728: TWD S7E5 "Go Getters" Rewatch

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[00:00:30] [SPEAKER_08] Hmm? Ah! Hmm.

[00:00:37] [SPEAKER_10] Well, I'm a team player. You know, I think that's why the people chose me.

[00:00:41] [SPEAKER_02] Well, the other people of ours you were dealing with? I think they got spoiled working with a guy like you. Yeah, well... Yeah. I think they might have got a little soft. Yeah. That's what got them butchered, I imagine. They're dead? They're dead? Very, very dead. Extremely dead. But you know, it all worked out.

[00:01:12] [SPEAKER_11] Because the people that killed them, they work for us now. And they, real go-getters, you know?

[00:01:24] [SPEAKER_04] Hey, deadheads, welcome to the podcast. I'm Jason.

[00:01:58] [SPEAKER_06] And I'm Carissa.

[00:01:59] [SPEAKER_09] And this is The Walking Dead 'Cast episode 728.

[00:02:03] [SPEAKER_06] In this episode, we're covering The Walking Dead, season seven, episode five, go-getters.

[00:02:11] [SPEAKER_09] Go-getters. Because that's what we are. Thank you for joining me for this one. I appreciate you coming on.

[00:02:17] [SPEAKER_06] You're welcome. Thanks for inviting me.

[00:02:19] [SPEAKER_09] I had a few announcements before we start, one of which is that Lucy is getting busy with life and she, next week she and Peter are entering into a civil union together.

[00:02:33] [SPEAKER_08] Oh.

[00:02:35] [SPEAKER_09] They're doing a ceremony and everything. It's not quite a marriage, but it's the same as a marriage in the eyes of the law. That's how they wanted to do it. And also her improv group is apparently kind of taking off. She's actually hoping that they come to Chicago next year, in which case maybe I'll go out and check them out. That'd be cool. So she still loves doing the podcast. She, you know, I asked her, are you burnt out? Do you want to quit? And she said she doesn't want to quit. She just needs to scale back.

[00:03:05] [SPEAKER_09] So she'll be back in a couple of episodes for number seven, season seven, episode seven. And then she's going to try doing every other episode for a while. So every two weeks and just see how that goes. So I'll be bringing in other guests for those off week episodes. But, um, yeah, I'm glad I told, I always tell everyone who's doing this stuff. If you're not having fun with it anymore, then you shouldn't do it because it doesn't pay anything. Absolutely. It's just for fun, you know? And she's, she is having fun with it.

[00:03:35] [SPEAKER_09] She's just needs to scale back a little bit. So yeah. Yeah. And I think she is, you know, she, I think she's a little burnt out on it, but not to the point where she doesn't want to do it anymore. And she told me she thought that season seven was going to be like, Oh, but she's actually enjoying it more than she thought she would. So that's cool.

[00:03:54] [SPEAKER_07] Well, congrats Lucy. Yeah.

[00:03:57] [SPEAKER_09] Congrats to Lucy. Uh, next I have a few other things in case you guys didn't know. Uh, I mean, we're back to the rewatch. So I imagine there's some people who just weren't listening to the other stuff who are coming back. So welcome back. If you didn't know, Karen and I started podcasting on this really good Apple TV comedy horror series. Widow's Bay, which is, if you don't know, it's about this mayor of a small new England Island town who that's cursed and he's trying to bring tourists in to boost the economy.

[00:04:27] [SPEAKER_09] But there's all these like cursed ghosts and legends and things like that coming to life and horror terrorizing everyone. It's really good. It recently won 14 Emmys, which is the highest ever of any comedy in a single season. And me and Karen are just having a lot of fun with it. You know, just if you miss me and Karen together, I highly recommend jumping on board with that.

[00:04:48] [SPEAKER_09] Um, it's on my podcast wax episodic where I cover a bunch of different shows, but also I've been breaking those out into their own standalone podcasts too, in case people just want one for each show. So there's one called everything's fine and widow's Bay podcast. And I'll put links in the show notes in case anybody wants to check them out. A couple more things. I started a new Patrion perk. It's called Dexter resurrections round table reactions.

[00:05:14] [SPEAKER_09] And that's modeled after our old fear of the walking dead round table rants, but more positive because Dexter's awesome. So if you're a fan of that and you want to hear me chat with other fans about it for like a half an hour a week, that's a Patrion perk. You can go to patrion.com slash Jason Cabassi, and you can even come on with me if there's space. Uh, if you're a fan and you're interested in that and you're a part of my Patrion, let me know.

[00:05:41] [SPEAKER_09] And maybe you can come on and chat about Dexter. It's really fun. And there's like no prep or anything. It's not as organized as what I usually do. It's more just like reaction. And then last, I hope you guys enjoyed my coverage of the Friday, the 13th prequel Crystal Lake with me and Jamie and Nathan that we've been doing on this podcast over the last few weeks. If you didn't get a chance to watch that, the, the, I think the best thing about it was Linda Cardellini starred in it as Pamela. I love her.

[00:06:11] [SPEAKER_09] And she was really, really good. I already loved her, but she really did something different and great with this role. Um, it's, I think a lot of people might go, well, I'm not a Friday the 13th fan, so I don't think I'd be into it, but it's different than Friday the 13th. It's, it does have that slasher aspect to it, but it's also about character and it's kind of funny and you know, it's, it's actually gotten, um, the highest reviews of any Friday the 13th thing ever, you know?

[00:06:40] [SPEAKER_06] So that's, that's incredible. Actually.

[00:06:43] [SPEAKER_09] Yeah, that's pretty good. So that's all my announcements. Let's get into this week's episode, walking dead season seven, episode five. Go getters. Would you want to read the summary?

[00:06:53] [SPEAKER_06] Yeah.

[00:06:55] [SPEAKER_07] Carl accompanies Enid to Hilltop to visit Maggie, who was recovering there with Sasha. Gregory is furious with Maggie and Sasha for not fulfilling their deal to kill the saviors and demands they leave.

[00:07:08] [SPEAKER_06] However, after they helped defend Hilltop from a Walker attack, Jesus told Gregory, he must let them stay while the saviors raid Hilltop supplies.

[00:07:17] [SPEAKER_07] Sasha asked Jesus that he can find out where a new thing lives, which he agrees to do. Jesus then sneaks onto one of the safest trucks where he finds Carl hiding.

[00:07:28] [SPEAKER_09] So what'd you think of what going back? How long had it been? Do you think since you saw this?

[00:07:33] [SPEAKER_07] Probably since the very first time I saw it when it originally aired. And, um, I dunno, it was, it was, it was just okay.

[00:07:44] [SPEAKER_09] That's good.

[00:07:46] [SPEAKER_07] It wasn't bad. I was definitely into it, but I don't know. Um, I think at this point in the season, like all the big stuff happened, you know, the first episode happened and Daryl's in prison and.

[00:07:57] [SPEAKER_09] And it looks like things are set up.

[00:07:59] [SPEAKER_06] Detour episode. Yeah. So.

[00:08:02] [SPEAKER_09] Yeah. I mean, my complaints, my biggest complaint about the Negan storyline is that I think they drew it out too long. And this in some ways feels like a repeat of the episode. We got a couple of weeks ago where Negan visited Alexandria, some asshole coming in and just humiliating everybody and enjoying it. And we watched that for an hour.

[00:08:28] [SPEAKER_09] But for me, what saves it is I think Simon and Gregory are pretty great characters, even though they're assholes. They're fun for me to watch. I know some people don't agree that Gregory is fun to watch, but I think he is. And, um, and yeah, I, I felt kind of the same as you, but I still found myself enjoying it and think it was amazing or anything, but I ended up finding a lot of things to talk about.

[00:08:54] [SPEAKER_07] Yeah, me too. And I agree about it was, um, fun watching Gregory and Simon interact. I mean, it was like on the edge of my teeth a little bit, even though I knew what was going to happen in an episode, but it was, it was entertaining, you know, and that's the best.

[00:09:07] [SPEAKER_09] Yes, that's true. Yeah. So what do you want to talk about first?

[00:09:12] [SPEAKER_07] Um, my first point is probably super petty, but I've always been, uh, I can't get in like Maggie's symptoms. And the last season when she got sick, just do not match a placental abruption. Oh, really? It's, it's like, also, she's too early in her pregnancy to have a placental abruption.

[00:09:34] [SPEAKER_08] Mm-hmm .

[00:09:34] [SPEAKER_07] And so I researched it and what can happen that early. And I mean, she seems like she's like two months along. It's like a first trimester subchorionic bleed. And you do have cramping, you have abdominal pain and you can have bleeding and it's scary, but not anything with it. Like she was experiencing with, it was almost like she was feverish. Like she had sepsis or something, which is, um, and so I just feel like it's so ridiculous for her to be so dramatic and she almost died. And then all of a sudden she's better.

[00:10:05] [SPEAKER_07] So my point is I wish they had have had her got like maybe sick in a different way. Another illness that caused a fever that would threaten her in the pregnancy, but not so, so specific, like a placental abruption. So specific.

[00:10:22] [SPEAKER_09] Yeah. Somebody did a little research, but not enough.

[00:10:25] [SPEAKER_07] Yeah. It sounds like exactly, you know, cause you know, when I was pregnant with my first son, I think I got the flu. And I was sick. I took Tylenol, did everything I was supposed to do. Um, cause I did get a fever. Um, but imagine being an apocalypse and then you don't have medication to control the fever. Right. Things we take for granted. Yeah. So I know they had a flu thing a couple of seasons before that, but you know, I don't know.

[00:10:52] [SPEAKER_07] I just felt like it should have been something like a little bit more less specific, I guess. But again, very petty point, but I had to.

[00:11:01] [SPEAKER_09] Well, no, I mean, that's we're on a podcast. So I, uh, I, I, I think it's good personally to be specific, but then you have to be right, you know, and it sounds like they weren't. So I forget, are you in the medical field?

[00:11:17] [SPEAKER_07] I'm not, but I've done medical writing. Um, I worked for a foundation that raises money for our local hospital. So I, I'm used to like looking at medical stuff and like knowing what I'm reading and what it means and stuff. And then, you know, I've been pregnant myself twice. Um, so yeah, it's any kind of illness while you're pregnant can be scary. So I just felt like they had a lot to choose from.

[00:11:42] [SPEAKER_07] Um, especially given the lack of medical expertise that they had.

[00:11:47] [SPEAKER_09] Things that wouldn't normally be super threatening would be. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. All right. I want to move on and talk a little bit about Gregory who, I mean, a lot of the tension in this episode is like Maggie wouldn't even be at a hilltop if not for this. How do you say it? Placental abruption? Yes. Sickness we'll say.

[00:12:16] [SPEAKER_09] And, uh, and that she needs to have a doctor and to rest and take it easy. But Gregory just wants her out. And, um, I think, I think most people are at least many people probably aren't going to agree with what I'm about to say. My opinions on Gregory, but I've been, this is the thing I've been most excited to talk about.

[00:12:41] [SPEAKER_09] Cause, uh, you know, we always have one thing I love and try to stress always is you don't have to agree. Argue back with me. That's fine. But here's what I think. I think, I mean, I often talk about, I think it's important, especially in really serious situations where people's lives or livelihoods are at stake, or if it has to do with justice

[00:13:06] [SPEAKER_09] or something like that, to look past how the people involved make us feel and look at what they're actually doing. Like if someone is super charming, I always say like Negan, but he's being, he's doing bad things, then don't, don't pay any attention to how charming he is. And on the other side of the spectrum, if someone is an asshole, but then you still have to be like, okay, I gotta see if he's doing the right thing independently in my feelings about his personality with Gregory.

[00:13:33] [SPEAKER_09] I absolutely don't think he's a hundred percent in the right, but I don't think he's a hundred percent in the wrong either. I think as far as his personality, he's, I wrote condescending, nervous, sleazy, fake and rude. And you could probably come up with a bunch of other things. Uh, like when he said, you know, Sasha's like, we can't leave Maggie's pregnant. And he goes, well, that's her mistake. Like, it's hard. I understand to look past shit like that. Right. You're like, fuck you. And I don't blame people for thinking that, but I just, the looking back at the history

[00:14:02] [SPEAKER_09] of what's happened here, like this is our first time back at Hilltop after Rick was there and needed food and proposed taking out all of Negan's people in exchange for food. And then at that point, Maggie was really bristling against Gregory, uh, deservedly. So he was being a total like sleazy dickhead. And so she's, she demanded that he give them half of everything Hilltop had food supplies. I think they got a cow. Daryl said, we want the cow over there.

[00:14:31] [SPEAKER_09] And, um, you had to give it to them right then before they would then go take care of Negan. And they, I think they did. They gave half their stuff to Alexandria and they got nothing for it except for the, for the possibility that the saviors would be pissed at Hilltop for associating with the people that killed a bunch of their people. And so that's why he doesn't want Maggie and Sasha there. Cause their people came in, heard their problems, cockily promised that they would deal with

[00:15:00] [SPEAKER_09] it and then ended up totally fucking up by killing some of their people in their sleep, then getting subjugated by their leader. And now they all work for, for Negan, like the people that were supposed to help them work for Negan. And then a couple of them are back here wanting their help and would absolutely cause problems that the saviors found out. And, um, I mean, Gregory says, Maggie said that people could take care of the savior. So for all, all they've done is put our community at risk and he's, he's right about that.

[00:15:27] [SPEAKER_09] And, um, so I understand his frustration here. And then, I mean, it's clear, like on the other hand, it's clear that Maggie and Sasha are the good guys and Negan and the savior are the bad guys. And the courageous and morally right thing to do in my opinion is to help the good guys. So he, he should be doing that. But it also does bother me that Maggie and Sasha come back with this attitude towards Gregory after what happened.

[00:15:57] [SPEAKER_09] Like, I think they should probably be pleading and not demanding. And, um, you know, like Gregory says, if they see you here, they'll think we colluded. And Sasha says, we did kind of with attitude. And I'm like, dude, you guys made promises and we trusted you and you botched it. You know, don't give me that bullshit. So I, I, I just, I think, you know, Gregory is afraid that his people are going to die because of this and he has good reason to be.

[00:16:25] [SPEAKER_09] And I'm, I'm sure the way he is, I shouldn't say I'm sure, but I wouldn't be surprised if he's more afraid for his own life than anything, but he is in charge of this community and he's trying to keep them safe too.

[00:16:39] [SPEAKER_08] Mm hmm.

[00:16:39] [SPEAKER_09] So, um, I have a bunch more in this, but I think I, I sort of got the point across and then Sasha, you know, suggests that Jesus should step up and be leader. And he says, I'm not the leader type. And then clearly he's thinking that Maggie is. And when Maggie punches him in the face, Gregory says, you know, we play nice. They played nice and Maggie punches him in the face.

[00:17:07] [SPEAKER_09] And I'm like, well, that's exactly what Ezekiel and Rick are both doing right now. You know? And I, but I think that's what made Jesus think, oh, she could be a leader. She's standing up to Gregory. And that, as we know, does end up happening, but I don't know, man, I'm not sure. I think that's fair. I mean, clearly the, the thing that he did that was super shitty was to try to turn them over to Simon and I don't agree with that at all.

[00:17:35] [SPEAKER_09] So I'm not, like I said, I'm not saying he's a hundred percent right, but it's not black and white as far as I'm concerned.

[00:17:42] [SPEAKER_07] Yeah. Um, I think that your point is the sound. I think that, um, the, our group did screw up badly. Um, to the point where they lost two of their people. Um, they tried to hold up their end of the deal, but they failed. And so I think it's fair that Gregory is hesitant, you know, he's a asshole, but you know, he could be nicer about it and more diplomatic about it. Yeah.

[00:18:10] [SPEAKER_07] I think it's fair for him to be a little bit questioning about like, should you guys stay here now? There is the right thing to do to let them stay and protect them. It's probably pretty easy to hide them. Um, and it was a risk, but it is a risk, but I feel like it's the right thing to do. Yeah. Um, and yeah, I mean, Sasha and Maggie are obviously grieving, but yeah, I feel like they should have

[00:18:34] [SPEAKER_07] been a little bit more humble, but I guess maybe their attitude, particularly Maggie's was to show Jesus that, Oh, she has potential because you know, Gregory isn't the right leader for this moment. Um, I think I mentioned in one of my points. And so he, you know, for long-term you probably need somebody else other than Gregory, but I agree

[00:18:59] [SPEAKER_09] with that.

[00:18:59] [SPEAKER_07] That's not, you know, you can't change it.

[00:19:02] [SPEAKER_09] It's all about, you need to have respect for your leaders. And as much as I think I can understand him not being happy with what happens and also even being nervous about having their people there, uh, you're right. He should have said it in a different way. And it's just like, I started out my point saying that you have to look past how someone makes you feel.

[00:19:30] [SPEAKER_09] But on the other hand, if someone, if a leader makes you feel like that all the time, it's not going to work. You know, they have to inspire you, not make you feel the ick every time you're in a room with them.

[00:19:41] [SPEAKER_06] Yeah. And that's what he does.

[00:19:43] [SPEAKER_07] And that's what is so, you know, probably feels toxic dealing with him because you can't even have a normal conversation with him without him like leering at them or just saying ass remarks. And it's hard.

[00:19:58] [SPEAKER_09] The sleaziness is just inexcusable. It's like, it's so inexcusable,

[00:20:02] [SPEAKER_07] but you gotta be strategic, I guess, you know, and try to figure out a way the best you can. So, um, so yeah.

[00:20:11] [SPEAKER_09] You do sort of wonder how he got to that position. Jesus is like, yeah, I thought he might've done something to earn it, but I guess it just happened or something like that.

[00:20:22] [SPEAKER_06] That happens sometimes.

[00:20:23] [SPEAKER_09] I guess it does. I guess it does.

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[00:20:58] [SPEAKER_09] Okay, what else?

[00:21:00] [SPEAKER_07] My second point is Michonne's support of Rick. I know this is kind of a roll over from the previous episode when Negan came to Alexandria to swing his whatever around. And I know, I didn't watch it recently, but if I recall correctly, Michonne was angry, I think. And she went to go hide a gun or something.

[00:21:24] [SPEAKER_07] But what I love about her is she's supporting his decision to go along with Negan, but also maintaining her stance. Excuse me, that she disagrees with it. And she, but she's open to being wrong.

[00:21:37] [SPEAKER_08] Mm-hmm.

[00:21:38] [SPEAKER_07] Mm-hmm. Which is what I love. And I love like their little shorthand that they do. I mean, both actors have really great chemistry and the writing and it's so amazing. But she just like kissed him and he was like, thank you. And then like, they were good. If there was anything there from before, because I'm sure they probably talked or maybe argued, who knows what happened off screen.

[00:22:02] [SPEAKER_08] Mm-hmm. Yeah.

[00:22:03] [SPEAKER_07] He knew she may think differently. I know she hasn't changed her mind, but we're good. And she's supporting me and then, but then she's trying to figure it out. So it's just, I just love their relationship. I hate that it started right when all this bullshit erupted.

[00:22:21] [SPEAKER_06] Yeah.

[00:22:22] [SPEAKER_07] But it's a good test. It's a good test though of just their bond and you know, they obviously made it through.

[00:22:29] [SPEAKER_09] That's true, man. Their relationship has been tested by some serious stuff.

[00:22:34] [SPEAKER_07] Yeah. Very, very serious. Yeah. And so yeah, exactly. And you know, I don't like always comparing her to Lori, but I have to. And it's just, I always wonder how Lori would have been in this situation with the stakes so high and everything. So like, this is a low for them. Yeah. It's a low for them.

[00:22:56] [SPEAKER_09] She'd be in Negan's harem potentially. No, I don't know.

[00:23:00] [SPEAKER_08] I mean, who knows? Who knows?

[00:23:02] [SPEAKER_07] But yeah, it's just like, he needs a partner. If he's going to have a partner, he needs somebody that's going to support him and they've got to figure out a way to work it out. But she doesn't have to, you know, do everything he says, which Rick does not expect from his partner. So I just loved it.

[00:23:17] [SPEAKER_09] Yeah. Yeah. I liked that. Um, that the, the way they played that scene where he's going on the supply run and he, I think he goes in for a quick, just sort of perfunctory kiss. And she's like, no, no, no. No. And then she gives him a deep one. And it's like, I want to show you that we're still connected, even though, you know, I don't agree with this. It was just kind of what you just said, but yeah, it was just a really good way to play that.

[00:23:43] [SPEAKER_07] I forgot about that part. He did kind of, it was like, yeah, I'm going to go.

[00:23:46] [SPEAKER_09] Yeah.

[00:23:47] [SPEAKER_07] And then she's like, let's stop for like 20 seconds. Yeah.

[00:23:52] [SPEAKER_09] Yeah. And it's nice that, I mean, I think she, like, she just said to Carl a second later, you know, I don't agree, but I'm not sure he's wrong and she's still figuring it out. But in the meantime, I think she thinks, you know, I'm not sure he's wrong, but even if he is, then I think he'll come around eventually, which he does as we know. So she's just not giving up on him.

[00:24:14] [SPEAKER_07] Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Um, they're in a tough spot to be honest. I mean, what, what they just experienced and what they witnessed, it's like, you need to calm things down and you need to like the stats. And I don't know how Rick responded to this in the comics. If it's different than what years been so long, I barely remember.

[00:24:38] [SPEAKER_09] I think it was the same though, but I'm not. It was pretty much the same. Yeah. He wasn't. Right.

[00:24:44] [SPEAKER_07] Right. Right. Um, you just have to take a breather, take a breather and try to like not create a situation where more people get hurt or die and just. Yeah.

[00:24:55] [SPEAKER_09] He acted rashly before.

[00:24:57] [SPEAKER_07] Yes.

[00:24:58] [SPEAKER_09] Yes. And that was a problem. But I think, I think in his mind, he's like, cause I, I, I, I feel like watching the second time around, I figured it out a little bit better that Rick is always all about protecting the people that he cares about. And he thought, you know, Hey, we've handled bad guys before and we need to take care of them before they can do anything. That's why he went and killed the saviors in the outpost, but that turned out to be the wrong decision and it got people killed. So now he's like, fuck, that was wrong.

[00:25:26] [SPEAKER_09] I need to just do what they say. Cause I don't want anyone else to die. That's what he cares about. Right. And what he doesn't realize yet is, Hey, they have a choice in that to these other people that you're taking care of. They, they have the choice if they want to risk their lives to be free or to at least let others be free, then they should be allowed to do that. And I think that's what he'll eventually realize.

[00:25:51] [SPEAKER_07] Yeah. Yeah. And also just with a person like me again, um, and we might talk about this later with the Simon situation, like it's just not sustainable. The way things are with the saviors, it's going to fall apart. I mean, it does fall apart, but it's things like that never are sustainable.

[00:26:11] [SPEAKER_09] I was thinking about how, um, when Simon made, um, what's his name? Gregory kneel.

[00:26:20] [SPEAKER_08] Mm hmm.

[00:26:20] [SPEAKER_09] And it just seems really humiliating, but it's also kind of what happened in like feudal Europe. I think everyone had to kneel to their lords and their Kings and it was just sort of institutionalized, but I think it's the same. Impulse that created that. Like, I guess you have to have a very, uh, easily discernable, uh, signs of, okay, I'm with you.

[00:26:48] [SPEAKER_09] I, you know, you, what you say goes just to keep that order. Um, I don't know what I'm trying to say about that, but it just, it seems like, um, I don't know. I would hope that you're right, that eventually people would fight back and that is what we're going to see on the walking dead. But I think there's been long periods of history where people just sort of accept their lot for a long time.

[00:27:13] [SPEAKER_07] You know, I can't imagine anything different. Um, yeah.

[00:27:18] [SPEAKER_09] Right.

[00:27:18] [SPEAKER_07] And so here we're in a situation where maybe you're getting into this corner where you're like, I guess this is my new life now, but you can't imagine something different.

[00:27:29] [SPEAKER_06] Right. Cause you've experienced different. I think that's. And so.

[00:27:33] [SPEAKER_09] Then you're going to fight back.

[00:27:35] [SPEAKER_06] Yeah. Yeah.

[00:27:37] [SPEAKER_09] Yeah. The bad part, like when you see parts of the world where that, for example, there's just fighting going all the time and you know that kids are growing up in that and that's all they know. And it's like, no, it doesn't have to be that way. You know?

[00:27:48] [SPEAKER_07] It doesn't. It doesn't. I think. Yeah. I mean, I think that's the good thing about our current world is that things are so even in places where everything's on lockdown. Social media.

[00:27:59] [SPEAKER_08] Mm hmm.

[00:28:00] [SPEAKER_07] One good thing about it is that I feel like it gets, still gets in. Oh, things can be different. We just have to figure out a way. So.

[00:28:09] [SPEAKER_09] Yeah. Mm hmm.

[00:28:10] [SPEAKER_07] Yeah.

[00:28:11] [SPEAKER_09] Well, speaking of Simon, let's see. I had a point about them, them ramming the car through the hilltops gate and playing music to attract the zombies and it's caged up and Maggie runs over it with a big tractor. And, um, I thought that was kind of fun and it reminded me how, when we did this podcast or when we covered these the first time, I mean, throughout most of the history of the podcast, I, I always had fun picking out songs to fit the moment.

[00:28:37] [SPEAKER_09] And for this one, I found this country song called big green tractor. I can't do it anymore. Cause I got in trouble for copyright. So I had to take them all out. But, um, it was like, I can take you for a ride on my big green tractor. We can go slow or make go faster. It was so funny. I stuck that in the middle. Oh, cause I remember watching this last night. I was like, oh, this is the big green tractor. It's kind of silly.

[00:29:05] [SPEAKER_09] But, uh, it was like climb up in my lap and drive if you want to. But then I thought it was super funny at the end when, um, she goes, she was telling Enid, Enid was asking her about it. Oh, I heard you ran over some cars as a tractor. She goes, I couldn't sit by and watch. So I guess I sat and did something. And then she tells him that she ran over a boy's Camaro with a tractor in high school.

[00:29:32] [SPEAKER_09] I don't think I caught either of those first time through. It's kind of funny.

[00:29:37] Yeah.

[00:29:39] [SPEAKER_09] And I like that the saviors carved a metal middle finger to flip off anyone trying to get into the car.

[00:29:45] [SPEAKER_06] That is so ridiculous.

[00:29:48] [SPEAKER_09] It's funny.

[00:29:49] [SPEAKER_06] I mean, that takes time.

[00:29:51] [SPEAKER_09] Yeah. And then later, uh, Simon said something about, you know, he said last night to, to Gregory, that was us working our asses off to provide you an example. People here probably forget what the corpses look like, what they smell like. So I think he was trying to frame it. Like we were doing you a favor just to remind you of what's out there. And he, but the part about how they work their asses off. I'm like, that's true.

[00:30:13] [SPEAKER_09] They had to like do up that car and, and, uh, heard the zombies in there and somebody took the time to carve this metal flip the bird. That's some impressive attention to detail. Just to prove what total assholes you are. Uh, and then he goes in and, you know what?

[00:30:36] [SPEAKER_09] I mean, I, I also had in this point to talk about the interaction between, um, Simon and, uh, why don't I keep forgetting his name? Gregory. Gregory. But did you have a point on that?

[00:30:49] [SPEAKER_07] Um, my only point was that the savior is making me physically ill. Like, like you said, like you have just had an episode with Negan where he's doing the same thing, just humiliating people and making people feel like crap and scaring them and threatening to kill people. And they're just the worst. I just, and Simon's like shit eating grin and amazing acting. But so good that it makes me sick.

[00:31:18] [SPEAKER_08] Yeah.

[00:31:18] [SPEAKER_07] And it's just like triggering. Because. You got these like, I don't know, I guess because we have seen in real life, these feckless leaders and their little. Quizzlings that just have no morals. And it's just the havoc that has spread and the psychological terror that they put people through. And this is what it is. It's like a mind game. It's like, I'm threatening you physically, but I'm also threatening you. I'm trying to keep you locked down mentally so that you don't fight back.

[00:31:49] [SPEAKER_09] Yeah. Bullying.

[00:31:51] [SPEAKER_07] Oh yeah. It's just bullying. And it's just like, I don't think I've ever experienced this feeling for a villain in my life and watching. I'm trying to figure out if there anyone else I hate, I don't know what is so unique about the saviors other than what you just said. Maybe it just went on for so long. Yeah. It's like, what episode is this? Five or something. And I'm fine. Right.

[00:32:14] [SPEAKER_09] I know. Me too. Yeah. Like that's enough.

[00:32:16] [SPEAKER_07] But yeah, it's just like, it's just great. And then like, even though I don't like Gregory, I felt really bad for him when he was being forced to kneel. It's just, to just humiliate people like that. It's just kind of, it's just bottom theater behavior. It's disgusting. So disgusting. Yeah.

[00:32:33] [SPEAKER_09] I just want to take those people and send them away. Go away. Go somewhere else.

[00:32:39] [SPEAKER_06] Just go away. Just do your own thing.

[00:32:40] [SPEAKER_09] Leave us alone and let us have our rich and wonderful lives that are better without you in them. Yeah. You add nothing.

[00:32:49] [SPEAKER_07] Yeah. And then I think my other point connected to Gregory is just how dangerous power vacuums are. Um, so we were talking about like, how did Gregory even get into power? And it probably just nobody stepped up. It could have been as simple as that. And he's like, well, I'll do it. And it's just, like I said, for this problem with the saviors, Gregory is not the right person. Yeah.

[00:33:16] [SPEAKER_07] And I think that we also, this episode serves for us to see Maggie as a potential leader of Hilltop. Also, I think like just a comparison between Maggie and Gregory, um, is, is what we're supposed to see. And it's kind of foreshadowing or whatever.

[00:33:37] [SPEAKER_09] So, um, your microphone just changed by the way. It sounds better. Oh my gosh. All of a sudden. I don't know what happened.

[00:33:43] [SPEAKER_07] I don't know. You can still hear me, right?

[00:33:45] [SPEAKER_09] It sounds better now.

[00:33:47] [SPEAKER_07] All right. I took these off.

[00:33:49] [SPEAKER_09] Oh, okay.

[00:33:50] [SPEAKER_07] Maybe they're dying. So anyway, um, but yeah, just, we're supposed to see the comparison between Gregory and Maggie and to see Maggie's potential and foreshadowing. Um, that's part of what this episode served, even though it was, you know, and, um, but yeah, power vacuums are so dangerous. That's why leadership is a very, very, very specific skillset.

[00:34:12] [SPEAKER_09] Yeah.

[00:34:12] [SPEAKER_07] Very, very important.

[00:34:14] [SPEAKER_09] I mean, last time I think I was like, I have no idea why Gregory is the leader this time seeing it from this perspective where I'm like, okay, well, he's kissing up to the saviors, but in their own way, Rick and Ezekiel are too. I mean, Rick, you have, it takes Negan saying, you're going to thank me right now, or one of your people are going to get hurt.

[00:34:40] [SPEAKER_09] And then Rick says, thank you with, with Gregory, it doesn't take any prompting and he'll kiss ass, but still it's the same idea. Like he's trying to protect his people and just not wanting, um, I can see a little bit of where, what he's doing. It probably did save his people.

[00:35:01] [SPEAKER_09] If he would have said, I mean, who's going to do this, but if he would have somehow let it be known that he helps kill these, uh, saviors, then that would have been bad, even worse leadership than what we saw. And by the way, when Jesus threatens, like, you want me to tell everyone that you worked with Alexandria and, uh, you know, if you make Maggie and Sasha go, then I'll tell everyone that you, uh, worked with Alexandria. And I'm like, well, if you do that, you might get everyone here killed.

[00:35:31] [SPEAKER_09] Jesus.

[00:35:33] [SPEAKER_07] Was he willing to push that nuclear option? I don't know, but maybe he thought Gregory would fold pretty quickly.

[00:35:40] [SPEAKER_09] Yeah. And Gregory, uh, he didn't totally fold. I think Jesus was saying he wanted him to step down and let them stay. And he said, okay, they can stay. So I guess he folded on that front. Yeah.

[00:35:52] [SPEAKER_05] Yeah.

[00:35:53] [SPEAKER_07] I mean, he's spineless. I mean, he doesn't wants the path of least resistance.

[00:35:58] [SPEAKER_09] That's right. And Maggie calls him a coward and she's not wrong. Yeah. Um, other things about this whole interaction between Simon and, um, Gregory Steven Ogg who plays Simon. I, he's so good at, he's like got sort of a pleasant demeanor and yet you still think he might just turn around and kill someone at any second, you know, like he's chaotic energy.

[00:36:28] [SPEAKER_09] His alignment is chaotic evil. Uh, and I always think about Trevor from grand theft auto five. Do you know that game at all?

[00:36:36] [SPEAKER_07] I've heard of it, but I've never played it.

[00:36:38] [SPEAKER_09] He's one of the main characters in it and he played an even crazier version of Simon in that. I'm sure he got hired on walking dead because of that. He's great in it, but, um, GTA six is coming out in just a couple of weeks here. Uh, what else? I thought it was pretty striking to hear Simon say to, um, Gregory, the people that killed our people, which we know are Rick and crew. They work for us now. So it's like, yep.

[00:37:07] [SPEAKER_08] Yep.

[00:37:08] [SPEAKER_09] And I think that whole, he was trying to suss out, I guess, whether Gregory knew more than he was saying about the people that killed. Right.

[00:37:18] [SPEAKER_07] Yeah. Yeah. He was definitely like fishing for like a reaction or something.

[00:37:22] [SPEAKER_09] He said anything else you want me to know? I don't, I think maybe Gregory was afraid that Simon already did know that Maggie and Sasha were there and he was testing him and he didn't want to fail the test. So that's why he was about to give them up. But I don't think, um, Simon didn't know that. I think he was just maybe sensing that Gregor wasn't telling me everything or just checking to see. I think so too.

[00:37:43] [SPEAKER_08] I think so too.

[00:37:44] [SPEAKER_09] I'm not excusing what Gregory did, but I just think that's what was going on. And then he took, I love that. He took all the scotch. I was like, what happened to half? And then he made a point to tell Gregory that he's not going to give him any credit for it. To me. You don't even have to tell him that. Yeah, he might not. I think he was going, he said, put it in the Negan truck. So he wants to score some brownie points, I think.

[00:38:07] [SPEAKER_07] Yeah.

[00:38:07] [SPEAKER_09] And that would be a treasure.

[00:38:09] [SPEAKER_07] Oh yeah.

[00:38:11] [SPEAKER_09] Maybe that's why they made a point of saying that he's a gin guy. So you'd believe that he was going to give it to give the scotch. Oh yeah.

[00:38:18] [SPEAKER_07] I remember he said that.

[00:38:20] [SPEAKER_09] I want the scotch. And then, uh, what else? I guess that's it. Okay. What else?

[00:38:27] [SPEAKER_07] Um, Carl. Um, my point was revenge is a dish best served cold because Carlos is hot now. He's mad. He's angry. He doesn't know what to do with his energy, but. Revenge. I mean, the, the point of that saying is if you're going to enact revenge, then you have to be calculating about it. You can't have emotion attached to it or you'll mess up.

[00:38:55] [SPEAKER_07] And at this point he is on his way to messing up. Well, ultimately nothing happens to him, but what Carl is doing is extremely dangerous. And all he wants to do is kill me and because he killed, cause he's angry and it's not really going to do anything about the situation. Um, if he was successful, like then what now we're back to a power vacuum and Simon would probably like slip into it, you know, say if he was successful in killing Negan, Negan's out.

[00:39:24] [SPEAKER_07] Maybe Simon might get in. I don't know, but it's just not like a well thought out plan. Um, versus Sasha also wants to kill Negan, but she's being a little bit more thoughtful about it. Like, can you get Intel for me, Jesus? And he's like, yeah.

[00:39:41] [SPEAKER_09] Which is what they should have done in the first place.

[00:39:43] [SPEAKER_07] Right. Right.

[00:39:44] [SPEAKER_09] Cause we already know Jesus knows how to stow away on trucks. Exactly. So they should have done this first.

[00:39:51] [SPEAKER_07] They should have totally gathered some Intel before they just went in and killed some people at a satellite station. Um, but yeah, it's just, there's, there's so much anger right now with, with Carl and, um, and grief with Sasha and Maggie and, um, Michonne is grieving and angry and Rick is grieving and angry. Like everybody is just in this pot of grief. So much fun. Fun times.

[00:40:18] [SPEAKER_07] Um, but like I said, things are, have to settle and I almost feel like in one way, Rick, in the back of his mind, he might be thinking subconsciously, I'm trying to work something out here, even though he's not saying it. And by, you know, he really does want to keep people safe and he's like, let's just do what they say.

[00:40:39] [SPEAKER_09] He did say something about Barry. He thought about bearing the guns and then they'd come back to him years later. It's almost like years, but that does suggest that he thought at some point in the future. Yeah.

[00:40:51] [SPEAKER_07] I feel like this isn't the forever plan, even though he's not saying that out loud and maybe even Michonne senses that I don't know.

[00:40:59] [SPEAKER_09] But, um, I mean, we all did, right. We all had to think like he, Rick's not going to be like this forever. Is he? Come on. It was painful to watch.

[00:41:08] [SPEAKER_07] Um, but yeah, I just feel like, yeah, you have to think about this because this is a, a, a villain or a problem that is outsized from what they've experienced in the past. And so you have to really think, and they didn't do that before.

[00:41:26] [SPEAKER_09] So, yeah. And they got spanked and it's sort of like, uh, and I'm not trying to make it. I don't want to make any cute comment with this, but it is sort of like an election where you lose big. Then you just have to go, Oh shit, I got to take some time to rethink and figure things out here.

[00:41:45] [SPEAKER_07] You know, where do we go from here? That's exactly right.

[00:41:51] [SPEAKER_09] Yeah. I mean, I think one thing about Carl is he pretty much tells Enid, I'm ready to die for this. So it feels like he's going in clear eyed. I don't, to me, it doesn't necessarily feel like hotheaded or reactive. Although then he did make a point of saying this isn't for, who do you say? It's not for anybody else. It's just for me or something like that. I don't pay enough attention.

[00:42:20] [SPEAKER_09] So yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But I think it's interesting how, um, Sasha and Carl and Rosita too. They're just like, no, we're not going to do this. We're going to figure out a way to kill me. And I think there's a, it's worth a shot. If you like, if anybody did have a shot at Negan at this point, even though you're right, that Simon might just take over that they should try it anyway.

[00:42:48] [SPEAKER_09] Cause it's worth seeing if it would be better, I guess.

[00:42:52] [SPEAKER_07] Yeah. It could also. Yeah. I mean, it's one of those things where either a power vacuum can be created and somebody that worse will slip in or it could cause complete chaos as well. And then that's your week, then they're weak. And then you can like go in for the kill, so to speak.

[00:43:08] [SPEAKER_09] And what we know about Simon is he likes to kill, right? Didn't he kill all the men at Oceanside and that piss Negan off? Yeah. So he would probably, if he did step in, he would turn it into a more, even more vicious organization. And I'm sure, I feel like he couldn't really keep it going in its current, its current organization where there's a whole bunch of people that are just workers, but they're

[00:43:37] [SPEAKER_09] not saviors that go out and do the dirty work. Like, I feel like it would fall apart potentially and become more like the claimers or something like that, but who knows?

[00:43:47] [SPEAKER_07] Yeah. Yeah. I can see that because Negan's a personality that that's how he keeps things together, similar to a person we know in real life. Yeah. Yeah. It's all about that. And that's kind of the glue really is the personality. And once that's gone, yeah, somebody could take over, but then it wouldn't be the same and it probably would fall apart even quicker.

[00:44:06] [SPEAKER_09] Maybe. Yeah. Although he does have a big personality to Simon, but it's just different. So it's a very different vibe.

[00:44:13] [SPEAKER_05] Yeah.

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[00:44:45] [SPEAKER_09] Uh, Carl. I'm going to call it talk about Carl and Enid. I thought it was kind of sadly funny. I, maybe I can say this. Maybe it's okay for me to say this because I have a lazy eye, but Carl having trouble hitting the darts. And then Enid says, I'll be fine. I've better aim than you. I'm like, dang. Oh my God. And then, um, she wants to go to Hilltop.

[00:45:14] [SPEAKER_09] And I was thinking back, like they were talking about what happened at the armory. That's because Carl locked her in there when they were all going to take their, the whole reason why they're out on the road and got diverted into that lineup as they were taking Maggie to the hilltop. Cause she was having trouble and Enid wanted to go and Carl locked her in the armory. So that's why I need it. And it's like, well, I'm going to go now. I need to see Maggie.

[00:45:38] [SPEAKER_09] And, um, then he wrecks a car saving her from some Zeds, but it seems like she could have just run away. And that was a waste of a car.

[00:45:49] [SPEAKER_05] That's what I was thinking too. I'm like, where do you get this car from? Is it like destroyed now? I'm like, okay.

[00:45:53] [SPEAKER_09] Yeah. And I think the reason why it was destroyed was because they wanted to show them roller skating, which was really cute. They thought it was sweet. And then I couldn't help but think they'll be dead soon though.

[00:46:03] [SPEAKER_07] Oh, that was another one of my points. A very brief point. Uh, if Glenn had lived, then I feel like him and Maggie would have pretty much raised Enid and that would have been her parent, her parents more or less. And that never happens. And then it just dies.

[00:46:20] [SPEAKER_09] It would be really fun to do just an, a limited series. That was an alternate universe where there was no zombie apocalypse and somehow all these characters would meet each other.

[00:46:32] [SPEAKER_07] That would be so fun. They kind of touched on that briefly and show with, um, Michonne and Rick about like, Oh, like if they met, um, without the apocalypse situation. But that, that sounds like, um, like what if with Marvel, like what if this thing happened?

[00:46:49] [SPEAKER_09] Yeah. That would be fun. I forgot about that. Yeah. That was really fun. They were like at a bar or something.

[00:46:56] [SPEAKER_05] Yeah.

[00:46:57] [SPEAKER_09] Uh, they had, I, did you watch dead city? No, they, this season was actually pretty good. They got a show runner in there and they had a whole season, a whole episode that was like an, like what I just said in alternate reality where Negan and Maggie meet in New York and Beth comes in and everything.

[00:47:15] [SPEAKER_07] Oh, I heard about that. It's kind of cool. Oh man. I might even just watch that episode in isolation.

[00:47:20] [SPEAKER_09] Yeah. Although it still killed me that she would even be friends with him.

[00:47:24] [SPEAKER_07] I know.

[00:47:25] [SPEAKER_09] Not in the ZA.

[00:47:27] [SPEAKER_07] I know. That's, that's kind of, I mean, I'm up for watching anything if it's good, but yeah, the conceit still kind of like, eh.

[00:47:33] [SPEAKER_09] Yeah. For that, for me to enjoy that, I had to just forget about the past. Forget about the past. Otherwise I'd be like, no, I'm not, I'm not into it. Um, so then Enid and Carl arrive at Hilltop and she realizes that it was Carl's plan to the reason why he's there is so he can wait for the saviors to show up and try to kill Negan. And I was like, well, why'd you have to go to Hilltop for that?

[00:48:02] [SPEAKER_09] They're making weekly trips to Alexandria. I feel like that's a plot hole.

[00:48:07] [SPEAKER_07] Yeah. Yeah. Just like you said, just so we can see them roller skate.

[00:48:11] [SPEAKER_09] Yeah. Yeah. Which I thought was, was really sweet. I like seeing them together.

[00:48:15] [SPEAKER_07] Yeah.

[00:48:17] [SPEAKER_09] All right. Anything else?

[00:48:19] [SPEAKER_07] Um, I guess my last point at the end, when they're about to eat dinner, Maggie and Sasha and Enid about giving her the watch, giving Enid the watch, Glenn's watch, which is her dad's watch and how she was going to put it on Glenn's grave, but she decided to give it to.

[00:48:37] [SPEAKER_09] Well, then it showed up in Gregory's pocket.

[00:48:39] [SPEAKER_07] Oh, my God. Oh, my gosh. If that's what makes me feel like, you know what, Gregory, you can just fuck off.

[00:48:45] [SPEAKER_08] Yeah.

[00:48:46] Yeah.

[00:48:47] [SPEAKER_07] Um, so just when she said, like, not leaving it on Glenn's grave and like, we can remember them, like, basically remembering them or us, our existence is what keeps them.

[00:49:01] [SPEAKER_09] How will we remember them? Because we have us.

[00:49:03] [SPEAKER_07] Yeah, exactly. Which is what Jesus said in the beginning. Mm-hmm. And it's like, we're going to have us.

[00:49:33] [SPEAKER_07] And it's like, we're going to have us. And it's like, we're going to have us.

[00:49:42] [SPEAKER_09] We're going to have us.

[00:50:11] [SPEAKER_07] Yeah. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. It's really important. Um, to think of that, even though it's so really hard to deal with.

[00:50:34] [SPEAKER_09] Yeah. I'm really glad you, you said all that and addressed it with the, the weight that it deserves. Because I was just like, eh, it's kind of dumb. You want, you want, you know, if you have, like, it reminded me of when Maggie burned that picture of her and Glenn.

[00:50:51] [SPEAKER_08] Mm-hmm.

[00:50:51] [SPEAKER_09] I'm like, no, just keep it. You, it's fun to look at what you are like when you're young, you know?

[00:50:56] [SPEAKER_08] Yeah.

[00:50:56] [SPEAKER_09] Uh, she said, I don't, we don't need this because we have each other, which was definitely a harbinger of doom. But anyway, I, I, what you said is much is what they were going for, right? That what's important is, is our impact on other people.

[00:51:13] [SPEAKER_08] Mm-hmm.

[00:51:13] [SPEAKER_09] And that will, as long as they live, that will stay with them. And that's what Maggie cares about the most. Mm-hmm. And that's beautiful. So, yeah. But I, I just, I think about this show, like it's so, one of the things about The Walking Dead, like the central things is these iconic objects that represent characters. Mm-hmm.

[00:51:33] [SPEAKER_09] And the watch is one for Glenn, the hat is Rick and then Carl and then Judith, Daryl's angel vest and his crossbow, Michonne's katana, Negan's bat. Mm-hmm. And so, um, I just think that's nice too, to have something to help you remember or just to bring about that feeling when you look at it, you know? Mm-hmm.

[00:51:59] [SPEAKER_09] So it was a little weird to have this theme of, and it was also weird for Maggie to say, you know what? We don't need something to remember them by because we have us. So here, you take it, Enid. And I'm like, doesn't Enid have us too?

[00:52:15] Oh.

[00:52:17] [SPEAKER_09] What are you trying to say? But anyway, I'm just sort of, uh, sort of, uh, regurgitating out all my notes on that. But I think what you said is the most important thing.

[00:52:27] [SPEAKER_07] Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So I like that.

[00:52:30] [SPEAKER_09] Yeah. Okay. Do you have any like random notes or anything else?

[00:52:34] [SPEAKER_07] Um, I don't, I only, I tried to come up with an only on the walking dead too. And I was like, I can't think of anything.

[00:52:40] [SPEAKER_09] I just said, uh, only on the walking dead would like a mob style protection racket involve sending a horde of zombies after people.

[00:52:50] [SPEAKER_08] Very creative.

[00:52:51] [SPEAKER_09] That's the zombie mob. Um, and also I, I just think it was a pretty good cliffhanger to have Carl and Jesus in the back of the savior truck together.

[00:53:01] [SPEAKER_07] Yeah. And Jesus's facial stretch was interesting. He was almost like shocked. And I was like, huh? Yeah.

[00:53:05] [SPEAKER_08] Oh, all right.

[00:53:08] [SPEAKER_11] Uh, numbers of citizens, people, they've killed.

[00:53:49] [SPEAKER_11] Are they slow moving chief?

[00:53:50] [SPEAKER_05] Yeah, they're dead. They're all messed up.

[00:53:56] [SPEAKER_09] All right. Just a couple of walking dead related things, sort of tangentially related. Lenny James, who of course played Morgan is going to be starring in this upcoming ITV series, which is a British network, I think called night swimming. It says weaving between past and present night swimming picks apart the events that led up to the devastating night when Matthew's wife and two teenage sons were brutally attacked in their beachfront home.

[00:54:22] [SPEAKER_09] While Matthew was performing his nightly rituals, swimming in the ocean in the present, Matthew mounts his own investigation into the crime that tore his life apart. Confronting old friends, revisiting broken relationships and interrogating the people who built the case against him. And the filming starts in Portugal in spring of next year. So it's going to be a while for it to be out, but I think it's, it's either a movie or a limited series. I'm not sure.

[00:54:44] [SPEAKER_02] Mm hmm. Sounds cool. Interesting.

[00:54:46] [SPEAKER_09] That might be cool. Yeah. All right. I want you to be back on the rewatch. He made his own 19 minute live action adaptation of parts of resident evil seven by biohazard. I watched a little bit of it and I love that game and it just looks right out of it. It's disgusting.

[00:55:15] [SPEAKER_09] If you played that game, Carl Chandler plays Ethan Winters, the protagonist and Jason Douglas, who played Tobin is the bad guy Jack Baker. Greg Nicotero contributed some special effects equipment or something. And the movie recreates a lot of the opening of the game. If you played it, you know there's a Baker family dinner scene that's just disgusting. And then there's a confrontation with the bad guy Jack in the garage.

[00:55:45] [SPEAKER_09] So that was pretty cool. It's on YouTube for free, so I'll put a link in the show notes for it. When they make these fan things, they have to give it away free. Because it's copyrighted. All right, let's move on to Lister Moans, Grounds, and Grunts. Want to go first?

[00:56:10] [SPEAKER_07] Yes. The first one is from Matt King. Just watched it. Not a particularly memorable episode. Fell asleep halfway through and had to re-watch the end. Simon and Gregory's interaction apart. And the roller skating from the kids. Nothing too much to see. This must be the turgid stuff you guys have been warning us about in season 7 and 8. And I'd pretty much forgotten it.

[00:56:37] [SPEAKER_09] I don't remember much of anything about what's coming up until the end of season 8.

[00:56:45] [SPEAKER_07] Me neither. It's kind of a blank for me as well.

[00:56:48] [SPEAKER_09] Josie Bowenectal says, first of all, I'm so glad we're back to the re-watch. It was agonizing, taking yet another break. Glad to hear your voices. Well, we'll be going until the Daryl show comes out in February. So there should be no more breaks for a couple of months here at least. Thank goodness Jesus is so smart and doesn't trust Gregory. I love watching him on screen. It feels like a long time since I've watched this bit of the show, though I re-watched only a few years ago. I love the scene with Enid and Carl on the roller skates.

[00:57:16] [SPEAKER_09] Can you imagine trying to fight a Zed on those, though? Yikes. Yeah, they missed their opportunity to show that. Now that you mention it, that would have been fun. Then stick the skates on one of the Zeds. I loved watching that Rishon kiss. My favorite thing about Michonne is that she largely stands by Rick, but also chooses to examine all possibilities. As she says in season five, quote, you know what you know, and you're sure of it. I'm not. This line applies here too.

[00:57:44] [SPEAKER_04] Bye.

[00:57:45] [SPEAKER_09] Yep. Yep, exactly.

[00:57:49] [SPEAKER_07] Is this Leah?

[00:57:51] [SPEAKER_09] I would say Leahy Dizzley, but I'm not sure.

[00:57:55] [SPEAKER_07] Leahy Dizzley. Hello. I don't have anything for this episode, unfortunately, but I do have a fun bit of info for the cell. When Randy summarized that the letters on the prisoners stood for shit fuck and asshole or something similar because Negan would find it amusing, turns out he's 100% correct. I was listening to the audio commentary for the episode with Angela Kang and Norman Reedus. Angela said she often got told theories about the letters when in reality,

[00:58:24] [SPEAKER_07] she had them stand for shithead, fuck face, and asshole precisely because it's savior humor. I would really recommend the audio commentary found on the DVDs. They are very insightful and answer extremely important questions such as this. Looking forward to listening in.

[00:58:43] [SPEAKER_09] I didn't know that. Thanks for writing that. That's really good.

[00:58:47] [SPEAKER_07] Yeah. Makes me hate to say it was even more.

[00:58:51] [SPEAKER_09] Michael Koska says, I totally forgot how much I love the dynamic between Simon and Gregory in this episode. Two fantastic actors that play off of each other so well. They're both sleazy characters, but in completely different ways. That's true. Gregory is a spineless self-serving coward who desperately wants to be perceived as someone important. Simon, on the other hand, is charismatic, intimidating, and clearly enjoys having power over people. My favorite part is how Gregory is constantly trying to charm Simon, flatter him, and act

[00:59:20] [SPEAKER_09] like they're two powerful men conducting business as equals. But Simon never really allows him that dignity. He's playfully condescending towards him, treating him like a pathetic little man while maintaining this strangely friendly, almost jovial demeanor. It's so good. Yeah.

[00:59:35] [SPEAKER_09] With Simon, it just seems like, I mean, I did some panels with Stephen Og and he had a little bit of that crazy chaoticness to him to where I didn't know what he was going to say or do next. I didn't feel like it was intimidating at all, but there was some aspect of that chaos there that was really interesting. Like an unpredictability. Yeah, for sure.

[01:00:04] [SPEAKER_07] But it keeps on your edge. It keeps on edge, basically.

[01:00:07] [SPEAKER_09] That's right. Yeah, it keeps you on edge. He was really nice, though.

[01:00:11] [SPEAKER_07] Yeah, they always are. People that play psychopaths. Psychopaths. Billy Thompson. Hello, hello. Hope you guys are well. It's been way too long. I missed the episodes in between the break, but I'm all caught up and so happy to be back with you guys for the rewatch. It was really nice seeing Sasha still caring towards Maggie, but also made me think, are they ever that close? Maybe I'm just forgetting, but I can't remember any specific interactions between the two before this episode.

[01:00:41] [SPEAKER_07] Maybe it's just going through the lineup together. Has brought the group closer. And Gregory. God. Can someone remind him how long until Maggie seals his fate?

[01:00:51] [SPEAKER_09] I think, yeah, that just like it was really moving to see Maggie and Sasha at Glenn and Abraham's graves together. And Maggie, I think, I mean, the first scene in this episode, she's waking up and the doctor's like, wake up or hello. And do you remember me? So it seems like this might be her first really like aware, lucid moment since the lineup.

[01:01:19] [SPEAKER_07] It's probably like patchy for her memory wise.

[01:01:22] [SPEAKER_09] Yeah. But I mean, I think it's all raw for her. What just happened right now, you know, and, and I do think you're right, Billy, that just, they both lost their partners. Yeah. And that probably bonded them together in this moment. And just, yeah. Sasha's being very supportive and nice and like, you need to stay here and I'm going to stay with you. And that's it. And I was just nice to see. Yeah.

[01:01:45] [SPEAKER_07] Yeah. I think it's not unrealistic that they were instantly bonded from that, from that trauma. Huh?

[01:01:51] [SPEAKER_08] Yep.

[01:01:52] [SPEAKER_07] Yeah. Why would Simon put Megan's resources in that sort of trouble? Blurring all the Zeds to Hilltop just to pretend they provide a service seems so stupid. Also, Simon says, you cleaned up the mess yourselves. Wouldn't he have seen Maggie? She was in clear view standing on top of the trailer. Well, maybe they weren't, maybe they weren't around.

[01:02:14] [SPEAKER_09] No, I don't think they were there. He realized they cleaned it up when they came the next morning.

[01:02:18] [SPEAKER_07] Yeah. Yeah. I think they just dumped their thing and left. Um, I just think this episode felt strange. Not much cohesion. Again, the action scene at Hilltop just felt so random whilst cutting back and forth to the Enid and Carl scenes. But the strange background music just didn't feel like it flowed properly. Overall, a very forgettable episode this week, but we're back, baby. I really missed you guys in this community.

[01:02:44] [SPEAKER_07] I really need to watch some more shows, not just the apocalyptic ones to keep up with everyone. Anyway, thanks guys. Bye.

[01:02:53] [SPEAKER_09] Give Widows Bay a shot, Billy. And then you can hear me and Karen talking about it on Wax Episodic in real time. We just did episode five of a 10 episode first season. Yeah. If you like good, smart comedy mixed with horror. Rinaldi Kaleek says, hello, Jason and Carissa. I just wanted to say I share a kinship with Gregory. And that's all he wrote. No, I'm just kidding. He says, cause we both think Simon is a crazy looking and scary dude.

[01:03:22] [SPEAKER_09] But where we disagree is that kneeling before Simon is not something I would be enthusiastic about. Well, I don't think Gregory was happy about that either. Regardless, I like the chemistry between Simon and Gregory. I also like the chemistry between Sasha and Maggie. I like how Sasha's support leads to Maggie regaining her full confidence and she takes a more active role in dealing with Simon and his group of saviors. Yeah. Yeah. This is really like, it's hard. It's easy to forget.

[01:03:47] [SPEAKER_09] Like, I think we're seeing Maggie turn into the Maggie that we've known since, you know, that this is like right where that transformation is happening. And also just them, um, sitting by the graves that I mentioned a minute ago, how sad that was when we first saw it. Cause we just lost them, you know, now we're used to them being gone, but it was much more impactful when you first watched this episode. I think probably this episode hit harder back then.

[01:04:15] [SPEAKER_07] Yeah.

[01:04:16] [SPEAKER_09] Because of that. Um, he says, I agree with Ben Beck that Maggie's not only beautiful, but strong and determined in a way that's admirable as well. She's also one of my favorite characters. I would say that too. She's one of mine too. Season seven, episode five, go getters is essentially a better version of the previous episode service. Though I appreciate Jason and Alex's explanation about why they liked the ending for the last episode. I like the ending to this episode better.

[01:04:44] [SPEAKER_09] Sasha trusting Jesus to find the sanctuary adds a little forward momentum with the plot. And I like seeing Jesus use his skills to help our protagonists. Yeah. Yeah. Uh, it was good to see Jesus get a chance to use some of his, uh, martial arts on the zombies. That was cool. And I'm sure Tom Payne who practiced martial arts to get ready for this role was happy about that.

[01:05:06] [SPEAKER_04] That's neat.

[01:05:07] [SPEAKER_09] Uh, he says when this episode originally aired, I hated the Carl and needed subplot, but on a rewatch, I think their subplot is cute. I've grown in my respect for Carl as a character over the years with subsequent rewatches. All of these reasons and more are why I placed this episode. Go getters at number 86. So my walking dead episode rankings in between 87 silence, the whispers, which is a season 10 episode and 85 twice as far where Denise had such a tragic death. Ultimately go getters is a really good, but not great episode. In my opinion.

[01:05:37] [SPEAKER_09] Thanks for another great rewatch episode of the walking dead guys. Don't get bit. Thanks for another. That's good. Okay. One more message. It's a call from C Brown.

[01:05:47] [SPEAKER_03] Hello, walking dead cast. This is Steve. This is going to be for the walking dead rewatch, uh, episode go getters. And, uh, I have to say this is, you know, this is, I've already said, this is my first time rewatching from the beginning. And, uh, I watch them. I have blue rays of all the seasons, even though I never hadn't watched them yet. And this particular disc that starts this section of the season has Maggie and Glenn on the disc. Just sad. And we start with a set of eyes opening up. It's not lost though. Cause it's two eyes, not one eye. Oh, and it's Maggie and Dr. Carson.

[01:06:16] [SPEAKER_03] Oh, and Herschel's watch makes it. Oh, Gregory trying to push people around. Like you're, I mean, you're kind of in charge, but the doctor gave orders. Come on, man. And he wants Sasha to stay. What? Well, back at Alexandria, Carl can't throw darts. He's sneaking out to try to get to the hilltop. Did she just jump off the, from the top of the wall? That's what it looked like. Oh, that's deep, Maggie. He's a coward. That's more dangerous than being an idiot. This is her and Sasha talking about Gregory. I forgot about Carl following her in the car.

[01:06:46] [SPEAKER_03] Felt like a drive. Carl still, that, that is just crazy. Oh, I remember now. This is how Maggie and Sasha get to stay because of the saviors doing this attack on the hilltop right now. She's going to give us the timeline during this, this podcast, but I forgot this season, right? Doesn't it only covers like a few days or like a month, right? Oh, and Maggie already taken over as leader before she even does anything. And Gregory, the coward that he is just backs up into his dark house and Maggie driving the tractor.

[01:07:16] [SPEAKER_03] I mean, technically she is setting. Doesn't even know his own people's name, Gregory, just called Miss Maitland, Caitlin. Ew, Gregory hitting on Sasha like that. Oh, they found roller skates. I thought it was bicycles, but yeah, roller skates is even better or different. Oh, and Simon comes with such a show of force from the saviors. Oh, Simon just said go-getters. The title of the episode, mic drop. Oh, what a snake, Gregory. You are going to give up Maggie and Sasha. See, Simon's description of scotch is the way I describe Jen. Ugh.

[01:07:46] [SPEAKER_03] One big, happy, dysfunctional family. Okay, Jesus. Yeah. Oh, I didn't see him take the watch from the grave. Oh, he deserved a punch in the face. I sat and did something. That's great, Maggie. Okay, so Jesus jumps in the back of the truck and is he going to use the scotch to mark the trail? But then Simon will know something happened. But Carl's in the truck too. Ugh. Okay. On to next week.

[01:08:10] [SPEAKER_09] I think he's just pouring it out to be spiteful, right?

[01:08:15] [SPEAKER_07] That's what I kind of was saying.

[01:08:16] [SPEAKER_09] He took a drink and then-

[01:08:18] [SPEAKER_07] Like, yeah, I'm just going to pour out your liquor.

[01:08:19] [SPEAKER_09] Ew. I'd just throw it in the bushes and go back for it later. I don't have a timeline report, but Lucy will be back in two episodes and I'm sure she'll have something for us.

[01:08:34] [SPEAKER_08] Yeah. Yeah.

[01:08:40] [SPEAKER_09] All right. That is our show. Episode 728. Thank you so much for listening, everyone. Back to be on the rewatch. And thanks, Carissa, for joining in. Glad to have you.

[01:08:50] [SPEAKER_07] You're welcome.

[01:08:51] [SPEAKER_09] Next will be The Walking Dead Season 7, Episode 6, Swear.

[01:08:57] [SPEAKER_07] If you want to write in or leave us a voice message about it, you can find all our content information at podcastica.com.

[01:09:04] [SPEAKER_09] While you're there, please check out our other podcasts. I mentioned Widow's Bay. We've also got Bakedastica going with Greg, Jamie, and Wendy covering Great British Baking Show. And coming up very soon is Yellow Jackets, which comes out November 20th, but we'll be doing this weekend. We'll be recording a catch-up episode for that. We're excited. It's the final season.

[01:09:30] [SPEAKER_06] We.

[01:09:32] [SPEAKER_09] This episode is made possible by Patreon supporters like Maria Lawson, who pledged their support at patreon.com slash Jason Cabassi. So thank you so much to Maria, a long time supporter and just a cool person. And we're doing those Dexter roundtable reactions. Last week, Rebecca and Steve were on, and that was really fun. And tonight it's going to be Rachel and Kelsey covering this week's Dexter. And if you sign up, it could be you next.

[01:10:02] [SPEAKER_09] All right. That is our show.

[01:10:04] [SPEAKER_07] Thanks for listening.

[01:10:05] [SPEAKER_09] Don't get bit. Conrad Forbester.