were all aliens. So it seems like, uh, that all the people who died were probably aliens. At least that's what Hal thought. So given that William Macon and his guys were involved and he's obviously xenophobic, maybe it has something to do with that. Yeah.

[00:46:44] Well, so that I was very, it was at the end of the show, I was like, well, who are the, who are the bad guys here? Because it's clear that how is interested in the aliens. And my take on it was to stop them from whatever they were doing. However, William Macon's who's clearly not a great character. Um, that's what he was doing too.

[00:47:11] And, you know, they sort of have stuff on how now, but they, it sort of felt like, well, that's kind of what they're both doing anyways. Uh, and then of course we get house death at the end. Um, and, and it was funny, much like you, Jason, I was, I was like, wait, what do we investigate? Are they investigating who killed the people who are dead on the field and they really don't know? Um, or are, is there something that we're missing? I feel like we're missing. Yeah.

[00:47:41] We're missing. Like the, that's the, that's a little frustrating because it feels like we viewers know less than some of the characters. Yeah. And we'll learn it, but. Yeah. Well, I hope, I hope so. I hope so. I hope that wasn't a plot miss because. Well, if I had to theorize, uh, I'm, I would think that Dillahunt's character Macon most likely is a nut is also alien.

[00:48:11] Why do you like that one? I heard someone else say that too. And. Well, in other words, you've got two groups of aliens that are. Okay. Or want, want to take over the planet and are kind of at war with each other. Okay. And that, you know, that might be what's going on here. You know what I mean? Maybe. Yeah. Cause they, the way they present William Macon is he's, I feel like, I mean, at least on the

[00:48:37] surface level, they're making a parallel with people who don't like immigrants, you know, fear of other. Right. Like if they weren't born on this planet, they don't belong here. Kind of a thing. Right. But then if he's also an alien, then that would be a twist that. Yeah. I love the line from John where he says, where John says, we're all aliens. It just depends on which planet you're standing on. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That was really good. Uh, so the reason why Hal figured out they were aliens is cause this projection of his

[00:49:07] consciousness tells John to tell the real how there's hail in Rushville, Nebraska, which Hal has been monitoring that area and told it to warn him, I guess, if aliens ever landed there, because from what I can put together, this is where Abin Sur, the alien that gave how the ring had crashed and Abin Sur had told how the earth is out of the lander's jurisdiction. It's a galactic fucking backwater.

[00:49:35] He said, and how things, you know, it's a fluke that humans got the ring, the big blue bosses. They'd never wanted any lander coming near our little shithole planet. And that's why my gut always told me that crash was no accident. When it says there's a shit storm on route that I make sure there's a lookout to tell me when it's fucking coming. So, you know, there's hail in Rushville, Nebraska means aliens have landed here. Maybe even specifically malevolent ones. Now I wasn't sure why if earth was out of the lanterns jurisdiction and the guardians never

[00:50:04] wanted landers to go there, that that would lead how to think the crash was no accident because it sounds like it was an accident, but I think he's saying they didn't even want the lanterns anywhere near earth. So if Abin Sur was near enough to crash there, he must've been there for a reason. For a reason. Maybe he got driven there by an alien or a bad alien or I don't know. But also it does seem to be, um, I think like, why would he be focusing on this one town?

[00:50:32] Like there seems like there's something to that particular spot that he feels like is drawing aliens there. Right. Otherwise you wouldn't just presume that that would be the one place to keep track of. I mean, it does feel like this is house point of focus for his life, to be honest. And I don't know what happens between 2016 and 2026.

[00:50:56] I have no clue, but I thought that the two actors that we get to see in 2026 certainly make it feel like Hal, Hal and John have been a part of this town a good bit between 2016 and 2026. So I don't, I, it's what's going on there. Um, I guess maybe Kirk maybe does fit in with what, if there's a lot of aliens at play and

[00:51:25] for whatever reason, I mean, it could, it could lead to the fact that we have a lot of aliens there. They, well, especially if it wasn't, if it's off the guardians kind of grid that they don't really care about it. That makes it a great place to hang out and settle and not have to worry about getting, getting any shit from them. And they made a point to say that there are several, I think they said 14 different alien races that can mimic humans. Right. So this could be two of them. Well, well, yeah.

[00:51:55] And who knows? Maybe one of those was mimicking. I don't know. Anyways, I, I think they, they did a nice job making us wonder a little bit because they, every time they filmed in the town, um, and they would, they would show shots while they were talking about aliens, they would show shots of different people and who would maybe look at the camera in a funny way.

[00:52:20] So I think they're, I think they're, they're, they're definitely painting pictures, but are they really, or are they, is, is Linda Loft at work? Just, I mean, also during this whole interrogation, which we'll talk about, talk about more, I'm sure. But, um, at the end house said, why are you here? And he said, why else vengeance? And he also said it had to do with a war. So that does make me think you're probably right, Kirk, that it, at least it would make

[00:52:49] sense that if Macon's men and these guys were having a shootout, that there's a war between them and that he's getting their one getting vengeance against the other. Hmm. I guess if you listen to our introduction podcast, maybe we allude to some of this. Comic talk. We'll, we'll get into a little bit more of our speculation based on what we know of the comics in comic talk at the end. Yeah. What else?

[00:53:18] Kirk, you got another. Um, subject. I thought the Harry Potter litmus test was kind of stupid. I thought it was a kind of a, uh, a blatant Warner brothers, you know, they're creating a Harry Potter series. I felt like it was an advertisement. You know what I mean? Yeah. I could have come up with a more interesting. I liked the idea of it. What about the Looney Tunes? Yeah. Yeah. I liked the idea of that, that. They're naming off all the Warner brothers properties. What about Abby versus Coyote?

[00:53:49] I think that there were parts of that. There were parts of that dialogue between the two of them that I didn't like. And, and, um, there were parts of it I really liked. And then there were parts of it that sort of was like, oh, they're just acting this out. And, um, and that was one of them that, that, that Harry Potter thing. But I think his strategy was sound. Oh yeah. The way he went, the way he went. And I think the way that, that, that piece of writing to me, just what didn't feel, it does feel like.

[00:54:18] It took me out just a bit as I could see, I could see an HBO executive or a Warner brothers executive saying, Hey, this is a great place for us to put this. Cause we could then, you know. Oh my gosh. I'm going to be less cynical than you guys. Cause I thought it was probably the best scene in the whole thing just because he went in and, you know, I think at this point, Hal has shown a lot of. The scene was great. The scene was great. It's shown a lot.

[00:54:44] He's shown a lot of, uh, uh, arrogance almost, or at least, you know, bravado, which the sheriff doesn't erase the sheriff Kirk. Sorry about that. He, she doesn't respond well to it. And I think she's just met him and she's the only one that doesn't like revere him. One of the few, but anyway, so we're sort of wondering, is he too full of himself? Like at least I was, I mean, I figured it's probably an alien, but we don't know for sure. And then when he starts asking him football questions and he's answering and it's like, Oh, see, maybe he's wrong.

[00:55:14] And then, uh, he asks about the Harry Potter thing. And then my favorite was Obama. But he goes, Oh, he's the president of the United States. That's it. As a rural Nebraskan, that's the breadth of your opinion of Barack Hussein Obama. Uh, he's the 44th president. He followed George Bush. There's some controversy surrounding his birth certificate. Like he's reading it out of Wikipedia or something. Yeah. Right. Right. And he goes, Holy shit. You are an alien. That was great. I loved it all. And the reason why the Harry Potter part is okay with me is because Harry Potter is

[00:55:42] one of the most popular things in the whole world. So it would be a really good thing to test him on if he didn't know that. If I had thought about the Vortabras connection, maybe I wouldn't have liked as much, but I didn't. So it made sense. But I love that scene. I just liked the whole, the whole thing. And then, um, you know, the whole, when he finally started to drop his facade, I thought that was thrilling. And then the cop, the, I mean, the sheriff was like almost disappointed.

[00:56:11] Like, oh fuck, he was right. Yeah. Well, another, another question though, is did she already know? Cause she first is trying desperately to get him to just not be there to back off, to not be part of this, to leave this alone. This doesn't involve him. Yada, yada, yada. She's the daughter-in-law to, to make it. So she knows.

[00:56:38] I think she seemed surprised rather than disappointed that not like disappointed that the alien revealed himself, but more surprised that Hal was right. I guess those are pretty close. Maybe you wouldn't be able to tell the difference. You know what I mean? I don't know. I'm just throwing, I'm just throwing that out there. I mean, cause she clearly knows her, her father, her father-in-law. The way I, uh, she makes it very clear to them that they're getting brought by him. Her relationship towards him seems to be that she doesn't like him though, but she's in debt

[00:57:06] to him, which is why she had to like the only way that Hal was going to get to interrogate this guy is cause the father-in-law said, told her to let him do it. She didn't want to, but I don't think I had, I don't know if I don't get the impression she's protecting the guy versus just sort of, she's under his thumb. Yeah. Not protecting him necessarily, but trying to keep a lid on this powder keg.

[00:57:33] I am interested in that whole family dynamic as well. I mean, her being married to Will Macon's son does make it feel like maybe there's a reason why they're married is, is Will Macon's son. I think when you, you cast Jason Ritter into a part, I think you're, you're, you bring him in for a reason. So you either bring him in for the reason that, um, he, he plays funny down to earth characters.

[00:58:02] Uh, is he a funny down to earth character in this? That's how he comes off. Is he really, they don't seem to fit together very well. Um, he's a lawyer and how does he fit together with her and why they, why are they together? Um, the son, the son aspect of all of this, uh, obviously plays a part because we get to see, um, John interact with the son, uh, in a way that maybe is a kinder version of what he was.

[00:58:30] I mean, obviously as a, he tries to tell him that, yeah, my dad used to shoot apples off my head as he's teaching him how to throw a football through the tire. I think the dynamics there there again is, is going back to that initial point of mind, the layers of all of this, um, is just setting us up to learn an awful lot. Well, if you're Macon and you want to control what's happening in this town, you want to control

[00:58:54] the courts and you want to control the police, which he seems to. Yeah. Well, he's certainly got, he's got his finger on those two areas. So he's always aware of what's going on because he's the sheriff is in his pocket and now he's got, you know, really well, renowned lawyer in town on his, you know, the judge didn't seem like she was bought, but, but it's just, you know, it would be a good strategy from him. I got a, I got a crazy one. Hmm.

[00:59:23] What if John's father is somebody? You mean involved in, oh yeah. Like, like Martian Manhunter. Hmm. Oh. Just throwing that out there because how did he, they, they, they seem to understand before how even like came into the interviews and everything else that, that there was a way

[00:59:50] for him to become, to grow up and become a lantern. How, you know, how did he have any. I just think that that, that part of the story is going to be. There's a lot more story there. Yeah. It's going to be a big part of all of this. Yeah. Like I said before, what made sense to me is that the guardians had already approached them because they, maybe they thought this kid had potential. I don't know. But yeah. That's possible. Yeah. I don't know.

[01:00:17] Or, or maybe, maybe the father and Hal have, have, have some history. Mm-hmm. You know what I mean? But you're right though. Like, how would they even know that it was a possibility? Possibility. Exactly. To be so like committed that you're going to shoot freaking apples off your kid's head. You got to know that this is going to bear some fruit here. No pun intended. Like. And the interview. We see that.

[01:00:45] The interview is taking place right at that moment for the first time he is doing the interview that's on television. And he says, what it takes is to say, you know, is to have no fear. Yeah. That's the first time anybody publicly knows. Right. That was basically the one condition. They already knew it because they're already knew it and they're already working on it. And they're already working on it. And they're already working on it. Apple wall already. Right. Exactly. And it would then make sense of why they didn't know it was. Here's my apple wall.

[01:01:16] Yeah. Don't mind the bullet holes. Because when he was, you mentioned that he was about to tell this kid, my dad used to shoot apples off my head and, but the kid got distracted, right? They called him inside. Yeah. Well, as we're watching it, my son's sitting next to me and he goes, aren't they in a neighborhood? Dad, I don't want to ever be a Green Lantern. Get a silencer.

[01:01:46] Yeah. All right. Jim, where else did you go? So my last point, you know, really was the, and I think in good storytelling, I always kind of harken back to Star Trek who would tackle topics, big topics and spacey ways so that you could talk about said topics.

[01:02:11] And I think one of the things that I've always enjoyed about Damon Lindelof specifically is that he's not afraid to tackle topics in ways that kind of are blatant and in front of you, but also kind of subtle in that old Star Trek sense.

[01:02:30] And I think that as we meet the Macons initially and, and he starts talking about aliens and he's, he's very clearly working on that xenophobic theme. That is, is, is something that unfortunately we see, you know, in the news today and not, you know, neither here nor there. I think they do it in a very, um, they do it in a very storytelling sense.

[01:02:58] I don't think that it's coming off as, um, as anything but part of the story. And I, I think in doing that, you, you can, you can tell, you can tell that subtle story. I think the, the way that the Barack Hussein Obama piece comes out, um, you know, you're from Nebraska and I think that you can have a slight chuckle at that, but also realize, no, he's right. Like, like this, this is, you'd have a reaction to that in certain parts of the country.

[01:03:28] And I think that, um, if you're going to tell stories today and you're going to tell them authentically, especially in a world where, um, it's hard to, it's hard to see truth. Uh, I think that, that this show is finding ways to tell a story, but to have deeper meaning.

[01:03:46] And, and I think that throughout this episode, um, we got to feel a little bit of that deeper meaning and, and really creative and easy and normal storytelling ways, not necessarily pitting people together, but just sort of putting stuff in front. Here's what's going on. These aliens are here. I'm an isolationist. I don't want them here. Um, it's an easy way to tell a story that we're seeing every day without actually smacking us in the face with it.

[01:04:15] Uh, so I think, I think that this, the writing to Kirk's point earlier is telling these deeper stories that I think we're going to get more of as the story progresses. Um, and, uh, and doing it in a really, in a really good way. Yeah. That's why I agree. I almost don't want Garrett Dillahunt slash William Macon to be an alien posing as a xenophobe because then I feel like it kind of takes away from that. Right. I, yeah.

[01:04:45] Yeah. I actually, I was going to argue the point Kirk until I started thinking about all the other pop possible plot points. It does make sense. Yeah. That it is. But then I feel like it takes away from that theme. Yeah. Yeah. And, and, and it was just a thought. I mean, it may not be, but, um, it does seem like they're, they seem to know who their enemy is and why it's, it's more than just that they're aliens. It seems like. Yeah. I think it makes sense. Yeah.

[01:05:15] We'll see. Um, okay. I want to talk about fearlessness because the theme of fearlessness has been a core, has been core to Green Lantern, at least since Hal Jordan became Green Lantern. I don't know if Alan Scott talked about that, but, um, Hal Jordan was the, who read Alan Scott? I don't know. I mean, that was in the forties. My grandpa probably did. That old. The fearless test pilot and the rings choose beings without fear.

[01:05:43] But then eventually when, uh, Jeff Johns, maybe before, I don't know, but he made it more about overcoming fear than actually being fearless. Like feel that fear and do it anyway, kind of thing. And then the rings are powered by willpower, which is kind of like the ability to overcome fear. And then his main, um, enemy is Sinestro who wields a ring powered by fear and it's yellow like fear.

[01:06:07] But I, I think there's a twist in this version that I found really interesting that where Hal says, you know, to the reporter, I don't get nervous. That's part of the job description. And you know, how did it test you? Well, it's only one question. Are you afraid? And I said, no, but then deputy Kane is telling, uh, John, you know, can't be easy having to deputy. I'm sorry. Why did I keep saying that? Sheriff Kane can't be easy having to learn. Because you're a misogynist.

[01:06:34] No, I read it somewhere, but maybe it's just, I just brought it to this. Keep demoting her. No, no. Okay. I'm going to call her police commissioner Kane. She says, you know, it can't be easy having to learn from someone you don't respect. John says, I do respect him. Why? I don't know. He's fearless. She goes, if you care about people, you know, husband, wife, parent, kid, then you're scared of losing them.

[01:06:59] First time he started up to me, I could tell Jordan doesn't care about anybody and nobody cares about him. He's not fucking fearless. He's lonely.

[01:07:30] He's lonely. By that. And then responded by not caring about anyone anymore. I'm not going to care. And so he's not afraid because he doesn't care maybe. And he doesn't even care about his own life. He's, he went into the very, the dangerous profession that his father got killed by. And then John, on the other hand, does have people he cares about, his brother, his brother or brothers and his father. And, and, you know. And his mother.

[01:08:00] He doesn't have a single father. Did we see his mother? No. His mother. Well, his mother is listed in the credits. Is listed. Okay. So, so anyway, he, he's trained to be, to be fearless. But, um, yeah, I just feel like they're, what they're trying to get at with Hal is that maybe he's armored up or something in a way that's sort of toxic. You know, something like that. Yeah, absolutely.

[01:08:26] Well, that's, you know, there's the, the whole, Jim, as you had pointed out, the commentary, the social commentary about aliens and the idea of some of the things that we're dealing with right now in terms of that and xenophobia and et cetera. The other issue that's real popular right now culturally that showing up in movies, I mean, Spider-Man Brand New Day is a great example. Obsession is another great example. Um, you know, is the male loneliness issue.

[01:08:51] And the idea that, you know, to be a strong man, you have to like shut everybody out and shut off your emotions and not care and not be connected and all this kind of stuff. And, and that, you know, that's not healthy. And, um, so they may be trying to kind of touch on that issue as well. I think the difference, I, there, there has to be more to it too.

[01:09:14] I, I agree that the trauma that, that maybe made him, um, become Green Lantern and the trauma of watching his dad, um, die in front of him. But I, the, the stark difference between how Jordan from 96 to how Jordan from 2006. Yes. Um, you know, to how Jordan in 2016 leads me to believe that there's a story yet to be told about why he does feel that loneliness.

[01:09:42] Um, or maybe it is just, um, you know, to your point, Kirk, um, you know, and I, you know, I think, you know, being a middle-aged man myself and someone who can be quite isolated, we get so. So when you take on a lot in life, um, I think that, that, that loneliness can sort of build, um, over time, you know, you know, you become a father, you become a husband, you become whatever it is that you do in life. And people look at you, um, to do all of those things.

[01:10:11] And you sort of lose sense of who you are. Um, that, that when, when she called him out, um, in that statement, Jason, that you quoted, you know, he isn't fearless. He's lonely. I mean, it's, it hit me like a, like a ton of bricks, um, callous. And I think sort of, yeah. Yeah. Well, and, and you get to see he's playing that sort of cowboy character throughout this until he doesn't, you know, he doesn't. Well, he's, he's fearless because he doesn't have anybody he cares about. Yeah. Yeah.

[01:10:42] Which is a weakness. Yeah. Yeah. But I think you make a great observation though, because the holographic image of him and that consciousness was from what date? 2006. And I think, and we were seeing that in 2016. Yeah. So 10 years. Yeah. I'm pretty sure he tells John, I'm, I'm from 2006 and, and how, and, and John says to him, well, I think I like you better.

[01:11:12] Yeah. I think I like you better. Yeah. It's true. He was definitely different. He was definitely much more, you know, um, uh, a team player, you know, like this is the right thing. This is what we got to do. This is what's happening. You know what I mean? It's like, did I do something to upset you? Yeah. The holograph even ties into it.

[01:11:37] It's really, and that, that, that's also the interesting thing about that, that I thought was really cool is it's not just a holographic image. It's not just a pre-programmed message or anything. It's a portion of his consciousness. I mean, the fact that, that, that apparition or whatever, what it is says that to him says, you know, am I not being, you know, am I treating you bad? Yeah. That's a, that's an inquisitive question. Yeah. That, that's not, that's, that's consciousness. That's not pre-

[01:12:06] Something changed, like you're saying, Jim. Yeah. Like something changed in between the last time he backed himself up. Yeah. Well, I, no. Comic-Con. Okay. Do you have any more, Kirk or? No, no, no. I would just want to throw on too that I agree with everybody that Garrett Dillon-Heltz, Megan was just phenomenal. He was so short. It was just, I can't look forward to seeing more of him. Yeah. He's just, he's such a phenomenal actor.

[01:12:35] I mean, he was the only thing that I really liked about Fear, The Walking Dead. He was very good on there too. Oh, it's just, he's everything I've ever seen. Strand was pretty good at times too. I've also met him a few times at cons and man, he's just the sweetest guy in the whole world. Yeah. Well, I used to do Q and A panels with him because he was John Dory on Fear. And one time when we got on the panel together, he goes, oh, I'm glad it's you. And who knows if you really met that, but my heart melted.

[01:13:05] No, he's a great guy. Jason, he meant it. Really? Yeah, he meant it. He meant it. Absolutely, he meant it. Absolutely, he meant it. I think that when you can play a character, when you see the different types of characters that Garrett Dillon-Hunt has played in the course of his career, how you can see, and whatever character he's playing, you can see the good version of it. And you can see the bad version of it.

[01:13:30] And we're getting the bad Garrett Dillon-Hunt. He was in a show, Deadwood, and he was two different characters in that show. Completely different characters in that show. To the point where there were people who didn't know he was on the show twice. And that to me, you get to watch him, you give him even a little bit of spotlight. And he just finds a way to fill it.

[01:14:01] He was the Terminator in the Sarah Connor Chronicles. That was a great one. But he said on one of his panels, I remember, he was like, what I like to do is play completely different characters and have it a different kind of person each time. And I was like, but you know, when you played John Dory and he was this affable cowboy, it kind of reminded me of the character you played in No Country for Old Men. And he's all, great, just contradict me right after I say something. Sorry.

[01:14:34] That must have been after he had said that he was glad. Yeah, that was after he was glad. Changes mind. But he, you know, the man is 62 years old. And I mean, does he really look like he's 62 years old? He made me puke. Shapeshifter. Maybe. And I hope, you know, I hope he listens to this, but he does play a good cowboy character now.

[01:15:02] You know, he's he's he did it twice in in Deadwood. He obviously John Dory is is near and dear to all of our hearts. This character, No Country for Old Men. So he does play different types of the same role very differently, which I think is great. And I think that he was just a scene stealer in this. And you do you don't hire him to be a bit player unless you hire him to be a bit player and still every episode that he's in. I have a feeling we're going to see more of him, whoever he may be.

[01:15:30] I loved how the character was affable, but there was just so much going on underneath, like almost passive aggressive or he would be like. Yeah, absolutely. Call it the ring and weapon of mass destruction. And, you know, just it was very, really rich. Well, even the statement of, you know, eating off another man's girl is pretty. Oh, yeah. Yeah.

[01:15:54] I think that when you're talking about toxic masculinity, I think that he he grabbed those two words, put them together, mixed them up and threw them on the grill. Because, I mean, it was all of that in a bag of chips. But you could also see a version of that character through him not being that. And that's what I think I love about him is he's just a complex actor who figures out a way to make every character complex. I love it.

[01:16:22] I just I. Yeah. Fear the Walking Dead. Let me talk about how it's like Ozark a little bit. So if you haven't seen Ozark, Jason Bateman is like an accountant and he hooks up with the mob basically and starts laundering money for them and gets shipped off to Ozark, which is kind of its own little world's community.

[01:16:47] A lot of different power centers of official and not and then connections between the two and families and groups and things. And like that show, this show had a slow build and it was about complicated and often morally compromised characters, which I think maybe the sheriff is here and other people. It was about how pressure exposes character.

[01:17:12] It was about how everyone has something they're not saying, you know, a lot of secrets. It was about how like political machinery and family obligations and different sort of systems can corrupt or constrain people.

[01:17:30] And most of all, I feel like it had this group of very distinct personalities, each with their own agenda, all constantly trying to navigate and even manipulate or outmaneuver each other. And so as this episode went along, I felt that kind of thing more and more and started to get hooked into it. It's like a stew is heating up or something like that, you know, delicious stew, like you said, Thanksgiving.

[01:17:58] I did not watch Ozark. I've heard nothing but great things about it. But I always kind of assumed it was kind of in the vein of Breaking Bad. Would you say that? Well, I didn't want to watch it because when I first, Breaking Bad is my favorite show. And I'm like, this is just a Breaking Bad clone. But everyone kept saying how good it was. So I finally gave it a shot. And it definitely has its own flavor for sure. Right. It's a little wilder in some ways. It's good.

[01:18:28] Yeah, it's worth it. I think you'd like it. I think the moral ambiguity of the shows are similar. Yeah. Where your heroes of the show aren't necessarily heroes. And I think that they're playing this Lanterns show in a similar vein because you have Hal Jordan, who has been a superhero for 30 plus years. And the weight of doing that. And he definitely has some moral questions.

[01:18:56] You have Jon Stewart, who is probably the moral center of the story, but apparently likes to have sex with married women in a car. He didn't know she was married. Probably. Yeah. So I, yeah. You're trying to be a Green Lantern and you're doing it in a car in a parking lot in a bar. I don't know. I don't know. Ticky tacky. Ticky tacky. I mean, you know, Kirk, you're a superhero. Come on. Hey, Hal Jordan was impressed.

[01:19:26] I'm just going to say, that's something Hal Jordan would have done. Yeah. Hal was like, you know, I wasn't going to pick you, but now I think you've earned it. Now. You're the man. Also a little, a little, maybe this is just me sort of wanting this to be true, but it gave me a little bit of the vibes of one of my all time favorite shows. Greatest American hero back in the eighties. Oh yeah. Cause it's a rivalry, kind of a rivalry among two guys fighting crime. And it was a breezy, quippy show.

[01:19:55] And, um, it just. Surprisingly. So. Yeah. Me too. Funny. Like we had, we said a lot of the funny parts. And the song at the end of this, it's, uh, Knievel by Scud Mountain Boys. Yeah. Just like, I was bound to leave the ground. It didn't take much living to see that I'm only free when I'm flying. It reminded me of how they used to play rocket man on, um, greatest American hero all the time. Elton John's rocket man. Yeah. Great song. Rocket man. Yeah. Yeah. I love that so much.

[01:20:25] And I mean, the, the, the, it's funny because the, the Knievel song, you singing it right there, made me think of a theme song of, of greatest American. Believe it or not. I'm walking on in. I'm walking on in. Yeah. So yeah. And he doesn't know how to use the ring. Right. I mean, it's perfect. Yeah. It's, it's, it's, it's God, I love that show. Thanks for bringing that up. I, it's such a great show. I forget about it every so often. And you hear about reboots now and again. I know.

[01:20:50] I kind of like it as it's pocket, it's pocket, but you, you could see, you could see someone, you could see some, some of these like prestige, like directors and showrunners, like grabbing ahold of that and turning into something. Um, and maybe this is it. Maybe this is, maybe this is it. I went back and watched it a year or so ago again, and it was still good. I still liked it. Yeah. Wednesday nights. Loved it. Yep. Uh, the complaints I had, we've already talked about.

[01:21:19] So I'm just going to briefly mention the, the thing about how jumping out of the car, I thought, nah, that's over the top. I didn't like it. Um, the thing about him. Okay. He set this notification in his ring and then it would produce a version of himself. That was cool because of the scene that we got, but. Does it really make sense? Wouldn't it just like start blinking? Like, Hey, you have a message. Okay. What's the message? Hey, there's aliens.

[01:21:50] And you, you know, it seemed weird that, and also that there's a version of his consciousness that comes out, doesn't know anything that's happened in the past 10 years because it wasn't backed up, but it does know that there's aliens in Rushville, Nebraska. Yeah. I did struggle with that. Why did it know? I guess it got that piece of information from the ring or something. I don't know. Okay. Yeah. Um, the fact that playing a song over and over again as a plan to go to jail.

[01:22:19] I don't know if that you could really be sure that, Oh, I'm sure some guy's going to want to start a fight with me because I do, because I did this. He kind of got lucky that that actually came true, that some guy wanted to start a fight. I was hoping that there would be a little bit of backstory to that. Like maybe, maybe there was something to it. The guy hated the song or something. Yeah. Yeah. Uh, why don't we, everyone listening, go try that and report back and let us know if it starts a fight. And then the other. We, we, we will not bail you out though. The other.

[01:22:49] No, no, no. We have, we take no responsibility. Um, and then the next, and then the last one was what you said about him just hooking up with that. John, just hook it up with that woman. And if it seemed weird, maybe in every episode, we're going to find out that John hooks up with another woman and we just find out that he's a playboy. Hey, then it's just part of his personality. Yeah. We might, um, funny lines. We've also said a lot of those, but just how not being sure if avancer's last words were good luck or off.

[01:23:18] Fuck was great. Um, the one where he said, you know, no matter what happens, don't get involved in this fight. Even if it looks like they're being, okay, no problem. Yeah. No problem. I got no problems with that. I liked in the courtroom when, um, how was just like, Hey, I'm just trying to question a suspect, uh, for this investigation, the judge, Oh, an investigation.

[01:23:44] I might understand, sir, that you are a law enforcement official official. And if so, could you kindly state for the record, which agency you represent? I'm green lantern. I didn't ask who you were. I asked which bureau you're an agent of. I'm green lantern and I'm an agent of green lantern. It was good. The humor was good. Yeah. There wasn't anything that dropped and it was like, ugh. Yes. Uh, do I have any more image?

[01:24:13] Oh, when, um, Hal starts questioning this guy that he thinks is an alien. When he first came in, he goes, yeah, I imagine you just want to phone home. Get home. I didn't catch that. That's great. I didn't catch that. And then when he like contained the bomb, but it still created some, somewhat of an explosion and you don't see him. So you're wondering if he's okay. And then he just, you see him rise up out of the smoke. Told him it was an alien.

[01:24:43] Yeah. So good stuff. Yeah. He, he, he comes off in the beginning is the kind of guy like, you're not going to, you're just kind of noise. Yeah. But by the end it's like, you're kind of like, you kind of like. It's kind of lovable. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. They picked the right actor for that. And now he's dead. So there you go. Maybe. Maybe. Maybe. Well, not yet. 10 years from now. We got 10 years of stories. Yeah.

[01:25:15] Man. It's take a long time for John to get that ring. Any like random notes or anything? I was glad to see a 10 years later, John Stewart with his goatee, which he eventually got in the comics and the cartoons and stuff. That was cool. Um, I think that early concerns of, you know, it being too dark of a show. I, I didn't, I didn't, I definitely has dark moments, but man, they're bright. It had it all.

[01:25:43] It had the greens, but not too much. It, I can see why maybe when we talked about this in the intro episode about Damon Lindelof kind of making fun of the, the, the color green and I can see why now, like, I think, I think that this felt like a green land. I mean, there was nothing about it that to me didn't feel like a green lantern show. If you're expecting like when he flies off for a green bubble to be around him, which I was a little bit like, Oh, where's the green bubble?

[01:26:11] But I think they tried to tone it down a little, but it was like, and I do think that there is a story to how he uses his power. I think when you see him in that pretty, pretty bright green, um, suit in 96 versus what we may eventually get to see. I think what we're going to get to see is just a man who has developed over the years into the character that he is now. Um, and that might not necessarily just be green.

[01:26:39] Um, but that's, you know, maybe for comic book talk or for another day, but I just, I thought to me, I just, I, I really felt like it hit the notes of a comic book movie or a comic book TV show. And it also hit the notes of a prestige HBO television show. It had the dark, it had the sweet, maybe not sweet, but the funny. Um, and it certainly had the color that lets you know that we're probably going to get to see a whole lot more of, as you noted, Jason, uh, they're going to probably, the ring is

[01:27:08] probably going to show itself at some point. Not only that, but we, you know, we know that the other green lantern does show up in this episode and he certainly is a colorful figure. Yes. So we'll, we'll, we, you know, there's just so much yet to play. And I think, I think that, that we've got the, they really did a nice job laying the foundation of what could be a great show. Agreed.

[01:27:50] All right. We always do a listener feedback section. If you guys want to send in any feedback, you can email the brightest day at podcast to go.com, or you can go to our Facebook group or our discord. And there's always posts up each week for each episode. And we'll read your comment and respond to it on the show. Uh, there's links in the show notes for both of those. So let's go into those.

[01:28:17] G Johnson, uh, wrote, I had very low expectations, but this first episode was intriguing. I'm not much if, uh, I guess he meant of DC fan, but this makes me want to see where this is going. I'm glad to hear that. Cause G was just saying like, Oh, I feel like my fandom and everything is slipping. I'm just not enjoying very much of anything. So here, it looks like he's into this one. Well, that's good. That's great. This one got him back in. Let's go.

[01:28:44] Um, Megan O'Connell, my thoughts. I love Kyle Chandler and as per usual, he is charming and funny in this too. Hope the season is great. So far it had my attention. Nice. Kyle Chandler was absolutely Kyle Chandler in this and he can play layered parts. And we got to see a little bit of that, but I suspect we'll get to see a lot more as the show continues.

[01:29:07] I got to say, when I heard that he was cast, I was not happy about it, but I'm very happy about it now. This, this really showcases the relationship that you and I have because I was literally, literally jumping up and down. And I was right in the middle. I was like, cool. Yeah. Well, I think what's become clear is that it's, it's a story about how, but it's, it's

[01:29:34] also a story about John and that John's really the, I think ultimately the important story because he's the one that's going to carry on. And this, you know, so the idea that this how was at kind of the end of his career is a great, great story and a great way to approach this, you know? But if the how was going to be the how comic books and be the lead, I think he wouldn't have been the right choice. Yeah. He's like a smart mouth guy.

[01:30:02] A lot of the time, Kyle Chandler in a funny way, but you maybe don't want your hero, main hero to be that. Maybe. I, I listen, I am telling you, you're missing out on Kyle Chandler. Like he's got some shows where he is not that character. And I think, I think, I mean, even, even as, yeah. I mean, even as Friday night lights character is not this at all. Like he's the, he's the, I wouldn't say not at all. He can be kind of jabbing at people sometimes, but he's like the coach that lifts you up. Right.

[01:30:33] Yeah. Right. Right. That's such a great show. I love, I love that so much. Um, Wendy says, Wendy Ann says, I liked it. I know she's a big fan of Ozark. So I was hoping she'd watch this. She says, I have no knowledge of the comics or even the movie. It did feel like a lot of complicated setup and exposition, but I can see from next week's preview that there is action to come. The acting was great. I'm glad. I'm really glad you liked it. Brad Holt said, I loved it. Can't wait to see how the story unfolds.

[01:31:01] The previews for future episodes look exciting and intriguing. Is the Manhunter they're referring to John, John, John. I don't know. I never knew how to pronounce that, but, or is it one of the evil androids the guardians created? Side note, it was cool seeing Chris Coy as the alien. Remember him as Martin, one of the terminus cannibals on TWD. Wow, man. There's a, there's a good flashback.

[01:31:27] And I bet you whoever cast him saw that scene because it's similar. Uh, the scene with Martin and, um, Tyrese where he's just trying to get under his skin a little bit in the walking dead. I feel like this was somebody who saw that and was like, yeah, let's get that guy. Um, so there, he mentioned some comic bookie things. We'll, we'll talk about some of that in the comic talk section at the end.

[01:31:56] Here's a call from Damien. Hey, Jason, Kirk, and Jim is Damien in Vegas. And I, uh, I just watched the episode last night. I haven't listened to your intro yet. I shall do that. Um, and I really don't know anything. I was going to say much, but anything about Green Lantern or Lanterns or much of the DC stuff. But, um, yeah, the, the episode was great. Uh, we shall see where it goes.

[01:32:24] Um, but yeah, I thought it was really good. There was, there was a lot of really fun stuff. Um, has some awesome people in it. Um, obviously, uh, uh, Carl Chandler, he, uh, he's great in everything. Um, but he seemed a bit more kind of world weary and kind of cynical and in this, uh, he was great. And then I love to see Kelly McDonald pop up anywhere being a train spotting is one of my favorite films ever.

[01:32:54] Um, so she's awesome. And then, uh, that's the sheriff. John Dory. Yeah. One of the best parts of fear the walking dead. He's incredible. I can't remember the actor's name right now. Shoot. Uh, but he's amazing. I've ever seen him in. So that was fun to see him. Uh, yeah, we'll see. I don't have much to say apart from it was fun. Um, I really liked everyone. I'm not sure about the, um, the second guy yet.

[01:33:20] Uh, his, uh, his trainee, he just seems a little kind of, uh, moody and quiet and we will see where it goes. Um, but yeah, very promising. And, uh, I'm excited to listen to the podcast and probably learn a lot more about it and get into it even more. So yeah. All right. On to next week. Bye. Bye.

[01:33:44] I kind of love it when fans who aren't fans of a specific character, um, become fans of a show. I love that. Um, okay. Joden, AKA Jeff from our discord server. I'm so glad I get to read this because of this line. My thoughts on the premiere in brightest day and blackest night, clear eyes, full heart can't lose. Had to with Kyle Chandler from Friday night lights. I really liked it.

[01:34:10] I liked the split timeline showing the pre Superman world and now post Superman world. Uh, we didn't really talk a whole lot about that, but that's true. That was, it was very true. That's a great observation. Yeah. And the 2026 timeline, I wonder if the ring went to guy instead of John, uh, for reasons we will learn in this show. I love Kyle Chandler and think he fits the bill as a more experienced lantern. I love the two thousands justice league show, which has John Stewart as the established lantern. Seeing him as a trainee is interesting.

[01:34:39] And I'm curious to learn more as the season goes on the supporting cast with Kelly McDonald is the sheriff and John Dory. We're also very good. A great premiere episode that sets up a mystery. I am eager to learn. Yeah. Yes. Kelly McDonald. I can't believe I didn't talk more about her. She was in train spotting. She was also in, um, Peaky blinders. I think. Yeah, she was awesome. She was great. Great deputy. Just kidding.

[01:35:10] All right. Here's a call from Steve Brown. Hello, lantern cast. This is Steven. This is going to be for the first episode, season one, episode one, lanterns. I don't really know much of the history of green lantern. I didn't really follow it in the comics back in the eighties, but I see this flashback. We're starting in 1996, but they're talking about 10 years before. So 1986. Oh, cool. So he's an air force veteran. I think I knew that about green lantern, but obviously he was an officer. I was enlisted, but still it's okay. Air force.

[01:35:38] I'm not going to try to explain too much about military stuff, but there's no way he was allowed to take his weapon, his duty weapon home with him. Not, not in 1996 in the air force. Sorry. I'll put on my suspenders of disbelief. Okay. So how the older Hal Jordan picks him up in his car and neither one of them is wearing their seatbelts. Oh, he just rolled out of the car, put the ring on the dashboard. And that was just the cold open. I'm going to try not to go long here. I did not expect this total twist, this backup of Hal Jordan showing up. Uh, uh, wow. I'm wow.

[01:36:08] Hal Jordan is not a secret identity at all. I like that philosophy about ties. I don't wear ties anymore. I don't even wear button up shirts anymore. I know. I mean, her hat is bigger than her. I like the character though. Wow. Oh, he can use the, the ring to just manufacture money. This is green. Good chase scene too. How many times did he put this one song on while he's telling his origin story? Oh, careful, John. I don't think this is just some random woman. So I'm back.

[01:36:36] I had to take a little break, but, um, so the sheriff figured out what he was doing, but still he's in court and now this guy's paying for his bail, but it's the sheriff's husband. So, wow. Okay. I know I'm saying wow a lot, but this is a great, I'm loving this show. Penises on those. Oh no, they're upside down. They're keyholes on the fence posts on the fences. I did not know that Garrett Dillahunt was in this. Great. Part of the DC universe is this in, are they, is he the only superhero? I don't know. Oh, that was the woman at the bar. Okay. I knew she was just another stranger. Oh, he caught him.

[01:37:06] He knows about the lantern. Knows about it recharging and the core. Oh, that was quite an explosion. Told you he was an alien. I am so in for this ride. I didn't realize that was all took place in 2016. And now we're in 2026. Yeah. All right. I'm double in now. Wow. Great. Wow. Yeah. I don't think at this point he's the only superhero and probably, you know, since the DCU isn't completely fleshed out yet, they're leaving a bit vague about who's flying around at this point.

[01:37:37] Yeah. But, uh, thanks Steve. I'm glad you're watching this show. Yeah. Excellent. Steve is a big follower of our moon night podcast, I think. Right on. That was, that was a great show too. Yeah, that was. All right. That is our show. Thanks so much for listening to everybody.

[01:38:06] Hope you enjoyed our first episode. If you want to hear us talk a little bit about like parallels to the comics with possible spoilers for the story coming up, if you know, they do anything the same way as they do in the comics, then stay tuned to the end of this for comic talk. But otherwise our next episode, of course, will be lantern season one, episode two. They're not releasing the titles at a time because they're mysterious.

[01:38:32] If you want to write in or leave us a voice message about it, you can send it to brightest day at podcast.com. Or you can leave comments in the podcast discord or in our Facebook group where you can also chat with us and other listeners about lanterns or whatever else you're watching. Links are of course in the show notes. And I listen, I highly recommend it. We have a great little crew at podcast. So, so join us.

[01:39:01] It's, it's a lot of fun. Yeah. Come chat. All right. That is our show. Thanks for listening. Was it good luck or was it all fuck? All right. We're now in the comic talk section where there will be spoilers.

[01:39:29] So, or, you know, potential spoilers, comic talky stuff. So if you don't want to hear any of that, then thanks for listening and we'll see you next week. Otherwise, uh, what did you guys want to talk about? The man hunters? I had never heard of the man hunters until this came up. I always thought the man hunters were Martian man hunters. I did not know there was a whole category of hunters that the guardians created first before the green lanterns. I didn't know that lore.

[01:39:59] So, but this is, this is where it gets complex, right? Because they're robots. Yeah. So from what I understand, I've read some comics with man hunters, but had to read up on the lore that they were the guardians of the universe, original attempt at this cosmic peacekeeping force, but they were like, yeah, androids or robots programmed to eliminate evil. So I guess they're kind of emotionless and they got reprogrammed and destroyed a whole sector or something.

[01:40:28] And so it just went wrong. And so the guardians got rid of them and started over with the green lantern core with, you know, living beings, but there were still man hunters out there and they were the enemies from then on. And I guess they like went in, went to other planets and disguised themselves as inhabitants of those planets and tried to convince them to go against the guardians or something like that.

[01:40:54] So did they have, did they have a chameleon abilities or? Like shape changing? Yeah. You know what? As far as I knew, they didn't. No. So yeah, I, I think that the confusing, confusing. Yeah. The confusing piece to this is we're so focused on aliens that obviously Martian man hunters, I think when you talk about man hunters, 90% of the time, Kirk, that's who people think of are the Martian man hunter. Yeah.

[01:41:22] Um, John Jones and, and the lore behind that, um, of course is two conflicting versions of, of Martians, um, white versus green. So I, you know, you, you, we, when you think about this show and you think about the people who wrote the show and who understand the lore, but also understand that there's some wiggle room to maybe play around with it a little bit.

[01:41:47] I think that, that this could be one of those situations where they maybe, because I don't know how big a deal it is to DC fans. They may be able to rewrite a little bit of DCU lore to make the man hunters, the Martian man hunters. Yeah. And maybe tell a little bit of that story. They might, because in the comics, even though those two ideas were created by two different creators at two different times, the man hunters and the Martian man hunters.

[01:42:17] Who, if people probably listening to this part know, but he's one of the justice league, he's the green Martian guy that can change shape. And he has like every power. He's basically Superman plus professor X, uh, plus Kitty Pryde. But, um, he, um, they made it so that the man, the man hunters design was inspired by the Martian man hunter or something like that. Something like that. I'm seeing this is our comic talk section where we're like, we're Marvel fans.

[01:42:48] But I was going to ask, I was going to ask, did, did the Martian man hunter get that name because the man hunters wiped out his population? And so then he became focused as a, you know, a hunter of hunters. I don't know if that's the, I don't believe, I don't believe so at all. I, I really believe that they were completely disconnected, nothing to do with each other.

[01:43:17] That's not to say one didn't lead to the other, just maybe by getting a seed into someone's brain, but I, they were not connected at all. So, but I think it, like I said, I think if you, if you take a look at a show like Watchmen where Lindelof specifically took some general ideas and, and turned them into something else that fit enough into the lore with the DC fans watched the show and thought it was great. I think there's, there's room for that. And this could be the room for that.

[01:43:47] Now it, and it fits perfectly if it, if it turns out to be some of the newer man hunter storylines where the, the history of the two groups or the history of the, of the Martians are sort of a race based white versus green that could lead right into what you were talking about earlier, where you have two, two sets of, of aliens, maybe getting ready to battle against each other.

[01:44:12] Um, they, they, how you can tie that lore in if, if you really wanted to really irritate DC fans is they've, they, they, they have not yet specifically named the, um, alien that, that, um, uh, they gave Hal the ring, but you know, they, yeah, they have been, sir. Oh, did they say it? I thought they, okay. Yeah. He said it. Well, he says the name of him, but it's not clear what species he is or what planet he's from or, or what his deal was.

[01:44:41] Is he involved in this war or was he, uh, you know, trying to stop it? The only, the reason why we're confused is because Martian manhunter is a shape changer and the manhunter are a green lanterns, uh, enemy. But if you go to the manhunter's wiki page, the only mention of Martian manhunter is when it says not to be confused with Martian manhunter, which, which may shut that shit down.

[01:45:10] Our three main writers saw that and went, well, we're, well, we're going to confuse the fuck out of everybody. I don't like this segment anymore. And then another thing. Don't confuse me with the facts. Is, uh, I mean, we'll see how it lays out, but, um, John, when we see him boxing, he's at coast city boxing and, uh, coast city is where Hal is from in the comics.

[01:45:37] And this is a big spoiler for something that comes up later in Greenlander comics. But when Hal turns evil and destroys coast city and everyone in it, he becomes this evil entity called parallax. And, uh, that's just what that made me think of. And I don't know if they're going to skip over that or not, but man, you would, that would be a shame to skip over that. Right. That's such a great story element to mine. I would think.

[01:46:07] I, well, no, no, I, no, I think it is. It's, it's, you know, which story are you telling and how long is the story going to go and where do you want to put it in the story? Do you want, do you want this whole season to, to give Kyle Chandler a chance to play Hal as Green Lantern? And then maybe the reason why they're sure they're going to do a season two is because we get to see that version.

[01:46:33] I, it depends on how connected to the comics this is, because I, I think one of the things that is least surprising is that Hal Jordan dies because he does, he does that in the comics of throughout, you know, and, and, and the parallax story, um, is part of that because in, in, in the, in the comics, like he becomes parallax and then ultimately sacrifices himself, um, because of all that he's done. And it's, it's, you know, so, so is that where we're at in 2026?

[01:47:02] I mean, but I, I, if you're these writers and you want to throw out a MacGuffin or you want to, you know, throw that red herring out, that's where you go with it. But I think when you are talking about the complexities of all these characters, I think it would be a great story to tell, uh, the, especially if it has that full arc of him becoming parallax and then what, what comes after that. Yeah. You'd want to take some time with it though. Right. So, but given that they're jumping around in time, Kyle Chandler could still come back for another season and do that. Oh, for sure.

[01:47:32] Oh, for sure. Oh, for sure. Yeah. I, I, there are so many little nods to the comics that I'm familiar with in this episode, but I, I think the, the one that, that, that parallax storyline is, is the one that's kind of, that's playing around in my head. And, and, you know, we, you know, I'm not going to give any trailer like spoilers, but I think there's more yet to come to, to really sort of give us a taste of the complexities of who, how Jordan is in this moment.

[01:48:01] And, and when I sit, when I say in this moment, it's hard to say what moment we're talking about because the nice thing now having, you know, now that I've watched the trailer is that you really don't know what timeline you're watching in that trailer. Cause it gives you no indication. And I almost want to go back and watch it to see if I can figure it out, but I also don't want to ruin the future of the show. So I'm done watching. I didn't even watch, like they had the whole thing coming up this season. I just turned it off. I, yeah, I saw that and I didn't, I didn't watch that either.

[01:48:28] So, but yeah, I, I, I think they're doing a great job right now, sort of towing the line of where the comic characters are, maybe with how they're going a little hyperbolic, you know, as far as his, his, his personality. I think that, that you can, you know, you certainly, you certainly see this personality and how Jordan throughout, throughout the comic book and all the comic book eras, but not maybe to this extent.

[01:48:56] Uh, but I, I, I do think that they're giving us bits and pieces of a bunch of different classic green lantern stories, all kind of combined in this one, this one series. How's always been a rebel and the kind of person that would, you know, he'll go to the guardians and say, I don't like what you're doing here. You know, like he's his own person. So they captured that pretty well.

[01:49:23] And I think John for the most part has been a little more stoic in that, in his character. I think so. And I think he was like an architect or something, but then when they redid the DCU with new 52, he became a military person at that point. I think. I believe he's got it. He's an artist as well. In fact, didn't they have him drawing at one point? Well, Kyle Chandler was, but yeah, you're right. Yeah.

[01:49:53] Yeah. So Kyle. So he, so he, I actually, he's, he's an architect. His, his base profession through many of the different comics has been that architect. So when I saw him drawing in, he, he was, he was, I believe he was drawing the, you know, the alien, the, the Waylon. By the way, we didn't talk about this, but the dude's name was Waylon Sanders. Could it, could it have been a more made up name? Sorry.

[01:50:22] But I, which leads to him being alien. But when he, he was tracing the alien and that he was carrying around that book with him. And I just sort of, I, I, so it could have been to your point, Kirk, an artist thing to do, because as you can probably attest, you probably walked around with something to draw in on occasion. I'm a good one. And he is constantly drawing. And, and he's not always just drawing the things that he's working on.

[01:50:52] A lot of times he's, you know, I think architects in a sense, not even in a sense, or, or, or beautiful artists in their own right. So I, I, it's yet, it's yet to be determined what, you know, what he's doing currently. We know that he was a sniper, which again was, I mean, I can't remember if it's a retcon, but I, I know that he's been a few different things, John. Um, and at some point he, that kind of got retconned into the story. If I remember right, I don't think that was his.

[01:51:21] He became ex-military or something. Yeah. So. I think the, I think the artistic background will, will play into the difference between how he uses the ring and what he chooses to manifest and how to manifest it. Um, versus how, who seems very blunt hammer, you know, box type of, you know, can opener, you know, not very imaginative. You know what I mean? The dollar was pretty clever.

[01:51:51] Yeah. True. But yeah. Yeah. And the comics he's making fists and bubbles, things like that. Then Kyle Rayner came along, the comic book artist and made dragons and, you know, just crazy, kind of things. Um, yeah. Okay. What else? Anything else? Yeah.

[01:52:16] I think that the, um, the relationship that we have currently between the two characters is, while it's certainly more over the top than I think we've seen, the comics, the version that I saw, um, back in the seventies. Uh, first of all, I, I have the original comic and I can't, it, I can't remember.

[01:52:43] It was, I found it a few years ago. Um, and the introduction to the two characters in the comic books, uh, way back in the silver age, um, was interesting. And we'll make the guy Gardner piece, um, interesting to see it, how that all plays out. But, uh, initially it was supposed to be guy Gardner who was going to take over for how he was the quote unquote substitute.

[01:53:11] I think that's literally what they called him in the comic, if I remember right. And then he got injured or something and they picked John who, and I think that the reason why the comic book writers did that was specific to who that was, uh, uh, was, I think that was Dennis O'Neill back in the day.

[01:53:30] Um, but he, he, the reason why he created the John character, a, um, they wanted to have a black superhero back then and B, they wanted to have a character who was opposite of how, who would kind of put it to how a little bit and create sort of that kind of dynamic. Um, and it turned out, it worked out really well. So I think, I think what they're doing is they're taking that initial relationship that they had in that first comic back in the seventies and there, and then they've, I think that's been fed.

[01:53:58] I'm not a current green lantern and Jason, it sounds like you're a little more, maybe you know a little bit more than I do. It does seem like, um, they're, they're the version that I used to read, um, pretty consistently. It seems like this is a hyperbolic version of that reason. They, they got along a lot better, but there was certainly the friction between the two characters, um, because their, their personalities are just so different. Yeah. Guy Gardner didn't come around to the nineties, right? Uh, eighties.

[01:54:26] Well, I don't know when he first came into comics. I don't think it was the eighties. Yeah, absolutely. It was the eighties when he did justice league. He was in justice league international. That was where he really made a splash with, uh, J M Demetis and Keith Giffen and some other writer. Yeah. But that was the eighties. He's been, he's been around. I'm telling you, he's been around since the sixties and seventies. Yeah. But he, I, they didn't make him into this.

[01:54:56] Oh yeah. But yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. He, he was, he was the next ring guy. Like he was the controversial next ring guy before how the, like he was, I mean, John is sort of filling in that role right now. Um, I, I, this. Wow. I'm, I'm out in fucking left field. Guy Gardner was introduced in green lantern volume two, number 59 published in March of 1968. Yeah. Yeah.

[01:55:25] Cause I, I, but he really wasn't much of a character. I don't think it was created by writer, John Broom and artist, Gil Kane created as a backup or alternate green lantern for sector two, eight, one, four. I think that the thing that the, the reason why that stands out to me, um, is I just was, you know, the idea of having multiple lanterns was, was such a, for, you know, for a kid growing up as a comic book fan was such a thrilling idea.

[01:55:52] Seeing two lanterns, both have the ring on in one episode of TV is just amazing to me, especially, you know, over the course of time of superhero movies, we've all sort of been waiting to see it. And, you know, we're sitting here after, you know, just a few pieces of, of James Gunn's DCU. And we've already seen three different lanterns, which is just crazy. So I, I, I, you know, I, are we going to get to see Kyle at some point?

[01:56:20] You know, that's that, you know, it is called lanterns. Who knows where we go, uh, in future years. But I, I, I just think that, I think that the, the connective tissue is all there.

[01:56:31] But as, as we've been talking about with, with the Martian Manhunters, I'm, I think that they're in the lore, there's so much different, weird and kind of quirky lore, um, that there's places where you can fudge it a little bit, bring other types of lore into it and really create, um, a really rich history. Like the idea of having the backstory of the March of the, of the Martian Manhunter, and then the backstory of the Martian war, uh, perhaps being part of this is thrilling.

[01:57:01] Of course, none of that may happen. So maybe, yeah. So there was, uh, Alan Scott was the first Green Lantern and then DC reintroduced a lot of its characters as different versions in the, was it the fifties? Fifties, I think the silver age. Yeah. Silver age. And so Green Lantern became more sci-fi because the first Green Lantern was more magic.

[01:57:27] And the second one, Hal Jordan was more sci-fi and that's been the mythos ever since. And so it was Hal Jordan, then Guy Gardner, but he really was sort of a false start. Right. Then Jon Stewart, then, uh, Kyle Rayner came along when the whole, uh, when after Hal Jordan became Parallax and destroyed the whole Green Lantern Corps. So it was just Kyle Rayner, but then Jeff Johns brought them all back.

[01:57:56] But that was a lot, that was like a 10 year period. I think where Kyle Rayner was the only Green Lantern. Yeah. Then there's this Simon Boz. This is more, a little bit more modern. He's, uh, I think a Muslim guy. Yep. Jessica Cruz, first female human member. There's a new one here. Sojourner Mueling created by NK Jemisin.

[01:58:18] This, uh, celebrated, um, I think sci-fi writer for a maxi series called Far Sector that won some awards. One of the listeners was actually talking about that. I don't know anything about that. That's all modern, like super modern stuff that I haven't been reading for a while. So, yeah, but there's a lot of earth Green Lanterns, of course, because that's where we're from and where the comic writers are all from. All right.

[01:58:46] I think that's good for now. Right. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I think, I mean, we didn't touch it all on Sinestro. Oh, Sinestro. Yeah. It's an episode, but I think, I think he's gonna, he's gonna play a big, a big role in explaining why, you know, why the, um, guardians are, feel like they need him to train somebody else. You know? Mm-hmm. I mean, they're probably worried because he was the mentor for Hal. So, did he rub off on Hal?

[01:59:16] Is Hal gonna be susceptible to the same kind of temptation? Yeah. So maybe we need somebody different. But then why have Hal train them? I know. Yeah. I mean, we're in spoiler territory here, so hopefully it's okay. But if you watch the trailers, you saw Sinestro's in some kind of a space prison and Hal is talking to him. We don't know what time period that's in. He's wearing the full Green Lantern outfit. So that could mean it's earlier or maybe he just wears that when he goes out into space.

[01:59:44] But in the comics, Sinestro was a Green Lantern, the one he trained Hal Jordan. But he also, his sector was like the most orderly. And then it was figured out that's because he ruled with an iron fist. He ruled by fear and kept everyone in line. And eventually, you know, that made him a villain. And he started his own yellow core, which later became the Sinestro core that was like fear-based. And the rings made yellow constructs. Yeah.

[02:00:13] Well, and fear seems, as you had pointed out when we first started talking about doing a podcast, fear and dealing with fear and not letting it control you, et cetera, seems to be a big theme of the show. So, yep. I do think that the best of the best comics do a really nice job looking at things like the Green Lantern Corps and showing the flaws of the idea of it.

[02:00:41] I think that, you know, you see that wrapped through time and different types of powerful organizations like the Green Lantern Corps. So, I think they're touching on this a little bit. And you could see it a little bit in this show. Poke holes in the concept a little bit. Yeah. Yeah. And I think when you talk about, you know, we talked about this earlier.

[02:01:04] I think the best that we, the reason why comic books and the reason why superheroes are so fascinating, aside from the fact that they're cool and have superpowers, is that they can show human flaws without making it as scary as actually turning on the news. And I think that this show has the possibility of doing that. Listen, this show's been a lot of fun for me, so I don't want to turn this into some sort of like deep dive.

[02:01:31] But I think the comic books over time that have meant the most to me are comic books that have deeper meaning. Yeah. That kind of really reach into your soul. And you're not only seeing a superhero in front of you, but you're seeing, I think the reason why I love Spider-Man so much. And if you haven't seen Brand New Day, I think it's the thing that touches me the most. I, I, it, it makes it, I think, yeah, I, well, I just, it made me, you mentioned it too off talk.

[02:01:59] It makes you, the best comics make us feel that, that we can, that we can be better. And I think that, that, that, that movie and, and, and, and a lot of ways, like when you watch a show like this, like you can, you can see the struggle and the fight and to be better.

[02:02:15] And that's why scenes like him hugging kids and scenes of, of, of John helping the kid throw the ball through the tire, as silly as that scene is, it, it shows you sort of the core of who they are. Yeah. And I, I. Yeah. And, and, and, and what made that Superman movie spectacular in my opinion was that he, he showed us humanity in that movie, which is something that you, it's hard to do.

[02:02:42] It was like a drink of water after being really thirsty for a while for me. Like, oh, this is what we needed in our Superman. Yeah. Especially that speech, that speech at the end. Yeah. When he's just like, you know, that I'm just, I get up every morning, just like you put two shoes on and try to make the best of it. You know what I mean? Fly to work.

[02:03:03] Um, and I mean, everything you're saying is really resonating with me, Jim, because like, I, you'll notice I'm not podcasting on any other superhero shows. And, you know, that's maybe not fair. They, they, they've, some of these shows are really amazing in their depth, but I guess what, how I should have approached this is just, I like to podcast about shows that have some meaning behind it.

[02:03:27] And that, you know, the best is if it actually has something to say or even reveal about human truths, you know, like it's fun to get a good story and a mystery and to see superpowers and stuff like that. But to really just be moved or even just sort of see things in a different way or something like that. Yeah. That's the treasure for me. To feel something. Yeah. To feel something. Do it. To feel something.

[02:03:48] Like, I, I just like, when I come out, when it, to give you, to give you a best example, and I know we're going off on a tirade here, but, but the reason why these shows, I, I mean, listen, I, I was as burned out as anybody. I mean, I'm not even saying that Marvel wasn't putting out good stuff. I'm not saying that DC, DC wasn't putting out good stuff, but I was as burned out as everybody. I came, I came out of, um, I'm just going to talk about the last two things that I've seen in, in, in lanterns. It was one of them.

[02:04:15] I came out of Spider-Man, not feeling like I watched a superhero movie while at the same time feeling like a good core of my youth was, I witnessed in front of me. I felt, I felt as isolated as he did. Um, I felt as seen as he did when people started to see him again.

[02:04:31] And when you can put that into a superhero movie, that is super special to watch, um, Kyle Chandler portray a character who is hiding, perhaps loss or isolation by being something bigger than he feel by. You could, you could almost, other people could see how small he maybe feels, but he's putting on a whole different persona because fuck, he's the green lantern.

[02:05:00] And we're watching this other person for whatever reason who has, instead of watching his father die, watches his dad come out with a gun and shoot an apple above his head. We're watching him try to honor that and also try to honor this other guy that he doesn't agree with at all. Um, and, and become the superhero that he was meant to be. I feel it. I feel it. Like, I feel it. Like, so I'm, you know, I, I just, I'm excited about where this show can go.

[02:05:30] I hate the fact that even with as great as this first, this first episode is, I'm like, oh fuck, they're going to do something stupid. Aren't they? That's always possible. I have good feeling after this. Yeah. We'll see. We'll see. I do too. I, if it wasn't the three P, I mean, you couldn't have the more three perfect people together for it to run, to run a show. They, yeah. And if they mess it up, it's only eight episodes. It's only eight episodes.

[02:06:00] What an inspiring way to end that. We can have, we can have a special, we'll do a special Patreon week to week where you can only see us on Patreon shredding the shit out of season two. Season two. Well, all right. I think that's a great place to end it. And thank you guys. That was a ton of fun. We'll see you next week.

[02:06:21] From the history of Hershey to the business behind the hit podcast acquired, Cold Call, the chart topping management podcast from Harvard Business School, gives you a seat in the classroom where these legendary cases are brought to life. I'm Brian Kenney, the chief marketing and communications officer at Harvard Business School and the host of Cold Call, which explores the real world case studies taught in our classrooms, featuring the professors who wrote them and often the executives, entrepreneurs, and innovators who lived them.

[02:06:46] In each episode, we break down the decisions, trade-offs, and leadership lessons behind some of the most fascinating organizations. Not to mention, we just dropped a new video series examining AI case studies like the Atlantic's partnership with OpenAI, Mass General Brigham's use of AI to streamline clinical documentation, and Harvard Art Museum's experimentation with generative AI. So don't miss out. Follow or watch Cold Call on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, YouTube, or wherever you get your podcasts.